half past three in moscow thanks for being with us on our t.v. these are your headlines more than five hundred wildfires still raging across russia fed by dry conditions from months of high temperatures experts are predicting another bout of smog from moscow and surrounding districts after a few days of clear skies fifty three people have been killed in the fires and thousands forced to seek medical help because of poor air quality for now though the capital is still free from the choking smoke. russia holds memorial services to mark a decade since the sinking of the curse in the barents sea a nuclear submarine sank during a naval exercise killing all hands of board one hundred eighteen in all most of the crew were under age thirty authorities have blamed a faulty torpedo for the tragedy the worst in russia since the fall of the soviet union. and the nuremberg court rules in a case brought by a fashion house popular with neo nazis the controversial german brand was defeated

by a left wing political group that it accused of putting its designs a logo of storage time are features a stork with a hitler like mustache. next darkeys interview show spotlight this time host al gore and of talks with the head of the international federation of journalists about freedom of the press and the dangers that reporters face stay with us here on r.t. . hello again a welcome to spotlight play into the show our tape. and today my guest in the studio is white twenty years ago the soviet parliament passed a law which prohibited any form of censorship and guaranteed freedom of press in russia but unfortunately no law can guarantee carefree existence to news than

themselves the number of cases when journalists rights are violated isn't getting low around the world and this by no means is the reason for and now this here is probably the worst thing quality of world media to talk about these and other issues and threats that we are facing our guest today is the general secretary of the international federation of journalists. politicians in many countries don't welcome uncontrolled press making it hard for free thinking journalists do their job but the bravest do their job some fall and too many die to secure free media in the world and protect correspondents the international federation of journalists was created today's the biggest journalist association with a membership of about six hundred thousand media professionals from over one hundred countries it's largely due to just one man aidan white the director general of the international federation of journalists since nine hundred eighty seven so

has anything changed in the last twenty odd years and what's next for the i have jay aged white is our guest on today spotlight. as to why thank you very much thank you very much for being with us on the show again just to align that view is that we had mr white here three years ago that raised nearly a thousand shows. i was the wife well first of all let's start with the news. at the latest scandalous news. involving journalist was this was this convoy the freedom car boy stopped by the by the israeli commandos well as far as we understand around one hundred people on those birds ships or whatever. detained by israelis were journalists what about them are you dealing with this issue what about their rights being of their as part of the convoy what are they doing their

job properly and are you doing your job now to somehow somehow help them well first of all thanks again for bringing me back and it's a pleasure to be here look the the flotilla story was a big global news story and many media knew that it was going to be and as a result of that around one hundred journalists from i think fifteen to twenty countries were present on the ships and they were there actually to report on the story because of of this great interest in it now as a result of the of the conflict itself and the assault on the boat among the dead was one journalist and all of the journalists were detained when the ships docked in israel many of them had their equipment confiscated some of them had the material in the film that they had taken also taken and used by israeli officials and this was quite scandalous activity now we've been working

very closely with our colleagues in israel to really get to the bottom of what happened here with supporting those journalists who are demanding that their material that was confiscated was given back and were demanding explanations from the israelis about how the journalists were treated here the fact the matter is that the journalists were. doing their job they weren't there as part of a political protest but they became inevitably caught up in the conflict will follow said two words they they were not there as a part of a political protest but they were detained inevitably so well i mean everybody knew he was going to happen to this for the tail when it was obvious and there do you think it was it was appropriate for a newsman to be aboard those ships as part of the people who were a political protest what they it be wiser and more correct to have

a special needs but no no i'm not sure that's right i mean look journalists when they're reporting a story need to get as close to that story as they can and of course therefore being on the ships where the action was taken place was extremely important they're on the ships they know exactly what the protesters are doing they know how they're responding and they're also able to see through i witnessing accounts of actually the astonishing as well go in our journalists don't go on the field as part of the army they go separately while actually at sometimes they do go part as part of the army it's when we're a well known imbedded journalism is a traditional part and always has been of journalists following armies incompetence into conflict that has actually always been there what is true only if they are detained it is appropriate of course of course but it's true that inevitably journalists and have to understand the risks that they're taking when they join the flotilla so we were not protesting actually that the journal no to help does that

