this is the main international headlines this hour the worst single shooting spree in modern history at least eighty four people killed and youth camp in norway a bomb ripped through the heart of the government district of the capital. seven the prime minister's office was hit the leader was not in the building at the time of the last. thirty two year old norwegian man has been arrested and charged with committing both attacks help as a liberal jihad initially claimed responsibility for response to noise and bold

enough going to start but later retracted the statement. program spotlight is up next it's time out enough talk to an axis crow from the royal institute of international affairs to find out whether the revolutions in north africa could lead to greater security threats in the future. i am observing nature and discover its buzy in the. league communicate with the wild and learn the. test yourself and become free to. see what nature can give you on on the.

move through the. color yellow welcome to spotlight as they enter the shelves on r t i'm now going all vents name my guest in the studio as alex described what last year and the united states were discussing with the new start treaty they argued whether or not it was for sexy europe from potential doing in this but very soon a different threat than merged revolutions and warfare spread throughout north africa and the middle east toppling regimes and bringing instability to their way so what are the biggest threats to your feeling of global security could say here's an expert at international security as the royal institute of international affairs alex this crowd. last year russia and the united states strengthen ties by

signing the new stock nuclear disarmament treaty which warmed russia needs relations and made things clear a hold with the european you sound japan's program but things are still where they started because the alliance wants intercept the misdialed skinniest in europe and russia wants guarantees they won't threaten its security but two parties also disagree with the current middle eastern issues like the syrian. hello i says well thank you very much for coming to the show it's a pleasure to have been here first of all before we start talking about war and missiles and all those things talk about from the more lively things like the referendum which we should realize not this holiday season what is it for you would you would you conclude to be in an. international international interest and international scale because of you but the whole world fall while certainly i mean it's definitely a transatlantic affair because of course report murdoch's interest in the wall

street journal ties it to the north atlantic business community as well and attention is drawn toward britain naturally because these sort of scandals of corruption and police chiefs resigning aren't supposed to happen in the old western countries here these are safer things of other countries but it's happening right in london it's happening right in westminster as we speak. the project is killing themselves. it's you know it's it's an interesting affair and i think also. at the start it wasn't it wasn't very clear how much this would affect cameron but i think it might affect him greatly i think he he behaved in such a way which was which was fantastic in that he was very candid in the way he responded in a way he wasn't guilty of anything but the way which he was slow to. to punish calls and for what had happened i think is going to hurt him in the long run what

they call the people called new group of colleagues from different russian. sources continue next period in britain saying should be really change the law should they will change the law regulating the work of the press and the relationship between the press and the society and we should know the new reason i think it's a matter of raw implementation. because people when people are breaking the law changes a lot of media not right because people are the government they want to change the law well no i mean i think it's also looking at the way in which the law protects the people in this if you follow the super injunctions scandals as well in the u.k. and of course we had julian assange a year ago. i think the way in which the relationship between the media and technology and people is evolving in such a rapid pace but this is a scandal of all the i mean this is you could write this in a book could be fiction it could be a television show war films this is something i know because there was the von film

in which there was. the villain was loosely based on rupert murdoch i believe so i think the relationship is changing but i don't think we should create new laws or disband or that he simply because they're broken. because in the film does that mean we need a double though person to deal with they're going to be among the scenes. somewhere with like. ok well well. do you think that this me seriously hurry. it is a business or will it maybe give more publicity to speakers. well i mean certainly not the news of the world of course that one won't be selling anytime soon but i think something like the wall street journal is going to be brilliant and. in a way businessmen my group of murdoch are buoyant until they become the house of

cards comes falling down like it did with for example ken lay and enron but that's not a scandal of that kind of proportions i don't think trickling down it's more of a question of his legitimacy so from here on out he's probably going to be completely inhibited in terms of pursuing business. i would say it is harming the. i would press new green. journalism in general journalism. but i mean i don't think papers for example like the financial times will suffer. so hopefully not ok now let's switch to. to world peace in the middle east leaders will change in house change and start over there with an established were non fly zone over libya and now to do going to war offensive operation in the region but the war in libya in its current form is not was not sanctioned by the

