strokes. we can generalize based on the parties and we can look at press releases and public comments by individual members, but that's not enough. we're owed more. we deserve to know what each member of the house and senate is prepared to do about the debt, not just what sound bites they offer. there's a reason we call you legislators. please, start voting so we voters are informed when we go to the polls next november. thank you chris matthews for this privilege. happy thanksgiving everyone. "the ed show" starts right now. good evening americans and welcome to the ed show. tonight live from minneapolis, newt gingrich served up his immigration plan on a silver platter. but tonight mitt romney looks like the real turkey. this is "the ed show." let's get to work. >> i'm prepared to take the heat for saying let's be humane in enforcing the law by finding a way to create league ality so they are not separate friday their families. >> newt gingrich is turning heads with his immigration policy, and the other republican candidates are on the attack. virginia congressman jim moran is here with reaction. >> i'm mitt romney, and yes, wolf, that's also my first name.

>> mitt romney doesn't know his own name. he's giving ron paul dirty looks in and his fir tv ad is a big fat lie. msnbc contributor e.j. dionne is here with the latest on mitt's very bad week. tomorrow is thanksgiving. i'll give you some shopping tips and advice on how to deal with your crazy conservative relatives. and watching fox news makes you dumber. pat robertson is confused about mac and cheese. and meagan kelly says pepper spray is a food product. daily show creator liz win stead will have it all on her plate. good to have you with us tonight folks. thanks for watching. if we found out one thing about the republican party last night, they've got a real problem with immigration. immigration seems to be the soft underbelly of the republican party and the top two candidates for the republican nomination are dealing with the consequences. today it's mop-up time for mitt and newt. for a hard core conservative, newt gingrich showed up at the debate last night with an off-the-wall answer on

immigration. >> you need something like a world war ii selective service board that frankly reviews the people who are here. if you've come here recently and have no ties to the country, you ought to go home. if you've been here 25 years, two kids, three grandkids, obeying the law, pay taxes, you belong to the local church, we won't separate you and kick you out. >> newt gingrich just affected amnesty. this isn't going to fly with the hard right wing conservatives in this country. michele bachmann's campaign sent out e-mails saying newt gingrich supports amnesty. saying gingrich's answer might be just plane dumb. mitt romney took a much different approach. he went far to the trite of everyone on the stage with his answer about immigration. >> amnesty is a magnet. when we have had in the past program that is have said people who come here legally will get to stay here illegally the rest of their life, that will only encourage more people to come here illegally. >> are you saying giving amnesty

or allowing some of these illegal immigrants to stay is a magnet that would entice others to come to this country illegally. >> there's no question. but to say to the people that have come here illegally that you'll all get to stay or some large number will get to stay and become personal meant residents of the united states, that will only encourage more people to do the same thing. >> there is no question romney saw this as an opportunity to score support with the right wing. in the spin room after the debate his spokesman had a hard time explaining romney's position to a reporter from the conservative "washington examiner." >> i think he made it very clear that he supported amnesty. >> so what, does then romney believe in deporting every person who entered the country illegally. >> he doesn't believe in creating amnesty. >> what do you do with them if they're here? >> first you have to turn off the magnets, to get them to stop coming.

>> but they're already here. >> he would not grant them amnesty? >> what would he do? >> he would not grant them amnesty. >> that's not an answer. what would he do? >> he would not grant them amnesty. >> what would he do? >> if you cut off their employment, if they can't get work, if you don't give benefits like in-state tuition, they will leave. enough of them will leave that it won't be as big as a problem as it is now. >> [ inaudible ]. >> i just answered your question. you keep heckling me about it. >> you can understand why this could be a problem for romney. he didn't want to answer the question "what would he do?" >> back in 2007 romney had a totally different position on immigration. >> my own view is consistent with what you saw is that those people that have come here illegally, the 12 million or so that are here illegally should be able to sign up for personal meant residency or citizen ship but they shouldn't be given a special pathway, a special guarantee that all of them get

