>> spoken like a true christian. thanks so much for watching. coming up right now, my friend ed schultz and "the ed show." good evening americans and welcome to "the ed show" live from new york. let's get to work. >> in the last few days i've been in london. >> tell me what you've been doing? >> speaking about american politics tonight. it's the moral sensibility of who we are as a people that's been threatened in our country right now. >> what worries me, if anyone does not work, neither should they eat. thou protests too much.

>> she needs to sort her priorities. >> teach a man how to fish. he can feed himself for a life. don't simply feed fish. >> she sleeps with the fishes. >> how do you know about him? >> elementary, my dear watson. >> what is our heart and what is our soul as a country is what the next generation is going to have to answer. well, is america going to figure this whole thing out when it comes to jobs, the economy, health care, paying the bills, interesting questions from the folks at oxford. as one brit said to me, it appears that the gentleman from texas seems to be causing quite a bit of difficulty as of late. i couldn't disagree with that at all. i just got back from across the pond. first time i've ever been to london. i was afforded the opportunity to speak at oxford university at the oxford debating society. i got a real insight into the way the world actually views

america in troubled times, at least in london. had a lot of conversation with folks on the street. of course, i was a tourist. you know how it is. my wife and i toured around london, visited big ben. had to do that. saw the queen's boat. it wasn't up for rental or i would have taken it out. visited the thames river and saw the tower bridge. also with a very serious attitude went to see the world war ii airfield museum at ducksford. being an aviation buff i have always been enamored are the sacrifice of world war ii and what we did as a country. this was the home of the eighth air force that lost 6,346 american aircraft, most of them were b-17s. it was the home of "the memphis bell," the movie produced there in ducksford back in 1992. this is just outside the ducksford air memorial, and the

numbers of americans that -- the number of lives that were lost and the sacrifice that was given. when you go around london, you see monument after monument of sacrifice of people that just were called on to save the world. and i coupled the sacrifice of that generation in my talk at action ford as to what is our sacrifice today, as not only a country, but as a world? is it going to be a world war like we saw back then? probably not. but the sacrifice changes, but the heart and the emotion and the soul of what we have to do as a people pretty much stays the same. you can't go over there to see this huge machinery that we developed as a country at the time -- it reminded me of a time in america where we actually built things, where we were going from automobiles and going from refrigerators and we were

actually manufacturing things now into a war machine to save the world. because of that we kept an extremist from ruling the world. back then the world had a very positive view of america. we could do whatever was put in front of us. today in the news, of course, we're all upset about a web page that's not working and there's no way it's going to get fixed. it just frustrates me. today's america's international reputation i believe has been damaged because of our politics. are we reliable? will we pay our bills? are we ever going to stop bickering and realize the absolutes of what the american people want? it's because of guys right here, the selfish politicians that only think of themselves. they took us to the verge of a global economy falling apart. we were the hostage in an attempt to deny 30 million people in this country health care. they have lost, i believe, a great deal of global

credibility. the conversation is so much different today. talk from republicans like this i believe had the entire world on the edge. >> i would do anything, and i will continue to do anything i can to stop the train wreck that is obama care. >> are you saying if he continues to refuse to negotiate, the country is going to default? >> that's the path we're on. >> there is no such thing as a debt ceiling in this country because it's never been not increased. >> if you don't raise the debt ceiling, what that means is you'd have a balanced budget. it doesn't mean you wouldn't pay your bills. >> i think all the talk about a default has been a lot of demagoguery, a lot of false demagoguery. >> should we be proud of the fact that we're the only industrialized country in the world that has a conversation like that? republicans brought the global economy to the brink of financial unknown, and the world for that matter, took notice. i spoke about this with the students at oxford university.

>> the fact that we don't realize because of our selfishness that we could bring the entire world financial system to the verge of collapse because we have decided we don't want to pay our bills. what we have committed to is a legislative body, and the president cannot spend a dime. what the legislative body has decided to commit to all of a sudden because of not being able to get their political way, has even entered the discussion that we would burden your country or others who have thought america was a good investment. and we've had the discussion, well, maybe we won't pay this bill because, number one, we don't like the president, we do not believe in his agenda for health care in america, so we will obstruct him and stop him

at all costs. >> that is simply not the america that the brits new of yesteryear. one brit told me many london, as america's economy goes, so does great britain's. republicans need to realize when they play games with default, their actions affect the entire world. the people i spoke to in london also call republicans extremist. they couldn't believe a small group of radical republicans could have that much power and possibly inflict that much damage on the world. i want to point out there is nothing extreme about social security. there's nothing extreme about medicare and medicaid, and there's nothing extreme about providing every american with health care. we are way behind the curve. i believe this and so do the folks across the pond. i tweeted out, man on the street conversation in the uk.

