this sunday, the strange twist and turns of the 2012 presidential race. president obama tries to quiet critics who claim he wasn't born in the u.s. by releasing his long-form birth certificate, setting up the spectacle of a showdown with donald trump, who inches closer to getting in the race. >> i do something that no one else has been able to do. i got obama to give his birth certificate. and it was about time. >> we do not have time for this. we have better stuff to do. >> what about the real issues -- jobs, government red ink and the debate over taxes and spending now gripping washington? with us for an assessment this morning of the political landscape, independent mayor of new york city, michael bloomberg, republican governor of virginia, bob mcdonnell, plus former senior white house adviser to the president and now campaign strategist for the obama re-election campaign,

david axelrod. then, the views from freshman senator and up-and-coming gop star marco rubio of florida, reading the leaves of the tea party and its influence in 2012. plus, the debt ceiling debate, america's role in libya and the prospects for a republican party struggling to attract minority voters. finally, after a week like this, you've just got to laugh. >> donald trump has been saying that he will run for president as a republican, which is surprising since i just assumed he was running as a joke. >> inside some political comedy from the star of last night's white house correspondents dinner and head writer for "saturday night live," seth meyers. good morning. big news developing overseas this weekend in libya. moammar gadhafi survived a nato air strike on a tripoli house that reportedly claimed the

lives of his youngest son and three grandchildren, this according to a government spokesperson. u.s. security officials say they believe such attacks may be the only way to force gadhafi from power. and in rome, the late pope john paul ii moved a step closer to sainthood, as he was celebrated during a joyous ceremony that drew more than a million people to st. peter's square. back in washington, the fight over spending will continue in full force as congress returns from a two-week spring recess to face debates on raising the debt ceiling and crafting a 2012 budget. i'm joined now by the independent mayor of new york city, michael bloomberg, former senior white house adviser to president obama, david axelrod, and now serves as campaign strategist for the president's 2012 re-election bid, and republican governor of virginia, also vice chairman of the republican governors association, bob mcdonnell. welcome to all of you. i want to start with mayor bloomberg to talk about some crucial matters that are really determining the re-election fight, but also the debate here

in washington, and that is, the economy. here is the cover of "the economist" magazine that caught my eye this week with the statue of liberty on the cover. "what's wrong with america's economy?" and here's what the lead says -- "the economy is recovering, yet american confidence remains mired at levels more commonly seen in recessions. for that, blame unemployment, petrol prices and a deeper nagging feeling that america is in decline. a gallup poll in february asked americans to name the world's leading economic power. by a significant margin, they said china." and unemployment is really the driver. this is the chart of how it looks in the course of the obama presidency from february of 2009, the high point in october at 10.1%. now we're at 8.8%. what kind of economic recovery is this, mayor? it seems like a tough one. >> well, when you come out of a recession, first thing that everybody does is tighten their belt and try to do more with less. so, it's not surprising that corporate profits are going up and governments are finding ways

to provide services with fewer people. it is only a little further into the recovery that you start to add more people. companies are willing to take risks, governments think their tax base is going to be better and start expanding services and hiring people to provide that. like anything else, some parts of the country are doing poorly, some are doing well, some are doing better. new york city, for example, is doing better. we're not back to where we were before, but we are doing better. i think what's happening really here in this country is petroleum prices. although industry is less dependent on petroleum than they used to be. but if you drive a car, you're very dependent on petroleum. and gasoline at $4-plus is something that a lot of americans find very difficult to work into their budget and they don't have a lot of choice. a lot of commodity prices, food, have gone up dramatically. and the statistics don't show quite the impact on individual families because they cover a lot of different costs. having said all that, there are some bright spots.

i think if you wanted to go buy a house and if you can afford it and if you're secure in your job, mortgage rates are low, housing prices continue to fall. you can get great bargains and you shouldn't wait until the end. the most important thing, however, is jobs, and we have a great mismatch in this country between the skill sets of those who are unemployed and the demand in industry and in government for people with a very different set of abilities. and it's a function of years and years, decades of poor schools and not training people. >> this disconnect, where we hear that the economy is getting better, stock market is improving, so much has gone on on wall street to get healthy again with the major banks getting healthy again, and yet, we're in this state where you have stubbornly high unemployment. >> well, there's a couple of different things here. one, there is a crisis of confidence, and the one that really is worrisome is not just when you go out and say do you feel better or worse about the economy.

