three. three. three. three volunteers video for your media project. guns or t.v. dot com. sixty one point six trillion dollars that's the amount of money the us has promised but certainly does not have so if us keep relying on credit just when will the empire foreclose. our foreign policy and expansionist foreign policy. whether you agree with me or nani will win because we're out of there you go with someone who wants to save money so is it rand paul to the rescue or is the rest of congress so comfy with kickbacks from the current foreign policy it's not likely to happen so are story current topic not historical topic yes even one hundred fifty years later we'll take a look at how the arguments of the past can be seen all over the present day usa.

good afternoon it's wednesday june eighth four pm here in washington d.c. i'm lauren mr and you're watching our t.v. now we know and we've been hearing that the u.s. is facing a point three trillion dollar deficit but a new analysis shows the situation is actually much worse that trillions more dollars for two thousand and ten are owed because of the way congress has to do their accounting we don't really hear about that they don't have to report it we also know that the u.s. is in four point four trillion or excuse me fourteen point four trillion dollars in debt and the u.s. national debt is now expected to exceed the size of the u.s. economy this year that would be a first since world war two that's according to a treasury report i do want to point out that this wasn't supposed to happen until twenty fourteen according to past estimates now of course the government. and agree

on how to deal with this as we're seeing here in washington but joining me now for more to offer their solution that's a tough order we're going to get right to it are heather steer my she is from for forty group public relations and caroline hellman she is professor of politics at occidental college thank you so much for being with me now it's a usa today analysis that is reporting these numbers that shows that the government actually added more than five trillion dollars in new obligations compared to the one point five trillion in new debt taken on last year and this is largely from medicare and first social security now it's not reported because congress can postpone recording their spending commitments until it writes a check also the federal debt doesn't take into account what's owed to seniors veterans or retired employees but just what's owed to the public so this is a much bigger picture and a more dire picture that adds up to some more than sixty trillion dollars owed long run than what we hear just talked about in the debt ceiling or the debt negotiation debates congress isn't it a disagreement about what to do i want to ask you ladies what big picture do you

see as the solution without getting into too much detail but what is the solution really big picture for getting this country out of the situation and allowing it to pay its bills i'll start with you had experienced you well i think it's easy to understand is compare what's going on at the government to what good could go on in the household if you reach your limit you can just easily raise your own ceiling which would mean you say we can take on more credit cards the quicker companies won't let you do that but for whatever reason united states has set a precedent where we can raise our debt ceiling and definitely keep on borrowing or making money and that's just not good fiscal policy and the reality is are the foundation of our economy can only sustain so much we already have cracks and the ceiling is going to start falling on us whether you agree or disagree with you how is the government going to pay the twenty four point eight trillion dollars it goes for medicare or the twenty one point four trillion dollars that is for sure.

security if it doesn't raise the debt ceiling sure well that's why we have these negotiations going on right now we have a medicare plan from representative paul ryan that we are debating right now the republicans in the house have come behind it and we're having a debate on that right now and those are good solutions and the democrats voted yes you know but it's not a popular solution with the american people i want to switch over to you professor help me to ask you what do you see as the solution to this big problem because there are many good point that have been pointed out that you know point of fact that the government can't keep on like this. well first i think those numbers are a bit soft because they don't take into account the fact that g.d.p. will grow we'll have economic growth we'll have more revenue we'll have a greater population there will also be alterations in these programs with that said the structural deficit problem has been a problem now for nearly a decade it emerged about ten years ago it's emerged at various points but most recently about ten years ago and we know that the primary driving factors are three things one are unfunded wars two we have shifted away from taxing the wealthy their

fair share i argue fair share but there's no doubt we've shifted away from taxing them at previous rates and three corporate taxation has shifted so we simply haven't been bringing in the same amount of revenue all of this compounded by the fact that we're in an economic downturn so you address those issues and you alter existing programs and we get out of this problem i want to ask heather something about that because one of the reasons that the debt is now expected to reach the level of the g.d.p. this year is believed to be because of bush tax cuts that were extended by the obama administration that we saw in december so how can you argue that extending these as republicans want to continue to do is a good thing it isn't hindering it's death situation that you say is a problem well look we have to cut programs we have to make changes we have to make reforms we have to look at our life really in a different way and i would argue that even personally make some sacrifices perhaps we need to raise the retirement age to seventy. or to raise taxes that i mean is

