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tv   MSNBC Documentary  MSNBC  January 7, 2012 9:00pm-10:00pm EST

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give me courteous and respect and not an animal. >> he wants to be freed from 16 years of solitary confinement. boy hood friends struggle to father their kids from behind prison walls. but one cut off from visits with
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his son is on a razor's edge. >> i hurt a lot. i seek revenge from that. >> hail all thee holy gods. >> a convicted murderer seeks legitimacy for a religion prison officials suspect a front for white supremacist gangs and we turn our cameras over of them. >> whabash, locked up, is in th state. >> i hate wabash, you know what i mean? >> they make sure you're in prison every day. >> who wants to be locked in
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with another man for 18 hours a day and then three of the half hours that we come out is to go get the worst food you've ever ate in your life. i don't even know how they call it food. >> every day, things people take for granted, we would cherish right now. >> wabash valley correctional facility, a maximum security prison on the western edge of indiana, the centerpiece of the rural town of carlisle. the inmate population for nearly 2200 out numbers local residents 4-1. many of indiana's most violent anders a e offenders are sent here. >> the approximate breakdown, murder, voluntary manslaughters, battery, assault, is approximately 35% to 40% of our ander population. >> the most violent of these offenders are housed in prison cells 24 hours a day in the
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confinement. few, however, are more noer to vous than learn naerd mcquay who spent 16 years here. >> he still escort from behind the back. recreation is solitary by himself. he doesn't do rec with other people. his activities are dissolved just by himself. >> everybody in dl knows his history. >> the most infamous chapter of mcquay's history occurred while serving time in indiana state prison 17 years earlier. that's when he stabbed a corrections officer to die. >> we approached him from the front according to reports. stabbed him one time in the front chest area, which actually broke a rib. he stabbed him with such force if sound of it targeted another staff member that was over to respond. when he responded he actually observed the second stab to the back, according to the reports. before the officer actually
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died, they said that he told them that he didn't know if he was going to make it or not and mcquay was the one that actually stabbed him. >> at the time, mcquay was serving 20 years for sexual battery. he was sentenced to an additional 60 years after being found guilty of murdering the officer. despite the eyewitness accounts, mcquay still proclaims his innocence. >> it's been a long ride, but, hey, to a lot that i maintain my balance and my mental health. mcquay will soon reach a milestone. his time-out in confinement is about to surpass the years he spent free in the outside world. >> you know how sometimes you can be in an environment like this and a person begins to see you as a mad dog. every chance you get you are
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going to lose control or snap on somebody. that's not me. >> periodically mcquay files requests to be moved back to general population where he would have considerably more privileges. >> i still believe that leonard mcquay has an ulterior motive. >> the first person he needs to win over is case manager beverly. >> we are notarizing what? >> we all get along with leonard. he is very, very likable and very charismatic. just so friendly but he's so overly friendly. it's so fake. it's not for real. >> since coming to wabash, mcquay has been involved in several incidents that enforced his violent reputation. >> he was on the rec pad and he asked for a basketball, and when they went to hand the basketball he actually come through the
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door and pushed his way through and began assaulting a couple of the staff members and several staff responded, along with myself, and there was about six of us finally to restrain him and get him down on the ground and get him in cuffs. >> sometimes emotionalism can push you over the edge. sometimes you can regret after becoming so emotional the things that you do, especially when you know that one action can result in a lifetime of misery. >> but mcquay says he has had a spiritual awakening since converting to islam. >> it's a reflection of a new person and a new man, a changed man. >> mcquay is not the only inmate at wabash valley who has gone through a spiritual transformation since coming to prison. >> [ indiscernible ]. >> marcus murray is a self proclaimed priest of a little
