many in that same caucus who do this. the same ones who shut the government down. >> we'll see you back on friday night. good evening, rev. another day of disgrace as we can see in washington, but thanks for throwing it to me. i'm live tonight from atlanta. breaking news at the white house. at this hour, president obama is meeting with congressional leader does try to end this government shutdown. will republicans stop holding the nation hostage over the president's health care law? all today there was signs and more signs that they're still playing game, and the president said he's fed up. >> i am exasperated with the

idea that unless i say that $20 million, y 20 million people can't have health insurance we won't open the government. that is irresponsible. we have a bunch of folks who think they can't be held responsible. >> this shutdown is hurting real people. some even refuse to call it as a shutdown. >> i think it's a slow down. not a shutdown. >> people are going to realize they can live with a lot less government than what they thought they needed. >> if that means they're going to sit this out for a month or two months, let's sit it out. >> the state of arkansas can help out. localities can help out. i believe no one is going to star of in arkansas because of this shut down.

>> no one is going to starve because of the shutdown? here's what's happening where the shutdown is already hurting people. >> did you all eat today? >> no. >> this six year old got fed when she got home. but the same could not be said for every other child at the boys and girls club. >> because the government got shut down our meals were not delivered. >> i would have to go to work to supply food for my child. >> one place you might not think would be affected are local food pantries. but if they don't get federal commodities, they have to shut down. >> without this food pantry i won't have anything to eat. >> one mother in utah with two

sets of twins says she literally doesn't know how she's going to feed her kids. >> money is very tight. we're struggling to afford dierp rs right now. >> her youngest has medical problems and has a formula that costs $750 a month. she typically picks this formula up at the wic office for free. >> they called today saying they're shutting down. how am i going to feed my kids? >> what are republicans in washington going to say to that mother? what's their reason for why she can't get formula for her babies? that they don't like a health care law that has nothing to do with the health care fight? the national institute of health is being forced to turn away roughly 200 patients each week, including children with cancer from its research center. and here's something really

chilling. the man in charge of all intelligence gathering for this country says furloughing his agents has put our national security at risk. >> give' been in the intelligence business for about 50 years. i've never seen anything like this. from my view, i think this on top of the sequestration kwuts that were already taken, that this seriously damages our ability to protect the safety and security of this nation and its citizens. this is a dreamland for foreign intelligence service to recruit. >> it's a dreamland for america's enemies and a nightmare for us. but despite all this, republicans are still playing politics. they're voting again tonight to fund just some parts of the government and ignore the rest. it's cynical politics. and it's hurting real people. joining me now are congressman

emanual cleaver of missouri and karen finney. >> congressman, how can republicans ignore the real pain this shutdown is already causing people all across the country? >> well, i think we're living in a parallel universe, because as i listened to the debate on the floor before i came before these camera, i'm listening to people saying things that are absolutely irrelevant to what's happening in people's lives, and i think that, you know, the lower approval rating that the public has of congress right now is going to drop it further. now it's already dropped down do 10%. and i think saten is probably at 12%. so we are in real bad shape here. but it's a parallel ufrs. they can't even see what real people are going through every day. >> congressman, there are at

least 17 house republican who r said they two vote for a clean continuing reslation to fund the government without touching obama care. is there any chance speaker boehner would let a bill like that get to the floor in your opinion? >> i don't think so. and reverend, i'm going to give you a secret, you and karen a secret. there are more than 17. i've been speaking with republicans who are not the volatile folk who are causing much of the shutdown who are saying to me very privately, this day, that they believe that they have taken the wrong course and that they would like to see a clean bill come to the floor. some of them are concerned about and afraid of their base. they think they'll get a primary challenge from a tea partier, but the number is higher than 17. but the speaker, i don't think, is going to allow that to come to the floor because it will pass, and we'll get more than 17

votes. >> now karen, house republicans are also seeing criticism from other conservatives. >> right. >> wall street journal editorial page wrote quote, the longer they hold out, the more chances increase that the public will turn against gop governance. and senator tom colburn says quote, they're going to dig in harder until the pain becomes so bad they yell uncle. how bad will the pain get before they cry uncle, karen? >> well, i think we have to make them cry uncle faster than the pain hits the real people. as you were discussing the pain is hitting people. and this is something like the sequester where they tried to say that things that were happening weren't really happening with the kind of urgency that they are. we're talking about the republicans keeping our government shut down so that people won't get health care, so that children can't be on head start or can't have the food they need to eat. as the congressman says, they're