there no way out of this without raising another another solution that paul ryan also has and his plan is means testing which means that if you make over a certain amount of money you shouldn't have to rely on medicare you should still pay into the system but you don't need to get that and yet right now we've given there so to speak to millionaires we can so security to millionaires a professor helpmate can the country afford not to raise taxes. well i don't think we can afford to i would argue restore taxes back to their previous levels we were wealthy individuals used to be taxed at a rate of about ninety percent fifty years ago we're down now to actual rates of around twenty percent that could go up quite a bit i think and there wouldn't be pain i mean the fact that that wealth increase for the top one percent it increased seven percent during this economic downturn while the rest of us were suffering that speaks to me that the wealthy can afford that and i would very much agree with either that we need alterations to these programs we do need needs based programming for both social security and medicare

so that we're not basically supplementing millionaires we also need a public option for health care to bring those costs down we also need the prescription drug plan we need the government to be able to negotiate with big pharmaceutical companies and republicans put that in when they instituted the bill that we couldn't do that that that's just foolhardy when it comes to talk station when it comes to our our money i mean i want to go a little bit outside of kind of this partisan debate and look at something that kind of neither sides of the aisle really want to touch and that is military pay defense spending is something very popular and i want to bring up a graphic to show what exactly to united states is going to be owing in terms of military pay these are military retirement and disability benefits three point six trillion dollars that's thirty one thousand dollars per u.s. household and i want to show you how that's grown the wars in iraq and afghanistan let's move to the next graphic they've contributed a forty six percent increase since two thousand and four and the cost of pension medical care and disability benefits for former service members this is the biggest

jump that we've seen seventy one percent increase since two thousand and four to one point three trillion dollars in the cost of future pension checks to retired military personnel. for the disability program rose to one point five trillion that's up fifty four percent since two thousand and four and nine hundred billion dollars for retiree health care that's up thirty two percent so how can you not look at defense spending and the amount this. has promised for these wars that it's involved in when you look at the budget heather i think you have to look at all facets of the budget however what the republicans have decided to do right now realizing too that is going to be controversial i mean we're having a hard enough time just suggesting to make moderate changes to one program but a bigger picture should these be cuts that are on the table i is this out of line and should foreign policy be brought into this i think good looking outside of politics sure i understand i think that the defense spending though is for the most

part a worthwhile expenditure i don't think that we should look too closely how much we're spending on defense and my personal opinion i think that's a very noble thing to spend our money on that does not mean that there aren't cuts we have to there is so much that is put on each bill that we pass so many things that i would argue the average congressman doesn't know is in the bill what about two thousand pages of a bill and you know it's a long bill i think that sometimes they don't get it right i want to ask you know what about something like a two hundred twenty million dollar doomsday plane for the president they can withstand nuclear blast an asteroid it's on standby twenty four seven in addition to air force one what about things like this that are inexpensive looking at other countries you know the prime minister of united kingdom david cameron have to charter a plane or schedule you know schedule one in order to travel are these like some of the things that should be next. well you know we spend certainly yes we spend more money on our military industrial complex that eisenhower warned us about you know sixty years ago then all of the other advanced industrialized nations combined the

cold war after after the fact we found out that the arms race was about ten times what it should have been in order to keep us safe and not only do i have an issue with the amount that we spend but we're also spending it oftentimes unconstitutionally when the president is going to war without congressional approval at horrible cost of the human lives involved we see major issues now with mental health because so many servicemen and women are going back into battle again and again and of course i want to honor their service and their pension should not be touched but we need to think long term about what our priorities are as a nation i want to thank both of you ladies for weighing in on what you think could be done of course we still don't know how our bills are going to get paid in this country to everybody that is owed but we certainly when i think heather stemming from four hundred forty group public relations and caroline help and professor of politics at occidental college for their insight now some analysts would argue that republicans and democrats have duke it out to methe tickly on many things like we just heard what it stood together on america's costly wars and expansive foreign

