against the nation's first african-american attorney general. it's part of an ugly effort that began even before holder took office. and hasn't let up since. republican lawmakers are now threatening to hold him in contempt of congress. they're also calling on him to resign. it's an escalation of their attempt to attack him over a program called fast and furious. a so-called gun walking operation that was dreamed up by the bush administration and ended by holder. he made that very point yesterday. >> if you want to talk about fast and furious, i'm the attorney general that put an end to the misguided tactics that were used in fast and furious. an attorney general who i suppose you would hold in higher regard was briefed on these kind of tactics in operation wide receiver and did nothing to stop them. nothing.

>> there were three gunwalking operations during the bush administration. but republicans going after the attorney general have resorted to attacks that sink to a whole new low of dishonesty and disrespect. he is, after all, the chief law enforcement officer of the united states. >> how many more border patrol agents would have had to die as part of operation fast and furious for you to take responsibility? >> you know, i mean, really. does that -- is that the way in which you want to be seen, you want to be known? that kind of question i think is frankly -- and again, i think that's beneath a member of congress. >> republicans have launched every attack they can no matter how petty. >> you're well known in this town for not reading memos. what does that say about your leadership and management? >> given the decision to almost

engage in character assassination, i'm going to respond to at least some of that. >> they've accused the attorney of lying. >> you either lied or you were grossly incompetent in your actions. >> that was among the worst things i think i've seen in congress. you took a whole series of statements out of context with no context. do i treat the members of this community with respect? i always hope that i do. and what you have just done if nothing else is disrespectful. if you don't like me, that's one thing. you should respect the fact that i hold an office that is deserving of respect. >> he's right. you don't show that kind of disrespect to the attorney general of the united states. in fact, i want to name the politicians you just saw in that clip. congress woman ann marie berk l of new york. congress man tim wahlberg of

michigan. congress man raul labrador of idaho. these are minor lawmakers, but they should be ashamed of their conduct. paul gosar said obama and others in the administration might quote, be accessories to murder. and of course the far right has also ripped a page out of its old playbook and accused the attorney general of racism. "the wall street journal" ran a column with the title eric holder's people. blasting the quote racial bias of the justice department. and last month the paper criticized his quote, racial incitement. taken together, these smears represent an unprecedented attack on the top law enforcement official in this country. and it has to stop.

joining me now is congressman emanuel cleaver of missouri and chairman of the congressional black caucus. he wrote a letter to stop the contempt charges against the attorney general. thank you for being here tonight. >> good to be with you. >> what's behind these attacks on the attorney general in your opinion? >> first of all, i think in the united states during an election year, if one side wants to take its shots at the president and even his administration and that's part of what we do in a nasty way. when you start trying to hold people in contempt because they've chosen to enforce the laws that they swore to enforce, lyndon johnson in 1968 signed into law a measure that would prohibit the justice department

from ever presenting or leaking or giving away information secured on a wiretap. and what eric holder is being threatened about is obeying that law. and i think -- so what's going on is -- and it's happening in washington so much, reverend. and it's a sick moment for our nation. it's a dark moment. because what we're doing is we are so caught up into the disposal of president barack obama that we are dropping down into a level of incivility and some that most people have never seen before that it's making the entire political process soiled to the point that nothing is productively happening. >> now, it really is motivated in part by politics, large part.

steven king, republican member of congress, in march said this was all politics. he said and i'm quoting him. i think leadership doesn't want to be seen as using the gavels here for political purposes. i think there's a bit of an aversion to that. me? i have no reservations about that. this is politics. >> well, you know, that confirms what i have shared with people. some of the people in my party get upset when really speaker boehner is a pretty good guy who wants to do the right thing. and i think there are others in leadership who also are trying to do the right thing in the republican side. however, i think they're getting enormous pressure from the other side to go far, far, far to the right. far, far, far beyond what was

previously acceptable. democrats do the same thing in terms of an election year trying to make sure that the party in power pays some kind of price. but not to the point where we try to dismantle a man's character. we're trying to destroy eric holder for enforcing the law. >> and destroy any respect for the office. and the fact of the matter is that when they say he has not cooperated in the fast and furious probe that they want to hold him in contempt for, he has had 140,000 documents reviewed. 7,600 pages turned over. eight hearings before congress. he says let's keep talking. i can't give things that are somehow sealed or somehow beyond my ability we the law. the public needs to understand it's not there hasn't been some cooperation. but if it's politics, i don't think some of those that we're

talking about would be satisfied. let me tell you what really caught my eye. in attacking attorney general holder yesterday, the senator brought up the voting issue. and called for his resignation. let me show you what he said. >> won't cooperate with -- and won't hold yourself accountable. blocking attempts to combat voter fraud. you leave me no alternative but to join those who call upon you to resign your office. >> with all due respect, senator, there's so much factually wrong with the premises you started your statement with. it's almost breathtaking in its inaccuracy. i don't have any intention of resigning. >> now, you know, i don't know a lot about fast and furious. i do know this was start eed unr george bush. i know mr. holder ended it.

