if you don't chew with your mouth closed, i'm going to take the nutri grain bar away. >> that dad. we're talking about viral videos that are probably awesome but not worth the time. anything has to do with dominos awesome. that's a guinness book of world records. we have three hours of "morning joe" starting right now. ♪ >> to have unanimous consent because i want to make a point in a minute. >> i would like permission to use scissors? [ laughter ] >> that's the best evidence yet that our congress functions at a kindergarten level. [ laughter ] >> actually what we should do is we should cut this credit card up. which is what i'm going to do because that's the way i vote.

i think it's time we quit borrowing money. time we quit borrowing money. [ laughter ] >> what are you doing? do you know how angry the giant whose credit card that is going to be? >> good morning. it is thursday, october 10th. welcome to "morning joe." with us on set we have the chairman of deutsche incorporated, donny deutsche and mike barnacle is here. we have msnbc contributor robert gibbs here with willie, joe and me. good morning. >> good morning. the cardinals make it through. >>leal adam wainwright is huge. >> talk about pirates.

tough. >> great story. >> we're albumed about pirates. but the cardinals, what an organization. >> where do you think gibbs got the table cloth? >> i don't know. i was wondering that myself. >> a little offseason but cute. >> man speaking of fastballs at your head. >> you know what? steps up first swing and pre-season, boom. >> let me tell you barnacle i'm taking fashion advice from a lot of people but one of them is not you. >> for the first time since 2008 the economy is not america's top concern. new gallup polling shows the government shutdown, the dysfunction in washington has become the number one concern of voters at 33% and while all sides are taking a hit in their approval hittings as a result, the damage to the republican brand is proving to be the worst. now only 28% of americans say they have a favorable view of the republican party.

that's the lowest number since this poll first began asking the question the 21 years ago. for senator ted cruz, though, there's nothing to worry about. he's good. according to the "washington examiner" in a closed door meeting with his republican colleagues cruz argued the shutdown has been good for the gop. pointing to his own internal polling. that same poll which senator cruz paid for shows republicans taking the lion's share of the blame for the shutdown but cruz says republicans are actually in a better position than they were than back in '95 because today's standoff is based on the fight over obama care not spending in general. >> yeah. i don't think anybody is believing that. he's put himself in an absolute horrible position now. he has his fingerprints all over it. you look at donny deutsche at

record loss for the republican party and gallup polling. it was pointed out democrats are only one point off their lowest since 1992, and an ap poll came out yesterday that appears to be an outlier that had the president in the high 30s. most averages have him around 44%. but this hurts absolutely everybody. >> hurts everybody. >> but the republicans especially. >> there was a fundraiser on long island last night for nassau county executive and he like his constituents are really, really worried come november if the republicans continue on this course because there will be a backlash where people will flip that switch, say what you want about obama, this is the republicans disaster. obviously it will tar him one way or the other, but it is -- people are just at the point -- you talk to people, just to point to where they are

repulsed. they are repulsed by what's happening and in my lifetime i have never been as fed up with government, with politicians, you just want to take a shower. it's disgusting. >> you really do. it's on both sides but the republicans are really bearing the lion's share of the blame right now and there's a column -- >> yes. >> a conservative guy for the "new york post." calls at any time republican party suicide. >> suicide of the right. some conservatives say they don't care about the gop what they care about are conservative ideas. they are right not to assign special glory or power to a political organization, but here's tconundrum. there is only one electoral vehicle for conservative

ideas -- but if you mostly clear up the engine, smash the windshield, put the wrong tires interest and pour antifreeze in the gas tank you're impeding its forward movement. you're not running it, not repairing it. it may not have been a very good vehicle in the first place and maybe you think it couldn't drive worse but oh, man could it ever. it's the only one you got. >> it's getting worse. you know, there is -- it's a tale of two parties, mike. you look at a guy like chris christie, he's ahead by 33 points. in a state that just a year ago barack obama won by 18 points. >> 66% approval rating. >> 66% approval rating. let's go through this real quick. the gop is suffering but republicans outside the capital, numbers tell a different story. new jersey is a state won by president obama by 18 points last year.

chris christie currently head of his democratic challenger by 33 points. overall christie enjoys a 66% approval rating in that blue state. let's look around to other governors. you can go to like ohio, a state that went blue in 2012, john kasich has a 54% approval rating. 52% approve his handling of the economy. new mexico a state that the president carried by 10 points. martinez has a 67% approval rating. mike barnacle this isn't about the republican party. these people, they do certain things. >> yeah. they run their governments. they operate their governments. >> they don't tell their bond holders they are going to buy bonds for their states, hey, you know what? we may default. no big deal about defaulting. in wisconsin, he's an ideologue.

our bond rating. we're getting fiscally responsible. >> those are just for you governors that we have up on the screen right now and the biggest difference between those four republican governors and the republicans, a specific portion of the republicans in the house of representatives in washington, d.c., those four people you see on the screen get up every day and tell their constituents that a, they can run their government and are running their government and b, those who are running they are running for something not against something. >> and they also work, willie, with democrats and scott walker's 48% that's higher by a point or two than barack obama in that same state. >> they have to. they have to get things done for their constituents. in washington they are wing political point. a year ago at this time the contrast was put in stark relief when you had chris christie

managing his state through superstorm sandy, president obama comes to the state and he's attacked by national republicans. chris christie is. he says what the hell your talking about? the president took care of us, i'm trying to help my state get through it. that to me was the contrast how dare you shake hands with a democrat. he said -- i'm saving my state. >> the entire state suffers. let me go to robert gibbs. rork robert, it's a tale of two parties. a lot of republicans controlling the governor's mansion. >> despite the gratuitous shot at my snazzy shirt -- look, it is hard for the american people to give the keys of government to republicans that have no desire to want government in any level to operate. you have republicans that are making it work in different

states. you got democrats that are making it work in different states. and as was said you have to work with the other party. you have to make progress. you can't get any of what you want if you won't take some rather than all and i think you've got -- i think that's why in 2016 while the base will be excited about people like rand paul and ted cruz, the eventual nominee comes from a state because it's just a much better laboratory for how they might run washington. >> it will be a, you know, chris christie or scott walker or mitch daniels. i'm wondering, you go back and it's said, clinton won in '92 and he was going to be a new democrat and more centrist democrat and going to bring washington together. that was eight years of political hell. then george w. bush came to washington. we heard all the stories about how great the guy worked with democrats in austin, texas and he was going to change all that.

he was going to be a uniter not a divider. that was eight years of political hell. then barack obama was the hope and change candidate. he heard the stories about how he worked with republicans in the state legislature. and here we are six years in and man, it's just as bad as the past, you know, two administrations. what is it about washington that breeds the dysfunction that even these presidents did not have in their past lives on the state level? >> well, i think part of it is endemic to this town. john boehner's message is let's negotiate. most people would think he's probably the least positioned to negotiate. i think, you know, the message tends to be the opposite of what the other guy is saying when that might not be the best thing to do. then add into that i think you

got, again, things like a much faster media cycle, things like twitter and the internet that have risen in many ways and add into that the political polarization. how many people come from safe seats that are, whose outcomes in their individual elections is so different than the national elections and which gives them on each side of the political spectrum no real incentive to work with the other party. i think all of that is a very toxic cocktail. >> i'll make a prediction. this is a huge punt for the republican party. >> this is a prediction to do with how many bracelet us wear around your hands? >> guys, whalts the over/under for that. >> these are from my children. >> how many children do you have. >> do you mock the children? you're mocking the children. >> we're mocking you. >> how many kids do you have. >> you have to show both of his

hands. >> hold up both hands. hold up both of them like this. >> i love joe. joe is a good person he helps the children of nantucket. but when you mock my bracelet, you mock the future of america, today's youth. this is actually the best thing to ever happen to the republican party because they are bottoming out. i think it's the people, you feel the people of this country and this is a moment in time where the emperor's clothes have come off. this disgusting bottoming out is actually the opportunity for the republican party to redefine itself for really what conservatism is. these guys are masquerading as conservatives. and they aren't. you'll see a backlash that will

help the republican party. >> here's where we are now. later today president obama will host a handful of republican lawmakers in the white house to find a solution to re-open the government. the president invited all 232 house republicans to the meeting. however, house speaker john boehner decided to send just a handful of party leaders and committee chairmen. jay carney responded to boehner's decision saying in part president obama is disappointed that speaker boehner is preventing his members from coming to the white house and that the president thought it was important to talk directly with the members who forced this economic crisis on the country. any hope for a break through appears to be focused on a short term deal to increase the debt limit. what do you think is going on there strategy wise? there must have been one there. >> there are a lot of guys that i wouldn't let go over to the white house to get in front of the microphone, right, mike? i can name a few but i'm not

