i appreciate you coming on the show. i assume seven years out of the political business and in prison you have learned something about life, something important you didn't know before. i'm just guessing. what are your attitudes now, how are they important for us to learn from? i assume you learned something. >> first of all, i'm glad to be here, chris. i'm glad to be anywhere. i still have federales swarming around me. they won't admit that. they are looking for any opportunity to send me back. it seems like this whole valley has been in prison. i'm upset with the fact we have 12,000 delphi retirees and salary and hourly workers who are going to lose their pension, their health care and pick up a $60 million a year factor. when you look at the multiplication factor of this

area $250 million a year with a $1.5 billion loss throughout the state of ohio. this is very important, this deaf fi issue. it hit us harder than the closing of steel mills. second of all, if we can give billions of billions of dollars to bank who won't lend it to people unless they have $3 in the bank for every $1 we borrow. i'm tired of seeing this money going all over the world. stimulate this. that's what i'm saying. >> you still talk like a politics like you are running for office again. >> you never know. i may. i want to get the irs, kick them in the crotch real good. i want to reform the justice department who investigates themselves when they commit crimes as they did in my case. it is going to explode before it is over. most importantly, the problem with america no one is talking about, while they are talking about health care and these issues to camouflage what i think is a systemic problem, we

have a tax code that cannot be reformed. it must be replaced. they have to throw the tax code out, abolish the 16th amendment and come with a 25% fair tax retail sales tax. now dr. dale jorgensen at harvard did a study and stlad wouldn't be an appreciable cost factor because of the heavy penlization of investment rewarding dependency in this country. it is crazy. we have to start with the rudimentary problems. we have to be careful, everyone is losing their job, health care and home. >> you sound like a republican. >> well, if a republican program is good, i'd support it. if a democrat program is good, i support it. if it's good for america i'm for

it this is a problem in washington. too many of these people walk like lemmings over the cliff with so-called leaders. chris i've got to tell you something, i have never seen such weak leadership in my life. tip o'neil is rolling over. jim wright may have had his problems. but he was railroaded. he was a speaker. when he said something he did it. it is time the democrats lead and quite disguising problems. look at the tax code. these imports are coming in, our trade deficit, chris, is $700 billion plus. beam me up. how can we overcome these problems. >> you're talking with this populous fervor, jim traficant and yet the democratic party and the congress voted you out. they voted to kick you out. how do you go back into a room of politicians and say you guys were all wrong, i was right?

all wrong. i'm the only guy in the room that was right? >> i don't have to tell anybody they are wrong or right. i was targeted by the justice department since 1983, the only american to defeat the justice department in rico. they couldn't live with that. i was a number one target in the american/israeli public affairs committee. people are scared to death in washington to say what is wrong with the country. if you reconcile some big people you're done. they're more concerned with perpetuity. and the country is going to hell in a hand basket. >> without getting into the specific charge with apac, when you sit in congress i want your perspective. are you saying that members of congress are basically prostitutes? that they are basically scared to death of the interest groups?

what are you saying about the system? >> chris, years ago on the house floor on a foreign aid debate i called the members of the house of representatives a bunch of political prostitutes. they demanded my words be stricken. they jumped up like 100 tv evangelists. i said i apologize to those offended and those not offended i commended them. i went outside and a stringer group said tell us what you really feel, jim. i said i want to apologize to all the hookers in america for having associated them with the united states house of representatives. yeah. i think it is a big whorehouse and they better start taking care of america and stop worrying about the middle east and worry about the midwest, take a look at the trade deficit and throw out this tax code. it is killing america. >> let me ask you about -- >> that's what i stand for. >> you have been missing a few