to stay here. >> romney is all over the place on immigration. he's even got his own staff confused. last night mitt romney was right on the stage in front of some very powerful washington conservatives. he knew he had to take a hard right stance on immigration. republicans, what are they? they are beholding to corporate interests when it comes to immigration in this debate in this country. if we start talking about amnesty as far as conservatives are concerned, we need to talk about low wage workers joining unions and signing up to collective bargaining so they can go have a better life. corporations don't want to hear anything about expanding their payrolls or collective bargaining. hard right wingers don't want to hear about compassion. mitt romney made a play for the corporations and the hard right wing last night. newt gingrich made a play for human decency. in the end, both of them may lose. get your cell phones out. i want to know what you think. tonight's question, can

republicans ever develop a humane immigration policy? text a for yes, brks for no to 6226 39d. our blog is there for you at ed.msnbc.com. results coming up later in the show. joining me is congressman jim moran of virginia. good to have you with us tonight. appreciate your time. first of all, happy thanksgiving, thanks for being on the ed show. i'm thankful you're here when we ask you to be here. you know newt gingrich. was he speaking from the heart last night, or was this just a political ploy to get the latino vote? what do you think? >> normally it would be a political ploy, but no rational person thinks we could or should deport 12 million people, particularly if they raise their kids and grandkids here. many have volunteered for the military and so on. romney's position is a nonstarter. it's just fascinating how the level to which he'll prostitute himself in order to pander to the tea party republicans. newt is a fascinating case. i wouldn't want him, ed, ever

teaching history to my kids, but he has made history. when you think back, he's the one that got rid of speaker jim wright back in the '80s, largely because wright was upset about the reagan administration's funding, the right wing death squads in central america. he got rid of them largely for the same reasons that he was fined $300,000 when newt became speaker. then, of course, he's the one that ushered in this republican resistance to any kind of tax increases because he engineered pappa bush's defeat in '92 because he had a mixed package of revenue enhancements and spending cuts. then he's the one that created the toxic environment that the country is still suffering from in the congress when he brought in the new gingrich republicans and the contract on america in '95. so there's -- newt has a fascinating history, and i think you need to see what he says, consider it in context. >> last night he made a very interesting play to moderate republicans if there are any out

there anymore. he made a very interesting play to the latino community i think and i think the republicans have a hard time with that voting bloc out there. here he is saying we can't round people up and throw them out. the bottom line is, the corporations don't want amnesty in any way, shape or form. would you agree with that? >> i think that's the case with many of them. but neither do they want these workers deported. the agricultural industry desperately needs migrant farm workers. construction industry needs them, the hospitality industry needs them. so the idea that you would deport them is counter to what most businesses want, certainly small businesses. but they certainly don't want them to be able to be organized and have the right to speak out by joining organized labor or even having the rights of citizenship. right now they're powerless to speak back. that's what they want. >> that's what they do. >> that's the issue. that's right. >> you give amnesty.

or if you get a pathway to citizenship, these low-wage workers, especially in the service industry are going to go right into unions, that's exactly what the conservatives are concerned about, that's what the corporations are concerned about. this was newt gingrich's response after michele bachmann pressed the amnesty issue last night. >> i don't see how the party that says it's the party of the family is going to adopt an immigration policy which destroys families that have been here for a quarter century. i'm prepared to take the heat in saying let's be humane in enforcing the law without giving them citizenship but finding a way to create legality so they're not separated from their families. >> congressman, what did you think of that answer? he basically took a shot at the republican party and saying you folks are wrong on this and i'm willing to take the heat on that. what do you think? >> i agree with what he said then. this morning his spokesperson said what he's talking about are

community review boards where the neighbors of illegal immigrants would decide whether or not they get deported. i'm not sure how much credit he should get for being hugh mane and rational in that response. >> congressman jim moran from virginia, thank you for joining us. let's turn to democratic strategist steve murphy and msnbc analyst michael dyson, author of "can you hear me now?" i think that's what newt was saying last night. it was very different from what everybody else was saying who was on the stage last night. steve, you're not convinced. i read what you put on one of the blogs. you're not convinced this was a gaff on gingrich's part. explain that. >> two reasons. first of all, i think what newt -- newt is very shrewd in terms of dealing with the media. he's risen to the top in the polls. he knows all his personal life now is going to become a big issue, freddie mac, $30,000 a month for half hour meetings. the media is pouncing on that, vetting him as a potential nominee.