going to. no you don't want them in front of the white house, in front microphone stuff talking about their tin foil hats and the messages that they are picking up from the planet klatu. >> robert, you're more familiar with the intricate lay out of the white house. do they have a large rubber room in the white house if all those members are going to come down? >> they are in the basement. >> as joe just kpresd boehner has an issue here. he cannot allow, really some of the really crazy republicans to have their moment, their second in the sun at the white house and then emerge on to the lawn and basically saying well -- i looked at my mastercard statement and i don't care about the deficit. the debt ceiling. >> stuff will happen. >> if that's the case it certainly shows the strength of their message going into a meeting like this if they are afraid someone might walk out of

the white house and say what their message is. this isn't just an appearance problem it's a strategic problem. i think there's a whole level of these things that doesn't make a lot of sense. and, again, i think you see it -- look not just in the brand numbers of each of the parties, but, i mean, what is stunning is if the function of the government or the dysfunction of government really becomes a voting issue the dynamics of the most recent or most upcoming elections in 2014 might be much, much more fascinating than we previously would have thought because, again, i think that real estate of congressional districts has locked in the results for a lot of them save something big and if the dysfunction in government becomes what is big that becomes a real, real wild card next year. >> we have these reports this morning that house republicans are considering a deal that would involve an extension of the debt ceiling, a short term extension of the debt ceiling

for a couple of weeks. what i don't understand what do we think we'll happen if we kick the can down in a few weeks. the president will not negotiate on obama care. that's settled. he settled in on that. the idea we'll have a grand bargain in a couple of weeks extension is not realistic. >> i had a conservative friend ask me why i wanted a short term clean cr. i said to reset the debate for republicans. reset it. nobody is listening to ted cruz any more, by the way. nobody is listening to ted cruz on shutting down the government for obama care. nobody is talking about it any more. ted cruz has lost. so, okay, let's give it two weeks, three weeks, four weeks, clean cr and then make it about what republicans actually fight about, saving the entitlement system, paying down the long term debt, like paul ryan's piece, tax reform that actually

encourages economic growth and creates new jobs. that is a debate that we can have on a level playing field not telling the president that he's got to get rid of, you know, his signature program. >> but the president has said he's not going to allow republicans to use the debt ceiling as a bargaining chip as a point of leverage so why would he -- >> i think -- the president himself is saying let's extend it and then we'll have time while we're negotiating about it. listen, i think the president would love a grand bargain. right now he's facing into the abyss, historical abyss of being a president of the most dysfunctional washington in modern american times. this president and paul ryan if they can come together with a grand bargain i think it's good for everybody. >> i had someone who has a fairly high function in the white house tell me the other day that they were surprised the president at his press conference when he was clearly speaking without notes, when he

indicated that past the debt ceiling thing then we can talk. he was not reading from notes or off the teleprompters, pass the debt ceiling. but they were surprised, a couple of people in the white house were surprised john boehner didn't come in the next day and drop exactly that right in the hopper, okay, we'll get a month long extension on the debt ceiling, now you say you want to talk let's talk. >> you guys see this. >> two more stories to get to. wait. got the wrong side. >> joe girardi. such a huge story in new york, donny about this cop that allowed the motorists to be beaten up by the motorcycle gang. >> it's disgusting. 99.9% of cops are great and when this happens unfortunately -- >> very embarrassing. >> sullies police every where. disgusting story. >> my gosh. we're following that. remember we had the mayor on

earlier this week and he wasn't commenting. they clearly were trying to pinpoint what happened. there's about a week until the special election, debate for u.s. senate seat in new jersey happened last night. got kind of heated. republican candidate called new york a big black hole for state taxpayer's money. >> what did cory booker tweet back. >> cory booker served as that city's mayor. they grew heated over more than once. >> shootings in newark are down 27%. critical issues are not solved with like background checks which my point poses. he's getting support from the nra who is dropping money into his campaign. >> cory booker about a month ago, 14-year-old ally henderson

was shot to death in newark. he was on the jimmy fallon show telling people what a great job he's doing. ten people end ten days while my opponent was running around hollywood promoting himself. >> we have the pull back of e.r.a. let the fracking go on. >> you may not be able to swim in that river but it's because of all the bodies floating around from shooting victims in your city. the fact is -- >> oh, my god. we have a government in shutdown, really being shutdown because of tea party extremists in washington that are stopping our government. now my point is the leader of the tea party here in new jersey. he's somebody that has said i support the shutdown. >> people across the united states of america donate every time you say tea party. keep it up so we can offset the million dollars you're getting

from michael bloomberg. we advocate for lower taxes. you would be a charter member. >> wow. that's some tough stuff. i'll tell you when, willie geist. this race is about to change. we got somebody coming in to campaign against cory booker. >> governor sarah palin. coming in this weekend. >> okay. >> that's going to work in new jersey state. >> i bet she's big in jersey. >> in some parts she is. >> think she is. >> i'll have sara ferguson come before sarah palin. >> fergie? >> fergie. >> i want to apologize. i want to apologize for the children.

>> of nantucket. >> across the country. you're a great dad. i know this was a slip of the tongue. >> can i ask you something? like do women look at that and think that makes you more sensitive. >> yes. finally. finally. >> that and little puppy dogs. >> when i'm walking in central park with my two white labs, pushing my go daughters in their strollers -- >> do your children know they are props for like a pick up game? >> by the way, it's not written down, but for everyone we meet there's a trip to fao schwartz. everyone wins. >> so the girls do know that women -- >> fao schwartz. >> the nanny takes the kids to fao schwartz. donny goes back to his house so the kids are child actors. >> like the olson twins. >> they are well paid. >> oh, my lord.

coming up on "morning joe" -- i'm just going to punch him -- the ranging democratic head of the house, chris van hollen. we'll talk to author and harvard professor, niall ferguson and willie garcon will be here. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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27 past the hour. time now to take a look at the morning papers. the tampa bay times, florida's longest serving congressman bill young says he'll not seek re-election in 2014. young says he'll retire when his term ends to toend his health and spend for time with his family. the 82-year-old expressed his frustration with the government shutdown.

he served 42 years in the u.s. congress. >> he slalso is a mentor of min. a great representative. bill young was actually the minority leader in the florida senate and whenever he called a caucus, you know, we would meet wherever he was because he was the only member of the republican party in the florida senate. a great man. >> 42 years serving. designee also protected me from the leadership. >> there's that. >> every time they got angry with me he said stay away from joe. >> from the "new york post," a street performer will be going to prison. dan sandler pled guilty to blackmail the girl scouts ever trying to spread rumors about spreading sex between men and young girls. he was also arrested at anti-semitic comments to

tourists. a 9-year-old boy who flew to vegas without a boarding pass broke his silence. the father tearfully expressed his concern for his son describing him as hard to control. >> i'm a parent. i'm not perfect. we assumed that he was at a friend's house. we had no idea where he was. identify been asking for help. no one is helping me. i'm in double jeopardy. if i whoop my son i get locked up. if i let my son keep on doing what he's doing i get in trouble. somebody please help me. please. >> wow. the "usa today" for the first time, first two weeks of november mcdonald's will give out books to replace it's iconic happy meal toys. all the kids said blah. this comes as mcdonald's to reinvent the happy meal which

has been criticized for marketing unhealthy food by nay sayers. it will feature fruit and veggies and no longer come with sugary drinks. >> there's nothing happy about that. you get a book instead of toy. you don't get sugary drinks. you don't get french fries. >> you should get some satisfries. "the washington post" a man from south carolina took it upon himself to clean up the grounds around the lincoln memorial. with a rake, lawn mower and a south carolina state flag in tow chris cox has been in the capital for days now cleaning up. cox says i'm not here to point fingers, i only want to inspire people to come out and make a difference. >> got to be careful. they may arrest him. >> flir"first look" at times

magazine," bloomberg unbound." let's go willie for "the politico" playbook. >> the executive director the jim. we were hoping to see his son james. >> i'm the sub today. >> go ahead. >> come bearing goodish news. i always feel like i have downer news usually from washington. i now believe we're going to have a deal. i think within days to avoid the debt limit crisis and potentially to even reopen the government. and the reason -- there isn't any formal announcement coming out but almost every sign now is moving towards a compromise. you have the president open to a short term deal. you have paul ryan who has a lot of sway among house republicans talking to a lot of conservatives about a deal that would give us at least a short term increase in the dict less mitt in exchange for talks about entitlement reform.

you have most conservatives now saying they might warm to the idea that ryan is talk about. so only the far, far right would be opposed to that. there's enough votes to get that done. you got mitch mcconnell getting involved in the negotiations. he had been on the sidelines. he's talking about a deal similar to what paul ryan is talking about. you have business. community over the last 24 hours going public with their concerns and their warnings to republicans about the consequence on contributions, the consequences on some of these house races. i think all of those factors are going to lead to a deal and a deal relatively soon at least on the debt limit. the big question will be, it's going to be a short term deal which to me is always very unsatisfying because you know there's not enough time to get the grand bargain they talked about but at least it would avoid the debt limit crisis, it might get the government up and running again and give us the possibility of talks that, who know, once you get in a room maybe something can happen.