it is a crisis of confidence among business people. they look at washington and they say you can't run something this way. no company would survive if you ran it the way washington runs, where they focus on small issues that have nothing to do with the real america, on issues they can't come together on. the most obvious one is immigration. this is a country that was built by immigrants. this is a country that became a superpower because of its immigrant population. and unless we continue to have immigrants, we cannot maintain as a superpower. i'll give you an example of how you can fix some of the problems in america. take a look at the big, old industrial cities, detroit, for example. they've got a great mayor in mayor bing, but the population has left. you've got to do something about that. and if i were the federal government, assuming you could wave a magic wand and pull everybody together, you'd pass a law allowing immigrants to come in as long as they agree to go to detroit and live there five or ten years, start businesses, take jobs, whatever. you would populate detroit

overnight because half the world wants to come here. we forget, we whip ourselves little bit too much. we still are the world's greatest democracy. we still have the hope for if you want to have a better life for yourself and your kids, this is where you want to come. and you could use something like immigration policy at no cost to the federal government to fix a lot of the problems that we have. >> let me ask you about taxes. big debate, as you know, in washington over the future of taxes for the wealthy, for the middle class. do you think it's possible to bring the budget into balance if you don't just raise taxes on wealthy americans, but also on those so-called middle class making $250,000 or below. alan greenspan last week said the bush-era tax cuts should expire for everyone. >> number one, what the democrats have to understand is you're never going to balance the budget unless you make meaningful changes in entitlements. we used to have 30-odd people supporting every retiree. today it's three people or something like that supporting every retiree. so, the democrats have to understand, we cannot get

through this with the same set of entitlements that we have where we keep giving benefits, and there's fewer people to pay those benefits. on the other hand, republicans have to also understand, you cannot balance the budget just with cuts. the american people, whether they vote republican or democrat, in the end, they don't want their programs cut back, particularly the big ones, medicare, medicaid, social security, those kinds of things. and i thought that the al simpson and erskine bowles came up with with their committee the exactly right answer. you can tweak it, change some small things. i assume the gang of six will come out with something very similar. you have to have some combination of cuts in expenses and revenue enhancements. you can call those taxes, whatever you want. and i was talking to erskine yesterday. his idea is 25% an increase in revenue and 75% in terms of cutting expenses and some ratio like that is the solution. how much chaos and destruction to our economy we have to do before everybody in washington starts acting like an adult, coming together and not pandering to the small voting blocs but say, look, this is the interests of the country.

and i'm not going to sit there, do a poll, find out where my constituents are and follow them. we need leadership from the front, and that's true in congress, it's true at the other end of pennsylvania avenue, it's true on both sides of the aisle, it's true in the case of states. the governor's very proactive and he's, you know, steered virginia through some very tough times, but he's done it by making decisions and pulling together, and people know where they stand with this government in virginia, and that's what we need to have in america. >> let me widen this discussion out to all of us here at the table, and we'll get back to the economy. i want to touch on some other issues, though, that are part of the political dialogue, for sure. the economy is certainly the backdrop. governor mcdonnell, the tornado damage has been horrific through the south. we have a map here that shows just how devastating it has been throughout alabama, georgia, tennessee, mississippi and virginia as well, had significant damage. 342 deaths, 288 tornadoes. this kind of outbreak has not

been seen in this country. as much as $5 billion in insured losses. the president and the first lady were touring the damage in alabama on friday getting down with folks. both in terms of what you've gone through in virginia and assessing the president's response, how would you rate it? >> well, it's been heartbreaking. we've had three weeks in a row with catastrophic damage, loss of life in virginia. over 25 tornadoes reported. i've been to three locations as recently as friday to view the damage. and we're not used to that in virginia. but i'll tell you what i see is the plans from the first responders, if it works like it's supposed to. the american people, even though we disagree on some things, when we're attacked or have a catastrophe like this, we bind together and work together better than any other country on earth. the president called me on thursday to tell me the federal government would give everything they could to help. secretary napolitano followed up. and we've declared a state of emergency and now we're asking for federal help for isolated counties that have been particularly affected. i think the systems are working

as good as they can, but it will be a long road back for some communities, particularly alabama and mississippi, but we've got some people that are hurting in virginia now. >> david axelrod, you're, of course, inside the white house, you're outside the white house, but certainly a top adviser for the president still as he campaigns for re-election. i mentioned at the top of the program the strange twists and turns of a presidential race. while we're talking about the economy and jobs, there are huge distractions, and we saw that play out this week. the president released his long-form birth certificate to try to quiet people who actually still believe -- >> which is a lot like a short-form birth certificate -- >> right, and he had to get a special waiver from the state of hawaii to release the whole thing. they came about in part because donald trump, who may be a presidential candidate, was talking about the need to do this. this was the scene that played out on wednesday, a kind of split-screen america between donald trump and president obama. watch this exchange.

