>> we're big with the jet lag crowd. >> this one is from robert. the pattern on willie's shirt woke me up. >> how's that going? it's "morning joe" starts right now. president obama just went to the g-20 summit to give europe advice on its debt crisis. wait, europe's getting economic advice from obama? that's like j.lo getting marriage advice from kim kardashian. >> oh, lord. good morning, everyone. it's friday, november 4th. with us onset, he's already inappropriately blurted something out, msnbc contributor

mike barnicle. and mark haleprin. willie's on his way walking in. >> yeah. >> yeah. happy friday. >> where's my crimson tide tumb tumbler? kate? what do you think? i gave it to you so you could drink off set with it? where is it? it's not doing anybody -- it's not doing bama nation any good downstairs. >> when's this game done? >> never. >> it goes on forever. >> really? >> who are you going to watch with, mika? >> i -- >> you going to watch at a party? >> no, i'll try and tune in. keep up with what you all talk about incessantly. you want to talk politics? >> no. no. it is tomorrow. the tailgating has begun. >> has it really? >> yeah, barnicle and i were -- were grilling out and eating

pork this morning 5:15, washing it down with some mountain dew. >> mr. pibb. >> we've had meat on the grill for four straight days. >> rc cola goes down good. >> was there anything? >> no, i was going to tell him, you know, people up in connecticut and new jersey, they should invest in -- if they can, reasonably priced little generator that you can hook up to your heating system and keep some lights on when these -- >> well, thank you, barnicle. >> these clownish power companies lose their way. >> yeah. you know, there was one -- and it's not the good people of connecticut light and power. i love them. >> right. >> i love them, but there are structural problems. you got one town that had been out of power for four days and they had one power truck working it. >> that's not right. >> and you know, this is -- dare i say -- because i'm asking the natives up there, what's causing this. and they say unions.

they say that you can only -- you know, in florida where you don't have as tough union rules, i wake up in the middle of the night after a hurricane the first night and honestly after ivan, which was devastating, i looked out my window, there were four mississippi power trucks. it was 3:00 a.m. in the morning. by the time i woke up after this devastating storm, the power was back up. connecticut is a wreck right now. >> the good news is, if you're in the shelter for a few more weeks, the carolling will start. >> i don't even know what that means. >> people will start singing christmas carols in the shelter. >> that is true. that is true. could i have that now, please? i have no idea. >> make her say roll tide when she puts it -- >> come here. yeah, this probably should have been here at the top of the show. like the time t.j. figured out after the first break that there was a 30-second delay and said, oh, do you want me to fix that? oh, anyway.

you know, do we want to talk about herman cain any more? seriously? that thing's over. >> yeah. >> what about rick perry? he denied he was drunk when he sounded drunk. >> no, and rick perry's people saying they didn't do the herman cain thing. >> there's no indication this has hurt him yet. >> right. >> but we're going to see national polls soon. it'll be interesting to see. >> it's stunning what doesn't hurt him. >> nothing hurts him. >> it's stunning. >> he's not teflon man, he's super man. >> kryptonite wrapped in teflon. >> watch out for newt gingrich. i think at the end of the day, newt may be the next alternat e alternative. >> really? >> if he doesn't say some really stupid things. which newt has had a 25-year history of being in a position where he can get past stupid things he said in the past and

move forward and say something else stupid. if he doesn't blow himself up between now and iowa, his people know he's got a shot. >> i believe tomorrow night during the game, the rival thing to watch is gingrich versus cain debate in texas. >> that'll be very good for newt gingrich. >> you can flip over during the game. >> i don't think so. a new gallup poll shows barack obama neck and neck with his competition. it's based on battleground states including florida, new hampshire, pennsylvania, and virginia. in these states, mitt romney and president obama are in a statistical tie, the president is slightly ahead of texas governor rick perry and herman cain. as for the direction of the country, a 4 to 1 majority say they are not satisfied with the way things are going in the united states, 60% of swing-state voters say their families would be better off three years ago before obama's

presidency. the same poll shows that an overwhelming number of republicans are enthusiastic about the upcoming election. 59% say they are extremely or very enthusiastic. as opposed to just 48% of democrats. >> what do you see in those numbers, mika. >> i'm just curious about the republicans that are enthusiastic. because i actually -- just from talking to your friends, it seems like there's frustrations and divisions within the party as to who they should ultimately be supporting and who they really are. >> yeah, but -- one thing that is missed is the members of congress that we saw on capitol hill. >> yeah. >> they know what they're doing. >> they do. >> we talk about dave the other day, the chairman of ways and means, good, solid, decent guy. smart. i have a feeling his constituents are going to be very excited to vote for dave. >> i see. >> there are -- i said this

before, it can't be stated enough, we in the national media focus on these presidential candidates for obvious reasons because they could be the next president of the united states. but there are 200, at least, 200 members of congress in the republican caucus that are more qualified and know more of what they're talking about on foreign policy and domestic policy, on tax policy, on debt policy than just about any of the presidential candidates that are out there. we had paul ryan on yesterday. right? >> yes. >> willie agree or disagree, willie. you know you could talk to paul about policy for five hours and never once would he have that -- he would never have to once resort to one of herman cain's stupid rhetorical tricks. well, do you know what one plus one is? >> excuse me. >> excuse me. >> i don't think there's any question. i think that's what they do all day. they look at the numbers and

look at policy, i don't think herman cain did that quite as much, although he did meet with henry kissinger yesterday. we'll show that photo later. but on your enthusiasm question -- there's the photograph there. they got together. just two guys talking about foreign policy, trying to figure out when china's going to get those nukes. >> that's why he went there. i understand they are trying to develop -- >> henry kissinger. >> i was just thinking, imagine if he could open up china and an american president could go visit. >> somebody sent me a bumper sticker. >> what would that be like? >> he sees a world where there's a mcdonald's in china. >> stumbling toward accuracy has made a bumper stick. >> 60% of the republicans, you hear that when you go out, republicans are broadly enthusiastic, they this president is extremely vulnerable, 9% unemployment. they're not specifically enthusiastic about the

candidates. they're frustrated they have this opening, they feel like they should win next year and don't feel like they have a guy who will win. >> yeah. >> if i remember barack obama, i would be thrilled with those numbers. >> exactly. >> given the condition that the country is in economically, given the level of people's frustrations. the fact that he is neck-and-neck with the republican field is amazing. >> the enthusiasm gap is the one concern that you bring up. mark, in these swing states a lot of time, it is turnout that matters. it was turnout in 2000 that mattered in the swing states, turnout in 2004 that mattered in the swing states. if this is say a 51%/49%, or a 50/50 race as it was in 2000 or 2004, that enthusiasm gap makes all the difference in the world. >> well, it does. but on the other side, you've got the president's campaign operation now working really hard, organizing in those states. they know where the battlegrounds are, and they are

good at organizing, face-to-face. that can make the difference one, two, three points potentially. and there's no republican in the race now. no outside group that can match that organizational ability. that may offset. the president's in a very good position in terms of polling right now and given the climate in the country and the economy. and as they continue to organize, continue to raise money, the president can fight back somewhat. >> so, mika, have the greeks decided to destroy the european economy? >> yeah, i think they're working toward that. >> working through it. >> they're trying to work through it. >> what happened yesterday? >> the turmoil in greece continues. and the country's embattled prime minister faces a critical vote of confidence today. that vote comes a day after announcing he would abandon his bid for a bailout referendum in the wake of sharp criticism from other european officials as well as members from his own party who have said they will not support him.

in an address to parliament yesterday, he said "i don't care about being reelected, i am interested in saving the country." the prime minister added he is open to the creation of a transitional government that would ensure greece gets the next round of bailout funds. he said he would be open to new elections. about 90% of greeks oppose papandreou's administration. president obama says finding a solution to the european debt crisis is the group's most important task. big meeting with sarkozy, that will be fascinating. my daughter has french exchange students, and they had to make pictures of what the french girls think of americans. >> oh no. >> so she brought home a picture of a big guy with a beer on his

belly. that's what the french girls had drawn. a clown for the way we dress. somebody holding money, and gobbling it up. someone eating a burger. i'm just saying, it was -- what they think of us. it's fascinating. it was a fascinating dinner conversation. >> you want to -- yeah, exactly. the belly. >> are you describing what the french -- these french girls think of the country? >> of americans, yeah. >> or of what they think of "morning joe." because it fits "morning joe" to a tee. >> i asked her if i could bring it in and she said no way. >> well, you know what? i think we'll somehow get by without that. >> we gave them jerry lewis and mickey rourke and they've never forgiven us. >> how old are these girls? >> 15. >> why don't you ask them when they go back home, take their -- >> barnicle. >> take their impressions of us and walk through normandy.

>> there you go. >> walk through the province of normandy and see all the american cemeteries. have them read the names of the dead, now dead, these many years. and reflect -- >> i'll do that. i'll do that. >> you tell them, grandpa. and also, get off my lawn! >> yeah. >> wilson! >> a picture of the american flag. that was nice showing our pride. >> boy, that's great. >> so we're in a financial mess, though. there's no doubt about it. and the president's going out, still going out pushing on this jobs plan, and it actually -- we have seen it. it's working for him. either that's working for him or the republicans going -- running out to the middle of the debate stage and setting themselves on fire. >> incredible confluence of events that may be very lucky for this president. turning now to the unemployment crisis here at home. in washington, democrats and republican debate rivals --

rival jobs plan bring release to america's working class and pull us out on our own crisis. as the senate blocks a $60 billion bill from president's jobs plan. it would have provided $50 billion in infrastructures with an additional $10 billion going towards investments and private construction projects. the measure would've been funded by a .7% surtax on individuals making more than $1 million a year. i don't see what the problem is with that. >> what's fascinating, the president is doing this talking jobs, jobs, jobs, jobs. the whole issue in washington right now is the deficit commission. will the deficit commission meet their mark? or will washington once again fail? we've got two sides of pennsylvania avenue, mike, on completely different tracks. >> and meanwhile the country bumps along, jobless people continue to look at what happens

in washington with great frustration. you get harry reid. do we have the harry reid clip? he is just nonsensical. >> what did he say? mcconnell, the back and forth? >> we have that. you want to see that? >> yeah. >> barnicle wants this. take a look. >> democrats have deliberately designed this bill to fail. deliberately designed the bill to fail. so the truth is, democrats are more interested in building a campaign message than in rebuilding roads and bridges. >> their goal is to do everything they can to drag down this economy, to do anything they can to focus attention negatively on the president of the united states, in hopes he can get my job, perhaps. and i would say to my friend, we can stay here all day, i will get the last word. >> it is certainly the case the majority leader can always have the last word, but i would say with all due respect to my friend, he made another campaign speech. >> welm, that's nice, they're friends. >> i mean, these people are

jokes. they are jokes. my friend, my friend -- people have been unemployed for months on end, the unemployment rate, the real unemployment rate in this country is probably upwards of 14%, people who have given up looking for work and they carry on like this each and every day and they've done the same thing for two or three years. both sides of the aisle. >> and as you know, the way these deals get done. grown-ups go behind the scenes and sit down and negotiate it out. don't tell me what separates these two parties is that different. at the end of the day, let the left wing bloggers and the right-wing bloggers say what they will at the end of the day. what separates these two parties is not that great. it's just not. this isn't -- this is not fdr versus taft. >> no. >> you know, it's -- they're in

