scene and we'll bring them to you live. a grsome twist in the investigation of an american killed in mexico. the decapitated head of the lead investigator was found. will this threat keep mexican officials from searching for david hartley's body? plus -- >> you e-mail me and i'll go down, i'll fly to a school, and we'll go talk to the bullies for you. >> this guy is creating a lot of buzz. he's a mixed marsutial arts fighter. he talks about his plan to crack down on bullying. he's saying this is not about violence. he wants to use his personal story. he's received thousands of messages from kids who want his help. good day to you. i'm tamron hall. we're following the emotional, tearful rescue playing out in chile. 18 out of the 33 miners that have been trapped more than 2,000 feet underground are seeing their loved ones and

breathing fresh air for the first time in 70 days. the amazing pictures have captivated the world for hours. first out around 11:00 last night was florencio avalos, whose son burst into tears when he saw his father's face. he was followed by mario sepulveda, who they're calling super mario. he pumped his fist in the air, showing that he is a survivor. we've been watching the miners emerge one by one for about 15 hours now. kerry sanders has been at the scene all night. we're going to get to kerry in a second. kerry, if you were watching msnbc, he was right there. he was live with lawrence o'donnell covering this event. and you could see the joy because kerry has been talking with these family members day after day, waiting to see if it was possible that their loved ones could be brought out of that situation safely. i understand kerry is ready for

us now. kerry, we just watched yet another rescue. i got to tell you, i was watching you last night and you could feel the excitement that those families were sharing with you through your emotions. >> you know, how could it not be infectious because of what's taking place here? calculate 70 days below earth and then everybody said it wasn't possible and then they were coming up. and now it's continuing. and it may actually be wrapped up by tonight because they're moving so further ahead of the schedule than they actually thought. they thought this would take 48 hours. this started just after midnight last night and now we continue to see that the tempo is improving. the family members are, you know, going up and being brought out and every one of them is getting that same opportunity to greet their loved ones coming up that shaft 2,040 feet a shaft

that's 28 inches wide through the hardest rock on earth. the capsule, 26 inches wide. the fenix 2, as the miners are climbing in, it's working flawlessly. the engineering involved in this, the tests, all of the efforts that have gone into this, an estimated 1,000-plus people involved in preparing all aspects of this rescue. the helicopter pilots taking them to the hospital, the reports from the hospital thus far that everybody looks great. i mean, you could not have thus far a happier ending, and every family member now still waiting now that we're past the halfway point. they have the confidence that it's going to be perfect for all of them all the way down to miner number 33. >> and we just watched, kerry, the 18th miner, esteban rojas, in the last hour. next up is pablo rojas, his cousin. what else can you tell us about his story? >> i have one of those baseball

cards to keep track of these guys. i did not meet his family, so he's 45 years old. he's a -- as you know, he is the cousin. his nickname is conita. and he is -- he's actually what they say in an interview that his wife did with the newspaper down here, a very pragmatic gentleman. when his wife asked him how are you doing, he said, okay. during this ordeal while he was down there. >> we just watched his cousin, esteban, pulled to the surface. kerry, give me an update on the timeline when we might see pablo rojas pulled to the surface. >> well, if it's keeping the tempo that they've had, we're doing now in just under an hour. the mission to the surface is about a 14 to 17-minute ride up.

and thus far, the reports back are all getting on board have experienced no mental problems. there was a serious concern of somebody panicking. even those who have some conditions like heart conditions have not shown anything other than a calm nature as they arrive up to the surface, which is really good news. of course, you know because of the communications, those who are on the surface and what their experiences are like being transmitted down to the guys over the video conference. so that they can kind of have an idea from those that are going up what to expect. >> all right, kerry sanders live for us still on the ground in copiapo, chile. we'll bring you developments as soon as they make a move. with me now to talk about how harrowing these rescues are is bruce dial. bruce, thanks for joining me. >> it's good to be here. >> let me talk to you first about the condition of these miners. what do you think about this?

