just their loans or they'll start to see some defaults and some pushback and i'll have to change their structure so i'll have more on the i.m.f. meeting on monday on our new show but that's going to do it for now for more on the stories you cover go to our t. dot com slash usa we'll see back here next week for more news until then good night . which was the same of you are going to let you go on the one thing that they know nothing less than against another legal intervention approved by the u.n. now in the ivory coast of florida a leader is one seated at the expense of hundreds of civilians. more news today violence is once again flared up. these are the images the world

has been seeing from the streets of canada. trying to look for a shelter on the day. hey tom are in here broadcasting live from washington d.c. coming up today on the big picture. we'll. bring you the latest in science and technology from around the world. the future of coverage. the official policy allocation your money

phone on called touch from the i.q. exam still. life on the go. video on demand tease my old pals and r.s.s. feeds now in the palm of your. machine on the dot com. the lead take a. listen to. the lonely. people about another legal intervention approved by the u.n. now in ivory coast a former leader is on seated at the expense of hundreds of civilian deaths will the country's new leader be any different or will the west help him clean his image up as fast as he got rid of his predecessor. led. to.

the sole end. to discuss the turmoil in ivory coast i'm joined by now love go k. he's in washington he's a. political analyst and founder of africa diplomacy dot com in paris we go to francoise and then we he is the founder of the african advisory board and in london we have are you johnson he used the founder and director of viewpoint africa all right gentlemen this is crossfire that means you can jump anytime you want but first let's have a quick look at what has been happening in the ivory coast over the last four months. decisive action and immediate results france us military help to respond we're calling it i request miss him to convert some justice to the country with one thousand four hundred french troops we're told over and overthrow its longstanding leader who refused to accept defeat in the last presidential elections the sayings of his fall are iconic for the whole of the african world and

from our concerns of the desperate sufferings. for others this is nothing less than a cruel and it's imposing our will so. well as parents are still divided over the shift of power and your president officially won the elections the torah is making promises. our country has turned to painful page in its history. after more than four months of post electoral crisis march my still really lives lost we are finally a jewel of a new era of hope. but the friends clearly picked a side in their current conflict it doesn't want to miss in a stakeholder and invader backed by the united nations its claims its soldiers stopped at the gates of the presidential palace and left a final battle for iraq already. no matter what it is called a smart intervention or just a small french contribution it's going biggest it's

a selling point for further western military interventions in the separate trouble for cross-talk r.t. . carol gentlemanlike to go to washington first what we heard in the report was it a smart intervention on the part of the french and the united nations smart intervention or neocolonialism. thank you very much i. don't know for me to be on this show and i think what you do you know thank you for all your good work you do in. your new career is that when i was given the opportunity to talk about the crisis in the country. by what was going on the country i have denounced a new group release them and many many and their ministry media you know want to talk about that this is not the first time france has done that in the country they did that in two thousand and four when they destroyed the evident as air force on the ground killed sixty nine. and

a wounded more than one thousand people they wanted to overthrow the president in two thousand and four they did not succeed you know some seed this down and it did and of course it is pure new colonialism ok if we go to london eye on what do you think about that i mean it's very nihilistic on the part of the french and the west in general this is not the first intervention we've seen in i in the ivory coast and in a whole lot of other countries in the region and we might want to talk a little bit about libya later go ahead. absolutely i think the intervention by the west has always been their game plan and usually if they've got need for regime change or if there's not something more personal in terms of resources location or land grabbing but nonetheless i think in this particular instance i think the french were very very keen and eager to get into the game play and i think it's a mistake because it sends the wrong signals that especially when they supported mr ouattara very heavily that mr ouattara as