between the 40 yard lines. and grown-ups sitting back behind closed doors figuring this out could come up with a deal but everybody postures. everybody postures. >> the one divide that does seem to be completely intractable is taxes. >> but that's not -- >> that's why republicans say, yes, we agree we should invest in infrastructure. both sides can gri on, but we won't pay for it with this .7% surtax. >> but the democrats know if they want more revenue into the government, they know how to do it. work with the republicans to close loopholes. that brings more tax dollars in to washington. and you can even, if you're a democrat and are interested in getting the deal done, even say and we'll even lower the top tax rate by 2 percentage points, let's say, which is just sort of just wrapping a bow on top of this package. because you're going to be

getting a, you know, billions of dollars more in tax revenue. they could do that. it becomes intractable when the democrats come out and say, hey, this is what we're going to do. >> no, when the republicans sign a pledge that they will not do anything with taxes at all and they have to stick to a point where they can't negotiate. >> you're a couple of days behind. >> no, i'm not. >> there are 100 republicans, many of whom who signed grover's pledge who said they were backing off on it. >> it put a wedge in the conversation. and i don't have any problem with tax on millionaires. does anyone have a problem? >> no. >> any millionaires at the table have a problem with that? >> i'm not worried about that, mika. what i want to do, and what democrats want and what a lot of republicans want. and this is middle ground if people will stop talking in ideological sound bites. they want to figure out a way to bring more tax revenue to washington, d.c. and there is a way to do that without raising the top tax code. if your goal is to win a

political ideological fight, then go ahead and fight about raising the top tax rate. if your goal is to get more tax dollars to washington so we can invest in education, infrastructure, r & d, bring down the debt in the long run, we can do that, we can strike a deal. we can. the question is, are people going to be more interested in scoring ideological points or winning the future? >> i think they're different goals, as well. >> let me ask you, then, how do we get one of those sides to move off the position. whether it's no new taxes or we're not going to close the loopholes? how do we get those guys in a room and sort this out to get beyond politics and fix the problem? >> i would guess, you can find 350 votes in the house of representatives to close the loopholes with the right package. >> the adults on the super committee can do it. there are a lot of adults on there. >> they can do it. that will pass. that then opens up entitlements.

>> pretty pessimistic. >> to slow down the rate of growth and entitlements. i don't mean to be overly simplistic, although it is what i do for a living. but i will tell you -- >> you choose to -- >> a couple of smart people on capitol hill could put together outlines of a significant plan that could pass if the children would let the adults run the show. >> but they won't. i mean, mark was talking about the adults on the supercommittee. a couple of them are extraordinarily pessimistic about meeting any goal. >> well, you look at people like mark warner and saxby chambliss, there are -- we had them on this past week, they're adults there. let's hope they win the day. coming up, former secretary of state madeline albright. the washington post's eugene robinson, and deepak chopra. don't miss willie's weekend review. >> this is big.

>> first, though, we're going to go to bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> you can miss this. go ahead. >> turn the channel now and come back. >> definitely. >> go heat that muffin up. good morning, everyone. we have two big events. joe was talking about the big game at tuscaloosa. also new york city marathon this weekend, weather looks fantastic for that. travel trouble spot this morning down in virginia from southeastern corner from virginia beach to norfolk to richmond, southward to raleigh, that's where the wet weather is. we're looking at a cool day in new england. another dry day, one of the longest dry stretches we've had this year. the rain exits the carolinas, beautiful in the middle of the country after a chilly morning. travel trouble spots out there, san francisco, l.a., and taking you through your weekend, looks like a nice weekend on saturday and on sunday. east coast, no problems at all. remember, we get an extra hour. set those clocks back as you go to bed saturday night. you're watching "morning joe"

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i am proud to offer you an amazing investment opportunity. europe. haven't you always wanted to own a continent? europe has germany, france, italy, eat dinner at 10:00, take a nap at 2:00, meet your lover at 4:00ment cheese, cheese, cheese. and thousands and thousands of the strangest toilets. act now and we'll throw in greece. even if you do not act now, we will throw in greece. please, just take greece. >> that was pretty funny and sad. let's take a look now at the "morning papers." we'll start with the "los angeles times" that says despite

vows to punish, u.s. officials are now backing down. sources say that the sight of such sanctions could disrupt oil markets and damage the u.s. and world economies. >> here's one from our parade of papers. in northwest montana, a man who made headlines in 2008 for flying a specifically rigged lawn chair tied to hundreds of party balloons is about to embark on his next flight, this time in baghdad. the lawn chair balloonist says his mission is to encourage iraqis to "dream big" knowing the sky is the limit. >> wow. okay, and in the sunday "parade" magazine, features an essay by colin powell, plus personal stories from six of our veterans from conflicts. let's turn to "politico" now. patrick gavin with a look at the playbook.

good morning. >> good morning, everybody. >> our man luke russert asked john boehner yesterday at a press conference about the impact grover norquist has had on the republican party. >> grover norquist was on the hill this morning. is he a positive influence on your conference? >> listen, our focus here is on jobs. we're doing everything we can to get our economy moving in and get people back to work. it's not often i'm asked about some random person in america and what i think. >> is he a random person, though? to your conference, is he a random person? >> our focus is creating jobs not talking about somebody's personality. >> random person, patrick gavin, what do you make of it? >> obviously there's nothing that could be further from the truth. he's been as you guys have talked about a big player during not only this whole year but especially during any sort of debate over the fiscal policy. i think what is interesting,

what luke was smart to bring up was pulling the curtain back for average americans who may not know who he is to see the influence he does have in a lot of these debates. one thing to keep an eye on for as you were saying in the last segment. could this be a point where a lot of people do buck grover norquist? and if they do, what does that mean for the future of grover norquist? i do think, you know, it's very unlikely that's going to happen. john boehner has signed that taxpayer pledge and grover does carry a lot of influence. and he will hold it against anybody who sort of breaks the pledge in the next election season. and that really i think is what john boehner is worried about and other folks on capitol hill are worried about, as well. >> can you help viewers understand the influence of grover norquist? a lot of people hearing his name for the first time over the last several months. why would congressmen sign a pledge to this guy who is not in new government or representative of anyone? >> hep represents a dominant view within the conservative movements.

he's got massachusetts roots and he's wicked smart. and he's able to take his public relations and tactical skills to say that people in the republican party, if you want to get elected, you have to toe the line on this one issue that's important. it's not about his whim, it's about him capturing that strong belief, you should never raise taxes. >> and it also is about a guy that has results. you look at the last fight, the big fight about raising the debt ceiling. if there were not the gofer norquist pledge, you better believe there would have been tax increases in that package. >> did you sign the pledge when you were a member? >> yep, i did. never voted to raise taxes and i'm proud of it. and guess what? we balanced the budget. >> would you have raised your hand -- >> four times. >> when the candidates were asked, would you take $10 in cuts -- >> oh, i would take in 2011, i'd take a 3 to 1, 4 to 1 cut. i would do the tax reform -- the

tax reforms we're talking about, closing tax loopholes if it got us to the real problem and the problem is entitlement spending, the explosion of it. it's funny, everybody is so ideological in their own way. on the right, they always talk about no new taxes, on the left, think about all the people we've had on this set. over the past several years and you ask them what the problem is. what was bush's biggest problem? he could've asked americans to sacrifice. he could've raised taxes, but instead he just told us to -- everybody -- i can't remember the guy's name, but in a ten-year celebration of 9/11, a brilliant, smart guy came here and he talked about the great tragedy of the last ten years. and we asked what the great tragedy was. welm, well, bush had a chance to raise taxes and he didn't. the left is as blind on this tax issue as the right. raising taxes isn't the answer. it's not going to save us.

it's one part of the equation. >> it's a part of the equation. >> it's a part of the equation. >> now, for the left, it is all encompassing, it's all they talk about. they are as crazy about raising taxes as people who sign grover's tax pledges about cutting taxes. it's an obsession by both sides. >> hmm. >> mika's biting her tongue. >> yeah, i am. >> because she's one of them obsessed with raising taxes. >> i think that takes two to make an argument. and when one side digs in completely and doesn't look at the big picture, you say it's all ideological and bringing in revenue and math of it and how do you fix the problem, and you've got to look at our society and look at what's happening and the trends. and i'm sorry, sometimes you have to change course. sometimes perhaps you have to go back on an extreme pledge and -- >> i don't think it's an extreme pledge at all. >> negotiate to take -- >> i don't think it's an extreme pledge. i think when the federal

government goes from spending 19% of gdp when i was there to spending about 25%, 26% of gdp, i think when you have over the past three or four years, the federal government spending at such an obscene rate, an obscene rate, they have rolled up $4 trillion at least in deficits over four years, i think we need to look at spending before we obsess over raising taxes. >> okay. and maybe we should have rattner come in with charts about when we actually experienced growth and under which presidents and which presidents actually raised taxes and did not. >> sure, we can do that. >> there's certainly a lot of hypocrisy in there. >> i don't know what -- >> sports is next. >> what are you talking about? i'm confused. ♪ [ female announcer ] who'd have thought that the person you'd grow up to be -- how creative or confident or kind --

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all right. let's do some sports. the nba still trying to save its season. >> why? >> exactly. >> they don't have to do that on our account. we're good. >> we have football, we're all fine. a new round of talks scheduled now between the players union for tomorrow. there are signs of unrest between the players and their union. reports yesterday showing players held a conference call to discuss the possibility of

decertifying -- vocal critics would like to decertify, that would mean individual players could file lawsuits against the league. >> this is like when the hockey guys went on strike. >> et cetera, et cetera. >> for a couple of years. i didn't even know they were on strike. >> the nfl knew they had to fix the problem or there would have been a revolt in this country because people don't know what to do with themselves on sunday in the fall. nba people are like, eh, take a year off. we'll see you next year. >> when does college season start? >> next week. >> great for college basketball. nobody cares about the nba. >> they care -- they care after the super bowl's over. then start watching. come back after the super bowl. >> you guys hang out on south beach, have a good time. we'll see you in a couple of years. >> or come back after march madness. >> that's perfect. >> start the season in april. >> now baseball starts in. seriously, nba, you're no longer needed. take a year off. we're good. >> baseball. could be a reunion in the windy city. >> no, no.

go ahead. theo epstein says he's talking to the former red sox manager terry francona about taking over that team. mike says no. we're going to sit down and see if it's a fit. epstein hired francona in 2003, they went on to win two world series titles. barnicle says it's not happening, why? >> i think tito has a better shot at the cardinals job than the cubs job. i think theo wants to make a complete break with the past, including a break from his past. he likes tito, they get along well together, but he wants his own new manager. >> why is he floating him? >> i don't know he was floating him. he was asked about it. >> he answered disingenuously. >> i don't think so. there was a picture of him taken, eating chicken, i think

it could happen. >> where were the beers balanced? on their undershirts? >> undershirts. >> huge event tomorrow night. >> this is as big as it gets. honestly. one versus two. >> you know what? i would say this is ali/frazier -- actually, that was the fight of the century. ali/frazier, '71, the fight of the century, maybe the sport event of the century. >> i was talking about jose canseco and lennie dykstra. >> forget what i said, this is the fight of the century. >> and also a football game. number one ranked alabama against lsu. alabama a 4 1/2-point favorite right now. first time the number one and two ranked teams have played each other during the regular season. one player who could be that deciding factor in the game, trent richardson in the middle of the heisman race right now.

