it. fix the technology. the ability to fix it. >> did you ever talk about resigning? >> what i talked about is doing the job to get this fully implemented and to get the website working right. >> we fought the fight. we didn't win. we live to fight another day. ♪ good afternoon. we begin with republicans' uncontrolled impulse to scratch at any aspect of the obama administration that may respond to political exploitation. today's version, healthcare.gov. and now that the shutdown debacle is done, let the fear mongering and conspiracy theories over the affordable care act commence. >> we've got the whole threat of obama care continuing to hang over our economy like a wet blanket. >> the rollout of obama care is nothing short of a debacle.

and the american people are now fearful of their health care. >> now, some may be trembling in frustration at a website that everyone admits is underperforming, to put it mildly. we just learned that democratic senator, max baucus, plans a fince committee hearing on that very issue in the coming weeks. but if anyone is quaking in fear of the affordable care act, it surely is due to the rampant disinformation by the gop. like that favorite storyline that health care reform is turning us into a part time nation. workers are having their hours downsized in droves. a claim, by the way, that politic fact rated patently false. never mind, kathleen sebelius should be fired for it. yanker out of meetings with insurers at the white house this afternoon, take her out of her work fixing the rollout issues. the grand old party needs a great big fall guy and for them, she is it. and in the surest sign of revved

up republican blood lust congressman darrell issa has put on his detective's hat saying the whole website kerfuffle is due to a shady effort by sebelius and the white house to hide the real truth about the affordable care act. >> they delinquently went the other way, broke best practices and buried the information about the high cost of obama care. >> oh-oh, yes. issa knows all about internet best practices. he has put together his own list of kitties having trouble with health care call centers and the website. isn't that adorable? although i must confess, i'm mightily relieved he never got his hannon a picture of our own russian blue. but leaving cats and dogs aside, you will not believe what else republicans are up to. >> paul ryan will lay out the big republican reform plan in january. i think it will be much better for the country. >> do you think it will have an alternative to obama care?

>> absolute full alternative to obama care. >> wait. what? what day is this? paul ryan will present republicans' health care reform plan in january of 2014? after the president's law has been legislated, signed, upheld, litigated on the campaign trail by mitt romney and paul ryan? really, republicans? now you're going to offer your own plan. >> speaker boehner, bill crystal said on "morning joe" this morning that paul ryan would unveil the house gop plan for health care reform sometime in january. is it your understanding that's going to happen and can you give us an idea what it might look like? >> i'll let you talk to paul about that. >> we would love nothing more than to talk to paul ryan about that, but we can't. so let's get to our panel, my msnbc colleague, krystal ball has joined us, and professor shrum. what do you make of this

remarkable earth-shattering development from bill crystal today, the republicans have suddenly decided to cover the 40-odd million people with health insurance. >> you notice he didn't say that. and actually, if he presented an alternative, i'm sure it would be something like health savings accounts can, which differentially favor to an overwhelming degree wealthier people who already have health insurance. look, the republicans are afraid. >> so they would never be offering an alternative. >> no, they're not going to offer an alternative that's going to cover the 40 million people. and, in fact, the plan that was passed and that's in effect now is modeled on a plan that mitt romney negotiated with ted kennedy in massachusetts and has elements of republican ideas from the 1990s. these folks are obsessed with the glitches in the exchanges. and they're unforgivable in some level, but they're also understandable. this happened with the rollout of medicare, although not because of computers. it happened with the rollout of the prescription drug benefit, which was a complete mess. it's going to get fixed. and after it gets fixed, the volume of calls and of people

trying to log into this tells you that people want this health insurance, they're going to get this health insurance. it's going to become ultimately politically untouchable and the real people afraid are the republicans. they're afraid of when that happens. >> and yet, krystal, you have been much more critical of these glitches. you are angry. >> i am actually quite angry about it. i myself and many others have been making the case that once people actually saw the product, once they could actually log into the exchanges, they would see how powerful and how important this law is. and yes, medicare part d was a disaster, but that was under george w. bush and he is someone who has contempt for government so i hoped as many hoped this would go much more smoothly. but i will say, we see at the same time as all these problems on the website are rolling out, we actually see obama care approval ratings go up. now why is that? that seems like a very strange thing. and what i think is going on is republicans have been making the argument not that it would be a bad website. but that the sky would fall, and it would be the end of the country all together.

