moderator david gregory will review his interview with bill clinton. and finally, rod blagojevich just can't help himself on his never-ending media tour. he now claims he's the anti-nixon. more of what he said in the "hardball" "sideshow." we begin with jamie rubin on the disclosure of the iran nuclear facility and president obama's response. jamie, according to several reports, we heard prior to this press conference and i think things that the president alluded to during his q&a session with the media, russia was kind of surprised with the revelation of this new nuclear development in iran. if, "a" do you believe that, and, "b" if they were surprised, does that make our position, vis-a-vis dealing with iran, stronger and why? >> first of all, i doubt the russians will end up surprised when they finished absorbing all the information that's been

provided and what the iranian i sass back because in the end this will be another enrichment of iranian facility, very similar to one that's already existed. the iranians will make the same arguments and in the end the russians will have to come to the same judgments. in a tactical sense, in a sort of today, tomorrow, the next day sense, the russians probably did not expect this to become a public issue right now. and they may not have had the same intelligence we had. when you examine very carefully the white house fact sheet about this facility they make clear that it doesn't change the intelligence community's assessment that iran has not begun an actual nuclear weapons program. and so we're back to the same dilemma that we've been facing for quite some time now. this revelation, today, is important. it has highlighted the dilemma we've been facing for quite some time, but it doesn't change that

dilemma. the dilemma is that iran is going full bore for the ability to enrich uranium to a level that is not weapons grade, but they will have the capability inherently to increase that. an inherent breakout capability. meanwhile, the u.s. intelligence community doesn't think they have a nuclear weapons program right now. so that difference between having an inherent capability, having a peaceful so-called nuclear energy program and actually building weapons is something where countries like the united states, france, and britain are extremely worried and they take a tougher stance. countries like russia and china, as long as they don't believe the iranians have begun actually enriching uranium to weapons grade, as long as they believe the iranians are still not actually engaged in a nuclear

weapons' program their response is going to be limited. we're going to be in the game the president was talking about in the last question which is some form of sanctions. >> you say the same dilemma. you just mentioned sanctions. i mean, the u.n. has been rather a toothless tiger when it comes to sanctions, has it not? we've been talking about sanctions as a country, vis-a-v vis-a-vis, iran, for 30 years. >> in the last three years president bush and now president obama have gone to the security council and sought some form of economic sanctions. they're quite limited. they effect certain industries, certain individuals, they're not, you know, the kind of embargo, say, that we have on cuba. i don't think we're going to get that kind of embargo. this information doesn't dramatically transform the case the iranians have or the case the americans have. it's very effective tactical intelligence that will put the pressure on russia, put the pressure on china, but it's not going to change their

fundamental position. we're not going to see an economic embargo, some sort of blockade of iran or something like that. the truth is, and this is what the last question brought out, which is most experts, most people involved have a hard time seeing why this particular regime, now that it's become even more extreme with this recent election and the crackdown, will capitulate in the face of an economic sanction of some kind. so this dilemma is going to become even starker in the coming months for the president. >> you know, you have lived within the diplomatic world for a large part of the -- >> you're about to throw one at me, aren't you? >> i'm not. i think the average person listening to you might say to themselves, you just referenced embargo in cuba and the average person might say, how crazy is this? the only missiles they have in

terms of why the u.s. has taken such an extreme stance. the bottom line posted against iran. there will be some form of restriction on certain oil products, maybe gasoline if we're lucky. in the end, this regime run by the more extreme version of the iranian revolution, those who have been left after this terrible crackdown which involved many of the members of

the government and the elite and the establishment there, breaking from the revolution their guard that seems to be in control. what's left of the iranian government is the least likely to be subject to economic sanctions, so all i'm saying here is that the president and his team have done a great job of highlighting the tactical situation to put some pressure on russia. now this is a major international issue they, themselves have highlighted it. have brought it to supersede the entire economic summit here in pittsburgh that's taking place, and, yet, the result as you saw in that last question, is no closer to achieving the iranian's stopping this program and we're headed for in the coming months, you know, some big questions. do we learn to live with this inherent capability or do we do something much more drastic?