to give you an idea of how tough it is to bring this man down while he's carrying a football, in an interview yesterday talking to dan patrick on the radio. here's part of the exchange. patrick asked richardson what he benches, richardson responds i really can't tell you the truth because i don't know the truth. i did 475 easy and they won't let me go above 475. >> wow. >> patrick can't believe what he's heard. >> which is the truth. they will not let him. >> he asks again. yeah, i did 475 easily, but they won't let me go up from there. that's astounding for a running back. >> no, apparently a youtube video of people in pensacola, about 10 of his friends jumping on him and he flips them off. nobody can take him down. they -- they don't let him -- he can -- when you get down and push, you can -- the squats. he can do 600-pound squats, and they don't want him -- they think he's bulked up enough. but really you look at those

arms. look at the arms. they're not really that different than my arms if i had this jacket off. but they're big. he's a big, strong man. >> you know who's coming for him tomorrow, the honey badger. he takes what he wants. >> and he snorts it out. >> no, no. >> spits it out. >> unfair. mika's must-read opinion pages next. what is that? it's you!

it's me? alright emma, i know it's not your favorite but it's time for your medicine, okay? you ready? one, two, three. [ both ] ♪ emma, emma bo-bemma ♪ banana-fana-fo-femma ♪ fee-fi-fo-femma ♪ em-ma very good sweety, how do you feel? good.

yeah? you did a really good job, okay? let's go back to drawing.

that's a live look at the white house. really dark in washington this morning. spooky. time now for the must-read opinion pages. we're going to start with paul krugman.

oligarchy american style. talking about the disparity in our country. but why does this growing concentration of income and wealth in the few hands matter? part of the answer is that rising inequality in a nation in which most families don't share in economic growth. another part of the answer is that once you realize just how much richer the rich have become, the argument that higher taxes on high incomes should be part of any long-run budget deal becomes a lot more compelling. the large answer, however, is that extreme concentration of income is incompatible with real democracy. and that is a little bit of what i was trying to say in the last block, joe. it's not just about ideology. this being about addressing our current state. >> right. but we've been having this debate for a week. and i've been trying to tell you, you can feel good by raising the top rate and say, oh, we got an ideological victory, we reverse those

bush-era tax cuts, look at us, we're on top of the hill, we win. but at the end of the day, people like warren buffett still paying 18% in taxes, millionaires and billionaires still paying 18% taxes. or, you can try to get something done. and shut down the loopholes that allow general electric to pay 0% in taxes, shut down the loopholes that allow warren buffett to pay less in taxes than his secretary does. it doesn't matter what you raise that top rate to, the really rich are always going to have the lawyers and the accountants. >> or you could not just feel good, but feel better and do both. >> i -- >> is that crazy? is that crazy, haleprin? >> it's not crazy. >> i don't want to take this into a second week. go ahead. go ahead. feel good. tax, tax, tax, tax, tax. i mean, the focus -- if the focus is on taxing reform and bringing enough money in so we don't have to slash infrastructure, but that we also don't gut our economy, then obviously you're going to have

to walk a center course. and you're going to have to figure out a way to bring money into the economy without causing a double-dip. i mean, it's the same thing. cutting taxes is keynesian just like spending money is keynesian. so you've got to balance all of these things. "new york times" putting millionaires before jobs. mitch mcconnell, the senate republican leader, bitterly accused democrats of designing their infrastructure bill to fail by paying for it with a millionaire's tax as if his party's intransigence was so indomitable that daring to challenge is somehow underhanded. the only good news is that the democrats aren't going to stop. there are many more jobs bills to come, including extension of unemployment insurance and the payroll tax cut. if republicans are so proud of blocking all progress, they will have to keep doing it over and over again, testing the patience of american voters.

i guess how do you see politically this attempt to pass things drip by drip, the jobs bill, will play for this president? perhaps politically smart? >> i think it may help the president. i don't think it's going to help the senate democrats or the house democrats. i mean, mark haleprin, we had paul ryan on here yesterday and he said two very important things for republicans. one, we have passed 15 bills, 15 job bills, they are sitting over in the senate. you don't like them, you don't think they're good. harry reid, democratic senate leaders, bring them up for a vote and let's have a debate on whether the american people think they're good or not. we've sent you 15 job bills over the past year and you've let them all die. and oh, by the way, we have a budget over here, but you haven't produced a budget in over 900 days. you have been running the united states senate for 900 days. you were required by law to produce a budget yearly. and you have -- you have not

done that for over 900 days. i've got to say, by the time the election comes along, i think the republicans are going to be in pretty damn good shape when it comes to obstructionism. because they're doing something and the democrats are killing it. now you've got the president finally trying to do something on jobs and the republicans are killing it. it's a wash. >> well, there's no question republicans don't get a fair shake in the media in general on those two points, and they have a point on both of them. but those are views that can get a majority in the senate or at least enough to pass through. so if people want to spend the next year posturing, they can, but it's not the right thing for the country. and the president needs to convince republicans and his own party we don't have a year to waste. unfortunately, right now, that's the trajectory we're still on. >> and mike, that's where we are. the republicans are passing their bills, which the democrats are killing. democrats want to pass bills that the republicans want to kill. this is the time that tip

o'neill would put his arm around reagan and sit down in the white house and they would work for what's best for america. >> exactly. but this last line of "the times" editorial. they're so proud of blocking or progress, testing the patience of american voters. people in the "times" editorial board ought to take a walk around the building they're housed in. most americans think what's happening in washington is a virtual clown show. both sides. >> for sure. we'll be right back with willie's weekend review, speaking of. [ male announcer ] want to achieve more with your money?

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oh, yes. >> hey, it's time. >> is it time? >> welcome back to "morning joe." >> welcome back. >> please tell me it's time. >> 7 minutes to the top of the hour. >> tell me it's time. >> it is time for a special edition of "the news you can't use." time for "the weekend review." and what better place to start than with mr. rick perry? >> oh, yeah. >> if they print any more money over there in washington, the gold's going to be good. >> at number three, perry unplugged and unhinged. >> i grew up on a farm. i grew up -- i grew up on a farm. >> texas governor rick perry late last week delivered a downright giddy speech in the state of new hampshire. >> and it was like live free or die, victory or death. the perry campaign said the governor was passionate. >> today has been awesome, girl.

>> others guessed he was something else. >> best-case scenario, that dude's hammered. worst-case scenario, that is perry sober, and every time we've seen him previously, he's been hammered. >> governor perry said he was just drunk on a big old handle of new hampshire freedom. >> i felt good, i think the message got across very well. so it was a good speech. >> at number two, slumdog comes to life. this 27-year-old is not a perfect match for the lead character in "slumdog millionaire," but the shop clerk earning $120 a month had all of india watching when he won $1 million earlier this week on "who wants to be a millionaire." after getting his big check, kumar naturally raced to the nearest train platform to

perform a fully choreographed number with frita pinto. >> kim's fairy tale wedding ends in divorce. >> she was reportedly sick of his partying and mooching. >> kim kardashian's divorce moved markets this week. >> brutal day on wall street, the dow dropping nearly 300 points. >> but it was a 12-year-old sexual harassment episode that moved the race for president. >> i have no idea who is egging this on, who's on this witch hunt. >> herman cain's front-running campaign spent the week responding in many different ways to revolutions about the candidate's alleged behavior as head of the national restaurant association. >> i am unaware of any sort of settlement. >> when i first heard the word settlement, i thought legal settlement. >> i was trying to remember some of those facts in the middle of a busy day.

>> i did this saying you're the same height as my wife. >> mr. cain did a lot of trying to deflect from the attention by singing. ♪ jesus came to love me so >> by yelling -- >> excuse me. excuse me! >> and by alerting america to china's 27-year-old nuclear ambitions. a tough week for the candidate, but the polls and at least one other candidate stood behind herman cain. >> i love herman, is he the best? >> he loves herman. >> you had some good material. >> he loves -- >> sometimes they write themselves. >> it did. it wrote itself this week. >> coming up, secretary of state, madeline albright eugene robinson, and david gregory when "morning joe" continues. capital one's new cash rewards card

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♪ amazing grace will always be my song of praise ♪ >> yes, "amazing grace" will always be his song of praise except when he's singing this song which is about the song "amazing grace" but appears to be sung to the tune of "danny boy" just like i sing about

loving "danny boy" to the tune of "stairway to heaven." ♪ there's a song i love, and it's called danny boy ♪ ♪ and i only sing that song not this one ♪ >> welcome back to "morning joe." live look at the capitol. mike barnicle and mark haleprin are still with us. also in washington, associate editor of "washington post" and msnbc political analyst eugene robinson. good to have you all on board this morning. we're going to start with politics. let's get through this cain stuff and get to the polls, shall we? >> we'll charge through it. new details. >> i agree. >> it's officially reached call me when it's over. >> well, i do want to hear what david and eugene have to say about why this is even at this

point. >> well, let's -- >> because the polls show something, as well. >> let's give him a respectful reading because he is in first place. >> wow. front-runner. new details are emerging. >> i'm sorry. >> about an alleged incident that led a female employee of the national restaurant association to accuse the front-runner, herman cain, of sexual harassment back in the 1990s. that's your front-runner. according to "politico," the employees say cain made a "unwanted sexual advance." the woman left her job shortly after the incident with one year's salary, about $35,000. politico reports that a separate woman who accused cain of inappropriate behavior received a settlement of $45,000. but nbc news has not been able to confirm this amount. today the national restaurant association is expected to decide if they will lift the confidentiality agreement allowing cain's accuser to come forward with her story.

well, that would be just be terrific, wouldn't it? >> the thing is, though, cain is going on the toughest -- you've got to give the guy credit. he's going on tough outlets where people are going to ask him really, really rough questions. where did he go yesterday? >> belly of the beast. >> mika? where did he go yesterday? the belly of the beast, didn't he? >> he was on the radio with hannity yesterday and -- >> those questions had to be brutal. >> talk about getting grilled. >> that guy goes to the heart of the matter and uncovers it, you know what i mean? no softballs here. anyhow. he said the story reported in "politico" was untrue. later, he offered why people were critical of his campaign before the harassment allegations emerged. >> they can't stand someone who is his own man period. they can't stand it. and what makes it worse, i'm a black conservative that is causing their heads to explode. >> well, i -- i think that's

just not true. i think the fact that he doesn't know that china's had nuclear weapons since 1964. the fact he says his answer to the immigration problem is electrocuting illegal immigrants, i think the fact that he comes out with a different bit of evidence every day that he's not only woefully ill-prepared to be president of the united states, but woefully ill-prepared to run for president of the united states. i think the fact that -- forget the underlying sexual harassment claims -- >> well, there's that. >> -- that he lied four times in the same day and said things that a fifth grader would know just wasn't true. i think herman cain is herman cain's biggest problem. >> and david, you interviewed him on "meet the press." is there anything we're missing here? >> no.

i mean, i think. i talked to a republican operative last night who said the problem in this presidential race is satire is dead because it's being overtaken by life. part of the problem here is that herman cain is creating this alternative universe and running for the presidency. he's running against the political establishment. he's running against washington. he's now running against the media in effect. and who as a conservative, who doesn't want a good fight with the press to rally support of the base? so that's the only piece i think is being missed here. there are elements of this campaign that are being sustained because he's being able to reach out for some things and create this kind of alternative universe. think about how striking it is that this week he's dealing with this avalanche of sexual harassment claims, but buttons up the week by meeting with henry kissinger.

and so this alternative universe he's running in at the moment has has buttoned up some of his support. another republican i talked to yesterday said something interesting. >> holden. let's show that picture again. and then if we can juxtapose the picture of elvis meeting nixon from '72, '73, i think they're about the same. henry, come on. >> what are you doing? >> might be time for a caption contest. >> we're going to have a "morning joe" caption contest. send them in. >> david talks about this friction with the press. eugene robinson, it reminds me a little bit of sarah palin and her friction with the press. >> yeah. politicians love to run against the media. and it's -- you know it's always profitable for a while. but in the end, people are going to look at herman cain -- our heads are not going to explode because he's a black conservative. my head may explode if he sings again. i think he needs to stop the

singing. and i would -- i would give anything to have been a fly on the wall of that meeting between herman cain and henry kissinger. kissinger saying that there is only one becky in uzbekistan. and the president -- how did that go? where did they start? >> well, i would hope they would start with china, and whether china had nuclear weapons. >> well, herman cain sat down for an interview with "the daily caller" and was asked about his assertion last week that china is trying to develop nuclear wes. >> maybe i misspoke. what i meant was china does not have the size of nuclear capability that we have. they do have a nuclear capability. i was talking about their total nuclear capability. that's what i meant by that.

