>> no. i don't think so. they said ugly things about me at the break. >> you stayed up late. >> i will have to deal with pain and suffering now for a very long time. >> have a grade weekend, everyone. >> when you bring john heilman in here. >> it's way too early this morning. here's chuck todd. the dodgers won over the braves. have a great weekend, everyone. >> there you go. the deadly car chase from the white house to the capitol puts washington on edge. the latest on the woman behind the wheel and the response that sparked a rare moment of bipartisan applause in the midst of all this partisan fighting. the list of things that are not happening keep growing. no jobs numbers from the labor department. talk about the economic impact

of the shut down. president obama's plan for a week long trip to asia is totally out the window. it's a lynch mob how senators described the private lunch on wednesday where colleagues chastise crews on the shut down strategy. good morning from washington. it's october 4th, 2013. this is "the daily rundown" and i'm chuck todd. we will begin with the frightening car chase yesterday in a town where everyone is already mad at each other, the last thing people need was an act of violence. more to an act of violence, you can imagine what people think when they heard shots had been fired. it was 2:15 when a connecticut woman slammed into a white house barrier of sorts way on the outside close to the treasury department where she had the first confrontation. she raced to the capitol where officers had her surrounded and opened fire as she sped away. all the while, there was a

toddler in the car. >> this does not appear to be an accident. this was a lengthy pursuit and there were multiple vehicles and officers struck. there were perimeters that attempted to be breached. it doesn't appear to be an accident. >> she got stuck in the office building and shot dead by police. the woman is miriam carrey, the 34-year-old dental hygienist from stanford, connecticut. her 1-year-old daughter was pulled from the car safely and is right now in protective custody. the whole thing was over in less than an hour, but lent a chaotic development to capitol hill. it was shut down and lawmakers were cleared from the area so they can get inside or duck down to be safe. >> i heard four or five gunshots

and this swarm of police cars came in. >> they told the officers to get down and get behind the car and then come back and we heard that we were supposed to run back. >> officials in connecticut evacuated residents from carrey's apartment complex, bringing in dogs and the bomb squad. the area was locked down for 16 hours overnight. relatives have been telling law enforcement she had begun to suffer mental issues after a fall a few years ago. she also suffered from postpartum depression. nbc's correspondent joins me now. what more can you tell me about this investigation? i assume most is connecticut-based. >> that's right. connecticut and brooklyn, new york. that's where carrey is from and has family members. her estranged husband lives in new york. the picture is of a woman who was tortured by mental issues.

authorities we talked to say the relatives say she took a very serious decline after the birth of the child that she did have a struggle with postpartum depression and recently she had begun to think that the government had her under surveillance and she was being stalked by president obama. they are trying to reconstruct when did she come from connecticut down to washington? did she drive directly to the white house? that appears to be the picture here. a couple of other points. number one, despite the initial confusion yesterday, police say she did not have a gun and never fired at the officers. the only shots fired were by washington, d.c. metro police and the secret service. two points where the shooting happened. at the foot of the capitol and the white house where she crashed her car into a barrier.

the child they didn't know was in the car is fine. it was in good condition and sent to the hospital and now released to social services and presumably will be reunited with the family members. finally the other thing as you know so well, there is an exemption from the government shut down for basically law enforcement people. they were required to be on the job. two were injured yesterday and the secret service officer at the white house who she hit with her car at one point, they are both fine and released from the hospital. the d.c. police officer had minor injuries and they were not being paid. ious. >> the question is when the shut down is over, will they be paid? >> i talked to a lot of people in uniform and they say yeah, we go through this thing now with the shut down, but once we

resolve that, we get into the sequester where at least many law enforcement people will be furloughed for perhaps as much as two weeks. they won't get pay for that. needless to say, regardless of your point of view of the shut down, it's not doing much for the morale of people who carry a gun and a badge. >> that's an important point to make. i want to talk about quickly, what are authorities saying as to the decision by the officers to fire on the car, considering that they found out she was unarmed? did they believe she was? >> they didn't know. there has been pretty universal support from members of congress and from police officials about the decision to use deadly force. they say that this is a woman who twice ran into -- disobeyed orders to stop and hit a u.s. secret service officer at the

white house and driving at extremely high rates of speed, barrelling down pennsylvania avenue at up to 80 miles an hour and one member of congress put it, a car going that fast is a lethal weapon. they were worried a speeding car could strike a pedestrian. of course they had no idea what was in the car and what she had in mind. she seemed intent on getting past the security at the white house or getting up to the hill and repeatedly ignored requests to stop, even kept going after she was fired on and presumably in that fertile encounter, we will never know if she was wounded first or not. they are defending the decision to use deadly force. >> on top of the story. we will be seeing you later today. thank you, sir. up until 2:00, it was business as usual on capitol hill. which is to say a lot of arguing and finger-pointing.