>> repeal delay, and the short term we're talk being about entitlement reform. help me understand why president obama would go back and look at entitlements in a way he hasn't in the past. >> well, be clear for the president he's been saying happy to look at entitlements and other issues as long as it's not part of the deal, he's not going to say we're only going raise the debt limit. if you pass the debt limit increases in you pass the cr he's happy to have those conversations. having those conversation and getting a deal is tough. the president's own budget has lots of mechanisms on social security and medicare for some some small entitlement changes. the problem is he always wants corresponding tax increases and it's hard for me to see republicans stomaching any kind of tax increase to get a entitlement deal after they do a full surrender on health care. they might get a tiny provision but ted cruz position of the

world is a dead end position most republicans now know it. >> how short term a deal are we talking here? >> i think short. anywhere from four to six weeks. they might make it contingent how big of a grand bargain are they talk about. the bigger the talks the longer the deal will go. it will be short. we'll avoid drama in the moment but face drama within weeks. >> the grand bargain is back. thanks, jim. >> see you later. >> the cardinals headed to the nlcs riding the great arm of adam wainwright. we'll show you the highlights and the post-game pep talk. sports is next. hey, we got our cards, honey!

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. time for some playoff baseball. the pirates, the darling of the season and the cardinals in an winner take all game, david freese and matt adams has two home runs. the story of the game is that man, adam wainwright went the distance pitching a complete game eight hits striking out six.

wainwright gets pedro alvarez swinging for final out of the game. that sends the cardinals to their third consecutive nl championship series after a 6-1 victory. >> i trust you all, i believe in you, let's bring it home, guys. need the sky goggles. adam wainwright talking to the team after the game. big huge game tonight game five, tigers in detroit against the a's, verlander in oakland, the rookie from vanderbilt going in the biggest game of his life. >> rookie pitchers pitching in the playoffs. >> alvarez is from vanderbilt. >> four more years for joe

girardi. the team agreed to a four year, $16 million deal. that makes him the second highest paid manager. if he serves out the entire contract we'll manage the yankees for ten total years. put that together with joe torre that's incredible stability for a team that used to go few managers like three in a season. >> you can make a strong case for joe girardi of being manager of the year. girardi's job this years keeping that club in contention with all of the extraneou issues. >> next year will be a different story. did you hear the story about mike ditka talking about his biggest regret. former nfl player, mike ditka

telling the dick kinson press his biggest mistake was not running against barack obama in 2004 to represent the state of illinois in the senate. not that i would have won but i problem would have and he wouldn't be in the white house. >> mike ditka changing the course of history. >> mike ditka said he should have tied into the 2004 -- >> his running mate. . >> coming up next, harold ford jr. is in the building. >> ladies and gentlemen -- >> from the great state of tennessee.

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44 past the hour. it's dark in washington but the lights are on in the white house. welcome back to "morning joe." >> great metaphor. that was a nice metaphor, dark in washington. >> here with us now, msnbc political analyst and visiting professor at nyu, former democratic congressman harold ford jr. harold, good to have you. and gibbs with us with the table cloth. >> i like the shirt. >> thank you, willie. >> just want to read joe's political piece which backs up some of the polls we were talking about earlier today and this is about the governors who are getting stuff done. unlike d.c. republicans conservative leaders like walker, christie and kasich have succeed by creating budgets and working with democrats. they are the future leaders of

the republican party instead of those d.c. creatures who are leading them down a rat hole. it's time for the party of reagan to focus on creating jobs and tackling the debt. paul ryan, donny, made an attempt yesterday to put out a way to cut deal, save face and maybe actually do something that backs up the conservative cause and it just fell flat it seems. >> yeah. there is, as i said a few moments ago. you're starting to see cracks within the republican party. there will be a deal. i think that the 50 or 60 folks on the republican side will be left alone and eventually will pay a price for this. i think they are starting to understand there's an unraveling that's happening that can't happen. >> every time you think that will happen they double down and

triple down. so i don't know where this ends. harold? >> i think it's been said here already the pivot from health care, there's no doubt boehner understands from what of his friends in the main street business community, wall street business communities traveling down this path fast without a plan as they have done in the past could have ramifications that would be hard to put back in the bottle meaning the economic consequences. they are beginning found. they will work right up to the very end, tuesday, wednesday of next week. we'll get some sort of temporary push off of the debt ceiling while they work on some kind of small term grand bargain that's where they are headed. >> every republican thinking about still standing behind these 50 or 60 i die oats, if the debt ceiling isn't resolved

their net worth will be cut somewhere between 20% and 50%. if they understand that. >> their constituents will suffer. >> in terms of what they will do. >> their voters. >> this next one is pretty emotional. we should ask gibbs or someone why this message hasn't been sent but this is in "the washington post." obama care saved my family from financial ruin. house speaker john boehner said his tea party friends shut down the u.s. government because of people like me. i'm the mother of an insurance hog. someone who could have blown through his lifetime of health coverage by the time he was 14. my son managed to. >> i've despite insurmountable challenges and wears his pre-existing conditions like a super bowl ring having lived in hospitals with my son mason for months. i've seen bad things, accidents, freak illnesses happen to smart, cautious and otherwise undeserving people. it's one thing we all have in

common. we are fragile being, so what is wrong with allowing to us purchase a financial safety net? what's so unamerican about that? if i could get john boehner and ted cruz on a conference call, i would explain this to them. i would tell them that while they were busy trying to derail the affordable care act over the past two years, mason has again learned to walk, talk, eat and shoot a three-point basket. >> it's obviously, robert, a moving op-ed. republicans have their argument from a business point of view. against obama care. but tinting thing sthin debate we're having right now, we're not talking about the affordable care act or obama care. it began that way. now it's about deficit reduction. jim reported we could have a short term deal. do you really believe in the space of four to six weeks there's suddenly going to be this grand bargain that we've never been able to get to before? >> no. look i agree with you, willie.

if we were serious about wanting the space to do a bigger deal, the likes of which could be there if you really got people into at that room but for a longer period of time, do this for six months. give themselves the space to do this. nobody thinks we're going to other than have a do over for be republican messaging that we're going to somehow solve this in four weeks given where we are right now. push this off six months. give everybody the space to come and have a smart conversation and make sure people like that, like jeanine's op-ed are part of that conversation. there's no lifetime cap limiteds on insurance. somebody with a pre-existing condition can get coverage. i think this is one of the reasons why it's not about health care any more. >> can i ask one quick question. when the deal worked, the sequestration came about and came about because the democrats and republicans couldn't agree

on a long term deal, could they come up with something like that that could force them to act? have some hole around this thing. >> i just think you got to give these guys some space and i think, you know, assuming that you can get something done in three weeks i think will be exceedingly difficult. i think for our economy let's give ourselves six months, move the debt limit six month, let's not go through this again right before christmas when retailers want people to have consumer confidence. >> harold stay with us. we'll be right back with more "morning joe". i love having a free checked bag

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boids. don't antagonize me. it's not safe four in this zoo. don't think i'm not from chicago for one second. >> dude, that guy is crazy. >> what happened? >> his tweets are crazy. man, he's crazy. >> that was him with jimmy kimmel last night. kimmel did this spoof where he had kids acting out an interview that kanye did where he said he was the number one rock star in the world. kanye went crazy. there was no bit. jimmie sitting there listening to kanye. >> how did it end? >> it went on like that for a while. jimmy just smiled. >> kanye very talented guy. i never really focused on kanye, the dude. is he as crazy, has he always been this crazy. >> he's a different cat.

very weird genius creative in his own world kind of guy. >> he needs somebody around him to get him away from tweets and tv shows. >> it's working out just fine for him. everything he does goes to number one. >> coming up next -- >> a lot actually. >> oh, my god. >> where we come from we say bless his heart. >> that's right. >> bless his heart. and yours too, donny. thank god nbc's andrea mitchell joins the conversation. a huge stipulate. plus author and history professor, niall ferguson's book look at how institutions decay and economies die. hopefully he's not talking about the united states. >> i think he's talking about paul krugman. >> he joins us next.

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obama actually healed another hour long press conference to say once again he won't negotiate. so speaker john boehner had his own press conference. >> the central argument is this, are we going sit down and have a conversation or aren't we. there's no reason to make it more difficult to bring people to the table. there's no boundaries here. there's nothing on table, nothing off the table. >> that is a leader with a clear goal. i want a table. [ laughter ] >> willie, it's time.