>> that bumper sticker is going to be useful. >> it's john lubbocks at snl. he's morphed into an uncle that i feel sorry for. come on, tell andy the truth. >> we have to hope and pray that the national restaurant association does not void the confidentiality agreements and allow these alleged victims of herman cain's to speak or this will continue for another two or three weeks. >> this will become beyond a feeding frenzy. >> let's end the madness. >> david has the final point. >> i think that's part of the point here is there really is a strategy that's being devised on the fly. if you want to run for the presidency and bone up on foreign policy, you probably should start doing that before you actually get into the race. and instead he's actually, you know, he's finding areas that are blind spots. and it's not normally how it's done. you start preparing at a different time. they are actually -- in some ways using these sexual

harassment claims to craft a new strategy, to now -- i mean, they are bringing up the specter of clarence thomas, doing the interview with his wife. there's a super pac with an ad out. he's putting all of these pieces in place to keep providing another leg of the stool of his candidacy. doing a book tour in alabama when there's 20 states with primary votes before alabama. i mean, these are the issues. but, but -- i think it's important not to just dismiss all of this because there's a reason why there's at least a flirtation going on. why don't we ask what does that say about the republican race about what primary voters are being moved by in this election against barack obama. >> it's not what -- >> we're not dismissing it, but it's disappointing, right? >> it's not what they're being moved by, david, as much as what they're being moved away from. and that is they are moving away time and time again from mitt romney. let's go talk about gene's

column. >> oh, fine. >> gene, your column today basically said you don't believe mitt romney's a lock because of people like herman cain and michele bauchmann and woefully ill-equipped politicians going ahead of him. >> yeah. and, you know, rick perry sight unseen, before he uttered a word, he was leading the race and then he started showing up at debates and, you know, he kind of fell down in the polls. but anybody, there is a huge anybody but mitt -- not faction, probably majority in the republican party right now. and this is a problem. i know the republicans usually, eventually fall in line. they don't have to fall in love. i'm just wondering if this year fits the pattern. because the -- this sort of -- i don't know if you could call it an ttipathy antipathy, but it's close to

romney, or distrust of romney by many conservatives, doesn't seem to be going away. >> well, let's look at the latest gallup polls. new usa today gallup poll shows president obama neck and neck with his republican competition. the poll is based in a dozen battleground states including florida, new hampshire, pennsylvania, and virginia. in these states, mitt romney and president obama are in a statistical tie. the president is slightly ahead of texas governor rick perry and herman cain. as for the direction of our country, a 4 to 1 majority say they are not satisfied with the way things are going in the united states. 60% of swing state voters say their families were better off three years ago before obama's presidency. >> wow. >> the same poll shows a growing number of republicans are enthusiastic about the upcoming election. 59% say they are extremely or very enthusiastic as opposed to just 48% of democrats.

>> so david, if the question is asked by the republican nominee and the debate -- the final debate, are you better off today than you were four years ago, borrowing that line from ronald reagan, the answer right now clearly is no, we are not. and following up on a peggy noonan line, i suspect we'll be hearing republicans saying not only are things bad, not only did he inherit a bad economy, he made things worse. >> or as mitt romney has said, you know, that a good guy, but doesn't have a clue about how to fix the economy. that's going to be his strategy. i think that number about right track, wrong track is so important because we know that's a big barometer of how independent voters are going to go. the white house knows that too. they understand that in states like colorado, nevada, new hampshire, a lot of the rocky mountain west, they're going to have to reach those independent voters with some vision for the future while they're also tearing down republicans as being the ones who will take you

back to a worse place. who don't really have the right ideas about how to fix things. it'll have to be a much more negative campaign. you think about younger voters, think how positive the experience was in 2008 for a lot of obama voters. voting to make history, voting to go forward generationally, not back ward. here they're going to have to vote for obama because he's ripped the bark off the other guy. >> what would this scandal do to herman cain's poll numbers? and we have the first legitimate national poll that answers that, not much. washington post, abc news, romney, 24, cain, 23, perry, 13. so he's maybe a little bit down from his average over the last few weeks, but that's far from a collapse. he's still the co-front runner. >> give us the numbers. >> romney 24, cain 23, gingrich, 12. 55% of republicans say the

charges against him are "not serious," 70% say this is not a voting issue for them. >> gingrich has fouled up awfully a lot at the beginng, had people leaving, but he's kept his head down, been fairly effective in debates and he's creeping back up. >> and saying confidently every place he goes, this will be one-on-one me against mitt romney. >> i think he may be right. >> everyone has been sitting and waiting for the other shoe to drop on herman cain saying this isn't going to last. the bubble's going to burst. it's been months now. if he's withstanding this kind of scrutiny, going back to 9-9-9 plan, the foreign policy comments, and this kind of scandal, what will burst this bubble? >> i think the support he has may not go anywhere for a good, long time, until, maybe they get down to picking a president. one of the vulnerability in polls, people don't think he can win. they don't think he can be the nominee. they will hurt him, perhaps, at

the end when people actually vote. but it's hard to come up with something bigger what's already happened. >> actually, one thing. when the book tour ends and he goes home and stops selling books. >> that could hurt him. >> i think that could hurt the presidential campaign. >> gingrich seems to be picking people off one-by-one in the republican field. two months ago he was at 3% or 4%, now at 12%. so one-by-one, he's picking them off as he climbs the ladder. interesting. >> yeah. >> he needs a little bit more money, he needs to be on tv. >> david, who do you have on "meet the press" this sunday? >> well, we're talking to jon huntsman, also haley barbour and bill richardson. and maybe barnicle can tell me one important thing. do you think that steve garvy? do they have a shot at owning

the bears? >> no shot. steve, go get me a cup of coffee, that's about it for him. >> no, steve's going to be like nolan ryan. >> no. >> i could be with him there, i'll wear the wristband. the multi-colored wristband. >> you better get a couple more because it's not going to happen for steve. >> make magic johnson the face of the dodgers. >> that could happen. >> bon jovi? >> no, you're thinking arena football. >> people from southern california with a lot of money to bring that franchise where it ought to be. >> why do you hate steve garvey so much? >> i don't hate him. he's got no money. he's got no money. >> he knows people who have money. >> so do i, but i'm not going to be running the dodgers. coming up this hour -- thank you, david. former secretary of state madeline albright will be here onset. up next, we'll talk to gillian tett.

but first, bill karins with a check on the forecast. bill? >> good morning to you, mika. we're in store for a nice weekend. much of the country, nothing like last weekend's october snowstorm. let's take you into the travel trouble spot this morning. eastern north carolina, this rain will be exiting during the day today. it'll be long gone by the weekend. you're cold, you'll have a nice afternoon. even san diego with that chance of some showers today. as we watch that storm moving into the rockies on saturday. almost all of the eastern half of the country will be dry as we go throughout this upcoming weekend. sunday into the dakotas and into sunday night into wisconsin, we could have showers. really the west coast is kind of showery and cool. the east coast, not bad for this time of year at all. a dry stretch of weather for the eastern sea board and that will continue at least until the middle of next week. i guess we're due. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. ♪

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president obama just went to the g-20 summit to give europe advice on its debt crisis. wait, europe's getting economic advice from obama? that's like j-lo getting marriage advice from kim kardashi kardashian. >> there is that. 22 past the hour. joining us now, gillian tett. good day to have you. you have a piece in today's "financial times." subprime moment for risk-free sovereign debt. it is one thing for european regulators to make banks write off greek bonds. it is another to reshape the entire rules of modern finance. but the more contagion spreads across europe's sovereign debt market, the more pressures will rise for a longer term rethink of that zero-risk label. if regulatory systems that had

not encouraged banks to be some complacent in the past, markets might have done a better job of signaling that structural tensions were rising in the eurozone, and today's crunch would not be creating such a convulsive shock. it is as i said above warily reminiscent of the subprime tale, and sadly, that's no comfort at all. given that we have no comfort after reading what you wrote this morning. under what circumstances as we look at greece right now that could touch off a terrible situation? under what circumstances does greece stay in the eurozone? >> the markets are in a complete funk. this is the emperor has no clothes moment. people thought you could take subprime mortgages and create aaa securities. and people are realizing that so much of this is not sustainable. the fundamentals of the eurozone simply don't work.

and what's really important about the last 48 hours is that for the first time, eurozone leaders have started saying that maybe greece is going to have to exit. but if greece does exit, that is going to be absolutely cataclysmic. it's going to be like lehman brothers in terms of shock. >> that and the g-20 summit. what do you think will be the options they'll be looking at there? and what are the implications specifically on the economy? >> they're very unlikely to get past solutions. there are really only two options for europe right now. either they pull together and create a fiscal union, they're at a crossroads, or they kick greece out, and both of them will be difficult. and the americans are so worried. they are so frustrated. i was down in washington this week and the real problem is it's very unclear what the americans can do at this point. >> right. right. >> unlike lehman brothers, the situation with greece, there's one big difference.

at least to someone as pedestrian as i am about all this. and it is that this has been going on for a year. at least a year. so who is responsible for allowing a situation to go on for as long as it did with no solution over a course of a year? not a weekend, a year. >> this is absolutely crucial. and in fact, i've spoken to secretary albright about this earlier in the green room. the real problem now is an constituti institutional one. it's a very important moment historically. because not since the collapse of all those decades ago where we had that situation where no one's in charge. there's no one in the eurozone who is standing up to take responsibility. right now angela merkel doesn't look like she's able to because of her domestic political pressures. and the ecb's very reluctant to step in and be the final person who fires that bazooka if you like. and the americans can't really sort this problem out.