this changed all that. after the all clear was given, lawmakers praised the first responders. >> i join the majority leader in expressing our gratitude to the capitol police. [ applause ] >> the irony of all this as steve brought up, on capitol hill police responded while they are exempt from furloughs. they are not being paid because of a shut down. they are getting ious. less than an hour later, good feelings were gone and lawmakers were back to placing blame. >> they are pretending to care. it's time to stop pretending to care and really care. >> it's hard to feel good and stand by and let a train wreck or a nightmare, depending on which democrat's description of

obama care you want, just let it go. >> as the shut down drags on, it's now impacting american policy and image overseas. late thursday the white house announced officially that the president was cancelling his entire trip to asia to stay in washington. it's a no brainer. hard for the president to justify being out of the country in shut down. you never know when there might be something you can do and you don't want to be in the middle of an overseas flight. it comes at 8 price. economic opportunity can be lost and it doesn't look good in the eyes of countries like china. house republicans have a meeting and it's tough to make predictions about what may come out of that one. we are however getting clues as to how speaker boehnering inned to keep republicans in line. he is telling the rank and file while he wants health care to be part of the deal, that's not all of that. he wants to include the

debt ceiling and assuring the moderates he won't let the country default and he will use democratic and republican votes to raise the debt limit. that's always the case. stick with me on shut down and don't worry about the default. he made similar assurances saying he would find a way to shut down. that didn't happen. one thing they are wary of is how they are receiving them. susman did the party no favors when he said they deserved to get something out of the shut down, something the president counts on. >> what you get is the economy not stalling by continuing to grow. what you get are workers continuing to be hired. that's what you get. that's what you should be asking for. >> within an hour of the president using those remarks, stutsman released a statement

that said i carelessly misrepresents speaker boehner's work on behalf of the american people. the house republicans are trying to move forward on the bills continuing a strategy that will address situation this is critical statements. these 11 bills are coming up and covering everything from nuclear security and expected to pass the house and so far harry reid has been unable to take em up in the senate. they should agree to fund the entire government and not pick winners and losers. >> marcia blackburn, good morning. >> good morning, chuck. >> i want to start with the various speculation that is out there about what house republicans might agree to do today. there seems to be growing group of moderate republicans who say they would support a clean funding bill, no strings

attached, short-term and force a negotiation on a larger, bigger deal. where are you on something like this? >> i think we are all wanting to keep a resolution to the long-term fiscal spending issues. this is something that we are better served, some of us have been trying to do this for years as you well know. we have been frustrated that the senate wouldn't do a budget now. they did a budget and didn't want to go to conference and as we look at the debt ceiling, we have to look at tax reform and entitlements. we need to roll the cr and the debt ceiling discussions together and say let's look at this long-term. can you talk about spending and priorities for congress to do the appropriate amount of oversight on that discretionary portion of money. certainly over the past couple of years, we picked that up. i think putting that attention

on stabilization of the trust funds, medicare and social security and reform of the entitlements and tax reforms so we get an economic growth age a agenda, those are imperative. >> you said that the senate didn't want to go to conference. they did want to go. >> no, they wanted us -- >> they wanted to go on the annual budget. >> no, no, no. >> harry reid tried to do it and you haven't appointed. >> what they wanted us to do is predetermine that we were going to agree to a tax increase. we were not going to make that predetermination. we wanted to take our budgets to the table and work things out and put us in a posture so that woe are able to address these long-term entitlement issues and address stability of the trust fund which are going to have to be done sooner rather than later. we need to put all of this on