>> today i am very proud of myself because i've accomplished something that nobody else has been able to accomplish. i was just informed while on the helicopter that our president has finally released a birth certificate. >> we're not going to be able to solve our problems if we get distracted by side shows and carnival barters. >> why did the white house wait this long to do this? >> first, let me just say i'm happy we could contribute to mr. trump's self-image, that he feels good about himself, proud. he needs that little ego boost. look, the reality is, it isn't -- you say it became a distraction. donald trump -- donald trump didn't make the decision to put himself on a split screen. donald trump didn't make the decision to cover this over and over and over again once he raised the issue. and the president's point was, the day after he made a speech on this issue that the mayor was talking about that's so

important to our country, which is how do we solve this debt problem in a way that is balanced and fair and serves our future, the president did an interview, answered a lot of questions about it, got one question on the birther issue. and on the evening news that night, that was what led the news. and at that moment, the president said, you know what, we've got to put a stop to this. and he wanted to make the point that we have more important issues in this country and we ought to move on. and the point was as much, frankly, david to your industry, as it was to anybody else. >> if republicans ever want to have a chance of getting in the white house, they've got to get off issues like the birther issue. we need to talk about the economy and the deficit and immigration and health care, lots of social problems here, and not waste our time talking about frivolous things. >> but governor mcdonnell, why is it that republican leaders have not stood up while this was going on and said this is nonsense? i mean, speaker boehner was on this program and said, look, i can't tell people what to believe. can't he? >> yeah, well, i've said that. i thought it was a waste of time. the problem with the president, president obama's not where he's born, it's some of the policies that he's advocating.

the people attempt, i think, to be able to get our deficits and debt under control with the proposals made in the president's budget really are the issue in this campaign. we're $14 trillion in, and under the president's proposal, we'd be over $20 trillion. that's the crisis in america. until we have serious dialogue about that and reducing spending, including entitlements, as the mayor said, we're not going to get out of it. i think that's a side issue, never should have raised it, and i've spoken out about that. >> the president insisted on doing this himself, in the white house, standing up, and certainly making this a big issue. the president gets out there and does it. was this motivated by a sense that, hey, i am going to raise donald trump up to beat him down and to single him out and sort of say, look, this is the republican party for you? >> david, as i said, it wasn't about donald trump. it was about the media fascination with this, because we agree, we ought to have the debate the governor's talking about. both the president and the republican party say we have to deal with this issue. we both have proposals. the difference is the president

thinks we have to do this in a balanced way that's fair. if you essentially do away with medicare, as is true under the republican proposal, and at the same time, give $200,000 tax breaks, new, $1.1 trillion in new tax breaks to millionaires and the wealthy, that is not a prescription for a better america. if you slash education by 25%, if you slash research and development and clean energy activities by 70%. this is a prescription for economic failure and an imbalance in our country, and that's what we should be talking about, you know. and so, that's why he spoke out on this. >> once more on the birther issue, is racism involved? did the president believe that? >> i'm not going to -- no, i have not had that discussion with him, and frankly, i'm not going to entertain that question. i don't think that's a worthy question because -- >> there's a lot of african-americans who think it's offensive that the president has to go up there and defend this. >> but i don't think just african-americans.

i think a lot of americans were offended by it, of all stripes. listen, we're a country, and the mayor can speak to this. he has the most diverse city in the country. we're a nation of immigrants. we come from all over the world. there are americans of every stripe and every background who have built this country, and that whole episode was offensive to a lot of people. but the point is, we've got big challenges in this country, we've got big problems. we have a big debate about how we build a better future and we ought to get to it. >> mayor, on the cover of "bloomberg business week" is donald trump, not on this issue, but with a simple question, "seriously?" does he have a real voice in this campaign if he gets to issues that are what he's contributed in business, what he's built, the issue of the economy? >> anybody can run. he has a right to run. he is a new york icon, bigger than life in a lot of things, and he can put himself into the mix.

there are an awful lot of people whose names surface looking to potentially be the republican candidate in 2012. some will fall by the wayside very quickly when they realize what they have to go through in terms of disclosure and criticism from the press and raising money. some will stick it out and they will be a candidate -- >> you call him an icon. is he worthy of serious consideration? >> that's up to the voters. i can't sit here and say i'm going to pick any one candidate and say they are or they aren't. the nice thing about america is you get a chance to go out there and make your case. i will say, however, and it talks to david's point and the governor's -- when you talk about the problems facing this country, and they both talked about the deficit going forward, i've always thought we do this wrong. we take a look at the deficits and say we've got to cut. we should stop and say what do we need to keep this country going, whether it's education or research or defense or a variety of other services. these are the services we absolutely need if we're going to keep america, the great

country that it is and the land of opportunity. then try to find out what it's going to cost to do it efficiently and then go and have a debate about how you raise the money. you can spend less, you can get more coming in, but you don't start with -- there's nothing magical about deficit as opposed to making sure the streets are safe. there's nothing magical about a deficit as to making sure we're protected from terrorists. there's nothing magical about the deficit in the context of if we don't educate our kids, they're not going to have a future and we're not going to have a tax base down the road. so, we are all looking at this the wrong way. the debate should be about whether or not government should provide this kind of education or that kind of education, this kind of a defense policy, that kind of a defense policy, not let the money drive it. we're spending money we don't have. we shouldn't be doing it. but the first and most important thing is what are we going to do to keep this country safe and growing.