here he comes out in the next debate and gives them this to nibble on instead of his real vulnerability which is his -- he's a washington insider and a horribly partisan divisive figure when he's been in government in the last 15 years. >> michael, have republicans completely lost out at any attempt at winning the latino voters? what do you think? >> for the most part that's absolutely right. the reality is even if he's right for the wrong reasons, we have to at least acknowledge that newt gingrich moved the debate in the right direction. we can talk about a pathway to citizenship. maybe we can talk about some kind of amnesty that is an agent ma to the larger republican fold. it is true that he took and will continue to take heat for that position even if he has political calculations out there to secure the interest and support of the latino community. for the most part the republicans are tone deaf and blind to the need to create families. they talk family values all the time. i think newt gingrich said this rather bravely. you speak about family values all the time and yet you destroy them. we need to take advantage of what newt gingrich has done. if it's a gaff, let's turn it into a gift and move forward. >> steve, you can't deny -- go ahead frngs steve. >> i was going to say, a couple of other points about this. issue, freddie mac, $30,000 a month for half hour meetings. the media is pouncing on that, vetting him as a potential nominee. here he comes out in the next debate and gives them this to nibble on instead of his real vulnerability which is his -- he's a washington insider and a horribly partisan divisive figure when he's been in

government in the last 15 years. >> michael, have republicans completely lost out at any attempt at winning the latino voters? what do you think? >> for the most part that's absolutely right. the reality is even if he's right for the wrong reasons, we have to at least acknowledge that newt gingrich moved the debate in the right direction. we can talk about a pathway to citizenship. maybe we can talk about some kind of amnesty that is an agent ma to the larger republican fold. it is true that he took and will continue to take heat for that position even if he has political calculations out there to secure the interest and support of the latino community. for the most part the republicans are tone deaf and blind to the need to create families. they talk family values all the time. i think newt gingrich said this rather bravely. you speak about family values all the time and yet you destroy them. we need to take advantage of what newt gingrich has done. if it's a gaff, let's turn it into a gift and move forward.

>> steve, you can't deny -- go ahead frngs steve. >> i was going to say, a couple of other points about this. first of all, newt didn't really say that these folks would be given amnesty. they're not going to get a path to citizenship under his plan. look, he said community review boardsment but what he's talking about is turning all the illegal immigrants in the country who have a job, who have been here for a while into a guest worker program like what you're talking about. they couldn't be citizens. it would be very hard for them to join labor unions. he knows what he's talking about there. secondly, even a plurality of republicans are opposed to mass deportation of illegal immigrants. that's not the tea party position. in places like iowa where the participation level is low, this is going to be a real problem for him. but he gets to places like new hampshire and big statewide primaries and i don't think this is going to destroy him because

he hasn't said they can become citizens. >> well, what about romney? what about romney? can he keep surviving but changing these positions? we played two sound bites earlier in this segment that were totally different than what his position was on immigration. he saw an opening last night and took a hard right wing position. what about that? >> he's like -- in one sense, mitt romney is looking at the paraphernalia of seduction here by which i mean whatever audience he's in, he's going to play to them. if he's with this hard right wing audience, american enterprise institute and the like, he's going to sound tough. if he tacks to the moderate side because he's in a different room, he's going to go there. he's trying to engage in political camouflage, hiding himself behind whatever position that appeals before the audience that's immediately before him. >> gentlemen, one more thing before you go. i want to get your reaction to this clip from pat robertson's show. >> what's the one thing you have

to have at thanksgiving. >> mac and cheese. >> sister, that's my dish. that's the only thing i can rock. >> good interview. what is this mac and cheese? is that a black thing? >> it is a black thing, pat. you guys -- the world needs to get on board with macaroni and cheese. christmas and thanksgiving we have to have macaroni and cheese. it trips me out that you don't. >> i really don't. i don't and i have never. >> is that the generational divide right there? michael, what's your reaction to that? holy smokes. >> not only do black people like macaroni and cheese, we like freedom and justice and progress and equality. add that to your thag as well and we can stuff that in the turkey. >> great to have you guys with us tonight. happy thanksgiving. we'll see you down the road. remember to answer tonight's question at the bottom of the screen and share your thoughts on twitter. coming up, mitt romney is refusing to pull his fraudulent campaign commercial and we will see a whole new side of the

