yes in london. he is chair of the muslim safety form and stephen gash he is spokesperson for stop islamization of europe all right gentlemen this is crosstalk that means you can jump in anytime you want but first let's see how the oslo attacks may influence political discourse in europe. ugly tragedy that struck norway on friday has become yet another grim reminder of the growing threat of far right extremism a problem long since recognized but unresolved in europe with the body count still in progress authorities and politicians in europe are left to re-evaluate the spread of domestic radicalism and possibly recast the profile of a modern day terrorist little sense of grief over such a high death toll as a result of the bombing of a federal building in los low and the shooting rampage at a labor party youth camp. strong feeling it chris. we have been in order to get. the norwegian

people to the admission of the need to ask hard questions particularly how one man was able to bend such destruction without being stopped will want to make sure that we like others any lessons there are to learn about how to be more secure against horrific rages like this indeed lessons need to be learned to identify terrorist threats such as the charge anders behring breivik long before they happen his fifteen hundred word manifesto posted hours before the carnage denounced the government's failure to protect norway from islamic influence nurtured in europe a growing climate of hatred that comprises a mix of anti immigrant sentiments racism and economic recession brave exposition mirrors a civilised political debate about multiculturalism across europe but. this is not the cultural approach syndic to simply leave. and a happy about each other this approach has failed or to feel the attacks have

unveiled questions that strike a chord with politicians across the entire political spectrum what does it mean to be european tolerant and open the answers to these questions until very different outcomes the most extreme of which was played out in oslo question but now hans public opinion and policy makers since the nine eleven attacks against the us the western world has focused its attention and resources on what it deems a security threat from the islamic world so will the attacks on our slow carried out meticulously by a right wing christian prompt the west to knowledge the new face of a modern day terrorist suspect. muscle channel for class stock are. ok as i'd like to start with you in london do you how do you look at this horrific attack in our slow this is extreme extension of the type of rhetoric that we hear from right wing political parties in europe this gentleman before he pulled off

this horrific. attack used the language that you can hear very often across europe about. about immigrants immigration about islam about the koran except for so here's a man that spoke in extreme terms and acted even more extreme yes absolutely and let me add my condolences and heartfelt sorrow for what did take place i mean this barbaric act of terrorism that took place is an extension of and to muslim islamophobia a trend that is sweeping europe and it is like you mentioned the extreme end of that wedge and unfortunately i think i do agree with a lot of what your reporter said earlier which is that a disproportionate amount of resources and time has been allocated in dealing with one strand of terrorism at the expense of others we have europol and others who have indicated for years way back from two thousand and six that the threat from

far right extremists and that of terrorism is something real and should be taken seriously ok stephen what do you think about this attack here because again this is norwegian man i mean he was part of a lot of these different groups that were pan-european that were very anti immigration anti muslim and here's and he step further he stepped way over the line in oslo what is the difference between the rhetoric that we hear across europe and the little bit of the an inch further where you get this kind of attack. well first of all i like to join my fellow guest in offering my condolences and commiserations to the families of the victims and also in no way itself it's a complete disgusting act that this man turf a traitor it will get to your question i actually think this man is a one off he's reported as being an anti islam and but it's notable that the target

that he chose was wasn't muslims it wasn't mosques or anything like that it was indeed the ruling party of norway the rhetoric that he espoused. a myriad some of the language that he used against islamist at the moment but he is diametrically opposed to stop islamization of europe's tactics and methods and strategies because we have always been a peaceful organization we've always had demonstrations conferences and i've written articles. and such events are always authorized and okayed by the police the north or it is here we are a peaceful organization and this man is in my view a one off i live in the north of england and recently we've had a guy does not make this point because. this is an exception that proves the rule really in the north of england not far from where i live we had a similar event of mass murder and nobody knows what the motivations worth of the

horrific attacks this man is reported to have been an anti is the most we have no record of him joining our group at all it was summarily thrown out of the facebook group which is the fleetest contact that he had with others. as he was found out that he had nazi links on the a nazi links he was thrown off because we're fundamentally anti totalitarian as a group we oppose not only is our mail here for communism a nazi is ok as i didn't want to jump in there you want to reply that i had as i yeah i mean. i think steven what he says is me he has his half right which is that met the tactics are different but the rhetoric is the same this man is in his own words he is an anti muslim you know he hates muslims and the reason he chose his government and these young people on a holiday island is because he sees them as the people who failed to protect