a competitor and governance moving forward will be tainted to an extent by the fact that he is a supporter of the west he is controlled and he will deal with the west far kindly than any other leader would otherwise do better i think is that blood will found himself in a lot of trouble going as far back as two thousand when he came into power not to mention in two thousand and two when he refused to get mr ouattara to engage in the political machine in that country and of course the subsequent civil war that we had did not play in his favor more so most recently when he had the elections which were otherwise certified by the international community that he did lose i think the writing was on the wall and the rest is history so are i think for all the intentions of the the french taking part in this equation and supporting mr watson and getting involved in the politics i think it's for the right reasons i need to send a signal to mr gbagbo that he lost the election be that it's controversial because it's a bugger was said all right that he won those elections france why in paris what do

you think about that because what has been called the bretton woods candidate i mean he used to be a functionary over at the i.m.f. so he does very much look like the west man there and no insult to them a gentleman who does have a french wife on top of that i mean is he really again a fine insult with the ivorian people because that's one of the problems that the country has there's a lot of ethnic strife religious strife i mean there's a lot of divisions is he the right guy to overcome those divisions in this country . these would be up to the people of could give what's the answer but regarding what happened on the way the this conflict has been concluded by military intervention i think that this is something that is disastrous even we have to start with law continue with law and finish with love and when we talk of law we have text and we have actions this french and u.n. intervention was based on the result nine hundred seventy five. no place and no

progress in this intervention do you see any justification of a massive attack as the military after the one you have on the contrary in point number two this resolution said that. although of all the parties to continue to try to find a political solution here and this these resolution even for is the african union decision to appoint a special a special envoy to solve this issue. this special envoy have been exonerated it was the minister for no brito of a cup of elder mr what president. but the what are can't refuse this guy so it was possible to continue to find another special envoy to try to find a political solution to this so i think serving a problem the this way it's

a disaster it's a disaster because you you have refused because when you act like this you refuse the voice of the people you have is that of the electorate the electoral process you choose the military process so we no longer in the logic of the voice of the people through elections this means that people are being frustrated and these are the if mr ouattara starts the president if you have a very difficult. ok i'm going to go back on who's going to look at what i'm going to back to washington because i think you bring up a very good point here i mean international media by goes a really bad guy and maybe is ok but he is the new president sitting president now is he any better be it a meaning does he have any less blood on his hands when it comes to this conflict because it seems to me it's very one sided there's a good guy and there's a bad guy but it looks like a look at the two main players have

a lot of blood on their hands are they going to be both held accountable. hello yes thank you very much when i i was talking to democrats in our i said that in ivory coast it was not a matter of one person being a hero and the other one being villain or one be an engine another one being. on both tragic heroes this is what i said on the most pressing hour and i lost under an hour what. i think i can even tell that he has more blood on his hand than the book because came to power through peaceful means so when and then he became president of course there was a moment of repression and then there were some you know some people were killed by these crosses which i have denounced but alas i want them out that are created in rebellion in every cause in two thousand to split the country in two and then when the international community said that is the winner of the election which can be

disputed because when the president of the electoral commission in asked that the prosecution really do the second round was eighty one percent that could not be possible because of all critical sources said that the presidential rule cannot goes beyond seventy percent so now when. friends are said in paris when they were trying to find that peaceful resolution to the call for it now the united nations the us and friends have given a green light to our son and i want to really they're all fancy in order to our part of the army of the ivory coast and kill innocent people and menace to millions as mistake it was even reported this morning by a french newspaper there are certain people and they killing supporters everywhere in abidjan in some to do it it wasn't part of the country so of course there are some other is disqualified to talk about hope and change and then and then peace in ivory coast this is my only desire finally you would i mean

a new president now he has french military backing ok i mean he has a free hand right now doesn't he i can you know this whole neocolonialism card is in play you can only lead a country when you have powerful western backers and what does he have to give up to keep that support. well that's what is the price he who pays the piper calls that you're absolutely spot on but i think the intervention is wrong and i personally think that mr ouattara has his work cut out because he's got to find a mechanism to support the entire country and for the country start operating as one on how he galvanises the people in the south how he got a nice as a youth son of her employment training and such and such identify with a separation and needs remains to be seen whether it's capable of doing so and he's going to need all the support he can have internationally and very much so from the french and the international community and otherwise what you will find over time is that you will have a tiny rebellion against starting in the south building up to outstay him in the