>> mayor, i think we're a lot closer to that thinking than you suggest -- >> that may be. >> that's exactly what the president is saying. we have certain responsibilities. one is to be fiscally responsible, but we also have a responsibility to our future. we have a social compact that we have to keep with our senior citizens, with our children to educate them and give them the tools to compete. there are certain things we know we have to do. that ought to guide our decision-making here. it's not just an arithmetic exercise. >> governor, what about the pessimism in the country? what do you see in virginia as people struggle through an economic recovery that still has unemployment so high? >> well, virginia's open for business and i'm trying to tell that story throughout the country and throughout the world. we're down to 6.3% unemployment. we've grown at 9% to 16% over the last six months. the reason i think we're there is we made all those really tough decisions last year, david. we balanced a $6 billion deficit without raising taxes, mostly through spending cuts, and it included education and included health care, and yeah, there was some short-term pain, but we ran

a surplus within five months, we're going to have a big surplus this year, and so now we're coming back. and here's why. governors have a balanced budget amendment. we cannot make excuses, form committees, kick the can down the road, we can't increase the debt limit willy-nilly. we've got to make tough decisions, and i think that's what the congress and the president need to do. i will say in fairness, most of the deficit's been run up by republican presidents over the last 30 years. it's a bipartisan problem and we need bipartisan cooperation to get it fixed. >> no question about that. and look, you're a good guy and i commend you for trying to wrestle with this problem and you've made some cuts. your predecessor made billions in cuts before it, but you also balanced your budget with $1.7 billion in money from the recovery act, you balanced your budget by borrowing $3 billion against future receipts on transportation to fund your transportation program, you borrowed money from your pension plan that you're going to have to return, and you did it because you were managing through difficult times and you didn't want to burden the taxpayers of your state through these difficult times.

but those bills are going to have to be paid. so, you are wrestling with the same problems that the president, governors and mayors are wrestling with, and there are no easy answers. >> well, the difference is governors have to balance budgets, and i think the mayor probably does, too. the federal government for the longest time hasn't. you know, 30 years after the second world war, we cut the deficit every year. the last 30, we, for the most part, ratcheted it up. 72% of gdp now tied up in debt, heading towards 100%-plus. this budget and frankly, the ryan budget. most people don't get it, why congress can't find a way to cut the deficit and balance the budget. >> when you borrow from future receipts and borrow from your pension system and say your budget is balanced, the next governor's going to have to wrestle with that. i know you only have one term, but the next governor's going to have to wrestle with that. >> mayor bloomberg, the issue for president obama handling of the economy -- if you look at recent polling on this, that's still an area of considerable weakness for him.

57% disapprove of his handling of the economy. you have something of a pulse on independent voters around the country. and particularly as it talks about surging gas prices, a lot of independent voters say in polling they will not support obama, particularly because of this issue. it's hit them particularly hard. >> number one, it's a long time from now to the election and who knows where gasoline prices will be or what the issues are really going to be that the debates will be about. i think the president has to show that he understands the pain, that he understands that we need businesses to come here and thrive. he has to give people confidence that he's not going to support policies that will stop job creation, that government can't be the solution to everything. in the end, it is the private sector economy that really does give us the hand-up rather than the handout that america needs. and he's just got to get out there. i've said this a thousand times, he needs more contact with the business community and not just by calling in half a dozen well-known business personalities and talking to

them around the table and leaving. that doesn't get things done. it's small business that's going to create the jobs. it is people's confidence that will get them to buy a car so that general motors will go hire more people. it is an intelligent tax policy that people not only can understand -- it doesn't cost them a fortune just to fill out the forms, but a tax policy that they think is going to be consistent going forward and lets you know that government is going to have labor policies, tax policies, regulations that are predictable and consistent. businesses can't adapt and plan for the future and make the kind of investments. we have banks with a lot of money. they're scared to make loans. why? because every time they turn around, they get attacked. whether they should or shouldn't get attacked is not the issue here. the issue is it does not leave them when they go back home and sit around their table and say what are we going to do? well, you know, everybody's after us. let's not run any risks. and in fact, you want banks to run the risks.

we vilify the banks for running the risks of giving mortgages when that's what we wanted them to do. we vilified banks for funding a lot of companies that in the end couldn't make it, but we want them to go out and take risks. unless they do that, nobody's going to be able to -- >> governor, a lot of republicans i talk to sound increasingly pessimistic that the president can be beaten for re-election. do you share that pessimism? and if you don't, what is the rationale, what's the case for beating him? >> the president's a great campaigner. we expect a spirited campaign. we're going to have great candidates. we've got three or four in already. i think we'll have probably two or three more in before it's all done. >> you'd like to see a governor? >> i'd like to see a governor because governors have got to balance the budget, they've got to be decisive, they can't make excuses, they've got to lead and i think that's what we need. >> we had a governor's president for the previous eight years and we started with record surpluses and ended up with record deficits. >> the president before that was a governor also and we had record surplus. >> i'm saying being a governor

is no guarantee of anything. >> no, but that's what we need right now is decisiveness and getting confidence back in the economy. i think the mayor's exactly right. i think to some degree, we've had attacking wall street and business in this white house, and that's what we need, we need pro-growth, pro-economic policies, we need to keep taxes in check and we have to have the fortitude to cut spending. and that's what i think a governor will bring to the table. so, i'm not at all pessimistic. i think we've got some good candidates. they'll get stronger. and through the crucible of these debates, i think -- >> i have two questions for you in the remaining moments. campaign spending, bill burton worked in the press shop in the white house. and back in 2007, then candidate obama was critical, decried all of these independent expenditures. it's thought that he might spend $1 billion on his re-election campaign. >> well, that's expected -- >> is president obama ultimately going to represent the death of campaign finance reform in this country after being a champion for it?