totally disconnected. but i do think there is a very important opportunity here politically, i'll be very political on this, this shows you the incompetence of republican leadership. this is absolute incompetence, and what happened the last time the republicans controlled the house? you had tom delay and a the culture of corruption. i think there's a broader hit that the republican party should take on their econoincompetence. they're just trying to shut things down and say no. >> congressman, i saw you nodding your head when karen started talking about inkpe teps of gop leadership. >> it's unfortunate that the speaker is being held captive. i really believe john boehner's a good and decent guy who would like to do the right thing. unfortunately, he feels as if he's held back by a segment of the republican conference.

and unfortunately, he's not, at this point, willing to stand up and say, look, i'm more interested in putting this nation on the right track than keeping my speakership. unfortunately, i do think that there are people who would probably want to remove him if he put this on the floor. but at some point, you know, you've got to stand up. howard they armen used to say i you step-on a worm at least it will wiggle. you know, it's time for the speaker to wiggle and stand up. >> well, he's at the white house right now, meeting with president obama. and i hope he comes out with a little wiggle. thermen said if you let a little weight off, maybe a worm will run. i hope he runs or wiggles or does something. karen, you know, the president said today his biggest concern was that it affects middle class families. >> yep. >> listen to this. >> the biggest concern that i

have day to day, though, is how's this impacting middle class families? are we creating a system in which ordinary people who are working hard and acting responsibly have an opportunity to get ahead. every day i'm tracking how is what's happening here in washington having an impact on that. and what we can say unque givically at the moment is that washington is have ago negative impact on the lives of ordinary people. >> at the same time, karen, members of congress are still getting paid, but the huffington post is reporting that some republicans say they haven't decided -- listen to this -- haven't decided if federal workers will get paid once the shutdown is over. senator chuck grassly said, i would not make a judgment at this point. senator richard burst said it's

too early to even consider that. senators flake and ber owe sa and tim scott said it's too early to decide. paying federal workers who got furloughed because of the shutdown, shouldn't this be easy to decide? >> i was working in the clinton administration during the last shutdown, i was barely making enough money as it was to pay my rent and do what i needed to do. and luckily, we got, we were able to get paid for that time. there are people who literally, they are living month to month on, you know, very little money. when you talk about -- >> check to check. >> check to check. and when you talk about not getting paid back that money that you lost. >> congressman, can you brief they're talking about it's too early to decide whether people should get the money even after? >> well, now this is sick. i usually try not to get upset. this is sick when you

participate in self-mute illization. and these people through no fault of their own have been laid off, and they are struggling, even when they're here. contrary to the myth that people have been pushing out about government workers, nobody's making a lot of money over here. you know, and you got people making 25 and $30,000 a year, struggling in washington, living in apartments with four people. >> and this paycheck is a big deal when you're making that little money. so when you see republican congressman saying they can do with less, they're going to see how much less they can do with. they have no idea what is happening and how people are living. i think that's what the president was saying. >> a paid vacation. they just think maybe we won't pay them. thank you for your time tonight. and be sure to watch disrupt

with karen finney weekends at 4:00 eastern. right here on msnbc. ahead, republicans are using world war ii vets as political props in their fight against the president. we'll tell you what's really happening at that memorial in washington. and ted cruz was for the shut down fwf he was against it. the man who dragged us over the cliff is now shocked, shocked that the government isn't running. plus the obama care news that republicans are afraid you'll hear about. it's working. and people all across america are signing up. >> just with him being in the hospital over the past year and a half, we've wracked over 20, $30,000 in debt. so it's huge. it's, not have that worry is big. >> i'm going to feel safe, i

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listening to the republicans, it's hard to know which way is up. they forced a shut down of the government, but they say it's not their fault. listen. >> four times, already, the house of representatives has offered compromised. >> we're offering a series of compromises trying to get a middle position. >> house republicans compromised and compromised and compromised. >> we have repeatedly made reasonable and responsible compromises. >> they literally just voted against working out a compromise. >> they're the ones who want to compromise? is your head spinning yet?