former governor. i saw a whole new side of the governor last night. i want to share it with you. later a heated exchange on the hill between a congressman and university professor. we're right back. coming up, mitt romney's arrogance was on full display last night. meanwhile his campaign defended his attack ad on barack obama. e.j. dionne of "the washington post" is next. jesse la grek ka has tips on avoiding a conservative food fight with relatives. liz win stead is here. we'll find out which republican candidate she's most thankful for. i'll have a commentary on black friday. stay tuned. @ápápáp:@:02 "

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coming up, mitt romney's arrogance was on full display last night. meanwhile his campaign defended his attack ad on barack obama. e.j. dionne of "the washington post" is next. jesse la grek ka has tips on avoiding a conservative food fight with relatives. liz win stead is here. we'll find out which republican

candidate she's most thankful for. i'll have a commentary on black friday. stay tuned.

willard mitt romney started the national security debate with a bang. willard doesn't seem to know his own name. >> i'm mitt romney, and yes, wolf, that's also my first name. >> rom any's lie wasn't the only low light for the vul cher capital lift and world class job killer. willard was caught on tape acting like a spoiled brat when congressman ron paul answered a

question about defense spending. take a look at this. romney could on the hide his destain. his stares and facial distortions show a lot about his character. willard was born with a silver spoon in his mouth and a chip on his shoulder. romney treated ron paul like a stranger who walked on stage for the first time. before tuesday's debate, romney and congressman paul have shared the stage 25 times over the last four years. you think he's heard just about every answer? willard romney has an elitist attitude, he's treated the debate process like a coronation instead of a competition. willard romney has no respect for his opponents. the stare he puts on governor perry is interesting as well. his reprehensible campaign commercial doctoring president obama's words has been labeled a lie and proven a lie. today the romney campaign is refusing to pull the commercial. romney's communication director said we were very up front. we included that portion intentionally. let's bring in nbc contributor e.j. dionne

columnist for "the washington post." great to have you with us tonight. i'm watching this debate last night. they know each other. they've been on the stage together a lot. the facial expressions of mitt romney towards someone who is serving the country, i just think is the pressure getting to him? but it was just flat-out disrespectful. are we seeing a side of mitt romney -- we've seen him in the debate as well saying let me finish, let me finish. he gets a little testy when he doesn't get his way. what do you make of this man's mannerisms and demeanor when he gets under fire in a debate. >> first of all, happy thanksgiving, ed. i think you can ask in fairness to romney the following question, does he respect these opponents? answer, probably not. question, have any of these opponents earned a whole lot of respect. i'm not sure the answer to that is yes. but i do think you did see something there, and especially you saw it in that exchange you referred to with rick perry where he just wouldn't let go of

the fact that rick perry interrupted him and he wanted rick perry to live by this particular set of rules. there's a kind of rigidity there which i think is part of him. i think the premise of your piece is correct because the danger to romney is precisely that he will look like this wealthy, privileged guy who looks down his nose at other people, and he cannot allow that to stand. i suspect his team is going to make him watch that videotape to tell him you can't do that anymore. i would go so far as to that it's a lack of discipline. someone very wealthy, always seems to get his way and can be disrespectful and get away with it. i think it's a real snapshot of what kind of president he would be. i can't imagine hillary clinton or barack obama having that kind of an exchange or any of the democratic nominees that were up on stage in 2008. do you think that mitt romney feels entitled? >> well, i don't know. you know, he has lost a couple of races, and i guess one of the

things i like best about him is the devotion he has to his dad, george romney, who is actually a very progressive republican. i think all that part of his is true. i was really struck by a very good piece about a month and a half ago in "new york magazine" by benjamin wallace wells. he had a really interesting way of describing romney. he talked about him as a perfectly objective efficiency machine. now, that is not -- maybe you want that as the consultant to your company. but that's not a great description of the kind of politician you want to have. bill clinton was not a perfectly objective efficiency machine, and that's kind of what makes him a good politician because he's human, because he's warm, because he's out there. >> well, there was nothing efficient about his first campaign ad because it's been viewed by many and also labeled and proven to be a lie. should we expect more lies from the romney campaign? is this the way it's going to be? they are defending the ad that