>> david, let's be clear, this independent group formed was formed in response to the ones that spent hundreds of millions of dollars in the last campaign to defeat democratic candidates of undisclosed campaign contributions. and we tried to pass a law through congress that would force them to disclose, all groups to disclose who was giving them the money so the public could see. it got 59 democratic votes in the united states senate, 41 republicans blocked it. and association of course, now there's a reaction to what happened because democrats are sitting there saying we can't play under two sets of rules. we need one set of rules -- >> but they have an advantage, going into 2012, do they not? >> i don't know because the campaign is not done. >> we should walk down to capitol hill and urge them to pass the law and that will govern both republicans and democrats and everybody will be playing with one set of rules -- >> but it's not even. democrats have a huge advantage going into 2012, do they not? >> i don't know because the

campaign's just begun. we won't have a huge financial advantage if people like the koch brothers, karl rove and others spend up to $1 billion that they say they're going to spend. so, we don't really know who's going to spend what. i don't think this is healthy, i don't think it's good, but it's the system we have. and you can't expect one side to operate under one set of rules and the other side to operate under another. >> final point, iraq. what if the iraqi government says u.s. troops stay beyond that withdrawal date? is that a promise that the president is willing to be flexible on if the iraqis request it? >> first of all, i'm not here representing the white house, so i want to be careful about this question. i don't want to misrepresent. but the president feels strongly that our mission needs to be wrapped up in iraq, and i see no change in that -- >> keep that promise and not have it go beyond? >> yes. >> all right. i'm going to leave it there. thanks to all of you. the debate will continue on all fronts. coming up, how will the tea party influence 2012? and what has been its impact on this congress? plus, budget battles, raising the debt limit and america's role in the middle east. we'll talk live to rising republican star freshman senator from florida marco rubio in his first "meet the press" interview. then, a break from the seriousness of the week because

sometimes you've just got to laugh. insights on political comedy and its role in politics, from the host of last night's correspondents dinner, head writer for "saturday night live," seth meyers. for saturday seth meyers. also get a free flight.

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we are back joined now by the freshman senator from florida, republican marco rubio. welcome to the program. >> thanks for having me. >> good to have you here. so much talk about the tea party and the tea party's influence in washington. you were known as a tea party senator and candidate, embraced by the tea party, but you have your independence from the tea party caucus. what has the tea party or the

tea party sentiment, what kind of impact has it had on the debates we're having in washington? >> first let's remind ourselves was it was. it was everyday americans tired of the country, often tired of the direction both parties were taking our country, and they wanted people to come up here and change direction. and i think for the first time in quite a while, you're seeing a debate in washington about how much to cut. in the past, it was about how much to reduce the increases. now there's a real debate about how much to cut and i think that's an important influence and important impact. on the other hand, we need to remind ourselves that our problems are big and they're moving very fast. they're moving faster than perhaps any problems our country's ever faced have moved. i think the real risk is are our problems moving faster than our solutions or our ability to solve them? and that's one of the issues that's overlying all of the debates we've had. >> that's interesting. do you describe yourself as a tea party senator? >> first of all, i don't ever run away from the folks who have supported me who are in the tea party moment. i've never ascribed that to myself because i think the tea party movement is a grassroots movement of a lot of people that's not necessarily all

republicans. some independents and some democrats that are not of washington. they want to influence what happens in washington, but ultimately, the principles that i stand on i think are principles that people in the party identify with. >> but there is a thought to the party, don't compromise. you've said you don't think people in washington are serious, i assume republicans and democrats, about really taking on the toughest challenges we face. as you think about yourself, are you here to legislate? are you here to compromise? >> compromise shouldn't be a dirty word. in washington, compromise seems to be a deal and that's what it's meant to people over the last 20 years, a deal that's meant to be a solution but doesn't solve anything. i think the compromise is between two folks with the same goal but different ideas of how to do it. that's not a negative thing. >> you voted against the compromise on the budget deal in the lame duck session. you apparently didn't think that was a good deal, that that was a fair compromise. did the republican leadership fail here? >> first of all, i respect the work that speaker boehner put in.