future so to avoid that and i think the international community the french have got to support mr ouattara he clearly is the man of the flavor of the season at the moments but above and beyond that mr ouattara house to find a mechanism as to how we can unite the country how we can disarm the thousands of ammunition is out there lots of people who have guns how are you going to make those streets safe how are you going to encourage people who have left the country to come back and i think the international community have been here a little talk about the end game later even achieve the reason actually after the break we'll continue our discussion on the ivory coast a. story . if you.

the latest in science since england from. the future covered. if. he's.

welcome i'm sorry i'm fairly helped remind you we're talking about the ivory coast intervention. ok if i go back to france why. in paris one of the biggest problems with these interventions as of late libya or maybe even afghanistan and we can look at iraq is

the and game now has anybody smart people that planned this military event with their bleeding hearts thought about the end game what comes next year are we going to have a fair trial for the deposed or is it just going to be winner take all yes this is a very interesting question because this is this can be sure. and idea of what the people who planned this operation think what we should try as much as possible to remain neutral here and to look at the reality on the facts and the question here is not to to call to or to measure who has more blood on his hand whether what our or or we have electoral process and then after that we have an electoral dispute the matter was how to solve this electorate disputes and again you have to go back to the text. of what i was

a sovereign country with a constitution what did the constitution say it because he said that it is up to the constitutional court to decide who was the winner. but the constitutional court had decided that rubber was the winner but in fact given all the things that we these decisions in my life in my in my view was not fair this isn't and i think this is where the biggest mistake on the decision of the constitutional court was not fair because of many things because of it's know it would be very wrong to to explain here but at least people who have reconsidered this decision are the african advisory board we have proposed a way to solve this problem which we could have started first but in doing this decision and try to see all the claims of to buckle ok so france won

a major event here let me ask you this is the lead up here i think this is important are ok go ahead quickly there's a very important. yes not only do you know a lot of the want you jump in go ahead yes ok yes. he said he's going to be too long too of the inquisition and by the by the results my point is that. some don't know what the law is perceived and it is true. he did and his best sieved there fresh governor in the country and expressive as somebody always necessity. to the. cry of many. many leading people are traumatized and then when the you you allow your you know your your forces you know to be good and if you want to think that the results they were way way way way way too at least probably six percent of the country this house or the country are not right there where god and

his wife have been your media when you do that and you come and talk about reconsideration is going to be difficult second thing i.e. if you were here that this approach he received from friends and the united states and the international community there is no way i sometime know what the law is going to be and. the needs of the people in the country because he has to first the interest of that international community and second he is one of the person who believes that you know you can you know you can still get good enough to get where you need to go and i found out that our. sword is sort of too good so there is no way you can really be like a president was going to take i would go to the next level ok in london i'm going on i think really you one of the things in researching this program i find it remarkable how many times internationally recognized president ok it is it is the outside community and we all know with the international community means it

means western europe and united states that's the international community and we hear about public opinion and it was almost as if there was a drumbeat here is that the west if it already determined what the outcome was going to be in ivory coast and then they found finally their tools to do it and in their favorite one is military and intervention am i wrong about that. yes to an extent it's the mindset this this is a battle of hearts of nine's and the west has got to understand that if they go in premature if they go in in some countries and getting involved into politics that they're not understand if they fail to understand cultural and tribal mixes and how that integrates on the ground itself then you can find that they can have similar stations what we have found in afghanistan iraq and most recently that's all of somalia out of course now we're seeing similar situations with libya so it's a lack of preparation lack of foresight and a lack of understanding and very much so they can get it so wrong and they do not