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known germanic pagan religion. >> [ speaking foreign language ]. >> it is the pre-christian religion of northern europeans. >> hear me now your son of [ indiscernible ]. >> it is popular among predominantly white inmates in prisons nationwide. he says he discovered it shortly after coming to wabash 11 years earlier. he is serving a 60-year sentence for beating another man to death and says that the religion has helped him come to grips with the murder. his pendant and prison tattoos are symbols of his faith. >> they are all norse oriented,
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as you can tell. viking age is a large portion of the religion. study viking age history. >> but prison officials have begun to see it as something else, a front for white supremacist gangs. wabash has banned gatherings. >> the white supremacists are using it to have the gang meetings in the services itself and it has been quite disrupt everybody at other facilities. >> murray denies ties to white supremacist gangs and wants to appeal the ban on the asatru group meetings. >> it is not a gang or promote gang mentality or any criminal elements at all. it's a religion based on virtue and knowledge. >> the ban also hasn't stopped murray from recruiting new members. his latest, william jones, jr. >> marcus has been teaching me
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about what the hammer means and what the different gods and goddesses are. >> jones, who also denies being a white supremacist, came to wabash three years ago at age 18. he was sentenced to six years for burglary. >> i was hanging out with the wrong people and strung out on drugs and broke into a house and took a tv and a bunch of other little items like tattoo gun and took them and sold them for drugs. >> the house he robbed was his father's. >> when he called the police he said, i strongly believe it was my son junior. it killed him to do it. >> jones would like to rebuild a relationship with his father and will soon have a chance. he leaves prison on parole in one week. >> you're not enjoying the weather, are you? >> no. >> why would you enjoy the
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weather, man? you can enjoy all that when you go home next week. >> next thursday. >> he wants to be influenced. because he's still being molded as a man. you know, he's still a kid and he's turning into somebody. >> delivering papers? >> no, that is just temporary until i can find a real job. >> okay. i'm glad you have aspirations. >> what the hell does that mean? coming up -- >> i have a $100 bill tattooed on my penis. >> two cell mates are at a crossroads. >> and later -- >> i'm asking you to open your heart. >> leonard mcquay tries to rehab his image. >> i treat him with respect but i do not trust him. [ male announcer ] juice drink too watery?
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i recognize i got a family
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out there that really needs me, been spending a lot of time away from me. can't say i've always been the best for them. matter of fact, their lives probably would have been a lot better without me in it. >> the wabash valley correctional facility is isolated among miles of corn and soybean fields in southwestern indiana. some of the state's most violent inmates are housed here, and they've been known to hurt each other. james stone has been in prison for the past 25 years for attempted murder, and he's had more than a few scrapes in that time. while some inmates have been known to create knives out of toothbrushes or anything else, several years ago when stone was at another prison, he devised another more unique weapon. >> the cheese graters was
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leather work gloves that i had that i took pads off welding gloves, the inside welding gloves, i took the pads off of them. had varnish, dipped them in varnish. put pads on top of the varnish and dripped back down in the varnish and went to the drill press where the curly qs are. i dipped down in a bunch of them so it looked like a metal bush on my gloves. let them dry for a minute and then i ran them through the top layer of the varnish in the can to keep them from breaking off and let them dry on your hands while your hands stay balled up. once they dry, they last forever. every time you hit someone it's like taking cheese through a cheese grater. it's not pretty. it's like making slaw. >> among this population of
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seasoned inmates like stone are two celliecellies. once boyhood friends on the outside, they rely on each other for survival on the inside. >> we met at different places when hung out when we was what? >> 13 or 14 at the latest. maybe 12. >> robbie mcanalley is serving six years for armed robbery and is no stranger to prison. >> i will be 23 in a couple days. and with patrol violations, all together i came to prison for a long time. i don't want that. i really don't have nobody out there. i wish i had some place to go. i wish i could get on my feet and get a job and live life productively. i don't want to keep coming here. this ain't for me. my bro is going the help me stay out, though. >> you hear me? you already know.
