he's 48 years old. hey, there's the cheering. that always feels good. these families have been waiting a long time. he's a father who has been trapped in the mine all this time. he's married. he's got some vision problems. they're going to get some sunglasses on him as he comes out, which is a brilliant move by oakley, by the way. it gives you a sense of how much these guys are going to get once they get out of the mine. there's already a lot of gifts waiting for them. apparently a lot of money. and, fraor example, those oakle glasses they put on them to make sure -- to make sure they're okay are actually worth $280. and apparently his sister, maria, told the associated press that she will, quote, quikick h backside so he never goes in a mine again. there he is coming out. it's always great to see. now, let's bring in bruce dial. he's a former federal mine safety official. and he joins me now. tell us about what's going on

today, how long does that ride last, and where are we at with this whole process? >> well, they're continuing to bring the miners out. the rides have been lasting about -- between 15 and 20 minutes. they still have quite a few to go, but so far, everything is working well. >> and tell me about how they built this escape hatch, if you will, the tunnel. who did that and it went a little quicker than they suspected, right? >> yes. actually, the navy -- chile's navy built the capsule. they built two of them. and they used nasa to help design the capsule that has oxygen for them. they have two-way communication. they have a television camera in there. and also it has an escape hatch. if the capsule were to come up and be hung up in the shaft,

they could escape out the bottom and go back down to the -- the room downstairs. >> and it's not a straight shot up, right? >> no, it's on an angle, plus there's a couple of turns in the shaft itself. >> all right. let's listen to it for a second here. it's always great to see how happy people are when the miners come out. obviously he's ecstatic. this is the first time he's seen sunlight in a long time. >> bruce, did the chilean government ask nasa to get involved? did nasa volunteer? how much of a help was that? >> i'm not sure who made the initial contact, but my understanding is nasa helped a great deal with the understanding of building the capsule and also with the -- the psychological end of it, how to treat these men after being trapped for so long and being

alone, going up this long shaft by themselves so they don't panic. nasa had quite a bit to do with it. >> by the way, as you watch him getting covered in the blanket, they have to be careful about a number of medical issues that might arise. a lot of them have skin infections. having been down in the mold for so long. and they've got to make sure that they're okay on a lot of different fronts. you've got about six weeks to six months to make sure that their health is okay, considering all the things they went through down there. one last thing for you, bruce, in this scenario here as we watch the 20th miner come out here. what -- how about american mining companies? were they involved at all or -- or was it just the chilean navy and nasa? >> there were american companies involved. i'm not sure -- i think they had some mining engineers that were involved from america. also, they had the -- the drill manufacturer.

they normally deal in oil -- oil drills. but there was quite a few different companies from america involved in this rescue operation. >> all right. thank you, bruce dial. we'll be following this at the rescue site all day long. we'll bring every development to you. of course, next up is mine number 21. it's yonni barrios. he has a wife and a mistress. a lot of people are looking forward to that. we'll bring you that story later in this hour. he's slated to come out. all right. now on to other news. politicians love to smear their opponents by accusing them of being elitist. obama gets this charge all the time. even though he is a mixed-race child, brought up by a single mother who was middleclass, he gets it anyway. now christine o'donnell is bragging about not going to yale. i also didn't go to yale. does that make me qualified to be a senator ini don't know. i should think about it, right? what do people mean

eliti elitist? it can't just be where you went to school. bill clinton went to yale law school, but he's bubba. why are clinton and bush theoretical not elites but obama is? that makes no sense. here's what people really mean when they're tired of people who can't relate to their real-world problems. that's what the problem is. that's why they love clinton, because he felt their pain. some in washington and new york feel like everyone makes $250,000 a year. that's who people are talking about when they say elitist. people also hate the wheeling and dealing that goes on in these elite power circles. it's not a crime to go to yale. if you give your buddy a government contract after you become a congressman because you both went to yale, you're part of the elite. it's like a jeff foxworthy skit. you know you're part of the

elite -- and the american public isn't wrong. there are bubbles in d.c. and new york where people live in their own elite world and don't have any idea what you're going through. but you can't judge whether someone is an elitist by just where they went to school or even how much money they have. remember, fdr had a lot of money and stuck up for the poor in this country. in order to figure out who is the real elitist, we'll bring in jason wiseburg. he's the expert on this. he's the editor in chief of slate.com. talk to me here. do i have it right? let's start there. i want to see how politicians use this. >> i think you are right. i think that people on the right in particular are using it almost just as an is synonym f "bad person" now. you're an elitist if you think you're better than me. there are people out there who think they're superior to us. that's a standard populous move. it's an interesting question, why, you know, a liberal who