whereas they could sort out many of the other problems we've seen in asia before. so there really is a vacuum of leadership here. and that's one reason why it's gone on so long. why it's so dangerous. >> eugene robinson has a question. eugene? >> gillian, my question is, is there a chance that greece would withdraw from the euro and go back to the drachma? there's an argument that in the long run, that could be better for the average greek citizen. there are lots of arguments it wouldn't be. do you think that's a possibility? >> there is absolutely a possibility that happens right now. and you've got banks in london and new york doing all kinds of side drills trying to prepare for that. that really is a concern right now. >> and the implications of that, if that were to happen. let's go through the two options and what we'll be left with. >> well, i think it's still unlikely to happen because the implications would be so scary. but one of the things you have

to realize right now about what's going on, for the last couple of decades, people thought you could predict the future by plugging in a few numbers into the computer, and it was all about economics. right now, it's not about the economy, it's about politics and society and culture and really big social stresses. and just as everyone's been wrong-footed in the last 48 hours by the fact the greeks said we're not going to have a referendum, the politics right now, the political stressors and social stressors, not just in the eurozone are unbelievably unpredictable. >> i want to ask you about the political and social stresses. there's obviously been unrest in greece to say the least. >> absolutely. >> and across europe. how is the occupy wall street movement or whatever viewed from your perspective and from the perspective in europe? is it connected? >> it is completely connected. because what you have right now amongst the population is a shriek of pain. and there was a fundamental

question dubbing the western world right now, which is everyone knows we have too much debt. everyone knows we have to cut it back. the question is, how are we going to allocate the pain and ensure that societies hang together? that's what kind of links together all of this. so in the euro zone, who is going to take the stress? who is going to pay for greece's every indebtedness? and who is going to pay for the fact we have this crazy financial bubble here in america and somebody's going to have to take the pain. >> mark haleprin? >> i'm going to ask you about the greek government. and they've obviously performed horrendously over the whole year as mike said. are there people, senior finance people in that government who are serious who understand the stakes involved and can contribute to a solution? >> well, good news for washington, what the greeks have done in the last 48 hours makes congress look really rational. but no, there are people inside the greek government as you can completely understand what's at stake. the problem, though, you have a greek electorate that is increasingly frustrated. and all the opinion polls show

that the majority of the greeks do not want to exit the eurozone. but at the same time, they don't want to absorb the level of austerity that's been imposed on them. who would? and those are two completely incompatible aims. they want to stay inside the euro and have it easy, but they can't. and the question is, when reality bites, who are they going to blame? are they going to blame the germans, their own leaders, is it going to be rising nationalism inside greece, or will they pull together and find a solution? and we don't know. >> we're in an election season. i'm wondering if you can frame out for us the parallels between the financial crisis and europe and the financial crisis this country has been enduring for the past few years. and is either side of the pond learning from the others' mistakes? >> well, the issue really is about this emperor having no clothes. so for years, people overlook the risk. and now they've suddenly woken up and realized actually everything they've trust eed

before doesn't really work, and they've lost that compass. and that creates the volatile political climate. it feeds into this sort of incredibly turbulent time in the republican nominations right now where people are frantically grasping for any magic wand that will save them from these problems. no one single person can actually solve these problems right now. >> great for romney. >> yeah, it is. you're absolutely right, haleprin. >> so later today in europe, they're going to have to issue a statement of the conclusion of this summit. so how do they issue a statement with regard to this situation with the greek debt? and are they going to go back to the drachma and things like that. and can plunge the world into a

deep deeper -- >> i think everyone's going to be saying that's off the table, we're scrambling together to pull off a deal. and they will put together a statement. right now there's a lot riding as the new head of the european central bank. what a terrible first day in the office to arrive on. and people are asking, well, maybe he could come in and fire that bazooka and actually buy up a lot of the bonds across the eu eurozone. because the other thing to stress is it's not just greece right now. the really big gorilla in the woods right now, not even france, it's italy. italy is one of the biggest bomb rockets in the world. at the moment, the bond yields are trading at a level almost entirely unsustainable. and if italy starts, then that will be incredibly messy. >> gillian tett, thank you so much. >> so gloomy on a friday. >> you're such a bright light, it's unbelievable. don't want to go --

>> i'm wearing a bright color to cheer it up. >> no, it's the reality, though. and it's great to have your insight. another great piece in the "washington post." >> can i say one thing? i wanted to say happy birthday to my mom. mrs. louisa robinson. >> eugene, thank you. happy birthday to eugene's mom. >> absolutely. that's great. all right. standing by in the green room, former secretary of state madeline albright. keep it here on "morning joe," brewed by starbucks. [ male announcer ] nature valley sweet & salty nut bars... they're made from whole roasted nuts and dipped in creamy peanut butter, making your craving for a sweet & salty bar irresistible, by nature valley.

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36 past the hour. time now for a quick look at the news with just 19 days until a deficit deadline, members of the bipartisan congressional supercommittee appear to be at a stand still. while talks continue, sources say no additional meetings for the panel are currently scheduled. and revenues continue to be a sticking point as republicans oppose any tax increases. but all six republican members of congress, including house speaker john boehner have signed a tax pledge sponsored by americans for tax reform.

but boehner down played norquist's influence on the party. >> grover norquist was on the hill this morning, is he a positive influence on your conference? >> our focus here is on jobs. we're doing everything we can to get our economy moving and get people back to work. it's not often i'm asked about some random person in america and what i think. >> is he a random person, though? to your conference, is grover norquist a random person? >> our focus is on creating jobs, not talking about somebody's personality. >> all republicans sitting on the supercommittee have signed the norquist pledge. but boehner said his party could soften its stance if democrats agree to what he calls "real reform on the entitlement side." an ominous sign for the u.s. economy. according to new census data, 1 in 15 people are now considered to be the among poorest

americans. a record high for this group. about 20.5 million americans or 6.7% of the u.s. population make up the poorest of the poor. a number defined as those in the bottom half of people living below the poverty line. that's where we're at. as they debate this in washington. we'll talk more about this coming up. secretary of state madeline albright, former secretary of state joins us here on "morning joe." i have astigmatism.

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you should change that. >> no, no, it's dr. brzezinski. you've known mika since she was -- >> small, yes. >> knee high to a grasshopper. >> i was friends with her daughter. >> and her daughter taught you to do something. >> yes, she did. you want me to announce on television? about katie albright teaching me how to shave my legs? >> yeah. >> really? okay. >> so dr. brzezinski was your -- professor? >> he was my professor at columbia. and the best course i ever took in 1963, he was teaching about comparative communism, which nobody thought was a subject, that everything was monolithic. all the reading was in russian. anyway, he was a fantastic professor and then he was my boss. >> that's when -- you meet so many people who have been taught by him in columbia. >> my daughter karlie is doing an english project on him, just about his personality and life

and family. and she said what is your greatest regret? and he said, hmm, that americans didn't take advantage of the end of the cold war. >> that's interesting. >> yeah. >> karlie was a little confused. >> but it'll be a nice fifth grade project. anyway, we had a nice picture of henry kissinger talking to herman cain earlier. did you talk to herman? and if so? what did you say? >> how did that meeting go? >> well, he didn't call me. i'm the wrong gender. >> oh, okay. >> there you go. >> may have been safer for you. what would you tell herman cain if he came to you and said what's the greatest challenge facing america? other than my lack of experience in foreign policy? >> well, i think the greatest challenges are our economy and our deficit. i think it is a national security issue. as has been testified to by the former chairman of chiefs, and i

think that is the biggest problem. but in addition to that, it's the fact that we are linked and interdependent with everybody. i was listening to the previous segment with gillian. and clearly we're interdependent. so when our deficit is a real problem, so is everybody else's. and i've been traveling a lot -- surprise -- and basically a lot of people will say it's your fault. it's your fault what's gone on. so we have to deal with that. >> it's america's fault? >> well, that's what they say. i don't happen to believe it. but i do think that our deficit and the whole debt issue and the inability to deal with it is a national security issue. >> and we're not being any more responsible here than they are across in europe. but greece in particular, do you think greece -- are they going to do the right thing? are they going to bite the bullet, move forward with this austerity program? >> hard to say. a couple days ago, the "washington post" had an editorial with the best opening line i've seen in ages. since they sent a horse to troy,

there has never been a surprise like this by the greeks. which is really -- and i think the whole pulling out of the referendum and changing their minds. i know george papandreu very well, and i think he's a smart man and trying to do his best. >> did he just blink when he decided to put it up for a referendum? now it looks like his own party's abandoning him today. >> well, i think it was all part of an internal maneuver in order to try to get support out of a coalition government or get a unity government. and the real problem is the complete disconnect between the government and the people, which actually is going on in a lot of places. >> mark? >> we're headed into an election year. and i know you think of foreign policy largely as non-political. but there's going to be a debate about the president's record. beside his csignificant achievement on the war on terror, what would you list as

achievements with contrast with what republicans might put forth? >> well, i think the achievements have been very large. people haven't focused enough on the issues of nuclear proliferation. that was something that the president put out very early, the new start -- >> specifically with russia? >> well, russia -- >> what about beyond? >> well, i think, in fact, the international agenda. we're going to see something very interesting, the iaea is going to put out a report on iran in the next few days. the different relationship with the iaea, and generally talking about and moving beyond the new start. i also think that he has done a lot in terms of working with alliances. i happen to believe that it is essential -- if you look at the problems out there today, to work with partners. i think that barack obama's middle name is partnership. and he really does believe that. and i think he's shown that. i think libya is actually a very important victory for both him and nato. >> i was going to ask you,

madame secretary, about what that says about the future of american foreign policy. which is went into afghanistan and iraq, obviously with smaller coalitions and have remained there with a decade. it was called early on leading from behind when it lasted more than a couple of days and weeks and people said what are we doing in libya? do you think he was vindicated, first of all? and second of all, does that lay a template for the way we handle ourselves? >> i think he was vindicated. i did write a book, i'll write a new one. basically a memo to the president-elect at the time. and the issues that i laid out were issues such as how to deal with terrorism without making more terrorists. how to deal with nuclear proliferation, et cetera, and they were all issues that required cooperation with other countries, no matter how strongly the united states is. and i think nato acted very well. i think the president in the way that they coupled with it made a lot of sense. and i do think that alliances and ad hoc coalitions are going

to be the way to go. because we need help, and it's a force multiplier. >> i want to ask you about hillary clinton. but first i want to cite a comment from your 7-year-old granddaughter about women in power at the state department. apparently she said what's the big deal about grandma maddy being secretary of state? only girls are secretary of state. >> which is quite amazing. at her age it's true. that's incredible. >> when people thought girls couldn't do it. >> look at that. madeline albright. condoleezza rice, and hillary clinton for as long as she wants. >> yeah. you also recently said that while secretary of state, you had no problem with arab leaders in the middle east. but you did have to work with male chauvinist pigs in the u.s. who felt she didn't deserve the position. oh, gosh, i understand, though. how is hillary clinton doing?