>> closed day ten. we went to george lucas and we said we know you've done some good stuff in the past. >> impactful. >> we'll do something special. the holograms -- >> pointers that have lasers come out. >> look what we got. day ten. >> he's always in the next place. >> this, i guarantee you, a decade from now we'll be talking about it -- >> welcome back to "morning joe." harold ford jr. is still with us. robert gibbs in washington. and joining us, niall ferguson who is the author of "the great degeneration." >> niall has written a few articles about paul krugman.

kind of tough. we'll talk about those in a little bit. >> in fairness to niall they are not tough. >> her honest. >> quoting some facts. >> but niall leaves some things hanging so you can look at them. >> the way you want to interpret it. >> like the title of his book. >> so, let's talk first about the news. >> sure. later today president obama is going to talk to a handful of republicans at the white house in an effort to find a solution to thamblgs a maybe a solution that would reopen the government and avoid a default. the president invited all 232 house republicans to the meet, however house speaker john boehner decided just to send a handful of party leaders and some committee chairman. white house press secretary -- >> i think it might be best. >> it might be. >> you don't want guys going out there saying some crazy stuff. >> jay carney respond boehner's

decision saying in part president obama is disappointed that speaker boehner is preventing his members from coming to the white house. and that the president thought it was important to talk directly with the members who forced this economic crisis on the country. any hope for a break through now appears to be focused a short term deal to increase the debt limit. >> so, niall, where do we stand? what's your view of what's going on in washington? >> well, on the beltway, from the vantage point of a historian, the idea of a default of the united states on its debt is seriously being discussed on shows like this. that's not healthy. it's already causing significant financial -- >> you disagree with the extremes that are saying default no problem at all, we got enough money. >> that's crazy talk. what worries me is both sides are in really uncompromising positions now. it's a little bit like game of russian roulette except it's

being played next to a fuel dump and politicians are underestimating how much of a risk they are take. it's not just the "tea party" or speaker boehner. the white house has been unyielding. this illustrates the point i made. this president has been very disconnected from the legislature. he's not been good at getting his own party to do his bidding. he doesn't interact with legislators very much. one last point i think paul ryan made a reasonable suggestion. that's not uncompromising. >> do you think republicans will rally around -- i pay paul's suggestion is a good one. he's facing some incoming from his own party. >> but i think it seems like the ration enamel thing for them to do. doesn't mean they will do it. >> "the washington post" came out endorsing it. again this allow as reset. the ted cruz strategy, which everybody but ted cruz now agrees is a failed strategy, can be washed aside.

they can embrace paul ryan. which you and i have talked about before, that's where the money is, you got save entitlement, you got to save social security, you got to save medicare and medicaid and if they get a grand bargain that gets us 10% of the way there is an important step. >> one of the arguments i had with mr. krugman was the congressional budget office's long term budget forecast which could take our debt up towards 190% of gdp in 25 years time. we need address entitlements. this is a step in that direction. >> by the way the congressional budget office is saying if there's a default regardless of why some of these people while being restrained could thread a recession and in as little as two months. a deep recession. >> they argue how bad it could be and some say that's north that point that's not tissue. we're talking about ted cruz.

he's convinced still at this point that he is 100% right. >> what worries me slightly is the president may be convince this is the way he can destroy the republican party by pinning a default on the default recession on them and that's what some democratic strategists are thinking. >> niall, i think the republican party is doing a good job of that themselves. >> both sides are playing a high stakes game. >> i disagree with you. >> hope you're right. >> i disagree. i think this president and a lot of democrats think that they need to destroy a lot of these people in the republican party so they can win in 2014 and the president can get his agenda through his last two years. please, we are talking about washington, d.c. here. these are not saints on either side. >> yeah. >> everybody wants to win. democrats can hurt republicans,

republicans hurt democrats. the question i have is if republicans believe that ryan's ideas and i happen to think there's some room for real agreement there, why can't they rally around him. if they arrive at the white house with this meet, accept this as our starting point, you give use you want to go let's gate deal done. >> robert you want to jump in here. >> he just blurted it out. >> the word delusional. >> you quoting paul krugman? that's one much his favorite words. table cloth and delusional coming from it. >> the notion -- i think the notion -- somebody said ratio l rationali rationality. nobody is destroying the republican party but the republican party. they've taken this foolish decision on first to try to defund obama care, now they are trying to default, they think they are running around saying

default isn't default. this notion that somehow the president is trying to destroy the republican party, you know, you have rational actors and irrational actors. the irrational actors are running the republican party. they are running it. they are not -- the president isn't destroying it, the republicans are destroying the republican party. >> niall? >> don't defend the tea party. i think this has been very dangerous the way they plated. but we can't just ignore the fact that this president has been so disengaged that he can't discipline his own party. remember it's not that the republicans have defeated larry summers nomination that was the democrats. so party discipline has broken down on both sides. i think that has to lie in some measure or at the feet of the president. we can't blame it all on ted cruz. that's too simple. >> so you think if democrats were more unified we would have a solution to this? >> no. i'm trying to make a point

there's a break down of party discipline on both sides and that has to be the responsibility of the president in some measure. >> don't think there's a break down in party discipline. >> there's a break down much party discipline if a freshman senator can call the shots. >> we're not talking about the nomination -- you somehow believe if we all had these guys over for tea they will agree with everybody else's ideas and i think that's wildly naive. >> the president has invited republicans to the white house many times and i believe speaker boehner has not accepted the invitation. >> we'll see if the president accepts the paul ryan initiative. >> the economy is actually not the top concern according to new gallup polling which shows the government shutdown, dysfunction in washington has become the number one concern of voters at

33%. while all sides are taking a hit, the damage to the republican brand is proving to be the worst. now only 28% of americans say they have a favorable view of the republican party. that's the lowest number for this poll since gallup first began asking the question 21 years ago. but for senator ted cruz, niall, there's nothing to worry about he says. according to the "washington examiner" in a closed door meeting with his republican colleagues cruz argued the shutdown has been good to the gop pointing to his own internal polling. >> the internal polling shows the republicans taking the lion's share of the blame. it makes no sense. 48% versus 51% blames be republicans. >> cruz paid for this polling. >> sees so irrelevant. the republicans have turned against this defund obama care

strategy that by the way republicans most smart republicans said was a disastrous move in the first place. >> they turned against it? >> yes they've turned against it. you don't hear people going out saying we're -- you hear ted cruz saying that but you sure don't hear john boehner or anybody else say that. that's failed. ted cruz has been exposed. >> i got to say this really quickly. it was pointed out the democrats polling numbers are only one point higher than their all time low. it's hurting everybody. let's go harold and then you. >> tinting thing for me if republicans had started with ryan's position from the outset how different would this conversation be. we would be closer to a resolution. put aside party standing and what public opinion is. we could have avoid a calamity. i want to hear from niall how this could affect international

markets. if ryan led where would republicans be today? >> we would be in great shape. robert gibbs the president would have been far more open to a discussion on entitlement reform and tax reform because he's talked about entitlement reform and tax reform for the past five, six years. "the washington post" is seeing this as a hopeful sign. nobody is saying he needs to adopt what paul ryan is saying but that's far more reasonable than saying you got to get rid of your marked piece of legislation which everybody knows he won't do. >> the biggest hope we can have here is give these guys some space. again, i said this earlier. i think that in two weeks we can get this done or four weeks. we should move this deadline on the debt ceiling months if not, you know, six months down the road and give these guys some space. what concerns me is a number that was tucked inside the ap poll that showed that people

that identify as tea party republicans only 15% of those when they were asked how do you get out of this mess would, 15% supported compromising with the president as part of that solution, and while other republicans had a much higher number in terms of compromising with the president and i wonder, quite frankly, if there will be enough space in the republican party to come up with that solution. >> so, robert, you brought up the ap poll. we have it this morning, thought it might be an outlier that ap poll says the president has a 37% approval rating. should the white house be concerned >> look. white house has always been and i think they should have always been understanding nobody is going to come out of government dysfunction completely unharmed. i certainly don't think they did. and i don't -- my guess is republicans in their meetings never thought the damage created thus far for their brand would be as deep as it is. i think again the best thing we can do and the best thing

washington can do is just take these deadlines away for a longer period of time, and then let's have that conversation, let's have that talking. if we do that we're much more likely to come to a place of some agreement. again, i think if we just move the deadline to a week before christmas we're just going to be having this discussion two weeks before christmas and thinking how we'll move the deadline to sometime to the mid. february. >> another number in that ap poll 5% approval rating for kong. >> is that good? >> 5%. >> that good? >> i don't think we should be surprised when you have private charity, think about, having to is in the and flail of government should be playing in providing death benefits to families of fallen soldiers. we had four bodies returned to dover air force base yesterday. and a private charity, the fisher house foundation had to step in because the government couldn't do its job to take care of families of people we asked to go in and defend the country.