lives in new york city is an elitist but a ceo of a company in texas who lives on a 10,000-acre ranch isn't. you know, a lot of it comes down to politics. >> i think it comes down to the cowboy hat. if you put on a cowboy hat, you're not an elitist. you could be a hollywood actor, ronald reagan, you could be a millionaire son of a president, george w. bush, and you're still not an elitist, right? obama want s onc s to put on a hat. maybe it will work for him. there is this real issue. we had david k. johnson on the show. he told me a story. he said in the beginning of the bush administration, and he talked to somebody inside the administration, and asked them, hey, what do you think is a medium income of the country? he said she answered quarter of a million dollars. and he's like, are you kidding me? the real answer, of course, at the time was about $28,000. >> about a tenth of that. >> right.

>> that's an elitist, right? that'ser real. people exist, people who think that way. >> look at palin. she does play this card. sarah palin is very rich now. she's making multi-million dollars a year. she has a life that's totally disconnected from the way ordinary people live. but she continues to sort of play this card. and i do think it means less and less. it really is just an expression of sort of open-ended political anger. but it does seem to have this motivating quality. >> see, i think the democrats or whoever it gets used against -- because it gets used against republicans from time to time, too -- they've got to stop the shell game. what i mean, you've got a real issue of elitism in the country in some places. but they're switching it so they're saying, like, oh, if you're smart you're an elitist. if you have an education, you're an elitist. bubba went to yale and he's not an elitist. >> what the consequences of this? are we says we don't think there's a police for expertise

and knowledge and experience in government? i mean, our secretary of energy is a nobel prize winner. he knows more about energy than your average man on the street. but some of this rhetoric suggests that there's this liberal elitism that means we know how to do things and we're going to impose solutions on you and that's by definition bad. and it almost makes a kind of argument for a sort of -- there is no place for expertise. >> but it's -- based on what you just said, look, there are -- they're claiming that only liberals are elite, which is comical. i mean, how -- can you get any more elite than george w. bush? your dad was a president, your grandfather was a senator, you've got oil money handed to you, et cetera. but more importantly on the issues, right, when they say i know better than you, is there a better example than when they say, hey, you know what, you're pregnant. well, i'm not going to let you

make your own choice. i know better than you, and you need to have that child. >> precisely, or to take a less polarizing issue than abortion. there is a sort of conservative argument that liberals are engaging in elitism when they dictate policies that it's telling people what to do. conservatives aren't. so is telling people that they can't get health insurance unless they have a job or telling people that gay people can't get married? those may be legitimate policy positions that i probably happen to disagree with, but i don't think that's more telling other people how to live than what liberals do. i think both sides are prone to their forms of elitism and both sides are prone to tell other people how to live. >> so, jacob, how do you get past this problem? unfortunately, it leads into another problem, which is that republicans fight strong, whether you agree or you don't agree, and democrats usually back down. don't you need a democrat to say, yeah, hell yeah i'm smart. i went to a lot of schools. i worked hard. i'm not embarrassed about that.

if that dummy didn't go to yale, that's her problem, not my problem. don't you need to fight back? >> yeah, except for the dummy part. i mean, i do think obama, who is the son of a single mother, michelle obama whose father was, you know, a postal worker in chicago, you know, first people not just in their family but in their whole worlds to go to college. that is something to be proud of. you know, i do think that liberals should stop hiding when conservatives make this charge. they should throw it back at the conservatives. with the way they define elitism, it really doesn't apply to the left any more than it does to the right. >> i want to ask you this last question. i don't know if you know the answer to this. historically, did -- you know, did people accuse lincoln of, you know, of being an elitist? were they worried about whether they could have a beer with him? or is this something new that's more propaganda, you know, for a particular political purpose? >> well, this does have long roots in american politics. there's a saying that before andrew jackson, there was no

american president who was born in a log cabin and after andrew jackson, there was no president who wasn't. you know, which is that since, you know, since the early 19th century, there's been this game that you play up the humbleness of your origins and how far you've come. and lincoln certainly, you know w the railsplitting, not that it's not true, but it's an example of that kind of myth-building as part of someone's political image. so it's an old game to play enamerican politics to say i'm a man of the people. and the others represent the elite. what's changed now is the elite used to be defined by money, by religion, by inherited family position. it used to be the episcopalian elite. now it's defined by taste, by manne manners, by where you live, whether you live in a city, and more than anything else, by whether you went to an elite university. >> more than anything else, whether you eat sushi. >> i think that's the opposite of the cowboy hat. cowboy hat, not elitist. sushi, elitist.