the table, chuck. be adults. sit at the table and work through these issues and i'm one of those who said let's do it now. i don't want problems to fester and get out of control. >> you brought up the adult word. mike rogers, republican congressman from michigan said basically the adult thing to do would be pass a temporary bill and do a short-term debt limit rise and essentially put it at whatever, weeks and use that to do it big negotiation. anything wrong with that? that doesn't seem like a radical suggestion, no? >> no and there lots of good suggestions out there. some of us feel that since the obama care or affordable care act programs are the greatest portion of growth in the budget. this is where -- it was to be an $863 billion program and now

it's $2.6 trillion on the cost estimates. what you have to do is put that in the mix. and address it before this program kicks off. the reason we are confident that this has to be a part of the overall picture is because what we saw with the test republic in my home state of tennessee, it quadrupled in cost over a five-year period of time and ended up being 35.3% of the state's budget. we cannot afford that. if you look at it -- >> i understand that, but i will stop you there. it doesn't explain why not fund the government now. we have fema workers being called in. not being paid. capitol police is a big example yesterday. what's wrong with just aicsi six-week? >> the open components, we would

prefer for the senate to work with us on this. we have given the senate a lot of options. >> but you are not funding the whole government. >> we are going to get components open and on a budget basis and move it back to the point that we have all of the services that are available and open and do it in a responsible way. >> why pick winners and losers. >> we are not picking winners and losers. >> doing these shots are doing just that. >> no, i would disagree with that. what we are doing is getting stewardship over the taxpayer dollar. the american people have long said that they want the auto control spending addressed. they want attention put on this and they are concerned about the debt and the long-term liabilities. we are saying you got to eventually put it on the table

and address these problems. i'm ready to go to work today and get it done. i hope my colleagues in the senate join me in that. >> they are playing my song and i have to go to break. >> thanks, chuck. >> thanks for your time. a lot more ahead. the economy and economic impact. we'll be right back. to angie's list for bringing us together. find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust.

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because of the shut down, the labor department is not releasing the monthly jobs number that normally would have come out today. the chief economist from moody's, i want to talk to you about the shut down, but the job fixtures we have -- >> nothing changed. we have 156,000 jobs in the month of september, roughly where we have been for the past

three years. i don't think it changed in september. >> economic impact of a government shut down. i know the cost to taxpayers is anywhere from 50 to 1$100 millin a day. with inflation you would assume that both the economic impact and one of the things that grow exponentially. >> it grows exponentially. it starts to add up. three or four weeks it's a weight on growth. the economy is growing slowly and you could say it stalls out. obviously the key is the debt limit that has the increase. >> normally i'm talking about the jobs picture at this point in time. we have the huge and big news on manufacturing. we hadn't seen this in quite sometime as far as the increase there. how quickly does this thing get turned upside down if the debt limit and shut down merge

together into one large crisis? >> i think if we briefed the debt limit everything will go down pretty fast. the government spending will be so significant in every part of the economy including manufacturing because defense is a key part of the recovery. financial markets will see a recession and there is no obvious response from policy makers. what good is that going to do? by definition they won't be doing anything. they have to raise the debt limit. the shut down of the government, after three or four weeks it becomes an issue. i don't think there is give on the debt limit. >> instant crisis. >> in my mind. it will be a complete deadline if we don't do that. >> i still wanted to check in with you even though i had no doubt. >> even though i didn't have the numbers to talk about. that's kind of you. >> see you next month because we have data. anyway.

take care. the gaggle is straight ahead on "the daily rundown." a special group to take us behind the scenes. the politics of capitol hill and later on, this is the week of the health care law getting into action. we will get the inside scoop on the co-ops. how to use them from one of the people who got them into health care law. the man who invented this idea. former north dakota senator tim conrad. which member of congress had a unit of measurement named after him. how many boehners is your height? is that what it is? probably not boehners. first person to tweet the answer will get the on air shout out. that's coming up on "the daily rundown." we will measure you in kanters.