andrea mitchell broke the story. she will be with us in a second. it's disgusting. >> it's absolutely pathetic. niall ferguson, you have written a series of columns going against your dear friend and mine, paul krugman. explain. >> more in sorrow than earning. paul krugman plays "hardball." he uses harsh language. >> he says -- he uses thermometers every time he starts losing a debate. i should know. >> interestingly you've been on the other side. so have i. he throws these words about on the basis what? a claim he's always been right. called everything right throughout financial upheavals of the last five years. >> what's wrong? >> this is the key point. one if you look at his journalismism, i'm a historian,

the documents show he completely failed to anticipate the nature of the financial crisis. >> april of 2010, the world is in danger. >> 20 separate statements from eurozone breakup. it's amazing, it's still intact. here are two clear predictions one was the housing boom would lead to a dollar crisis. wrong. that's not what happened. one thing that didn't happen -- >> he got angry when i quoted him saying that the dot-com boom and that bubble need to be replaced by a housing bubble. he doesn't like when you actually throw his words back at him. in fact, he accused me of attacking -- >> i didn't criticize him. i quoted his book that he wrote in 1996. i agreed with a lot of his stuff. i agreed entitlements are in grave danger and then he didn't

feel compelled to say that was an attack. >> i agree he's an amazing intellectual victory over himself. his possession on the federal debt is on 80 degrees from what it was back ten years ago when he was warning of a fiscal train wreck. designee said we could not afford a iraq because of the fiscal crisis. he said we couldn't afford any more tax cuts because of our huge debt and suddenly we have no problem with huge debt. >> twice the size in relation to gdp. >> it was about $6 trillion. now it's $16.7 trillion and it's not a problem. when it was george w. bush it was a grave crisis. >> krugman's key claims we should have done a much bigger stimulus lurks three times of the size we did in 2009 and no

down side troirisk to the credi worthiness of the united states. it's based on his models. these are economic models. these models were so -- these models -- >> knees harold. >> i'm sorry. these models fail to predict the financial crisis. they were wrong about that. i showed that in my "huffington post" article. >> the third of the third part series on krugtron the invincible. you got to read that. designee called himself that. >> he glories. it's the hubris. in public exchange, in public discussion there needs be humility, honesty and civility. that's all. that's what he lacks. there's no accountability.

nobody edits that blog in the "new york times" and it's time somebody call him out. people are afraid of him. >> i won't tell you which pub ed tore but one of the pub ed tors of the "new york times" told me off the record after my debate their biggest nightmare was his column every week. >> they should do something about it. >> humility, honesty and civility in this next story doesn't exist on both side because both sides are blaming each other for this. joining us now from washington, nbc chief foreign affairs correspond and host of "andrea mitchell reports," andrea mitchell you have an update of suspension of death benefits for families of those that lost their lives in combat. >> you know, mika and joe when we first report this on tuesday there was a lot of outrage. how could the u.s. government not pay emergency death benefits to families of men and women who died serving our country. today it's clear despite all the public outrage in the past few

days in washington and congress, people there knew this would happen even before the government shutdown. for days now we've heard the outrage on capitol hill. >> it's disgraceful that they are withholding these benefits. >> now they are being denied death benefits because of this senseless shutdown. >> i'm ashamed. i'm embarrassed. >> lawmakers complaining families of fallen u.s. service members are not getting emergency death benefits because of the government shutdown. the outrage spread to the white house. wednesday president obama told doreen gentzler of nbc's wrc. >> when i heard this story i told the. department of defense we should able to get that fixed. >> at a press conference in late september several days before the shutdown the pentagon warned this would happen. >> we would be required to do some other pad things to our people. we couldn't immediately pay death gratuities. >> wednesday as the remains of

four service members killed in afghanistan last weekend arrived at dover air force base, the house unanimously pass ad bill that would have restored the emergency benefits for families. >> how dare we not provide these grieving families with the necessary support in their time of need. >> but the senate refused to consider the measure. late wednesday the white house and justice department scrambled to find a fix. >> that's how i think veterans feel they are stuck in the middle of this political debate. whether it be death benefits, whether it be va comp and pension. >> ken fisher who heads a private organization for veterans and their families stepped into the pay the benefits after seeing our report on "today." >> they're grieving. they suffered enough. why on earth should they have to worry about where their next dollar is coming from. >> also stepping up, jefferson's restaurant in bellville, illinois which post ad message on facebook offering to donate 100% of their profits wednesday to families of the fallen.

>> maybe if one person does it 100 more will do it and we'll help more people out. >> the pentagon will reimburse the phish house charity once the shutdown is over and today the special operation warrior foundation will present $20,000 to each family of the troops killed in afghanistan this past weekend. another warning from the head of the veterans department, the secretary said if this goes very much longer by november 1st hundreds of thousands of veterans will lose $6 billion in their benefits because their workers have been furloughed at the va. >> what a terrible situation. you've been in washington for quite a while. have you ever seen think it bad the? >> the politic ace rointd. >> never. >> unbelievable. >> and in the past there was always a middle ground, always a negotiation at andrews air force base or some place where you

some budget officials and there was an argument over dollars. this is not an argument over dollars. i can't figure it out. it is the seinfeld shutdown. shutdown over nothing. >> andrea mitchell thank you. we'll see you at 1:00. niall ferguson thank your as well. >> good luck out there on twitter. >> robert gibbs, thank you as well. >> robert, have a nice lunch. >> thank you, robert. we really appreciate it. >> thank you very much. up next congressman chris van hollen reacts to suggestions from corners of capitol hill that the u.s. may not be facing default after all? we'll be right back. you're matching "morning joe".

it is pouring in d.c. look at that. 27 minutes past the hour. welcome back to "morning joe." here with us now from washington, democratic representative from maryland and ranking member of the house budget committee congressman chris van hollen. >> congressman, thanks for being with us. we just had niall ferguson on. you might disagree with niall on several things president but eblgs like i believe a default is a default and that's not good for the united states of america. break it down for us. what happens if america defaults on its debt obligations? >> right. well,o joe, as you know, nobody knows what will happen because our country has never defaulted. so, the risks are very, very high. and you hear that from across the, you know, economic community. what happens, first of all, is that if the united states doesn't going pay its bills and

i mean any of its bills, you do begin to undermine the full faith and credit of the united states. specifically what begins to happen is that the treasury can no longer meet its payments and that means, you know, folks on social security or folks providing medicare service or our troops in the field don't get paid. and ultimately you put the whole full faith and credit of the united states in jeopardy. that means that interest rates go up. people's 401(k)s and other investments get slammed. it is a very, very toxic mix which is exactly why we never allowed this to happen before. >> so, there are those that are denying that this could happen, or saying that it won't be as bad. >> who are those people that are saying it won't be bad? give me five names. five names. >> we showed it yesterday. and there are a few guys that i know well and respect -- >> don't think that's the issue. >> i'm very surprised.

>> there's not one business leader that does not understand -- >> i don't think i want to find out. >> the koch brothers have come out and said hey guys, stop. we're conservatives. we are conservatives. we want small government. but stop this nonsense. i guarantee you the koch brothers don't think a default is not a default. they think this ted cruz strategy is stupid. and backed away from it. it's hard to find mike barnacle, the "wall street journal" says we're for small government you guys are walking into a canyon. you're going to get killed by this. i think this is the point, mike, isn't it? where the fever breaks and the people that have fund ad lot of these campaigns in the past say you guys have stepped over the line and what you're doing is not only bad for the republican party, it's bad for my business

and it's bad for america. >> well, the koch brothers have gone to the point yesterday to point out that they are not among the deniers. >> yeah. of course not. >> they are not among the deniers. they are conservatives but not among the deniers. congressman, let me ask you today, later today we're going to have a group of republicans down to the white house to meet with the president. you've been on the floor of the house now for several years but specifically during these last several weeks with these points of conflict arise every 15 minutes, what is the objective? what is the end game for the republicans right now? if they to define victory for themselves in this horrendous episode what would it be, what do you think? >> mike, the problem is there's no tsunami your particular kwaen the reason i say that is that within the republican caucus there's no agreement. and this is the challenge we had

all along. normally you would have a speaker who represents the position of the caucus, and the speaker then can get together with, you know, democrats or the president and negotiate an agreement. what we have right now is the speaker minute to minute, doesn't know what his position is ballgam is because he continues to consult with the caucus sean driven by the most radical parts of the republican caucus. i've heard a lot of different plans floated by the republicans in the house and senate but no republican position. when you're in negotiation somebody has to speak for the house republicans in this case or you can't find a compromise or agreement. >> congressman, it's willie. good to see you this morning. obama care is off the table at this point. it was driven originally by senator ted cruz. that's not what republicans in the house are asking for. what do you think about the paul ryan plan. he wrote a piece in "wall street

journal" yesterday. he put it forward in the republican study committee yesterday about asking for what he calls modest changes to medicare and to social security in exchange for raising of the debt ceiling. what do you make of that idea? >> first, our view is that you shouldn't be tying raising the debt ceiling to any specific demand. but at the same time we've been trying negotiate on the budget. we've been trying to go budget negotiations since march. we've actually been blocked in the house three times from appointing budget negotiators. we welcome the opportunity have a discussion on the budget. paul ryan has a budget. the president has a budget. there's a senate democratic budget. we should be at the table. we should have been at the table since march hashing those things out. what you can't have is someone demanding to have their way on the budget in exchange for them doing what every member of congress should do which is to support the debt ceiling, to pay

for the bills that we've incurred. i would ask the country if the president was to take the position he would veto the debt ceiling, if he was going refuse to pay our bills, unless the republicans in congress adopted the president's budget and the president's fiscal agenda they would say the president absolutely lost his mind and yet that's exactly what they are doing. so, we welcome an opportunity to sit down around the budget table. we've been trying to do it like i said for a long time but let's get rid of the threat of shutting down the government, continuing to shutting it down and threat of defaulting on our obligations. >> congressman chris van hollen thank you so much. coming up camelot's court takes us 0 inside t-- inside the kenne house.