chapters, the election of barack obama while you were inside. when you got out, you were watching the tea bag parties, the birther movement. what is your reaction to the world you missed. this angry american right out there. are you part of that? >> number one, i'm speaking at a lot of these tea bag party, t.e.a. party rallies. they need reaction. they mean well. as far as obama is concerned i tell thee t.e.a. party groups to say, i don't think you should go after president obama. his hands are tied. i think his heart is in the right place. but the bottom line is no one is dealing with the problems, chris, because if you deal with the problems, the real problems in america, you get targeted and you know what i'm talking about. i don't want to give you chills up your leg again here. >> jim traficant, that was below you. you can do better than that. let me ask you about your

personal situation. i'm going to ask you one time only. it is a free country. you are a free man now. do you believe you were in any way guilty as charged? in any way guilty as charged? >> number one, i'm not a free man and no i was not guilty. >> in any way? you were a totally innocent man? >> in any way. in any way. when it is all over, it will come out. >> how are you going to establish that fact so the people listening right now will believe it? i'm serious. how are you going to make your case you didn't make seven years ago. >> chris, i'm not trying to convince anybody. you have juror number eight leo glazer who is giving revelation. four of the seven people who testified coming out they lied. a young black man in nigeria said his life was ruined because

he wouldn't lie against traficant. they are deporting his 79-year-old parents. i'm going to say this to washington, you should look into the ocolo matter. they destroyed his life and his parents because of the goth's zeile to convict. they broke every law to convict. i want them to know i'm coming back at them. >> jim, a final question, congressman, you were under ohio law -- >> don't call me names. >> jim, you can run for office, there is no legal reason why you can't, right? >> i'm 25 years old, i'm eligible to run. there is no restriction on me running. >> what would get you to run for office again? >> number one, i would have to look at the variables on it, chris. the thing i can't imagine if i come back how well i was received. i never realized how well i was received across the country.

my case is beginning to explode. people are admitting they were pressured to lie. there is a microscope put on that thing. i don't know what i'm going to do. i may run. if i do i'm going to say this on your program, i'm going to try to abolish the internal revenue service, repeal the 16th amendment and go right at the justice department who investigates themselves when they commit a crime. finally, if i am subpoenaed to germany in the case, i'm going over and i am appalled not one politician in america has looked into this man's plight. period. >> you are sticking to your defense. you believe he is innocent? >> the first time, chris, it was my freedom of information act request that proved he wasn't ivan. it came from the justice department. they let the justice department go without being charged. he was convicted, sentenced to death when i brought him back from israel. he is in germany.

israel wouldn't charge him on this second offense. i want to give israel credit because the sixth circuit court r in cincinnati wouldn't accept my evidence, congress wouldn't hold a hearing. i sent it to the supreme court in israel they gave america a lesson in justice. they said, take him home, congressman. this man is not what they are saying he is. it is a shame no one is looking at his plight. >> thank you very much, jim traficant. >> i will, chris. >> thanks for coming on "hardball." >> this is "hardball." >> you speak your mind, sir. what is the mission in afghanistan? can we meet that mission? president obama is considering using fewer troops in that country. can he win without losing in pakistan sfwhel we'll be right back the question, can he sell it to his own party. you are watching "hardball" only on msnbc. thanks. so is our bike insurance. all the coverage you need at a great price.

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welcome back to "hardball." president obama is weighing whether to send more troops to afghanistan or scale back our operations to hunt down al qaeda. according to the nbc news/"wall street journal" poll it would be a tough sell. 51% of americans oppose sending additional troops to afghanistan. broken down by party, 2/3, 67% of the democrat oppose a troop increase, republicans, 3 out of 5, 60% support there is a real difference in the parties. what are the political perils. pat buchanan and dee dee myers. i want to start with pat. i know you are of two minds about this, but speaking as a man of the republican party.