>> this is true. >> so when people see, okay, there is a real thing. yes, there are problems with the website, but there is a real thing here where i can actually buy insurance and the republic seems to be managing to keep it together. >> yes. >> i think that they're realizing the republican rhetoric has been pretty over wrought over all these years. >> right. is darrell issa says the white house is, of course, hiding the real costs of the affordable care act. that's interesting, because a new report shows lower than projected premiums under the aca will save the federal government $190 billion over ten years. and boost the law's deficit reduction by 174%, to almost $300 billion. i mean, again, falsification. >> look, they have never cared about the truth. this started -- >> hang on. >> they haven't. on the affordable care act, they have never cared about the truth. death panels, rationing, seniors were going to lose their medicare, go through the list of charges. they're all false. i mean, they still stand up and say we're going to repeal obama care to reduce the deficit. if you repeal obama care, you're

going to raise the deficit by that $330 billion. >> congratulations. >> so it is a consistent pattern, it is ideologically driven. and i'll tell you what i'm afraid. what i'm afraid of as boehner plays to this chorus of people he's got in this kaub caucus, these crazy people, if i can call them crazy people and he can get pushed down the road and we can go back into january and february with the same kind of crisis we just wept through. mitch mcconnell says you learn when you get kicked in the head not to go back and get kicked in the head again. i think these people are pretty hard-head and had there is not a lot in there and they may want to get kicked in the head again. >> krystal, does darrell issa now have his perfect trifecta? he had benghazi, he had the irs. now he's got the affordable care act. you know what he's going to be doing? he's going to be holding these hearings, he's going to be investigating. he's got the trifecta. >> and then we'll have another conspiracy theory after that. >> and that's the problem here. is that he's so overplayed his

hand. he has absolutely no credibility. and there is a real issue here. the website is not working properly. and that is worthy of inquiry. but there is no conspiracy theory. and this guy has no credibility, because he's been out there in benghazi, out there on fast and furious, the irs. i think there was some new black panther thing. one thing after the other. american people have no trust in this guy. and they have no faith in republicans to put forward any sort of good solution. don't you think, though, the overwhelming en tension in this whole situation is to ruin the project itself as the koch brothers have tried to do by those ads, encouraging young people not to sign up so that there's an insufficient amount of income available, which is how the system is designed to wo work? isn't that the most pernicious tactic? >> yeah, and if the koch brothers have any shred of decency at all, they ought to set up a fund to cover these kids they persuade not to get covered. >> these guys are worth billions

of dollars and have the audacity to tell someone don't sign up. >> some 25-year-old gets brain cancer, that person is not left without protection. this is an attempt to destroy the program. but i think krystal is right. i think they have moved from arguing the merits of this to arguing the rollout of this. and yeah, the rollout is a mess. it's a disgrace. i'll say it again. it's going to get fixed. and in the meantime, people are seeing, as you said, there is a real product out there that can make a real difference to me in my life. and long-term, i don't think republicans are gaining a lot anymore from this. in fact, i think they're hurting themselves. while they banged obama care during the shutdown and during the debt -- crisis, obama care became more popular. and by the way, the numbers that show that it is marginally up popular are secured, if i can use a republican word, for one reason. about a third or a quarter of the people who disapprove of obama care disapprove of it because they think it's not expansive enough, doesn't do enough. >> so does the situation get

fixed? >> with the website? >> yes. >> it will get fixed at some point. my frustration is we still have no visibility on how long that will take. but i think the dirty secret here for republicans is that they don't actually believe in universal health care. they don't believe that health care is a human right. so when they're dissueding young people from buying health insurance, i think it's utterly immoral to go in that direction. >> it actually is. professor shrum, quick sip of drink there we caught you on camera. and krystal ball, thank you very much. could members of congress be anymore reckless and cavalier on gun safety? could you, congresswoman? >> north carolina congresswoman, rene elmers has been robbed, and what was taken has everyone talking tonight. an ar-15 military style rifle stolen from her dunn home. the break-in was reported by elmer's husband 9:00 this morning who told police his son had been target shooting yesterday and apparently left the ar-15 unlocked next to a gun safe in the garage.