was -- that i'm talking about. and they are owning up to the fact that president obama said it, even though it was taken big time out of context. is this the way it's going to be for romney? >> i thought that was honestly one of the most outrageous ads i've seen in a long time and i've seen a lot of bad adds. here was president obama saying what john mccain was saying and criticizing him for it. they have those words coming out of obama's mouth as if it were obama's. it's like putting rick perry's words into your mouth. i think it's crazy. i think this year we'll see a lot of this kind of advertising, not only from the candidates, but also these big money groups that have been freed up by citizens united. i hope the mainstream media is ready to call a lie a lie when it's a lie. >> after viewing this debate last night and watching mitt romney, i have to say that, you know, he just appears to be a game show host. and if i was in the crowd and he told me to come on down because

i won, i just don't think i'd believe him. e.j. dionne, great to have you with us tonight. happy thanksgiving. always a pleasure. millions of americans will storm the shopping malls this weekend. next i'm going to tell you where to find the best deal in america, the absolute best deal in america. and jesse la grek ka is here to show you how to deal with your low information relative voters that watch fox. stay with us. no psycho talk tonight, just holiday straight talk. i've wanted to do this for a long time on the air, this is the perfect time. the day after thanksgiving is black friday. we as americans go out every year to start the holiday shopping season right after thanksgiving. around our thanksgiving table tomorrow, i will remind our family just how lucky we are to have our health and a job. there are millions of americans who are out of work, millions of americans out there without health insurance. as a family, we are very fortunate to be able to give.

so what can we do as americans this holiday season to make things a little bit better in a tough economy? i think as a country we should all focus on buying american. instead of buying some cheap product from china that's sitting on somebody's big department store shelf that will help them build their empire, save a small business in our country this year and buy american this holiday season. may i ask you to do that? let me tell you about a very important phone call i made. when i got my medicare card, i realized i needed an aarp... medicare supplement insurance card, too. medicare is one of the great things about turning 65, but it doesn't cover everything. in fact, it only pays up to 80% of your part b expenses. if you're already on or eligible for medicare, call now to find out how an aarp... medicare supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company, helps cover some of the medical expenses... not paid by medicare part b. that can save you from paying up to thousands of dollars... out of your own pocket.

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no psycho ta .lk tonight, just holiday straight talk. i've wanted to do this for a long time on the air, this is the perfect time. the day after thanksgiving is black friday. we as americans go out every year to start the holiday shopping season right after thanksgiving. around our thanksgiving table tomorrow, i will remind our family just how lucky we are to have our health and a job.

there are millions of americans who are out of work, millions of americans out there without health insurance. as a family, we are very fortunate to be able to give. so what can we do as americans this holiday season to make things a little bit better in a tough economy? i think as a country we should all focus on buying american. instead of buying some cheap product from china that's sitting on somebody's big department store shelf that will help them build their empire, save a small business in our country this year and buy american this holiday season. may i ask you to do that? buy something made in this country. buy american. americans, you and i, we will spend $10 billion this this holiday season. if we just make the effort, we can save a job. we can help a company stay in business and do something for our neighbor. that's what we do so well in this country, at least we used to. most small companies in america are two paychecks away from closing their doors. it's that tight. if we focus as americans on our

economy, we can make a real difference. unfortunately our politicians, hell, they can't even agree on this. buy american is strong and it means something. it means everything to that small manufacturer, that small business person. americans, can we agree tonight that we are consumers and we have the power? the best gift that we can give to our country this holiday season is to byproducts that have been made in america. my dad used to tell me that tough people last, tough times don't because we're americans. we can certainly see this country getting through these tough economic times. it's about loyalty. are you a loyal employee? are you a loyal american? do you abide by the laws and the rules? do you love your family, your country, your community? make the effort this holiday season to buy american. it affects jobs. $10 billion is going to be spent in our economy in this holiday season, and i think if we can just get a fraction of americans to say, you know what?