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as president of the united states, i find it heartening and a great pleasure for me to welcome them as part of the official family. they are all patriotic men who are devoted to the welfare of this country. and i'm confident that they will meet their responsibilities with high distinction. >> that was president john f. kennedy weighing in on his newly

sworn candidacy in january of 1961. here with us now presidential historian, robert dallek. he writes this of kennedy's cabinet members. each in his own way was a combatant to persuade the president that he had the best if not always the right answer to the various intimidating challenges they faced at home and particularly abroad where the danger of a catastrophic war was constantly before them. they fought with each other. they wanted to prevent the ultimate world catastrophe. good to have you on the show this morning. >> lovely to be here. >> they've been called famously the best and the brightest. were they and did that always translate into good policy? >> the answer is yes and no.

they were brilliant, wise in some ways and mistaken. jack learned that over time he had to doubt what they were telling him because he was so furious after the bay of pigs operation and he walked around saying how i could have been so stupid. he was just so frustrated by the advice they had given him. but the greatest difficulty he had were with the joint chiefs of staff because he was terrified of getting into a nuclear war and at one point during the missile crisis he said to this young woman, mimi, his mistress, who was there one night, he said to her, mimi, i rather my kids be red than dead. he never could have said that in public. >> interesting talking about

these brilliant men around him and that's what's interesting about this picture, they are all men. he was a great listener. >> he saw charles de gaulle in the spring of 1961, and de gaulle said to him listen to the advisers. hear what they have to say but then make up your own mind. he remembered what harry truman said, the buck stops here. he felt the responsibility to handle these problems. and what's most amazing about him, of course, is that he was plagued by all these physical ailments. he had all these medical issues. i sat down his medical records alongside the cuban missile crisis records and it was amazing how stoic and effective he really was. >> so before we -- we've been talking all morning about approval rating, democrats,

republicans, president obama and you mentioned something about his before we got on taxpayer. >> 85%. the only one close to him was ronald reagan with 74%. so in a sense the puzzle is why 50 years later does he have this hold on the american public? and i think a lot of it has to do with the fact that people have been so frustrated with the other presidents we've had. johnson, the failure in vietnam. nixon and watergate. ford's truncated presidency. jimmy carter, first bush only there for one term, second bush with iraq and katrina and bill clinton with being the only elected president in history to have been impeached. i mean they turned to kennedy. they see him and they remember his words. he remains a kind of inspirational figure. >> it's also, i would think, the

dangling possibility that what might have been possible. >> exactly. >> it would have been if he lived. for instance in the book, terrific peric piece, terrific . the book indicated mansfield's coolness. so, in december he told the senator his assessment didn't tally what he was hearing from the administration subordinates. afterward kennedy said i got angry with mike mansfield and i got angry with myself because i found myself agreeing with him. i want gets back to his distrust of his national security advi advisers and the joint chiefs. what would he have done with

vietnam? >> you know, my answer is i don't have a ghost of a thought in the sense that nobody can say gee i don't think he himself knew what he would have done. i love the antecdote and schlesinger says what will i do there and kennedy says i don't know what i'll be doing there. see, he was smart and he was honest about the fact, you run for president and you say all sorts of things but you don't know what will come up to hit you in the face. >> he followed a guy, eisenhower, who was rising in all historians eyes at the same time that thought that kennedy was too young and too inexperienced to be president and didn't like his management style. ike told kennedy it's like a

pyramid, if it gets to the top it's very important. richard reid said kennedy saw himself in the middle of all these arrows. it was chaotic sometimes. >> without question it was chaotic. we talk about crisis. he passed through crisis after crisis over cuba, over berlin, over nuclear weapons. >> who was the most influential voice and least influential voice. you wrote in the book some people were misinterpreted. >> most influential voice was bobby kennedy. one of the frustrations for historians is they had meeting after meeting behind closed doors. we don't have records of that. we don't know what they said to each other. the only way we could figure this out is bobby would go into these meetings and say things and some people said jack would smile. because bobby was sort of being the hatchet man.

he was taking the initiative. bobby kennedy was the adviser. >> the book is show white coll fifth season. they join us next. guys. i'm driving. hey, you guys comfortable? it's best-in-class rear legroom. and with a turbo engine that gets 35 highway m-p-g. you know j.d. power ranked passat the most appealing midsize car two years in a row? i bet, uh, dan here wishes somebody found him most appealing two years in a row. ron: it's ron jc: ron... exactly. vo: get 0 down, 0 due at signing, 0 deposit, and 0 first month's payment on passat or any new 2014 volkswagen. not double-talk. if you have the nerve to believe that in a puzzling financial world, clarity is king.

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a. >> i know what you're thinking and no. it's the experience theory. >> of course. i will however seek experience truth. >> joining me at home, it can't point back to us. >> very well. nothing gets territorial. >> hey. is that a guy up there? >> i'm going to jump! >> oh, my gosh. were you afraid? >> i'm terrified of heights. >> i didn't like that. >> they don't show when they doctor the footage later. i was wearing cable, but it looks like i'm not. >> that was a scene from the hit

usa show white collar. everyone knows you, but "sex and the city," right? >> and the deadliest catch. >> three times you played oswald? really? there had to be a conflict at some point. >> i was the quint essential oswald. i don't think the audience knew. >> we were talking about camelot's court and he gets on the set and said i played him three times. >> and it's odd because he was folically challenged as i am, but he was only like 24 or something. >> go ahead, mike. >> how do you go mentally from playing a largely female cast

from "sex and the city" to a largely all guy cast in this one? >> happily. each roll and each cast has its own personality and challenges and character actors like myself who move on and you enter into the world and you move on. he was an iconic figure. it is shocking. >> now white collar is in the 16th. that's exciting. >> it is pretty exciting. >> the character you play, how is it over the five seasons? >> what's great about a long run is that you learn more every episode about the person that you are playing. each season we find out the fbi finds out my real name who i am kind of an underground operator

behind the scenes. we are kind of hunted and we don't like that. it was how we operate under pressure. we are usually the criminals pulling all the strings and this year we made a deal with the devil and you have to answer to someone else. >> very nice. >> it's great for actors. all of these contents. >> yeah, but it's unbelievable and also on cable, we are allowed to do things a little easier. we can get away with a little more. we are not eating chocolate bars. >> next wednesday on usa. thank you. up next, why republicans on

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ed. >> i want to make a point in a minute. >> i would like permission to use scissors.

the biggest evidence yet that our congress functions at a kindergarten level. >> i'm going cut this credit card up. it's time we quit borrowing mon money. i will just tear it up. >> what are you doing? you don't know the giant whose credit card that is. >> good morning. it's 8:00 on the east coast and 5:00 on the west coast if you take a live look at new york city. that's where donny deutsch is. and in washington, robert gibbs. for the first time since 2008, the government shut down and

function in washington is the number one concern and over 33% and all sides are taking a hit in approval ratings as a result, the damage to the republican brand is proving to be the worst. now only 28% of americans say they have a favorable view of the republican party, the lowest since the poll first began, asking the question 21 years ago. senator ted cruz, according to the washington examiner in a closed door meeting with his republican colleagues, they argued that the shut down has been good for the gop, pointing to his own internal polling. that same poll that senator cruz paid for shows the republicans taking the lion's share of the blame. they said republicans are in a better position than they were

in 1995 because it is based on the fight over obama care and not spending in general. >> i don't think anybody is belaboring that. he is putting himself in a horrible position now. he has his fingerprints all over it. you look, donny deutsch, at the record lows. democrats are only one point off their low since 1992 and an ap poll is an out liar that has them in the high 30s and most averages have them around 44%. this hurts absolutely everyone. >> but the republicans have a fund-raiser and they are really, really worried come november if

republicans come in. there is going to be a backlash and say what you want about obama. this is a republican disaster. obviously it's going to hurt one way or the other, but i never have seen him just talk to people just that they are repulsed by what is happening. in my lifetime i have never been as fed up with government, with politicians. you just want to take a shower. >> you really do. the republicans are really bearing the lion's share of the blame right now and there is a column with a conservative guy and the republican party's suicide. >> in the new york post, some conservatives say they don't care about the gop, but what they care about are conservative

ideas. they are right. but here's the conundrum. there is only one electoral vac. the republican party. it's one thing reing to waste your time buffing a vehicle, but in making the vehicle function better you muck up the engine, put the wrong tires on it and pour antifreeze in the gas tank, you are exceeding forward movement. you are not repairing it. it may not have been a good vehicle in the first place and you may not think it couldn't drive worse, but it's the only one you've got. >> it's getting worse. there is a development in the parties and you look at a guy like chris christie, he is ahead like 33 points in his state that

barack obama won by 18 points. >> 66% approval rating. the gop is suffering with the republicans outside the capital. they tell a different story and the state won by president obama by 18 points last year. chris christie currently ahead of his challenger by 33 points and has 66% approval rating in that blue state. let's look at other governors. you can go to ohio, john casic has a 54% approval rating. new mexico carried by ten points and the president carried it. a 66% approval rating. mike, is it about the republican

party? these people do certain things. >> they run their government. they operate their government. >> they don't tell the bond holders they are going to buy bonds. in wisconsin, he is such an idea log, our bond rating because we are getting fiscally responsible and it will be easier for wisconsin to borrow money. >> there were four governors. the republicans have a specific portion of the republicans in the house of representatives in washington, d.c. those four people you see on the screen left every day until they can say that a, they can run their government and are running their government and b, those who are running are running for something and not against something. they also work with democrats and scott walker's 48% have

barack obama and the same thing is they have to get things done for their constituents and winning political points. they had chris christie trying to manage the state through super storm sandy and president obama shakes his hand or whatever they did and they were taxed by national republicans. he said what the hell are you talking about. i'm trying to help my state get through it. how dare you shake hands with a democrat. he said i'm saving my state. >> let me go to robert gibbs and come back to you. robert, it really is a tale of two parties. republicans control 60% of the government. a lot of them are doing really well. >> i go off of what mike said.