the republican party says it is for a troop buildup. is that a deep seated belief or hawkish impulse? do they think there is a win to be had in afghanistan given the karzai election, the dishonesty the rest of it? >> the republicans have to have their doubts, i'm getting a little feedback in the ear. it is quite natural for republicans to be hawkish and believe in the efficacy of military power. they think people like mccain, they are honest. they do believe if we press down and keep at it we can win this war, that perseverance counts. they have to have their doubts. >> it seems the democrats are anti-engagement in that part of the world. they don't like deeper military involvement. obama seems to be off base with his party on this. >> the lessons of history are

not that encouraging whether you are looking at the history of afghanistan where many have gone into their peril or lessons like vietnam where you get into a war that is in many ways unwinnable and it becomes a quagmire. obama worries this could become his quagmire. there are lessons of history that make democrats wary of this. we have seen how things have gone in recent months. not having a stable partner to fight if insurgency is difficult. >> the problem obama's got is this. if he draws down troops you lose afghanistan to the taliban and he loses the country. if he maintains the present level of troops mcchrystal saying we are headed for mission failure until we get more resources. ie, 45,000 more troops or somewhere up toward that number. i think the political imperatives and the imperatives

on the ground and his own lack of knowledge and being boxed in by secretary of state and the republicans and the generals and by mccain, i think that probably argues for a temp rising decision to send more troops but not to 45,000. >> that doesn't sound like a thoughtful thing. it seemed to me he walked back into this. i don't want to fight for iraq. that was a mistake. it reminds me of jack kennedy saying i'm not going to fight for laos. kennedy didn't believe in the south vietnamese struggle. he was indecisive. when a president is not following his own hunch. he is making a political move and finds himself in a real situation that is hellish. should we be losing lives in afghanistan right now? >> that is the question on the table. march, barely six weeks into his

presidency obama sent additional troops with a new strategy into afghanistan. he talked about the campaign that afghanistan was the good war. we took our eye off the ball. we should have nipped that in the bud. we didn't do it. things have deteriorated. we had escalating casualties, the debacle of the election in afghanistan. the president has said let's take a look, let's not send resources after a bad strategy. let's re-evaluate our strategy. on one level that is solid to the president rethink things. he is being pushed around by the generals, the secretary of state and others. >> chris, if this is not a wise war or winnable war he ought to say fe are going to have to turn around and come out of this. he himself is a bit of the problem. he escalated with 21,000 troops.

he said this is not a war of choice. this is a war of necessity. he laid down all these markers. the question is barack obama, if he doesn't believe in is a winnable war, is he a big enough man to say we are going to turn around and walk out the way reagan did after he put the marines in beirut and they got killed but he came out. >> we made the right decision in the second instance. here is secretary of state hillary clinton, his former rival. i think she is putting up a situation he is going to have to contend with. here is secretary clinton. >> some people say well al qaeda is no longer in afghanistan. if afghanistan were taken over by the taliban, i can't tell you how fast al qaeda would be back in afghanistan. >> she is his ally, top foreign policy minister. she is dictating policy. i'm not being tough, just stating the facts. how does he respond?

>> i don't think she made a secret out of what she thinks. this is a very difficult situation. what general mcchrystal calls for is nation building. the president ought to consider that very carefully. the way to win is not to kill all the insurgents and take on the taliban, but protect civilians and enhance their lives through better governance and economic development. that is a very tall order in a country that is very primitive, with few resources and no infrastructure. >> that is not worth a lot of american lives. somalia is a no-man's land. yemen is a no-man's land. al qaeda could move into there. they could move back into afghanistan. people have to remember it wasn't the guys in afghanistan. they plotted this in delray beach, arizona. in democratic countries. we can't run around everywhere

al qaeda is, take over the country, rebuild it, turn it into vermont and hope they take care of keeping al qaeda out. >> didi, one of the things i didn't like about the nixon administration, we weren't going to win that war because we stuck it out because no one wants to lose a war. if this president stays in afghanistan because he doesn't want to have an "l" next to his name that is bad. he has to believe the mission should succeed or shouldn't be there. how can we be the allies of karzai after he steals an election? how can we justify the loss of another soldier in defense of a government that is corrupt? it has to do with morality as our leader. >> he doesn't have a choice. the first thing is you have to wait on some level for the ott come of is his commission that will review the election.

