former governor howard dean, gets tonight's last word. thank you very much, howard. >> thank you. good evening. colin powell versus reince priebus, who are you going to call? let's play "hardball." i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start tonight with this. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start tonight with this. colin powell, perhaps the most respected republicans in country, says his party is sending a message to african-americans by pushing measures making it harder to vote, it's saying that it -- the it wants to punish -- this puts colin powell, the hero of the gulf war in a battle with rnc chair reince priebus, who has presided over the multistate effort to close down voting days and set higher requirements for voting in this country. who are you going to call? the general who wants americans

-- all americans to vote and participate in this country's government? or the party chair who supports bills for making it harder for minorities to young people to vole? who are you going to call? colin powell or reince priebus, the field marshal of the rnc. who vastly reduced the number of black voters. james peterson is a director at lehigh, an engineer, and clarence page, a columnist for "the chicago tribune." let's start with colin powell, and what he said in his own words. he was speaking in raleigh, where he criticized republican efforts to limit voting. the news and observer quotes him as saying, quote, i want to see policies that encourage every american to vote, not make it more difficult to vote. it immediately turns off a voting bloc that the republican party needs. these kinds of actions do not build on the base, it just turns people away. you can say what you like, but there is no voter fraud. how can it be widespread and undetected? what it really says to the minority voter is we really are sort of punishing you. clarence page, you've been covering politics as long as i have. colin powell only comes from from olympus, or wherever he reigns from, and everybody hears

every word he speaks, because he is a republican. >> he is, and it's not -- not just republicans were pushing him to run for president, a reflection of the level of credibility he has. but you know, chris, i've often thought that powell was in the military for the second half of the last century, almost like being encased in ice while all these crazy changes have happened in the republican party. it's moved farther right. he still represents what's left of the old rockefeller republicans, the eisenhower republicans, the jake javis republicans, that's his sensibility. >> he was one of the chairs in new york. dina merrill, there's an

interesting duo. >> that's right. >> you're right. >> not to be too comical, but that's the republican party i grew up watching and my party was part of. professor, this thing is a battle writ large, i think. you have the most respected republican across party lines and reince priebus, who has a job. he's a partisan. somehow he got the idea with this 30-some state effort to reduce the chance of a black vote, that the way to diminishing white percentage of the country and diminishing

republican portion of the country will survive, is to make it harder for the other portion, the growing portion, to participate. it's pretty blatant, especially when we'll have in quotes on this segment of republicans saying that's what they're up to. >> you're right. it's blatant, and it is quite. cynical, kind of a last-ditch effort to play to that shrinking base over -- chris, you're right about general powell's sort of measuredness in terms of when and how he makes interventions, and part of the reason why he's able to retain some of his credibility is because he does it so rarely, and so we does it, we want to hear what he has to say. every time he's made any of these interventions, he's been challenging his party to be more reasonable, and i think that's kind of the pathway to the future. unfortunately reince priebus is in a tough situation where the candidates and the politicals within his party that want to have a certain kind of campaign sort of stretch into the mid terms and ultimately into the presidential election are very much interested in continuing to play to his base. not everyone in the republican

party is trying to do this, but reince priebus is following the lead of the ted chris wing of the party right now. >> let me tell you, you're sitting in philadelphia with the cityscape behind you. it reminded me i grew up in pennsylvania, you're a professor at lehigh, with hugh scott, arlen specter, both republicans, and arlen would get like 35% of the african-american vote, a huge chunk, which is the historic percentage the republican party used to get, before it started to get 10% of the black vote, which is why it loses a net 80% of the black vote in the big cities, because 90 minus 10 is 80. it used to be two thirds minus a third was a third, and the republican party could win statewide easily. about you when you start losing a net 80%, you're in the not in the business anymore. here is pennsylvania republicans, speaking out openly about using requirement to limit the vote. here's pennsylvania house republican leader mike turzai in june of last year. let's listen to him admit they're using this requirement to screw the black voter out of voting. let's listen to him. >> voter i.d., which will allow governor romney to win the state of pennsylvania -- done. >> romney wins, and just this summer, the pennsylvania republican party chair bragged that voter i.d. helped republicans shave some points, like point shaving in basketball, shaved some points