so far, no physical issues, no mental issues that we can see. you saw the one miner known as super mario leaping out of that capsule, pumping his fist. what do you make of their condition? >> well, they've had a couple of months now to prepare for it. and i guess after that long period of time, they were glad to be getting out. and they've been able to control their emotions and control their fears and come out and join their family. >> how incredible of a rescue is this? i mean, we know that this will break records. no one has stayed underground this long. 70 days. the first 17 of those, these men were believed to vbeen dead. they survived on a teaspoon of tuna and biscuits. what does this say about our hope that we have a great ability to save miners who have become trapped? >> well, it's an ordeal that hasn't been accomplished before to this level.

they got the miners out of quecreek, but they were only down there for four days. they got these miners out -- well, they didn't find them for 17 days. that ordeal in iticiself, they didn't know if they'd be found or not. it was miraculous that they found them. and then to set up this plan to go in and get them out with this kind of setup is something that's never been done before. >> it is amazing to see. something that's never been done before. we greatly appreciate you joining me today. thank you. if you just can't get enough of this story, head over to tv.msnbc.com. there is an interactive feature with info on all of the miners. you can go to that to get more information. also, another big story, tiffany hartley says her heart is aching today after news of a chilling discovery in the search for the body of her husband. a texas sheriff now says the decapitated head of a mexican police commander investigating that case was discovered in a suitcase outside a mexican army

base. janet shamlian has more from texas. obviously, that severed head was meant to send a message and the worry is now from tiffany hartley and her family that this will keep the search -- this will prevent them from searching for her husband. >> and it appears it has had that impact, tamron. because although mexican authorities say the search continues for david hartley's body, on the united states side, looking at what's happening from mexico, the sheriff says he has not seen any activity for 24, 36 hours. so this could, indeed, be having a chilling effect. how could it not? a decapitated head in a suitcase on top of a vehicle left outside of a mexican army base. this guy was the lead investigator in the jet ski murder. he spent all day searching for david hartley. did not return home to his own family. and then the next day, his head was found outside of this base. as for tiffany hartley, she says

she will not be going over to mexico. she feels terrible for this family. she'd met this man. he said he would do his best to bring david hartley's body home. now he has ended up a victim himself, tamron. the story just gets more bizarre at every turn. >> you are absolutely right. thank you for the latest, janet. new developments in the 10-year-old cancer survivor feared dead in north carolina. family and friends claim that zahra baker's step-mother, elisa, had a bad temper and took her anger out on that little girl. one neighbor claims she witnessed elisa meeting zahra. neighbors say that zahra was home schooled and they rarely even saw the child. zahra baker's step-mother was in court this morning facing charges of felony obstruction of justice after admitting she wrote a fake ransom note found at the family's home. well, 20 days before the november midterms, one of the hottest senate races involves three-term democrat russ

feingold fighting to hold on to his seat against ron johnson. johnson says if elected, he will fight to repeal health care reform. and just minutes ago, michelle obama appeared at a fund-raiser in milwaukee for feingold. >> my husband also said something about russ that i think is worth repeating today. he said that russ is always looking out for the people of this state. and i think that's clear in just about everything russ has done during his time here in office. >> joining me now, dominica. this is a tough fight for russ feingold. it's a seven-point difference between russ feingold and johnson. >> yeah. just a fascinating race. another bit of what michelle obama said today, she actually said russ feingold and i have another thing in common. we disagree with the president at times.

so everybody sort of distancing themselves from obama, even his wife. but, you know, this is a fascinating race. wisconsin, people should remember, even though barack obama won it overwhelmingly in 2008, it was a close state the year before. if we're moving back to a 2004 readjustment, feingold is going to have a tough time. you know, it shouldn't be surprising that he would have a tough race. he has never won with more than 55% of the vote. you know, he's definitely in some polls trailing. and, you know, has a little bit of an uphill fight, tamron. >> all right, deminico. thank you. we'll keep an eye on the first lady. she has a lot of stops ahead of her. the republican candidate for governor of new york is now apologizing. sort of. for remarks that he made that offended some gays. carl paladino says i sincerely apologize for any comment that may have offended the gay and lesbian community. he also promises if elected as

your governor, i will stand and fight for all gay new yorkers' rights. paladino did not back down on the content of the comments he made sunday when he said kids should not be brainwashed into thinking it's okay to be gay or to be taken to a disgusting gay pride parade. joining me now, michael smerconish. michael, in his statement, paladino says i should have chosen better words. what do you make of what he's saying now? >> well, i think there are two issues. first of all, i don't buy the apolo apology. when people say, may have offended, or i wipe it out beca it's fake. he should have said, boy, did i say something stupid and that's not the real me. shy of that, i'm not buying it. issue number one, the comments that he made -- you've addressed those already. but issue number two, tamron, is the fact that he acknowledges in this statement that he was