it may say karzai won in sfit of all the things going on. in which case you don't have another choice if you are going to build an anti-insurgent operation. as general mcchrystal says you have to do more than fight the bad guys. you have to protect the safety of the civilians. you can't do that without a government partner. >> we are not george washington. >> if you don't believe this is a wise and winnable war, you shouldn't fight it. you should have the courage to turn around and say we may have made a mistake for going in for nation building. you go back and listen to lbj talking to richard russell, 1964 he didn't believe it was a winnable war and he put them in there for five years. >> johnson and nixon kept us in a war we couldn't win. should we stay in a war we can't win because of political or pr reasons? up next, don't be so helpful. moammar qaddafi talks up barack

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back to "hardball." time for the "sideshow." pitching a fit. remember the welcome moammar qaddafi gave the lockerbie killer? he is finding a hard time finding a place to pitch his tent. he tried to pitch his tent on property rented from donald trump. you can tell from the new york post cover that bid was a no go. trump and town officials ordered his tent dismantled.

he had only good things to say about our president during his diatribe. >> americans are happy, proud that one son governors the united states of america. now the american people, the black africa kenyan young voted for him and made him a president. we are content and happy if obama can stay as president of america. >> did you hear. he called him a kenyan. he wants obama to be president for life. birthers alert, another chance to go crazy. art imitating life. last night was the premiere of "the good wife" that revolves about the public fall of a cheating politician. catch this scene between julie l julianna margolese.

>> men can be lazy, women can't. that goes double for you. not only are you coming back to the work place but you have some prominent baggage. but if she can do it, so can you. >> that is hillary clinton in that photo. according to a new study of congress there are 57 members of congress on the social networking site on twitter. how many republicans? 101 republican lawmakers are atwitter as we speak. nice big number. will the republicans win by going hard right by ideologically purifying themselves and is sarah palin their new hero? we'll look at what is next for the "r"s, the republicans, next. you are watching "hardball" only on msnbc. announcer: trying to be good to your heart? so is campbell's healthy request soup. low in fat and cholesterol, heart healthy levels of sodium,

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i'm bertha coombs. this is your cnbc market wrap. stocks finish in the red. the dow jones industrials closed the day down 18 points. the s&p 500 was off ten points while the nasdaq lost 14. markets rallied around midday as the feds delivered the most optimistic outlook on the economy. economic activity has picked up and consumer spending has stabilize. the fed is extending, not adding to its program to buy back toxic mortgages. right now they are going to slow the pace of those buybacks though they will keep the program alive until the middle of next year. investors started cashing in on the rally. hardest hit american airlines, down 8% after it planned to raise $250 million in cash.

that is it for cnbc, first in business worldwide. now back to "hardball." welcome back to "hardball." a south carolina republican with conservative cred to spare is facing four primary challenges because he is not right wing enough. an effort by conservatives to purify the party. speaking of the conservative core sarah palin addressed bankers and business people in hong kong today w. the polarizing palin back in action, what is the future of conservativism in this country? sam tanhouse is the editor of the "new york times" book review, the author of "the death of conservativism."

your book points a traditional threat in conservativism, fight for what is good and correct what isn't. not to be an insurrectionist trouble making party new york city one is listening to you. >> i guess not. qaddafi does a great borat imitation. a guy doesn't need to be purified. he is true blue or true red yol logical conservative. he thought joe wilson dishonored the house he is a member of. conservative is about to be honoring and respecting political tradition and institutions. that is what inglis did and now they are saying he is not pure enough. it is interesting, too, because we see the old culture war coming back. nobody is looking at inglis' record. this isn't about policy or politics. it is a kind of verbal war that they are waging against this

guy. also notice how when you see a party reduced to its minority core as this group is, everybody runs to the right. you might think when they've been pushed over to the side there they would want to crawl back to the center because that's how the republican party got into power in the first place, by capturing the center. >> let me report another way of looking at this. i will challenge this. you are something of an intellectual. >> don't call me names. >> i'm going to refer you to p.t. barnum who said if you want a crowd, start a fight. that is how they used to get people to come to the circus. they would have a fist fight on the street corner and hand the bills. before they marched the elephants in the streets. the republicans have climbed back. look at the new nbc poll and "wall street journal."