he was in a tough spot. let's remind ourselves of the last election cycle and what it was about. we were dealing with major issues in our country, big issues that deserve big solutions. now, people like me, who were elected in the wave of 2010 to make a difference, if we don't stand up and say that, who is going to stand up and say that? if folks like me elected in 2010 don't come here and say these big issues, these big problems deserve big solutions, no one's going to say that. >> right, but you still have to compromise. i mean, you say he was in a tough spot. he's in a tough spot because you either have the votes or you don't. so, you send a statement or you compromise and get things done. which is what senator rubio believes in? >> well, i think you want to have a compromise. a compromise better do something. my problem is the problems have to be solved. to say we compromised for the same of compromised, that may get you short-term likes in the media, but long-term, it doesn't accomplish anything. we need solutions. >> you have a debate over raising the debt ceiling, the limit on america's credit card. you said no, i won't vote to raise the debt ceiling unless we

talk about serious cuts and reforms in entitlement spending. the treasury secretary said this would be a catastrophe and this is irresponsible. this is what he said this week. >> the idea that the united states would take the risk, people start to believe we won't pay our bills is a ridiculous proposition, irresponsible, completely unacceptable risk for us to take. >> is it irresponsible for you to carry through to the voters? >> it's irresponsible to continue to borrow trillions a year with no plan to end it. i marvel how people in this town run around with their hair on fire because of the potential of a technical default over not raising the debt limit, but they're not concerned about not paying our debt obligations because we don't have the money. my point is we know this is a problem. you look at any projection that shows you the debt kri sis will come if we do nothing. let's start dealing with it now. let's use the debt limit debate as an opportunity to begin to put in place a plan and execute a plan that gains the confidence of the world. >> but the treasury secretary says let's talk about it, work on parallel tracks.

the tea party's got everybody talking about spending, but if you can't reach agreements on social security reform, medicare reform, other specific cuts, do you then take the next step and say we're going to -- >> first of all, there is no magic bullet. in essence, you can't solve this debt problem america faces with one solution. there's not a magic bullet. a series of reforms have to happen. what i'm saying and what i think others are beginning to think, including many in the democrat party, is now as part of the debt limit debate, let's not just talk about the debt limit, let's talk about how we're going to put this country on a fiscal path -- >> all right, one of the ways to do that, as you well know, chairman paul ryan of the budget committee said we have to change medicare as we know it, premium support or a voucher system, but it's going to change. okay, are you prepared to vote to support the ryan plan? >> medicare as we know it becomes bankrupt, so you can't sustain it the way it is. between the next 5 and 12 years, medicare as we know it will go bankrupt, and all of the people out there attacking the ryan plan, where is your plan? introduce your plan.

because if your plan is to keep medicare the way it is, then that's bankruptcy and it doesn't work for anybody. number two, as far as the ryan plan is concerned, i will support any plan that saves medicare, doesn't impact current seniors and doesn't hurt economic growth. if the ryan plan does that, if people don't like the ryan plan, introduce your own plan. >> you'll vote for the plan? >> i'll vote for any plan that saves medicare, doesn't hurt seniors and doesn't hurt economic growth. if someone has a better idea on how to do that, they should propose that bill. >> you can't assert that it saves medicare when there's so much uncertainty about it, and it certainly dismantles the way medicare operates. and you have said recently you don't want to dismantle a program like medicare or social security that your own mother relies upon. >> that's right. >> look at some of the reaction in terms of how people feel about cutting spending for medicare. we'll put it on the screen. cutting medicare spending -- 78% oppose. medicare spending -- 69% oppose. you're not operating in a political vacuum here. you well know that. you are a senator from florida

with a lot of older voters. are you prepared to stand up to them and say, sorry, folks, we've got to do this? because a lot of republicans think this is handing something to the democrats that will be potent against republicans. >> the ryan plan doesn't cut medicare, it actually increases funding to it and the only people that have voted to cut medicare supported obamacare, which cut trillions out of medicare and is using it to fund a science experiment somewhere outside of medicare. the only people who voted to cut medicare spending are the people who voted in favor of obama care. that's a fact. the truth is -- >> but you don't deny, if you introduce a voucher system into medicare, that there is going to be a set amount of dollars seniors have to go into the private marketplace. that is not medicare as we now have it? >> well, medicare as we now have it goes bankrupt. it's not an option. here's my challenge today -- anybody out there who thinks there is a better way to save medicare should introduce a bill on monday. tomorrow, when we get back to work here in washington, run up to capitol hill and introduce your bill. why hasn't the president

proposed a medicare plan? why hasn't the congressional democrats proposed a medicare plan? why haven't the leaders in the senate who control the senate -- they haven't even proposed a budget, much less a medicare plan. what is their plan to save a program that's going to go bankrupt in 5 to 12 years? don't just criticize, propose. otherwise, you're not serious. you're playing political games. >> you've been here for a matter of months in washington, so you have a fresher perspective. what is your assessment of the president's leadership? >> well, i think unfortunately, the president has failed to lead. and i say this with sadness. let me tell you something, i'm a republican, i'm proud to be a republican, but i love my country even more. i desperately want america for the next 100 years to be what it's been for the last, an exceptional country in many ways, socially, politically, economically. america has been unique and special. i want it to continue to be that way. it cannot unless the president leads. i want the president to lead. i want the president to lead. we can't solve this medicare issue, we can't keep it from going bankrupt if the president doesn't lead. we can't put our country on a sustainable path of spending if the president doesn't lead. we can't play america's proper role in the world if the

