and it's been asked before how did we not see the economic collapse coming well we'll speak with a man who says he's not the answer and it all comes down to capitalism and what we weren't taught about. fresh air strikes in libya as nato is now in command of the no fly zone so what is the latest sunset of operation odyssey dawn. twenty eleven may be the year of protests and we can now out of jordan and syria to the already long list so we're connecting all these countries and how is it

spreading. help and that's why you only go to war when it's an absolute interest to your national security the pentagon sells it made three media advertises it and the public buys it but to the people of buyers' remorse when it comes to three wars. it's friday march twenty fifth five pm in washington d.c. i'm christine freeze out there watching our team. i will start off with the situation in libya where after six days of intense negotiations among its member member states nato has agreed to assume control of the no fly zone there it was of course authorize first by the u.n. security council resolution one nine hundred seventy three and is known as operation odyssey dawn over the last day western warplanes have continued air strikes and in the libyan capital of tripoli reports are saying or the one hundred

people were killed are just cauliflower is in tripoli and bring both an inside look this is the proof of civilians being injured and killed in coalition is strikes we've driven more than forty minutes to see the remains of a rocket and some glass to the bedroom window with a father says he was very lucky that his family was not at home forgive us for being a little bit suspicious but certainly here the pressure is on for the government to try and show the international community that indeed its claims that more than one hundred civilians have been killed are true and we attended a mass funeral where more than fifty toughens with we were told that inside we see millions the government spokesperson later did admit that it was possible that some of the bodies were fighters the chest reaching at the scene or position and say that all libyans are slices so six the question in terms of what is the difference here between a fighter and a civilian now the journalist we said was a hospital within where more than a dozen bodies were charged beyond recognition and presume to also as proof that

these is tribes are killing civilians there are rumors here in the capital city the bodies are being brought in from other areas the reason tents of fighting and being presented to the foreign media as proof again that civilians are the targets and are the collateral damage in these is strikes the reaction on the ground in terms of the announcement that nato now. right a prayer is always a focal point security downtown has been stiffed up in fear that it could be massive demonstrations overnight there were it strikes in the east in the west of

the city targeting military barracks a military airfield at the same time there was a lot of empty aircraft and gunfire over the capital city so indeed the situation tense people angry and most just fearing for the next few days and weeks tempering policy r.t. tripoli has not just libya of course the violence is spreading throughout the middle east reports from syria did help troops opening fire on protesters in several cities with pro and anti-government crowds clashing in the streets this is happening in bahrain jordan and yemen as well earlier i spoke with he's a professor and director of international studies at trinity college and here's part of our conversation. some of this is simply if print looking reviewing says being brought together by a can be agent you know once tunisia it inspired people in other countries to bring up big reveals is too good to wards

a public space i mean that's one of the main things nobody has talked about is egypt the capital cities has a public square where people can gather you know if you are in your or the united states where public spaces have declined will not appreciate how important that he square was for cairo the ability to occupy. that is center of the city and has symbolic meaning so there was a grandmother said by the protesters early from companies here that has been followed but it must be kept in mind that in each of these contexts these situations are local the grievances are different in but in the grievances are separate from the grievances in syria and certainly the context in libya is utterly different certainly utterly different by your take on why you know the u.s. has chosen you know the u.s. the u.n. nato has chosen libya to focus on and avoided these other countries bahrain john

and now syria libya was the most convenient country to focus attention on because libya's only leadership has a very checkered history with the west on the other hand but how to end the gulf states have a very intimate close relationship with the west it was unlikely that there was going to be any attempt to take out any of the leadership in fact be in given ssion in the heart in was the opposite of the intervention in libya there has been an intervention invite it has come from saudi arabia's troops and they've come in good defender regime the thread that guy is libya to the head in is in a sense the old head which is oil and power where the. babylift conservatives are going to remain in. the west has defended them so in the case of libya the erratic leadership of gadhafi has only just threaten the west and indeed years threatened his own people but apart from there the west has long look for

a conservative force to come in and govern libya on its behalf conservatively not exactly but i feel has tried to govern on behalf of the west recently. whereas in bahrain and in yemen there's going to be a very stable transfer of power once again and they will leave but the authorities in structure will remain a common thread here is oil and power you know here in washington we've been hearing a lot of cries lately especially since president obama has returned from his trip to latin america cries asking him to be more specific outlining the strategy what do you think the day that you know nato and the u.s. is going to find in libya what do you think the result is going to be the first thing people need to understand is resolution one thousand seven hundred three passed on my chin nineteen is a very very resolution it is not specific at all the vagueness comes from the