>> we're joined now, jamie, by chuck todd, who is in pittsburgh, was at the press conference. chuck, jamie rubin, you just heard jamie talking about the answers to the last question that the president gave about sanctions. jamie seems to feel, correct me if i miss interpreted it, while russia and china will be on board, he thinks, for sanctions, they are tiptoeing into the realm of sanctions and might not end up agreeing with tougher sanctions nearly as tough as we would want. what's the feeling within the white house and the administration about how hooked into this russia and china happen to be? >> reporter: right now they're very bullish on the fact they think russia is on board. the statement that russia put out today was tougher than they would have thought they would have gotten out of the russians, say, even just a couple days ago. so they're bullish on this idea the russians privately really do feel a little bit burnt by the iranians. in the fact that the iranians

were concealing this. the u.s. folks that i've talked to some sources i've talked to indicate it's pretty clear to them the russian didn't know about this site. and that bothers them not on the intelligence front. that bothers them in that relationship. they've been out there defending iran. been sort of, you know, in many ways china has been hiding behind russia in this divide between british, between britain, france and the u.s. and where china and russia stood on this issue. so suddenly if you have russia aboard, the hope among those in the white house is that that will bring a reluctant china. they're still acting very reluctantly and they're not -- that's where i think jamie could be right in china may not be ready to go with as tough as sanctions at the u.s. would hope for. i tell you, on one hand they talk about north korea. say, we have the chinese on board some of the toughest sanctions against north korea anybody has gotten out of the

chinese in a long time. that's fine. iran is going to turn into a domestic political fight in this country. the pressure the president is going to feel on this front is different than north korea. you're going to see congressional democrats -- today, joe lieberman, evan bayh put out joint statements today about their feelings on iran. hawkish statement. message to the president about getting tough. there could be bipartisan bills that come out of congress with a lot of teeth. a lot of sanctions in it that could pop up as a bill for the president to sign before he can make any headway, frankly, when it comes to what he's trying to do. this b 5 plus 1. this line in the sand that the president sort of drew for next week, but then said, well, they have a few weeks. so, you know, look, it depends on what the iranians do. do they show up, number one? do they agree to basic, some basic things that these six nations have been asking them

for starting with allowing for inspections by the international atomic agency? >> speaking of the testing and the sites, take a look at the pictures of the alleged uranium facility in iran, released. the first was from march 2005 and the second is from january and 2009. i don't know what we can tell from that. i certainly can't tell anything from that, but jamie, let me ask you. chuck was talking about the domestic politics aspect of it here in the united states. joe lieberman, evan bayh. what do you think the situation is in tehran? they've gone through a summer of unrest based upon the elections and street riots. who's in charge in iran? ahmadinejad who's no longer the craziest guy in town. the guy from libya is even crazier this week. or is it the ayatollahs in iran? who's running that country?

>> two points first of all. after this crackdown this summer, it's clear that president ahmadinejad has more power than he did in his last term. the collective leadership that existed in iran for many, many years, decades is now split with the most extreme members of that collective leadership led by the leader mr. hamani and now president ahmadinejad, fully in charge and the more moderate so-called conservative, true conservatives, some of the clerics, a number of the business men, et cetera, the more reasonable ones are now in opposition to this government. so this is the most extreme government in iran that's ever existed. people will argue they've always been extreme. i think it's clear this is the most extreme government. it's clear to me, at least, what is going to happen at this meeting next week. iran has already made clear they're going to go in there, going to allow inspections of this facility sooner ar later and they're going to say this is

another example of our peaceful nuclear energy. this is an enrichment facility that the white house paper makes very clear is not a military facility. it's enriching up to 5% which is the energy level. it happens to be. this is quite interesting. at a republican revolutionary guard facility. so it's showing the potential military capabilities here. the dilemma hasn't changed. they say they can do enrichment at this 5% level and the international community says no. that's the problem. >> okay. thank you, jamie rubin and chuck todd. coming up, the democrats could be in for a rough 2010 campaign season. their fund-raising is dropping while the republicans are raking in the bucks. can the dems hang on how both houses of congress? national car rental knows i'm picky. so, at national, i go right past the counter...

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welcome back to "hardball." democrats may be bracing for a bit of a battle in the 2010 midterm election. fund-raising has dropped while republicans have been watching the cash flow into their coffers. what are democrats doing right? rich masters, democratic senator, former aide to landrieu. joe watkins, a republican strategist. i'm going to give you multiple choice to open this up. a, b, c and d. "a" the reason they are not able to raise the money they want to, is, we won. "b" we're in a rut.