but i know a lot of us that are concerned about voting. and for cornyn to say that part of the reason he should resign is because he has the justice department looking into the whole question of changing voting in states where you and i, the congressional caucus, civil rights groups have established there is no fraud. how do you say the attorney general ought to resign for protecting people's voter rights? >> well, i think that the sad thing about this is that in the united states of america, republicans and democrats, conservatives and liberals ought to be about wanting as many americans to vote as possible. this is the world's leading democracy. and for us to have to deal with a problem that doesn't exist and then ask the attorney general to resign because he wants to make

sure that in a democracy everyone has a fair chance to vote is just asinine and shows you just how low we have sunk. i mean, we are going down, down, down in terms of credibility. not only to the people of this country but in this world. i'm here in kansas city and i talk to people and no matter what side they're on, they are disgusted at what they see. and people still continue to do it. >> chairman cleaver, thank you so much for your time tonight. >> good to be with you. >> i want you in the audience to understand the level of outrage that came to me around what was going on increased when senator cornyn raised this question of voting. something that you know we deal with a lot on this show. why? because there's been no established increase of voter fraud. in fact, there's been an

established number that a fraction of 1% have found voter fraud. yet they're trying to change the voter laws all over this country. look again and listen to what cornyn said. >> you won't corporate with legitimate congressional investigation and you won't hold anyone including yourself accountable. your department blocks states from implementing attempts to combat voter fraud. >> block states from implementing attempts to block voter fraud. what voter fraud? we've gone over and over again there are no clear evidence, there are no numbers they can put out. we've used the numbers from the bush administration. there is no voter fraud. so what he's really saying is that the attorney general should not enforce the voting rights act. the voting rights act which partly says that certain states that have had a pattern of violating american citizen

voting rights must have clearance to change the voting laws. it is not the states that can say the federal government is standing in their way. it is the state standing in the federal government's way if they try to change the law in those states without preclearance. that's the law. that is the law that was made and put on the books in 1965. it is the height of hypocrisy to stand up and talk about how we love the civil rights movement and how we all fought together with dr. king then undermine the voting rights act. what bothers me secondly, is where is the leadership of the democratic party? that's right. we've heard some democrats stand up. congress man cleaver and others among them. but i'm talking about the heads of the party. why have you in this whole debacle gained political laryngitis?

i think you need to be called out. maybe i'll start coming with names. because it's bad enough when those on the other side start shooting at you for no reason. it's worse when your friends duck so they can get a clear shot. ahead, how did florida governor rick scott hatch his plan to purge voters? the amazing answers coming to that coming up next. plus republicans wrap themselves up in religion. so why are they waging war on the poor? a group of nuns is shining a big light on this tonight. and one who wants to claim he cares about the middle class. wait until you hear what he's saying to the wall street crowd today. you're watching "politicsnation" on msnbc.

we knew mitt romney was wall street's guy, but now he's practically bragging about it. how will president obama respond? that's next. [ slap! slap! ] [ male announcer ] your favorite foods fighting you? fight back fast with tums. calcium rich tums goes to work in seconds. nothing works faster. ♪ tum tum tum tum tums diarrhea, gas or bloating? get ahead of it! one phillips' colon health probiotic cap a day helps defend against digestive issues with three strains of good bacteria. hit me! [ female announcer ] live the regular life. phillips'.

we're back on "politicsnation" with a real news flash. wall street loves romney. i know it comes as a big shocker. so why do they love him? because his policies put more money in their pockets. today romney met with 100 of the country's top ceos. he was just connecting with his people.