handed a script. and he read from the script. high w he was appearing in front of a special interest group. it was a conservative religious organization. imagine if he walked into goldman sachs or wall street, bp, anywhere, and someone handed him a script and said, here, governor-to-be, just read these words and he went along with the program. that shows an appalling lack of independence. >> let me ask you also, paladino actually had two properties. he owned two properties that housed gay bars. so in a sense they were saying that he has received money from gay organizations or gay club owners. gay for pay, i think, was the headline for "the huffington post." here he is renting out his property, gay bars are there. he didn't have a problem with that. >> well, you're right. as long as the money is green, it's okay with paladino the businessman. i think it's appalling. he's being held accountable for

things that were written for him that he didn't say. now it all makes sense. gets handed the script, he looks at it, he stutters and stammers while he's reading. some he says aloud, some he doesn't. lack of independence and an appalling lack of treatment toward gays and lesbians. >> michael smerconish, thanks. robert gates says that there will be enormous consequences if the u.s. military abruptly ends the don't ask, don't tell policy. but will the white house still appeal? the latest also on what defense secretary robert gates has to say. and a big shake-up in education reform. and this is not something you see every day. what are we looking at? you're watching "news nation" on msnbc. [ female announcer ] last year, the u.s. alone

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welcome back. our cameras are, of course, in

copiapo, chile. we're waiting for the 19th miner, pablo rojas. he's married, worked in the mines for less than a half a year. only about a half hour ago, his cousin, esteban, was pulled to the surface. so he is inside fenix 2. that's the capsule. we are waiting for yet another rescue to play out live on television. in the meantime, defense secretary robert gates says abruptly ending the don't ask, don't tell policy will have enormous consequences for troops. he said the question about whether to repeal the law should be decided by congress and only after the pentagon completes its study of the issue. his comments came a day after a federal judge ordered the military to immediately stop enforcing the policy against gays serving openly. pete williams joins us live now. you can imagine people are saying, it depends on who is in control of congress. we know the democrats are in trouble in the house and perhaps even the senate. how does gates' comments factor

into that equation? >> and the president said much the same, tamron. echoing what secretary gates said today, the president's spokesman, robert gibbs, said that what the president believes here is the process is more important than the decision itself, that it's important for congress to make the change, not the courts. so this, i think, is a pretty strong indication that the next step we'll see is the justice department go to court and try to put a freeze on the judge's order. it was a judge in california yesterday who ordered the u.s. military to stop enforcing don't ask, don't tell. to stop investigations of suspect service members, to stop removal or separation proceedings. and what we expect the justice department to do now is to go to court and say, look, put a freeze on that order, let don't ask, don't tell continue while we decide, we the government, whether to appeal. it would seem from what the president and secretary gates say that they believe the government should appeal. the court battle is by no means

over on this, tamron. >> thank you, pete. greatly appreciate your report. well, testimony begins in the ft. hood shooting case. that tops our look at stories around the "news nation" today. an army sergeant wounded last november told a military court accused gunman nadal hassan shouted "god is great" in arabic before shooting. he is charged with killing 13 people and wounding 32 others. authorities in all 50 states and the district of columbia have launched a joint investigation into allegations that mortgage companies mishandled documents and broke laws in foreclosing of hundreds of thousands of homes. and take a look at this dash cam video. this is out of west melbourne, florida. police tased a jogger wearing nothing but goggles. are you a jogger when you're not wearing shoes or jogging clothes? anyway, i digress. the jogger told police he was a

superhero. see, he wasn't a jogger. he was a superhero. i knew it look at this guy. this is a mixed martial artist star. he says he used to get bullied when he was growing up. now he's got a plan to stop bullies in their tracks without violence. his tough message. plus, there's no longer a situation on "dancing with the stars." aren't you going to misthose abs? "news nation" is back in three minutes. s those abs? "news nation" is back in three minutes. ready to try something new? campbell's has made changes. adding lower sodium sea salt to more soups. plus five dollars in coupons to get you started.

