but in the low to show at the real headlines with none of the murders a parking lot in washington d.c. but a lot of death still leaves a lot of questions for the u.s. and countries around the world so if the obama administration stops talking are outside or conspiracy theories in it then shifting to the topic of libya it's becoming obvious of the war has reached a stalemate but will the western powers ever admit that they made a mistake the first g.o.p.

primary debate kicks off tonight in south carolina but frankly nobody's going to be there so we're going to ask why and then since it's a go to my over going to revisit an issue that was dominating news cycles this time last year immigration so why the crowds and the coverage suddenly disappear then stir up your favorite cocktail you won't want to miss tonight's happy hour we'll introduce you to the dumbest criminals of the day details on all that and much more as a night show but first our top story. the more time that goes by the obama administration announced the killing of osama bin laden the more questions are raised here at home and around the world yesterday the white house announced that they would not be releasing photos of bin laden to prove his death or releasing any new details about the raid in order to protect operational techniques that may be used in operations in the future and the last week has been a constant change in the story beginning with the line of the lot and was are the news as white as a human shields both details which have now been walked back by the white house they've admitted that bin laden was in fact. not art but he said he resisted and

therefore his assassination was in line with military and international standards but pakistan and it's the embarrassment that the al qaeda leader was found in a mansion sized compound in a city that's also home to retired military leaders and a military academy where they've now launched their own investigation and the pakistani security officials have said that there are no signs of bin laden or others were armed or resisted and they've been labeled this killing as cold blooded and vowed disastrous consequences if any more on authorized raids are carried out so with the white house deciding to seal their lips will we ever know the truth or does not move just open the door for more outside hereis to about earlier i spoke with lieutenant colonel anthony shaffer senior fellow at the center for advanced defense studies who is still serving as a retired reserve lieutenant colonel and i first asked him if he thinks that obama is making the wrong choice by not releasing the post-mortem pictures made a consistent decision which i believe ultimately is wrong but the fact that first

off this was going for better for worse and we need the american people the american people need to be the ones that the audience of the white house is actually answering to in this case i think the american people are owed for better or for worse the picture plus the print the president's authority with president bush when we killed our car we in iraq that picture as gruesome as it was was released today and qusay their pictures were released so that almost seems picture of what he was that was really so i don't anticipate you know what i believe it is realistic that there would be a muslim. or a massive response any more than it's going to happen once bin laden's wife starts talking about her perspective on what happened so this is where i think there's a hugely inconsistent perspective by the white house and you can get something that is very even be a massive response to considering that another of our other policies are changing we still have troops in iraq we still have troops in afghanistan we're still in a shadow war is going on in yemen and in pakistan so will one man's death. i mean

granted yes he was the leader of al qaeda but would put our troops in any more danger of you know i mean this is we're probably out of this mother i'm a proponent of we should have captured him but with that said he's dead just put it out there get it done the other issue we're talking about here which i think is going to hurt us in the end is this is just leaving the space open for all to conspiracies my facebook is full of all my friends talking about this is you know these are different there's no so you know to me one or another part of up here people say well they can photoshop it would you just do it just get out there and as best you can fix the narrative say this is what happened and let it go you know the other thing to the last argument here aside from perhaps you know being scared that there might be some type of reaction to a lot of staff into releasing the photos but they're also saying that there isn't much moral argument here that we don't need to parading around like a trophy there's no need to see these gruesome images but you know i think a lot of people are if you can only recent days through that how moral is it to go wage war to go assassinate somebody and then not be able to see what you've done to realize the consequences i agree with your point completely this is not in the name

of the american people there was so as bad as it is good it is it's done just own up to it secondly president obama and others were calling for the release of photos relating to person or abuse so i don't understand how prisoner abuse photos or any more or less you know bad but having a good terrorist who clearly even a lot of the muslim community wanted this guy did so i don't know i don't understand what were the clemency is different between water and prisoner abuse photos released and dead terrorists i don't know i guess i don't get what do you think is really going on in pakistan here obviously there are a lot of fingers being pointed they were i think that they're embarrassed as well if you consider the fact that you know we flew into supposedly announced of course that some of that modern was hiding in a massive mansion the size compound in the same town you know they have a military academy but what they're doing now is they've launched their own and that's again. and that they don't want the u.s.