>> i think she's doing great. i really do. she has -- every countyry's bee heard from. i think she's tackling them in a very organized and strong, solid way. >> her travels across the world, i would think are injecting her overall ability to perform politically, as well, don't you think? and is there a future for her beyond being secretary of state in politics? would you see one? would you want one? >> well, i actually for a long time obviously saw one. and she is a very good friend, and we did an awful lot of things together. and i think it's obviously up to her what she wants to do. because i think she really does understand issues across the board. she's terrific. >> and as senator, she immersed herself, and as secretary state, she immersed herself -- >> she always -- >> she's incredible. >> she works extraordinarily hard. >> completely focused. she works incredibly hard. >> no doubt about it. you were here last night for

what occasion? >> well, they -- i'm a member of the aspen board. and then they had a big dinner last night, and they gave me an award. which i was delighted to accept. but what i was really pleased about the money that came with it, i turned over back to the t more involved in it being a part of our discussion. i feel so strongly. >> fabulous. >> to use what they know and give them the honor and credit and what they have done for us. >> what award did they give you, greatest secretary of state of all-time? >> henry is the one that actually -- kissinger, was the one that introduced me. and it was so nice. >> really? >> he couldn't have been nicer. we're very good friends. and he told the story, and he said, when i firintroduced madeline, i said hey, madeline, welcome to the fraternity. and i said it's not a fraternity anymore. >> i love it. was that after his meeting with herman cain? >> that was after -- >> i just still can't get over

it. secretary albright, it is great to see you. >> love having you. >> wonderful to be with you. i watch you all every morning. i love the show. thank you so much for having me on. >> all right. still ahead, deepak chopra will be here and a great moment in game show history with alex trebek. we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ [ daniel ] my name is daniel northcutt. [ jennifer ] and i'm jennifer northcutt.

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you know, we always like to follow up our segments with internationally respective former secretaries of state with game show bloopers. it just flows. >> it's called balance. >> it's balance. >> right. >> so last night, you got your tournament of championses on "jeopardy" right? and it was a moment i think we'll be seeing in one of these game show blooper recaps hosted by bob eubanks. >> group sex. >> if andy yearns for brenda and brenca cares for charlene who pines for andy, the three of them have one of these. >> what is a threesome? >> no. roger. >> what is a love triangle? [ laughter ] >> kara obviously has had much more experience than i. >> by the way, not that outrageous an answer.

the category is group sex and three people. >> come on. >> it's like an snl sketch. >> seriously, that sounds like a question that was put together by a guy who sleeps naked. why as al forsaken us, trebek. >> i forgot about that joke. >> thank you. >> ran down the hall naked. >> no, he had his underwear on. >> there was an attack and a scuffle and then i put on my underwear. >> okay, stop! >> so i could run down the hall. >> just stop! . >> after the intruder -- >> it being a woman -- come on, man. willie, you know what, i've got to cleanse the palate, get it out of my mind. okay -- >> whatever is on your mind. >> well video. you have an incredible video. >> check this out.

santa cruz, california. >> it's like a giant video jukebox. >> watch this. whoa! those are two humpback whales. a surfer on a surfboard and two kayakers. >> don't say that in front of trebek. >> santa cruz, california. and up pop a couple of humpback whales close to the shoreline this year. they got a surprise of their lives. a whale of a story. >> what incredible video. that wraps up our newscast. have a good night, everybody. and finally tonight, a whale of a story from santa cruz, california. >> my goodness. >> we've got to end this. >> you're all wet. >> a new poll breaks down who is leading in the swing states. >> oh, that's exciting. great tv. >> swing states. plus, deepak chopra. keep it on "morning joe." [ indistinct talking on radio ]

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♪ good morning. it is friday. welcome back to "morning joe." 8:00 on the east coast as you take a live look at manhattan. back with us on-set, mike barnicle and mark halperin. >> so do we want to talk about herman cain anymore? >> no. >> seriously? >> no. >> that thing is over. >> yeah. >> what about rick perry? rick is denying he was drunk when he sounded drunk. do we want to talk about that?

>> no. and rick perry's people are saying they didn't do the herman cain thing. >> one thing about herman cain. there is no indication this has hurt him yet. but we're going to see some national polls soon. it will be interesting to see. >> it's stunning what doesn't hurt him. it's just stunning. >> he's not teflon man. he's superman. >> tonight wrapped in teflon, wrapped in candy coated shell. >> you can't stop him. >> let's look at some new polls in the swing states. >> i just want to say. >> hmmm. >> watch out for newt gingrich. i think at the end of the day, newt may be the next alternative. >> really? >> if he doesn't go out and say some really, really stupid things, which newt has had a 25-year history of being in position where he can actually get past a lot of the really stupid things he said in the past. and then move forward. and then he says something else stupid. if he doesn't blow himself up between now and iowa, his people know, he's got a shot at being the alternative. >> i believe tomorrow night, during the game, the rival thing

to watch is gingrich versus cain, lincoln douglas debate in texas. >> that will be very good for gingrich. >> during the commercials in the game, you can flip over. >> i don't think so. >> a new "usa today" gallup poll of 2012 swing states shows barack obama neck and neck with his republican competition. the poll is based on a dozen battle ground states including florida, new hampshire, pennsylvania and virginia. in these states, mitt romney and president obama are in a statistical tie. the president is slightly ahead of texas governor rick perry and herman cain. as for the direction of the country, a 4-1 majority say they are not satisfied with the way things are going in the united states. 60% of swing state voters say their families would be better off three years ago, before obama's presidency. the same poll shows that an overwhelming number of republicans are enthusiastic about the upcoming election. 59% say they are extremely or very enthusiastic as opposed to

just 48% of democrats. >> what do you see in those numbers? >> i'm just curious, actually, about the republicans who are enthusiastic. because i actually -- i mean, just from talking to your friends, it seems like there is frustration and divisions within the party as to, you know, who they should ultimately be supporting and who they really are. >> yeah, but one thing that is missed is the members of congress that we saw on capitol hill. >> yeah. >> they know what they're doing. >> they do. >> like, if they -- are we talking about -- we were talking about dave camp the other day, chairman of the ways and means, start. of i have a feeling dave camp's constituents are going to be very excited to vote for dave camp, instead of a democratic candidate. >> i see. >> i said this before. it can't be stated enough. we, in the national media, focus on these presidential candidates for obvious reasons, because they could be the next president of the united states. but there are 200, at least --

200 members of congress in the republican caucus that are more qualified and know more of what they're talking about on foreign policy and domestic policy, on tax policy, on debt policy than just about any of the presidentipresiden presidential candidates out there. we had paul ryan on yesterday. willie, agree or disagree. you know you could talk to paul about policy for five hours and never once would he have that -- you know, he would never have to once resort to one of herman cain's stupid, rhetorical tricks. >> well, do you know what one plus one is? >> excuse me. excuse me. >> i don't think there's any question. that's what paul ryan -- that's what they do all day. they look at the numbers and they look at policy. i don't think herman cain does that quite as much, although he did meet with henry kissinger yesterday, in one of the great staged photos of all-time. i think we'll show that later. but the enthusiasm question,

60% -- there's the photograph right there. they got together. they're just two guys wrapping about foreign policy, trying to figure out when china is going to get those nukes. >> well, that's why i went there. >> hey. >> i understand they are trying to develop -- >> henry kissinger. >> henry kissinger. i was just thinking, imagine if we could open up china and an american president could go visit. >> somebody sent me a bumper sticker -- >> what would that be like? >> what was the thing my dad said? >> mcdonald's in china. >> stumbling towards accuracy, a bumper sticker. >> your enthusiasm, 60% of republicans. you hear that when you go out. republicans are broadly enthusiastic. they think this president is extremely vulnerable, 9% unemployment that's not going to get much better. but they're not specifically enthusiastic about the candidates. in fact, they're frustrated. they have this opening, they feel like. they should win next year, and they still don't feel like they have a guy who will win. >> yeah. >> if i were barack obama, i would be thrilled with those numbers. >> exactly. >> given the condition -- >> can you imagine?

>> that the country is in economically, the level of people's frustrations, the fact that he is neck-in-neck, still, with the republican field is kind of amazing. >> yeah, the enthusiasm gap is the one concern that you bring up, mark. in these swing states, a lot of times, it is turnout that matters. it was turnout in 2000 that mattered in the swing states. it was turnout in 2004 that mattered in the swing states. if this is, let's say, a 51-49 or a 50-50 race, like it was in 2004, that enthusiasm gap makes all the difference in the world. >> well, it does. but on the other side, you've got the presidential campaign operation now, working really hard. somewhat quietly organizing in those states. they know where the battle grounds are, and they are very good at organizing face-to-face. and so that can maybe make the difference one, two, three points, potentially. and there's no republican in the race now, and no outside group that can match that organizational ability.

so that may offset, as mike said. the president is in a very good position in terms of polling right now. and given the climate in the country and the economy. and they continue to organize, continue to raise money. the president can fight back against that enthusiasm somewhat. >> so, mika, have the greeks decided to destroy the european economy? >> yeah, i think they're working toward that. of they're trying to work through it. >> what happened yesterday? >> the turmoil in greece continues. and the country is embattled prime minister faces a critical vote of confidence today. that vote comes a day after announcing he would abandon his bid for a bailout referendum in the wake of a sharp criticism from other european officials, as well as some members of his own party, who have said they will not support him. in an address to parliament yesterday, the prime minister, who faces growing pressure to resign, said, quote, i don't care about being re-elected. i am interested in saving the country. the prime minister added that he

is open to the creation of a transitional government, which would ensure greece gets its next round of bailout funds. he also signaled he would be open to new elections. recent polls show about 90% of greeks oppose the prime minister's policies. >> kind of hard to build a base, political base from that. >> i think he's going to have to resign. the fast-moving developments have overshadowed the latest g-20 summit in france, where president obama says finding a solution to the european debt crisis is the most important task. meeting with sarkozy, that will be fascinating. my daughter has french exchange students, and they had to make pictures of what the french girls think of americans. >> oh, no. >> oh-oh. >> so she brought home a picture of a big guy with a beer on his belly. that's what the french girls had drawn. a clown for the way we dress. somebody holding money and gobbling it up. >> i could draw a caricature -- >> someone eating a burger.

i'm just saying, that's what they think of us. >> hmmm. >> fascinating. fascinating dinner conversation. >> you want a -- >> exactly. >> you're describing what the french -- these french girls think of the country? >> of americans, yeah. >> or what they think of "morning joe"? because it fits "morning joe." to a t. >> i did ask her if i could bring it in, and she held it closely and walked away and said no way. >> well, you know what, i think we'll somehow get by without the french loving us. >> france is the most amazing country. >> we gave them jerry lewis and mickey rourke and they have never forgiven us. >> how old are these girls? >> 15. >> why don't you ask them, when they go back home -- >> barnicle! >> take their impressions of us, and walk through normandy. >> there you go. >> walk through the province of normandy, and see all of the american cemeteries. have them read the names of the dead, now dead these many years.

and reflect. >> i'll do that. i'll have them over for dinner tonight. >> you tell -- and also, get off my lawn! >> wilson. >> a picture of the american flag. that was nice. showing our pride. >> yeah. >> boy, that's great. so we're in a financial mess, though. there is no doubt about it. and the president is going out, still going out, pushing on this jobs plan. and it actually -- we have seen, it's working for him. either that's working for him or the republicans going -- running in the middle of the debate states and setting themselves on fire. >> confluence -- incredible confluence of events that may be very lucky for this president. turning now to the unemployment crisis here at home, in washington, democrats and republican debate survive rival job plan bring relief to america's working class and pull us out of our own economic crisis as the senate blocks a $67 bill from the president's jobs plan. the bill would have provided $50

billion in infrastructure improvements made to highways, railroads and airports with an additional $10 billion going towards investments and private construction projects. the measure would have been funded by a .7% surtax on individuals making more than $1 million a year. i don't see what the problem is with that. >> the president is doing this, talking jobs, jobs, jobs. the whole issue in washington right now is the deficit commission. will the deficit commission meet their mark, or will washington once again fail? we've got two sides of pennsylvania avenue, mike, on completely different tracks. >> and meanwhile, the country bumps along, people -- jobless people, you know, continue to look at what happens in washington with great frustration. you get harry reid. have we got the harry reid clip? it just -- he is just nonsensical. >> what did he say? >> mcconnell, the back and forth? >> yeah.