norwegian society from this influence of islam in his own eyes and his links to far right extremist organizations like the english defense league is well documented and we had last night the leader of the english defense league actually issued a threat on live on national television saying that you know in five years' time you can expect similar attacks in the in the u.k. so the link there is very very strong ideology ideology clee they come from the same place yes the tactic this individual decided to take was different however he's not alone he's already told the police that you know there's fifteen to eighty people out there who are ready to do what he's done he's declaring himself to be belong to the knights templars you know where we're going back into the history here he's bringing up. rhetoric of the crusades so this man is not acting alone his not deranged he's not a lunatic he knows exactly what he's doing and he did it in

a calm collected and very very well organized way how on earth can this be done the planning there was for years without being detected from the security services or anyone else simply there also is simply because that disproportionate amount of time has been placed on looking at one strand of terrorism at the expense of the other what do you think about that stephen because you know it's we could call this blonde on blonde terrorism here because we'll talk a little bit later about the disproportional focus on islam in europe when it comes to terrorism which actually if we did some research it's minuscule can compared to other terrorist acts committed by nationalist groups in europe but what about that i mean you know if you look at the media the first thing you hear was oh it's the islamic attack on europe and then they shifted it ok and then all the sudden it became a fundamentalist i mean even the rhetoric and how we talk about these things is so

completely different because of a skin color religion and war some people come from in the world. well first of all i'd like to say the react the immediate reaction shows that. ray vick was the exception that proves the rule the automatic assumption was that it was muslim terrorism because that is the norm for our present days. sorry that it was like the same story that i know and i know you're there i did i didn't interrupt you and i'm now well i have my story on here and i'm very unstable sure. but basically. i don't believe he has any links at all to any right wing groups and the language i agree with the fellow i guess the language actually has to change the left wing and right wing far right far left is meaningless now people are more sophisticated in that we go people from a broad spectrum of political persuasions on our demonstrations are not left wing the not right wing they perceive

a threat to their culture and identity and they come out and demonstrate against it . you know this knights templar thing i think it's complete boni i don't believe they exist is something that historically arm an english nationalist a fervent english nationalist and i i know the groups that are involved with english nationalism in this knights templar to me is a complete fabrication so i don't believe you got any links at all with any english nationalists. the thing i'm just going to say go ahead you want to jump in there before we go to the break go ahead here i mean what was the even fails to recognize and this of problematic is since nine eleven there has been a concerted and well organized orchestrated campaign from neo conservative islamophobia groups think tanks input training anything that happens in the world as you know it's the fall of islam it's the fall of muslims etc etc that's why you had when this horrific act took place that's why you had experts one after the

other coming in and saying things like all of this has. well the whole mocks of al qaeda this is an islamist that's ok so i'm going to jump in here we're going to go to a substantial and short break we'll continue our discussion on the oslo tragedy stay with r.c. . plane and if you. want to go. last time the close of team was in the cool gun region where men flock from all over the world to have a few centimeters to their self-confidence. this time r.t. goes to the on the region. for the cold war still gets people hyped up. or an ancient tribe likes to save its culture place where cranes are protected in

the first ten dollars on official nature reserve. to the original. russia close up on the r.t. . twenty years ago the largest country. began a journey. where did it take the. nation in free credit patience three times for charges free arrangement the free. free. free. download free broadcast quality video for your media projects for free media r.t. dot com. ok.

well. you're all about to remind you we're talking about extremism in europe. ok. ok as i want to go back to you on a comment that you made before we went to the break about the media and al qaeda it's quite interesting that in the fifteen hundred page manifesto that was left behind there was an enormous amount of admiration actually for al qaeda because of its tactics i mean that has got to be one of the greatest irony is that all this considering that media and many politicians including the united states and simply said this is al qaeda or al qaeda like operation this is this telling us that we're missing this is a huge security lapse and on the part of western governments because it's their own homegrown people that are committing most of these acts of terrorism. yeah i mean

before i answer that if i could finish the point i was trying to make earlier even today you would find mainstream media do not call what took place in norway a terrorism act they don't report it as a terrorist act that you know they call it everything but terrorists acts that's one thing second thing is like we heard our prime minister you know he doesn't use the word terrorism this man's admiration for terrorism is of plain if he using his own worst to admire another terrorist organization and here we are denying that this man is have his committed is anything but an act of terrorism and i think this rhetoric that the media has you know over over the last ten years been dr ated in moscow what we need to do is we need to work on facts you know if we are solely believe in one society many cultures here where we are one society but we allow for many cultures and people to have their individual freedoms human rights to do as