united nations doesn't mean that what the nato is doing in libya is illegitimate you know i mean i would say that apart from the french dropping weapons. by and large needs who is fighting with its hands tied behind its back it's it's almost crippled in its execution of hostilities there or just underneath hostilities in accordance with the u.s. congress and in order to fight within that remit i believe that it's not fighting as effectively as it was could you so i do think that it's fighting within the u.n. security council along those lines apart from funding weapons. resolution ninety seventy three the united nations security council allowed nato to secure this no fly zone to start doubting from slaughtering his own people. don't

the attempts to assassinate who will condemn me and and there been a number of them and later seems to be obsessed with the idea doesn't mean they're the real real idea behind the campaign is regime change in the country well if you go back to from the nineteenth of march on words. there's a real there's a great word in english which is backsliding there was a real backsliding and skidding into what began as a holding un resolution one thousand seven hundred three and really trying to protect civilians in the slaughter of civilians. for example you heard b.h.o. benevolently livy and france really pushing this we've got to see the civilians much in a sort of recalling rwanda and what happened in kosovo in bosnia. and so that was the real the real tension pushed forward the moment and then you backslide into well how are you going to do that do you need to remove gadhafi from

power and in a sense you do so there was a real reticence to use the words regime change and change and then all of a sudden it starts sliding back into this well we don't seek regime change but after you must go. and so now the real question is how do you remove a man from power. do you put him in asylum that one of the things is putting him in asylum but within libya but i don't really necessarily know how that's going to work we will i don't think it will work president kathy is in the will do what would you say is get out if you do believe because he himself seems pretty confidently that he was he did look worried this couple of weeks but now he seems confident knows he's got staying power that. many has got staying power so long as the need to cannot fight a war effectively which it cannot do. because it's fighting within the bounds of

u.n. security council resolution it's not going to really be able to step up its efforts unless it goes back to the security council and another resolution is passed which one wonders the viability of that russia has refused to recognize the libyan rebels as the only legitimate authority in the country it's probably the media reports. eight and started its military operation in libya four months ago making west promise not to take sides last week washington changed its mind at an international conference in istanbul it to recognize libya's transitional national council as the country's government until an interim authority is in place the united states will recognize that t.n.c. as the legitimate governing authority for libya and we will deal with it on that basis in contrast the united states used to conduct the regime as no longer having with authority in libya more than thirty nations for would suit now with diplomatic

recognition the u.s. will officially be able to fund it in gaza based opposition it can use some of the said to be un use dollars of could darfur regime assets frozen and american banks russia has condemned them merican decision to all of those behind the recognition are fully siding with one political force in the libyan civil war on this again means that those who took this decision are pursuing a policy of isolation but in this case that solution of trouble is not only to go. russia maintains a concept called tripoli and gardley site to get to run the negotiation table meanwhile neither secretary general pulled in the alliances numbers certainly aircraft to do this straight some libyan targets so far who months of meaningful demand have not helped break the deadlock in this civil war.

well you mention condell feasibility to resist and then thirdly has been underestimated in later what was the reason for this and list of issues which you say troy well i think to begin with again you are facing as a swordsman with one hand tied behind your back because regime change wasn't mentioned to begin with if you look at the international community in the wider international community sometimes if you look at meijers engagement with other countries for example afghanistan. and iraq it's given me to a bad name it's means that the u.k. and the u.s. are coming to see regime change sensually and so because of that bad name to begin with france and britain and the us did not you explicitly did not use the words regime change and of course there are several air power theories one of whom is called eliot cohen for america and he said that the use of airpower exclusive