why does your media want health care to fail? now, this was several days ago in london when i tweeted this out. they don't have these conversations. they've gone beyond that. their media doesn't attack universal health care the way we do. is there view of humanism different? are we that far behind the curve? do we really believe that we must have political gain and put people's lives aside? you know, you go overseas and you talk to folks and you get a different view about what america is all about. we're having fights over things that have been decided years ago in other countries. and the sacrifice, what is our next sacrifice going to be? i'll tell you it's going to be

financial. we have income inequality in this country that is unbelievable. we have the vulcher chart as it continues to separate. we have the middle class being charged a hell of a lot more and not being able to move forward. we've got the top 2% who are controlling it all and the corporate interests running our elections, and these folks are okay with it. how are we going to overcome that? the challenge for the progressive movement is to talk about sacrifice. the wealthiest americans to keep our financial house in order are going to have to pay more, and i believe progressives and liberals in this country are going to have to not be timid about saying that during budget negotiations. we have corporations that don't pay any tax. we have money parked offshore, dodging the tax code, or should we say should we change the tax code to ensure there's more

fairness in the system? that's the sacrifice, the next sacrifice. if we think we can play with disaster every 60 days in this country and have it not affect our reputation in the world, we're mistaken in a big, big way. are we reliable? i hope so. the people speak in every poll out there and every election so far, we don't want medicaid, medicare and social security butchered the way republicans want to do it. and we want more fairness when it comes to taxation when it comes to wealthiest americans. i want to know what you think. have republicans policies ruined our standing in the world? text a for yes, b for now to 67622. you go to our blog at ed.msnbc.com. for more on this, let me bring in congresswoman jan schakowsky

of ill now. >> good to be with you. >> have we learned any lessons, has washington learned any lessons? have the republicans gotten out of this deep, dark cave and realizing people are kind of watching what we're doing? >> it's not just the rest of the world. i think most americans, as you pointed out, ed, in the polls most people want to have health care, they want obama care, they don't want it to be repealed, they want it to be fixed. most people are against cuts in medicare and social security and the s.n.a.p. program, the old food stamp program. i think that republicans really i hope learned at least in part a lesson in the final vote that opened the government and made us -- allowed us to pay our bills, that this was a losing battle. they lost big on that.

more importantly, i think come the next election, if we do just what you said, make sure people are really looking at the major problem in our country which is income inequality. that's what's really hurting our economy. hopefully they will create new jobs and build a better better class, then i think the democrats will prevail and we'll be able to really move forward. looking at the history of england and the coordination between the americans and the brits, there was an attitude, and it's very clear in reading all the history that there was never any question about whether we were going to be able to succeed. in today's media right now, we're having a big discussion about whether a website can work so people can get health care, and that's our big problem. it's almost as if we blow up problems to the point like we can't achieve much in this country anymore at all.

it's almost depressing, and i hate to use that word on television. but we as americans follow this political fight that is going on in washington. is it damaging the country to the point where we don't believe we can get anything done anymore, including fixing a website? >> of course it's sory doik laos, because the real issue is that we're going to finally provide health care or make it available to all americans, millions of people who have pre-existing conditions or have never had health insurance as all. as the president said, this is far more than a website and of course it's going to be fixed. in fact, in 2006 when medicare part d was rolling out, the secretary of health and human services, leavitt, on the 53rd day after the rollout was saying, well, you know, when you roll out something this big, of course, there's going to be problems, but we're making progress. so we've been there before. but the republicans act as if this is a new thing, that we

should repeal it because the website doesn't work. it's crazy. >> they will take any more sell of information to be negative because they want to change the law. congresswoman jan schakowsky, thanks for joining us. now let's bring in msnbc director richard wolffe. good to have you with us tonight. interesting country. i thoroughly enjoy it. you know what i noticed about people in london cafes, they are consumed with reading newspapers. in america we're all on our machine, on our iphone and blackberry, everything else. but it is a huge northbound town which tells me they go beyond the headline. they actually want the devil in the detail. how do you think we're viewed based on what we've gone through as a country, the shutdown, almost didn't pay our bills and here we go again in 60 days? >> a couple things. in the uk they look at europe, countries like greece and say here is a bunch of countries on the brink of default because they cannot afford to pay their

