these horrifying images you are not seeing elsewhere as because they are the real faces the real problems these of war parties one of the few outlets still reporting from libya we haven't left but neither have nato forces so is the toll of that war being too much to bear. and obama the optimist morning investment in america seems to be the president's the latest plan to save the economy solid strategy or a desperate attempt to create home amid the gloom. there were a very. heated debate was.

ok well maybe maybe not so much but well keith olbermann and glenn beck prepare to bask in the light of their new ventures these old giants really the face of the alternative press and will their star soar or crash and burn. it's tuesday june twenty first here in washington d.c. i'm lucy catherine of any watching artsy well death toll the death toll is rising in libya and the culprit this time isn't a bloodthirsty dictator but the very same forces who are there on a mission to liberate the country now the latest bungled nato air strike has claimed the lives of millions how a lot of civilians and the inclusion of two toddlers among the latest death toll how the alliance struggling to defend its credibility argues morea for an ocean of reports on the ground in tripoli. another day has brought more death and destruction to leave here

a large private company the rest of the capital tripoli has been leveled reduced to rubble in apparent as strike. rescues have discovered the remains of fifteen people according to libyan officials. the house destroyed belonged to general who are like movie one of the people closest to colonel gadhafi he was among those who took part in the military coup to bring the leader in leader to power forty one years ago the general escaped injury but most of his family died in the attack. this man is talking about legal are one of the grandchildren of the general and one of three kids killed in the incident the day of the bombing the family had gathered with friends to celebrate his fourth birthday. libyan civilians families when

attacked in the airlie hours of this morning killing fifteen people including three were children are. mothers. it's. the number is fifteen people nato has denied these claims just as it's never committed the deaths of more than eight hundred others believe in god and says were killed by their bombs and nine people killed in sunday's bombing of a residential building in tripoli i mean the only civilian casualties i can all this by the lines which claimed a mistake did your weapons technical pay their former pentagon official says the only thing clear about the nato campaign is the mountain casualty toll and damage it's inflicting on the even people they try to achieve a certain level of humanitarian effort and initially but the protracted bombing is now increasingly hitting civilian targets and it's creating

a very negative reaction i think it does raise the question of what is nato's role continue going to be there as discontented actions and crazies are the voices become more and more about to the voices of the libyan people. and it seems that the more anger they feel about nato the more they support their leader. that that's what this is the sense was that. was a. challenge it was. the best that. they can stay in the united states is that was. that.

we will let you all go to live in all of this is cool we're not sure. what is the more dying. off. only. now on a does libyan mission mission continues many voices here in the u.s. are calling for an end to this conflict and one of them is former u.s. attorney general ramsey clark who joins us live now from new york mr clark thank you so much for taking the time to speak to us i really do appreciate it. more of course is never meant to be a pretty thing it's a serious business and you know when accidents happened what the consequences are really serious to shouldn't these civilian casualties be seen in the broader context of a mission to supposedly help the people of libya against a terrible regime i think it's a green cash position for called. you to be seen in the context of a war of aggression which nurnberg charter and the nuremberg judgment defined

as the supreme international crime. new united states additionally or perhaps still now to some degree or nato has a right to the track of. libya under international law it's not the first time i want to order maybe in one nine hundred eighty six after president reagan caused the attack on tripoli and benghazi killing hundreds of civilians there at that time and first the first target was the compound where colonel gadhafi lived they hit the they hit the office building the same one you see in the pictures today to hit attempt help in the compound there we don't have a middle of a grassy field they hit the home killed a small child a daughter of stray at that time of government and here we go again it's a war of aggression going to be condemned as the supreme international crime that

it gives if it's a supreme international crime or are you saying the president the united states is a criminal and if so what consequences should we face well the united states is the principal instigator and the president is. the chief executive officer of the united states under article one of our constitution so there's no declared war the congress is upset about that our constitution requires there be a declaration of war by the congress but. so far the congress had declared many wars of aggression. it's declared war to enter wars and have been under way or to. real interests of the united states and it's unclear if they are i doubt that they would have rejected the president's plan had he gone to congress but i guess the broader question is you know if you look at the history of warfare in the united states every single president since reagan has had a war of his own so to speak. is there