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in the routine tragedy of gun violence in america, not a day passes without yet another loss of life. just 24 hours after a nevada middle school teacher, a former marine, at that, lost his life to a student shooter, who then went on to apparently turn the gun on himself, now a story perhaps even more tragic. in texas yesterday, a 5-year-old little boy found the gun of his napping babysitter, sitting on a coffee table. he accidentally pulled the trigger and took his own life. the babysitter, 19-year-old melissa ann ringhart, is being charged with endangering a child. she had left her loaded

semiautomatic .40 caliber handgun out on the table, when she went into the bedroom for a nap. and if you're left wondering why congress still refuses to take any sort of action against the easy availability of guns, perhaps it's because they have no idea themselves about how to keep their weapons safe. representative renee ellmers, a republican from north carolina, had her family's ar-15 military-style assault rifle stolen from her garage last week. why was it so easy to steal, you ask? because the garage was unlocked, and the deadly weapon was leaning against a gun safe. not in it. a spokesperson for representative ellmers points out that the congresswoman is big on gun safety, and wants to get to the bottom of this herself. but fear not, the stolen rifle has now been added to a national database used to track firearms.

if only it had been registered beforehand, perhaps the thief would have thought twice before stealing it. but either way, as congress continues to lack the courage to act, they'll continue to bear some responsibility for every gun that ends up in the wrong hands. coming up, the itch republicans just cannot stop scratching. perhaps it's this master of the anti virus can provide some soothing relief. >> people ask me, did you really sleep with ten 17-year-old girls and you're a 67-year-old man and i go yep, i did. ♪ why can't we be friends why can't we be friends ♪ the american dream is of a better future,

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website, republicans believe they may have found the answer to all of our technical problems. mr. john macafee. yes, mr. mcafee has received e-mails seeking his expertise for the health care exchanges. you may know mr. mcafee as the founder of the company that bears his name and sells antiviral software. but in the eight years since selling his company, mr. mcafee as gained a slightly different reputation. one republicans have either overlocked or possibly embraced. there is the john mcafee who fled the country of belize last year, after being named a person of interest during an investigation into the murder of his neighbor. there's the mr. mcafee's appearances on fox news where he recently offered a rather fidgety indictment of the health care rollout, as well as his appearances on the alex jones radio show, as recently as monday, where mcafee suggested scrapping the whole thing. then again, maybe it's mr. mcafee's rather, how shall i put

it, buxom explanation of how to remove his antiviral software that has proven irresistible to republicans. we could show the rest of that video but we are after all a family show. joining us now is congresswoman loretta sanchez. good afternoon, ma'am. >> good afternoon. >> no one is suggesting that the health care exchanges do not have problems. but does anyone really believe that republicans have the solution? >> well, certainly, my republican colleagues, especially in the house, have given us no alternative. most of them were very against trying to get health care for those who had preexisting conditions, and hadn't been able to get health care for a while. so i've heard nothing from them with respect to what would you put in place. and quite frankly, when i've gone home to california, to orange county, where i represent, people are lined up at computers at the public libraries, and they are calling on the 800-number. we have covered california.

they're in orange county, and most of them are pretty excited that for the first time in a long time, they are going to get some affordable health care. >> but given the problems that exist with the system at this moment, would you be inclined to join the position of some other democrats who have suggested that maybe delaying the mandate would be a good thing? >> well, remember, that states had the opportunity to build their own system, and i come from a state of california, the largest populated state, of course. we have about 38 million people there. and we have our own system. and so far it's worked great. in fact, martin, i was able to go on it and take a look from the same company that provides my federal insurance. i was able to take a look, and noticed that the premium that i pay through the government is just $1 difference through the premium that i would pay in covered california. which means to me that in

covered california, the policies that are there are as if you were working for a large organization. >> okay. but -- >> the negotiations have actually brought the price down. >> okay, but what about your colleagues in states where republican governors have rejected or refused to set up. >> martin, isn't that a shame that so many places refuse to do that. >> but the question -- but the question i'm asking you is, do you think that there ought to be some opportunity in places where this dysfunctionality is rife and perhaps delaying things might be a good thing to do. >> we have delayed it, actually, until march of next year for people to actually go in and purchase it. so most of the time, you're going to be doing it from about october 1st to the end of december and this year we have given it an extra three months. and that's a good thing, because we knew there would be problems. are there problems with that website, absolutely. but remember that this program