>> we have that. >> no wonder people -- >> you want to see that? >> yeah, let's watch it. >> all right. barnicle wants this. take a look. >> the democrats have deliberately designed this bill to fail. deliberately designed the bill to fail. so the truth is, democrats are more interested in building a campaign message than in rebuilding roads and bridges. >> their goal is to do everything they can to drag down this economy, to do anything they can to focus attention negatively on the president of the united states, in hopes that he can get my job, perhaps. and i would say to my friend, we can stay here all day. i will get the last word. >> certainly is the case that the majority leader can always have the last word. but i would say, with all due respect to my friend, he just made another campaign speech. >> well, that's nice. they're friends. >> i mean, these people are jokes. they are jokes. my friend. my friend. people have been unemployed for months on end, the unemployment rate -- the real unemployment rate in this country is probably upwards of 14 or 15%, people who

have given up looking for work. and they carry on like this each and every day, and they have done the same thing for two or three years. both sides of the aisle. both sides of the aisle. >> and as you know, the way that these deals get done, our grown-ups go behind the scenes, and they sit down and then they negotiate it out. now, don't tell me that what separates these two parties is that different. at the end of the day, let the left wing bloggers and the right wing bloggers say what they will at the end of the day. what separates these two parties is not that great. it's just not. there's not -- this isn't, you know -- this is not fdr versus taft. >> no. >> i mean, you know, it's -- they're in between the 40 yard lines. and grown-ups sitting back, you know, behind closed doors, figuring this out. could come up with a deal.

but everybody postures. everybody postures. >> but the one divide that does seem to be completely intractable is taxes. >> but that's not. >> that's why -- republicans say yes, we agree we should invest in infrastructure. both sides can agree on, but we won't pay for it with this .7% surtax. >> so the democrats know, if they want more revenue into the government, they know how to do it. work with the republicans to close loopholes. that brings more tax dollars into washington. and you can even -- if you're a democrat and are interested in getting the deal done, even say, and we'll even lower the top tax rate by 2 percentage points, let's say. which is sort of just wrapping a bow on top of this package. because you're going to be getting a -- you know, billions of dollars more in tax revenue. they could do that. it becomes intractable when the democrats come out and say, hey, this is what we're going to do. >> no, it becomes intractable

when the republicans sign a pledge that they will not do anything with taxes at all, and they have to stick to it, to the point where they can't negotiate. >> well, mika, you're a couple days behind, many signed a pledge who came out and said they were backing off on it. >> it put a wedge in the conversation. and i don't have any problem with tax on millionaires. does anyone here have a problem with that? >> no. >> any millionaires at the table who have a problem with that? >> i'm not worried about that, mika. what i want to do, and what a lot of democrats want and a lot of republicans want, and this is middle ground if people will stop talking in ideological sound bites. they want to figure out a way to bring more tax revenue to washington, d.c. and there is a way to do that without raising the top tax code. if your goal is to win a political ideological fight, then go ahead and fight about raising the top tax rate. if your goal is to get more tax dollars to washington so we can invest in education

infrastructure, rnd, bring down the debt in the long run, we can do that. we can strike a deal. we can. the question is, are people going to be more interested in scoring ideological points, or winning the future? >> i think -- i think that there are different goals, as well. >> so let me ask you, then, how do we get one of those sides to move off the position, whether it's no new taxes or we're not going to close the loopholes? how do we get those guys in a room and sort this out and get beyond politics and fix the problem? >> i would guess right now, you can find 350 votes in the house of representatives to close the loopholes with the right package. >> the adults on the super committee can do it. there are a lot of adults on there. >> they can do it. that will pass. that then opens up entitlements. >> they're pretty pessimistic. >> to slow down the rate of growth entitlements. i don't mean to be overly simplistic, though it is what i do for a living.

but i will tell you -- >> you choose to -- >> a couple of smart people on capitol hill could put together the outlines of a significant plan that could pass if the children would let the adults run the show. >> up next, a conversation about spirituality and science. we're going to bring back best-selling author deepak chopra and cal tech professor albert lebanon. and the economic crisis with greece. and don't miss willie's week in review. >> i can't wait. >> it's going to be so good. >> let's go to bill karins. not so awesome. >> not awesome at all. >> when he flexed his muscles yesterday, that was like wa-waaaa. >> you should have seen the ratings boost when i did that. best show ever. good morning, everyone. we have a lot of big events going on as we head towards the weekend, the new york city marathon, one of the best college football games all year going on in tuscaloosa. the weather forecast couldn't be better for both of those. you can plan your weekend out. today no problems in the

northeast. cool, chilly start. a little breezy out there, but at least it's dry and sunny. as we look towards the middle of the country, no problems whatsoever. actually, it's the west coast, l.a. and phoenix will have showers and storms today. tomorrow, look at all of the great weather. a little bit of snow and unsettled weather in the dakotas through colorado. but as we go into sunday, the east coast is fantastic. some showers north of minneapolis. and the west coast, not a lot of rain, not going to ruin your weekend plans. just hit and miss. and remember, we turn the clock back an hour when you go to bed saturday night. so come monday morning, the sun rise will be earlier and sunset earlier, too. we're brewed by starbucks. [ man ] i got this citi thank you card and started earning loads of points. you got a weather balloon with points? yes, i did. [ man ] points i could use for just about anything. ♪ keep on going in this direction. take this bridge over here. there it is. [ man ] so i used mine to get a whole new perspective.

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♪ welcome back to "morning joe," 22 past the hour. joining us now, spiritual leader and founder of the chopra foundation, deepak chopra. also physicist and cal tech professor leonard maladenow. i'm going to say it the american way. >> that's all right. >> they're back with more on their new provocative book, "war of the worlds: science versus spirituality." >> so you guys at the end of the book have to hate each other. >> just at each other's throats. >> actually, we're going to change the sub title next time. it's going to be called "science and spirituality." >> oh, it's not versus anymore? >> well, we kind of started out versus, and we realized that it doesn't have to be a fight, you know. that you can have science and you can have spirituality coinciding or coexisting. >> look at this. >> what? >> if they can come together. >> it doesn't have to be a war. >> the worlds are very

different, but we don't have to be at war. >> really? >> so they come together on this extensional -- actually, the key question of our existence, and congress can't pass a budget. >> science is an excellent map for understanding partial truth. and now he agrees. >> do you agree with that? >> well, science was never intended to explain everything in the universe. the meaning of life and where the laws of skacience came from. >> that's not science's job. >> that's not science's job. but religion and spirituality is also truth. there is meaning of your life and how you should live and treat other people. and then there is the meaning and the truth in the physical universe. >> so at the end of this journey for you, you believe now that science and spirituality can coexist. >> i think that they should coexist. and i thought even when we started writing the book that it was very unfortunate how -- at least in our society, how often they're at each other's throats. and that in particular as a scientist, we feel attacked

quite often by politicians who use issues in science to get votes and to appeal to certain constituency. >> but we get -- >> what did you learn? >> what i have learned -- >> he learned quantum theory. >> first of all, i have learned quantum theory from no better than leonard malardnow who co wrote with steven hawking. but more important, what respectable scientists do, and what some people who call themselves scientists, like richard dawkins do when they go very vociferously and adamantly and also angrily with their idea of the god dilution. leonard says at the end of the book, science cannot and does not conclude that god is a dilution. and for me, that's so refreshing. >> well, it's crossing the line from being an agnostic to being an atheist. and you're saying being an

atheist is offensive. >> no, i think being an atheist is all right, as long as you don't go for it with missionary zeal. you don't become a zelot about it. >> there was an evangelical fervor to a lot of atheists in the mid part of last decade. >> i think today it continues to exist. but deepak, is there a difference or can you tell us a difference if there is one between being spiritual and being religious? >> yes. spiritual experience is the basis of all religion. so when i look at the experience of jesus, he uses his metaphors, like the father of one, love your enemies as yourself, turn the other cheek, love is the most important thing, compassion is. that experience comes from the transcendent, going beyond space, time and getting in touch with the mystery of our existence. out of that evolved what we call play tonic values. truth, goodness, beauty,

harmony, evolution, humility and reveren reverence. einstein said it was humbling for him, and i must turn him into a state of reverence just to see the nationality made. so it's about humility, reverence, but it's also about this quest, you know, that is there a part of us that's not subject to space-time, that is immortal, that doesn't have a beginning or an ending? leonard says the universe is infinite. for me, that in itself, the fact that the universe is infinite and i happen to be existing in it, wow. you know, it's such a perpetual surprise. that's the spiritual experience. >> but i think that if there are people who are, you know, let's say overly zealous atheists, there are also people on the other side who are -- suffer from what i like to call the

anti science syndrome. i like that term, because the acronym describes what i think about those people. >> you're talking about those people -- you're talking about certain religious zealots who believe that the earth is 4,000 years old. >> or politicians who say -- >> or that the earth is not 4,000 years old, you don't believe in jesus. >> yeah, but it doesn't have to be that extreme. the global warming deniers, just like in the '60s, the people who denied the evidence against smoking and health. >> would you put the global -- and i believe in global warming. but i think that's quite a leap, to put in the same category, people who are skeptics, global warming skeptics in the same category as people who believe the earth is 4,000 years old. >> right. those are two different issues. but -- both issues are fairly settled in science. look, between -- i think there was a study that between 1993 and 2003, there were almost 1,000 papers and academic journals on global climate

change. and not one of them came out against, you know, saying that it wasn't true. the american geophysical union, the american meteorological union, the natural -- you know all this, right? >> right. >> what i'm saying is that science is a very -- >> and by the way, people who are confused right now, munching their cheetos. i'm not saying there is not global warming. i'm saying there is. but your comparison -- >> well, i think that -- >> as herman cain would say, apples, oranges. >> they're both fruit, aren't they? so there can be two things that are different but in the same category. and i put them in the same category, because the category is people who don't respect science. you know, there are thousands of scientists working long hours, dedicating their lives to investigating these issues, coming to this conclusion. and then there are other people who don't really know much about it, and just dismiss it, because it's either politically convenient or goes against their beliefs. but to me, it's just like, look, i was reading in the "new york times" today about rick perry taking all of these private jets everywhere to do his political

bidding, right? and when he gets on his jet and he's 30,000 feet above the earth, you know what, he is saying, i believe in science. because arrow dynamics is just a theory. and it's not even a theory we understand that well, based on nonlinear differential equations. >> you're upsetting me here, because every time we're on a plane, i think, this doesn't make any sense. this big object should not be flying -- >> but you go because you trust science -- but -- >> you know -- >> when it's not convenient. >> can we get back to spirituality, please? i mean, what i've learned now from leonard is that as we explore the scientific map, with every discovery, there's more of the unknown, and there's more of the unknowable in principle. and that in itself is humbling again. you know, that the universe started from nothing, and then when the big bang happened, it happened everywhere. everywhere. because before that, there was no time, there was no space. that's omni present. it started from nothing.