seem to be learning from the lesson but i think the united states has learned because this is why in in libya especially they decided not to take before the moral high ground and i'm and push to come pay for it as they usually do in other countries but taking a backseat because mistakes can happen and the longer that these conflicts go on the longer they do not find a solution to it to some of these crisis the more likely can make mistakes and the more likely public opinion can change on you and very much this battle is hearts and minds how you maintain the status quo locally with the population how you maintain the coalition itself and very much on how you maintain international consensus and that starts to change then the whole thing starts on rumbling and there are risks when you get into the sort of mindset and when you get involved in other people's. machinery and was it's thankfully in this particular instance in ivory coast a court of law we did not find that to be the situation but it remains to be seen how under locally whether mr ouattara can be embraced how the people in the south

can support him and how very much so how the country would move forward so i think only time will tell ok and i think you know i'd like to ask all three of you the same question and i'll go to washington first what message is this interventionist military intervention into ivory coast telling other leaders in the region i'm thinking about members of the african union through north african arab north africa and beyond i mean really we just could have to give me used to more and more interventions i mean it seems to be the flavor of the time that we go to washington first on that. and they thank you here i'm going to take your personality you know to see the. obama sarkozy and the international community the. site. and of course a to new crisis by allowing a military offensive in the country and you can probably north. of decatur. africa for many years i can talk about their first visit of i because of for going

in i can talk about mugu killings that we can talk about you know rule for almost forty years and to go all of those leaders where backed by due west france in the u.s. and then of course i got some people were not injured did you not intervene in order to restore democracy and now secretary of state of the united states hillary clinton said out a do over to send a clear message to the world i think she was wrong because there are millions of africans who sympathize. and who still remember african heroes who have tried in order to defend our african civil right it in africa nationalism who believe in upon african ideas and who are tired of the nuclear lism enough rica and who are tired after french interference in african affairs so those people are not of the same understanding of the people see as. a leader

who is trying to promote nuclear nearly them because if they want to weave their want to talk about the world russet they can they should go to can have us all where the president of the country one of the the best people you can have in africa to my son kyra and i was in power for more than twenty years and it was big creating where's it pretty written where in liberia in sierra leone and now in africa those so these are the people that should go after but of course you know we love they're not going to do that. because these are good proper. like the leading african nations france are firing on paris where you think how do you reflect upon that because it still looks like there's going to be an element within the political establishment of african countries will always look for the west to get them in power to choose them as their new dictator or a new friend in a particular country and in the region in general it's still a bad habit that hasn't been broken yes yes you were talking about the messages

what will this what messages. come from this. military intervention i think i see all the negative messages the first one is that instead of solving a problem through a legal process through a political process the the so-called international community france and the us prefer the military option the military option is destructive secondly this is a foreign intervention in africa we no longer need this if the limits have been solved by african african soldiers fighting each camps we don't need a foreign intervention you have a call us you have the african union's these are this is an african problem that should have been solved by africans this program is not happening. in argentina or . so it's a nothing can problems i don't know why french or not all these foreign forces were

intervent thirdly one is constituted to do this thing we see what's what's what is the outcome now. president if you consider the prison situation. let's say a president. somewhat as a president contrary to my brother from washington i don't have any any clue against him suppose he's the president i don't have any clue against the president ouattara suppose he's the president one would he be integrated into what's what's constitutional test you see when you're a president you have people who just people come out of this from the town by millions approve you base this on the constitutions that say you are not you are elected no this military intervention has created something unprecedented in call d'ivoire you have a president we don't really know exactly who has elected him because this could

have been solved if you have been again possible to see what is the voice of the people of god before all right gentlemen as you have been here over all the time we could have gone along a lot longer i'm sure many thanks to my guest today in paris london and in washington and thanks to our viewers for watching us here on arche see you next time remember rostock me. still. hey tom are in here broadcasting live from washington d.c. coming up today on the big picture.

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