a culture of aggression and warfare that we're fighting here that's broader than just libya. yes of course it goes back before reagan. remember the korean war bloody bloody war three or four million people killed for no reason except. these are who dominate the korean peninsula and divided. the motion unified society on the planet at that time culturally never fought in a war off its own soil and certainly divided and. mutilated by huge army marching against each other time and time again for years but mr clarke it was much easier about mom and vietnam of course it was much easier though in those days of that with a limited media to control the message by the white house by the congress by the by the the forces in power now the people do have access to this information they see the consequence of the wars why do you think there isn't broader support behind messages like yours to end these complex why are folks like yourself marginalized

and c.n.n. with all due respect sometimes that's french by the mainstream establishment. or i think the mainstream media is still the dominant. informer and opinion setter. you know facebook and all these things are she was kind of an entertainment or a game or. irrelevant career but not not the serious word not the official word so. the domination of the media by the same interests that. she will leave military industrial complex. is a threat to life on earth and who stands to benefit from this i mean do you see any any indication that more folks will sign on to what you're saying and i don't actually demand an end to the seemingly endless day of war.

where we've seen what's happened throughout the arab world we've seen the heroic. struggle of the people of egypt for freedom after many generations of. very violent dictatorial government supported by the united states. so documenting. the baraka for decades is harder two hundred fifty people are on the streets as early as two years ago in cairo because of fear you have to bring foreigners and it will be the majority of the protest finally with the union and to loosen it across the arab world and beyond the urban see people road they're not going to take it anymore the cart of repression and. and the misery of their lives but it's the same very dictators and united states supported all these years put in place and machine in place like in saudi arabia and emirates for the most part

they're under attack that. we want to protest and it's those who are independent of united states wife of libya as iraq was it would be with united states wanted so we paid a heavy toll with us wars of aggression well heavy toll indeed for our independence and not lining up with the with the interests in power mr park i really do appreciate you taking your time thank you so much and when it comes to war it's all too easy to forget the enormous damage behind that small tiny three letter word splashed across the headlines i set it on the t.v. screens a war becomes an abstract an idea a talking point that has almost nothing to do with the actual devastation that damage the destruction that it wreaks now a warning what we're about to show you is graphic and probably not going to see it on other networks but these images likely say more about the meaning of war but words ever can so here it is this is the face of war we've seen before you is the

toll the consequence of war taxpayer dollars guns planes tomahawk missiles those abstract terms all adds up to this this devastation this is what they we will be right. enjoy it only it would seem a case of you don't work to bring justice or accountability. i have every right to know what my government's true if you want to know why i think taxes. i would characterize obama as a charismatic. american exceptionalism. what drives the world the fear mongering used by politicians who makes decisions.

being made who can you trust no one who is you be you with noble mission ridge see where are we heading state controlled capitalism it's called fashion when nobody dares to ask we do our tea question more. or pitting now to the economy we're scenes of good news is getting harder to come by for us no one knows that better than a president who is trying to convince the country to elect him to a second term in office despite of course soaring unemployment plummeting home sales and payrolls that are grinding to a crawl while yesterday obama announced one little piece of good economic news for the rest of the world may not love us foreign policy but when it comes to its assets it seems that america has not lost its sex appeal and that is at least according to the president who is touting a nearly fifty percent increase in foreign investments last year so what is this administration's a new plan to save the economy while rolling out

a giant welcome mat for foreign investors that reads we are open for business invest in our country you see some economists like mike joe at euro pacific capital are simply not buying it here's what mike thinks of the new white house strategy. well you know all the consequences coming out at least officially on ostensibly from the great recession you know right right pre-crisis level of our deficit was. in real life it went down to three hundred eighty billion dollars. how can that be a way to fight and we believe trillion dollars so that was one percent increase in our current account deficit so those are years that you spazzing there and really. i get the budget issues and that will be good news next will be something when but you obviously. didn't do all the americans pension

because she was already. so i mean you know obviously if something goes down because of a giant crash and i think i don't know if we can show it here we have the graphic behind us not sure if the cameras there we go so yeah i mean sure it rose back by fifty percent nearly fifty percent but look at where used to be so i mean what's the what's the about obama administration doing here painting putting lipstick on a pig well you should absolutely understand how. ministration can be great we have a right up nearly three quarters of the chili. that dropper up because of the great will we say about you chad and i mean the bounce back so. great i think. for prosperity you know you play it but. i show you how that really aggressively fighting inflation better like