>> the people who get charged with this, they've got to stop getting run over. if you're going to prove you're not an elitist, put on a cowboy hat and kick some ass. come out and fight and saying, look, christine o'donnell may be proud that she's not a witch and didn't go to a good school, but that's not something to be proud of. it doesn't mean if you didn't go to a good school you can't do well. ronald reagan went to a very small college. but you shouldn't brag about. i'm not going to apologize for working really hard to go to a good school. >> you've just described the strategy of the bush family. george bush sr. was -- he said i'm not going to let this happen anymore. remember, he said he loved country music and pork rinds and he adopted this whole -- this is the dad now, adopted this whole texas persona to get rid of the connecticut. and it worked up to the point for him. but it really worked for his son. >> yeah. absolutely. jacob, thank you so much for joining us. >> thank you. >> really appreciate it.

when politics and education collide, just as students get into the groove, there's a major shake-up in d.c. that could have national impact. we'll explain all of that ahead on msnbc. plus, breaking news. we've been waiting for months. the chile miner rescue is in full swing. at the top of the hour, you saw the 20th minor reemerge safely. number 21 is next, and he's an interesting one. we'll be right back. boss: and now i'll turn it over to the gecko.

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welcome back to msnbc. now we're going to talk about the resignation of one of the most controversial figure ins education reform. is this a clear sign that politics trumps everything? even when it comes to educating our kids? let's take a look at some of the things that rhee was able to get done in the nation's most difficult urban school system. she dismissed 241 teachers, put another 737 on notice that if they did not improve, they'd be shown the door. rhee closed two dozen schools that were not getting it done.

she negotiated a ground-breaking contract with the teachers union that included provisions for performance pay and ending tenure as a job for life provision. that means teachers who were rated as ineffective are immediately terminated. if they're rated minimally effective, they have possible pay raises frozen. if they show no improvement, they also get fired. that's tough love. but with the state of the washington, d.c. public school system, many argue that's exactly the kind of toughness that was needed for real reform. darrel bradford is the director of education for everyone, a group in favor of school choice that was co-founded by newark new jersey mayor cory booker. all right. i want to start the conversation this way. look, a lot of the stuff she did that was considered toughness and good was firing teachers. >> yeah. >> is that fair? is that the -- at the heart of the problem here? >> i think what we were finding, you know, before chancellor rhee was chancellor, she ran the new teacher project. it was like an alternate route,

alternate certification way of placing teachers with all kinds of different life experience, which is to say they were non-traditional candidates. if you ever sat down and talk to her, you'll understand that she knows that putting a great teacher in front of a child is the most important thing you can do for them, which means that you're in conflict with this g dogma that the american federation of teachers have, which is that every teacher is the same, we deploy a good teacher in every classroom. we know that isn't true. you know, when the rubber meets the road, you have this -- you had this big fight that ultimately wound. really changing the discussion around teacher quality, how we hire and fire people, how we reward and retain them, how we remove them, which was like a -- a conversation that democrats and republicans couldn't have before. you couldn't even whisper this stuff before she took over. >> and maybe you can't whisper it now. look at what happened. her mayor that supported her and that she supported lost.