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you e-mail me, and i'll go down -- i'll find your school and we'll go talk to the bullies for you. >> so a man who makes his living beating up other people is laying down the smackdown, you might say, on bullies.

he's not doing this, though, with raising his fists. mma star daniel pewter wants to talk to kids who are targeting their peers. he gave his e-mail address to tmz, and how his inbox is exploding with messages from around the world. he joins me now live from burbank, california. thanks for joining me, daniel. >> thank you for having me. how are you? >> i'm cool. you were at a bar or a restaurant and some people wonder if you were being serious when you said this. what were you thinking at the time? >> you know, i mean, i wrote something on my facebook a few days before. it's a big topic. it got a lot of comments and a lot of likes on facebook. and i thought it was just a, you know, when they approached me, i thought it was a good topic to talk on. >> you speak from experience. i mean, a lot of people see you fight and they can't imagine that you were someone like so many of us, quite honestly, who were bullied. >> yeah. you know, i was in special ed my whole life.

when you're in the special room, you're taking tests different than other people. it's -- it's, you know, it's hard. people make fun of you. you can't comprehend. you can't read as fast. so it -- it's a lot different. >> right. it has an effect on how you see things. you were brave enough to survive it, move forward. as you know, there have been other young kids as of late who have been bullied for a number of reasons, including them being gay or perceived gay and they've taken their own lives. this is life and death for so many kids, daniel. what are you hearing from the kids who have reached out to you? >> you know, we just got our first good e-mail back. a positive e-mail where a girl e-mailed me a few days ago, she finally went to her mother, they went to the principals and the principals instantly took care of this. >> wow. >> so i'm very thankful that i can see little improvements. that's what i'm here for. >> what is your message to bullies? >> you know, i'm taking a couple

of steps back. this happened five days ago. the biggest thing, there's so much out there. and in the next three to four weeks when i go to japan to wrestle, we're going to come back with a complete plan on how to tackle this one step at a time. >> you know, i think it's cool that you're reaching out. you make your living beating up people, you might say, but you're reaching out to kids. one step at a time. you're able to help one kid already. pretty cool. thanks, daniel. we wish you the best with your next match. >> thank you. a live look from the mine in copia copiapo, chile. we're waiting for pablo rojas. he is inside the capsule. he should be at the surface any minute now. another live rescue playing out here. plus, should you have to pay a fine for not locking up your own car when it's parked on the street? it's supposed to be a crime-fighting measure, but you could get the short end of the deal. it's our gut-check poll of the day. you're watching "news nation." [ male announcer ] sitting, waiting, hoping.

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19th miner, pop lablo rojas, ha been pulled to the service. live for us. he is following the same routine as the others who went before him including the 18th miner who was his cousin, esteban. he, again, according to kerry sanders when he spoke with his wife through the e-mails and video correspondence they were able to have underground said he was doing okay. he's 45 years old. he helped oversee the coming and going of packages to the mine. he's worked at that mine for approximately six months. and he was trapped underground with his cousin, esteban. his sister, cecilia and many other family members, his mother included, will be there at the scene. he spoke to his family on sunday, told them he was doing well and that he's happy and calm and counting down the minutes until he could see his family. that time is now. you see he also has the sunglasses on to protect his

eyes. he's smiling. he wants to give the thumbs up, not wanting to put on that helmet. again, another rescue. pablo rojas. they are past the halfway mark here. getting those 33 men, if this all goes well, and it has gone off so far without a hitch. if you've been watching this play out since last night, it's just been mesmerizing to watch. you see a wonderful embrace there. i assume from a family member. let's listen in to a little bit of celebration. [ applause ]