they please within the boundaries of the law but for us to sustain this and maintain this we have to operate honest and interact with integrity and unfortunately a lot of our commentators politicians and media do not meet those requirements. are they not standing it is a fact it is a fact in media that when we went from a terrorist attack to a lunatic a nutcase i mean christian fundamentalists i mean it shows they did but the act is no different than an act of terror that would be nine eleven oklahoma city seven seven in london i mean it's the same thing but it's a fundamental sin it's a nut case. well i agree entirely with that such. as the view that anders breivik is every bit as much an enemy of democracy as those who bombed the london buses and tubes and that's not only muslims it also includes irish fascists who bombed london i lived back in the eighty's so you know there is a strategy which is

a terrorist strategy and please the point being made because i totally agree this was a an act of terrorism the thing about other to go back to the point about. brave and. what was said regarding the fact that. the leader of the d.l. on the program. british television last night i was invited to speak on that program and i wish to make the point made the point that he was a one off he isn't. it doesn't resemble or is not representative of the group star are demonstrating or anti islamist if you like he's a one off so i don't think there's kind of any more of these kinds of actions. you know that i don't know they may be a story so you will i just need to know your senator did your does does that does that make one point i think what we won't see we will see the kind of actions that peter tatchell talk against the church of england synod where he invaded and i

think we're going to see maybe mosques surrounded invaded or muslim gatherings being disruptive that may happen so that's are still going on in our i don't i don't believe i don't believe you know again i don't see any can carry on and go ahead. i mean you were just going to you were just going to say there was a going to be an act of terrorism we have five mosques that has been sent. to wipe out a substance that the police are treating very very seriously we have mosques that are daily vandalize we have muslims that have been killed we have an elderly man who was killed at a bus stop simply because he was a muslim and with. the language of you muslim go back home look see i did say really very very seriously this we have i we have seen here is our scholar and you are going to see more and you saw firsthand some while and you are saying terrorist

the way out for you right wing is very very likely ok this is the reality we're man who is with god why did you. go ahead i did a freedom of information request the crown process prosecution service about that murder at the bus stop and asked why it wasn't treated as a racist attack as it was in the first place and the reason was because it wasn't right wing nationalist as you like to call them who perpetrated that murder it was a group of local youths looking to do with any right wing groups at all and the crown prosecution service actually obfuscated all the requests i made and in the end they said they were going going to give me no information because it. was it was concerned with the case notes and they weren't subjects people like people like the leader of the e.t.l. they admire i mean he wasn't a national television green with many of the messages out of the fifteen hundred words he only disagreed with one thing which was the terrorist act itself but he

agreed with everything else the rhetoric was there and then before he finished he categorically issued a threat saying in five years' time this is going to happen unless you wake up unless you wake up and there's the this is you know the thing is i would just say he says a person is alone when he was finished my point stephen lewis from going to school for this personal drug deal is all. the norwegian police there's another two cells ok he's put in his own manifesto and he's mentioned to the norwegian police already that he's worked with english defense league there are seven may and i was pleased to do that that's an important point stephen you can reply to that days go ahead are i said to serve on newspapers and television that i don't believe this sort of thing is going to happen again but underlying threat that you've got if we're not listened to you're going to see more terrorist attacks i just think i believe it's a load of rubbish we're not going to see this kind of thing happen in england we're not going to see it happening across europe this man was

a one off nobody would ever get to know what his motivations were but i will say this about that i'm pleased that his hearing is being held in secret because we've been trying for years to get the place of islam in western democracy discussed and all we've been called the fascists and the phobic race is ok it's all right this is the just let me go to the so and so this man for forfeited his rights by this atrocious act of mass murder i don't want to harry's views because he is a murderer he focused even steven he last has a new spine here we already know what his views are he left fifteen hundred pages behind as i'd like to go to you when the police when the police apprehended him they called him by his name they knew who he was. exactly how this is something i think is very interesting i mean they know the music he was around being nude his views were but he bought six tons of fertilizer now that's