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>> unlike his boyhood friend who has been in and out of prison five times, this is bradley napier's first time behind the walls, but as a juvenile he was twice placed on house arrest. now he is serving 16 years for burglary and criminal gang activity. >> when i heard my sentence, i was crying. at 18 getting 16 years, you know, it seemed like forever. it seemed like, oh, man, i ain't never getting out, you know? but we got a good relationship. we talk to each other crazy. smack each other around when nobody's looking. >> it don't matter. it's always all good right afterwards. >> even though they are from the same hometown, their lives in prison would make it seem like they are from different sides of the tracks. >> his tv is just a little older model and my tv is one of the flat screens they just started
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selling. it's expensive but a bigger picture. you know what i mean? everything in here is ours. you know what i mean? it's not -- whatever's mine is his and whatever's his is mine. that's the way we live. you know what i mean? >> thanks to support from his family napier also has more money to spend on commissary. so once a week he loads up for both himself and mcanalley. he eats half of everything. he needs to carry half of everything. robbie! robbie! damn -- [ bleep ]. >> why would you just grab that? >> all the commissary goes in one box. we both eat out of it. he doesn't have a lot of the things going for him that i have so it's hard for him to stay on the right path. >> one thing that he does have
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is an abundance tattoos. >> i got these praying hands for my dad. that's my mom's name in the heart, honor thy mother, on. >> narrator: thy father, that's my mom's name in the heart and my south side down just my neighborhood where i'm from. over here is moneybags, naked girls. everybody likes naked girls and money. that is all clowns up there. >> don't you got a $100 bill? >> i do have a $100 bill tattoo. >> where is that at? >> that's crazy, bro. i got a $100 bill tattooed on my penis. >> what do you tell the girls about that, man? >> it's money to blow. >> the imagery on his body only tells part of his story. he keeps pictures tucked away in his photo alum to tell the rest. >> how often do you look that? >> every day.
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>> he hasn't seen his son, three-year-old robbie iii in more than two years. he has had a contentious relationship with his son's mother. >> since i came back to prison, me and her got into it, and i came back to prison and i ain't seen him at all. it has been 26 months ago. >> napier is also the father of a young boy, 2-year-old bradley, jr. >> this is what he sent me for my birthday. another thing he sent to me, put colored on, put stickers all over it. it's my world. it's my whole life. >> like other aspects of their friendship, their relationships to their sons are marked by a have and have-not quality. unlike mcanalley, napier enjoys regular visits with his children. >> i wouldn't be able to go through what he's going through, not see anything son and stuff. i don't know. >> there's reason behind a couple of weeks. there ain't no reason behind 26 months. >> that's just how it is. we're in two different places. >> while mcanalley is longing
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for a visit from his son, murray has been playing fat 24er father figure and teaching asatru and believes to another prisoner. murray says he hopes that the religion will help keep him from returning to prison. >> when you are hanging at the house and you have bills to pay or something like that and somebody comes over and offer the opportunity for you to you know make a bit of easy cash, you know, go rob something, things go bad and things break bad. people get involved and people that weren't supposed to be there come out with shotguns and you get killed. you end up being another justin. another heartbreak i have to deal with. >> not going to die. >> i've been through this before. i've had friends of mine that i taken under my wing, youngsters that get out before i do. and they get out there and mess up. in fact, i lost a friend about six years ago, justin, he got
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shot by a police officer in indianapolis. i feel like i failed him. 12k3w 12k3w 12k3w4r. >> i promise you, i will send you a card every month that you're out there. but if you come back i will send a blanket party your way. >> i'm not coming back. >> all right. thank you. coming up, leonard mcquay gets a job and a chance to prove himself. >> now, that was to the dislike of some of my supervisors. they thought i lost my mind. >> and later, marcus murray lashes out when an asatru member says the wrong thing. tha to pick up some accessories. a new belt. some nylons. and what girl wouldn't need new shoes? we talked about getting a diamond. but with all the thank you points i've been earning... ♪ ...i flew us to the rock i really had in mind. ♪
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[ speaking foreign language ]. >> every day islamic prayers can be heard drifting from the cell of leonard mcquay at the wabash valley correctional facility in indiana. >> five times a day, it's mandatory for muslims all over
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the world, five times a day. >> mcquay is serving 60 years for the murder of a corrections officer at another indiana state prison 16 years earlier. since then he's been in administrative segregation at wabash's segregation unit. >> read the quran every day. >> while mcquay says his koran has helped him grow spiritually, the other books in his cell have helped him grow physically. >> this is what i call my weight bag where i every day i do me some curls, right? i do these. i do shrugs. what they call shrugs. do these. do back arms like this. like this. this is probably about -- probably about 55 or 60 pounds. >> mcquay has spent years trying to earn his way back to general population.