43% prefer the democratically controlled congress, 40% prefer republican. having had their rear ends kicked are now within three points of taking back the house, perhaps. i'm just asking you this, you advised them to be tame and civilized, the crazies, the birthers, the flags, the nuts, the crazy charged against barack obama that seem to be working. >> it is a great way to draw a crowd and get people into the tent. we have a tecountry with 300 million people. we are seeing con speck white house thousands who are calling attention to themselves. the great william f. buckley said the conservative movement always had its share of noise makers and pyrotechnicses.

another point, if we look where politics was conducted at the street level, the left that was doing in the late 1960s, that gave conservatives and the republican party to get back in power because they were the defender of institutions, of social order. >> there is one point i'm looking at because i'm a practical guy, eric cantor, sharp number two guy in the house from richmond, virginia. the guy is acting very cautious. he had a town meeting that was not crazy people yelling crazy things. it was civilized on the mark. he has the polls to show republicans if they want to get back into power, even though they have to be conservative, they have to be conservative grown-ups. >> well, sure. even when you have the statistic about twitter, we forget if you look at the reporting on this, it is older people not younger people who use twitter. it is interesting, too, that one

surprisingly strong demographic for the republican party emerged in the 2008 election and everybody looked away because of the raptures of president obama is the elderly. they are a major constituency. the same people who are worried their medicare is going to be taken away are the same ones who said to george bush don't cut into our social security. i think we are looking at a demographic shift in this country they may have to do with age -- >> i think the older people without any slight to them because i'll be there soon, they are so happy with socialism, they don't want anybody else to have it. they have medicare that is free, but when everybody else wants it, they say, no, no, we can't have that kind of government-run program. is the republican party three years from now going to be the hawk party the neoconservative

party that is raising the flag of war or are they going to be going the other way? it looks like they are still the hawk party? >> i thought you made a great point and pat did about the political bind barack obama has put himself in. during the campaign it was easy, a great line to say we took our eye off the ball in iraq. we should have been in afghanistan. afghanistan is worse, harder. they didn't have decent intelligence through the bush years. they don't know where to fight the battles. obama set himself up in a position where he looked as if he had the more rational answer. it may not look that way in the months ahead. the country tends to trust republicans. >> are we going to knock off karzai like we did in '63. i'm serious. it is a deadly situation.

how do we get out of the bind of backing a guy who stole an election? we cut a deal with someone who shouldn't be there. it is a problem. >> we made those mistakes. we ended up assassinating the guy and do it in the name of democracy, we alienate the people. di di meyers is right. it sounds like a bad old movie. >> thank you. good luck with the book. up next, the democrats are getting 60 senators soon. the big question, who is it going to be? my money paul kirk. you heard it here. paul kirk is going to be the next senator from massachusetts in a couple of hours. this is "hardball" only on msnbc. (trump) i think you should lose the headband.

so, at national, i go right past the counter... and you get to choose any car in the aisle. choose any car? you cannot be serious! okay. seriously, you choose. go national. go like a pro. with the republicans supporting the call for more troops in afghanistan and democrats against it, how is obama going to make a decision? ♪

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>> we're back. time for "the politics fix" with salon.com joan walsh. i'm in massachusetts, i have to give a speech at my college, holy cross, i'm thrilled we are going to have a new senator from massachusetts. the word i'm getting is paul kirk, chairman of the party, a long time kennedy ally. apparently the kennedy people were ticked off at the boston globe gugus who tried to jam

dukakis down their throat. >> to have gone this trouble and defy the wishes of the kennedy boy and vicki kennedy is not something duvall patrick could have done. it sounds like you might have another senator during your trip. >> we will have charisma. dukakis has a little, but paul kirk has a lot. will the reality of of democrats change the thinking of you and people like you who are tough and militant. i use that positively in your case. >> thank you. >> and in ed's case, who believe the democrats can rule because they have the power. you don't wait for 60 votes. you jam it through with reconciliation. i'm talking about health care. >> i understand. >> is 60 votes mean they will