a good plan to attract solar direct investment but showing the country right. because you are a huge target. what i call those other strategies you mentioned sound like they take a little bit more work and a nice press release and i try to hold my breath for that but i mean. the surprising thing about the strategy or whatever you want to call it is that how out of line it is with frankly the typical fear mongering that we see out of washington i mean you know the japanese were demonized two decades ago for buying up american corporate signals we saw the scandal over the dubai ports deal we saw china wasn't allowed to buy a company an energy company that it wanted to buy so why why do we see this flip from foreign equals bad to suddenly foreign it equals good. well i think you certainly get me and you know for some good music. to read and read every right watching best in the united states well you wonder radical if you were also in the country because of our huge balance of payment deficit they have these cars anyway

they do jump on the stage driver. which they do right. i cost which by the. american citizens anyway was interest in the future which is the fair tax then tourists so this isn't good news we're not americans right we're actually ours increased by actually in cali trade that really was in a nation. we. chatted and greet. each other in the back bay china. i think for our letters but actually going to lead to a us was gracious is going to lead to us iraqi crisis and then yes i will i. can't reach the dhamma begging the federal reserve to step up. but that's i mean

that's that all sounds pretty damned scary to me i mean if that's the case then what do you dearly you know simple cuts aren't going to are going to do the job and i don't even know if the fed can change policy in time to avert this crisis they speak of so if you were a bond i would you be everyone has his own personal i would i was fired. immediately replaced by a laptop go back and like i said you have to balance the budget i'll get ceiling isn't raised you know we have two point two trillion dollars in income and we have actually in their cars and literally dollars in debt goes wait are we going to meet with. what is strange ikea only then will he take in as a. very solid like you. living within our means that must be something in them those chinese came up with i never heard of that here in this country well mike thank you so much. thank you so much that was my senior economist at euro pacific capital. but you don't have to be

a fan of either man to know that keith olbermann and glenn beck are polar offices when it comes their politics of course aside from one supposed to giants paychecks from their cable news employers the the two men have very little in common until now this after years of generating both readings and headaches for their perspective networks both men are trading in their mainstream podiums for new ventures butting up the strength of their personal brands their personal characters will guarantee success even if that means starting over on smaller riskier alternatives television platforms artie's on associates working on that story. i think it's. despised by some lot by others they certainly can't stand each other who'll make you weep more for journalism keith olbermann or me the less than one percent of the country that watches your listens to the show thinking they are not listening to an educated imperceptibly wacko. can these mainstream media stars shine just as bright in the scary world of alternative media after years of mad

chalkboard ing fox news channels when back is about to step off america's t.v. screens as fox shows him the door it's imperative that now is responsible citizens who are awake we don't just sit in front of our t.v.'s and say yeah. yeah oh my god it's going bad what an amazing broadcaster i'm going to sit here i'm going to all the lies i'm going to miss the propaganda beck will now take all that to his own web network. about to get started it's called the t.v. . the truth lives here. access to this truth will cost cash as beck's fans will have to subscribe to tune in to turn the damn t.v. off right now if you have to at one point he was up to three point one million viewers how many of those three point one million are going to we want to plunk down less than five bucks a month to see the guy it's difficult to to have people pay for something they had

to get for free the whole time one person who won't have trouble pocketing the big bucks is former emerson b.c. star keith olbermann several months after being dropped by the network reportedly for making campaign contributions to democrats he's appearing on a new platform current t.v. channel called founded by former vice president and the face of america's green movement establishment our war the whole idea of having a broadcast network is to have viewers it's all about having viewers and nobody watches current right now nobody watches it. i could yell out my window and more people would hear me probably if i was the. channel hopes that will change with the liberal pundit hopping on board were reported i pop in ten million dollars a year a satisfying three million dollar raise from alderman's emmis n.b.c. days a much bigger corporate own network and maybe the sort of thing where the first night the first week wow he's got three million people watching him but in week three it

is a go down to twenty three thousand at that point i think people are current t.v.'s skirt showing their fingers down to their knuckles and he what have we done while it'll take time to show which campbell's payoff and which are bust old messages are likely to stick even our new platforms oligarch. the one that's missing is why. i don't know for turning into an oligarchy or what we're turning into but unless you ask why. we're going to transform into something i've got a question. i don't sure hers. nor he or that obama still orders see what's unlikely mainstream media stars jumping the mainstream shit becoming a trend but warm comfort of sleeping in bed with corporate pillow is too cozy for most others to get up and leave i don't think there are enough movers in the world to convince o'reilly that you should you know hang it up i think about riley is in