following problem which the african command of the united states military has discovered it's supposed to be an air not fly zone established to predict civilians on the other hand as general ham of the african command has demonstrated it's very hard to build a difference between protecting civilians and protecting the rebels so is the united states and french and north fly zone intended to give air support to the rebels in their war against gadhafi is troops or is it to simply protect civilians why d.j. why is it hard to tell the difference here well good to be fair they are not wearing uniforms the rebel army as they wouldn't i mean they have not had to you know contract. peelers in good new uniforms mean to their direct their group their allies new solutions were big enough arms and become a rebel force so from a cockpit it's very hard to tell whether these troops saying giving rebels or

whether they say billions whereas in a briefing room in stuttgart or in washington d.c. it's easy to see where we are defending so many lives not rebels but pilots it's not that easy to do so even a sense what delusion one thousand seven hundred three has produced is an ambiguous situation where you need two forces will and now french and american forces are essentially providing air cover to the rebels that is to say they have become part of a war and that's quite different from the un's obligation to protect civilians which was the initial approach into resolution one thousand nine hundred seventy three and that was the jaipur shot professor and director of international studies at trinity college. still of course a lot of confusion about what's going on but i do expect in the next few days there will be quite a bit of a marketing campaign as far as libya is concerned by some of our highest leaders more and more as part of the strategy of the mission itself are his loyalists or

takes a look at how this is continually done and what exactly comes out of it. the reality of war war is hell and that's why you only go to war when it's an absolute interest to your national security it's one reason why i coalition forces do battle with an information war to fight alongside the real one playing out on the ground in afghanistan for example so what's not widely known by these milestone the longest war american history we have surpassed the soviet campaign there we have spent. money but instead carries this message good morning afghanistan welcome to the new day of hope and reconstruction in the war torn region which accommodates conflict that longs for peace that's the nato version told in this promotional film it was given to international journalists like myself at the annual nato summit presumably to spread the message public relations after it's like these are nothing new and

commander of the nato forces the united states spends billions of dollars alone to market its version of the war to the world including p.r. at home and abroad u.s. funded media as well as psychological operations for example a leaked classified cia document revealed a plan for our lights a quote strategic communication program across nato troop contributors that taps into the key concerns of specific western european audiences that could provide a buffer if apathy becomes opposition to fight declining public support for the war from france and germany as a young girl she recalls the day when the taliban ruled into telecon talked to tank outside her home and kept watch on her family under an eater's. tapped afghan women as the perfect messenger to make an emotional appeal about the taliban and professed their aspirations for the future as this woman does here. some media

picked up on this message to hear time. dean equates pulling out u.s. troops from afghanistan with brutality against women however the thing you remember about this poor girl this happened while he was true through there and some like them and it's writer jill bloke with which argues these p.r. tactics are an assault on women too i think it absolutely exploits the women's issue and exploits women used purely to advance u.s. foreign policy objectives they certainly weren't interested in women's rights in that region and before it became strategically important to them in this so-called war on terror. and it's not clear efforts like this even work it's absolutely impossible to tell but i would be willing to suggest that. it's very ineffective and maybe u.s. defense secretary robert gates would agree as his recent closed door nato speech can attest he's now resorting to scolding allies for getting ready to abandon the

war meanwhile hillary clinton says the u.s. is losing when it comes to broadcasting its message abroad on state funded t.v. station on the street unfortunately we are paying a big price for it even though the u.s. is spent one billion dollars alone to broadcast its message to the arab world where it's at war through the state news network. the network has locked in just happen percent of viewership now. you know with all showing perhaps you can't sell old war welcome to the new days unless you have a buyer lauren mr archie york. also a huge financial burden which brings us now to the economy you know for a great many people it's become a system that is part and part a result of the two thousand and eight financial collapse so how do we climb out and get to a place of progress well you know big problems need big ideas and here's one start with money and throw it away sounds crazy right now we're going to talk to someone

who thinks this live the exact. what we need here joseph as a filmmaker and also of founder of the movement. hey there peter i'm of course simplifying here it's not just get rid of money or currency it's instead making this monetary based economy you make it a resource based economy talk about what this actually means. well actually you're half right a resource based economy explicitly does want to remove the actual mechanics of exchange and the market system itself as radical as that may seem the most you have to understand first of all the problems we're seeing in the world is not the result of some bad policy or some legislation or some inflationary cycle boom and bust phenomenon the words that we taught to social economics the very foundation of the economic structure is intrinsically flawed we create money out of that we charge interest on it which doesn't exist we create the principle but yet the principle plus the interest is always outstanding people it's

a game of musical chairs the put into a singular phrase everyone systematically suffers through the system in its offset so when you hear about debt collapse sovereign debt default these are net abilities of the system not based on just someone's road policy or some flagrant activity of the stock market and derivatives granted those are very important attributes of it but my point in my work with the movement is that the system is intrinsically inherently flawed and for us to get on a on a scale on a pace on a plan a in a way to make our society sustainable or not suffer all these economic consequences we have to get down to the life ground of what actually supports human life what we've learned from the natural world the systems that actually that actually generate food when you realize this we live in a technical reality not a monetary one and if we for example one child dies every five seconds from poverty in preventable diseases on this point this is of course unnecessary technically we could easily feed everyone on this planet and when you travel a train of thought when you take a technical perspective as opposed to