>> obama care. might want to get health care to act more like a consumer market. i happen to be a real believer in competition and consumer markets. i also am going to put in place a policy that no agency of government can add regulations without removing opposite regulation. i want to see lower tax rates. it makes no sense to me we have the highest corporate tax rate in the world. >> lower corporate taxes, repeal dodd frank, treat health care like a consumer market. he's wooing them. wooing them all with the right words. and they're falling all over him. today politico reports he's winning with a landslide. he's already pocketed $37.1 million from the financial sector donors alone. he's going to save them big bucks if he becomes president.

romney plans on raising taxes on the poorest people in this country while giving his multibillionaire buddies a massive tax cut. so this is what this election is about. fairness. you have the 1% candidate. then you have the guy fighting for the other 99%. >> when i hear governor romney saying his 25 years in the private sector gives him an example of how the economy works, why are you running with the same bad ideas that brought our economy to the brink of disaster? we've got to move forward to the future we imagine. where everybody's getting a fair shot. and everybody's doing their fair share and playing by the same rules. >> joining me now is bob shomer. an ana marie cox.

thanks for both of you being here tonight. >> happy to be here. >> bob, glad we got that news flash out there. the lines are drawn. how do you see it playing out? >> wall street is going to put money into this. he's not only unfair, the policies are not only unfair, they're unbelievably stupid. what he is proposing to do is go back to the bush era of deregulation. get rid of the stuff that's been put in to prevent another crash. give massive tax cuts to those at the top which will increase the deficit and the debt. that's the recipe that led to the crash of 2008. now, you have a lot of these guys who only care about themselves. who know that they can go out there and recklessly gamble, make billions of dollars. and if things go bad, they're going to say they're too big to fail. the average guy has to come and rescue them. that's what we have to get over. that's what we can't afford to repeat. then you have the democratic cry

babies on wall street. the people who just can't believe that the president's denounced speculation. so their feelings are hurt. and they're going to support someone whose economic policies would hurt the economy and ultimately the stock market too. >> now ana marie, when you make a position or take a position that's one thing. i think that he's even gone further than that. let me let you hear where he said people who want to go after the rich and raise their taxes should be ashamed. look at this. >> i don't want to raise the individual marginal tax rate from 35% to 40%. i know there's some who think that that's a great way to go after rich people. and first of all, shame on anybody who thinks we're going to divide the country based on success. >> i hate to give another news flash all in one segment. the country's already divided when they have a tax rate lower than everyone else.

the question is trying to close the divide and have people all pay their fair share, ana marie. >> it's true. i mean, the shame is really on the people that would increase that divide and make the divide deeper. which is what the impact of romney's policies probably would be. i for one really appreciate what he said today, because i feel like he laid out exactly what it is that he wants to do. and i think that the american people are smart enough to realize that those policies are a rollback to the very things that got us into where we are today. and why would we go back to that? it's true that the economy still has not flourished like we want it to. and people blame obama for that. i think this election is looking like it's going to be a clear divide about what the role of government is as far as in the banking industry and in people's lives for that matter. when you bring in the health care reform argument. and obama's argument is government is there to make sure we have a fair playing field. and romney's is we take the

referees off and let everybody scramble for the ball. also, by the way, some people are hobbled and can't even get on the field. he's not interested in fairness. >> now, bob, you're one of the best strategists in the country. let's go to the politics of this. the government has to deal with the government problems. but in politics we are in a very troubling economic time. how do we run against him given this economy politically? what is the political strategy that you see? >> i think the obama people are doing a very good job here. and i don't have much patience for some of the bullfight critics in the democratic party who are sort of complaining about this, think they should be doing it. they've set out to make the election a choice, not a referendum. they've drawn the lines along the fundamental question of fairness. who's going to stand up for you? who's going to stand up for the favored few? i think the answer to that is clear. and they've always done it on jobs in this opening.

the bain ads and the ads about massachusetts are about a guy who in the public sector did a bad job of creating jobs. you've got to give people a choice. make them look ahead to the future. doesn't mean the president should run from his record. but he has to say in essence we've done a lot, but we have a lot more to do. >> now, ana marie, in an interview yesterday, romney said it was strange that president obama would accuse him of being out of touch about police officers, firefighters, and teachers. and that the federal government doesn't pay for teachers, firefighters, and police officers. let me show you so you won't think i misquoted him. >> he says that you're out of touch. he says that you want to cut firefighters and teachers. that you don't understand what's going on in these communities. what do you say to that, governor? >> that's a very strange

accusation. of course teachers and firemen and policemen are hired at the local level and also by states. the federal government doesn't pay for teachers, firefighters, or policemen. so obviously that's completely absurd. >> now, just for the facts before you respond, ana marie. the federal government pays nearly 11% of public school costs. spent over $1 billion for hiring police officers. awarded over $630 million in grants to hire more firefighters. when you apply for a job, you'll maybe get a job description and know what it is you're applying for if he's going to head the federal government. i mean, this is a little wacky to me, ana marie. >> yeah. i think that the word strange here is interesting that romney uses it. i think his response is very odd. it's very, very odd. but understandable. when is the last time that romney met a teacher probably or met a firefighter or fireman?