the journalists will google were detained what we are protesting about is that they're rinds our journalists perhaps have been violated in particular we're concerned here about the confiscation of material and the misuse of that material that seems to us to be quite outrageous and not justified at all and that's why we have set up this system of of taking case by case to these. you're asking for an explanation about what happened but this sounds like a pretty worthless position here on the part of the i have well you know the thing about the misuse the israeli authorities tried very carefully to control the coverage of the whole story the three story the out of the story the vents themselves and they succeeded to a great extent over here happy as a journalist as the general secretary there is a ship by the by the coverage in general or you think it was more by is this should

have been very thing i mean i think the israeli government on the israeli national institutions are some of the most skillful spinners of news and information and control of use of information anywhere in the world i think they can teach almost every public relations agency in the world a trick or two in order to get their story across and we saw this during the gaza conflict last year the fact the matter as you remember it was a scandal that the israeli authorities would not allow international journalists into gaza to report on what was going on and what they did is they corralled them outside gaza and fed them hand fed them lots of sort of local stories which were very much suited israeli strategic interest now that sort of control i mean i am surprised by it because that the israelis should know that that sort of direct control actually creates real resistance within journalism media don't like to be manipulated in that way but of course the the israeli position has always been well known if they take get the opportunity they will restrain journalistic

investigation and they will get their story across no matter what and journalists have to be aware of the put pop possibility that they can be manipulated in such circumstances do you do did you have any tools in the federation any tools to to to counter this spin to fight the spin to to try to get away with the things that are rather propaganda the worst. one not only in this case i mean generally i mean. well actually we're not a media organization i mean what we are is an organization which which fights hard to create the conditions so the journalists can do their jobs without interference so our our job really is to say to the israelis in this particular case is to say hands off the journalist is to say don't put restrictions or obstacles to journalists doing their work and to create the conditions for the best possible flow of information because we actually think that's what journal good journalism is about about creating

a good flow of information which tells the whole story doesn't just tell one side of the story and we know the government whether it is role or other government will always tried to get their story across no matter what is the interesting thing you say we say no restrictions but people who want one sided story they usually try to help a joke to say we will help you we will share with you wolf a similar table give you the transport to everything access even really mean just do it our likely that does happen in many parts of the world and unfortunately we have real corruption in the relationship between vested interests and journalists and we do see brown envelopes changing hands a lot in many parts the world and that's that can be put down to in some conditions where actually journalism exists in terribly twilight conditions of poverty and social neglect and i think there's an interest take advantage of that government or particularly powerful groups will pay journalists will sort of encourage them you know to be biased now we have to campaign against that we have to say we have to

say that this sort of activity is corrupt is unacceptable and what we need to have is much more respect from the government downwards and right away through society for the role that good journalism plays in building democratic society speaking about quality jared of the i have just recently stated and i'm going to going to quote that publishers. of traditional news media and those systematically abandoning fundamental principles of independent journalism that are cutting jobs stopping investigative journalism seizing training and adapting business models based on the opposite of ethical journalism. does that mean that the eye of jerry is a lawyer and why the situation we call it is here isn't is it true what i said the very beginning of the program that the quality of journalism in general is getting lower and lower unfortunately i think that's right i mean i think we are alarmed by the situation and the fact of the matter is that you know at this particular moment

it's a historic period for media and for journalism because we see the dramatic changes that have taken place in technology means that traditional business models that have delivered returns for business investment in journalism no longer work the migration of the tabloids well while the the new but it's not always the case but the migration of advertising to the internet and changing habits of consumers has had a really damaging effect now what how have media responded to this unfortunately they've responded by really trying to cut the cost base and what they've done is in a way they've they're cutting their own throats that is to say they've they've started sucking journalists there's been a talent lost within journalism they've cut back on training they've cut back on investment in investigative journalism as a result of that the quality of media is in the quality of journalism is in decline you mentioned tabloid in fact what we see is an attempt to grab or dns through

sensational journalism which is often often very populist very short term and often appeals to base instincts so we're seeing a lot of low taste we see that we're seeing a rise in in journalism which is fomenting extremism more racism more xenophobia more alarmist media this is populist and it's not. attempt to use headlines to grab circulation boost. the consumer range but in the process there's a great loss to quality and the loss to quality isn't just in terms of the jobs of journalists it's also in terms of the contribution journalism makes to democracy says a new white general secretary of the international federation of journalists spotlight will be back shortly right after a break we'll continue this interview stay with us.