is not just a website. it's an 800-number, there are insurance brokers out there who are schooled in this. and are able to sell the policies also. so i think that certainly, i would be the first one to tell president obama that they need to get this -- this internet site up and going the correct way. >> and do you -- >> and not get confused or angry about it. >> so final question to you. do you share the republican view that john mcafee is the answer to those technical problems? >> i certainly don't believe that this gentleman, if you could call him that, is the answer to the technical problems we're having. in fact, many people you know, silicon valley is in california, orange county is one of the largest places for this. much of our brain power from there is now being used to fix these problems on these particular websites. >> congresswoman loretta sanchez, thank you so much. >> thank you. stay with us. a special top lines words without friends edition is right

ahead. >> to demand that this president leave town, to get out. to put the quran down. to get up off his knees, and to figuratively come up with his hands out. >> there are so many things wrong with that. factually, ideologically. graham matcally. this looks like everybody behind him is like shut the [ bleep ] up so we can bid on those storage containers! i'm not big enough or strong enough for this. there should be some way to make it easier. [ doorbell rings ] what is a wetjet? some kind of a mopping device. morty, there's a lot of dirt on here. it's almost like dancing. [ both humming ] the swiffer dance.

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escalating of the. >> congressman allan grayson. >> congressman allan grayson sent out a fund-raising e-mail, comparing the tea party to the ku klux clan. >> he's spelling tea with a flaming cross. >> he spells out tea party. >> the cams reads now you know what the tea stands for. >> and he is standing by it and thinks it's a good thing. >> there are certain things you don't touch in american politics. and you know, this -- referring -- equating somebody to a member of the kkk -- >> next time we do the bags right and then we go full regalia. >> that could be one of them. >> mad as hell, one word. >> marine lieutenant allen west, who is furious. >> this is despicable. this is demeaning. this is disgusting. >> what is driving you absolutely nuts. >> we all know that alan grayson is pretty much a sensationalist. >> get the hell out of the united states of america. >> he can continue to say things

that over the top barack hussein obama like a low-level socialist agitator. that. >> is like former union propaganda. >> about 78 to 81 members of the democratic party that are members of the communist party. >> we continue to hear the worse of this extremist language. >> allen west said, hold on to your seat. >> jihadist language, arsonist, extortion i felt. >> congressman west said president obama showed third world dictator like arrogance. >> created the ku klux clan and the symbol of the burning cross. >> good evening, congressman, trait tough words. >> do you stand by those words? >> and this hypocrisy cannot continue to stand. >> hear hear. let's get right to our panel. joining us is democratic strategist, angela rye. james peterson, who is director of africana studies. mckay, the female representative

from allan grayson, depicts a burning cross, links the kkk to the tea party. do you think it went too far? >> i mean, yes. i think it did. there has certainly been a four-year now running debate about the elements of racism within the tea party. but this went way past any kind of reasonable or rational conversation about race and conservati conservatism. it's interesting, because progressives forever have been saying we need to have a serious substantive, thoughtful conversation about race in this country. republicans claim that they want the to enter into that conversation, as well. but you saw in that montage at the beginning, neither side is really operating within, you know, parameters of civil or thoughtful dialogue. >> angela, what do you think? do you think allan grayson should apologize? >> i don't think allan grayson should apologize. i do understand the commentary around maybe he went too far. what i cannot accept, though, is why we can't really have an hospital conversation about tea party and bigotry.

they continue to promote the kind of bigotry that led mr. grayson to send out this particular e-mail. and enable him to raise funds from it. there are obviously segments of the society that agree with him. if we're talking about, you know, the gop-led or tea party-led succession plan immediately after obama was elected to his second term, or the visceral reaction to obama care, or even romney saying, those people and their free stuff. there is a clear racial tinge to a lot of the rhetoric from the tea party. and there are some even within the republican party itself, which is why someone like judge carlo key put out an announcement saying he's leaving the republican party to become a democrat. so there are some clear discussions that we need to have to his last point. but, yeah, there is definitely some bigotry there we need to discuss. >> professor peterson, what's your reaction to what alan grayson has done? >> so i won't -- i don't know if he should apologize or not.