bills. how come america, the world's richest country, the biggest economy in the world is willingly, intentionally putting itself in the same position of greece or portugal or spain or italy? it makes no sense at all. what that does is it reinforces really ugly cliches that america doesn't know how to run itself, what is going on? there's a lot of great good will to the president, still very popular overseas, especially in europe. but they do not understand -- remember there's a conservative prime minister in the uk. they're all about we are for fiscal responsibility. they would never flirt with default just like the conservatives here. >> so this has taken america into new territory in the eyes of the world, almost to the point we're unpredictable. >> you have to say the conservatives here, especially the tea party, have weakened america's standing in the world. no question about it. when it was democrats who were questioning whether there should be a war on terror, they were

told they were unpatriotic. i don't see that same language going at republicans. there has been just as much damage to the world, maybe much more damage to america's standing in the world by saying we're ready to default compared to democrats saying should we invade iraq, for instance. >> they're having the same conversations in the uk as we're having here when it comes to pensions, when it comes to workers rights, unions, health care and the expenses and how to control it. there's a huge austerity push there as well. what we do in our congress, does it affect their mindset over there? the world economic councils when they get together, international monetary fund and they all meet globally, they all talk, oh, gosh, we can't pay these bills. >> we've got a democratic president here, the growth there without that extreme austerity. there's been spending cuts here but nothing like what it's been over there. growth here they can only dream about over there.

austerity hasn't worked for them. talk about second world war, the socialized medicine they have came out of the second world war, kcame out of a shared sens of responsibility. rich and poor, it's immoral to think that someone who is wealthy deserves or should have a right to a better health system. you faced the same bombs, faced the same bullets. you should have the same health care. they did that after the second world war when the country was on its needs. they could barely afford it. it remains popular with a conservative prime minister. they look at this debate and say, okay, you want people to not go bankrupt. what about getting the same kind of level about health care, the same care and attention? >> richard wolffe, thanks so much. remember to answer tonight's question, share your responses on twitter and facebook. we always want to know what you think. talk about inflation, john stossel has inflated ideas about

the federal reserve. ted cruz may lead the crusade against obama care, but wait till you hear where he gets his health coverage. stay with us.

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watch over all drilling activity twenty-four-seven. and we're sharing what we've learned, so we can all produce energy more safely. our commitment has never been stronger. a time for the frienders in social meade yeah. you can find us on facebook, twitter and on ed.msnbc.com and on the radio monday through friday noon to 3:00, sirius channel 127. now, you have decided and reare reporting. here are today's top trenders. >> what does that mean? >> the number three trender. >> fox and fed. >> northwest americans don't know what the fed is. >> it has the power to destroy your savings. >> it can wreck your life. >> john stos el wheels out inflated rhetoric. >> they basically printed $4 trillion. >> dollar, dollar, bills y'all.

>> miraculously so far we haven't had rampant inflation. after world war i in germany, people had to go to the grocery store with a wheelbarrow full of cash to buy groceries. that helped bring on hitler. >> you might have to take that to a dunkin' donuts some day to buy a latte. the number two trender, ub 45. >> hillary clinton received a resounding standing ovation as she walked on stage to speak at ub's alumni arena. >> hillary clinton avoids talking about 2016. >> perhaps you could describe for us what the ideal candidate for the presidency would look like in three years. >> i'm not as interested in what the candidate looks like as what the candidate stands for. >> but didn't take any bull at the university of buffalo. >> at one point a man got up and began shouting benghazi, you let them die. >> we have to be willing to come

together as citizens to focus on the kind of future we want, which doesn't include yelling. it includes sitting down and talking with one another. today's top trender, dose of hypocrisy. >> could, would you with a goat? >> i will do anything and i will continue to do anything i can to stop the train wreck that is obama care. >> while he fights against obama care, tez cruises on his wife's health insurance. >> now will the senator answer my question, whether his family is protected by the government administered federal employee health benefit program? >> i'm hell jibl for it, not currently covered under sglit most things can be fixed with duct tape and extension cords. >> see, america, you don't need health care. if you have a medical emergency, go to home depot. joining me, e.j. dion an msnbc contributor, columnist from "the washington post."