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hu business history as a violent offender continues to haunt him. >> i basically engaged in what i considered an emotional response to being disrespected. >> i was warned when i came into this job regarding offender leonard mcquay. leonard is very smart, very, very clever. he can talk a great talk. >> though caseworker beverly gilmore has raised serious questions about mcquay's trustworthiness, her goal is to give segregation inmates an opportunity to prove themselves. she recently made a controversial decision. after mcquay successfully completed a prison life skills program, she gave him a job in his housing unit. >> i did make him a sanitation worker. that was to the dislike of some of my supervisors. they thought that i had lost my
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mind. i would never, they say, let him out of his cell. i said, let's give him a chance. i talked to leonard i say one time and you passing a scrap of paper to an offender, you will be without your job, and we are watching him more closely -- at least this ms. gilmore is. i have something to prove. i think he can do it. >> change is gauged by behavior. if you are actually changing, your behavior must change, and i believe my behavior has changed. >> mcquay hopes that a positive job performance will help win him his transfer and his fate will be determined at his next review less than a week away. >> i'm still somebody who deserves respect and to be treated like a human being. fits given to me, i'll give it. treat me like a human being and give me the respect and courtesy of a human being, not an animal, and you will receive the same.
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hello. gop candidates raised around new hampshire today ahead of tuesday's primary. they're also getting ready for back to back debates this weekend including tomorrow morning on "meet the press." congresswoman gabby gifford returned to the tucson shooting scene for the first time after she was shot in the head last year. survivors and residents are prepare for tomorrow's one-year anniversary. six people were killed that day. now back to "lock up." due to mature subject matter, viewer discretion is advised. isolated in rural
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southwestern indiana, the wabash valley correctional facility is more than a hundred miles from a major urban center, but it has plenty of reminders of urban problems behind the walls. >> wabash valley has 43 different gangs and approximately 400 different gang members. that doesn't reflect all of the suspected members. those are all confirmed members, and we have approximately somewhere between 200 to 300 suspected gang members at this facility. >> most of the gangs are divided along racial lines. but the majority of gang members here belong to white supremacist gangs like the aryan brotherhood and the saxon knights. prison officials believe that a growing religious might be a front for asatru, a white supremacist gangs. marcus murray one of the leaders at wabash denies that. >> there has never been anything
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in my studies that says one race is more dominant over another, one culture more dominant over, nor a religion. believers believe that our religion is fine and yours is fine. >> guy ratliff who has been practicing asatru for several years here says there is pun group is not welcome. >> if we found out that someone was a child molester, he would be banned from the community. he cannot participate. it's a bylaw. >> ratliff who uses another accepted pronunciation of the group's name also defended the fact that some members have swastikas tattoos on their bodies. >> the swastika was around long before adolf hitler came along. okay. i don't have nothing against uncle adolf, but he took
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something from my religion which was a sun wheel and made it part of his party. it goes back to ancient civilizations. they had a swastika in persia way before national socialism came along. >> while rat cliff defended asatru, his comments disturbed murray who let him know how much when he returned to his cell. >> you made us look like a bunch of [ bleep ], [ bleep ]. >> i tried to talk about this with you. i swore i did. sorry, marcus, i [ bleep ] up, man. i'm sorry. i apologize, damn it. try not to get mad at me. >> it's hard not to, man. you just sank my boat. >> later, we told murray we recorded his exchange with ratliff and asked him to explain it.