from obama's win last year. let's listen to this guy admit it again. we're not making this up. >> reporter: do you think all the attention to voter i.d. affected last year's elections? i think it did. think about this. we cut obama by 5%, which is big. a lot of people lost sight of that. he beat mccain by 10%, romney by 5%, i think probably photo i.d. helped a bit in that. >> what is this guy, under sodium pentothal? clarence, i don't get it. i don't even know why they admit it. what is the world they live? >> some people are tone-deaf to how they sound. his party is denying that photoo i.d. has anything to do with, when everyone knows the opposite. he kind of gave the game away, kind of like when lee atwater said we don't use the "n" word anymore, now we're more abstract. use words like school bussing or crime in the streets, blah blah blah. that's the same kind of thing happens here.

>> but he's saying the mere word spreading in the black community, when people live in row houses and don't have driver's licenses, and people who get old and lives into their 90s they're not driving around in cars, and they get the word, because the republican effort out there, hey, there's this new requirement, you don't have the right paperwork, a lot of people, according to this guy, 5%, didn't bother voting, because they thought they weren't allowed to, so they won by just the bad noise. >> it's absurd, though, chris, because what the data shows is this tactic backfired at the presidential level. it galvanized voters and charged them up to wait longer and sort of pursue through it. but why aren't they talking about voter fraud, which is supposed to be the reason behind this? they're talking about shaving points and try to reduce and diminish, but we live in a

democracy. we're trying to make it a great democracy where more people participate or we're not. so you're pulleting in laws, instituting supporting laws that are again it. listen, this is not just against the black vote. this is against elderly voters, as you just pointed out, against latino, hispanic, against college students. the i.d. laws and other laws sort of shrinking the window to vote, basically reduces our democracy to less than what it can be. this is why it's intolerable. the general is so smart. he's not denying there's fraud, of course it happens. but it doesn't change the results of statewide election. results of stayedwide elections. or anything like that. as powell points out, the great irony, it's a bit sarcastic, if there's so much of it that affects elections, how how can nobody find any if >> that's right. even more movement today. in addition to general powell's comments, the justice department filed a lawsuit against the state of texas to block that state's voter i.d. law that went

in effect a mere hours after the supreme court's decision essentially gutted the -- in a statement here, eric holder said -- we will not allow the supreme court's recent decision to be interpreted as open season for states to pursue measures that suppress voting rights. in fact, within hours of that comment, senator john cornyn of texas, who is one partisan paul, issued his own statement, saying -- facts mean little to a justice department bent on inserting itself into the sovereign affairs of texas and a lame-duck administration in trying to turn our state blue. excuse me, senator. lame duck? we are six months into a four-year presidential term, but that's the way they want us to think, isn't it, clarence? they've been really good at it. make people think that obama is on his way out the door. >> sure. the irony of this is, as was mentioned earlier, while the republicans have put so much attention on voter i.d. they had

a problem getting white and blue collar male voters to turn out. that's probably what sunk romney. when you look at the low turnout among reliable republican voters in -- reliable districts, especially rural districts, that made a big difference, because romney was not connecting with the base. this is -- >> he connected once when he said 47%. >> that's the thing. >> everybody in america heard that one. >> that apparently had a bigger impact than anything else. >> a lot of republicans are below the average income. >> right. >> they're regular republicans, my family. regular republicans are not all rich. >> thank you. that's where the reagan democrats came from. ronald reagan connected with the blue collar white voters, but they've not had that connection since in the gop, so they've turned to tactics like voter i.d. >> tell me, professor, i've only seen you do such great things on this network and i mean it.

