better like that first man a second look at what nature was like right at the beginning of the universe tells us more about what you are says made of and how it's put together and in many ways we can't do that without making new experiments to recreate those conditions because nature is so cold now we're thirteen billion years after the big bang so we have to do something to recreate their early early conditions to get access to see things that were there right at the creation the start of our universe evolving ok neal in london also all right let's say what we just heard you know we can find out we can find out those things through these experiments so what yeah so what. well i mean first of all it's basic science and basic science has always been an imperative for human beings we always wanted to understand our own environment ourselves where we come from what might happen to us so in a sense there is it's just answering fundamental questions about our own existence and some of some scientists will argue that you don't need more for justification

than that but saying that there are enormous benefits to understanding our environment our understanding nature around us you just have to go back to the early twentieth century when quantum physics was happening and i'm sure people would have wondered about the whole importance of trying to understand the underpinnings of that level and today what we're doing talking across continents using television and sophisticated electronics all of that is possible only because we understand matter at that level so you know the sort question may not be obvious when we are doing the experiments but it eventually does become very very useful and it is a basic human impulse ok i don't i'm going to guard i mean is this a good idea this collider is this is a step forward we're going in the road right direction is when i talk about the expense of it and what we get out of it later but how do you feel about these experiments here recreating the big bang and all the. because he did tension is

wonderful as long as we six are taking into account science is something very very positive and the question the problem is only that there are some risks here which are not being addressed enough otherwise the attention is nice and even don't really say that the big bang is just an ideology but maybe the man would find out whether the beeping is kuwait or not with an experiment eventually there for such experiments are important nonetheless in this case there is an internet risk which must not be taken ok ok otto can you expect can you extrapolate on that what is the risk you're saying there is risk can you give us a percentage the you know the chances of something going wrong because a collider had some problems not long ago and they fixed it so it can break i suppose so what are the risks. it could i was actually running at the moment as far as i know and the risk is proportional to the number of collisions being made or

have already been made. and the risk is absurd i mean. in nature you see there was some from somebody called bacon in the history of his science who said that man has to fight with nature people don't know that anymore that it's sometimes dangerous to fight with nature and sometimes nature is fighting back in my experience here is that this is such a complicated situation it has happened that several problems have been overlooked which mean that this is a true in horse this experiment everybody is happy to have it but unfortunately it might mean the end of the of the planet ok jordan that's a pretty big statement coming from that's what this is this is just scaremongering go ahead it's clearly just scaremongering i mean what we're doing is is actually

doing something that happens all the time in nature and the unique thing we're doing is we're putting a collision it happens all the families are in a situation in a lot of oratory where we're going along with it comes out our journey you want to continue to be like i do know better i do know that go ahead george if i can give a few details i mean what all those worried about is that there's there's something serious i think this is one of the really might create make i'm going to stick. i'm going jordan one more time given it give it a shot where you can say we're making mistakes but yet ok so what i'm trying to say to all those worried and many people have been worried by the idea that we may have noticed many black holes in the in the collision ok and you can argue in essence one of the predictions is that. is that this could happen and the argument i'm making is simply that in fact what we're doing the collisions we're making in the laboratory happen all the time in nature it's not something that we wouldn't see happening around us if if these kind of collisions made many black holes that were

able to eat planets it would have happened nature is doing this constantly all right i mean i'd like to go to you how do you know. i don't like to go to anyone london here i mean how safe is this because in researching this program i came across contrarian voices there was a petition before the machine was turned on to have it not turned on to take that seriously or not i'm not a scientist but there are people concerned out there is this an exaggerated concern . i think it's an exaggerated concern i mean there was just to give you an example in two thousand there was a collator starting up in the united states called rick c. and similar concerns when great were raised about the rate being able to produce something called a strange little particle that will eventually devour the earth and nothing like that has happened at all there is agree with jordan completely this is a lot of scaremongering and you know it's interesting that it's just the same people talking about this there or. you can go to the cern web site and for

instance look up all the papers that have been written on this and have been peer reviewed by scientists so you know one thing i would like to point out that these are you know thousands of scientists who are working on this project and we know the thousands of scientists are working on this project a lot of you know their careers are stake and they don't want to be devoured by a black hole i mean that would be silly so you know there might be noble prices in there waiting for some people and to think that all of that will go to waste because you know if a black hole they're not foolish enough to do that themselves so you have to keep that in mind not foolish you know ok i know go ahead go ahead oh no go ahead you know so they are avoiding to this concept to discuss this group sweetly and really think. this is a completely tremendous amount of discussion. no no not with me i mean let me just say that i mean i think there are certain scientists have taken very seriously the

objections and actually gone through and calculated no they have not. some things that are against the science they have done you know it's. going to be material you don't publish as a full document. ok and i think. it's not ok. theories tell us one for you ok otto i mean what we have two other gases saying that the risks have been checked very carefully i went to the website i looked at all of the objections and they gave answers to what i mean why are you not satisfied with that they have not looked. selectively answered only those questions which seemed safe to do but we fusing to discuss the dangers that have not been disproved is not science ok can you give us one example should you give it more now could you give us one example yes. yes. what already has been

said but by gordon a few minutes ago then we did the same thing was was happening all the time and therefore this must be safe this is in that in one sense it just clicked in another sense it is a lie so we to say used that word because there's a difference between two trains hitting both in the same direct both with the same speed so we don't know how it i'm looking on this screen this is not the same thing as if you do the same thing in such a way that the two things that the whole thing is moving at a high speed this is called. momentum conservation and if if one particle is at rest and the other is hitting very fast as it happens all the time then the producta the little black hole that might be generated would be itself very very fast and therefore it would go right through the earth ok all right all right gentlemen if there is after a short break we will continue our discussion in the large hadron collider stay

with archie. it.