wait and get it the usual way instead of jam it through? >> i think they have to wait and try the usual way. we have the sad situation with senator byrd. we are dealing with a situation that is very much in flux. everyone prefers at this point, if barack obama and his allys in the senate can twist some arms and bring along kent conrad and some of the other people who have doubts about public option i think everyone prefers he could do that rather than going reconciliation. in the end if it has to go to reconciliation, i would prefer that than a bad bill. i think 60 votes is a great shot in the arm to get the party back together. we've never had those 60 votes. no franken and then no kennedy. >> why not invite everyone to a room and say no one leaves the room until we agree on the bill.

get the staffers out of the room. get them in the room and say this is a party vote. ladies and gentlemen, this is a party vote like the budget. you are not going to vote against it. what is your problem? let's fix it. we can leave together and enjoy life as a victorious political party. >> we have the power to do that. sure there is going to be horse trading but why can't we come together and really -- if they could do that, they would help their chances in 2010, chris. that is the political win as well as i think it would probably result in a good bill. but we'll see. >> is rahm emanuel the person to do this or does it take someone who is not there yet? rahm emanuel is a tough customer. he knows the hill. he could have been speaker someday. does he have that kind of grasp and attack or is he too big ro?

is he too big city? i'm wondering if he can talk turkey to blanch lincoln. can he sit and talk db i'm not sure you can. i'm not sure i can. if you're a democrat and say, look, we have a common interest in success here. we have a president whose life is on the line as a political leader here. if he goes down and fails on his number one onnive he will be a failure. that's going to hurt the party. >> we'll all be failures. he will take down the party. to come to this point where we have a decisive margin in the house to have an actual 60-vote margin in the senate and then lose, no, it's got to be the president. i think it's brong. >> looks like we have paul kirk as the next senator from massachusetts. let's put that on the table. does the presence of 60 democrats make it more likely they'll go the usual route, get 60 democrats, maybe olympia snowe for 61 to replace maybe ben nelson or whatever? can they do it now? >> yeah. i think it's more likely, but

chris, i'm not sure how much more likely it actually is. keep in mind, that 60 is not a real 60 because they're not all true liberal democrats. a lot of red-state democrats in the south and the west going to want to take a long look at this bill and not going to automatically be a democratic vote when the roll call is called, chris. >> the roll call is called whether you're the party who wants to win or lose. does anybody in the party think they're better off losing on health care? jonathan martyr? you're with politico. does anybody think it's a win if you lose? >> talk to blanch lincoln, kent conrad. they may think it's a tougher vote than a vote against it in their states. you're right in the sense shooting it down is a big, big step. i'm not sure the democrats are going to want to be responsible for killing the health care bill that hurts their party in the long run. they're looking at it for their own state, 64 sort of red states. >> this isn't the only problem

barack obama has as president. much more real. about life and death on this planet. the war in afghanistan. was he right to double down and put more troops in there? will he keep fighting for afghanistan? we'll be right back with joan. is he willing to pull the plug? pat buchanan asked the question if he's decided he's wrong. we've got karzai in there the wrong guy. do we have to leave? rinkles. not surgery. this is our way to do your eyes. new regenerist anti-aging eye roller. get wrapped up in the luscious taste of butternut squash, blended with delicate herbs. v8 golden butternut squash. from campbell's. a soup so velvety and delicious you won't be able to contain yourself. campbell's v8 soups.