>> thank you. >> but tell me what you tell to school guys up at lehigh, and how do they see this, the republican party after all these years after being damned good on voting rights in the '60s. i check it out. only two republican senators in the entire senate voted against the act. john tar row of texas and of course strom thurman. that was it. >> that's right. >> every republican senator was gung ho for voting rights. today what would the vote be? >> it will be almost the opposite of that, and what i try to tell students, chris is we have to be students of history, but also understand this particular moment. it gets real tricky, when you think about the history and how they have sort of switched sides, and a lot of progressives think the democratic party is kind of the republican party of the immediate future, so there is some confusion, but these particular cases, we have to pay attention. what attorney general holder is

looking at is the section of the voting rights act that hasn't been gutted that prohibits any kind of voting practices that discriminate or what they refer to as linguistic minority. congress in the '80s added certain addendums, so the courts could use important information, to look at the history of a particular state or district, to look at racial polarization, to look at representations, so we have to share that and teach young people to look at the details around these issues, and that's how we wrestled thus these kind of complications. that reminds me reince priebus -- quick. >> chris, one more thing, we're not engineers anymore. we're the mountain hawks now. >> okay. like the stanford cardinal, with its christmas tree mascot. anyway, it's like the little kid who takes his ball home, because he can't win the game. it was once the republican party's great challenge to compete for the african-american vote, and they did a decent job for years. that's my coach -- get back in

the game. a programming note. rachel maddow will broadcast her whole show tonight, live from elizabeth city -- actually tonight a whole show tonight. north carolina is getting hit on this stuff. coming up, the latest idea from the republican fever swamps. here it is, lame duck, and here's the bigger word, impeachment, as one gop congressman put it, impeachment would be a dream come true. it's just that we don't have any evidence. isn't that backwards? they start with the verdict and try to come up with a crime. also, it looks like bob filner is finally out as mayor after 18 women. i guess that's enough -- that it's time to get out of there. he is leaving this friday. plus something you have to hear, an incredible -- this is heartwarming, a 911 call from a school clerk down in atlanta who talked down an armed young guy with an ak-47 and 500 rounds of ammo and got him to not kill anybody. the creator of" west wing" is on

tonight, aaron sorkin gets a news organization in real life to set the record straight. does it live on our show. this is "hardball", the place for politics -- or at least taped.

dramatic new poll numbers in the hot governor's race in virginia. let's check the "hardball" scoreboard. according to a new poll, muck all live has a real six-point lead over cusp necessarilyi. who say they are likely to vote in the november election. according to nbc's first read, no one in either camp believes mcauliffe is up this much, as suggests, but both -- might be an outlier or may not be. we'll be right back. we're back. in case you ever doubted the republican hatred of president obama, they're now calling for him to be impeached. let's watch. >> if i could write that bill and submit it -- >> do it. >> excuse me. it would be a dream come true. i feel your pain. i went back to my office and i've had lawyers come in, ph.d.s, tell me how i can impeach the president of the united states. >> here's the issue, you tie

that into a question i get a

we're back. in case you ever doubted the republican hatred of president obama, they're now calling for him to be impeached. let's watch. >> if i could write that bill and submit it -- >> do it. >> excuse me. it would be a dream come true. i feel your pain. i went back to my office and i've had lawyers come in, ph.d.s, tell me how i can impeach the president of the united states. >> here's the issue, you tie that into a question i get a lot. if everybody's so unhappy with what the president has done, why don't you impeach him, and i'll give you a real frank answer about that. if we were to impeach the president tomorrow, you could probably get the votes in the house of representatives to do it. >> you saw them, they're hardly