i'm buying american this holiday season. i'm going to help save an american job, i think it will make a big difference. we found a republican from alaska who makes sarah palin sound like a moderate. his story and doug brinkley will be here to talk about his tus sell on capitol hill. fox news makes you dumber. no kidding. there's a university study out there that proves it. liz win stead will take the republican candidates to school later in the show. stay with us. there's two things republicans really like. that's tax cuts and oil fields, wherever they are. it doesn't matter. they like oil. the drill baby drill folks were out in full force at a recent house committee hearing about

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when long-time alaska congressman don young arrived. he once told "rolling stone" magazine, environmentalists are a bunch of waffle stomping harvard graduating intellectual idiots. they aren't americans and never been americans and never will be americans. he showed his contempt for environmentalists at a hearing on friday. he skipped the testimony of award winning historian and expert on alaskan universe dr. doug brinkley from rice university. when he did show up he made it clear he had no intention of learning from brinkley's expertise. the congressman didn't even get the professor's name right. listen to this. >> i will tell you, if you ever want to see an exercise in futility, it's this hearing. that side has already made up its mind. this side has already made up its mind, and the -- i call it garbage, dr. rice. >> it's dr. brinkley. rice is a june vaersity. you went to yuba college and couldn't graduate. >> you just be quiet. >> why? >> you be quiet. >> you don't own me. i pay your salary. joining me is dr. doug

brinkley, presidential historian, author and professor at rice university. dr. brinkley, great to have you with us tonight. i think that's an exchange that a lot of americans appreciate. here is an arrogant congressman who wants to run over the environment. all you wanted to do is go there and give the expertise about what drilling would do at anwar. i think i've got this right. you tell us more. did you know what you were getting into with the congressman? >> everybody knows he's a bit of a crackpot. so i kind of expected that. he never shows up to congress. he's got one of the worst ratings -- if you look up bridge to know where, and you'll find his name. when he does show up, he says it's garbage and beat up on people. so i struck back. i was there to talk about the arctic in a celebratory way. dwight eisenhower created the refuge in 1960, our nation's premier wildlife refuge. i was there to talk about u.s. fish and wildlife and places like the grand tetons and grand

canyon and redwood country of california and the alaska arctic. he's a bad faith operator. what i want the american people to know is we can be proud we have this national park system and our wildlife refuge system. just because we're having a little tough time now, we don't want to molest these places. i've been getting, i'm not kidding you, thousands of letters including from republicans, conservatives aghast at the way congressman young treated me. 's par for the course. i've found out he's done this literally to dozens of people who have shown up on capitol hill. >> why do you think members of congress like don young are so opposed to listening to experts as yourself when it comes to drilling for oil in anwar or restoring anything that we have preserved as a nation? >> well, theodore roosevelt, one of my heroes and dwight eisenhower, both republicans, i might add. they talked about people like young as being land skinners, despoilers, slob hunters. the hunting community in the

united states is fantastiction, they're conservationists. i grew up in ohio, my mother and father went to college at clarion state, hunting and fishing country. real people that want to take care of america. what young wants to do is line his pockets. it's a flak for the oil industry. he's failed. he's been in congress since the '70s. anwar is one of our crown jewel national sites. young i think is on his way out. the letters i'm getting from people in alaska are sick of him. even people that want to drill in alaska care about the alaska wilderness. at one point he was saying don't camp. camping is elitist. i've gotten letters from the boy scouts of america, church groups that are angry at young, telling young people that camping is america. i think it's cracking. in some ways it's sad because he's a man only barely there in reality. he seems to be operating on a very -- on a platform that's about to collapse on him at any minute. >> the congressman from alaska continued to attack you at the

hearing. here is more. >> i made a mistake when i said mr. rice, because i heard rice university and that can get in my mind. like i say, when we're here, we're the ones that ask the questions. you answer the questions. you may not work in the private sector. >> i do work in the -- >> i'm not asking you a question yet. when you think about it a moment, you made a comment about me is why i'm really pissed right now. you, in fact, said i wasn't here. i was over in the floor voting. >> i know you were. >> then don't mention my name. >> why do you think he was so upset? what's wrong with this guy? >> honestly, ed, he's not right in the head. what can i tell you. beyond that, he just never shows up. there i was giving testimony. he wasn't there. and then at the last minute when the cameras started he kind of snuck in, and you can watch him sit there and started calling it garbage, and mr. rice. it's a very bad faith operator. it doesn't do anybody any good to have somebody like that in congress. i hope the people in alaska --