"c" a bunch of wall street rich people who contributed to obama, oh, he's new, great, going to change everything. compensation restrictions, bonus restrictions. i'm not giving them any money other again. or "d" other. rich masters, what do you think it is? >> i think there's a little bit of truth in many of those. there's a little bit of complacency, i think. truthfully i think a lot of it has to do with the economy where we are right now. let me bring up another point, too, mike. i think that we're all kind of stunned that this president is actually governing. he's not running the presidency as if it's an extension of the dnc, much like we saw with the bush administration. it was an extension of the republican national committee. he's trying to govern. he's got a very busy agenda. senators and members of congress all have a busy agenda. health care, the economy, the environment really across the

board. barack obama has proven you can raise tens of millions of dollars when the idea is right and the motion is behind you and you can do that in a relatively quick period. i think democrats are in good position going into next year. we need to get health care done, keep this economy on the right track that it's on. >> joe, i can hear you shaking your head. >> rich gave a very, very nice spin. i have to take my hat off to him. that was a very kind spin. the reality is that, of course, the democrats are seeing their coffers dry up a bit because the big donors, big people who gave generously to barack obama's campaign in 2008 and other democrats are not happy because in part, yes, they don't like being the part of the administration whether it has to do with having to pay more than their fair share of taxes with the health care plan that will unfairly tax small businesses.

they don't like that. the other part becomes the small missteps taken by the administration over the last few months. there's a lot -- there was a lot of excitement about the president coming in back in january of this year, but it started to erode with the handling of various situations. for instance, health care that has not gone particularly well with democrats. of course, if you look at small things like more recently the lack of making some of those counties around atlanta federal disaster areas. then the last thing would be the handling of the new york governor's race that's upcoming in 2010. president obama, the african-american president, of course, made it known earlier this week that he does not wish for the black governor of new york to run for election in 2010. >> all right. okay. i'm going to give you -- based on the last one. that was pretty lame. okay? here's what i want you to do. here's what i want you to do. richard, i'm going to ask you to answer the same question. i'm an independent, joe and have

$1,000 i can play with. tell me a couple of things why i should contribute to a republican candidate. >> a republican candidate is going to allow you to keep more of your money and wants to reform health care but doesn't want to reform it on the backs of small business owners and not by taxing charitable contributions or by making the wealthy the whipping boy of any kind of legislative agenda. i'm going to give money to republicans because they're going to be more fiscally conservative and not enlarge the size of government, not create 52 new agencies to deal with health care or anything else. >> rich, tell mel why i should give my $12 1,000 to a democrat. >> it's simple. the reason you give $1,000, the majority of givers to the democratic parties are in $10, $20, $30, $40 dollars. the reason you give the thousand dollars, mike, to the democratic party, is several reasons. one, we all know that health care is unsustainable.

it's unsustainable for taxpayers. unsustainable for the government. barack obama and democrats have a plan to fix it and one that's not going to, you know, screw up insurance for people who already have it but focus on the folks who don't and let them have that. they're going to focus on getting the environment back on track and do it in a way that's going to create tens of thousands of green jobs. it's already working. if you want jobs, that's why you give $1,000 to the democratic party. barack obama is not getting the credit for the economy. there's at least three good reasons. i can go for another 20 minutes. >> joe, let me ask you, how do you think michael steele is doing in terms of raising money for the republican party? >> he's doing very, very well. that's probably the best measure of the job he's doing. he's got to raise money for the party, he's got to encourage great candidates to run in 2010, win those midterm elections, win back house seats and senator seats and governor races in 2010

and he's focused on that. >> rich, we can all agree we have a fairly angry electorate out there in a very volatile time in our country's history for reasons having very little to do with who is in office. let's state that. okay? how much more angry do you think the average person would be if they knew the amount of time their elected officials have to spend raising money? >> oh, i think they'd be furious about it. i mean, no one really knows. i mean, i worked in the senate. i know joe's worked with political leaders. i think it's a disgrace how much time you have to spend. if you want to be a united states senator and these are six-year terms, mike. i mean, if you realize you have to raise $20,000 on average, $20,000 a week for the entire time you're a united states senator, think about that. $1,000 increments, $2,000 ink represents. it's a disaster the amount of money in the system as it is right now which is one of the reasons i was a big supporter of barack obama's. he's actually fundamentally

changing it. look at the donor base for him as well as the democratic party it's coming from moms and pops, people who want to fundamentally change america. i think that's fundmently the way to change the entire system. >> last quick word on this sickening process. joe waut kins? >> rich makes a great point. senators and congressmen and others have to spend a lot of time, maybe too much time raising money from people. it certainly calls for -- makes it sound attractive to push for a term limit so we don't have people running again and again and again. at the same time, i don't see that the system changes any time soon. we have a shot in the 2010 to regain, recapture a number of house seats, certainly if we can make inroads in the northeast, that would be huge for republicans because we lot a lot of our footing there. 2010 is a real opportunity year. >> joe watkins, rich masters, thanks very much. up next, disgraced ex-illinois governor rod blagojevich won't stop talking. this latest offense next in "the