is that part of why he lost? >> well, i think the most important thing is that whatever reason he lost for, this in a lot of ways affirms why you've got to give parents more choices. you can have a great heder at the top that can be the victim of a political change. and then, you know, tomorrow the pir parents of the children in d.c. public schools will still be there. in two months, there will be a different mayor and there could be a different chancellor with a different agenda, and those kids will have no idea who, you know, where they're going or where they're headed. so she was definitely a political casualty. there's no ways about it. >> why did the mayor lose? it goes to the heart of this. was it that the unions were so strong, teachers unions were so strong they mobilized the vote? that seems unlikely. or was it that she wasn't very popular among african-americans in washington, d.c. who didn't believe reform was coming or coming quickly. >> i think newark and washington, for instance, our

offices in newark are very similar in this. i'm from baltimore. it's another place that's like that. the african-american community there is sort of insulated and looking for solutions that are home-grown. and when something, you know, out of the heavens that you don't know shows up and is offering you an answer, you immediately get pushback no matter what the results. >> so you think that was an issue? >> there's no way it couldn't be an issue. it's an issue for cory booker in newark. it was an issue for adrian fenty. it's an issue for all of these guys that are kind of like new african-american leadership and education reform is part of their portfolio. >> nationwide, do we have to break the teachers unions? look, i -- i'm split on unions, but it depends on public or private. is that the problem here, that you've got teachers who are -- there's nobody else. in a corporation they're fighting against the corporation. here there's no other power to balance them out. >> i think -- unions are -- teacher unions aren't the problem, but their the problem when schools are bad.

there are plenty of good schools that are unionized and charter and otherwise. that's one thing. but the other thing, it's just like, you know, the first person who wins a fight is the person who realizes it's a fight first. and what they've done is convinced people that they have the absolute best interest of all of the kids in america at heart. what they really have is the best interest of their members at heart because their members pay dues and there are economic interests that trump everybody else's. so if you realize that, then we can go out and fight. michele rhee realized that. >> but is that the magic bullet, teacher and the unions? if we just got rid of the unions -- there's got to be other problems in the education system other than just union teachers. real quick. >> look, more choice, vital. private school, charter schools, whatever. monopolies don't work. and funding, you've got to have it. we've got plenty in newark and d.c. >> we'll continue this conversation later. thank you.

so now moments ago, the capsule arrives to bring miner number 21 to the surface. the assent begins. he should be out in minutes. more on the unprecedented rescue efforts head on msnbc. [ female announcer ] does your volume pass the afternoon test?

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i had fun today, grandpa. you and me both. if copd is still making it hard to breathe, ask your doctor if including advair will help improve your lung function for better breathing. get your first full prescription free and save on refills. breaking news. the rescue of the chilean miners. you're look at a live picture from camp hope. the 21st miner is on his way up. that's the famous yonni barrios. he has the wife and the mistress. which one will greet him? stay with us. we'll have a live up date coming up real soon. also up next, who are the secret names behind political attack ads and what is their motivation? you're watching msnbc.

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i'm hampson pearson with your cnbc market wrap. here's how the stocks are doing. right now, we see the dow is up

about 96 points. the s&p up over 10 points. and the nasdaq up more than 27 points. a record-breaking day for apple shares. they've topped $300 for the first time with the market cap of about $273 billion. apple has far surpassed microsoft, google and ibm who also hit an all-time high today. strong ipad sales and a planned expansion into china are giving the iphone makers high hopes for the future. apple plans to open 25 retail stores in china next year. top legal officers in all 50 states have launched an investigation into allegations that mortgage companies mishandled documents when they foreclosed on hundreds of thousands of homeowners. officials and bank regulators will examine whether employees made false statements or prepared documents improperly. employees of four large lenders have acknowledged in depositions that they signed off on foreclosure documents without

reading them. that's it from cnbc. back to you. >> thank you. now we're following breaking news out of chile at this hour. we're waiting for the 21st miner to be pulled to safety. thousands of people are standing by to watch the rescues unfold. while millions of others are watching around the world. natalie morales joins me live now. here comes the 21st miner, yonni barrios. >> we know a lot about him. >> drama. go ahead. tell us about him. >> yeah. i was going to say, this is probably one of the most watched and probably one of the most interesting rescues here. number 21, yonni barrios. he is the doctor. he has performed the very important role down in the mine as being the one who is a paramedic, a trained paramedic. he's assisted in monitoring all of the vital stats of the miners

down below. but i think what a lot of people are very focused on is who is there to greet him at the mine shaft. and -- because he is the one who has the wife and the mistress. now, he's been -- he was married -- or is married to the wife for 28 years, maria. but he also has a mistress of ten years. and they discovered this relationship while they were here keeping vigil at camp hope. and we are told that the wife is actually boycotting this rescue. she is not going to be there to greet him. perhaps understandably because as it turns out, yonni barrios invited both the wife and the mistress to be there at the mine shaft. you can't make this stuff up here. >> natalie, i'm interested by that. look, the bigger story, of course, my god, these people are