the only ones who have publicly discussed now the matter of impeaching obama. members of congress like mish bachmann, steve, james inhofe, has advocated for it. and now buzzfeed, the website, is reporting that senator tom coburn, said yesterday that obama was getting perilously close to the constitutional standard of impeachment. the fringe voices have been magnified by town has and wacko birds, called by some, like ted cruz. cruz has offered his sympathy and implicit support to those looking to impeach obama. here's cruz at a town hall this week. >> it's a good question. you need the votes in the u.s. senate. can harry reid and the democrats controlling the senate -- i think the stage is said for 2014 to be a fantastic year for republicans. i believe in 2014, we can take

the majority of the u.s. senate and retire harry reid. ed rendell, and john braybrenner, a strategist. with many impressive clients, i must say, i learned that today. let me go to the governor on this one. this attempt began way back with the you lie and birther iism and sort of an attempt to put an asterisk next to his name, so on the list of presidents someday they'll be able to say he was never really president, because he was some some other country, and the bill he hassed was never really really an act of government. they are using tissue rejection to try to get him out of the american body politics. i've never seen it. they didn't like clinton. we all fought over different people. this is an attempt to say you ain't even there, obama.

>> well, chris, i love it, and the reason i love it. >> love it? >> i tell you, i love it, because it is costing them supporters. the normal people, the moderate republicans, the conservative democrats who may have a tendency to vote republican, might have had a tendency to vote for mitt romney, they think it's crazy, mean-spirited and divisive, everything they hate about american politics. they've come to the conclusion they can't support republicans, because even if the individual is a good guy, he's controlled by the wacko faction of the party. i think it's self-destructive and from the standpoint of a loyal democrat, i love it. they're wacko. >> let me asking you john, the politics. it's people -- given opportunities by the press at the time. you walk up to a guy and say --

what is this like and everybody goes, well, they're entitled to their opinion. >> well, it's really a symptom of a bigger problem. we have no republican messenger running or message where we're all behind it. so what's happening is different elements of the republican party are trying to raise money, they're talking only to the base, and what they're doing is very counterproductive. what they're really doing is shrinking the base, only talking to the most passionate supporter who frankly want to get rid of obama. i think that this is counterproduct i have been. counterproductive. i think the governor is right, if we don't change it, it could hurt us in the 2014 elections. >> what is this thing about impeachment? it's an attempt to have a revote. i think that's a misuse certainly with gray davis and others, and we can argue about scott walker and the rest.

but the fact is you shouldn't i go to you, governor. if somebody commits a high crime, then you have an impeachment, but i don't know what high crime is even being pushed by the republicans. they keep saying -- even a gill as smart as cruz is saying, i'm trying to find some historians, or it's not that we don't have enough votes in the senate. how about the more cardinal question, is there grounds for impeachment? even darrell issa, we're going to find some grounds and then i'm going to get the guy. >> that's exactly right, chris. high crimes and misdemeanors is the constitutional standard. there's not a scintilla of evidence anywhere that the president has doing anything against the law, but it doesn't matter. it doesn't matter. as john said, they're trying to feed the base in many cases for their own political purposes, and by feeding the base, or the extreme part of the base, they are absolutely shrinking it. you know, when we campaign against a good guy like pat meehan next time, we're going to say pat's okay, but he's controlled by the republican leadership and they're

controlled by these wackos, the divisive, hateful people who you don't like. the only way to change it is to get rid of republican control of the house. >> so that sort of 34idles him, doesn't it? it forces him to say -- >> absolutely. >> forces him to say, well, i'm not one of them. that puts him in a bad situation. >> but there are certainly districts where it is just the base, so a congressman -- >> delaware county is not like that. very modern. but you have to be careful. he said, number one, i am not calling for impeachment. i am saying there are people calling for them. i don't think he's done anything unethical. i think he's incompetent, but he 'also a friend of mine. >> who is more powerful -- this is loaded. here's the question. is boehner more powerful, or is the angry guy in the last row at the next town meeting? who's the more powerful? >> i'll be honest, i think it's the angry guy as long as he's