to be a part of it's an independent investigation their investigation is already saying that in fact none of these men were armed that this was a cold blooded murder if you bob ministration now really remains tight lipped on this doesn't say anything else then our people can start listening to pakistani we know that the u.n. is also asking for all the details of this raid you know are they going to become suddenly the credible source here and they will absolutely i think the obama administration in many ways the old adage is if you're going to hold stuff big and i think they need to stop to get their act together and what this narrative really is because it changes so many times is this is not good the second thing this is happening here not only the pakistanis doing their own investigation they've hired high priced lobbying firms here in washington to make sure that their side of the story and the money we pay them continues so i think clearly whatever happens here the pakistani investigation will only benefit the pakistanis we have to we have to understand that no matter what they say but the problem is this the rest the world's going to probably take an area the pakistanis come up with and run with it

based on the fact that we've changed our story with us for so many times do you think that we should give the u.n. all of the details they're asked to do an investigation to see if this really was conducted illegally the obama administration is saying absolutely this was all within the legal realm lots of times before we heard it with their treatment bradley manning at quantico to the only that's all according to the military plan of military rules don't we just want to quell those very words by at least telling the u.n. giving them their investigation let me say something to shock your viewers we do things that the american government that are illegal and international law all the time no way i don't i don't it's a harsh fact but that's the truth and the truth is we violated the sovereignty of another country so i don't care how many times why when i spoke to says we do this legitimately we did what we thought was in our best interest as a country and violated their sovereignty just to give us one of those situations accept that fact and get over it now the question becomes why did we half divide.

your soccer team that goes back to your original part of your question about what about the pakistanis the pakistanis have not been a good partner and this is what i think most of i spent part of the day on capitol hill this morning talking to members asking me my perspective on what does this all really mean well this is what it really means the pakistanis are going to act in their own self-interest this is not our policy makers continue to fail to understand as long as we give them the money with no expectation of results other than you know they'll tell us before our best they will continue to play us against ourselves and this case they're going to of course put a put together whatever narrative benefits that it's time we get much more realistic and frankly i knew my book operation dark heart talks about this we knew this in two thousand and three that pakistanis cannot be trusted by the fact they have their own interests that are contrary to ours in many instances unless we understand it and deal with it we will continue to kind of problem as we're doing here for our officials you know secretary of state hillary clinton will say that this is a relationship that we still very desperately need that we're a friend to me is that we maybe. understand each other all the time but we really

do desperately need each other how much they really need the pakistanis if we have bin ladin if supposedly i mean that's where al qaeda is now right we need to get out of afghanistan how much do any of that was frankly i thought this point be only thing that i see is a clear concern of ours is their nuclear weapons program by the fact that we want to make sure it remains stable and control the people who will not use them against us or our allies with that said we are now actually helping fund through the funds we're giving them their ability to develop new technology within their weapons program and as most of us know most of those weapons are aimed at india and other allies so the last thing in the world we want to do is help stabilize a relationship between the indians and pacts which result and possibly a war between the two of them so this is where we've got to take a realistic look at where is our money going could we really get anything all these years and to me it's it goes beyond a shadow of a doubt that the pakistanis are either gravely incompetent or in cahoots with al qaida in some form there's no. nothing else and with that in mind you've got to

look realistically what sort of money is being used or if it's not being used to benefit our interests i'm sorry being brutally honest here then we should reconsider why we're giving and speaking of money now a lot of congress members are of course big fans of these special ops teams. in general and that's where a lot of the money is going to strike going to what i want to thank you very much for joining us tonight. coming up the war in libya has reached a stalemate so what's next must be for professor robert farley about the real possibility of putting troops on the ground there's a g.o.p. presidential primary debates tonight in south carolina right now it's actually going to be there so explain why with us to debate with j.p. fair and stared out of. let's not forget that we are in a park. i

think. either one well. we haven't got the. safe get ready because of the freedom. they charge in here broadcasting live from washington d.c. coming up today on the big picture a. new website with twenty four seven. live streaming news towns what to do about the

ongoing financial hardship unlimited free high quality videos for download. and stories you never find on mainstream news. to me that leads. me to listen to. posting more on aren't you just watched. you guys welcome the show and tell. we part of our guests have to say on the topic now i want to hear audience is going to you tube the video response or the twitter first part of the question that we post on you tube every monday and on thursday the show long response is please let your voice be heard. already or an agreement of the nato led war in libya has reached a stalemate graphene still shows no signs of stepping down and casualties continue