this for the better. so fans relax the one sided shouting matches are not going anywhere for now and especially turkey no r t do you work. ok well from the mainstream to the news stream i mean is this really the future of alternative news here in america now when you the older man was interviewed by rolling stone magazine recently about his new venture he said that the london and i were in the same boat now but what is that boat and more importantly where the heck is it sailing to you first only time will tell but in the meanwhile we decided to pose that question to someone who knows a thing or two about alternative news sam seeder is the host of the majority report and here's his take. they're both leveraging their personal brands and taking in the smaller. and hoping that their fans will follow them there i mean it's not a. precise a privilege because you know a minute still on cable television people can stumble upon him in

a way that they can't necessarily stumble on glenn beck glenn beck you have to go to a specific u.r.l. you could theoretically skip lives and families and find keith olbermann on fable but there is a similar. move to basically walking away from a larger corporate structure and. using the the attractiveness of their own brand to have their fans follow and it is it doesn't say more about the family or the mainstream channels and supporting alternative views or is it just too isolated cases where and decided to make their lives for whatever personal reasons they need it so well i actually think i think it's a combination of the former in that there is a failure by the corporate media to. reach certain audiences but it's also in many ways sort of the natural evolution of technology i mean we've seen people in music do this you've had you know musical acts who have left the corporate

structure of their their record labels and you know sending out there are distributing their their music independently and this is the next step and i'd be surprised to see more i mean in many ways this is very similar toward howard stern did with satellite radio he left a certain corporate structure to wrestle radio had it into a place where it was a little bit workflows where it was little or specifically for him and his product and i think this is we're going to see more of this going forward that's what i have to ask i mean it in the case of keep keep going on for example i mean you know he's not going over to democracy now to earn whatever salaries those hard working folks are and i think he's going to be reportedly on. ten million dollars a year i mean is this really leaving the corporate structure for some new sorts of alternative media or maybe much of the old same just couched in a in a different brand oh no actually i mean i think i mean i think the ten million dollar figure i'm not sure how accurate that is i know that when put out there but

the difference is is that currency be privately owned it is not a corporate that is also making ball bearings or nuclear subs or some other product fox news is just one part of a larger media empire so the difference is that there's going to be less minefields in terms of what olbermann could deal with i mean on on his from your night his last guest talked about why he had been banned from m s n b c i think you're going to see a lot more taking on of corporate power because there is no corporate entity that that will be able to control and so it really is a change it's not so much his salary it's much as the independence that comes with a with a media company that is not owned by a corporation that you know offshore jobs you know. around the world so i do think there is actually going to be a big difference i do agree with you that there's a major giant difference between

a general electric the parent of everything you see and current t.v. but at the same time just push back a little bit i mean this is still a you know the brainchild of al gore what degree of us politics are not he is by all accounts an established elite insider if it's not the equivalent of state democracy now or some more grassroots funded organization so could we really expect a change in the message and you know see this as a real alternative media frenzy or oh yeah i mean i actually think so i mean i don't know you know i don't know either al gore or bill clinton out there where they disagree on politics but i imagine it's not serve. different and you know al gore is no no general you know at the end of the day i don't expect the goldman to become a democracy now but i think that has more to do with what he's interested in foxing about and where his both its allies and less about there's going to be any

management saying you can't discuss this. method i really do think there's going to be there is a big difference but on that note i mean wouldn't it be more productive to take whatever amount of money that's going to these guys and maybe you know use that for independent man on the street journal lestat really do that kind of grassroots reporting that that's that's moving the country away from a persona based following or is that just unrealistic because you know it's personas i guess attract viewers and sell not ratings in this case but i think that's the nature of. this industry. because when you're talking about you know he told me is both reports but it's also commentary so i think you know commentary from individuals because of the way they comment what they're willing to back or with how they present is relevant i mean you know i don't think that the this is implicated in the broader problems that we may have with our media which i

think are frankly broader societal issues and very briefly you know glenn beck purports to be preaching to mainstream america that's a major mainstream that coming from unemployment to housing right house and house prices etc etc i mean i've had these folks really going to shell out for ninety five a pop if not more to listen to their their man speak. they've been banging. their table and and and other expenses i would imagine that important to me you know or ninety five will be worth it for them to maintain i would suggest delusions that he sells them. for. good or be behaving in that type of greatness or ninety five i do seems like a deal all right so i guess who needs the food and clothing when i have one back will save yourself thank you so much that was sam seder host of the majority report . took a well that's it for this hour here on r.t. america the news doesn't end with this broadcast there's plenty more story.