the shot of his snazzy shirt. i just used that. it is hard for the american people to get the keys of government, the republicans that have no desire to want government in any level to operate. you have republicans that are making it work in different states and democrats that are making it work in different states. you have to work with the other party. you have to make progress. you can't get any of what you want if you won't take some rather than all. that's why in 2016 while the base will be excited about rand paul and ted cruz, the eventual nominee i think comes from a state because it's a better laboratory for how they might run washington. >> it will be a chris christie or scott walker or nick daniels. let me ask you, robert, you go

back and clinton won in 92. he was going to be a new democrat and bring washington together. that was eight years of political hell and george w. bush came to washington and we heard the stories about how great he worked with democrats in austin, texas and he was going to change all that and he was going to be a uniter and not a divider. that was eight years of political hell. we heard the stories about how barack obama worked with republicans in the legislature and here we are six years in and it's just as bad as the past two administrations. what is it about washington that breeds the dysfunction that even the president did not have in their past life on the state level. >> part of it is endemic to this town. it was interesting when you

watch -- john boehner's message is let's negotiate. most people would think he's probably the least positioned to negotiate. i think the messages tend to be the opposite of what the other guy is saying when that might not be the best thing to do. you can add into that, you have again things like a much faster media cycle and things like twitter and the internet that adds to that. the political polarization you see in the representatives that come here, how many come in and whose outcomes are so different than the national elections and each side of the spectrum, instead of working with the other party. i think all of that is a toxic cocktail. >> you guys saw this? >> you have the wrong side.

>> joe gerardi, man. this is such a huge story in new york about this cop that allowed the mother to be beaten up by the motorcycle gang. >> it's unfortunate, but it's policing everywhere. >>a i disgusting story. >> my gosh. we are following that and then we had the mayor on and he was commenting and they are trying to see exactly what happened. before we go to break, there was about a week until the special election and the senate seat in new jersey happened last night and got kind of heated. republican candidate called them a base line for the taxpayer money. >> why didn't corey booker tweet

that? >> a few contenders were heated more than once over the topic of gun violence. >> since i have been elected in 2006. shootings are down. critical issues that are not solved by background checks in the secondary markets that my opponent opposes. he is dropping money into his campaign. >> corey booker about a month ago, a girl was shot to death. he was telling what a great job he was doing in new york. >> ten people in new york, one a day for ten days while my opponent was in hollywood and san francisco promoting himself. >> the delaware river, we have to pull back and like many want to do it can pollute all waters. >> it's because of all the bodies floating around from

shoot being waters. >> oh, my god! >> we have a government in shut down because of tea party extremists that are stopping our government. my opponent is a leader of the tea party in new jersey and somebody that supports the shut down. >> across the united states of america, you get 10 $ every time you say tea party. you can offset the million to advance the left wing agenda. they are americans for prosperity with taxes and liberty. if they were called politicians for prosperity, you would be a charter member. >> wow. i will say this. this race is about to stay. they have someone coming in against corey booker. sarah palin is coming in to

campaign. >> let's go work in the jersey state. >> i bet she is big in jersey. >> in some parts she is. >> i met sarah ferguson in jersey. >> fergie? >> i want to apologize to the children. nantucket. >> i know you are a great dad. >> can you ask you something? women look at that and thinks that makes you more sensitive. >> yes, finally. >> and the puppy dog. >> when i'm walking to the park with my white labs and pushing the stroller -- >> can i ask you this? do they know they are like a

pick up game? >> it's not written down, but everyone we meet, everybody wins. >> the nanny takes the women. donny gets back to there also. the kids of child actors. >> coming up on "morning joe," we will check in with politico and mcdonald's looking to boost its public image offering free books in happy meals. that's featuring the company's own characters. that story is just ahead. you will love that. the government may be shut down, but man cleaning crew is taking the capital by force. lawn mower man is into action.

>> bill is the one. >> he walks around with one of the leaf blowers. >> and stares into windows. >> only your house. >> good morning. we are watching a horrible weather pattern on the i-95 corridor. they had a beautiful fall. from philadelphia all the way southward, it's raining and moving to new york city. philly is the only airport with a two-hour delay. all the airports have a chance of that. this storm is impressive. it's a nor'easter-type look. the waves are up on the beaches. it's a large wave coming onshore. every high tide, we will take a little bit of the beach away. we will get beach erosion out of

this. it will rain hard too. they are producing two to three inches of rain. some in jersey northward, again, that's over three days. it will be chilly with the temperatures if we lucky. they will clear out and the middle of the country, they had a great week. look at this today. 78 and sunny. all the way up to the border. you have 78 and sunny in minneapolis. they are dealing with this today. through the upcoming weekend. you are watching "morning joe" on this thursday.

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>> per time to take a look at the morning papers. the tampa bay times. bill young will not seek reelection in 2014. we will retire for his health and spending more time with his family. the 83-year-old expressed frustration with the government shut down. he served 42 years in the u.s. congress. >> he also is the mentor and a great man and great representative. bill young was the minority leader in the florida senate and when he called a caucus, we would meet wherever he was because he was the only member of the republican party in the senate. >> 42 years serving.

>> every time they got angry, they wait. >> what a guy. >> what a guy. evil elmo is going to prison. he pled guilt tow black mailing the girl scouts after threatening to spread rumors about the organization after sex with young men and girls. he was arrested for selling anti-semitic comments. >> the minneapolis star tribune, the father of the 9-year-old boy who flew through security broke his i had sense with his face covered. he tearful expressed concern for his son, describing him as hard to control. >> we have no idea where he was. what can i do?

i need help and there is no one helping me. if i want my son, i get locked up. if i let my son keep doing what he is doing, i get in trouble. it's terrible. please. >> wow. >> "usa today" for the first two weeks of november, mcdonald's is going to give out books in the place of the iconic happy meal toys. this comes as they continue to redo the happy meals. they will feature fruits and veggie options. >> you county jail them happy meals you ought to look. >> there is nothing happy about that. >> take a look at that. >> you don't get a toy and you don't get french fries. i might as well get socks.

>> "washington post," the men from south carolina took it upon himself to clean up the ground around the lincoln memorial. it's with a lake, lawn mower and the south carolina state flag. he has been in the capital for days cleaning up. he said i'm not here to point fingers, i only want to inspire people to come out and make a difference. >> better be careful. they may arrest him. >> a look at the "time" magazine. time will be looking at how a $31 billion debate can change gun control. >> interesting. >> let's go to willie for the politico playbook. >> let's go to the executive director. we are hoping to see his son, james, but we will take jim. >> on the subtoday. >> you are the sub. >> i come bearing goodish news.

i always feel like i have downer news. i believe we will have a deal. within days to avoid the debt limit and potentially to reopen the government. the reason is there is no formal announcement coming out today and almost every time it is moving towards a compromise. the president is open to a short-term deal. paul ryan has a lot of sway costing them about a deal that would give at least a short-term increase in exchange for cost about entitlement reform. you have most conservatives saying they might warn for that idea and only the far, far, far right would be opposed. it would be enough to get that done. mitch mcconnell is getting involve and he has been on the side lines and is talking about a deal similar to what paul ryan is talking about. you have business community over the last 24 hours going public

with concerns and warnings to republicans about the consequence on contributions. the consequences on some of these house raises. i think all of those will lead to a deal and a deal relatively soon on the debt limit. the big question is it's a short-term deal that is unsatisfying because you know there is not enough time to get the grand bargain, but it avoids the debt limit crisis and gets the government up and running again and give us the possibility of talks. once you get in your room, something could happen. >> and defund obama care and the short-term entitlement reform. help me understand why president obama would go back and look at entitlements in a way he hasn't in the past. >> be clear for the president said they would be happy to look at entitle 789s as long as it's not part of the deal.

we will only raise the debt limit if you pass the debt limit increase. he's happy to have the conversations. i think having the conversations and getting a deal is tough. the budget has lots of perspective for entitlement changes. the problem is he wants corresponding tax increases. it's really hard for me to see republicans stomaching any kind of tax increases for an entitlement deal after a full surrender on health care and they will do a full surrender. because of ted cruz's position of the world is a dead end position, most republicans now know it. >> how short-term are we talking? >> i think short. from four to six weeks and they might make it contingent on the bigger the talks, the longer the deal might go. it will be short. we will avoid drama in the moment, but you will face drama

within weeks. >> coming up next, the opinion editor, emily miller from crime victims to gun rights advocate. "morning joe" is back in a minute. ♪ ♪ [ girl ] roses are red. violets are blue. splenda® is sweet. and so are you. [ female announcer ] just about anywhere you use sugar, you can use splenda® no calorie sweetener. ♪ splenda® lets you experience the joy of sugar without all the calories. it's a very good reason to enjoy something sweet with the ones you love.