>> there you have it, with his hands extended in the air. can you believe it, 70 days not being able to see the light of day until this moment. someone yelling out, pablo. he's going to follow the same course as the other miners prior. they will be evaluated, get some personal time. both physical and mental evaluations to make sure these men who survived something that no other human has quite honestly survived are able to deal with their adjustments now that they are back in safety. we're watching the 19th rescue. pablo rojas. his cousin, esteban. let's listen in. got to love it. next on the list is dario

segovia. his father was trapped in a mine for a week. he is marriemarried. he has some medical conditions, including vision problems. his sister said that when her brother finally surfaces, she'll tell him that she loves him and then she said with a smile, i'll kick him in the backside because he's never going into a mine again. we are waiting on quite a welcome there. and then he will be followed by the 21st rescue, yonni bearrios. he's made headlines not only because he's waiting to be rescued, but because his wife and mistress were at one point outside of the mine. his wife said that he sent her a note asking that they both be there when he reaches the surface. his wife is now boycotting his rescue. so there is drama. there is intrigue. but most importantly, there are fathers, sons who are returning to their families. what is saving the miners is a piece of technology that is simply called the fenix 2.

it's the capsule. it is the latest gismo, if you will, to keep the miners safe and get them to the surface without any trouble. it has to make at least 33 trips of about a mile. richard louie got the chance to get inside that capsule. i cannot imagine how that would feel. >> yeah. as we watch all of these miners come up from the mine, we're going, what are they going through as they're in there for 15 minutes? what we're able to see here was a capsule that was built back in 1972. this capsule cost $25,000 to build at that time. in fact, this specific capsule inspired the phoenix that tamron has been talking about for this last hour. this is what we found about that capsule. take a look. >> the didameter is 21 inches o the inside. and i have the ability to actually have light outside, but you can imagine through the 15-minute trip that they'll be taking from the bottom of the mine going up 2,000 feet,

they'll have to keep their hands down to the side like this. >> you have to remember, too, that in a 26-inch diameter hole, you're going to have a stone wall right here the entire time as you're coming up. >> one of the dynamics would be i would have vision that might go two to three inches. i'll have a portion that will be smooth because there's a well casing for the top 3330 feet. below that depth, it's going to be rock. it may even hit me in the face as the feels abrade. because the fenix has wheels on the top and the bottom to assist it as a turns. this capsule also will rotate just a little to the left or to the right as it makes those turns, making it up that half a mile course. and, again, there would be mesh in this space. let me grab the camera just to get a sense of how packed it is in here. as i get in here.

i do this because i really want to give you a sense of how tight it is as we move in some of the safety levers there. the top, you can see, which is only about a foot. i'll need that should i know in an emergency because i would put on that harness that you see above me. let me show you what it looks like below. the amount of stapace i've got here. i'm 5'10'', 150. not a big guy. my shoulders are lockstep side-to-side here. my shoulder is right up against the left side. my right shoulder is right there. so if i were, you know, any bigger -- i'm only a 38. it would be very difficult to survive or fit in here, shall i say, based on the space that's in here. all right, bill. thanks. let's get me out of here. you do want to get out of there, tamron. there's another guy dressed up as a miner. this guy is josh. 6'2'', 300 pounds. i said i'm 150. i don't think this guy can get

in. but he was able to get in. he scrunched himself up. that's the capital from a wide view. interesting features. they use bronze around the side of this capsule because it does not spark as much. and the pulley at the top, you can attach it to yourself and there's an escape lever that's right where your butt is. you hit that and then the bottom drops out in case the capsule gets stuck and you need to get out. or if you're feeling you need to get out of that capsule. there's only two or three of these designed according to the foundation that brought that over. >> that is impressive. it gives you a different perspective to see. i'm standing next to you and to see you inside there, that is amazing, the technology. perhaps what we've seen in these rescues will help improve safety for miners not just in chile where it's like 40% of the economy that comes in is from mining, but here in this country as well. it's spectacular to see. and if -- by the way, a couple of things. we'll continue coverage as we just saw the rescue of pablo

rojas. we're expecting another rescue very soon. and here's a tidbit. the 12th miner rescued, edison pena, he's 34 years old and he wanted elvis presley music to it relax. graceland formally invited edison pena to come to memphis and hang out with them. so life is already changing for his miners. that's pretty cool. we have a picture of edison pena for you. graceland extended an invite for him and loved ones to visit elv elvis' home in memphis. >> disney land is next. >> probably. >> all right, richard. thank you. if you can't get enough of this exciting story, head over to tv.msnbc.com. there's an interactive feature, info on the miners. there are still minorers trappe and we hope they have that