joining me now, a democratic senator from ohio. thanks for your time tonight, senator. >> thank you. good to be back. >> you were a member of the house the last time the government was shut down in 1995. how is this one different? >> it's different, well, first i'll say it's the same. they wanted to privatize medicare, social security, you're hearing the same thing now. some of them are saying well, we'll compromise, we'll keep the government open. we'll do our job. we'll do our duty if you pledge to us to go after basically the privatize medicare and social security and begin to rein in spending on those wasteful programs they say. well, the fact is, what's different, though, from now, is newt gingrich, hard for me to say this, but newt beginnings rich showed some maturity in leadership, real identified the country wasn't with him, went to his own caucus and said you've got to do the right thing. john boehner's got to make a decision. is he going to be the speaker of

his right wing fringe of his party or the speaker of the u.s. house of representatives and let all members of the house and representatives cast a vote on the it senate clean resolution to open the government? >> will the democrats in the senate hold? will they stand and be firm? >> yeah. i think democrats in the senate understand, we understand one fundamental thing. and all of us do. there may be one or two. but by and large we all understand, if the president caves in in any way to this kind of hostage taking on this, then come october 17th on the united states avoiding default, then they'll ask, they'll demand again, we're going to default if you don't do this, then, when this six-week continuing resolution expire, another month, month later, then they'll try to do that here. and we'll end up lurching from crisis to crisis, unnecessary

crisis to unnecessary crisis induced by politicians that want to attach to this document, this let's run the government document, they want to attach to that the republican party platform. it really is, the 2012 platform, piece by piece they're trying to put on these resolutions to get them through the senate and the house, and you don't run a government that way. they lost the election in 2012, forget about that for a minute. you just don't run the government that way by extortion the and the ohio newspapers have said this borders onion american. another owe/newspaper say this is is gop extortion. ohio newspapers aren't known for criticizing republicans by and large. >> when you say that it brings to my mind this new poll that asks people what they felt the gop's highest priority was, senator. 32% said it was causing political problems for the president. 20% said reducing gft debt.

14% said creating more jobs. this's third on the list. 13% said the top priority was reducing health care costs. you know, are republicans really willing to hurt the country in order to try and hurt this president? and the public feels they ran saying they wanted to create jobs and the public only feels that's their third highest priority? >> yeah, i'm not surprised by that. when mitch mcconnell said his number one priority, not jobs, not balanced budget, not fixing in his view the health care law, the number one priority was to make sure barack obama was not reelected. something leaders have never said. this is a faction of one party in one house in one branch of government that is holding the whole country hostage to close down the government, because they're not getting what they want. we're not letting them attach

their 2012 political party platform to the budget resolution so that they can get their way. and you can't govern that way. neither party can govern that way. it would be terrible for this country if we start governing that way. >> thank you. and thank you also. you're donating your salary, i understand. >> during this week to the honor flights. people all over ohio fly in and for many of these veterans in their 80s, first time they have ever been to washington. they get to go to arlington and the world war ii memorial. it's moving to help them. rush limbaugh slams michelle obama again tonight. >> i'm responding. ♪ ♪ unh ♪ ♪ hey! ♪ ♪ let's go! ♪

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president clinton famously said it takes brass to attack a

guy for doing what you did. and that's exactly what ted cruz and the political anarkists are doing with this shut down. their unbelievable new attack has to do with veterans who have been locked out of the word war two memorial in washington because of gop's government shut down. michele bachmann was the first to grandstand. she rushed to the scene, took pictures with vets, shook some hands, and she had the audacity to say this. >> for political purposes, president obama and harry reid wanted the government to shut down so they could say, look at those evil republicans. they want this to happen, and they want to make sure that world war ii veterans get shut out. we said nut does that. we're not going to let the world war ii veterans be used as pawns. so that's why we showed up 250d, to help them. >> let he get their straight, the woman who voted for this

shutdown is now doing photo ops like some kind of hero? no one's buying it. yet today they're still trying to sell it. the guy who endorsed ted cruz's antics maid the trip to the memorial to announce that the rnc would pay to keep the memorial open for 30 days. >> make no mistake, it was the obama administration's choice to barricade this memorial. and it was their choice to lock out veterans across this country. >> yes. the man whose party is responsible for the shut down will now wrap himself in the flag and be a hero. does he think americans are really that stupid? but who's the last guy that should be grandstanding? yes, you guessed it. this man. ted cruz. the senator who led us into this mess. put out a statement. quote, president obama is even