he hasn't need for much public school teachers. he probably could afford to hire his own security. he doesn't think in terms of an average american who relies on those public servants on a daily basis. especially the people in the middle class and lower middle class who might have more interactions with police and firemen and might actually be police and firemen and teachers. it's a stunning statement. i hope it gets the attention it deserves. i'm glad we're talking about it. >> bob, dnc released an ad of using teachers and first responders to take a swipe at how out of touch he is. let me show this and get a quick response from you. >> i'm a firefighter. >> i'm a teacher. >> i'm a police officer. >> mitt romney says there should be fewer of me. >> and me. >> and me. >> he wants to cut taxes for people like himself by cutting jobs like mine. >> and mine. >> and my job too. >> very effective ad.

draws the dividing line. look, romney knew when he was on fox and he said that. he knew what the facts were. he knows the federal government puts money into all these programs. but this guy will say anything, do anything -- you know, sometimes i think you know how you can tell when romney's lying? he moves his lips. >> bob shrum and ana marie cox, thanks for your time tonight. ahead, they're doing everything they can do to cut from the poor like attacking food stamps. now groupers doing something about it and it may surprise you. [ male announcer ] hey, isn't that the girl

who tore out your still beating heart? [ bowling pins ] ok, how's this gonna play? mi amore. [ chicken clucking ] [ male announcer ] bit needy, g. ok don't sweat it. just do your thing. hey! hey! [ male announcer ] definitely a little bit epic. stride. ♪ power surge, let it blow your mind. [ male announcer ] for fruits, veggies

and natural green tea energy... new v8 v-fusion plus energy. could've had a v8. new v8 v-fusion plus energy. if you made a list of countries from around the world... ...with the best math scores. ...the united states would be on that list. in 25th place. let's raise academic standards across the nation. let's get back to the head of the class. let's solve this.

folks, have you checked us out on facebook? the conversation is going all day long. come find us at facebook/politicsnation. please join us. as he escaped life as a child soldier. twenty years later, he was still running, he just had a different thing driving him. every step of the way. ♪ visa. supporting athletes and the olympic games for 25 years. join our global cheer. visa. supporting athletes and the olyavoid bad.fats.25 years. don't go over 2000... 1200 calories a day. carbs are bad. carbs are good. the story keeps changing.

so i'm not listening... to anyone but myself. i know better nutrition when i see it: great grains. great grains cereal starts whole and stays whole. see the seam? more processed flakes look nothing like natural grains. you can't argue with nutrition you can see. great grains. search great grains and see for yourself. for multi grain flakes that are an excellent source of fiber try great grains banana nut crunch and cranberry almond crunch.

it's delicious. so now we've turned her toffee into a business. my goal was to take an idea

and make it happen. i'm janet long and i formed my toffee company through legalzoom. i never really thought i would make money doing what i love. [ shapiro ] we created legalzoom to help people start their business and launch their dreams. go to legalzoom.com today and make your business dream a reality. at legalzoom.com, we put the law on your side. welcome back to "politicsnation." folks, remember her? think way back to the year 2000. that's kathryn harris. she was at the central controversy as secretary of state in charge of certifying the route of 2000. nobody will ever forget the

hanging chads and the confusion in the days after the election. then there was this ballot. the butterfly ballot. used in palm beach county. the source of major confusion. the top part was easy. if you wanted george bush, you punched the top circle. but if you wanted al gore, you had to punch the third circle. it turns out, over 6,000 who wanted gore punched that second circle and accidentally voted for pat buchanan. after all of that, it boiled down to 537 votes. we all know how that turned out. >> i hereby declare governor george w. bush the winner of the electoral votes for the president of the united states. >> no, before that katherine harris was involved in a massive effort to disenfranchise

thousands of voters in florida. but she made a big mistake. her voter cleansing program designed to vet the rolls for felons wrongly kept thousands from voting. particularly minorities. 12,000 voters were wrongly identified as felons and purged from the voter rolls. 12 years later, we've had massive voter suppression going on again. and surprise, surprise. it involves voter purging. the breaking news today, an explosive report if the miami herald saying governor rick scott's voter purge plan was hatched after a five minute conversation with his former secretary of state kurt browning. browning who was an election supervisor for 26 years recently told the miami herald quote, i didn't feel comfortable rolling this initiative out.