incidentally i go to alaska all the time. this summer i'll be leading a cruise group up there. what an incredible place. you go to the aleutian or mt. mckinney, glacier bay. i encourage people to go to alaska. most people up there are warm hearted and great conservationists. young is just an odd duck. >> i tell you, dr. brinkley, i totally agree with you. i have fished lake clark up there and also the al lag in that case river, some of the most fantastic salmon fishing on the face of the earth. i feel privileged having an opportunity to go up there. when you see the pristine wilderness of alaska and you hear a congressman like that go off the rails, it's just amazing to me. thanks for sticking to your guns. i appreciate it so much, dr. doug brinkley with us here on "the ed show." next fox news viewers are dumber than most. no kidding. chances are you'll have to deal with one of them at your thanksgiving gathering. we've got a plan. jesse lagreca joins me next on

how to communicate with conservatives over turkey. that's next. up next, jesse lagreca shares tips for surviving thanksgiving dinner with your crazy relatives. lizz winstead carves up the republican field just in time for thanksgiving. stay with us. > here is the scene at every thanksgiving. there's uncle rich running his mouth about the liberals. let's turn to activist and freelance journalist jesse lagreca. here is a right wing lie you might hear at the dinner table tomorrow, occupy wall street protesters are dirty and they need jobs. here is newt. >> all of the occupy movement starts with the premise that we all owe them everything. like you used to? when you fear losing your independence?

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> here is the scene at every thanksgiving. there's uncle rich running his mouth about the liberals. let's turn to activist and freelance journalist jesse lagreca. here is a right wing lie you might hear at the dinner table tomorrow, occupy wall street protesters are dirty and they need jobs. here is newt. >> all of the occupy movement starts with the premise that we all owe them everything. they take over a public park they didn't pay for to go nearby to use bathrooms they didn't pay for to beg for food from places

that they don't want to pay for. we need to reassert something as simple as saying something to them go get a job right after you take a bath. >> how do you handle that at a dinner table. >> thanksgiving is about sitting down with our families and enjoying the food we enjoy, the values we share. i work on the idea of kill them with kindness. the idea is the larger issues that are more important to americans are what we should be discussing. if somebody is going to start off by telling you to take a bath and get a job, just dismiss that. it's nonsense. what we should be talking about is the fact that the average american has seen their standard of living decrease over the last ten years, 30 years. progress.org this year reported the cost of putting a thanksgiving dinner together has gone up 13%. i think the overall game plan should be to skip the petty talking points and go to the larger issues that all of us can agree on. >> all right. here is another right wing classic lie. president obama apologizes for

america. here is romney. >> president obama apologizes for america. it is time for us to be strong as a nation. and if we are strong with a military and economy that are so strong, no one in the world will try to attempt to threaten us or to attack our friends. >> i mean, wait a minute now. we've got obama supporters sitting at the table for thanksgiving. we can't take that, can we? how do we handle it? >> i imagine the unit nation ss like a big thanksgiving dinner. after the republicans have been there, they've embarrassed the country for eight straight years. we have explaining to do. we're apologiing for the it in wits that ran this country into the ground. they start thad war, it was a dumb idea to begin with. we don't want to continue that path so we're going to change direction. i think our thanksgiving dinner tables are all a part of the same conversation. we're not apologizing for america. we're apologizing for embarrassing republican presidents. >> if you have any diehard fox

news family viewers there, you're certainly going to hear about the $16 muffins. here it is. >> at a training conference in august '09 $4,200 was spent in muffins, that adds up to $16 per muffin. they've sure they. >> reporter: presented in a pleasing way. the $16 muffin becomes a symbol of how wasteful the feds are. >> jesse, that's a flat out lie. we can't let that go at the dinner table, can we? >> no. it's meant to distract from the larger issues. these guys are sought of touch with reality, the most important thing they'd like to talk about is mouf fins. let's talk about the lower standard of living a lot of americans are expected to put up with especially under the paul ryan budget that would end medicare as we know it. i think most people want this honest conversation, whether at the thanksgiving table or here at "the ed show" or anywhere else in america, we want to talk about our future in an honest way. >> finally, here is rick perry on how the stimulus doesn't