smooth ascension ride. superman or superwoman has officially left the classroom. d.c. public school's chancellor michelle rhee is featured heavily in the documentary "waiting for superman." she has announced that she will resign at the end of this month. >> we have agreed together that the best way to keep the reforms going is for this reformer to step aside. the thought of not being in this role anymore is hareart-breakin to put it mildly, but i do know it is the right thing for the school system and the right thing most importantly for the children of d.c. >> rhee drew the wrath of unions after firing more than 200 d.c. teachers and putting 700 more on notice that they would be fired based largely on student performance. rehema ellis covers education for nbc news. janua we saw "waiten for superman" and michelle rhee talked about how few chancellors in that

department come back, that it's a job that breaks you and now she's leaving. >> it is very interesting because even in just 3 1/2 years, she is one of the longest-running tenured chancellor s in washington, d.c, which tells you that there is not longevity in this job. it is a very difficult position. as you know, people talked about it was one of the worst performing school districts in the nation. and she was brought in by the outgoing mayor, adrian fenty, to try to turn things around. he gave her license to make bold changes. she did just that, but in the process along the way, she also made a lot of people very angry and very upset. she talked about that today. she and i had a one-on-one sit-down interview, not so long ago, and she said it's a very sad day for her. because she was actually anticipating not only finishing out one term with adrian fenty as mayor and she as chancellor, but a second term. but as you know, when this all went up to a vote before the

residents of washington, d.c., much of fenty's term became in many ways a referendum of michelle rhee's tenure as chancellor and the voters voted her out. >> incredible development here. thank you very much, rahema. a bad situation. let's get the scoop from corte haslet. you've got a short segment. i can't believe this is the one thing that survives. >> i know. when the world ends, we'll be left with the situation. we know him from "jersey shore." he's no longer on "dancing with the stars." it means there's no more regular coverage of the situation on our air waves. "jersey shore" is over. he's off "dancing with the stars." he received a score of 28 out of 60 his last round. >> does this mean young people don't watch that show? >> or his fans just finally have turned on him somewhat. he's really bad at this. at some point, you have to be a good dancer. he said, you know what, i told

myself if i got eliminated, i put it all out on the floor last night. no regrets. >> i thought it would be the situation and the hoff as the finals. >> i think it would have been fantastic if that was what happened, but jennifer gray is waltzing her way toward the finals. >> richard's piece in the -- >> inside that capsule. >> that's amazing. horrifying to see. >> it's turning out to be a great live event that we're watching, but for the very latest entertainment news, i can't keep my mind off the chilean miners. go to msnbc.com, be a fan on facebook as well. like the rest of us, courtney is watching the chilean miners. there's only been one living medal of honor recipient since the vietnam war. should there be more?

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welcome back. we're whopping breaking news out of copiapo, chile, where the 20th miner is expected to be brought to the surface within -- we estimate maybe another 30, 40 minutes now. we're waiting to get a visual on whether or not dario segovia has been placed inside that fenix 2 capsule. he's 48 years old. he's married. he suffers from some slight medical problems including vision problems. his father was also a miner.

and we are waiting, again, for the 20th miner to be pulled to the surface within this hour. we saw number 19, pablo rojas, pulled to the surface, greeted by family members. so we will bring the latest developments to you as this plays out on live television. and one week ago today, president obama awarded the congressional medal of honor to army staff sergeant robert miller. the 24-year-old was killed two years ago during an ambush giving his life to save 22 american and afghan soldiers. for his heroism and valor, he was awarded the nation's highest award. last month it was announced that staff sergeant salvatore junta would become the first living recipient of that medal. the question floating around some military circles is why aren't we seeing more medals of honor being handed out, given the 150,000 u.s. troops in iraq and afghanistan combined? i'm joined by jack jacobs.

colonel jacobs is a recipient of the congressional medal of honor. sir, it's great to have you. john, you brought this story to my attention when we spoke last week. what is the issue here? why aren't we seeing more of these medals being handed out? >> well, there's a big debate about that. i don't actually agree with congressman duncan hunter on a lot. he's an iraq war veteran that serves, congress. but he's brought this to light. you know, asking the pentagon why we're not handing out this many medals of honor. it's 1 per 1 million in the wars in iraq and afghanistan. in other conflicts, it's 28 per 1 million. some people say it's the type of combat that's different in this war. how do you get a medal for valor for not getting killed by an ied road bomb? they vet maybe the personal aspects of someone's life more than what they've done in combat, but no matter what, they're not handing out as many medal of honors as prior and it should be looked at.