something was telling me this wasn't going to fly. we didn't have our is dotted and ts crossed when i was there. i would not have sent this to the list of counties. and to the next florida secretary of state ken detzner. a funny thing is happening on the way to the purge we found out. joining me now judith brown dianis and susan booker. she's the supervisor of elections for palm beach county, florida. thanks for being here. >> thanks. >> miss booker, let me start with you. will you participate with the governor's plan to go through the voter rolls in your county? >> no, sir. we did not send out the letters out because we felt the information provided to the supervisors was not credibility nor reliable information. >> so you're saying as the

supervisor in palm beach county you have not sent out the letters and you do not feel that the list complies with what it needs to and should be required to for you to operate as an official of elections in your county? >> no. the determination, the final determination in florida law lies with the supervisors of elections. prior to us getting ready to send letters out, we discovered some colleagues who did send the letters out, they found a world war ii decorated veteran. they found a lady born in ohio, somebody born in massachusetts. the information is outdated. it came from the division of driver's license. and you can see on our data, some was old from the year 2000. we requested updated information. we haven't received anything else. >> you found veterans, people who had a long history of voting. you found people on the list that was blatantly incorrect. what do you think the government

is up to here? >> well, i think we have a previous history and i think you already stated that, you know, florida has a history of trying to update the voter rolls. very interestingly so in the presidential election year. you know, the supervisors want to keep accurate data and voter rolls. since i joined the supervisors office three and a half years ago, we have legally purged almost 50,000 voters who passed away, moved, or no longer have voting rights. that's the way it should be done. it shouldn't be at the 11th hour. secretary browning who has a lot of election experience did not feel confident that the information provided to the supervisors was credible nor reliable. otherwise he would have sent it to us when he had it. it's been around for about a year. it's interesting that at the 11th hour they're pushing this on us. we're in election mode. we don't have the time to do this. i'm pleased that the -- >> it's not you don't purge voters. but you're saying do it right. don't do it at the 11th hour and

wait until the election time. very interesting. so you're not apologist about cleaning the rolls. but you want to do it where people are protected if i'm hearing you correctly. >> that's correct. you know, there's no time any supervisor in any state wants to tag a voter and says show me your papers and have them show up to be a u.s. born citizen. that's not fair to us. the only place we've received the information is from the department of state. and the information is obviously incorrect. and the supervisors are not complying with the direction of the governor and the secretary of state has requested. >> now, judith, this happened after a five minute conversation between the then secretary of state and the governor. five minute conversation. >> that's right. i mean, this is clearly the smoking gun evidence of this debacle. here you have, you know, the secretary of state saying, you know, this is wrong. you know, this isn't the first time this has happened. in 2000, actually the company

that did the purge actually said to them to katherine harris, we should not do it this way. but she decided to go ahead. there's no coincidence this is haening at the last minute. when we look at this, this is about a showdown around democracy. in one corner we have the secretary -- we have the governor who is the voter suppresser. in the other country we have the attorney general of the united states saying he's going to stand with the citizens of the united states. and he's going to protect the right to vote. >> now, judith, the governor says he's trying to fix a problem. a problem that doesn't exist. let me show you what he said. >> this is protecting the rights of the u.s. citizens and not diluting their vote. when non-u.s. citizens vote, it diminishes. >> for the record, the voter

fraud in since 2000. there's been 178 allegations out of 37 million votes cast. i mean, this is really the epitome of a solution looking for a problem. >> that's right. americans should be outraged by this. that this governor is standing in the way of democracy. he is undermining our democracy trying to get people off the rolls at the last minute. and in fact, it's illegal. you can't suppress the vote this -- you know, you cannot suppress the vote first of all. then you cannot purge so closely to an election. and we know what this is about. this is about him doing it for partisan gain. >> susan, let me ask you the last question. what's the way forward? the standoff here, the justice department's involved. what's the move forward in your opinion? >> we're going to look a to the courts to do the right thing. and we're going to ramp up for

an important election year. we have policies and procedures in place to protect the voter rolls and protect the voters. i'm confident the federal government will help us proceed in the proper manner. and we won't be purging the voters. because we're in election mode. we're so close to the presidential and the primary that the 90 day time frame that is outlined in the federal law and also in the state law should be adhered to. and that's what we're going to do in palm beach county. >> well, let me say this. obviously we all have our own opinions, and i'm very transparent about mine. but this is not about who you support. this is not about what party you might be a member of. this is about protecting everyone's right to vote. and we're going to keep talking about it, keep fighting in florida and everywhere else. i don't care if the people we protect all vote against the way i think they should. they must be protected. we must protect the democratic right to vote for everybody.