policy when it's a continuation of wars in iraq and afghanistan not to mention guantanamo bay and drone strikes in pakistan continuing from bush to the obama administration and you're a libertarian leaning republican senator rand paul though he's an outsider someone argue more willing than the traditional politicians to call a spade a spade and to call for a change in the foreign policy department so will this mean anything for us foreign policy we're going to get to that but first our chief correspondent helen ford has more on exactly what it is rand paul is calling for. senator graham for senator rand paul america is a quote for sure but it can't be defended by a deficit we're out of money i mean our foreign policy and expansionist foreign policy will end whether you agree with me or not it will end because we're out of money. was made waves in the republican party by outlining his own foreign policy and challenging military in humanitarian aid around the world by and large foreign

policy has been bipartisan with very little dissent in our country that's why i am on usual and that's why i'm called names and anybody who brings up less intervention is called an isolationist for decades american presidents have decided to intervene while taxpayers foot the bill grenada we were told was a friendly island paradise for tourism. well it wasn't today i want to talk with you about our nation's military involvement in somalia american and coalition forces are in the early stages of military operations to disarm iraq. even the president the campaign promises to keep if gadhafi does not comply with the resolution you know they. will oppose what's a resolution will be enforced through military action paul has also proposed ending the u.s. has three billion dollars in aid to israel even as all sides of the aisle expressed their unwavering support despite talk to small talk's we've increased foreign

military financing to record levels and he's called the united nations a quote forum for dictator but unlike his father congressman ron paul get the troops out of after scan a steal in a in that war that hasn't helped us and hasn't helped anybody in the middle east. isn't proposing immediate withdrawal of u.s. troops. is the fourth increasing the percentage of the budget spent on the pentagon despite in eighty one percent increase in defense spending since two thousand and one when i prioritize spending that i think national defense is a constitutional function of government and so it would have a priority for me over all other spending really going to rand paul's views are often portrayed as far outside the mainstream but with a resume fifty three percent of americans favoring ending u.s. involvement in libya it may be closer to popular opinion if not by congressional ford artsy washington d.c. . and joining us for more here in the studio is jake of hornberger he is president

of the future freedom foundation thank you for being here and so we just saw a report about rand paul and some of the things that he is calling for foreign policy wise which in his own words he said has made him unpopular what do you say in his words he said that i can't find it exactly but he basically says that he's an outcast as a result of what he is calling for my question to you is when someone is speaking out against kind of this bipartisan consensus on foreign policy that is continued from congress and from the administration's push to obama does he stand a chance to shake up. well i think so i mean ideas have consequences rand is calling for a more constrained restrained foreign policy in which the us government does not intervene in baden occupy so many countries the problem is i see with those it still leaves in the hands of the government the power to engage in these interventions and so while you may call for more restraint policy all that subjective the government officials are going to be the ones in charge we

libertarians say the government shouldn't even be engaged in intervening anywhere should be a department of true defense and that my question to you because you're a libertarian i know that you from what i've read you part rand paul and his ideas why are republicans and democrats so quick to kind of cast off libertarians as being out of touch when it comes to foreign policy or isolationist that don't really understand the world why is that well because we take a completely different approach than they do i mean our paradigm is completely different our paradigm is consistent with the founding principles of america which is the government does not go abroad in search of what john quincy adams called monsters to destroy we don't go abroad to save people to regime change or kill invade and whatever what we do instead is we liberate the private sector the cultural groups the business from an economic groups to exchange and trade and interact with the people of the world so we want to isolate the government which

obviously upsets the big government advocates and the republican and democratic party we want to liberate the private sector they want to do the exact opposite that you know the thing work well because we've had a history of it i mean from you know seventeen eighty seven the u.s. government did not have a huge standing army it did not have a military industrial complex it didn't have this empire seven hundred eight hundred bases around the world and yet we were building trying to build a model society here a big exception slavering in tears and so forth but it. worked very well in terms of keeping america out of these foreign wars so what's different today i mean what would be holding back members of congress who may be you know let's say have large donors that are military contractors who benefit from the four hundred twenty billion dollars that the united states has spent in afghanistan eighteen billion dollars in civilian aid it's gotten over the last eight years are there pressures that we keep members of congress from supporting foreign policy like what you're