i think that's interesting is that this -- it is a sensational ad. but it does open the door for us to actually have the conversation that people have been talking about. unfortunately, sometimes that sensationalism leads to the right kind of discourse, which is for a long time now been trying to think about the ways in which the tea party and a small minority within the republican party use the southern strategy, play on issues of race in order to score political points. if you think about the history of populism in this nation and the ways in which race has been used to sort of fragment poor white folk from poor people of color, it seems to me that the rhetoric of the tea party has been coded that way. and so while it's very, very difficult to always pinpoint that, this kind of ad helps to draw more attention to it. but any time we're talking about states' rights, any time you think about the ways in which they were racialized things about entitlements, 47% and so on and so forth. when you talk about secession for some of these states in the south. when you have a number of different -- people running for president, using racially coded language like food stamp president and all this other

stuff, the n word rants, all of the things that came out of that suggest to us there is a there there martin, a racialized discourse that undergirds the rhetoric and at the end of the day, these ads help us get access to the folks who aren't paying attention to social nuances. >> to the point, we have not had a week go by in the last five years when we have not heard some republican somewhere cast aspersions, either on the president's faith, his place of birth, or smearing him on the basis of his race. >> sure. i mean, you know, there is -- i think no question that there are racist people in the conservative movement in the republican party. but, you know, the -- this whole debate about whether the tea party is racist, it's kind of a hard debate to have. it's hard to brand an entire movement the of people who are not all the same, with one big, you know, declaration of racism, right? i think that the question really comes down to is, whether the -- you know, obviously there are

individual crazy people in this movement. the question is whether this movement would have been born out of frustration with a white liberal president. right? >> no. >> and that's -- it's a difficult question to answer, because it's a counter factual. >> angela, quickly, because i want to get to another point. >> really quickly. if you look at allan west's comments about being the modern-day harriet tubman a couple summers ago and comparing black democrats with 21st plantation oversears or obama care is worse than slavery. racism can be can promoted by people of color. there is absolutely that existing in the tea party. >> no doubt. professor peterson, listen to these comments by alan west, the former congressman from florida. take a listen to this. >> where is president obama? you know, here we have the guy that supposedly the first african-american president. the big difference is that the president does not share that same experience that young men such as myself and women have seen and understand what the ku

klux clan represents in this country. especially if you grew up down south. >> so what's he saying, professor? is he saying the president isn't black enough for him? >> listen, it's so strange. i mean, oddly here, mr. west sounds like some of the critics of this president on the left. i wonder if he really is consciously aligning himself with this. let's be very clear. at the moment in which you enter into conversations about authenticity and blackness, you have already lost and you definitely have lost me. because the range of experiences within the black community are expansive. and so you can't dial them down or reduce them to one ticketration of what black identity is. mr. west is obviously not the sort of captain of who is black and who is not. he's just playing into the sort of ways in which you can delegitimize president obama. it can be about where he's born, his religion, is he an authentic black person. all are complete fails. >> that goes back to your earlier point that this is where i question whether the sensationalstics do lead to

productive dialogue. is anyone on the right, anyone on fox news, any conservative honestly engaging the question of racism in the tea party or are they just respond ohhing in an equally visceral kind of inflammatory way? >> unfortunately, you're right. people are generally speaking just defensive any time you want to bring up the term racism. it shuts down conversation. what i'm saying here, though, is, i don't even know if people who consider themselves to be progressive can understand the ways in which we haven't had a comprehensive conversation about race. this ad helps to start that process. >> professor peterson, you're absolutely right. angela rye and mckay coppins, thank you for such a helpful discussion. coming up, a white house twitter mole let's what could. we'll have a live report from the north lawn. stay with us. ♪ so if you have a flat tire, dead battery, need a tow or lock your keys in the car, geico's emergency roadside assistance is there 24/7.

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visiting prime minister of pakistan discuss the issue of drone strikes just a short time ago. the white house has been fielding controversy surrounding the rollout of the affordable care act's website. for more, let's go to the white house and nbc's kristen welker. kristen, kathleen sebelius, the embattled secretary of health and human services, met with insurers today. we also know she'll be in phoenix, away from the first of at least three hearings on the website. how is the white house handling calls for her immediate resignation? >> reporter: martin, they are standing behind her. there is no indication that is going to change. the president has continued to reiterate his full support of her. having said that, and she made this clear in an interview she gave last night, he wants this problem fixed. so she is going to go to a call center tomorrow. she is also going to have public availability tomorrow. and i expect we will be hearing more from secretary sebelius.