willing to deny world war ii veterans the right to access the memorial they have earned through their heroic service. that is incredible. it's also despicable. the same political arsonists who started this raging fire are now blaming the president for the house's burning down? as bill clinton said, it takes brass. joining me now is congressman jim mcdermott and abbey huntsman. thanks for being here. congressman, you're a u.s. navy veteran. what do you make of ted cruz accusing president obama of locking veterans out of the world war ii memorial? >> well, he sounds like a kid in a playground who has lost and doesn't want to admit that he's lost. he's blaming everything on the president, none of it's his fault. he didn't have anything to do

with it. he isn't anywhere near it. he's like the kid who comes in with chocolate all over his hands and says i didn't eat the cookies. he is not making any sense at all. i don't know how anyone could consider him as a candidate for the presidency. he really is irrational. >> yeah, or blueberry pie all over his face, congressman. you know, abbey, republican congressman actually called for someone to be fired for closing the world war ii memorial. watch this. >> one of the most appalling events i've seen in our nation's capitol was the closing of the word war two monument. how offensive could you be? maybe we need to get a new interior parks director and fire those folks or furlough those folks that can't leave public spaces and memorials open to the public.

what an offense. >> so, shouldn't congressman fire himself? i mean, they're responsible for this, abbey. >> they know there aren't many things worse than denying access to world war ii veterans for their own memorial. so they're saying, hey, look, we're the good guys in this mess. we are the ones that are actually reopening the memorial. we passing individual resolutions to reopen parks to help veterans. we're really the good guys in this mess. and democrats aren't willing to come to the table. they're not willing to compromise. they're not fighting for you. to look like the good guys at the end of this thing. i don't think americans are going to buy it. so many americans around the country are really feeling the hits. you have over 700,000 travelers. i talked to a couple on fifth avenue who had planned a trip to new york city two years ago to visit the statue of liberty. obviously that has been canceled.

weddings have been canceled. what hits home is the nih. people's lives are on the lean. about 200 people a week that are being turned away cancer patients, young kids. that's where it's hitting home for so many people. people's lives are on the line. >> this is not a game. this is for real. and you know, congressman. they act like heroes. the they pretend to be the party of the military, but while down at the memorial, i wonder they mention with their gop budget cuts what they're doing. they cut training programs for vet, cuts to housing vouchers for vets, cuts to mental health counseling for vets and increase in the waiting time for burial at arlington national cemetery. so this shows how what they're putting on, how about these cuts they're doing to the military while they're out there taking photo ops with our heros?

>> you know, it's the middle class that's getting hurt in all of this, reverend, what you, i had in my office today the head start people from seattle. and they're closing head start programs all over the country. and they're sending -- that, sending kids out, 18,000 kids are going to go out in about two days from now, because there's nobody to pay for their care. and this, it's everywhere. and these guys have no understanding how the middle class lives. they live paycheck to paycheck. they're saying to 9 million people, we don't care if you get a paycheck. you can pay your mortgage payment out of thin air or maybe you can buy gas with thin air. it isn't going to work. the americans will not buy this. >> i want to put this front page of today's new york daily news up. it shows ted cruz and john boehner with the headline, what

did you do for our country. i thought this was very fitting. the two men responsible for this shut down and what have they done for america but disrupt it? >> and now the question remain, where is boehner's head at? what will the turning point be? he has made the calculated choice despite the public opposing this shut down. despite the fact that the gop has been given most of the blame here to say that you know compromise is seen as preemptive surrender and you know that jerry man derring is a huge part of this problem. there are 205 members in the house-sitting on a safe seat. the folks that are voting for them, i don't think they care, necessarily, about a government shut down. for them, it's sticking to their identify logic principles, things that they want the members to stand for.