to rise so could the next step for nato forces in fact be placing troops on the ground are teasdale bushnell has more. months of libya's speech to the aid and according to major libya's leader could look at that for years defensive positions be well civilian casualties from me continue to mount they too spokesman review this solution send good ground troops. the u.n. security council should adopt a new resolution on libya was allusion one nine hundred seventy three there's not invisible man operations we need a new resolution. and forces plonked that all along says a leading us law professor clearly what we're seeing in our own fault here in libya is a pre existing war play out by lagos by the british by the french by the americans with air moving everything now is going affording to buy in which is why

i believe that since they have failed to do polls khadafi with the steps are so far the next stage will be moving into a ground invasion and nato powers have to put the international community into supporting war and that's one of them protecting civilians was the claim but grabbing become truth resources is the real goal this is one of the most the worries and transgressions of rights of nation national sovereignty and international law that we've seen in the post-war period the west the u.s. and france and britain have been called virtually according to the evidence and it's leaking out covertly arming the opposition to gadhafi in hopes of grabbing control of the oil and in the different parts of libya the libyan government promises hill for nato if it sends in ground troops some agree such a war may be tougher than expected we will see increased military committing not

only in the air but also on the ground and maybe this will solve the problem one perspective for the nato countries but maybe it will simply be. the one who deeper . bombing from thirty thousand feet coalition soldiers feel fairly safe but then she wore activists war putting troops on the ground risks not just more civilian killing but made two deaths as well the further away they get from high tech and they and the nearer they get to know tech and the greater the danger of casualties on both sides turkey china and russia will criticize the bombardment of libya foreign minister sergei lavrov thinks nato has already gone far beyond the first u.n. resolution to maintain a no fly zone he hits the second resolution to move in ground troops may not come as easy now several nations feel tricked if anybody wants to ask for this money it will come to the u.n. security council we will discuss trying to understand what is planned because the

negligence from the money that we're seeing now are enough to learn lessons with international opposition on the rois they two states face an uphill task to make the case for more war britain's prime minister will dell sending ground troops to libya his defense secretary of methods of parliament they plan exactly that but you have members good at the number of civilian deaths from nato bombing a drone likely to welcome escalation of the conflict r.t. london. so while the world is currently caught up in what it means now that we're post bin laden and tries to weave through all the details of exactly how the getting rid of him mission went down let's not forget there's an entirely different war still going on in libya hillary clinton brokered a deal today in italy with the libya contact group to fund the rebels that's not the only sign of mission creep as the e.u. now says that its humanitarian aid mission might need ground troops and balad require a new u.n.

resolution so two months in it's become quite clear the airstrikes and calls for gadhafi to go are bringing about any change least of all positive results so is it time for the western powers to admit that they made a mistake joining me to discuss it is robert farley assistant professor at the university of kentucky patterson school and blogger at lawyers and money robert thanks so much for joining us tonight but you just wonder do you think that perhaps the intervention in libya has made could offer a stronger that if we hadn't gone in there may be you know some of the unrest would have continued maybe there would have been more pressure from inside but now what's happened is that surveilling casualties are rising now more cut off the supporters are coming out of the woodworks because he gets to as the nato victim. i think that's a really good question and he answered the answer but he still doesn't have control of half of his country and he was he was winning against the rebels when you know intervened it looked like he was going to spend hours whether you would have been told by mask or not is a different question. and so i'm not sure that he's actually stronger but i think

he's been far more resilient than anyone in nato expected i think he's been a lot more resilient than the rebels expected and in that sense i think that people are beginning to beginning to come to a better on those terms but of course we haven't see any signs of of regret that would be embarrassing i guess you would say from nato or from the u.s. quite the opposite now they're saying that they're going to start funding the rebels and the e.u. of course is saying they might need even need troops on the ground to go on with this humanitarian mission so do you just think for this continuously moving trudging creeping forward from here on out. we've talked about this a lot and it's really hard to see exactly where this ends up and i think you're absolutely right in terms of thinking about. moving forward but there doesn't seem to be any way to bridge a stalemate neither doesn't seem to have because of ideas about how to break the stalemate you would've expected parents to london and washington had some sense of