she is going to testify next week to a congressional committee. and i think the other important big headline martin, the cms is going to deliver daily briefings about the website. a number of republicans, but also democrats, were calling for more traernls transparency as the obama administration attempts to get to the root of what is wrong. it looks like they have listened. and they very least, they feel this is a smart part of their sort of damage control strategy. they're really trying to take back the narrative on all of this. so they've called in a number of high-tech people who are well-versed in this type of stuff. a tech surge, as they have dubbed it, and hoping to get to the bottom of it. but still no time line for when this will be fix and had that presents a challenge in terms of getting the number of people signed up they need to make this system work. martin? >> thanks so much. nbc's kristen welker. thank you, kristen. another controversy for the white house today has been the unmasking of a twitter mole in

the national security establishment. mr. jovi joseph worked for the national security council and was revealed to be the source of a popular, if gossipy and snarky twitter handle calle callecalled @natsec wonk. one read was humana abidni wearing goggles when she met anthony weiner. steve, you actually kpocorrespod with joseph when you only knew him by his twitter handle. you tweeted today you found the exchanges and i'm quoting you, useful and offensive. did you ever have an inkling that he might be an insider and what was it, you think, that made him so popular? >> i did along the way -- many of us in the foreign policy scene in washington, d.c. at various times, we were outraged by what he wrote. but often so intrigued by what he wrote, that we often thought,

wow, it would be kind of cool if we were, you know, national security wonk. i began to think he might be an insider, based on some of the time -- the timeliness of some of his commentary. i did interact with him. and some of the things he wrote triggered me to call the white house, asking for more information about things. and i had some very good exchanges with him. those were on the internet for a while. but as you know, his profile has been taken, so his responses have been removed. but we often had some very good conversations. but when he went into the deeply personal, snarky or engaged in nasty add wh hominem attacks, ended. i had one particularly bad exchange with him and sort of wrote him off after that. >> what was that about? >> oh, i mean, he began to apply -- he got back to me later, and saying that he did not mean to necessarily be anti gay. but he once wrote, why is clemens so obsessed with chuck

hagel and around the same time -- i mentioned tommy vietor, spokesman for the national security council was out working in a gym we were in, and he said oh, i wonder if see tore feels comfortable with you watching him. sort of an anti gay innuendo and it was very offensive. because it was clear to me he was a very smart, solid, high-quality professional in some aspect of his life. >> and yet also perfectly stupid in others. >> well, he would go into the gutter in pretty terrible ways. so i happen to know him in real-time. and he is a -- you know, michael sheerer put it best of "time" magazine recently. he is to some degree an epitome of often the people he was deriding, solidly part of the foreign policy community here. and i think he just needed this as an outlet for himself. >> steve clemens of the requesting atlantic" thank you for joining us. coming up, pick it, pack it,

fire it up. a new high for marijuana proponents, a new low for the republican governor of maine. but first, man dra drury has the cnbc market wrap. good afternoon. >> stocks closed lower today following weakness in global markets and a pretty mixed bag of earnings reports here at home. the dow losing 54 points. the s&p pulling back after a record run, closing down 8 points. the nasdaq also down by 22. back over to you at msnbc. [ male announcer ] once, there was a man who found a magic seashell. it told him what was happening on the trading floor in real time. ♪ the shell brought him great fame. ♪ but then, one day, he noticed that everybody could have a magic seashell.

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senator jackson claims to be for the people. but he's the first one to give it to the people without providing vaseline. >> the republican governor of

maine, paul lepage, has a particular way with words. a few months ago sources reported him saying that the current president of the united states does not like white people. and this after he said that mr. obama should go to hell. and if that doesn't en dear him to conservatives across the country, perhaps these comments will. >> about 47% of able-bodied people in the estate of maine don't work. >> what? >> about 47%. >> oh! >> yes, that's right. 47%. the exact same figure that mitt romney used en route to his disastrous performance in the last presidential electric. and just like mr. romney's ignorant and ludicrous comments, governor lepage misses the mark completely. because not only is maine's unemployment below the national average at 7%, but also, according to the bangor daily news, around 65% of mainers over the age of 15 are working or are