i am served nature and discover is. the. least the communicate with the wild and learn. test yourself and become free. see what nature can give you a nazi. wealthy british style. that's not on the.

markets finance scandal if find out what's really happening to the global economy with max cons are for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines to name two kinds a report on our. fixed for. fifty ft. fixed. welcome back cross talk time peter lavelle tree mind you were talking about whether the large hadron collider poses a threat to humanity or is a unique tool of discovering. it.

before let's see what russians think about this the large hadron collider or l. of c. is a twenty seven kilometer long particle accelerator on the swiss franc border first experiments were held there in two thousand and eight and because assists hold the elysee will help answer some of the most fundamental questions about the nature of our universe color some cold cold to let collider fearing the poet unleashes could swallow their public opinion foundation poll found thirty six percent of russians think l.h. c. is dangerous call humankind and the other thirty one percent disagree believing that collider poses no threat by the same token russians listed the l h c a launch as one of the top three most important events of two thousand and nine back to you . ok and you know i'd like to go back to you in london you know that the critics of

the of this these types of experiments say that you could actually really change the world that we're maybe maybe not creating a black hole that will swallow the world up in the rest of the universe but i mean we really you guys are really on the edge here is a is what are the chances that something could go wrong that you would use it you would find out something that you never expected and you know in my limited knowledge of this studying for the program you guys are really out there on the edge. you mean what could happen in terms of the end it seemed functioning and something happening that changes what i was saying this guy or you guys is on a large has everything been thought about that you could discover or uncover or trigger well peter i'm a journalist so i talk to the scientists to find out what they have been thinking about these things and as far as i can be i get that sure go ahead jordan.

go ahead i mean i think one of the reasons we do scientists is to find out what's out there and in fact we have some ideas of what might be there but we don't know all the answers and by studying we find new things and you know some time later we actually understand what it all means when we discovered how the atom was put together we didn't know we'd be able to harness the energy from it when we discovered how electrons and quantum mechanics and you're brought up earlier these are things fundamental discoveries that you don't know you're going to find and that's why we go looking for things now when it comes to triggering things i just repeat what i said before we're not triggering things we're exploring we're looking in new corners and finding out new things we're giving humanity more information about the world we live in and eventually that may lead to us being able to do things we didn't think possible today but it's one of the things about voyages of discovery you don't know where you're going to go until you actually go there what do you think about that are you that if this could go ahead i know this is correct as far as yes science is like this and it's a wonderful interval and want to just use the standards of safety so if if there is

someone who says there is a lowly. piece of luggage on an airplane airport this is sufficient to launch an investigation with this could not be a bone and if someone has provided such evidence there's evidence must not be suppressed from the public and the world because if you do that you use violence against the world and this is what susan is doing at the moment as long as these concerns have not been disproved it's not just opinions it's proof that has been given of danger ok i know there's a proof of danger i don't know you make it sound like this is talking too much you know no you're not and you can never talk too much on this program but you're making it sound like certain is a conspiracy is that what you're saying yes that's correct yes there's not just conspiracy hiding out there through thousands of letters this is perhaps a turn i think we have to jump in here because this this is just since you guys have to present. we're going to jump in anytime you want go and we'll go right

ahead we have jimmy and i mean this sounds this this is been an auto has been saying this over and over again i've heard him speak about this many a time and you would think that scientists elsewhere are fools not to pay attention to such claims i mean you know they have looked into all these concerns and then the committees oh look there's no it's pronounced no i disagree completely and jordan will also speak to it ok jordan can you jump in there please go ahead as a conspiracy is just george go ahead please i mean the idea of this concern is a conspiracy is. absolutely madness i mean it is a completely. one of those who do believe it leads to our scientists all throughout the world share information. like this or how the information these are tens of thousands of scientists can you give us why there is no exemption being hidden whatsoever can you can you give us one example where cern is lying to the scientific community and the rest of us one example yes yes. it is this example

that we already heard from jordan they did was the same thing so it's doing it was nature is doing but there's a difference which we don't talk about. and this difference. because for a shame to pay to address exactly that point absolutely it's. exactly this objection. all right it is not true so i mean i don't buy this was really serious business to really seriously obviously it's something that we wouldn't want to do and have any risk it all has the. they want to have a minute to explain just a little bit ok very quickly i don't because i want to hear from our other guest to please go ahead. yes. now. it's not so easy you see. there are proofs of. feature just to it's just a shortened this