houses parking. cars appliances is no use until they come to visit you. do you think the property bought on credit really belongs to you. on r t. every month we give you the future we help you understand how we'll get there and what tomorrow brings the best in science and technology from across russia and around the world join acknowledging updates on our jeep. welcome back to spotlight i'm out here now in just a reminder that my guest in the studio today is mr aden wide general secretary of

the international federation of journalists we're talking about journalism we're talking about the problems that we share i mean not only journalists only those who write also those who read our watch what we do and well we we've got together here because it's been exactly twenty years since the parliament and russia passed a law on journalism forbidding forbidding the propaganda censorship of the say the times by the way mr white. you know probably a should know that that all the russian journalists are very proud of the fact that that our law of jail is that that exists today is the one of the most democratic and the most free laws in the world it gives gives gives the. great amount of freedom as a buzz through it is a good you do is it what the we like to believe or is it true for those who would absolutely i think the media law here in russia is

a tremendous contribution to underpinning the important role the good journalism plays in building democracy i don't think any doubt about it i think twenty years on we can say look at the year we've had the law and we've got a lot of experience but many of the challenges facing journalists and media still remain that the fact of the matter is the law doesn't doesn't doesn't talk enough about the structure of media so it doesn't talk enough about problems of concentration of ownership for example as there is with many years so well i fear the problem is not the law but the implementation there's absolutely no question at all that getting a getting a good constitutional protection for rights is vital so. freedom of expression protected in your constitution a good media law absolutely essential but in the end they are only going to be useful if there is the political will to properly implemented them to make them viable and so where there's a lack of political will to to create the conditions in which the media law can

deliver to all citizens in every part of the country the sort of information that they need in order to participate in democracy then then the law is going to look good on paper but in practice it's going to be found wanting and i think this is the this is the challenge that russian journalists are looking at today we've got the law and i think russian going to be congratulated for it because actually russian journalists were part of the authorship of the law so they should go up themselves on the back because i think it's important but i think a big question facing them today is why isn't the law delivering the low. pluralism that our democracy needs three years ago in this studio your main issue you talked about was the impunity of crimes against all journalists and russia has something changed in these three are i'm actually i'm pleased to say i think something has changed in the last three years when we've dealt with that question we've we've carried out a specific analysis of what's been going on with our russian colleagues we've actually prepared a very detailed database of information about the victims of violence and so on we

produced an important report which was launched last year called partial justice which actually shows that the situation has begun to improve the fact of the matter is the judicial system here in russia is now investigating these crimes in a much more effective way than they did previously we're beginning to see. a change in the approach which recognises that when a journalist is a victim of violence it needs to be very specific investigation of the case and so on now there are cases which remain emblematic and problematic they are the sky cases is it is is is one in point so there are there are cases which one has to say want that more has to be done but in general i think it's right to say that the extra scrutiny that has gone in over the past three years into the way the russian judiciary and the police and the authorities deal with the attacks on journalists gives us encouragement and i think this is this is a good thing i want to ask you

a personal question well every time the russian journalist union headed by several mitchell who has problems in this country with the authorities with anybody you are always all his side what i wanted to ask you is because of just to solidarity because because because you like a trade union or because you believe that this union is doing a good thing the scene is doing a great job you know that some unions don't actually do a great job some unions. i find it difficult to adjust to change there's a massive change taking place in our industry a lot of it's exciting and a lot of it is really challenging and some of our unions are finding it difficult to adjust to the process of change i think in russia you've got a very vibrant media community there are lots of things happening in the a lot of challenges there's a free press in russia people who say there is no free press in russia are living in a different world of course is a free press it's not as effective as it can be many journalists are suffering in

conditions which are deplorable there's too much poverty there's too much corruption in some of the regions and so on there are many difficulties but the fact of the matter is real efforts being made to change the situation and i think the russian union has consistently over the years been in the forefront of pushing the authorities and pushing the media industry itself to be bringing about change this way. once they get back to something you said earlier in this in this interview you mentioned engineer journalism when they were talking about problems is it in their journalism killing print journalism traditional journalism look i don't think internet journalism is killing print journalism at all but i mean i think one of the things you have to we have to understand is the internet is doing a great thing it's actually opening up the global conversation for everybody in a way that it is allowing freedom of expression in a way which we could never have imagined twenty years ago and that's a great thing it's a great thing for democracy it's great for journalism but the fact the matter is that when a blogger is writing a piece that's not journalism necessarily mean because the internet allows us to