also writing checks to candidates. what's happening is we're being driven by candidates who want to run in 2016. what they're trying to do is compete for -- >> is the outside rail the best place to be? >> it's not. they're not all that way. >> they're fighting for the outside rail. let's face it, rand paul is fighting to get out as far as he can. and nobody's willing to say that. >> i agree. i think you have ted cruz and rand paul talking about libertarian, but you do have people like chris christie -- >> going the normal route. >> or rick santorum said we have to start talking to hard-working blue collar america. not the 1%. >> i don't think anyone can beat hillary clinton in pennsylvania, but i do think that chris christie would be an awesome candidate if the democrats didn't have hillary. >> except even chris christie, who i admire, even he's tacking toward the base. you saw after proposing a law to ban 50-millimeter rifles that

can be accurate at a mile and pierce kevlar, he put that forward as an idea. when the legislature sent it to him, he vetoed it. why? for only one reason. he's playing to the base. it's what mitt romney did. if mitt romney had run as the governor of massachusetts, he would be president of the united states today. >> you know what i do in those debates? i call those bullets cop killers. >> absolutely. >> nobody needs those guns. anyway, thank you. governor rendell and john, for your insights. i've said before and i'll say it again, starting monday -- i have to keep saying it. it's nigh job. "hardball" is at 7:00, you have to watch us at 7:00. for those of you who always watch at 5:00 eastern, you need to tune in at 7:00. i'm asking you to change your habits. i know it's a great time of night, as the sun goes down, we like to relax. hold on until 7:00. this is "hardball", the place for politics. [ female announcer ] made just a little sweeter...

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many are attributing that outcome to a brave school clerk, antoinette tuff, who succeeded in calming down michael brandon hill, who police say was carry an ak-47 rifle and 500 rounds of ammunition. in the 911 tape, you can hear tuff convince hill to stand down. >> let me talk to them and see if we can work it out so that you don't have to go away with them for a long time. >> no, it does matter. i can let you know that you have not tried to harm me or doing anything, if you want to. that doesn't make any difference, you didn't hit anybody. let me ask you this. he didn't hit anybody. he just shot outside the door. if i walk out there with him -- if i walk out there with him, so they won't shoot him or anything like that, he wants to give himself up. is that okay? they won't shoot him? >> yes, ma'am.

>> on the ground with his hands -- tell the officers don't come in shooting or anything. i'll buzz them in. >> okay. hold on. sit right there. i'm going to buzz them in, so you know when they're coming, okay? just stay there calm. don't worry about it. i'm going to sit here, so they'll see you did not try to harm me. okay? >> okay. >> it's going to be all right, sweetheart. i just want you to know that i love you, though, okay? and i'm proud of you.

i'm veronica de la cruz. new photos show hosni mubarak moments after he was released to prison today. he was flown to a military hospital where he remains under house arrest.

revelation from bradley manning, who says he wants to live as a woman. he was recently sentenced to 35 years for leaking classified document. and aaron hernandez was indicted on a first-degree murder charge in the death of his friend odin lloyd. now back to "hardball." he would come in and try to kiss me on the lips. and i would have to squirm to get away. >> he got very close to me, and ran hi finger up like this, and he whispered, do you have a plan man in your life? >> i was placed in the filner headlock and moved around as a ragdoll while he whispered sexual comments in my ear. welcome back to "hardball." those were just 3 of the 18 women who have accused san diego mayor bob filner of unwanted sexual advances. or inappropriate sexual behavior. well, today we learned that he has agreed to resign as part of

a deal reached this week with city officials 679 filner was spotted, by the way, leaving city hall with packing boxes wednesday night. always a sign you're leaving, but will formally vacate the office following a closed session of the city council tomorrow. he's also expected to speak tomorrow after that closed-door session. anyway, the question a lot of people are asking now, how did he get away with it for so long. a.b. stoddard is with "the hill" newspaper. she does cover capitol hill, where he was a congressman for so many year, and joan walsh is editor of salon and a analyst here. this didn't leak out, this problem -- >> he was there for 20 years. if this was happening in washington, he would have had a reputation about this, and he wouldn't have gone away with it for so long. he managed to have a longtime career, not as a standout congressman, but i'm still amazed. i mean, you listen to those women.