thanks for your time tonight. >> thank you, reverend sharpton. >> thank you, sir. up next, paul ryan is facing his toughest opposition yet. a group of nuns are traveling the country and speaking out against his attack on the poor. plus the e-mails are still coming in for my interview with newt gingrich. i've got one more thing to say, however, about his response to food stamps and secret meetings. stay with us. with the spark cash card from capital one, sven's home security gets the most rewards of any small business credit card! how does this thing work? oh, i like it! [ garth ] sven's small business earns 2% cash back on every purchase, every day! woo-hoo!!! so that's ten security gators, right? put them on my spark card! why settle for less? testing hot tar... great businesses deserve the most rewards! [ male announcer ] the spark business card from capital one. choose unlimited rewards with 2% cash back or double miles on every purchase, every day! what's in your wallet? here's your invoice.

mcallen, texas. in here, heavy rental equipment in the middle of nowhere, is always headed somewhere. to give it a sense of direction, at&t created a mobile asset solution to protect and track everything. so every piece of equipment knows where it is, how it's doing or where it goes next. ♪ this is the bell on the cat. [ male announcer ] it's a network of possibilities -- helping you do what you do... even better. ♪ to provide a better benefits package... oahhh! [ male announcer ] it made a big splash with the employees. [ duck yelling ] [ male announcer ] find out more at... [ duck ] aflac! [ male announcer ] ...forbusiness.com. ♪ ha ha!

america has always been a country that takes care of our own. but some don't believe in that anymore. now a group of nuns are doing something about it. that's next. wake up! that's good morning, veggie style. hmmm. for half the calories plus veggie nutrition. could've had a v8.

like in a special ops mission? you'd spot movement, gather intelligence with minimal collateral damage. but rather than neutralizing enemies in their sleep, you'd be targeting stocks to trade. well, that's what trade architect's heat maps do. they make you a trading assassin. trade architect. td ameritrade's empowering, web-based trading platform. trade commission-free for 60 days, and we'll throw in up to $600 when you open an account. ♪ home of the brave. ♪ it's where fear goes unwelcomed... ♪ and certain men... find a way to rise above. this is the land of giants. ♪ guts. glory. ram.

thought they were dead. huh? [ male announcer ] should've used roundup. it kills weeds to the root, so they don't come back. roundup. no root. no weed. no problem. welcome back to "politicsnation." there's a war being waged in this country. it's a war against the most vulnerable in our society. for months now the gop has relentlessly targeted programs that help the poor. today was the latest example. senator ryan paul offered up an amendment to the senate for their farm bill that would cut food stamp spending by 45% next year. is that really how we should be fixing this economy? by taking food out of the mouths of hungry children? no, it's not.

but sadly, villainizing the poor has become a cry for the other side. >> that allows able-bodied people. >> i'm not concerned about the very poor. we have a safety net there. >> we need people working with jobs, not our saving food stamps. >> our nation needs to stop doing for people what they can and should do for themselves. self-reliance means if anyone will not work, neither should he eat. >> neither should he eat. that's outrageous. but it makes sense coming from a party fully behind wrong way ryan's budget. a budget where 62% of the cuts come from low income programs. this isn't american. this isn't right. and it's why a group of catholic sisters are organizing nuns on the bus. a bus tour that will start in iowa and then travel through nine states to highlight the

cruelty of this legislation. joining me now is sister simone campbell. executive director of network, a national catholic lobby. she's organizing the nuns on the bus tour. sister campbell, thanks for joining me this evening. >> it's an honor to be with you. >> now, why is it so important to you that you and others are speaking against this budget? >> well, what we know is that out in the country, people don't know the reality of the budget. they just hear the sound bites of politicians saying this is wonderful, this is good, this is responsible. and what we know is that this budget that was passed by the house, proposed by congressman ryan erodes the very core of who we are as a nation. because what it does is it says we no longer believe in community. we no longer believe in caring for each other. we only believe in shifting