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washington is not only blaming the other side, but other government workers. take a look at them confronting a park ranger at the world war ii memorial as if it's the ranger's fault. >> we are just the park service. we work at the site. >> how do you feel people who travel with their family, how do you lock at them and deny them access. >> it's difficult. i'm sorry sir. >> the park service should be ashamed of themselves. >> i am not ashamed. >> you should be. >> this woman is doing her job. i'm out of work. it's because the government wants to pass a budget. >> that man who confronted him to came to the defense of a park

ranger was furloughed and vice president bide earn weighed in. he called the park ranger to say he was proud of her. let's bring in the former democratic senator and the senior reporter for politico and strategist and top aid. sometimes you see an event and you are like what? i think everybody wants the honor flight and the open air memorials to go around and understand the concerns and you have visitors to a world war ii memorial and there is concern. they may not have the resources to help it get around. >> when you are in a shut down situation, everything gets examined. a congressman gets examined and the benefit. you say everyone sees it. i like randy, but he shouldn't

have said that. that was stupid. the fact is this is why they have to open up the government and get back on budget. the whole strategy is dumb. they shouldn't do it. they should figure out a way. i understand they are getting negotiations and we have to do that, but the shut down puts a lot of stress on all the members. >> what i don't understand here and every republican outside of the house republicans think that the idea is so clean. do it for weeks and in that period force a negotiation on the larger issues. i was talking in circles just now and mark blackburn said that's what we want, but we don't want to open up all the government. you found a lot of republicans outside of washington. >> the story today, i talked to this governor and long time gop and current senators and they are furious. i talked to a lot of them and they said obama was in a

two-year low with approval ratings. >> he was on the rope. >> on the rope and one person said we gave him a lifeline. instead of talking about the implementation of the affordable care act, they have been entirely on government shut down. there is real frustration that you had a real moment here and it's slipping away. of course when the government closed down, that's going to be the entire focus. >> many of you have been talking to boehner trying to keep moderates from splintering. he said that before in any debt limit will have to be a bipartisan vote. do you sense the movement out of here? >> not really. even with the talk about the possible grand bargain. the republicans are not talking about increasing taxes which is what the white house wants. >> there is going to be revenue

there. >> not grand. the democrats, i talked to patty murray about this yesterday. the budget chair woman. she said we are not even talking to paul ryan about a big deal. this has to happen definitely after the government reopens. all the talk that is happening right now seems like the republicans are unclear what exact lly they want from the fight. >> you are somebody who is uncomfortable with confrontational back and forth like this. if you can negotiate with the harry reid strategy in the white house. >> i am always uncomfortable when people are arguing like this without realizing the damage that's being done. there so many issues to be dealt with. closing down the government, shutting down the government an creating jobs or growing the

economy. the things that are on the mo d minds -- >> do democrats have to help boehner? >> everybody has to help everybody. these people have unfortunately found themselves on hating government. we can argue about the size and scope of government. i voted many times to reduce government, but just shutting it down and giving up, there is no end game. they have no end game. where are they going with it? >> the frustration, there is no end game. >> nobody knows what it is. does anybody have an end game? >> they launched on wednesday. go after cruz about what the end game is here. >> they will have to get to some way to get the negotiation and an agreement on the bigger budget. it sounds like that's what it

is. >> if you promise me the super committee -- >> you have the bigger budget problem that can lance the boil of this shut down. let's get something out of it. >> i'm going to disrupt our shut down talk for health care talk. the latest explainer we have in the health care law and later, what wendy davis is now in the texas governor's race. can she avoid being a one-issue candidate and give herself an actual chance to win? president obama canceled his travel plans. is it image or economics? you are watching "the daily rundown" only on msnbc. but bounty basic can handle them. in this lab demo one select-a-size sheet of bounty basic is 50% stronger than one full sheet of the leading bargain brand. bring it. bounty basic.

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now they are offered through health cooperatives are making a debut through the online exchanges alongside big name insurance exchanges. now how they stack up. first a little background on them. they are basically businesses run by consumers and in this case they provide health insurance for the credit unions. they are nonprofit and designed to provide affordable alternatives while in theory forcing the larger competitors to lower their rates. the co-ops were a compromised idea to replace the public option. a government insurance option debated in 2009 after the so-called public option, congress decided to start co-ops by including funds for low interest loans in the health care reform law. that worked great for two years until the up iffing was cutoff as compromise to reverse the fiscal cliff by january. everything is connected. at that point, 23 states have

taken advantage, taking clos to $2 billion of loans to set up the 23 plans. they are set up in arizona, colorado, connecticut, illinois, kentucky, maine, mississippi, new jersey, new mexico, oregon, south carolina, utah, and wisconsin. it covers both iowa and nebraska and oregon tried to start, but couldn't get it licensed. forcing the federal government to cancel last month. in terms of how co-ops affect prices, here's what's going on. they have a happened in exchanges and offers through a co-op and the average oft of a plan for a 55-year-old is $389. if states where the federal government is running the exchange and if there no co-ops, the same costs an average of $430. there is seemingly an impact. the man behind the idea of a health insurance co-op,