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you. >> joining us now, senior editor of the opinion page of the washington times and author of emily gets her gun. emily miller. >> you can debate and obviously i get in the middle of it and regarding background checks, i keep talking about guns. i thought you were like born with a shotgun. a sawed off shotgun in your hand. >> i shot a gun for the first time less than two years ago. the governor said he is taking the hunting gun, girl. i never have been hunting. i want to go hunting. i'm from baltimore. my dad had a revolver growing up, but it was a secret from his daughters. i found out as an adult. i was the victim of a home invasion and that inspired me. i walk into the house and found

a man in there robbing it. i said thank god i was not physically harmed, but i wanted to follow him down the street to get a picture for the police and found his buddies around the corner and ran. i was like what if he came back and what if it happens again. d.c. has an increase in crime rate. i learned within four months to get a real gun. obviously it's going down the street and picking them off off each other. since then a year ago, we had a push by obama and talking about millions of dollars to push the laws and five states passing radical gun control laws. it's still pushed in the senate.

what happened since. i don't see how i went through to get a legal gun in d.c. is going to affect any gun control law for the crimes. that's the fact. the harvard study. >> do you think that -- i come from a family of gun owners and hunters actually. >> you grew up around guns. >> so i understand a lot of the concerns that gun owners have because i know a lot of gun owners. having said that, do you think the terms are created by people who purely want to chip away at the american second amendment rights or do you think an honest effort to beat around the problems of these unbelievably powerful weapons in the wrong hands? >> you are probably talking about the spotlights. that's a misleading term. an assault rifle is a machine gun. you pull the trigger and those

are not on the streets. although obama said military weapons have to get off the streets. those aren't military weapons. they are semi automatic weapons with cosmetic appearances. they are called assault weapons because it's one of the more original gun control readings. they said it will confusion the public into thinking before the assault weapons ban was enacted in order to think they are weapons of war. they are confusing them. i believe there is a lot of language being used. that high capacity magazine and high powered rifle and ammo doesn't mean anything. i think a lot of media use is not using the correctly. >> should people be allowed to

be allowed to use bazookas? >> i don't know what that is. >> those should be outlawed? why shouldn't i be allowed to own the weapons that are outlawed? >> why not? they have been outlawed since 1934. >> why those? >> those are weapons of war. >> those are automatic machine guns. >> so if i want to defend myself -- >> we as a society decided in 1934 and i don't think anyone anywhere is arguing to readjust that. you can argue that. >> where do you draw the line between a weapon and -- >> semi automatic versus automatic. >> like newtown. >> i think the best thing to defend myself family is with an automatic weapon. i think that's the best way to defend myself family. >> you want to own an automatic

weapon. >> i think it's the best way to defend my family. >> you can apply and they will do a background check. >> you get the assault weapon. do you believe that the supreme court is going to say americans have the right to defeat. we know it's not an assault weapon, but military style weapons. >> yeah. the owner of the bushmaster, i say the name of your company is confusing. a lot of people think bushmaster is something like that is in vietnam. it's just a brand and what differentiates it is a pistol grip. it's easier for me to hold because i don't have to hold

everything because i'm short and that is all that is. bushmaster makes it sound scary. >> it's a scary gun. >> it's not. it doesn't shoot any differently than others. than a hand gun or hunting rifle. >> it has a much different impact. >> there is no functional difference. >> if they went in with a hand gun ned instead of a bushmaster. >> he would have killed just as many kids. >> i don't think so. >> i hate talking about him. it's so disgusting. let's not talk about that. about people dying. my point is only about the ar-15s and the military style weapons people are afraid of. they are 100% not any different

than a hunting rifle. they look like military rifles and half the people own them are former military and law enforcement. >> they are not bigger? are. >> no. the same caliber and function. >> half the owners are for military and law enforcement because they are used to them and they are easier to shoot. they are the light car bine. >> easier to shoot where? >> 80% of people to own them use them for target practice. in all the 11,000 gun murders a year, 300 are from rifles. >> what is wrong back ground checks some. >> they are not working now. >> the system doesn't work now so why don't we make it better some. >> we need to get the mental health records. they have not been put in in a lot of states. that needs to be done.

the system, i went through it to get my gun and i didn't get caught, but all the records are in there. all the denials, people who don't pass, we are only prostituting -- >> why don't we make it a better system? >> we need to. >> you say i'm not going to support background systems because the current doesn't work. that says to me we need to make it better. >> we need to focus on the state's health records and the investigations and you are only getting down to like 60 people for illegal guns every year. woe all agree we do not want illegal guns and criminals. the drug abusers and all the people have guns. how do we stop them? the thing we disagree on is the way to do that.

>> em low miller, thank you very much. nice to meet you. "morning joe" will be right back. bl [ banker ] sydney needed some financial guidance

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>> kind of a bad day for 12 people on a roller coaster last night. riders of the rocket got stuck at a car on the top of the hill. it took two hours to get them down. no one was hurt. there was a glitch in the safety system. >> at least it was warm out. >> yeah. >> i was up there.

i guess we want to know the headlines of what he is saying. >> brian, good morning. let's check out the futures. the dow is up 100 points. that's a significant rebounds. maybe we have a short-term deal here. right now we have jack lew intensifying on capitol hill and a lot of people focussing on whether or not october 17th a week from today is the drop dead deadline in terms of when the u.s. runs on the debt ceiling. we hit the debt ceiling in may using short-term measures and keeping the up iffing going. he couldn't indicate whether it was much past october 17th. anyway, the u.s. will be able to keep going. a lot of people here if you look at the bipartisan policies it's

more towards the end of the month. it's basically the day for we need this deal and we will have to assume there isn't one. that won't happen towards the end of the month. hopefully that gives a sense of why we are rebounding and still remain vulnerable that we get out of the hearings and meetings with democrats and republicans throughout the day. one thing from washington, a couple of developments in terms of pc to mobile. something we are all familiar with right now. first of all spending on mobile doubled in the first part of this year. that's in the third quarter hit a five-year low. the trend from desk tops to tablets and mobile phones as the primary device is happening more quickly. at least the advertising agency

were able to get that. >> the stock price too, a lot of that has to do with the rebound in mobile. quickly you will see the headlines up 66,000. it's not necessarily a bad story when we talk about what's going on in california, correct? >> what happens there is a delayed reaction. the numbers are -- what they are telling you is the low numbers in the last several weeks and partly because you want to get out of california. a little bit fuller of data and impact from the shut down. that pops up to 375,000. it's not a great number and one of the only numbers we get out of the government. >> mika, they are over to softwares and a couple of weeks that they explained with the headlines. >> thank you very much. we'll be right back. helicopthierhis hibuzzing, andk engine humming.

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>> so john boehner had his own press conference. >> we going to sit down and have a conversation or republican we? there is a reason to make it

more difficult to bring people to the table. there is no boundaries and nothing on the table and nothing on the table. >> that is a leader with a clear goal. i want a table. >> congress and the senate are still getting paid and still in session. what are they doing? they are getting paid for whatever it is they are doing. here's what they were doing today. take a look at what's going on now. >> i ordered my ice cream. >> i went to the ice cream place. >> ice cream is healthy. >> i didn't want to go for ice cream. >> funny. tomorrow on "morning joe" our friend will be here to launch his project. his new social network culturalist.com will offer a new way to share opinions about pretty much anything through the mechanism of the top ten list to

add their own top 10 list where they can show their own conversation threads. we will show you that tomorrow including one that was going on in washington. the top ten best political leaders we need right now. we will be features our own top 10 lists starting with the top ten best "morning joe" moments. >> we talk about this plan. i'm looking forward to that. >> wow. i don't want to see that. that's not -- >> i want to know what we learned today. we'll be right back. hey, i notice your car is not in the driveway. yeah. it's in the shop. it's going to cost me an arm and a leg. that's hilarious. sorry. you shoulda taken it to midas. get some of that midas touch. they tell you what stuff needs fixing, and what stuff can wait. next time i'm going to midas. high-five! arg! i did not see that coming.

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but it's good to be prepared... just in case they don't. toyota. let's go places, safely. >> i don't know how they do that. mike, what did you learn? >> speaking with probrian shack, i want the detroit tigers. they can't feel for the defensive teams. >> other than that. i'm shocked. >> i thought the tigers were a team. >> talking during the team and listening to that. >> you are not looking. i'm talking and you are not looking. what did you learn today? >> instead of a top