it's hard to -- colonel jacobs is only the third medal of honor winner i've actually met. it's always been difficult. it's more difficult for these veterans. >> i agree. there are other factors as well. i also believe that it's a highly political thing. the kind of combat in which we've been engaged for most of the time since the statue in baghdad came down has not been the kind that was conducive to actions in which medal of honor would be recommended. but also it is very, very highly subjective. i remember the observation of a -- a guy named bob carey who is currently the president of the new school in new york, was governor of nebraska, was a senator from nebraska, himself a medal of honor recipient as an s.e.a.l., lost his leg in vietnam. someone asked him what it takes to get a medal of honor? he said, you have to do something, people have to see it, they have to be able to write, and they can't hate you.

>> john, how do we change our how does the conversation move past talking into action if it is the right thick thng that mo these medals should be handed out or awarded? >> i think since president obama has taken over, he's awarded more medals of honors. i think the other thing, though, that people like colonel jacobs or bob carey, i'm hoping the medal of honor community can bring light on this as well. nobody has more credibility for people to look into this. >> colonel jacobs, will that happen? >> the medal of honorer society, which comprises all living recipients, is not allowed to politic by congressional charter. it's difficult except as individuals to go out there and do the kinds of things that we're talking about, make -- particularly people in the defense people need to understand the service and sacrifice of the young men and women out there now and who have

served before now. >> thank you for bringing this story to my attention. greatly appreciate it. thank you, both. if you do not want to lock your parked car, and that should be your choice, should you have to pay a fine? a pennsylvania town is considering doing just that. what does your gut tell you about that? she stays tough! earlier, she had an all-over achy cold... what's her advantage? it's speedy alka-seltzer! [ male announcer ] alka-seltzer plus rushes relief for all-over achy colds. the official cold medicine of the u.s. ski team. alka-seltzer plus.

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welcome back. this just in, video of the 20th miner getting inside the fenix 2 capsule on his way to the surface. he is dario segovia. he's on his way up. we'll continue to follow this breaking news out of chile and bring you, of course, the latest rescue as soon as it happens. time for the "news nation" gut check. lock your car or face a fine? a philadelphia township is considering proposal a fine for people who don't lock up their

own wheels. it's supposed to be a crime-fighting tactic, but should residents be punished because they decide not to lock up their own cars? doug shimell has more. >> reporter: on one hand, they feel safe enough to leave their cars unlocked here, but on the other, police say they have created open season for thieves in upper moreland township. >> it's an enabling issue. it provides the people with these drug abuse problems to be able to just go down a block, check doors and grab something of value to trade for drugs. >> reporter: investigators claim 3/4 of the car break-ins here are because the car was left unlocked, so police want to be aibl ble to ticket people wh keep leaving their cars unlocked in a public area. >> i think they should, yeah. you're supposed to lock your car. >> if my truck gets broken into,

i lose my livelihood. >> reporter: tom says he always locks his van and isn't sure ticketing makes sense. >> that sounds ridiculous. if they've got the time to check everybody's car, i mean, what about the perpetrators? >> reporter: police say their proposal isn't designed to punish the occasionally forgetful. it's to anger people into remembering. >> i think it's a good idea. i mean, if it's happening to the same people over and over again, then they should get the hint to lock their cars. >> that was doug s hrkhimell reporting. what does your gut tell out yyo this one? take a look at what the "news nation" is saying about yesterday's gut check. should a state take away a child from its parents because of political beliefs or allegations that it was based on political beliefs? 60% of you say yes, if it's putting the child at risk. 40% of you say it's

unconstitutional. that does it for this wednesday's edition of "news nation." i'm tamron hall. [ male announcer ] if you think you can only charge your things

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we have breaking news as we start the show. the 20th miner is coming out in copiapo, chile. it's a very exciting moment. this is basically a slow-motion miracle that we're watching here. these people were in a lot of trouble. of course, in the beginning before they were discovered, there was very, very little hope. then they were discovered, and now after a long time, they're being pulled out. you can see family there waiting for the 20th worker to come out, the chilean minor. his name is