e.j., great to have you with us. >> great to be with you. >> what kind of reaction should america have to a man such as ted cruz having a cadillac insurance policy while he works to take insurance away from millions of americans who need it? >> well, i think they should be upset. when i heard what we were talking about, i went back and looked up one of my favorite quotations which says the law in its majestic equality forbids the rich and the poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets and to steal bread. and the rich and the poor alike are equally free to buy health insurance, except a whole lot of people among the working poor can't afford health insurance. too many people in the senate, in the house of representatives and in a lot of other parts of our society including those who work in the media, have never had the experience of putting off doctor's visits over and

over again for our kids, never had the experience of having to say, oh, gee, i need that prescription, but i don't have the money for it so i won't buy it or have had to get all of our health care through hospital emergency rooms. the notion that it's somehow an outrage that the government which already and rightly provides health insurance, the rest of america that can't afford health insurance to get everybody covered, the notion that that's an awful and evil thing that threatens socialism, that's a terrible idea. >> cruz's spokesman says being on his wife's plan means it's no cost to taxpayers. but between the government subsidies for employer-sponsored insurance and goldman sachs getting $10 billion in t.a.r.p. money, aren't we still paying for cruz's insurance in a round-about way? >> anybody who has employer provided health insurance does benefit from a big tax break.

it's true in our society that there are a lot of things that the government loses revenue on, which is essentially like spending, that gives benefits to -- we should acknowledge middle class people but also very rich people and gives no benefit at all to working poor people, and so, yeah, this raises the point that we currently have a health care policy that keeps 40 million people off insurance and that's what we want to change and that's why i really hope that for all these terrible problems that they're having on the computers, on the websites, they need to fix them. but whole idea of obama care is right, you've got to get insurance to people who don't have it. >> there's 20 million people that have hit this website in a short period of time. the true story behind all this we'll touch on a little later in this broadcast which tom harkin told me later today on the radio, they never had the proper funding and infrastructure to

get this thing done from the start because the conservatives made this their mantle to knock down president obama across the board. but the big picture in all of this about where it's working, where it's not working, is those states who have gone into the medicaid expansion. this is a big part of it as well. the states that have obstructed, that's where the problems are coming. your thoughts? >> exactly right. first of all, the states running their own exchanges where the governors, mostly republicans, didn't take a powder and walk away, like kentucky, those exchanges are working pretty well. the medicaid expansion is working well. i believe that oregon has already signed up 60,000 people and there were five million americans, mostly in the south, a lot of them but by no means all of them members of racial minorities who are being cut off from the possibility of getting health insurance because of decisions by their states,

enabled by a conservative supreme court decision to say we're not going to give our people health care. there should be a lot more outrage about this. >> all of these human interest stories are going to be outweighing and really outmuscling and winning the argument at the end of the day with all the antis out there trying to destroy the law, not the bill, the law. it's here. you can't turn anywhere without getting negative talk about obama care. it's all over the place. we have had generations in the past in this country that would take on any challenge except the challenge, america was great, we could get it done. our air waves are permeated with negative talk and a hope for failure. we're talking about people's lives here. i just don't -- i'm amazed by it. e.j.dionne, always great to have you on "the ed show."

>> great to be here. thank you. the republicans think they're rolling out experts, especially when it comes to the obama care launch. plus a utah senator has daddy issues and hannity is there with open arms. next i'm taking your questions live on ask ed live. we're right back on "the ed show" on msnbc. [ mixer whirring ] my turn daddy, my turn! hold it steady now. i know daddy. [ dad ] oh boy, fasten your seatbelts everybody. [ mixer whirring ] bounty select-a-size. it's the smaller powerful sheet,

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mouth sores to address possible life-threatening conditions. talk about your alcohol use, liver disease and before you reduce or stop cymbalta. dizziness or fainting may occur upon standing. take the next step. talk to your doctor. cymbalta can help. welcome back to "the ed show." "ask ed live," my favorite segment. we love hearing from you. tonight our first question from debby roy. what did you like most about london? well, we were only over there for three days. i enjoyed a lot of things in london. it was fun. one thing i was impressed with was the level of awareness of the citizens when it came to current events. i didn't run into any people that were -- seem totally disconnected. i think you can do that sometimes in america. i was impressed by it.

our next question is, should the gop be afraid if the tea partiers force them to choose ted cruz as their candidate in 2016? please, please picketed cruz, republicans! you won't do that for ed, will you? he's an extremist. there's no way an extremist would be elected president of the united states. i hope not. i think it would bring forward a serious divide within the party. i don't think he'll get the nomination, but you never know. would they be afraid? yeah, there would be a lot of gopers of raid. we'll have a lot more coming up on "the ed show." stay tuned. i'm mandy drawerry with your cnbc market rap. the nasdaq climbing by 21. the number of people filing for unemployment benefits fell by