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i love his laugh. back to "hardball." time for the sideshow. first up, blago's blitz. rod blagojevich has a new book out claiming he's innocent of trying to sell president obama's senate seat and that the incriminating fbi wiretaps were taken out of context. here he is last night on "the daily show." >> i'm the anti-nixon. i want every tape recording heard by you. i want that released by you. >> it's not like you came out and everybody said, really, blagojevich? people in chicago are like, that sounds about right. >> no, i don't think that. >> that's what it seems like. >> i don't think that.

would a guilty man say listen to all the tapes or would an innocent man say listen to the tapes? you'll hear the truth in the tapes. my accusers won't let you hear them. >> people can convince themselves of a lost of things. >> that's a sneak peek of what we might see during blago's trial next june. next, live from new york, last night the thursday edition of "snl's" weekend update brought back their take on new york governor david paterson. here's paterson's comment on president obama who reportedly tried to discourage him from running from re-election. >> why do you think he's getting involved? >> probably just has a bunch of time to kill. oh, wait, he's the busiest man in the world and he took time to bully me, a fellow black democrat. that's like the pope calling a local priest to tell him to go to hell. by the way, you know how to go to hell, chris? take the tunnel straight to new jersey. >> the obligatory new jersey

joke. time for tonight's big number. cbs/"the new york times" poll asks americans who they thought had better ideas about reforming the het health care system. president obama or republicans in congress? president won out. how big is his advantage on health care? 25 points. he bought out republicans 52% to 27% when it comes to who americans trust on health care. the president has a sizable advantage, 25 points. that's tonight's "big number." conservative critics are calling this video of new jersey schoolchildren singing the praises of president obama. brainwashing. what's going on here? pat buchanan and david corn will debate it next. discover a light yogurt like no other. activia light! delicious, fat free, and above all... the only one that has bifidus regularis and is clinically proven to help regulate your digestive system.

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i'm christina brown. police in southern california have arrested a 16-year-old boy suspected of setting more than a dozen wildfires. authorities say the teen could be responsible for as many as 14 acts of arson dating back to 2006. thousands of protesters marched in pittsburgh today on the final day of the g-20 conference. this week's protests were almost entirely nonviolent. president obama said he respectfully disagrees with protesters who view trade as the source of global unequalty. terror suspect najibullah zazi back in fork. he was flown to a detention facility in brooklyn for conspireing to use weapons of mass destruction on u.s. soil. paul kirk was officially sworn in on capitol hill today. taking over for the late senator ted kennedy. his appointment gives democrats

a filibuster proof 60-vote majority in the senate. now back to "hardball." welcome back to "hardball." there's a new video making its way around the internet that shows public elementary students in burlington, new jersey, singing about president obama during black history month. we've blurred the students faces. pay attention if you can to the lyrics on the screen. let's watch.

mmm, mmm, mmm, was a that song appropriate or not? should a public school teacher instruct children to since a song about the president? pat buchanan, when he was in grammar school he sang a song to cleveland, the same as those kids did. dave corn, washington bureau chief for mother jones. patrick j. buchanan, what is your take on this, as you listen to talk radio, it has become an incendiary issue in the last couple days. what's your view? >> mike, i have to say i was in the soviet union in 1971 and they took us into these little daycare centers and little kids of young pioneers came out and sang to father lennon. one of these little himm hymnal.

look, father lennon and barack obama are different. barack obama is president of the united states. these kids are cute, they're singing. they're innocent. i laughed my head off when i saw the thing on the web. i'll tell you this, i think the teacher comes right out -- she had these kids working it quite perfectly. it's either that or this is the opening of daycare center at mother jones magazine. >> david, your turn on that one. >> well, maybe we could use a sideline enterprise here. i don't think anybody can defend this. what i find funny is that on a day we discover there's iranian secret nuclear facility, you know, barack obama was up at the u.n. talking about securing loose nukes. we have 47 million people unemployed, still have an economy that's teetering and conservative bloggers are getting worked up about this one classroom? a, it shouldn't have happened.