calling for what rand paul is calling for of course i mean you've got big money involved here the military industrial complex plays a huge role in the amount of money but someone of your you've got contractors that are on the dole you have foreign dictators on the dole i mean look how many middle east dictators receive billions of dollars from the u.s. government those donors have influence they have influence in congress it's also a matter of domination you've got a full loss of the of the status of say we want the u.s. government to dominate the world to engage in regime change operations sanctions embargoes assassinations and beijing's occupations we want to stop that because look how destructive it is it's producing the terrorist threat that they then use it is an excuse to take away our freedoms and it bankrupts our country a couple things that i want to ask as you mentioned bankrupting our country do you think that rand paul is challenging any conservative who is for smaller government

and we see this huge debate over debt do you think he's challenging lawmakers by bringing up the money issue that the united states cannot afford to keep operating like this absolutely because you know they all say oh well yeah we want we're we're for a strong fiscal policy and fiscal policy sound dollar but they want to keep spending the money own this actually bankrupt in the country rand paul and his father ron are coming up and saying no let's start cutting the things that we're spending on including this military empire and so forth. and that is the way to alleviate the bankruptcy then why are they called names as rand paul says that he that is called names for talking like this and for investing these things because he's exposing the charade in the fraud the the conservatives and the democrats have always stood for they stand for limited government and free markets and so forth but then they expand on this huge empire war first a welfare state here at home they won't talk about abolishing anything in title notes departments and agencies nothing they want to keep spending the money really

really quick like they want to do this how much of a difference would it make if congress did change its tune and start to have more of a difference in opinion on foreign policy when so much is in the hands of the executive branch as we've even seen with libya where the obama administration could just continue war in libya at the sixty day mark which is required by the repairers after the president to go to congress and congress too much to prepare i mean they passed a resolution last week but before that the sixty days that really was an issue absolutely and they ignored the declaration of war requirement the constitution was there really need to be doing to start talking impeachment the only way they can get the president to obey the law he thinks is going to be removed from office if there's a threat or that you know bring him over to congress let him justify it and in an impeachment proceeding i got a feeling then presidents might be more cautious about obeying the law but until that happens do you think that even matter any changes in congress just briefly i doubt it i mean look the president's ignoring everything that's going on with

respect to what congress is doing with this new resolution that they just dropped many more bombs in in libya today they don't care i think only the threat of impeachment going to work yet congress is kind of dropped the ball to in fact you could argue i want to thank you for your analysis on that with jacob former president of the future of freedom foundation now it is the one hundred fiftieth anniversary of the state of tennessee is joining the confederacy during in the american civil war now it was a long time ago but this is one of many of the secession that is being celebrated this year on this one hundred fiftieth and her. three now last summer veer the date as a time to honor those in the south who fought for states' rights others recall in horror at what they consider to be tantamount to celebrating the reason for the war in their eyes slavery so one hundred fifty years later we see a country that is still split over what caused the war and still divided today by many of its lasting effects here some of them. it's a war that lives on in the united states. but. soldiers can be found camped out

near the battlefields where forefathers once fought reenacting the civil war one hundred fifty years later and off these fields its legacy still runs through the country the ohio river was once considered an extension of the mason dixon line in the united states dividing north and south a division that still remains today. mostly of the civil war the war in one country to country can finish please america usa for many in the south there's still rebellion against the northern victors version of events and battles rage on in americans minds about what was its stake in this conflict then and now there's a lot of people here i think the civil war is still a a current topic not a historical topic. in this town it's left residents defensive over their right to bear arms except whenever a. little bit here owning a gun is mandatory southerners view the last gasp of the citizenry against

a. oppressive government as is to revolt oh i say and in the very capital of the nation war i say oh and residents are still fighting the federal government for full voting rights and to represent taishan in congress the residents of the district of columbia have never had the rights that are persona upon everyone else in this country the limits to their rights stem and part from civil war divisions it's definitely part of and before that people never thought of blacks voting at all but scholars argue though the war may have ended slavery it was far from ending racism with washington d.c.'s large population of newly freed black citizens at the end of the war to limit their influence political elites. wish to curve voting rights for everyone presidents are still fighting that legacy today. just

like stand up for slavery. and the tea party protests that have swept across the u.s. have really energized the rally behind states' rights reminiscent of confederate rhetoric one hundred fifty years ago when you look at source software clee i've probably line up in the they're even generic pedigree on storm level going back to the states that the most these people are from it's much more along with the confederacy of eight hundred sixty southern belles celebrate civil war states the session one modern day civil rights activists equate it to celebrating treason and slavery and polls show a divided country more than half of americans believe the civil war is still relevant today only a minority relegated to history all the country remains split over the cards. for the group so while the literal reenactments of the civil war may be the most visible leftover of a war that divided the nation. left over battles are still being fought by many