airpower to carry out a political solution is equivalent to modern courtship it offers immediate satisfaction without little guarantees or commitments and so in that sense it is a policy of what robert pape cause decapitation decapitation policy literally taking the head off of a regime does little to change anything political or ground as we've so clearly seen in afghanistan with the removal of the taliban as we've so clearly seen with the removal of saddam hussein so it's not a policy that works regime change. however i would say that therefore wasn't on the cards to begin with. in that very overt sense but of course it had to be because if you're thinking of stopping him killing his citizens you obviously have to stop him . from being in power in some sense says alex this crowd expert on his national security at their wall institute our international affairs spotlight will be back shortly after we take a break so stay with us. forty

two thousand americans die each year from car accidents only a thousand. seven hundred thousand people. and thirty two thousand will kill themselves cancer in all its forms kills five hundred sixty thousand of us here part disease is even more devastating it kills over eight hundred seventy thousand americans every year. will look cool it makes a big splash in the world of heights or business but transit v. in science you know i just your products just don't understand coke uses cups he followed russian leaders to each of bidders abroad and their feet break through

back. sunlight on sunday lunch technology update here on. we've got the future covered. welcome back to spotlight than just two more in the studio today is alex's crowd and their experience at international security at the royal institute of international affairs well we've been talking about they are free and there will be talk of a little trip ration and you compared it to two saws been fighting with the world and behind the tide is back but many experience say that even. even if we try to to to to evaluate the operations that have been carried out that

it was a true fiasco do you do you agree with that the will truly the will truly did a lousy really lousy job underground i think this is symptomatic of the west's attention deficit disorder we might say it looks it looks at a problem area it looks at an issue it is size it wants to solve it and then it deliberates too quickly and hard to solve it so was to the all too late and this is of course what a lot of people said about obama's decision to step troops in afghanistan that it took him far too long to deliberate over this decision so i would agree i would say that in libya either we should have gone in it all. we should've done something like this which of course is not the nature of coalition fighting i'm reminded of every poll in comments when he said next time i fight mord may be against the coalition. but is there

a military solution in libya in the region in general. do you believe in nutritional no i think this is the great the single greatest problem of modern conflict. anyway alistair no you are and this is the problem is. does need to have the military capacity to wage coalition warfare yes it does granted if you have partners such as germany on board you know the danes are actually quite on board so it doesn't have the capacity yes it does of course there's political infighting things called national card. and and problems with material however the real question is political will and does it have the political will to sustain operations on the ground and afghanistan in the last decade has proven no we don't have a plan of there there really is no consensus because germany you mention italy the exactly enthusiastic about all of this but me at least what do you think a compromise between britain and france is the main partners in the you know this

well i think in the architects of the franco british defense treaty a very glad to see that france and britain have agreed and continued to agree and really rally around in europe and knocking on other leaders towards an across the globe is not love visit. no i would marriage would love how you think that britain different in general i mean this specifically here is renewed passion in the movement of this specific issue and one hundred million i don't want specifically ok i'll. tell you strikes are not working so do you think that nato. really invasion the world will need to be going forward for a resolution of the security council for a full scale aggression no i don't see what you will have what you have had since the start are spread was equivalent of what kennedy sense special advisers on the

ground in vietnam and you have special forces on the ground and i think increasingly in modern conflict you will see special forces operating on the ground in a small sort of shadow capacity. i think you'll continue to see that but not a ground invasion proved reserves of russia said that moscow will not support a resolution against syria's bashar regime does it undermine common approach towards the problem. well this these visas didn't intend to do. russia would china. it is something within the security council of course it attracts from the world but i think it seems to me that if the moment any kind of potential military solution or any kind of resolution against syria wouldn't happen at the moment as as i understand it i'm i'm not an expert on the middle east as i understand it but is is is making efforts to negotiate with opposition