president doesn't lead. i want him to lead. americans want him to lead. ultimately, i'd rather him lead than just hope that my party succeeds, but he's not leading and we're going to pay a tremendous price for that. >> do you think he's beatable in 2012? >> well, i think he has to lead. if he doesn't, i think he should be replaced. >> but the question is he beatable in 2012? >> sure. anybody's beatable in american politics. i learned that myself. >> what about your political future? you said no run in 2012. you wouldn't be on a vp ticket. people in your party are depending on you. if your party comes to you and says look, you can focus on florida, but in the fall of next year, we need you on the ticket to carry florida. are you saying there's no way you'll consider it? >> i won't consider it. i don't want to be the vice president of the united states. i want to be a senator. i want to be the senator from florida. i think in the united states senate i can have an impact on the issues we're facing. i'm saddened that americans are so pessimistic about the future. they shouldn't be. there's nothing wrong with the american people. we are the same people that built the greatest society in all of human history. we just need some government policies that allow the american people to once again do that. >> so, under no circumstances would you serve on a ticket in

2012? >> no. i'm not going to be on a ticket in 2012. >> under no circumstances? >> under no circumstances. >> what about donald trump? is he a serious candidate? >> well, you give him a lot of attention, so yes, he is. >> is he a true conservative? >> i don't know much about donald trump's politics. i know you have to ask that, but i'm more concerned about the issues happening here on planet earth, and back here on this planet, we're facing the issues that our country owes $15 trillion. our debt is larger than our economy, almost about to be larger than our entire economy, with no plan in sight to reverse course on that. around the world is the most dangerous as it's been in a long time. there are people as we speak planning to attack american interests at home and abroad. these issues have to be dealt with. if we deal with them, the next century can be an american century as well, but we can deal with them and the president has to lead. >> quickly on american policy. you've thought a lot about u.s. policy. there are reports that gadhafi's son and grandchildren were killed by a nato attack. will this push him from power, in your view?

>> well, i hope the libyan people will push him from power. i think the united states and nato and the international community have a role to play in that and he must be removed from power. for saddam hussein -- i'm sorry, for moammar gadhafi to hold on to power in libya would be the worst possible scenario i can imagine. he would be emboldened to act against our interests. he would create a blueprint for others in the region to act as he has. >> you would target him specifically? >> well, he hides behind civilians to shield himself. unfortunately, if he's involved in military operations and military installations and command centers, he's going to find himself in the line of fire. i think the best thing gadhafi can do is leave libya. >> we'll leave it there. senator rubio, thank you for your time this morning. up next -- >> look at the options republicans are kicking around, palin, gingrich, trump. that doesn't sound like a field of candidates. that sounds like season 13 of "dancing with the stars." >> inside political comedy and its role in politics in our elections from the host of the correspondents dinner, head writer for "saturday night live," seth meyers. bef

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and we are back. last night, the white house correspondents association hosted its annual dinner at the hilton here in washington, where president obama spoke, and he took the opportunity to take some real jabs at his most vocal critics. >> and then, there is a vicious rumor floating around that i think could really hurt mitt romney. i heard he passed universal health care when he was governor of massachusetts. someone should get to the bottom of that, and i know just the guy to do it, donald trump! is here tonight. now, i know that he's taken some flack lately, but no one is happier, no one is prouder to put this birth certificate matter to rest than the donald. and that's because he can

finally get back to focusing on the issues that matter, like did we fake the moon landing? >> silence there. on saturday, i sat down with the featured entertainer at the dinner, the head writer from "saturday night live," seth meyers. we talked about how he prepared for his hosting duties last night and the role of political comedy. seth meyers, welcome to "meet the press." >> it's great to be here! i'm so excited to be on "meet the press" without having to run for office. >> right. >> so much easier this way. >> if you want to declare something, feel free to do that. >> i think i'm mostly just go to run from previous statements and hit some talking points. >> good. >> i've been watching a lot of "meet the press" to prepare for this, so. >> actually, it's appropriate we're at the white house. >> yes. >> you and your family getting a tour here, which is always nice to see the people's house. >> yep. >> and of course, you are the star attraction because i picked up "politico" here, and here it is, "snl comes to washington," as you're presiding over it. >> yes, very exciting. >> this is, this dinner -- and i'm talking to you before you're

doing it here on friday -- this is a tough thing to prepare for. >> it's very hard to prepare for, but it's fun to prepare for as well, you know. it's exciting to be able to tell jokes that, you know, i feel like everybody here will get, and maybe the rest of the country won't. i mean, it's obviously a very wonky room. not a strong field. and who knows if they can beat you in 2012? but i'll tell you who could definitely beat you, mr. president, 2008 barack obama. you would have loved him. >> you're sitting around your office as you're all getting ready for the show, and a week like this happens. >> right. >> where you have this split-screen effect. the president releasing his birth certificate, donald trump announcing that he's proud of himself. >> right. >> and on cable television. do you just fall off your chair and say could they have made this any better for us? >> i was very excited. when you do stuff like this, in a lot of ways, it's about the year in politics, but i feel