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>> i was a little mad at him. he didn't mean any harm. he just -- just ignorant of the conduction of leadership roles you know, i think now that he has seen, you know, that it upset me and knows that it's not really how we do business, i think he's changed his point of view. >> murray hopes to also change the point of view of prison officials. he will soon have a hearing with administrators to appeal their ban on group worship services of asatru members and have it removed from the list of security threat groups. robby mcanalley faces a different challenge. he not only feels isolated from his young son but from his boyhood friend who just happens to be his cell mate. >> my celly is a great [ bleep ] dude and i have known him for years, even before we came to prison. but, i mean, i got my problems that i ain't seen my
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son in two years and [ bleep ] he gets to trip and act like he knows how i feel and stressing hard when he don't see his son for a week. he gets visits every week. it's everything that's possible to get in here, he's got it and i'm in here [ bleep ] up. >> mcanalley, serving six years for armed robbery, wears his frustration in prison ink. >> that says vengeance. it's because i've had a lot of wrong done to me. i've been hurt a lot. i seek revenge for that. i had a lot of animosity built up when i got it. i'm hoping i can let things go now, for my sake and my son's sake. ain't worth it to come back to prison over. >> he points to another tattoo as the source of his frustration. >> the mother of my child. i'm kind of mad at her that she is holding my son from me. >> but that could be changing. >> a recent letter and her submission of a visitation
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request are indications that she's planning to bring his son to see him. >> this is not the first time she said she would come and visit and that she's going to let me be in his life and then doesn't. the last time i seen him he couldn't walk or talk or nothing. i can't wait to see him. >> reporter: while mcanalley clings to the hope that he will see his son, his cell mate is enjoying a visit with his 2-year-old son, brad jr., and his son's mother. >> say touchdown. >> touchdown. >> bradley talks about his dad all the time. when we pulls up and he sees the guard tower and says daddy's house. daddy's house. he sees a guard tower and razor wires and he thinks that his dad's house. but in another sense that is his dad's house and he is excited to see him. >> this type of one-on-one between an inmate and child is
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rare in most maximum security prisons where visits take place in a large common area choked with noise and distractions. but his session is in a private playroom. but this is part of the prison's fatherhood program. >> the fatherhood program is great, man, because i get to spend a lot more time with my son. i get to come in this visiting room. in this visiting room, everything is great. it's one-on-one. me and him running around and playing ball. >> the monthly visits are carefully monitored by the program's coordinator, joshua collins. >> they have a responsibility is what we are trying to teach them. even though they are in prison that's not a cop-out not a be a dad. >> oh, my gosh. >> you're okay, buddy. get up. >> come on. let me kiss it. tell daddy to kiss it. say kiss it so it will make it better. >> you be all right. >> you're in beast mode.
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daddy's beast mode? >>. >> you're all right. >> glad to see you, mr. napier. go ahead and have a seat. >> following each visit, bradley undergoes another review. >> let's talk about when he cries. >> i just tell him to get up. he is raised by a whole bunch of women. they get babied and i don't want my son to grow up getting babied all the time. i want him to have a little bit of toughness about him because the world's tough. you know what i mean? just get up and go on. >> i understand where you're coming from. i want to give you a suggestion. it's okay for him to cry. it's okay for you to say that he's okay and then address the situation and move on. it kind of seemed that some of your patterns came from just a quick fix and let's get him on to something else.
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it's okay to acknowledge that he's crying and find out why he is crying and move on from that. do you understand? >> i fully understand. >> appreciate you coming in. >> thank you. >> i like to hear insight on what people think of how i am as a father. i will give thought about it. but i know how to be a father. i've done good with it, you know. coming up, william jones says good-bye to his mentor and hello to life on the outside. >> don't come back. and leonard mcquay argues for a transfer out of confinement.