now when is speaker boehner going to have to throw-in the towel? we know it's going to have to happen at some point, but what will it take for that to happen? >> and how many people will it hurt between now and then. you know, we lost congressman mcdermott. he had to go vote on the last republican scheme. a lot of fast moving things happening in washington tonight. so let pea ask you, ms. abbey. we show ted cruz in the lead in, his amazes hypocrisy, the guy who started the fire up, blaming the president. there was more blame today. listen to this. >> we can respond to the national security threat these two gentlemen have ralaid out, d the only impedestrianment to doing so is that harry reid would object to doing to. if god forbid we see an attack on the united states because the intelligence community was not adequately funded, every member of this committee would be

horrified. >> now god forbid we see an attack on the united states because of the intelligence community was not adequately funded. but he's trying to blame the president for the shut down? i mean, abbey, let me ask you. your dad has been a republican and has questioned some of the extremists. right now ted cruz has had his moment in the sun. but long-term, what does this do for the country? and what does it do for the party? because i think the president's programs are going to be fine? >> well, it hurts the country, and it hurts the republican party and it hurts ted cruz. you had speaker boehner in march saying we're not going to tie obama care with a continuing resolution. and here we are today. it's frankly, a really sad state of affairs that we're in right now. and honestly, it's anyone's guess as to how long this is going to last. many peep are scratching their heads saying we never we'd be here, and i go back to

jerry manderring here. they care about winning. and what they have to do is go as far right as possible to keep their seat. >> abbey huntsman, thanks for your time tonight. >> thanss, reverend. still ahead, the gop's worst nightmare. obama care is working. you'll hear from some. people mo ha people who have already signed up. news that will have the mrs. obama's critics eating joe. thank you orville and wilbur... ...amelia... neil and buzz: for teaching us that you can't create the future... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history. instead of looking behind... delta is looking beyond. 80 thousand of us investing billions... in everything from the best experiences below... to the finest comforts above.

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to them tonight.

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the president and congressional leaders are continuing to meet at the white house, trying to work out a deal to stop the shut down. we're watching that. meantime, there's other big news. the health care law is succeeding. whether or not republicans want to admit it. sure, there were glitches on day one as people tried to sign up for health insurance.

that's to be expected. but here are the headlines americans woke up to around the country. the la times, health care exchange off to a busy start. the providence journal, strong interest on the first day of rhode island exchange. even red states like indienind . >> just with him being in the hospital over the past year and a half, we've wracked over at least 20, $30,000 in debt. so it's huge, not to have that worry is big. >> this is centuries this the making, another half hour of hi my life isn't going to make that much difference. so i think it's important enough to be patient with the process. >> people are just wonderful. i'm going to feel safe.

i'm going to feel healthier. you know. >> oh, my goodness, you know, this is good government. this is what good government does. and this is good government. how much better does it get? >> how much better does it get? doesn't this law sound like something we should be giving a chance? >> that's like saying, give the soviet union a chance. no way. i didn't want to give the soviet union a chance. i, there's certain things i just know i don't want to get a foothold. and solid, tried and true socialism, statism, which is what this is, is one of those. >> socialism, rush, you've got a bad case of cynicism. you might want to see a doctor about that. joining me now are joy reed and

james peterson. thank you for. doing on the show tonight. joy, let me start with you. how much does this affect the argument of health care opponents? >> well, rev, this is the very reason why republicans are doing everything, including threatening to destroy the united states economy, because what they worried about were people like the ones in that clip would come out and say wait a minute, that i can get health insurance, that two by two inch card makes the difference between seeing a doctor or not. this is going to be young people or minority, and more often people in their own states, red states who are uninsured. once people get the insurance, it's going to be very, very difficult to take that hay way from them, so if in the future, a republican president is elected and a republican congress, they won't be able to

repeal it because people like the idea that they have the insurance, and they won't have the opportunity to undo it. >> this afternoon the president laced into republicans for holding the country hostage over health care. >> during the course of my presidency, i have bent over backwards to work with the republican party and have purposely kept my rhetoric down. i think i'm pretty well-known for being a calm guy. sometimes people think i'm too calm. and am i exasperated? absolute absolutely, i am exasperated. john boehner has not been willing to say no to a minority of the republicans. >> i'll let you take it. >> a couple interesting things. i think the president is

correct, that a lot of people are very happy to see him dig in here, particularly, the millions of americans who need access to affordable health care. he's also absolutely right. and much to the chagrin of many of his supporters and now supporters on the left he has made concessions to the republican party throughout the entirety of his presidency. and by the way, the affordable care act is one of those concessions because many of us still believe that the implementation is great support that we need to see single payer, this was a republican plan with the exchange and all that into place, but you can see there hasn't been much compromise coming from the other side. he said once this thing is implemented they're no longer going to call it obama care, you know why? it's going to be popular. in this kind of nation with the wealth and resources we have, we have to be able to take care of