the teachers should be teaching them maybe about grover cleveland. you know, path buchanan's favorite president. you know, it shouldn't have happened. end of story. not everything, not everything that appears on the internet has to be a big controversy. >> you know what i think, mike? when you went to parochial school, we would march to little drills like that but they weren't to barack hussein obama. >> the interesting thing, pat, when i was in parochial school we literally at the beginning of each day would say the pledge of allegiance and toast the president of the united states. it was then dwight david eisenhower. >> you would toast? >> with a glass of milk. with a glass of milk. >> when we did it we came in from recess at noon, you gave the pledge of allegiance, then you had all the prayers. before school in the morning you went to mass and walked into your classes. that was done at noon like you guys did it up there. it wasn't ike. it was fdr. my father was unhappy if we were

saying anything nice about him. >> i got to tell you guys, i had a very different upbringing. in my school we used to sit in the back of the station wagon chant lbj, lbj, how many kids did you kill today? different times. >> little schoolhouse you went you, huh, david? >> pat, david following pat, let me tell you what i find interesting about this. i agree with david. you know, that this shouldn't have been done. i sort of understand the context of it. the teacher retired at the end of the year. you know, was probably personal to the teacher. she gets little second and third grade kids to go along with it. this video that is now rocketing around the internet combined with the reaction just a couple of weeks ago to the president speaking to schoolchildren, i'm wondering, pat, what's your view on how incendiary the air, the

atmosphere, is around barack obama on the internet and on talk radio. what is causing this? what does -- are they afraid of him? >> you know, look, conservatives have always been concerned about public education, what children are being taught and whether traditional values and all this are drawn out. mike, you have a very good point. this will tent tend to confirm s out there who believe these kids are indoctrinated in values, beliefs and politics which aren't theirs at home. they're being taken away from their parents. i thought of the old pioneers. these little kids were singing, chiefs, what are these kids going to grow up to be? that is the fear i think you'll find of millions of parents who see this o ut there. the kids are very cute but there is a sort of chilling aspect to it. >> i would hazard to guess in that particular town most of the parents probably voted for barack obama as well.

nevertheless, you know, this shouldn't have happened but your question is whether there are people out there ready to pounce on anything. i mean, you have the t.e.a. baggers in town here a couple weeks ago running around with posters that made barack obama look like hitler. you know, i didn't see -- >> that's nasty stuff. >> it's nasty stuff. >> this is -- this is disturbing, david, in the sense that kids go to school. they're not there to be indoctrinated. it sure looks like it. >> we both agree this should not have happened. the secondary question, now, becomes, how big a deal is this and should people be using this to, you know, fuel the fires that they're already burning on other fronts? this has nothing to do -- >> are you saying they shouldn't see this? shouldn't be on the internet? >> of course they should see it. this shouldn't happen again. i mean, when it comes to what's happening in the world at large, what this little two-minute video from a classroom in new

jersey really is not that significant. >> you and i can talk about iran and what their facility is all about, but parents who have kids who are 6 and 7 years old, i sent them to teach them about god, conservative traditionalists. they see this on the internet and say, what's going on in our schools? it is disturbing to them. something they ought to see if it's not representative -- if it's not representative, fine. >> this is an outlier. that's the problem with our national -- >> how do you know that? how do you know that? >> give me the evidence this has happened any place else. this is an outlier. >> give me the evidence it hasn't. >> you know better than anyone you can't prove a negative. get mad about things -- >> you know what's really interesting? >> mmm, mmm, barack hussein obama. >> it's catchy.

>> listen, in schools across america now, they're cutting back on music classes. be happy for this. >> what's really interesting to me as a parent of seven children is the idea that so many radio talk show hosts and bloggers and apparently some parents as well think that the attention span of a second grader or a third grader is going to be such that this song or any song is going to stick with them beyond like that evening. i mean, it's crazy. >> mike, they had that stuff down pretty well. they've been working on it. >> i think the song will stick around. >> david corn, pat buchanan, thanks very much. up next, back to our top story. iran's newly revealed nuclear site. how should president obama handle the major test on the world stage? perfect 10 -- the 10 minute phenomenon from nice 'n easy. rich color, stunning high gloss,

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