a monetary perspective we see we can resolve just about all of the major human woes on this planet by restructuring the entire economic phenomenon to be truly economic i mean here you are thinking now earlier about realty you were talking earlier and you said you know everyone suffers by the system i think that maybe let's clarify a little bit a lot of people suffer but there are some people who want to keep this system exactly how it is not right. so the upper one percent certainly is and certainly has a prime interest has a very easy way to justify the fruits that they've paid claims we have one percent of the world's population owning forty percent of the planet's wealth if that isn't a signpost to the intrinsic flaw of the system that it's there to perpetuate one class over another i'm not sure what is so yes the proper one percent has a very vested interest and that's where that carries on to the governments which are essentially funded and supported by the corporate institutions and i know you have a continuous you've written about this large gap between the rich and poor and i

know one point that you've made in your writings is that america is one of the most socially immobile countries in the world i kind of had to stop and read that again when i thought of that but basically what you're saying i think is if you're born poor chances are you'll stay poor other than of course a few exceptions how does this change under the system. well it's not as like a system this work builds upon the research i meant by the man of jacques fresco which builds upon researchers from from well the past one hundred fifty years people have continually thought about a different economic model not based on monetary exchange and all of the intrinsic problems that come out of that dizziness project is something important invention which i see suggest people look into that is a partnership with this ice movement and it's a blueprint system based on referencing natural law and what that means is you actually get to the life ground as i mentioned earlier you look at what it means to make a human being what it means to meet the needs of the human especially the from obviously

the bare necessities to all of the emotional and bio psycho social phenomenon that actually generate our behavior generator well being in our mental health when you put all this together which is a completely technical orientation very limited when it comes to human opinion this is what science has given us by the way you see that the current economic model is stuck in time it's not actually representing what needs human needs and the more you step back and look at how we could technically provide for the human population eliminate war or eliminate famine eliminate poverty eliminate ninety five percent of most crime which by the way is not a terrible lated you begin to see that an entirely new approach can be taken it's very difficult to exclude scribed that to you in a very short little segment but a resource based economy is based on resource management intrinsically monetary relationships don't manage anything we have cost efficiency we have all of these things that inhibit our ability to create sustainable goods we have established institutions that are costly trying to preserve their market share it's essentially

a mafia orientation it's one group against another everyone's battling and we have this illusion that somehow it's for the betterment of us we had the self interest and it isn't it hasn't it's provably not if you look through history and what we're actually doing to ourselves and we're on a train wreck to a complete environmental disaster and a social disaster here i don't want to interrupt you real quick i can just hear that the bad election commercials in my head. you know if this movement gains momentum the people who the system does benefit are going to come back and this is what they're going to say they're going to say he wants to bring us back to you know he wants to make us a communist society what do you say that's all they know what that's all that's all they know their entire frame of reference you see the propaganda of the west and the free market or the free for all market as i call it is to constantly assume back orient back to these old structures that are based on autocratic dictatorship with no real communist attributes to it are true communist ideas of family you know

something i think we all can relate to we are about intelligent resource management learning about how to take care of ourselves technically and creating a ground a system that does that and the only way you can do that is by the elimination of this this supposed self interest intrinsic attribute of our system that we think is natural and obviously we all have self interest but self interest must become socially interest if we expect to survive as a species very simply i think about it actually and he told one of the question people would have it under this system what's the incentive what's the incentive to contribute more to try harder if in the end we're all going to be equal. well first of all no one's just equal in an arbitrary sense that's a loaded kind of concept equal in the ability to get the necessities of life to get out of the materialism that we have that few this this conspicuous consumption that's destroying the planet these values will change so the incentive will be

people actually understanding that when they contribute to society when they do something real not work in advertising or the stock market when they do something and are educated actually contribute to society that's for their own self betterment themselves so when i was if i was an inventor i would invent something not to make money off it that's a very sick distorted idea i would invent something to better the world knowing that that would come back to me in my own betterment so it's a completely different value structure in the best thing i can relate to you is that the idea of the family the idea of what it means to live in a family and the respect it's mutual a family we got tipping your mother every time she brings you something at the table it's an entirely new value system orientation unfortunately we have to undergo tremendous psychological distortion that's been created after a boil more or less centuries of this despotic system that is failing it right in front of us and will lead to simply more war more poverty so i don't really have to defend it by the fact that all you have to do is watch what's happening right now and what's going to continue to happen if you follow the trends and just real quick