money to the taut. more money to those who are the riches. and giving even more money than the military wants to the military. people don't know these facts. and we need to make it clear. we stand with the people who have -- our economy has pushed to the margins. >> people ought to know that food stamps helps kids basically and reduces poverty. doesn't make sense to target this program. the fact is nearly 75% of participants are families with children. and food stamps reduced the poverty rate by 8%. >> and that food stamps are a really important way to help families bridge tragic times in this really tenuous economy. additionally, it should be noted that many of the food stamp recipients work full-time. and that, in fact, food stamps should not be considered charity

but rather a business subsidy. because businesses can get away with paying low wages and their workers can survive. so i think we need to see this as a program that supports the whole nation, not just the ones who can buy food. >> now, i have to ask you this. paul ryan says that his catholic faith was a guiding force in coming up with this budget plan. listen to this. >> one of the primary tenants of catholic social teaching means don't keep people poor. don't make people dependent on government so they stay stuck in their station in life. >> i suppose there are some catholics who for a long time thought they had a monopoly of sorts. not exactly in heaven, but on the social teaching of our church. of course there can be differences among faithful catholics on this. >> what do you make of that? is there some catholic budget here in your mind that ryan's proposing? >> well, definitely the ryan

budget is not a catholic budget. he only thinks of supporting those at the top. what congressman ryan misses that all faiths teach is that at the core, yes, his individual responsibility. but it's also communal solidarity. we only are as good as the weakest person in our society. that's the measure of our society. that's the measure of our faith. >> now, how has the vatican responded to your tour? >> the vatican hasn't responded. but the thing we're excited about is our catholic bishops share our perspective that it is an immoral document. it is not a correct budget. it's not in keeping with our faith. so we are delighted to stand with our bishops and oppose the ryan budget. >> so we have nuns on the bus and the bishops are supporting you. >> i know. it's amazing. >> that's great. sister campbell, thanks for coming on tonight. good luck on the bus tour. we're going to catch up with

you. >> thank you. >> we'll be right back. i went to a small high school.

the teacher that comes to mind for me is my high school math teacher, dr. gilmore. i mean he could teach. he was there for us, even if we needed him in college. you could call him, you had his phone number. he was just focused on making sure we were gonna be successful. he would never give up on any of us. support team usa and show our olympic spirit right in our own backyard. so we combined our citi thankyou points to make it happen. tom chipped in 10,000 points. karen kicked in 20,000. and by pooling more thankyou points from folks all over town, we were able to watch team usa... [ cheering ] in true london fashion. [ male announcer ] now citi thankyou visa card holders can combine the thankyou points they've earned and get even greater rewards. ♪

last night newt gingrich came on the show and we got a chance to talk about his racially charged rhetoric on food stamps. i resented all that he'd said particularly because some criticized secretary duncan and the president and even me for working with newt on education reform back in 2009. for mr. gingrich to make those comments was disturbing. and he had to be challenged. >> a majority of the people getting food stamps are white. they're not black. if i'm talking about food stamps it's not a racial comment. >> it is if you say you go to the naacp and tell them they should get paychecks not food stamps. you didn't say you'd go help get whites off food stamps for paychecks. >> i also brought up how newt attended a secret meeting on the night of president obama's

inauguration. a plan how to obstruct everything about his presidency. mr. gingrich confirmed he went to the meeting and said he was proud of it. >> don't you think in 2001 in bush was inaugurated people got together asking how do we get the white house? >> there's a qualitative difference in how do we get the white house and we are committed tonight to block everything he does, that we are going to be relentless. and really care nothing about the fact that he was inheriting the worst economy since the depression by a member of your party. >> i'm glad that newt and i had that last night. we've agreed to do some more talking in the future. i was glad that woe talked openly about what i felt was racially tinged. and i'm more glad he admitted

they did meet that night. and no matter what president obama did, they already planned to block him. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start tonight with this. what's the difference between a democrat and a republican? when it comes to economics, what do democrats want done? what do republicans want done? what wants to keep a hand on wall street and who wants to let the big boys up there do whatever they want? who wants a fair tax system in this country? who wants to top to get all the tax breaks so they will invest more? who wants a health care system for this country and who does not? let's start with the best fight in america right now. it's up in massachusetts between democrat elizabeth warren and republican scott brown for the united states senate.