it spans 41 billion light years. >> right. >> now. omnipote omnipotent. universal laws spread out uniformly throughout all the galaxies. if anything, science expands the possibilities of god and divine origin. >> it also challenges you. and i wonder if you both could tell me, i'm curious about the process of putting this book together. at what point for each of you was there a moment when the other perhaps cracked everything or a concept of everything that you believe in and made you really think it over again. and come back to your conclusion again. whether it be something that you preach or something that you know. where did each of you challenge the other to the point where you were brought to the brink? >> for me, it was very good, because, you know, every time i made a statement about science that was inaccurate, even slightly so, leonard was able to correct me. and i was able to revisit my

thinking. but it did make me even more convinced that science -- if anything, and done in the right spirit, makes us more spiritual. >> oh. >> and, you know, it would be very easy to be dismissive of some of the things that deepak talks about. and investigating his ideas, i learned a lot about the history of his ideas, and of that way of thinking. and what's behind it. and i grew to respect the idea that we -- i mean, i always felt that i was a spiritual person. but, you know, as someone who goes through life really focusing on empirical data -- >> right. >> you know, i didn't think that much about the role of spirituality in life. and i think i grew to appreciate that more through writing this book. >> fascinating. >> good. >> the book is "war of the world views". thank you so much. >> peace breaks out. >> always nice. >> thank you, mike. up next, we're going to take

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♪ the new monthly jobs report just crossed and let's go to y nbc's melissa francis, and

unfortunately i have nothing stupid to say. so i guess just the news today. >> you'll think of something during the course of this exchange, i have absolutely no doubt. the jobs -- it's a feast of news over here. we're having a great time at cnbc this morning. so the jobs number just passed. 80,000 jobs was the addition, the expectation was 100,000 jobs. so that's pretty good, close to expectation. the unemployment rate fell to 9%. we're seeing futures move higher on this. so the official expectation was for 100,000 jobs, but we were talking to some economists off camera before they went out here saying they were looking for more like 80. so that's why we're not really seeing a negative response to this, even though it is a little bit shy of what expectations had been. for the private sector, it was an addition of 104,000 jobs, so there's that in there, as well. the big story of the morning, though, really is everything that's going on with jon corzine over at mf global. we have been, of course, following this story. he resigned this morning, confirming that he will not seek any sort of severance payment. he has also hired andrew le

levyander, a leading white collar defense attorney, saying he has voluntarily offered my resignation, the board of directors, this was a difficult decision, but one i believe is the best for the firm and for its stakeholders. >> and melissa, of course, there are reports also in the paper today, the "new york times," i believe, has a story talking about how he used his power in washington, and on wall street, to push back hard on regulations that would have prevented this type of reckless trading. >> he declined a reference package. >> that is going to be where all of the questions are. immediate issues, the cftc is counting all of the money that is in their clients' accounts and making sure that it's accounted for, and there's a lot of people that believe that there is going to be a shortfall. at the same time, nobody has seen jon corzine. you know, we have reporters out around the city who have been looking for him. people say they have seen him in the office, but he hasn't made a public appearance yet. and there's just a lot of

questions about how this happened, where is the money, what's the fallout? and you're right. you know, how did political connections help let something like this happen? and is there a domino effect? i mean, we saw the stock of jeffries, which was the lead underwriter on their ipo tanking this week, as well. so this is just an enormous story. and you don't want to forget about greece. there's that out there, too. >> unbelievable. melissa, let me ask this question. willie on weekends, i don't know if you knew this or not, very exciting. no, seriously. we've got a bright eyes cover band and we go down and got four or five bongo players. i play guitar and you play the part of conner. >> are you inviting me? >> yeah, we want you. we're going to go down to the middle of occupy wall street. >> really? >> and we're going to have this bright eyes cover concert. and going to charge, what, 15 -- $20 for it? >> $50. >> does mika go to this? >> i play the tambourine. >> really? >> i drive. >> and mike drives the van.

>> i haven't heard an invitation in there yet. are you building up to inviting me to join you? >> we would love you as a member of the 1% to be down there. and maybe you can pass some $100 bills out to bring people to the occupy wall street movement. we want to help the kids. we're all about helping the kids. >> i would love to join you. but you're the one that's in the 1%. i'm in the 99%. i read mika's book from cover to cover. i know. >> i actually -- my -- ifp is cracking up. it's cracking up. so melissa, we've got to go. >> okay, well, tell me when and where, because now you've sort of dared me and i will without question be there. >> it depends on when the acid is dropped, but it's going to be a ten-hour concert. >> it will peak four hours in. >> we'll look for jon corzine while we're at it. what do you think? >> we would love to have you there. >> okay. >> melissa francis, thank you. >> have a great weekend, guys. >> have a good weekend. coming up, a preview of -- a preview of what's being called the game of the century. keep it on "morning joe."

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and choose the right plan for you. learn more at 1-800-medicare or medicare.gov. i would just summarize our feelings in louisiana in a simple way. you all have a great team, maybe one of the best alabama teams ever. of but it really doesn't matter who lsu's opponent is, because as we say in louisiana, the honey badger takes what he wants. and we're looking forward to doing that on saturday night. >> this is the honey badger. watch it run in slow motion. it's pretty bad [ bleep ]. look, it runs all over the place. whoa, watch out says that bird. ooh, it's got a snake, it's chasing a jackal, oh, my gosh! oh, the honey badgers are just crazy! the honey badger has been referred to by the guinness book

of world records as the most fearless animal. honey badger don't care. honey badger don't give a [ bleep ]. it just takes what it wants. >> okay. he chases a python up into a tree and eats it. >> here's why we're showing you this. the honey badger is a player on lsu, this kid, the defensive back,ter ron matthew, who takes what he wants. and that comes from that viral youtube video about the honey badger showing that the honey badger takes what it wants, including a snake up in a tree. >> can you believe that? they've got the honey badger. >> all right. >> tomorrow night, number one, lsu, number two alabama. in tuscaloosa, bryant-denny stadium. tickets, $5,000 for a regular season college football game. never seen anything like it. 600 media requests. that's a record for the university of alabama. auburn-alabama game, they usually get 400, 450.

they're opening up new areas for the press. this is the super bowl of college football. >> and we showed the guy earlier that has basically my arm. >> trent. >> trent richardson. >> take your coat off. >> listen, i don't want to scare the kids, okay? they're still in central time zone. >> they will be scared. that picture that the kids sent home to my daughter. >> look at those arms, almost as big and burly as mine. but mine are naturally burly. but that guy right there, trent richards richardson, is running tomorrow night for the heisman trophy. if they win tomorrow night and he has another great running performance, he locks it down. luck might as well -- >> that's a heisman game. >> stay in physics class in stanford. >> does it concern you that everybody seems to be picking alabama? >> yeah. everybody. yeah. it concerns me. you know, we went around, everybody in alabama makes fun of les wilds, says he's dumb. and you know that dumb guy always recruits the best teams and beats us about every other

year. i mean, lsu is now the only team that rivals us. >> and they've got the honey badger. >> and they've got a honey badger. scary stuff. did you see the "atlantic" article yesterday? >> which one. >> why alabama is the greatest college football team in history? >> no. this year's team? >> no. >> alabama in general. and you know what they said the secret was? they did a bryant quote. our boys get the best mamas and daddies. >> love that. and is by the way, the other game not enough people talking about, down in the swamp. commodore. 4 and 4 commodore. >> oh! >> perhaps the music city bowl. >> we'll be right back. this is willie's week in review, and also a specialty rick perry rock show. >> what? >> what? >> what are you talking about? ♪ i grew up on a farm. >> bring it! everybody had their own time cap. rings ]

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call humana at 1-800-808-4003. [ stu ] yeah. it's electric. i don't think so. it's got a gas tank right here. electric tank, right over here. an electric tank? really, stu? is that what you pour the electricity in? it's actually both, guys. i can plug in and go 35 miles gas free, or i can fill up and go a whole lot farther. is that my burger? oh. i just got bun. i didn't even bite any burger.

all right. it's time for the top three stories of the week. we begin with governor james richard perry of texas. >> if they print anymore money over there in washington, the goal gold is going to be good. >> at number three, perry unplugged and unhinged. >> i grew up on a farm. i grew up -- i grew up on a farm. >> texas governor rick perry late last week delivered a down

right giddy speech in the state of new hampshire. >> it's like live free or die, victory or death, bring it. >> the governor was passionate. >> today has been awesome, girl! >> others guessed he was something else. >> based-case scenario, that dude is hammered. [ laughter ] worst-case scenario, that is perry sober, and every time we have seen him previously he has been hammered. >> governor perry said he was just drunk on a big 'ole handle of new hampshire freedom. >> i felt good, felt great. i think the message got across very well. so it was a good speech. >> at number two, slumdog comes to life. ♪ >> 27-year-old sushil kumar is not a perfect match for the character in "slumdog millionaire." but the shop clerk earning 120 bucks a month had all of india watching when he won $1 million

this week on "who wants to be a millionaire." after getting his big check, kumar naturally raced to the nearest train platform to perform a fully choreographed celebration dance. ♪ and the number-one story of the week. >> a fairy tale wedding ends in divorce. >> the margin lasted just 72 days. >> she was sick of his partying and mooching. >> kim kardashian's divorce moved markets this week. >> brutal day on wall street, the dow dropping nearly 300 points. >> but it was a 12-year-old sexual harassment allegation that moved the race for president. >> i have no idea who is egging this on. who is on this witch hunt. >> herman cain's front-running campaign spent the week responding in many different ways as head of the national restaurant association. >> i am unaware of any sort of

settlement. >> when i first heard the word "settlement," i thought legal settlement. >> i was trying to remember some of those facts in the middle of a very busy day. >> i was standing near her, and i did say, you're the same height as my wife. >> mr. cain tried to deflect attention from all of the harassment the talk by singing. ♪ my jesus came to love me so >> by yelling. >> excuse me. excuse me! >> and by alerting americans to china's 47-year-old nuclear ambitions. >> they have indicated that they're trying to develop nuclear capability. >> a tough week for the candidate. but the polls, and at least one other candidate stood behind herman cain. >> i love herman. is he the best? >> i love herman. is he the best? you're about the same height as my wife. coming up next, what, if anything, did we learn today, and a very special rick perry rock show.

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welcome back. what did you learn today? >> i learned that we have a special presentation about rick perry. >> yes, yes. >> okay. off of that, i learned that rick perry, herman cain, between them, the republicans could try the cabaret tax in a debate.

>> i don't know what that means. what did you learn? >> i can't wait until the game is over. you and madeline -- >> cover charge for the comedy. madeline is going to the game. thank you so much for being with us this week. lewis burgdorf. >> he got drunk and was playing with the computer. >> he got drunk, and i think lewis got drunk and he used pain killers. >> oh! wow. >> it was a very bad combination. >> at least he didn't go give a speech. >> i mixed this instead. enjoy. ♪ i grew up on a farm i grew up on a farm ♪ ♪ bring it ♪ everybody had their own time cap ♪ ♪ why not ♪ tom cat tom cat ♪ ♪ and i'm for saying it loud and saying it proudly ♪ ♪ i grew up on a farm i grew up on a farm ♪ ♪ bring it ♪ i grew