like the closer the news is to the actual day, the better, and obviously, this is an exciting time to be doing the show. >> so, we both do weekly news programs. >> yes. >> and you, of course, you talk a lot about politics. >> right. >> as i mentioned, talking about donald trump. so, where do you get your material? >> well, i mean, i think donald trump sort of brings it with a bow on it and leaves it at the front door, but you sort of follow, watch the news, and you know, spend a lot of time on the internet. for us, "weekend update," it's easier if it's a story that our audience is familiar with. we don't educate very well on our show, but if it's a big story, i feel like we can analyze it pretty well. >> but it's interesting, you spend a lot of time sort of insisting that you're topical, right? >> yes. >> you want to be relevant. >> i insist it constantly. say it right before bed and first thing when i wake up. >> "saturday night live" has been doing fake news long before it was cool to do fake news. >> how dare you? how dare you call it fake?

>> is part of the motivation that you have an agenda, that you feel like you can really influence? >> i don't think you ever -- as a comedian, i don't think you aim to influence. but it's really nice when people think you're influential. so, it's a nice side effect, but i don't think -- i mean, i think our first goal is always just to be funny. >> so, what is your impression of politicians generally, especially those who participate on the program? you had some impressions working with then candidate obama before you will skewer him while sitting on stage at the white house correspondents dinner. >> obama is great. he was really charismatic, he was great on our show. it's been intimidating to watch old correspondents dinners and see how hard he kills. he's very good at telling jokes. >> and when he was on the show, there was that bit, a halloween show, where with the halloween mask. >> right. and he took off his halloween mask and revealed that he was then candidate obama. so i guess we were really influential. i don't think anybody thought he was going to win and now he's president.

>> so, you dressed as yourself? >> well, you know, hillary, i have nothing to hide. i enjoy being myself. i'm not going to change who i am just because it's halloween. live from new york, it's saturday night! >> he struck you as funny? >> he struck me as very funny. i remember going to his room, his dressing room beforehand to run over some lines with him, and i mentioned that i grew up in new hampshire and he jumped right out of his chair to shake my hand, which i, as a primary state, like he appreciated. >> like you understood where he was coming from. >> yes, yes, yeah. >> tina fey. you've done something on "saturday night live" i haven't been able to do, get sarah palin to appear on the program. and you had a very positive experience with her. >> well, i mean, she was a great sport. that was a crazy time. you know, that was the month before the election, and she came on and was really funny in a sketch, and then i think one of the probably best things i've ever been next to in my time at "saturday night live" was watching her do the sarah palin rap and i got to jam out and dance with sarah palin, so

what's better than that? ♪ my name is sarah palin, you all know me, vice president nominee of the gop ♪ ♪ gonna need your votes in the next election, can i get a whoop, whoop from the senior section ♪ ♪ put your hands up >> she got the joke and she was okay with it? >> she did. she did. i wouldn't say that i don't think she trusted us 100%, but you know, i think she knew that we were good sports and she wasn't turned off. >> didn't think comedians in new york city would be -- >> she put a toe in first. she entered every room toe first, yes. >> all right, is there a difference between how republicans and democrats come to play on "saturday night live"? >> i have to say, i think republicans are just so happy to be, like sort of invited to the party? john mccain's been one of the most fun people we've had on the show and he's always been an excellent sport. >> right. >> and i think probably the sarah palin sketch i'll remember the most is when, you know, he came on as himself and tina fey played sarah palin and they did a qvc sketch together.

>> good evening, my fellow americans. i'm john mccain. >> and, you know, i'm just sarah palin. okay, listen up, everybody, i'm going rogue right now, so keep your voices down. available now, we've got a bunch of these t-shirts -- >> you look at this republican field. you know, you look at some of the polling, and there's not a lot of excitement -- >> no. >> -- about the republicans who are going to challenge president obama. does that worry you? >> no. it's excellent so far. this field is excellent for us. >> why is that? >> this is a really good field for impressions and comedies, and i already can't wait for the first republican debate. i know they have to get enough to actually hold a debate, but i think it will be really good for us. >> do you lay awake night after praying that you're topical and relevant that donald trump is a candidate? >> i would love it. if donald ran for president, it would be the greatest thing for us. it would not be good for anyone else, but it would be excellent for us and i'd be selfishly willing to take that. >> seth meyers, thank you very much. good to have you on the program. >> appreciate it. >> you bet. >> we'll be right back.

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that is all for today. visit "press pass," our press pass blog, for a wrap-up of today's program and updates from me throughout the week. it's presspass.msnbc.com. we will be back next week. if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." www.vitac.com -- captions by vitac --