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hangs over the indiana's wabash valley correctional facility most of the 2200 convicted felons housed here will treat it as one more routine day of incarceration. but not william jones, jr. today, after three years, he's going home. >> how do you feel today? >> nervous. i'm happy to leave but it sucks to have to leave people in here. >> the one inmate he most hates to leave behind is close friend and spiritual mentor marcus murray who is serving 60 years for murder. >> what's up, man? >> it's going to be hard, dude. >> you're going to miss me. you know it. >> i'm not going to miss you. >> oh, man. be cool, man. all right? >> while jones spends his final
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moments in prison just outside the walls his older brother casey and casey's family arrive to pick him up. >> me and my brother are pretty close. i'm just glad i get to pick him up and not have to leave him here. i have been here like eight times and had to leave him here. it was hard. >> have a good one. >> appreciate it. >> good luck and stay out of here. >> i'm going to. >> good luck, man. >> feels different. i guess there is nothing like walking out of prison, i guess. >> all right. >> being in jail is not real cool. i don't like it. >> in there. what's your name? >> jones. >> here's your clothes. >> thank you. >> get your property and we'll escort you out of here.
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releasing one from gate two. let's go. be right with you, ma'am. come along, billy, run to me. >> don't come back. i don't want to see you any more. >> i ain't coming back. >> nice to see you. >> a bit normal? >> good to be home? >> it's good to be home. >> let me do the honors. >> man. >> cigarette's in the car. >> can't have it right now. >> take a picture. >> hold it up. >> finally. >> all right. >> everybody in. >> while jones savors his first
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moments of freedom, back inside wabash convicted murderer leonard mcquay fights for a different kind of freedom. he has a hearing with his case manager to determine if he is able to be released back to general population from administrative segregation, the only world he's known for the past 16 years. >> you're going all of the way out with it, ain't you? dog leash and all. >> the prospect of mcquay being released into general population naturally has some staff on edge. >> offender mcquay, he comes off as a very well-spoken, polite individual. that being said, he has the conduct history with assault on staff and the murder charge on a staff member of a previous facility. even though he does comes across as a polite individual, you have to keep that in mind when you are dealing with him.
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>> they so evil, they are so barbaric putting all them chains on that guy like that. >> i do not trust him. i treat him with respect but i do not trust him. >> the last time mcquay had a review with his case manager, beverly gilmore, she approved his request for a job. he hopes he can now persuade her he is ready for general population. >> hello, mr. mcquay. how are you? >> i'm all right, ms. g. how it be i have my presentation for my review. >> mr. mcquay, what makes you a good candidate for release from administrative segregation into the offender general population? >> i've engaged in rehabilitation that has allowed me to take a retrospective look not only at my past violent behavior and my new more humbled
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progressive behavior, and i believe that i've made some significant strides in my social relationship with staff. however, how are we to be assured that you actually soaked this in and believe it down to the bone marrow. >> i'm asking you, ms. gilmore and i'm asking the administration here to open your hearts and look at me as a human being who has made some terrible mistakes, who has come back from the grave. i'm a new man. and the only way that this new man can shine is that you give me the opportunity. please give me a chance. that's all i need. i won't let them done. >> i will summarize that in a statement. thank you. >> they got reason to be concerned because of you know
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prior incidents, you know associated with me. and the only way that they can see that i'm not only a changed man but i'm ready to do something different with my life is to let me have an opportunity. i haven't had a chance. and that's what i'm hoping for. coming up, marcus murray defends asatru. >> you have a salute like a lot of white supremacists. >> no, sir. >> and a decision is handed down on leonard mcquay. whee whee wheeeeeeeeeeee-he-he-heeeeee! whee whee wheeeeeeeeeeee! pure adrenaline. whee whee wheeeeeeeeeeee! everything you love about geico, now mobile. download the new geico app today. whee wheeeeeeeeeeee-he-he-heeeeee!