there were women who served in our armed forces that had been raped during their service that he tried to put the moves on. this is really bad stuff. i'm just amazed that he admitted and still wanted to hang onto his job until tomorrow. >> yeah, he resisted with this, joan, with this therapy two weeks thing, which was obviously a time-delay tactic. it wasn't goods to get him off. >> only two weeks >> we don't know -- this thing hasn't gone to trial, and may well go to a civil court. we'll know more about how he was able to intimidate people. did he threaten their jobs? i don't know what he did to avoid people. the headlock one jumps right out at you. >> it's horrible. >> he treated me like a ragdoll. >> it's horrible. >> this isn't anything on the border. this is way over, almost criminal. >> yeah, and it's been awful, too, to listen to him claim age as an excuse, like times have changed, he didn't get the memo. >> when was the headlock era? >> yeah, right. i don't know, chris. i'm just not that old. when the headlock was okay on the job.

i shouldn't be making light of it. it's awful. >> i know. >> we're not. that was awful, because it presumes that men haven't learned, most men, the vast majority of men have learned what is acceptable. you know, it's a bipartisan thing. earlier last spring -- >> thank you, thank you, joan. i love that you said that, because it's everything in our business today that recognizes that financial corruption and sexual misbehavior are not rampant, but they are bipartisan. >> they are, sadly they are bipartisan. i've been a progressive for too long to pretend this doesn't happen among democrats or good enlightened progressives. it happens, but we've also seen our friends on the right try to hang filner and anthony weiner around the necks of democrats and pretending this some strange democratic malady. >> i'm of the opinion now that weiner is not really in the running, at least according to the polls. he may make a comeback, but not good for the party. he was used as sort of the doppelganger -- it was filner and weiner, used like a brace of trouble, you know what i mean?

it was being used partisanwise. >> yes, it was. i think george will made some comments about it. we had the spectacle of herman cain who i think was the leading republican candidate in 2012 going down in a scandal like this. so it is something that happens on both sides. i hope he's really leaving. >> you have a memory like an elephant. how did you remember? herman cain's existence? >> it was just last week. we spent way too much of our lives talking about that man. >> you are so smart. >> back into the stack of golden oldies. >> i was going to bring up congressman foley, and the reason democrats were hammering the republicans at that time is because there was a sense that republicans had known about it. and failed to stop it. but i don't think that filner and weiner reflect on their party. i think it reflects badly on

politicians who think they can do this. >> thank you, a.b. and joan. up next, the great aaron sorkin, the genius behind "the news room" on hbo, but he has something to straighten out, and i think he's right. this is "hardball", the place for right -- the place for politics. maybe it is. let me again remind you to

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let me again remind you to please remember starting on monday, "hardball" will be on exclusively at 7:00 eastern time. i know it means adjusting your evening rituals and habits, but i'm asking you to make the move with me. we're moving to 7:00 eastern, just one showing of "hardball" every night. we'll be right back after this.

welcome back to "hardball." aaron sorkin made politics romantic in "the west wing" and now is doing the same thing on for television news. hbo's "the newsroom" takes you behind the scenes of a nightly news show. a tad bit more dramatic than the reality, but not much. as it did in the first season, it covers real-life stories like the election, the george zimmerman case and benghazi, but season 2 also includes a story arc about the investigation into a military black-op known as genoa, where the network accuses american troops for using sarin gas on civilians. in pakistan. but the story turns out not to be true, and on this week's episode, that reality comes crashing down. >> we don't think the protest