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welcome back to "the ed show." let's cut to the chase. obama care's rollout, okay, has hit a few setbacks. i get it. it probably has something to do with 20 million people hitting the website. wouldn't you know, suddenly everyone is an expert on rollouts. >> when you look at the problems with obama care, all the focus here lately has been on the website. clearly there's problems with the website. but i would argue that the

problems go much further than that. >> just like katrina, when the big problem that president bush had was diminishing the significance of what was happening, way to go brown knee, you had the president yesterday talking about glitches and kinks. >> katrina was a storm. >> conan said the other night obama is urging americans having trouble with the website to call a 1-800 number, 1-800, we didn't think this through. >> the rollout of obama care is nothing short of a debacle. we all know the website doesn't work. >> it's another day and a new glitch for the obama care rollout. >> nothing works. nothing at all. we have no solutions. it's terrible, the world is terrible. how many of these critics do you think have firsthand experience when it comes to rolling out a business? this is coming from the party that did everything in their

power to sabotage this law from the get-go. republicans refuse to authorize requests from the obama administration for additional funding to do it the right way. republican governors across the country have chosen to opt out of medicaid expansion which will leave millions of poor americans uninsured. republicans shut the government down and, of course, they brought us to the brink of default in attempt to defund the law that they hate. we're supposed to believe all of a sudden they're the experts on rollout. they're the ones. and suddenly they really care about 48 million americans who were uninsured in 2012 which might explain the traffic the website is experiencing. you think? instead of criticizing this rollout, we should be focusing on the signs of high demand. but republicans are doing their very best to prevent americans from seeing the benefits of this law because they know -- once americans experience the

benefits, they won't care about website malfunctions. some of the republican theater here is working. even democrats, congressman rick nolan who is a friend of mine, but i take issue here, are calling for the president to get some swift action. >> i really believe he needs to man up, step up, and i feel that the people responsible for this did a terrible disservice to the affordable care act and to the president by allowing this thing to go forward when they knew it wasn't ready. >> the disservice has been the lack of cooperation by republicans who have fought this president and denied elections. no one is denying that the obvious issues are there with the affordable health care act's website. it is not the law. it's the glitches. all of this is going to get fixed. all the sabotaging,

self-anointing rollout experts need to take a backstep for just a moment and say, you know what? we've got smart people. if we fund this and resource it properly, we will get this fixed. fixing is not what the republican party is all about. joining me now are the two men that helped create both romney care and the affordable health care act, john mcdonagh, professor at harvard school of public health and jonathan gruber, a professor of economics at m.i.t. gentlemen, great to have you with us tonight. mr. mcdonagh, what was it like rolling out the health care plan in massachusetts and your thoughts on what we are seeing right now as this unfolds? >> it was very controversial. it had lots of people throwing political rocks at it from all directions. it didn't go quickly out of the gate. it took time to build up. people had to become familiar with it. people needed time to shop, to

look, to understand their choices, and five to six years later, the law is working well. we're actually feeling a little lonely up here in massachusetts these days since for the five years after it passed, it seemed like the "wall street journal" and the conservative media had to have at least one big article a week telling everybody how bad it was and since the election a year ago, we feel a little bit like the maytag repairman now because it's very clear in massachusetts the law is working well, and i think that's what the country can look forward to with the affordable care act once we get over this very difficult and complicated implementation process. >> professor gruber, your thoughts on where we are now? >> i think john has it exactly right. the first month that individuals who pay premiums, 123 people signed up. by the end of the year it was 40,000. it takes time to set these

things up. this is a difficult issue. individuals are trying the sign up for something they won't even get until january 1st. so there's no need to panic. as john mack donna and my colleague wrote, we don't evaluate it minute by minute, week by week. we should take a slow look every month and it will be up and rolling by january 1. >> senator tom harkin explained it this way on my radio today. >> for the last three years in my appropriations committee, i've tried to get the money in there that they needed to get these private contractors to set this system up. i've been denied that money, so they've had to skrim and try to figure it out. so what happened is that hhs and i believe cms, the center for medicaid services, decided, well, since they didn't have the money they thought they would have to go out and hire oracle and all these big places to do it and set it up and test it, well, they're going to have to do it in house.