democratic senator ken conrad. that last point is what the hope is. the co-ops again, is credit union a fairway to describe it? >> we have hundreds of them in my home state of north dakota. farm plots. we have them at every variety. it works extremely well. it's really the motivation for this. i read the book tr reid wrote, the healing of america. he looked at systems that worked. what he found was universal coverage and at least the opportunity for universal coverage, but not government-run systems. private insurance. this not for profit model he found especially effective. that was the impetus for the co-op plan. you satisfied with what you have seen. some can't get started because of that. >> i was extremely disappointed what they did in the last

minutes of the negotiation on the last fiscal cliff where they cut $3 billion of loans that saved only 50 or $60 million. now, to somebody listening, how can it be they only saved 50 or $60 million? >> loans get paid back. >> the loans get paid back. >> it's amazing how loans and interest and all that works. it's an investment. >> i tell you, i am extremely disa pointed and they did other things to restrict and use the money for marketing. if you can't advertise in the modern world, how are you going to be effective? they have done a lot of things and opponents of co-ops and the competition they would provide to hurt them to really try to prevent them. >> they are worth the price and

that was the whole speed. they now have to provide the service. what i have here is if you were in the senate, you would be in the middle of all this business here. that's a long time budget committee chairman. you believe there is a way out. you probably heard congressman marshall blackburn. they don't believe there is a way out right now if health care is not tied with opening the government. >> look, of course there is a way out. the way out is to focus on what this really should have been about all along which is the long time fiscal circumstance. we are on an unsustainable course. this is the opportunity to help america get back on track. by additional revenue and lowering rates and broadening the base which is what every bipartisan group concluded. additional savings which are desperately needed because that's where we are for the long-term. the 800 pound gorilla.

>> you mean medicare? >> all of the health care. medicare is number one, but we have a big component and the military health care accounts also that node re230erform. >> clean cr and clean debt ceiling and forced six-week negotiations on tax reform to medicare and all of that. >> actually naming a commission for social security. >> an elected official and not outsiders? >> however the elected representatives want to fashion it is fine with me. what's sprnt that we start taking on these issues that threaten the economic security of our country. we can do it. we have done it before. i didn't serve on that. those on the extreme left and extreme right probably won't be supportive, but i believe people of good faith in the middle understand what's at stake for our country. >> you mid-westerners.

anyway, good to have you here. coming up, will it be another weekend of waiting or will we see a breakthrough? we will take a look at those. of course all of this is going to have an impact on 2014, the question is how. first it's the white house soup of the day. by the way, it's going to be a rerun. turkey chili. the white house confirms it will be turkey chili until the shut down is open. it's open, but has a limited menu until congress can pass a budget. we'll be right back. one more t, just for themselves. before the last grandchild. before the first grandchild. smile. before katie, debbie, kevin and brad... there was a connection that started it all and made the future the wonderful thing it turned out to be... at bank of america, we know we're not the center of your life, but we'll do our best to help you connect to what is.

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>> there is not going to be a gubernatorial race in the country that is not saying that line over and over. don't insert capitol city here. that was wendy davis throwing her hat into the texas governor's race. just this morning, "the daily rundown" supporting that davis will get the quick endorsement of the pro choice women's groups later today. they spent a lot of money down there. can she escape from being a one-issue candidate in texas? all that was and more on our website. trivia, the member of congress that had a unit of measurement named after him, jake garnot. they use the garnot scale to evaluate how astronauts feel. congratulations to the winner jake goodman. send us your suggestions at