a huge zero no less can you imagine someone with a muslim name buying six sun fertilizer there there will be a raid immediately and this is the point i was making earlier i want to know you only say discipline or. you when you do you know allocate your resources disproportionately you will make these big glaring mistakes ok then this no to a no firing interest and he bought the ball. but that's one point he said pointing is second point is very very naive force the of and i'm very very dangerous and you know we all hope there are no more terrorism acts but it's very very naive to think that this was a one off and it's not like it's a happened if you look at the right wing and see islam mic and sunni muslim rhetoric in europe it is far higher than the u.k. for sure we have countries in the u.k. countries in europe who are banning certain acts of islam so they've banned the

minaret they've banned the wearing of all of these things are happening it's there in the u.k. it's not that bad at the moment they go he says it's good to see it now when you impinge on people's human rights then what are you talking about a liberal democracy you talk about democracy a good model and even revive that let's do it replied of our go ahead stephen replied that's a very good point because you look at saudi arabia which is the center of islam that's where america is all of the religions are banned and yet the western governments germany has just so and still does that the loneliness in the sense only the first day i want to interrupt you i mean look at jenny you will not be interrupting you stephen. germany has just sold two hundred tanks to. saudi arabia and we've sold jet fighters there dubiously now you can bet your life not one of those tanks will find its way to afghanistan to fight the taliban nor will they will they find their way into iraq to fight al qaida and the taliban.

they are so clearly literally tearing her prefer search perverse forms of islam is not an agenda to lead us to be attacked is i mean was that of all do we have a woman's decision to wear a certain type of clothing what on earth. are in the rock concert and how did you realize it or even towards your salary you say like we're very lucky because i'd like to ask you let me give you the last word in the program and then the biggest where do you think the multiculturalism discussion is going to go now in europe after this horrific event. i think people with common sense will see that we need to be one society with many cultures and we need to be on the front four which is being positive building relationships understanding each other i think the rhetoric of what's the even represents and his organization represents is is the cause of the things that we have just like it is for any religion any ideology extremists you know we need to shun them we need to marginalize them and

unfortunately stephen represents those kind of views so the way forward is that we are working on our front for bill positive relationship and recognize that we are one society with many cultural case even you were pointed out before we end well mohammad was the original terrorists he was the one who coined the phrase which is in the koran which is taught in every mosque throughout the world muslims make war on the co far who dwell around you and the need say no more he was the original terrorist he was the original now say who cleanse the arabian peninsula of all jews all right gentlemen there was a very heated debate here many thanks to my guest today in london and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at r.t. so you next time and remember rascals. and you. still. want to.

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a great way to go to the grand imperial. told us to. sit down to go and. read this in the kernel was her job as a retreat. headlines on the tortoise american security firm blackwater goes on trial for over billing the government for killing civilians in iraq and despite claims of atrocities against innocent people the u.s. resorts to using more contractors on foreign missions. the region intelligence says of the far right suspect who would admit it to the deadly terrorist attacks acted alone europe's growing nationalistic blood is feeding fierce more violence elsewhere. britain recognizes libya's opposition as the country's legitimate leaders and steps up the diplomatic offensive against

colonel gadhafi. just after eight pm here in the russian capital you're watching r.t. thanks very much for joining us now via infamous private security firm once known as blackwater is back in court this time though it's not over alleged killings in iraq and afghanistan but over claims it build washington too much for its services well to former employees accuse it of claiming more than one hundred million dollars in bogus expenses the company which is now known as c provides more mercenaries for the u.s. in afghanistan than anyone else and has been implicated in a number of scandals its contractors were. are accused of gunning down a seventeen other armed civilians in baghdad in two thousand and seven for which no one has been punished or the company is due an even bigger role in afghanistan with

the u.s. about to double its private army to replace departing troops meanwhile the un wants tighter control over her scenario to protect human rights but authorities gay and i reports it's more convenient for the u.s. to use hired guns since their actual slip under the radar. this iraqi men son nine year old kid nani was shot dead by private american war contractors four years ago his brain felt something ground between my feet and on the same day dozens of other innocent iraqis were shot by trigger happy us professional killers like you were trying to everyone if you see no one at blackwater the firm for whom the hired guns work has been punished with a massacre two other private american security companies were contracted to carry out interrogations at the notorious abu ghraib prison in iraq a name synonymous now with horrific human rights violations including torture rape and murder.