alive. that's fantastic. we're all thrilled about that. it's a great achievement. >> they're human. >> but, you know, of course everybody is curious about the wife. what happened there? were they separated so -- is this a -- are people making too much of a big deal out of this? or were they not separated? >> there is a little -- there is that belief. in fact, it turns out -- the family actually i've been told by some here who know here are very supportive of the one who is the mistress and they've known about this relationship for a long time. apparently she -- they've been in a very committed ten-year relationship. so whether or not this whole -- they discovered and there was this blow-up here at camp hope, not sure about that. that could have been one of these tabloid things that caught fire and everybody went with it. so -- and what i've heard from others is that he was separated from the wife. but all of this is just people

talking here, which, as you know, things spread like wildfire when you're in a small camp of this size. but i believe we are seeing some of the rescue going on here right now. >> right. well, natalie, we're looking at -- >> this is yonni barrios. it's hard to see the image. >> yonni is out right now. that is, feigniin fact, the so- mistress. yonni is 50 years old. they've been together for ten years. obviously ecstaecstatic to be w him. she probably thought she'd never see him again. it's a great, great moment in that sense. and a lot of people make him out to be a xwoet because of this drama, but he was the doctor, the paramedic and he took care of others. >> absolutely. >> he's the biggest hero out of all of this situation, isn't he? >> well, he's -- he's definitely -- they are all incredible heroes here, but this is a real emotional moment you

saw there. and quickly, he, again, is now saying thank you to the rescuers and greeting all of those who participated in this incredible effort. he is number 21. still 12 more to go. and pretty incredible to think that they have been well ahead of schedule here. in fact, if i do the calculation correctly, they could be done with this whole operation by around midnight tonight. they've been doing about -- one miner every 40 to 45 minutes. you know, it's interesting. right behind me down here, actually, is where yonni barrios' family usually waits for him. and the -- the flag right here says strength uncle yonni. so this is usually where we would see them. that's why we've heard a lot of the chatter about the gossip

about the wife and the -- the mistress over these days. but as you mentioned, truly he's performed a lot of those important -- took a lot of those important vital statistics on the miners as they were down below. the only trained emt of the bunch. he really was the one responsible for checking daily what their blood pressure was, their heart rates, monitoring every aspect, checking their anxiety levels. this is the guy who was the one who was communicating with the doctors above and was really giving all the tests and antibiotics. he was the one who took care of the guys down below. so truly a remarkable hero. what's interesting, you know, as i see here -- as they go from one rescue to another, is to see how the media moves from camp to camp to camp where the families are. in fact, right here to the side

is where a lot of yonni barrios' family and friends have waited for him. and you can see how the media just jumped. the minute they realized, okay, it's yonni, this is where his family is. they run over there. there's a crush of reporters every single time. and it's been really hard to get a picture of some of the families as they're seeing their loved ones come up because this is this throng of media here. >> all right. >> a captivating picture just right here. but truly something to behold. number 21. again, you know, we could be anywhere from 10 to 12 hours to c completion of this rescue. >> natalie, thank you. by the way, one last thing on yonni, the nickname, the doctor, is a really cool name. you saw they put him on the stretcher and took the doctor to the hospital. all right. now we have updates anytime on msnbc.com as well. you can check out other news on

there at all times. we'll be covering this story as we continue throughout the day and night here. now, the issue of money in political campaigns is as well as old as politics. with the supreme court ruling that corporations now have the first same amendment -- i'm sorry, the same first amendment rights individuals and can pour unlimited truckloads of cash into the coffers of their candidates, this issue of transparency has become a rallying cry for officials who smell a rat. bill is the new york public advocate. he sent a letter tuesday to 16 organizations demanding that they come clean about their donors. bill, thanks for joining us. we really appreciate it. let's talk about what you're doing. first of all, who are these 16 groups? what do you want them to do? >> these groups are in principle non-profit issue groups. some are trade associations. let me give you the numbers. these groups have spent $22 million on elections in the last five weeks. those attack ads you talked about, we want them to come clean.