say what we want when we want how we want that free expression we love that journalism isn't the same sort of thing when we journalists work we have to work in the framework of a set of values we have to tell the truth we have to be accountable this will balance of all we have to be responsible and accountable for what we do we have to be transparent so we actually have restricted freedom of expression that's what makes journalism different from internet parties. like bloggers and others and so on and it's that quality of journalism that the coincidence the more influential at the same time it makes more influential because people trust it more people trust journalism because it is organized in a framework of values now i think that's that's the biggest challenge and here in russia there's a campaign called the formular of trust which is seeking to build a new bridge of dialogue between journalism and society to try to get society to

understand and appreciate the really specific value of ethical journalism in building democracy and pluralism but anyway the internet has been growing ever more popular as a source of news and spotlights you learn that the media has more and that right now. it's no longer necessary to wait for a news block on t.v. to pay for a news paper you can go online in a minute and discover everything you wanted to know for free traditional journalism is being challenged by the rip the development of digital technologies with new portable devices information is no even more accessible moreover anyone can become a source of news blogs have become a popular alternative to traditional mass media work of restraint on the web results in greater freedom for bloggers their hands are not tied by editorial policy and they're often and loneliness and names being replaced with online leak

names. governments around the world are trying to regulate the web it's actually terms of time with the public discontent and accusations of sounds issue newspapers and t.v. channels trying to catch up with the trend and have their own online versions and their own staff. couldn't to a recent survey by the pew research center in the last online news has already become more popular with americans then we didn't use the words. well you said that it isn't really destroying traditional journalism but is blogging and twittering and etc is it replacing is it an alternative to traditional journalism look i don't think it is an alternative the fact of the matter is there's an enormous amount of change which is going on in journalism in the media industry we've seen over the last five to ten years thousands and thousands of people have been thrown out of work every month the major metropolitan daily has closed in the

united states over the last year or so we've got massive changes taking place in the media market but and the big changes as well through the internet because it's that of the changing habits in which people receive information and give information and communicate with one of the all of which i think is extremely positive news for but the fact of the matter is the essential need for quality of information remains the same and the fact is is that people will only trust information if they believe that it's credible if it's transparent and if it's accountable and journalism provides transparency credibility and accountability that's what makes it different that's what makes it important so i don't think the internet and i don't think blogging blogging and twittering or whatever it is actually doing journalism down but i think it's asking it is raising a serious question and one serious question is is a straightforward one if information pluralism is vital for democracy and that information pluralism can no longer be provided by the private sector in media then

the question is. who will provide it and who will pay for it and that is actually at the heart of a very big debate that's now taking place inside journalism and inside the media industry about the future because one of the big questions is if we're going to have journalism in the future that will serve democracy and serve citizens in the way that it has in the past and we need it how is it going to be financed well there's this really is a big question but it's if we talk about this crisis of credibility call me and so from your personal point of view who would you like you personally is who would you like to help. fight overcome this crisis the state of big business look i mean i'd. peston color it's a very very difficult sort of choice to make i she don't i think there's a third partner here and you haven't referred to and that's the problem such that consumers it's the public and that's one of the reasons why i'm very pleased about

the way that the russian journalists have built their campaign to try and build a new bridge of dialogue with civil society it seems to me is that relying on big business enough will not deliver relying on the state can compromise independence so we have to find a mix that will always be big big business and always be the state involved but we have to look for new models in the united states at the moment in many parts of europe there's a big discussion about whether or not there can be foundations or new ways of raising public levies or subscriptions in order to fund media because in order to fund journalism as well because we need investigative journalism the only way you can scrutinize power if you've got people who are investigating asking certain questions and producing the report that tell people what's going on thank you thank you very much for being with us and just a reminder that say you've been listening to aid why do the secretary of the international federation of journalists and that's it for the hour from all of us here if you're in there yourself spotlight just drop me

a line moving back with more of the comments on the wall. going on in and outside russia until then stay with r.t. and take care thank you.

immediately after the second world war major nazi leaders put on trial for war no wonder questions linger about victor's justice which is. more than five hundred wildfires still raging across russia fed by dry conditions from months up.