a little bit i mean the concern that ought to have been voicing this over and over again and there is you can go to the certain web site and they address it directly so i don't think we should waste too much time on something of this new law and i have been to the one i did i visited the website before we did the program and as i agree with jordan i looked at all of the objections and i looked at all of the answers and i'm asking otto here if why are you not satisfied with that because i come across in the blogs fear that we could be you know geneva could disappear in a nanosecond ok and no one's explained to me why that could possibly happen but i do feel in the last year and we have two scientists on the program or a journalist who writes on science and scientists that are saying that there is really no risk involved at all. how used. them is there is no peer review right the blogosphere is an open place where anyone can say whatever they want what i mostly made in a certain place ayers has going for it is that scientists have have

a chance to actually give the arguments and refute them in a way that you can publicly defend where in the blogs where you can say what you want or agenda and i'd like to kind of change the topic a little bit because i don't think we're really making much progress here neal what it is i do see what the scientists telling you about its location because it could be used for the military ok to be used for star trek you know these kind of things i mean what is the application of positive. if i go to you in line go ahead so peter you have to award the first thing we have to understand is that this is basic science right now like jordan said we are exploring nature and in order to understand what might happen in terms of applications you have to go back to look at experiments that were done earlier similar experiments which at that time were basic science and the offshoot of those experiments is all around us and you can go you can go into any cancer therapy laboratory hospital today and you will see you

will see the x. or machines you know proton beams neutron beams all of it being used for cancer therapy so why use them there's a lot of why you know ok. no no no it's not one person's claim it is well known i have this beautiful example you're the only person who goes out and speaks about this. no no no no no i have given proofs and soon is refusing to prove disprove disproved and more over. soon is hiding facts from the public so one is hiding the fact that there is an experiment. so it's not completely who don't know what i'm going to say the least contradicts me before i had really shot answers your you've made a statement. that certain is this information i see and hearing what you're saying why. you don't want to hear what i say that's nice to of you to admit thank you i

don't know you have just learned me when you make it very clear but audio you have to say if you are a state can you make it very angry very very brief go ahead. yes it certainly is claiming that little black holes generated by nature which must exist if soon we will produce them very fast which is correct therefore they should get stuck in neutral stars and have already destroyed new twenty stars if these mini black holes hoped for it soon were dangerous this argument is very good except for one thing neutron stars of super fluids inside therefore this know they are not being stopped inside their foot neutron star stars happen to be saved by quantum mechanics and i'm saying that i'm not alone famous nobel prize winner is behind me but this can be tested by an experiment possible at cern cern knows this since july two thousand

and eight but soon is claiming before the world that this was known that this is not dangerous and they are hiding the fact this is can be tested ok i'm not make a test to assure the planet before you act ok jorn how can you respond to that i'm not a scientist most of my viewers aren't i mean i think again again you have to read the papers carefully and also makes an objection that if you interpret something is all in the way he said it was an easy way for your leave these ensured to finish so you're going to get ready to do so so i apologize so the way the argument certain is answered is that ok is that. if it's from if there's a moving black hole which is what god is worried about these will also be captured by neutron stars so there it's the mass surrounding and the slow movement of the neutron star which would have again eaten all of this material up so again this is the scientific refutation didn't go for it so why didn't the moving argument

doesn't work all right gentlemen we've run out of time here and i want to. read out how i want to thank our guests in london and in stuttgart and i want to thank our viewers for watching us here darkie c.n.n. . time and remember crossed off rules. and if. you want. to be soo much brighter than if you knew about sums from funniest impressions.

from stunts on t.v. don't come.

in. the. hotel in. the imperial. hotel the cruise hotel. in israel.

this. are and this. show rage on charred ruins. there's no way to the. destroy lives. and the number of deaths has doubled in moscow while many people are trying to leave the capital which is still covered by. those who escaped with. no other place the same fate as they. refused to give up. despite government prohibitions.

because you live from our studios here in central moscow this is. widespread forest and. still raging here in russia leaving many cities suffocating under a thick blanket of small forecasters say the unprecedented heat wave that's fueling the blazes is unlikely to ease this week the fires of claimed fifty lives and left thousands homeless more than one hundred fifty thousand people are battling the flames including the russian military and volunteers thanks to vehicles and equipment to be sent from other countries the smoke from the wildfires is making it difficult to breathe in many cities including the russian capital from where you go to spin off ripples. the officials anymore and mentally say that the situation in general is bad twenty four seven although it does get may get a little bit better during daytime it is much much worse during the night and

specially in the morning hours it's hard to breathe and it's hard to breathe without gas mask i do have my own right here but i can tell you even when wearing one the eyes start watering and authorities strongly recommend to everybody to stay inside to shut the windows to drink as much water as possible and to always wear masks but there are no reports from doctors that the number of deaths in moscow has doubled and they blame the pollution for this also organized these so-called small centers across the city where water and masks are being distributed however already you heard complaints that some of these centers are not equipped with air conditioning and there are also reports that some pharmacies in the city are sold out of medical mass i can tell you that these medical masks are really of no use what you need is a mask which has this opening with an air filter inside the vents.