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call or click today. deaf, hard of hearing anprogre. we're back with joan walsh and jonathan martin with politico for "the politician fix. "what did you make of

trafficcant in his return to greatness? >> i think he's a legend in his own mind. i don't think he's returning to greatness any time soon if he ever was great. it was pretty hilarious. did a good job asking him questions. populous, but also flat tax. it's all about trafficant. not about political -- >> i think anger in youngstown -- he's still running for something. you, first, jonathan on this one. a tricky one for both of you. unopinionated and opinionated journalist. afghanistan is real. it's not a call pain issue. it's not a public relations issue. it's not an obama issue. it's a reality. we have people -- i was taken by the sight of that young atiital kid over a coffin. when you see a young kid leaning over his father's coffin and realizing the total finality of that, the final, forever loss of your father for a young kid and

go wait a minute, italy's not that far away from america. afghanistan's really far away. and it's different culturally. canc can countries -- where people really believe in sharia and are not going to change if we stay there 100 damn years. my question to you, jonathan, how does the president defend a campaign, a war, that isn't going to change anything? >> well, it's not an easy task, chris, especially with the base of his own party. you see vice president biden now, reports coming out about his own influence. he wants to have a smaller footprint there, move more american troops and do insurgent work in pakistan. >> anti-terrorism. they want to go from anti-insurgent to anti-terrorist. yeah. >> chris, you know the house very well. there's a lot of democrats and house representatives who have a grave concerns about what the plan of action here is in

afghanistan. you can be certain that those folks are getting louder and louder. it's not a huge coalition now but it's a growing coalition of folks on the left wing of this party not going to stand for a long-term sort of occupation in this country. >> you know, joan, the rest could be republicans. he could have a few conservatives on the middle east. hawkish people on the middle east. generally, jonathan's right. it's an easy vote to say he's not right. what are we doing there? >> you know, i've heard people describe him as seeming weak because he's taking his time. i disagree with that, chris. the facts on the grounds have changed. the weakness of karzai and the shady election have really changed the nature of our understanding and our commitment to karzai. so if we don't have a karzai government we're not fully behind them. then what are we backing? i also think that, you know, we've got george will, a few conservatives also expressing doubt.

really the issue here is, you know, the biden versus hillary debate where biden is saying, yes, counterterrorism, fight al qaeda and hillary is saying, but if you get the taliban back, good luck getting al qaeda out. that's in the democratic party. that's a democratic party battle right now. >> what do you think the president thinks of senator clinton? secretary clinton making a strong statement of policy at this point? >> i was surprised to see that. i don't know if it's with his blessing because it's what he thinks or -- >> has she boxed him in? >> no, i don't think he's boxed in. this is a sup primely self-confident man, supremely smart man. he's got his two closest advisers. they differ. he'll make the decision. >> i love the way you do this, joan. he's a self-confident man. he can take a punch from a woman. thank you very much, joan walsh. i lost the way you do this. you can't win these arguments. you always win. jonathan martin. thank you for joining us. join us tomorrow night at 5:00

and 7:00 eastern for more "hardball." right now it's time for "the ed show" with ed schultz. good evening, americans, welcome to "the ed show" on msnbc tonight. here's some new material. the public option is now responsible for unemployment and the never-ending war in afghanistan. that's the newest righty talking point. here's minority whip eric cantor this afternoon on that. >> health care in this building has now made it so that we cannot seem to get anything else done. we have burning issues out there in this country. first and mooforemost is the americans want to see job security return. they want to see economic security return, but somehow we're unable to deliver on that because of the intrang jens on the majority's part, even discussing ways for us to agree on health care. we have serious, serious challenges as far as afghanistan is concerned.

that's being clouded by the ridge jidty by which the majority hangs on to hr 3200 and imposition of a public option. >> there's just so much to do. we can't do it. eric cantor's suggestion that if the public option were off the table, heck, all the republicans would be on board with health care reform. another lie. the republicans want one thing, do not forget this, my friends, and that is failure. they will blame the public option until the public option is dead and then they'll blame something else. they want to dismantle reform. they'll never work with the democrats on this. now, here's another dandy from mr. candor, himself. just a couple of days ago. the congressman holding one of his, well, his only health care town hall in the state of virginia. a woman named patricia churchill stood up and told this story. here it is. >> i have a