those folk who cannot handle the cost of health care. we've got to do that systematically and that's what this law has been all about. >> but, you know, joy, one. things that the right-wingers and the gop has been cheering about is the glitches that happened on the roll out. listen to this. >> people on the left is a glitch. liberalism is a glitch. we're faced with the biggest damn give every damn day in this country. >> enrollment glitches from coast-to-coast. think if you had to go through this mess before they send an ambulance. >> they're harbingers of very difficult times to come where your glitch isn't on getting in and finding out what plans, but your grich is you need a liver transplant. and you can't get it. >> but look at, look at how popular the health care sites

were, joy. that's the real story here. since yesterday, 6.1 million people visited the federal site, healthcare.gov. 10 million visited the new york health care exchange and 5 million visited the california site. >> absolutely. the health and human services department had hoped to sign up 7 million by january 1. they've already exceeded the 7 million just by people going on the website. a website has never crashed because of a lot of it traffic, right? that's unheard of. those people you showed, spoken like three people with fat, gold-plated health care. >> how about that. >> they have gold, blue chip plans. if you don't have insurance, you know what a glitch is? not being able to go to the doctor, not being able to get health care at all.

what they're fighting for is private insurance companies to go in a marketplace and compete to sell health insurance. >> it is republicans' worst nightmare. obama quare is popular and is working. and when they wake up from the nightmare, millions will have insurance. thanks for coming on the show tonight. >> thank you. ahead, rush limbaugh is about to eat some crow. and the first lady's serving it. next. [ male announcer ] when it comes to doing what you love, more is better. that's why we designed the all-new nissan versa note, with more technology, to get you into, and out of, tight spots. and more space so that you always have your favorite stuff. and, just for good measure, an incredibly efficient 40 mpg highway. so that when you're doing more, you're spending less. the all-new nissan versa note. your door to more. now get a $139 per month lease on a 2014 nissan versa note.

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a bigger date tonight on the food fight against michelle obama. they can't stand her healthy school lunch program she's promoting. in fact, right-wingers claim that encouraging kids to exercise, drink more water and eat healthy food is just another example of government overreach. >> nutritionists at large, michelle obama is urging, demanding, advocating, requiring what everybody can and can't eat. demanding that everybody basically eat cardboard and tofu. >> michelle obama is suggesting what you should feed your children. >> what she is telling us is she

cannot trust parent does make decisions for their own children, for their own families and what we should eat. >> she knows better than anybody else about healthy eating because she has a garden. >> the first lady's efforts are working. the cdc says childhood obesity rates are falling in many state, specifically pointing to the first lady's work as a contributing factor. and now the ap is reporting that the new healthy school lunch program is working in 99.5% of schools that signed up for it. 99%. i guess all these educators didn't think that healthy food was part of the nanny state. did rush limbaugh and his buddies really think we wouldn't call them out when the facts show they're wrong? nice try, but we got you.

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finally, tonight, speaker boehner and the other congressional leaders are going to the white house and having a meeting. that's a step in the right direction to try to break this shut down. now he needs to find the political courage to take on the so-called suicide caucus, the far right republicans. they're coming out now, john boehner's walking out to make a statement. >> one more time tonight that he will not negotiate. we've got divided government, democrats control the white house and the senate. republicans control the house. we set four different proposals over to our democrat colleagues in the senate. they rejected all of them. we've asked for a conference to sit down and try to resolve our differences. they don't want to -- they will not negotiate. we had a nice conversation, light conversation, but at some point, we've got to allow the

process that our founders gave us to work out. we've appointed conferees to sit downen a work it out. it's time for them to appoint conferees. all we're asking for is a discussion and fairness for the american people under obama care. i would hope that the president and my democrat colleagues in the senate would listen to the american people and sit down and have a serious discussion about resolving these differences. >> that was speaker john boehner as he left the white house, saying that there's still no breakthrough. the meeting lasted almost an hour and a half. you heard his statement live outside of the west wing of the white house. and he's saying he wished the president would listen to the american people. some of us believe he has. the american people voted last year. the congress, the house, and the senate passed the