we want to know who's paying for this. it's as old as time itself, money and politics. who's paying for it? and these groups by and large have refused to disclose particularly the corporate contributions. if corporations and whole industries are now participating in campaigns on massive scale, you can imagine what that does in certain races. that could be absolutely decisive. we're saying the american people have a right to know who's doing it. >> all right. now, these aren't just liberal groups or conservative groups. there's a mix in there. >> yep. >> you don't really care what the organization's goal is. you just want to know where the money is coming from. >> that's right. i don't care what they are. we deserve to know what's going on. what you're seeing, these ads are flooding the air waves. you're seeing consumers and shareholders saying where is our money going? what is happening here? the supreme court decision opened up a very slippery slope. one that bluntly could change

the nature of your democracy. it's our job to demand disclosure and say to companies, you don't have to spend thism money. a number of companies have decided not to go down this road. >> but you see that's interesting. you know, every indication is that for money spent buying politicians -- i'm keeping it right here. it's a great investment. they'll get money dollars back in return, right? that, you know, for the bankers, you know, they get the great loopholes and the deals in the financial reform package. the drug industry made out like bandits. so i get their motivation. now, if you're a corporation, why should you stop that? if i'm a korticorporation, i'd politician, too. >> because the public won't stand for it. look at what happened with target corporation. they got deeply involved in one election in minnesota. they end up with a massive shareholder boycott. people are going to target to buy a product, not to foster a political action movement by target. the bottom line is, it is a

slippery slope. what we've seen with the biggest companies in the country, the biggest financial firms and tech firms have said we don't want to go down this road because we know the people we depend on to buy our products may not feel comfortable. our shareholders may not think this is the right action to take. >> you said the critical word there, shareholders. who owns these companies ultimately? >> well, look, this is where i think the shareholder movement is going to play a big role. some say citizens united, will things ever change again? it's still democracy. shareholder rights is one of the elements of this. shareholders want their companies to stay on a sound strategic path and they want to know what's going on. they don't want them venturing into reckless efforts. they want them to make the best products possible and doing well on the market. they don't want people gaining the system. you'll see this coming here more and more shareholder resolutions across companies, all across this country, demanding disclosure. and real limitations. a sense that a company needs to set some rules, some self-imposed rules.

and come clean with the people that own the company. >> because a lot of the shareholders are pension funds. people that have been working throughout the country, it's their money that's going into these corporations. sometimes the corporation spends money maybe for it own benefit, but a lot of times against the interests of the people who own the company in those pension funds. >> right. there is ample evidence that when companies venture into massive political spending or lobbying spending, it's often counterproductive to the bottom line. what you see -- i'm on the pension fund board here in new york city. what you see is there's a tremendous imf study and a university of minnesota study that looked at this. when you think you can gain the system, if you can buy your way to certain outcome, maybe you'd do that. but it takes the companies away from their strategic mission as firms. that creates the stability and from a pension fund perspective, we want stability. we want a company that's doing its job day in and day out. we don't want a company looking for a quick fix. the automobile industry in detroit tried that for decades. they almost crumbled because it.

they thought they had friends in washington. they stopped making the best product. now they've started to turn around. we want companies focused on the bottom line, not political intrigue. >> when you buy politicians or you gain the political system, it's anticompetitive. i know you're -- a lot of companies want that monopoly, but it makes them prone to a real competitor. you're right, ultimately it doesn't serve the companies. because of citizens united, you're not going here to end the campaign financing, right? you're not going to -- you're not saying you can't be a donor. you just want them to disclose it. >> one bottom line is everyone should disclose. if you want the respect of shareholders, consumers, pension holders, disclose. if you're not willing to disclose, it begs the question, what are you hiding? is there foreign corporate money now in our cysystem? we don't know. the second step, voluntarily choose not to go down this road. i guarantee you the public does not want an electoral system

dominated by money. they want a public debate. they want a level playing field. the companies that show restraint will ultimately do better. >> all right. new york public advocate bill diblazo, thank you. we're live at camp hope. miner number 21 just emerged. another amazing story of survival. stay with msnbc for complete coverage. ♪ let's take a look at the stats. mini has more than double the fiber and whole grain... making him a great contender in this bout... against mid-morning hunger.