create jobs. >> the fact is government doesn't create jobs. otherwise the last 2 1/2 years of stimulus would have worked. >> now, this is a big point here because the congressional budget has come out and said the stimulus package has created 3.3 million jobs. we can't let that go over turkey, can we? >> i think if rick perry has elected president, he's going to -- i think rick perry's own state has been the beneficiary of that stimulus, basically the only thing that kept -- he is the last person who should have anything to say about that. >> we should point out that he's taken federal money to guard the border. jesse lagreca, great to have you with us. have a great thanksgiving. >> rick santorum says africa is a country, rick perry can't do math. lizz winstead clears the table next for thanksgiving on "the ed show." tonight i asked you can republicans ever develop a humane immigration policy? 4% said yes, 96% said no. are fox news viewers less informed than others?

tonight i asked you can republicans ever develop a humane immigration policy? 4% said yes, 96% said no. are fox news viewers less informed than others? stay tuned, we're right back. m

welcome back to "the ed show." i'm thank for for lizz winstead because she makes me laugh a lot. she's a real talent and a friend. co-creator of "the daily show," she's author of a new book "lizz free or die" available for pre order on amazon and elsewhere. she's stepped away from preparing her own turkey to join us on "the ed show." i want to play this pat robertson sound bite when he's talking about a thanksgiving side dish. here it is. >> what's the one thing at thanksgiving you just have to have? >> mac and cheese. >> sister, that is my dish. that is the one thing i can rock. >> but only once, once a year. >> good interview, christie. congratulations. >> thank you, pat. >> what is this mac and cheese, is that a black thing? >> it is a black thing, pat. you guys, other people -- the

world needs to get on board with macaroni and cheese. seriously -- christmas and thanksgiving we have to have macaroni and cheese, and it trips me out that you don't. >> i really don't. i don't and i have never. >> lizz, got to correct the record. is mac and cheese a black thing? >> first of all, she's bummed out that she's tripping pat robertson out about macaroni and cheese. i don't think it's a black thing. first of all, i think it might be an italian thing first because it's pasta and sauce, and i guess it's considered soul food, and then it's also considered something a lot of people have. i normally do have macaroni and cheese at thanksgiving. i'm not this year because my butt is the size of a house, so i've decided to back off. but, no, it's so weird, why was -- he was so interested, is that a black thing? it's like -- i don't think pat robertson knows what one black thing is honestly, except for

that woman on the show. >> i don't think he does either. yesterday we reported about a study that came out of fairleigh dickinson university that proved that people that watch fox news are less informed than nonnews viewers. in other words, watching fox makes -- watching fox makes you dumber. now, what do you make of that study? >> if i hear you correctly, you're telling me that watching fox news makes you dumber than if you lived in a cave and watched nothing. is that correct? >> that's right. >> i think that sounds like a fine study. i think that's probably exactly right. >> for those who don't watch fox news, they're smarter than the ones who do. >> well, yeah. i believe that to be true. i've often pondered why fox news is popular. and as you know, ed, my dear mother was a big fan of the fox news, and she was 89 and half deaf and watched fox news which meant she got half of half of the truth.

i was trying to figure out why fox news is so appealing. it could possibly be just because it's the loudest network. it's just loudest and the graphics are the biggest. it's like, i can read that, i can hear that, this will be my truth, regardless if it is the truth or not. >> you're a big supporter of the occupy wall street movement. >> i am. >> give me your reaction to meagan kelly and bill o'reilly on the pepper spray thing earlier this week. here it is. >> first of all, pepper spray, that just burns your eyes, right. >> it's like a derivative of actual pepper. it's a food product essentially. a lot of experts are saying is that the real deal or has it been diluted. >> they should have more of a reaction than that. >> are you serving any of that food product at your dinner. >> i bathe in it. those wooster's sis at occupy can't take concentrated pepper spray in their face.