in and in so far as he continues to do that i think it will buy him time this is be the security council ok now there is a risk as experts say that the assistance given to the rebels to go to the so-called trans national transitional national committee will go to the al qaeda elements that are present within the ranks of this can really. do you think there are grounds for. such an expectation of god if you make a connection to al qaeda that's a quote it is quite a long connection to me i don't even think you need to make up for of a connection simply because do we really know who the benghazi rebels are and i think this is a big question did we really know the majority and were when the c.a.a. funded them back in during the war in afghanistan and in this this is the real question is not necessarily linked to al qaeda to. you i am al qaeda and islamic

magreb but even to any other group flooding flooding. a civil war essentially or an area prone to civil war with weapons is not necessarily an inviolable policy you have no idea where those weapons will end up or who those people will be eventually the question of what happens to countries like a likely be after the war results that we just leave. if we just stop fighting and that's it it will turn them into sort of an afghanistan local law or laws and. make a nice place for all those clowns and rend and groupings and then and and. through all the try to comply believe who's coming to power but if we want to to establish a sustainable peace in the country it's a long and costly for do you think that the europeans will be ready to to go for it

from time to crisis economic difficulties i don't think the west has the political will or the attention span to see that out i think the west is losing its attention span shorter and shorter gets focused under massive political consolidation look at what's going on within europe within the euro delaying the inevitable regard to greece and now it's you go to new debt ceilings in italy look at the congressional battles in washington as you can see there the attention span just snaps so i don't think. a lasting peace will be stabilized and imposed by the european union by need all or by the u.s. . and the other thing. if. people within the nato if they will decide to go for peace to work for a for for a treaty between khadafi and the rebels will they let nearly years like like south

africa for example or russia step in and try to to to to set up with agreements because this would this would discourage the previous policy which was the variables i would think eventually i would think that i believe that that makes sense i know that. president zuma i just got into sort of deep raul with cameron in south africa over this matter and i as i understand you sent your great chess experts to negotiate a libya so i mean i think that that is what makes sense in terms of bringing in other members of the international community in their experiences of resolving conflicts. what do you think. libya's word means for the future of nato and the the e.u. common defense project does it need rethinking isn't in the in the in rethinking process the moment a sign of things to come i think increasingly we will see coalitions of the willing

we saw in iraq. like we saw or like we're seeing in libya it i think what will happen within nato is you will see these coalitions of the willing group around certain issue areas so for example with cyber defense or with climate change or with nuclear defense and in terms of i think it's ringing the death toll the interventionism i think imposing values at the point of a gun hopefully is a policy which is being rid of the west as we speak in libya at the moment it's highly ineffective this week as we discussed. it seems that. russia's proposal to share the responsibility for europe's the cell defense according to the central principle is that a sign of the persisting distrust in europe towards the russian. i think that the problem within europe itself is that you've got so many different

gazes towards russia there's a german gaze and there's a british and there's a french gaze and there's an italian gaze and very very very seldomly do all of these cases look in the same direction and so i think this would just be symptomatic of european relations with moscow but as a i mean as i see it i think that the european union does far better in negotiating with russia as a collective entity than nato does but i think things initiatives like the native russian council are very valuable and even if they disintegrate at some point it's important if even if they're sort of suspended they don't disintegrate so i think it's important to keep them in place and you know the role of the united states it seems that for the first time in decades the u.s. is not pulling a leading role in the military operation doesn't it put the idea of so dependent european defense products into the region absolutely absolutely and i think this is

this is again indicative of a shift of of washington's gaze toward the east if you look to what secretary of defense bob gates one of his last sort of tours he talked about the pacific and the importance of the pacific and the way in which washington's attention will be much more focused on the pacific looking at newer global strategic partners in a way that france germany britain might not be the default strategic ally and i think that is that is indicative of things to come thank you thank you very much and just reminding that my guest in the studio rate was alex this crowd the next group of international security at the institute of international affairs and that's it for now from all of the pot right we'll be back with more and comments on the what's going on in the outside the ship when they likely take.

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