well, they didn't quite have all the expertise, but they didn't have the money they should have had to get the private sector to come in and set it up. that's because of the republicans. they would not let us fund it. >> professor mcdonough, your comment to that? this is an absolute. it takes money to buy whiskey. if you're going to do it on the cheap, there's going to be more problems. fair enough? >> absolutely. i think senator harkin is very on target. i worked on the senate health committee he chaired. during the process the conservative voices said we have to allow the states to set up their own exchanges. it has to be done that way. that's how the law was written, to give the states the right to step up and do it. we thought all the conservative states would jump up and do it, and then all the conservative states decided to hold back and say, no, we're going to let the federal government do it and we're not going to give the federal government the resources to do the job as well as it could be done. there's a lot of irony and more

than a little bit of hypocrisy in some of their complaints right now. >> professor gruber, this was never framed osh organized or put together with the mindset that there would be such rejection that we've seen? >> what's ironic here is the republicans are rejecting the part of this law which is using private health insurance markets to expand health insurance coverage. this is an idea promoted by the heritage foundation to use these exchanges to promote the organized purchase of private health insurance. republicans, by denying the funding to make exchanges work well, or denying the functioning of the private health insurance market, we need to let this work. states need to expand their medicaid programs. you mentioned this earlier, and we need the state to do what's possible to make the law work. >> both of you confident that this, too, shall pass, professor gruber? >> absolutely. remember, the key date is not january 1st, march 31st. that's when the mandate kicks

in. by that date it will be fine. >> mr. mcdonough, your thoughts? >> january 1st is a key date. after january 1st no american can be denied coverage for a pre-existing condition. the sushs difficults kick in. the medicaid expansions go into effect in states that are doing it. it's a fundamental change and a very important date coming forward. we'll get there and get beyond this. >> in the meantime, political opposition has all the ammunition in the world to make the case to the american people that this will not be successful. you be the experts on romney care and also the affordable care act bring us to a level of wisdom that their political fodder just doesn't work, the good stories and what this is going to bring to america is what we need to focus on. >> great to have you with us, gentlemen. coming up, the war for fair wages from walmart kicks into high gear. stay with us.

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welcome back to "the ed show." this is the story for though folk who is take a shower after work. low pay workers of walmart have had enough. are blasting the employer calling the executives welfare kings. earlier this week the president and ceo of u.s. walmart stores gave a presentation at the goldman sachs retail conference. one of the slides in his presentation said that over 475,000 of walmart's u.s. employees earned more than $25,000 last year. meaning the majority of walmart, 1.23 million member workforce, is paid less than $25,000 a year. now, that statistic was listed under the heading "great job opportunities." i'd say it's hardly something to brag about. the 2013 poverty guideline for a family of four is $23,550.

meaning a full-time working at walmart gets a family of four barely above the poverty line. our walmart. it says it's rare for workers to be scheduled for a full-time 40-hour week. dozens of walmart workers walked off the job in protest of management demanding they be given full-time work. let's bring in robert greenwald who directed "walmart: the high cost of low price." good to have you with us tonight. i find it interesting that the head of walmart of the american stores would come forward and say -- make the case that $25,000 a year is a really good living and people ought to be really excited about that. >> yes. well, that's from a company, ed, that made $17 billion last year in profit. and pays the average worker

$8.81 an hour. >> so walmart's argument is that everyone has the opportunity to build the kind of career they want. and many associates advance to salaries much higher than $25,000. so why do organizations like our walmart even exist? >> well, the reason that the organizations exist in making change at walmart exists is because they're fundamentally not paying people for their work. one of the biggest subsidies that you and every taxpayer is paying for is the number of things walmart need because company won't pay them. food stamps and home savings and all kinds of things. so the notion that we are paying so that the walton family worth over $144 billion can have more profit is really an obscenity. >> what do you say when they say it's the free market.

people are willing to work for these wages. >> they're willing to work for these wages because walmart is the single business force in driving down wages, in not paying people what they're worth, and taking advantage of an economy which is in deep, deep trouble. and the job of all of us and those great organizations and the people at walmart is to insist, pay me a fair wage. i'm willing to work hard. give me what is my due. >> what impact is this video around the country and these kinds of demonstrations, what's your anticipation on what kind of impact this is going to have on walmart? >> as we saw when we made the film about walmart, remember they're not a political party. they are selling you goods. they're concerned about the brand. they're concerned about tarnishing the brand. and they're concerned about the fact that walmart has one of the most negative associations of any brand across the country. that turns shoppers off and that begins to hurt their bottom line. >> do you think they'll change? >> i hope