has anything to do with the movie. >> we don't think it's a protest. >> what do you think it is? >> a planned coordinated attack. he has a source. >> he saw an e-mail at the operations senator to white house and say shariah is claiming the attack. >> well, the movie might just be a coincidence. >> it's not a movie "avatar" is the movie. >> how bad is this thing? >> it's been bad. >> really bad. >> you've been nothing but bad news since you raised your hand at northwestern. don and jim have a source at state that says he saw an e-mail. ansar al shariah cease -- and it may have nothing to do with cairo and the 9/11 attack. what? mac? >> we have to retract genoa tonight. all of it. >> dramatic stuff, and it's coming on sunday night. i spoke with aaron sorkin. the writererier today. while discussing his fictional

show, he cleared the air on a bogus real-life headline. aaron sorkin, "the newsroom" grabs people in the strangest way. it's on sunday night at 10:00. you think all weekend it's coming up. what grabs people is it's organic. you're watching these characters, and you have no idea where they're going to go. people really find it like it's a live animal, that show, like it's going to do something next. >> i can tell you that i feel like when i'm making it, i feel like i'm being attacked by wild animals. the show is a lot of fun to make. i want to work with a great group of people. i want for one second hijack this interview. there's something i need to do. i'm here in d.c., did an event last night for the new republic, at the motion picture association. we screened this sunday's episode, and there was a q&a after. and "mother jones" a terrific outlet, posted a story this morning saying that i said the huffington post sucks. i certainly did not say that. the headline writer didn't take me out of context.

the headline writer didn't exaggerate. the headline writer lied, and i just want to make sure that david corn and -- i'm sorry, that ariana and everybody at the huffington post knows i did never and would never say that. >> great. you've made news tonight. let's go to the thing about truth. i think in that episode, i did see a screening of the show you showed last night, and there's a real bad guy in it. you have a bad guy who's a news producer, who cheats, and it makes him look like he's saying something about the use of sarin gas, poisonous gas, that he didn't say, deliberate lying by the media. >> you're talking about jerry dantana, and he is a true believer. he's not doing this for the money or the glory.

he honestly believes that this happened, the story happened, the story has got to get out, that the general he's interviewing said it off-camera and just got cold feet when he went on camera. >> but did he say it off-camera? >> we're going to find out. i don't want to give too much away, but what he said off-camera "it happened. but the "it" that he's talking about is not the it that jerry thought he was talking about. >> this is important to me in my business. i deal about it all the time with producers, finding truth. you can have an attitude on top of truth, but facts are facts. they edited the tape, he cheated. >> yes. there is -- listen, i'm not a journalism expert and certainly not an expert on ethics in journalism. what he did is lying, straight-up wrong, what he did is exactly what "mother jones" did when they said -- >> getting back to that point. >> i'm going to try to hammer it home a couple times in this

interview, because it is mind-blowing to me that they simply invented out of whole closest the thing that i said, and then, by the way, i promise we'll get back to the subject, and then in the body of the article he contacts several people at "the huffington post," what do you think? this is playground coat holding. i never said that. this is a kid sitting there going, fight, fight, fight. >> so they constructed a story on top of a lie. >> they're constructing an argument on top of a lie. but in jerry dantana's case, there's no question that in that interview he's lying. he -- not i -- he believes it's for a righteous cause. >> why did i dislike the character the second i saw him. and began to dislike him consistently. is that in the writing? where did that come from? >> it's a bit in the writing. first of all, we cast and hammish linkladder, a great actor, we cast one of the most likable, most inoffensive actors possible.

because we didn't want him riding in with a black hat and twirling his moustache. you didn't like him for two reasons. and there's a real bad guy in, and you have a bad guy who's a news producer who cheats. it's a film. makes the general look like he's saying something about the use of sarin gas, poisonous gas, that he didn't say. deliberate lying by the media. >> he is, you're talking about jerry, played by a great actor. and the thing is, he's a true believer. he's not doing this for money. he's not doing it for the glory. he honestly believes that this happened, the story happened. the story has got to get out that the general that he's interviewing said it off camera and just got cold feet when he went on camera. >> did he say it off camera? >> we're going to find out. i don't want to give too much away. what he said off camera was it happened, but the "it" that he's talking about is not the it that jerry thought he was talking