if you do look around much happening especially right now this is not and i know this your idea and your movement has followers all around the world more than two hundred countries have chapter and talk about why this is not just a national idea that but how does an international. so absolutely well sovereignty is essentially a mirror of the corporate concept of the self preserving idea of the world going to have to learn to work together i'm sorry to say to all the politicians out there jingoistic patriotic the words of albert einstein patriotism is a disease it's one world it's a single round planet it's time we recognized as such we have to manage the world in this way too so there's a firm technical realities are just philosophical so there's like this movement is about bridging the difference between all races all nationalities all rigid religions all all everything that divides us because we all have to come back to the basic necessities of life and we can't even get that right within the monetary system the suffering is is unacceptable and not necessary so it is certainly

a movement firmly and legally we're out of time peter but certainly a big idea in this time that is filled with some really big problems peter joseph filmmaker and also founder of that guy. and the economic collapse of two thousand and eight was it in fact a collapse or implosion of the economy or was it the slow erosion and series of smaller events that ultimately led to well an avalanche all financial pundits and talking heads seem shocked some economists say we as americans or in part just asking the wrong questions and also in part we're getting the full answers about exactly what was going on behind the scenes earlier i spoke to hodgins chang an economist from south korea who teaches that cambridge university and. he also wrote several books including this one twenty three things they don't tell you about capitalism so i asked him who they are and what exactly they haven't told us here's his response. carries easily these free market economists which are told the

world and indeed they had a little guy influence on other things what on. him asian. told the world that we need to have freedom markets more we need to forget about things like income inequality let the market to do work in the end we'll all be richer and i remember hearing phrases like trickle down economy things that you know if the wealthiest have the money it will trickle down and everyone will sort of get a part i know that you argue that there's no such thing as a free market and the second thing i think about the difference that we overlook there are child labor laws there are environmental regulations things that first people protesting or getting there are rules in place why do you think this is important the concept of free trade and free market need to really develop into well you know we have to realize that all markets have a lot of regulations propping them up. who can trade what can be traded how they

can be traded but we don't see any of these regulations because we have come to accept these big lose and so much you know when two hundred years ago all other people that it was a perfectly legitimate to buy and sell people is. i mean one hundred years ago a lot of children are working and people thought this was a part of the free economy and these children want to work these people want to improve and there is no problem there but over time we have come to change our values and have introduced these regulators now we are these values march that we've seen these things this rig lesions so if you make this argument because you're trying to say there should be some more granulation then you just want people to realize that there are already are some in place my point is actually starting from my point is that you know free market because often tell us that the regulations that they will cause. our politically motivated need to fear is the

scientifically defined free market system where is the truth no it's not like that i mean deal for you just as. political as i'll put you don't so you these people say no actually you cannot have more environmental regulation because it goes against the principle of free market why diocese that actually is not clear what the principles. i think is interesting to another one of your really strong arguments when we talk about different countries and how far they've come in the state of their economies you argue that the companies with sort of the smaller income gaps between the rich and the poor are the ones that have a more highly regulated immigration system i think this is a really interesting concept about this yes i mean really how we should see it is. income inequality is not. i mean inevitably i mean twenty extent that we need

to motivate people and give incentive and so on but you know how do you justify the kind of increase in income inequality you have in the united states today. brazil today i mean these income inequalities have become dysfunctional so first of all what is important to accept is that this is nothing natural or you can correct it and a lot of countries are corrected through the use of the welfare state and of course countries with people welfare state you might think there are too many taxes are people who don't clean theirs and so on but actually. it is actually make people more open to changes because people have a safety net. in america or you lose a job you don't even have money to go to your host. countries that capital or just pay people not only get some minimum standard of living you can get retrained for another job and also paradoxically actually there's not less pressure for

protectionism in say scandinavian countries in america and i want to switch gears now i know in your book you talk a lot about neil liberal message as a kind of damage back in your opinion has neoliberal liberalism done to the economy yes i read this article created that you need to liberalize oprah not been privatized you can only tell you economy to the maximum extent and it has done shills damages you know i mean the biggest damage is probably what has been done to the firm or soviet bloc countries when they were opened up in the late eighty's early ninety's i mean they were told there were once you privatized all the companies very quickly and to regulate everything everything was fine no it wasn't i mean these countries went through very deep recessions which have followed me just. allowed through out the eighty's and ninety's these people implemented

a series of clean programs and on its structural adjustment program. the world bank and the i.m.f. and these programs or implemented with the prime minister well two three years of pay and then your clothes will take off because you are now going to get an open deregulated economy the result is that close to actually clap in africa and it has massively slowed down in knots and when i make these policies and done a lot of damage all over the world now come two thousand and seven two thousand and eight now it is policy has finally. relapsed and come down to hold the rich countries themselves i mean usa britain all these countries and because. that was hard to change is a senior research associate for the center for economic policy research and also the author of the got twenty.