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well, we love to use air force one as one of our bump shots there and it's grounded. president obama has cancelled his entire week-long trip to asia that was scheduled to start this weekend because of the government shutdown, but will his decision to stay state side help bring us closer to a deal? let's bring back the gaggle. senator lincoln, i will start with you. we've got -- it seems to me you've got the capitol police not getting paid and having to respond and then when they do, we're going to have more furloughs because of the sequester. then you've got the fema workers being called in. you've got, you know, a trip and, yes, people can say, oh, you know, that isn't a big deal. well, you know, china is going to be there going, hey look who's not here. and the united states has been trying to become a better rival

in southeast asia to china. stuff has an impact. >> it has a huge impact. and what's lacking is leadership. i mean we are -- we're supposed to be the leaders of the world economy. you're talking about diplomacy here that's getting put on the back burner. you're talking about the economy that's going to the back burner. we need leadership. we need people that are really going to focus in on the things that need to get done. i was visiting with some major business industries across the country, some of them international, and they're saying, you know, we were just beginning to see an uptick in europe and now all of a sudden they're watching us and what's going to happen. >> the cover of the economist, i don't know if i have time to put it up, but it was just wondering if the united states is ungovernable. i'm sorry, this whole grand bargain thing, i think the conservative grassroots are going to explode if this is the agreement that boehner does. and it's going to burn down the republican party. >> no matter what boehner does,

the conservatives are going to be furious. >> they're not going to be happy. any capitulation or -- it's going to look like surrender. >> and boehner knows he can't let -- he can't let the country default under his watch. he wants to get a deal, something to raise the debt ceiling. but the problem, he's got a lot of folks in his own conference who don't believe all the scare tactics -- the fear mongering from the white house. they don't think it will be as bad as the white house says. >> and they think the white house is going to blink. john, you sort of -- do you understand the white house's point of view here? they're going, you know what, we're not going to do this anymore. if they're going to go off the cliff, then drive off the cliff and see what happens. >> not really. i think the president has to show some leadership. >> that's code for he's got to help them out of their box? you think he'll have to help boehner out of his box? >> this was only the first blip. the fact of the matter is you have to do the debt limit. we have a budget crisis in this country. >> do we have a budget crisis? did you hear mitch mcconnell yesterday? he's making the case going, spending is down the last two

years, government spending down. what crisis? >> the debt ceiling is in october and it's not in july. >> what's the crisis? >> there's definitely a crisis with the republicans. >> they believe. >> and they control the chamber. it's important. you have to negotiate with the chamber. the fact of the matter, maybe obama should go travel. what they need is joe biden to cut the deal because harry reid can't hands it. >> what's the deal that gives john boehner cover? is it the medical device tax? is that what it is? >> what's the face-saving cover that gives boehner the opportunity to call a vote to both fund the government and also raise the debt ceiling? it seems like they're going -- >> i think that it's going to be pressure from within his own conference to put something clean on the floor. and -- >> so the interesting thing is these guys are not going home this weekend, which in a way may hurt their chances of getting a deal. if they go home, they'd be hearing from constituents. >> i keep waiting for senate

republicans, as the group, we know they're ticked off on this strategy. senate republicans, even in red states, have to -- need swing voters every now and then. we know the house guys don't. senate republicans know they need swing voters. they're going to be the ones to break, i think, if it breaks. >> and a lot of them used to be in the house. many of them were there with me in '95 when the government shut down. they know what's at stake and i think they're ready to work hard. >> here's the thing between '95 and '96. you had balanced budget, welfare reform, tax cuts. there's not the agenda that you had in '95 and '96 the republicans can get something out of. getting rid of obama care is not an option so they have to find something else to fight for. >> and what is that? >> keystone and probably some entitlement reform. >> the two big differences, you have a president not worried about re-election. that mattered. by the way, there isn't a conservative echo chamber that's making conservatives feel good right now, right? >> that's right. >> they're listening to fox and talk radio and social media and they're going, hey, we might win. >> and there's another thing too. harry reid, who does not want to

compromise as all will not give an inch o.j. this. >> shameless plugs. >> i wasn't ready for one, but -- >> who do they play this weekend? >> there's a great story in the paper from my colleagues about john boehner saying to his colleagues that he is in fact going to raise the debt ceiling. >> okay. >> well, i'll give them something to fight about and fight for and that should be sensible regulations and reg reform. when congress is inactive, it means our agencies are dealing with the law and we need reg reform. >> my colleague has a story in politico about how bad the relationship is between the four congressional leaders right now. >> particularly reid and boehner. >> they hate each other. >> and the chiefs of staff don't even like each other. >> worst ever. st. peter's catholic school on capitol hill, blou ribbon school from the department of education. congratulations to st. peter's school. >> that's it for this edition of "the daily rundown." what a week. we'll be back monday.

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