about. >> this is important to me in my business because i deal with it all the time with producers. we fight about this truth. finding truth. you can have an awe today attitude on top. he edited the tape. >> listen, i'm not a journalism expert and certainly not an expert on ethics in journalism. what he did is lying. it's straight-up wrong. what he did is exactly what "mother jones" did when they said i said the "huffington post" suck, i'm going to try to hammer it home a couple times in in politics, staff politics like i was in. romanced to the point where people said i want to be one of

the truth tellers in journalism now i think because of the newsroom and the producers and the fights we have here about trying to get to the truth, with attitude, obviously. but the truth. >> yeah, i've heard that. but it makes me so happy when i hear it because people are into public service. >> yeah. and how's journalism fit into public service? >> i think journalism is a public service, and i think that it's a calling. listen, i want to be clear. i'm no more an expert on journalism than i am, you know, i wrote the movie "money ball." i'm not an expert on how a small market team can make it to the world series either. writing a show that takes -- the difference between writing a show that takes place in a newsroom and working in a newsroom is the same as the difference between drawing a building and building which is is to say they're almost unrelated. all of my training, education, and background has been in play writing and not in journalism, not in politics, not in baseball, not in military law. and i -- i'll have a number of consultants who kind of feed me

phonetically sometimes the things i need to know. >> i think you're close to what we do. let's take a look at a clip of two weeks ago. it involves one of your actors, thomas matthews. >> one of our finest actors. one of our most handsome experts. >> let's take a look, a scene from an episode earlier this season. the news night staff almost gets bamboozled by prank callers trying to get on the air, claiming one is under the rubble of a bombed out hotel in syria. take a look at what happens. >> we're all set. we want to wait for a commercial break. >> mr. curry? >> yes, this is me, i'm here. >> mrs. curry, are you here? >> i'm here. is help coming for my husband? will you put this call on television? >> here's the thing, guys. syrians don't commonly say thank god. no one names curry is registered. and when that building came down, it took the cell tower with it. >> he's confessed to --

>> you still with me? stewart? we have unblocked phone numbers and that's why your super is knocking on your door right now with a police officer. >> it's a raid. can you open the door, please? >> [ bleep ]. >> tonight we take care of all family business. >> well, you got prank and you got even. >> yeah, i also want to say that actor, thomas matthews, it took us quite a while to get the information out of him that his father was a very well-known political pundit. >> well, he owes his looks to his mama. >> don't we all? but he got that part on his own. he came in and auditioned, and he's great and he's a great team player. football players talk about being great in the huddle. he's great in the huddle. >> thank you so much. good luck with the show. "newsroom" sunday nights on hbo. thanks for coming in here.

>> my pleasure. >> "mother jones" did withdraw the sucks headline. let me finish with one of the greatest speeches in american history. you're watching "hardball." the place for politics.

let me end tonight with these words about the king speech. of all the words spoken by millions of americans over the year, only a small number are remembered.

give me liberty or give me death. i only regret i have one life to give my country. we have nothing to fear but fear itself. high among them were the words spoken 50 years ago next week. the king speech. what's always gotten to me is the finale, what came at the end, that powerful bringing together of the cause of civil rights with the very land on which this country sits, this grounding of the god-given rights for the sons and daughters of former slaves, to the earth which this country stands and lives. so let freedom ring. from the prodigious hilltops of new hampshire, let freedom ring from the mighty mountains of new york. let freedom ring from the heightening alleghenies of pennsylvania. from the survashs slopes of california, but not only that, how i love that that, but not only that, let from stone mountain in georgia. from tennessee. from every mole and mole hole. from every mountainside, let freedom ring, there is in the scope and grandeur and fragrance of those words the very picture of this land, and this remarkable man managed to raise up civil rights as american rights, as american as the land