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when bp made a commitment to the gulf, we knew it would take time, but we were determined to see it through. today, while our work continues, i want to update you on the progress: bp has set aside 20 billion dollars to fund economic and environmental recovery. we're paying for all spill- related clean-up costs. and we've established a 500 million dollar fund so independent scientists can study the gulf's wildlife and environment for ten years. thousands of environmental samples from across the gulf have been analyzed by independent labs under the direction of the us coast guard. i'm glad to report all beaches and waters are open for everyone to enjoy. and the economy is showing progress with many areas on the gulf coast having their best tourism seasons in years. i was born here, i'm still here and so is bp. we're committed to the gulf for everyone who loves it, and everyone who calls it home.
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♪ [ female announcer ] if whole grain isn't the first ingredient in your breakfast cereal, what is? now, in every box of general mills big g cereal, there's more whole grain than any other ingredient. that's why it's listed first on the side. from honey nut cheerios to cinnamon toast crunch to lucky charms, get more whole grain than any other ingredient... without question. just look for the white check.
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that's my little boy right around my birthday. that is what the first picture was too. here's the day he was born. i don't know. this [ bleep ] is hell.
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>> robbie mcanalley has been in prison for two years and has not has a single visit with his three-year-old son. contact with the child's mother had given him hope that a visit might be imminent. now the child's mother has changed her plans. >> man, [ bleep ] that -- all she been talking about for two and a half months is i'm going to bring trey down there now all of a sudden she is too busy. i'm going to turn her into a clown, bro. i will turn her into a clown, bro. >> he just talks [ bleep ]. he love that girl. >> i love the [ bleep ] out of her but she ain't worth a [ bleep ]. >> later, he revealed one possible reason why the mother of his child has not followed through on visits. he said it was an incident that happened before his return to prison.
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something he rarely talks about. >> it was a domestic battery and i haven't seen him since then. >> a battery on her? >> yeah. that's the last time i seen him was the night that that happened. >> he can only accept the consequences of his actions and do little to control developments with those he's left behind on the outside. but today, marcus murray is hoping to make a big change on the inside. >> how you doing? >> he filed a grievous to have asatru removed from the list of security threat groups or gangs. today the coordinator and assistant superintendent have granted murray a hearing on the matter. >> if you saw someone coming to your community or services with ill will or intent to participate in a security threat group activity what would your take be.
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>> i would tell them to go back whence they came. there is no reason to bring ill will into the group. it's a sacred place. if one person is sick in the group then we're all sick. if you are in the community you have a say so. if it is anything that is kind of controversial it does get voted on. >> can you elaborate on that a little bit? >> let's say that somebody had an idea for how we salute each other. >> are you talking about greeting someone? >> like a handshake or something. like as a fraternity people like to set themselves apart. >> you stated that you or your community have a greeting that you referred to as a salute. could you show me what that refers to? >> no i never said that. you mean like we say something we say [ speaking foreign language ] which means hello and good health. >> you are not referring to a gesture. >> no.
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>> or body language. like a lot of white supremacists do with the hitler salute. >> no, sir. >> what is your input on other races joining your community? >> we will discriminate against no one regardless of race, gender, sex, creed, national origin, or of their religion. >> you have a minority in the leadership role. >> no. >> if that opportunity arose would that be allowed? >> yes, it would. >> do you have any questions? >> no, not today. >> do you have any questions for us? >> no, i don't. >> thank you. >> a final decision could be weeks off. but the wait is over for leonard mcquay. but prison officials have denied leonard mcquay's request to be moved back to general population. >> he seems like he has everything in the world going for him but when you sit down
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and really listen off the unit when he thinks you can't hear him talking some of the things that he talks about when a staff member was assaulted in another cell house he was applauding. that's a telltale sign he is not ready to go into the general population. >> i don't want to lose my mind on a unit like this. i don't want to physically begin to deteriorate where i can't get no help. so i want to actually be given an opportunity to do something progressive with my life. back here in solitary confinement i can't do that.

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