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i'm paige hopkins. rick perry says authorities should not back off the case even after a gruesome warning from drug cartels to stay off their turf. the served head of a mexican police commander turned up yesterday in a suitcase outside of a mexican military base. he'd actually been looking for the body of david hartley, whose wife tiffany was killed by mexican pirates. and right now hurricane paula dumping plenty of rain on cancun, but at this hour there are no reports of damage or injuries. forecasters are calling paula a small but strong category 2 hurricane. paula is expected to make its way west towards cuba by early tonight or thursday. the storm did not effect any of mexico's main oil producing in the gulf of mexico. it also spared the coffee-growing region in central america. we'll track hurricane paula as it continues that move west. that's the news now. >> thank you. appreciate it.

look, up next we'll do my takeaway on campaign finance reform. i think we're both losing out of this corrupt system that we have. i'm going to tell you how we can clean it up. this is msnbc. it's work through the grime and the muck, month. tow and pull without getting stuck month. sweat every day to make an honest buck...month. and if you're gonna try and do this in anything other than a chevy... well, good luck...month. great deals on the complete family of chevy trucks all backed for a hundred thousand miles. it's truck month. now, during truck month, get 0% apr financing on all trucks and full-size suvs like this 2011 silverado.

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now let's get another look at the mine site in capiapo chile. moments ago we saw miner 21 to emerge. waiting for number 22, age 43 and a father of three. we will have much more on this memorable rescue as it happens. stay with us for regular updates.

public financing of elections? why? people work for the folks who pay them. our politicians are paid by the lobbyists, they work for them, not us. it buys votes, ads you eso on the tv sets, campaign staffers and poll-tested talking points and mailers and the list goes on and on. these are all the things that are meant to deceive you. the reality is that people and corporations are not spending all of that money on lobbyists and politics 'cause they have your best interests in mind. it is 'cause they want to return on their investment. they spend that money to make more money, for themselves. some people complain that if we do public financing of elections, the taxpayer has to pay for the politician's campaigns. yes, that's true but we pay for it anyway. right now, we just pay a hell of a lot more, all the favors those politicians do for their campaign contributors. i would rather spend a few

million getting a clean election than spend billions of taxpayer money so that a politician can return favors for his donors. this should not be a conservative or liberal issue. why would conservatives want their politicians bought anymore than liberals do? we are sick of it. changing that system is what got so many people excited about 2008. but that is also why with the tea party folks want to do their anti-washington charge. we should be united on this. listen, i want a country where we go back to having honest debates about pro-lifer or pro-choice or all other issues of principle. right now, you can tell who is going to win on any given issue not by the principles involved or the public polling. you can tell by where the money is. for example, conservatives, i hate to break it to you, but you are going to lose on gay marriage, not because most of the country suspect with you that is kind of a split issue. you are going to lose because there's slightly more money on the gay rights side. that is not how we should settle important issues but the much larger problems are things like national defense where we buy

weapons systems not based on whether we need them or can afford them but based on which politicians got greased and where the factory is located. we waste trillions of dollars like this. and i haven't even gotten to the most powerful lob bish the banks. they sucked so much money out of the system that we had one of the largest economic crashes of all time and they are not even done yet. let me ask you this final question. do you think all these corporations and rich folks are spending money on politics 'cause it's not good for business? no. obviously, they think it is a great investment for them. nothing brings you better return than buying a united states' politician. do you think it might also be a good investment for us, to keep our politicians clean and working for us instead of their donors? i think it would be the best investment we ever made. look, that's it for our show today and next is dylan ratigan, going to continue to follow the story, the minors being rescued, of course, number 22 coming up

in minutes. i will also be doing a rant on dylan's show you don't want to miss on alvin green. always catch me on young turks.com as well as youtube.com/the young turks. wait for dylan's awesome show coming up next. ♪ [ man ] i thought our family business would always be boots. until one day, my daughter showed me a designer handbag. and like that, we had a new side to our business. [ male announcer ] when the martinez family saw an opportunity, the hartford was there. protecting their employees and property, and helping them prepare for the future. nice boots. nice bag. [ male announcer ] see how the hartford helps businesses

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good afternoon to you, i'm dylan ratigan. 21 down, 1 to go. dramatic scenes from san jose and chill lake, the entire world watching as those trapped miners emerge, one by one, into the daylight, a story of strength and survival, reaching across time zones, borders and hem misfierce. we will continue our ongoing coverage of miner mania here on the dr show.