what you do get off the ship we didn't collapse and we got a note that they would have some sense of what to do some sort of plan but it's. being increasingly apparent to me that they didn't really have any sense of what to do if something went wrong and so now we have a situation where we are continuing to have fighting ahead. and he is not backing down and he doesn't seem to be leaving and so yeah i mean i think that we are going to see some creep in the sense for more support for the rebels and of course they've already made the next the next meeting in june that there are you talking about perhaps down the line using that obvious frozen assets of those look like they're planning so my long term here and now you know you mention the fact that they didn't know what to do in case this went wrong i can't believe that we got into another war without a plan b. but let's look at the way that we just had all the situation with osama bin ladin of course you know also last week when coffee's son was killed as well as

a few grandchildren the seven thousand assassination attempt and while that may not be legal you think that nato or the u.s. might actually have the guts to go for it try to do in a real sense a nation of south we know that regime change is their desire. i'm scared i certainly think it's possible that because you know any killed at some time very strike. going forward whether he's going to be the director are going to have struck his or her question but when you're all in control command and control facilities and he's part of this command and control structure he may be killed there also may be some sort of operation with special forces but it is in some sense of order what i. want to skeptical of is that the death of gadhafi has said we're going to make the situation we're going to keep there is an entire regime here and it's a regime that is tied together by vines or windings of wealthy and people have been fighting the rebels the you know their own people who have surrendered have been executed by the rebels in many cases and they're going to be reluctant themselves

to surrender so i don't see even if you don't see is killed. by the west i don't necessarily see this conflict ending anytime soon and of course one of the other problems is that it was labeled as a humanitarian intervention to help civilians not necessarily pick sides and that i hadn't made the rebels but we see civilian casualties now piling up and you know this is something i asked one of my guests yesterday about i was just curious what your take is to you if you look at the international laws and they apply to war it just boggles my mind that it's illegal to go in and try to assassinate a foreign leader no matter how horrible and brutal they might be but it is legal to to launch airstrikes and to bomb from the air and to kill civilians. right right well it's it's because if you can't get legal questions one of which is that authored which means if you're trying to achieve some sort of military you need it by just brilliance that under the rules all their own sort of makes sense when they are carefully explained they don't make sense when you can sort of step back and see all the absurdity of it and they said nation rule is really weird it's i think

it basically so world leaders don't try to assassinate one another on a regular basis and so to get ruled out without. yeah but as we've often seen it rules do tend to be broken robert i want to thank you very much for joining us and of course we'll continue following to see what happens in the stalemate in libya now thanks so much thank you well tonight fox news is going to be hosting the first republican debate for the two thousand and twelve presidential primaries in greenville south carolina and almost nobody is going to be there that's right only five people are going to be there and it's herman cain gary johnson at ron paul rick santorum and the only so-called the big name tim paul n.t. it's another bad sign for an already painfully slow start to the g.o.p. selection race so why the lack of candidates and it could actually give a chance for those outsiders to have a real voice joining me to discuss what is change the fair senior communications strategist new media strategies and from our studio in new york is tara dowdell

democratic strategist i want to thank you both for joining us tonight tara i'm actually going to start with you do you think that this is the worst presidential debate ever you know i've read some really funny commentary today of people saying this is probably going to be the only presidential debate in history that actually lowers the statue of everyone participating. well clearly the front runners of the presumed front runners are staying pretty far away from this and i think that's a bad sign for the republican party and also of the land polling that's going on as you stated so grounding this debate is also adding to this sort of sentiment this feeling that they were publicans just aren't ready for prime time they were publishing contenders and the presume contenders i mean right now all of the candidates even the front runners no one's really lighting the world on fire and that's going to be a big challenge for them raising perspective and also on a number of other friends that are important to winning elections k.p.