more in a war that lives on today or in mr r.t. . here me now for more from our los angeles studio with anika perry and with the young turks and thanks so much for being with us my question to you just sitting in los angeles on the west coast a liberal area what do you care about the civil war or hundred fifty years later does this concern you at all. well i care a great deal i mean even though i'm in a liberal area where progressive voices of progressive ideologies trunk call i think that it's important to look back at the civil war and how it shaped the identity of the united states i know that this is still a huge issue in southern states right now where you have that debate as to whether or not the confederates won i mean it's amazing to me that people still want to have that debate and what the real meaning behind a civil war was and this is

a question that is happening in the united states right now and just based on the report that your viewers just watched it's incredible to see the diversity of ideologies that surround this very topic and that very war but before i want to get to why exactly that is that this divide exists i just want to ask you just kind of anecdotally you know because for me going this out and doing that reporting was really the first time that i realized how much the civil war really is a part of people's lives in a way that it was just wasn't from mine growing up in california do you feel the same way it is do you have the same reaction. i have the exact same reaction because here in california don't get me wrong we still have a very long way to go in terms of race relations racism still exists but in california you have this sense of equality among all and i know that that's not the case in a lot of other states and there are still people in southern states that want to raise the confederate flag and want to talk about how lights are superior superior to blacks and that's something that's jarring for someone like me who was born and

raised in los angeles but i think that it's a very important issue that we still need to focus on the united states you know one thing that i always think about is dr laura schlessinger and this is something that happened you know last year but she made the argument that since we have a black president african-americans in this country no longer have a right to whine about race relations and she claims that they all have a chip on their shoulders that just shows you that regardless of the civil war regardless of all the progress we've made in this country there are still people in the united states that are still racist that still believe that they're superior than any other race imaginable so it was jarring to me as someone who grew up in california but it's a topic that i think we should definitely discuss you know the thing i want to enter i want to ask you what do you think the divide is really about because you point to racism and you say that you know you would see waving the confederate flag as insulting and kind of channeling that that racism war or white supremacy people

i have interviewed in the south see it as you know honoring their grandfathers that fought and died in a war that they believe is about was about states' rights and was about other motivating factors and that it's not about racism it's about honoring their history do you not see it that way. i don't see it that way i see the confederates fighting for the right to have slaves ok that's what the huge issue was at the time of the civil war the northern states had already of polish to band slavery the southern states refused to do that and that was one of the main reasons why the civil war happened there might have been other factors the played a role but the major role was slavery so i can understand those individuals wanting to honor their ancestors their grandfathers their family members who fought in the civil war but we got to keep it real we know what the civil war was really about ok the question asked to then if that's the case why is this country still so split about it because you know you are in maybe you know i think it's like around forty

percent or so believe it's about slavery some believe it's about states' rights why do you think the country is still so split as you say you know we all really know what the civil war was about. i think the political question has shifted from slavery to something completely different you know in the report that we just watched there was the question of guns and the right to bear arms and you know the question has really shifted toward something completely different and you know people who live in the south and in a lot of other states feel like the government is out to take their rights away they're out to really violate their constitutional rights so they feel like they need to stockpile weapons or they feel like they absolutely need to have a gun and i think that that's something that is part of the fear mongering that you see in the media you know you see fox news talking about how the government wants to control every single part of your life and they want to take your guns away you have the n.r.a. telling you that they want to take your guns away so you have people in the south

who feel like they need to protect their rights by you know lashing out toward the government or by looking back at you know their confederate leaders and it's really not about slavery at this point like i said that question our political question is completely shifted to something different but you see that polarized politics in you know several different states in this country really quickly and you know we don't have a lot of time but you mentioned the polarization today and we have even seen states like attacks this that you know we've heard the governor talk about seceding we've heard that from vermont we hear some of the civil war rhetoric in the whole tea party movement do you think that it could ever ask to late to another breaking point as it did in the civil war times this yes or no and no i don't think that it's going to escalate to the point where we have a violent civil war like we did before i think a review moved past that but i could be wrong about how right i want to thank you for.