unemployed and actively seeking work. of the remaining 35%, almost all are retired, caring for children or other family members. or pursuing education or training or have a disability that prevents them from working. smearing the president and attack the poor as feckless freeloaders. who knows, maybe mr. lepage will consider running for president. i'm joined by jimmy williams and josh marshal. jim, can i start with you. first of all, mr. lepage is clearly a dunce when it comes to statistics, because his number is way off. but why go with the same number as mitt romney chose? >> because he's as dumb as mitt romney. actually, mitt romney is smarter than that. that's the saddest part. mitt romney is actually a very smart businessman. the problem with paul lepage, we have yet another one of these republican governors who spouts off at the mouth and just says

whatever he thinks, any time he wants. i mean, listen, i'm from south carolina. trust me, i have plenty of governors in my path have have done things to embarrass me. i would be mortified if i were from the state of maine. here's the problem. he can't even add. he's saying 47%. the real number is 1 in 35% and you put up the stats. they're either on disability, caring for the elderly, et cetera, et cetera. >> or disabled. >> exactly. so not only can he not count, but he's just plain dumb. but mainers, they elected him at 30%. so they deserve what they get. >> josh, what is the goal of politicians like lepage and to some extent, mitt romney and paul ryan last year. demonizing the poor repeatedly? this whole idea of smearing the poor and the disabled as feckless, hopeless free loaders, moochers. >> some of this is sort of the after effects of 2010.

you have governor lepage is like an artifact of that moment in fall 2010 where a lot of pretty wild people were elected. there is something that has changed. you -- there has always been something about the right, about the republican party that has this attitude towards the poor. but it was never so explicit as it is now. >> because people talk about george bush as a compassionate conservative. >> even before then, it was, you know, opportunity. that it's -- that people who aren't working, or are underutilized in work terms, it's because of big government or stuff like that. but it's only in the last few years when you see this very explicit that, like, half the people are taking from us, you know, living off us. mooching off us. and especially for elected officials. and i think what it is, it goes back to a segment of the population, big segment of the population, but a minority that feels like they're on the wrong side of history and feels very threatened. >> absolutely. jimmy, a lot of people, of course, think governor lepage

needs to settle down and chill out. and he might be in luck, because voters in portland, maine, will go to the polls on november the 5th to vote on legalizing the possession of marijuana at a time when 58% of americans are in support of full legislation. do you see nationwide legalization being a real possibility in the near future, jimmy? >> well, i mean, we're seeing this state by state. washington state has it, california now. you're seeing this on the ballot in maine. i think it's inevitable at some point. i think it should be regulated. i think you should -- you should tax the living hell out of it. maybe some of these states can balance their budgets off this. fine with me. i mean, good gosh, it grows everywhere. probably not in maine. they don't have a long growing season. but they can be an importer or wholesal wholesaler, i don't know. those of us -- i have very much the same opinion about marijuana that i do about gay marriage or abortion. if you don't want one, don't get it. if you don't want to smoke pot, don't smoke pot. that doesn't mean i shouldn't be able too. and by the way, i'm not dumb

enough to smoke pot and get behind the wheel of a car or operate machinery or whatever. but it grows out of the ground, for gosh sake. so legalize it, tax the hell out of it, regulate it and let's balance our budgets off it. fine with me. >> i wish we had more time, jimmy williams and josh marshal. thank you both. coming up, the drudge sirn is blazing. one man's desperate and lonely tweet for help. when we come back. ♪ of providing a free world-class education for anyone, anywhere. if you look at a khan academy video, they cover everything from basic arithmetic to calculus, trigonometry, finance. you can really just get what you need at your own pace.

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i just love this one... and it's next to a park. i love it. i love it too. here's our new house... daddy! you're not just looking for a house. you're looking for a place for your life to happen. a final note before we bid farewell this afternoon. last night, matt drudge, the drudge report, tweeted to his vast number of twitter follower,

quote, go to any walmart at 3:00 in the morning and people-watch and you will understand deeply why obama is president and why the nation is where it is. what are we to make of this tweet? is this some half-baked or perhaps in his case fully baked swipe at americans working so hard during the day they have to do their shopping at night? is it a mildly paranoid dig at the men and women working the overnight shift to support their families? maybe mr. drudge forgets that walmart's walton family heirs lined up with their pocket books in hand to support mitt romney and indeed many congressional republican candidates in 2012. or maybe he has inadvertently revealed a particular penchant for parking lot voyeurism. we'll leave it to the first person to respond oh to us is sinkly sum it up. drudge, sounds like you live a super weird life. thanks so much for watching. michael eric dyson sits in for