what's going on and why the hesitation for people to jump into the race here and you can see this is the clock is taking some people are trying to say that it's still early but if you look back to four years ago there were double the amount of contenders there maybe republicans have some magical candidate that they're just hiding until the right moment there will come out or you know what's the deal well there are a couple of factors that we need to take into account one is that unlike four years ago there is an incumbent president that is running again when president bush was leaving office that is vice president was not going to run so there was no legacy issue and said it was a question of what you want to happen now so that's that's a big part of it and this was also a fairly reminiscent of the discussion that took place with president obama then senator obama people were talking about how he couldn't be serious or that he wasn't quite ready and because he was working hard and early. being in this race he wound up getting the nomination i think that these are important things this is

an opportunity for the lesser known candidates to get their voice out before the whole gets out about you know what mitt romney or whoever else allows them to enter the race speak their turn get a lot of attention and show what they have to offer and you know if they get left off the stage then fine they didn't have much to lose but at least here's an opportunity for them to be heard but i wonder about five because you could say that obviously there is a lot of tension. right now politically a lot of people are unhappy with the two party system with washington in general you could say that even libertarian thought is starting to become a little more mainstream so wouldn't that be the most daring move that republicans could make is actually try to let ron paul be the main guy and take the lead and maybe be a contender for barack obama because there's no one else out there that i think looks exciting i mean i don't think tim collins he is going to beat obama in two thousand and twelve people are very excited about ron paul but i think that a lot of republicans feel that the best thing that they can do is what ron paul speak as much as possible and run into those areas where there are some conflicts

between himself and your average republican and that's and that's i mean this is where this sort of thing gets hashed out but at least here we can have that kind of debate and also ron paul does have staying power right i mean he will probably last at least until the end of this year if not the beginning of next so we're going to we're going to see a lot of ron paul if we're going to see a lot a lot of this debate where we're going to see some more. so some stranger issues maybe being brought up but at least we at least we get started on this by house i have so i think that a lot of the you know potential candidates this time around are going to have to answer some more difficult questions especially when it comes to going to maybe quantitative easing or what they think of the federal reserve and that will be exciting. i mean without this wild card being taken seriously terry what do you think does that make obama unbeatable and twenty twelve with at least the lineup that we're seeing now. well i think the good news for obama is that the lineup that we are seeing now you're absolutely right is that the line of the we're seeing now

there don't there's not a lot of support there's not a lot of enthusiasm and excitement in the twenty ten election cycle you saw enthusiasm you saw this groundswell for the republicans and that's how they had the massive numbers in the congress but you don't see that right now and for president obama yes he is well positioned but he should not absolutely should not take that for granted because we still have base challenges in this country the economy the rising price of gas and the president is confronting a lot there's still rests in the middle east as you've been talking about unrest in north africa and there are signs showing there may be continued unrest in parts of sub-saharan africa so there's a lot going on in this world and it creates a level of uncertainty and a lot of times when people are uncertain and feeling and secure they blame the people in power i think what we're also seeing is that when they were public and people are unhappy we're where they're going right now in congress they elected them they wanted to focus on jobs that was what the mandate the mantra was and the

republicans have not done that being that it is a lie that is going to. excuse me the democrats have said them from doing a little expose talk about the democrats haven't actually offered their own version of the budget paul ryan came forward with a plan everyone was talking about how this might kill the this might actually cause you to try to me and no that is that is true and. let me just president obama did come out with his own budget let's bring in a row of the budget only came out with a three page are talking about what he would do and it wasn't serious you had paul ryan and a slash. six trillion dollars that's a huge job creator that no one is taking seriously republicans do come out with a plan to take care of jobs and we have been harping on this issue nonstop now it's . their plan. let's hear let's hear where they've been. harping about jobs nonstop when they're going after n.p.r. they're going after planned parenthood they're going after you know it's going to use arena but these are these are parts of larger debates where the n.p.r.

thing was brought up in terms of you know cutting cutting the budget and frankly it was a distraction but it wasn't the only thing that they were talking about but it was about jobs i mean it was a side issue i mean it was a small thing the main discussion was happening about how can we reduce the size of government a very real discussion that needs to happen really a pretty second charity have anything to finish up i might suggest for by that point the reality is that the budget that has been laid for by paul ryan has been booed in the town hall meetings that he's been hosting people came actually building and every independent analysis says it will actually eliminate jobs not create jobs eliminate jobs and that's the last thing we need to do and what we have right now is a jobs crisis for a new government i want to thank both of you for joining us tonight. give us an answer as to who the hell is going to the president in two thousand and twelve but we will keep watching that coming up one oklahoma state politician has no problem voting for outrageous immigration laws but now he's raising money on this think that if i open my.