we recently lived within your means same advice they gave us with no moaning and social realities the us can dish it out but they can't take it especially considering the recent brush with death of paul why should america learn from russia's dose of economic shock therapy. and what lies beneath the debt ceiling drama well ninety nine economic problems and unemployment is one of big one so where all the jobs. experts are saying the trail of evidence leads annoyed one voice and only one direction and that is beijing china it does because the security

firm who i'm covered the cyber attacks say that is very good so where does the mainstream media get off at pointing fingers. good evening it's wednesday august third i'm lauren lyster here in washington d.c. and you're watching our t.v. well the united states may have barely averted a default on its debts but it didn't tackle its overall debt problem nor did it show washington's ability. the two point one trillion dollar deal is spread out over ten years with many of those cuts still t.b.d. and it doesn't make much of a dent in the fourteen point five trillion dollar debt as it stands now it also doesn't tackle the money promised unfunded liabilities such as entitlements some put that bill it two hundred eleven trillion dollars but with the u.s.

being the pursuit of solutions for other countries such as russia in the past is it time for the us to get a taste of its own medicine we'll talk about that but first a look back it's in u.s. prescriptions. congress has now approved a compromise to reduce the deficit and avert a default that would have devastated. the u.s. just had to swallow this bitter pill that many student it will how the patients recovery but will instead prove to be a poisoned chalice our economy is not growing at all in fact unemployment remains very high foreclosures remain very high no recovery is taking place and are we on a suicide mission we may be gesturing you know the kind of deal with there at the same time make it impossible for the government to play any role to save the economy economy is going down rapidly. some point shortly after the collapse of the

soviet union russia became an american laborde tree for nearly economic theories but can americans take their own advice now to deal with their own economic crisis . live within your means the same advice they gave us without knowing our economic and social reality were we to be russian guy how did russia's central bank in the immediate post soviet period the year he took up the chop in one thousand nine hundred two so the worst for people inflation in russia's history the u.s.s.r. tkinter nans of the communist economy was in collapse but there was nothing to replace it with. so it works or this situation was disastrous for him to do it was a real hundred billion dollars in gold in foreign currency reserves was some fifty million which effectively means new. people so are full of them government remember how in america's advice so-called shock therapy was

a plant the more kids might have got the therapy but the people got the shock to shelves and must all that was a nice girl i was once politician sued from a mortgage to a communist economy is easy it's like trying to turn your poor room into the shoop which do the opposite is much harder it's like trying to revive the good fish it took more than russia a decade to revive the quarry and return to economic growth transforming the country after the disaster of the nine hundred ninety s. but would be you are not a patient guy or need go it could all be. well soon see you burn marks and they know what was. going to be a rock. for america if you don't argue about art we. go fast forward twenty years later the world is concerned about the united states is sovereign debt and russia which actually defaulted on its debt in one thousand nine hundred eight is now outperforming most of the world at something my next guest has

pointed out she's an economist with a.c.m. partners margaret bogan raef she joins us to tell us if and how the u.s. should be taking notes thanks so much for being with us now you make the case in a recent article i read of yours that the u.s. as it stood poised for default russia's economy is looking really good and really is the exciting growth story for the brics countries looking back of course russia was a country to have to go through a lot of pain in order to get to where it is today including shock therapy in the ninety's as we saw in that report so do you see any lessons in that for the united states. well i think russia obviously offers an interesting laugh and shock therapy but i don't think it's actually a likeable one. so let's take a look at russian ninety ninety eight invited in august ninth and i gave us the the second year i was confident so when the government decided to devalue the currency to default on because i think that it's got a week or rather it was as shocked as it is this bill that will be put there are

but needed in order to be reset and about looking at the united states now if we enact it any thought of policies it would cause so much harm and make the global economy a lot of people i don't know how do you or i'm betting are speeding cars that have a car out of it will rust off or be very interesting keep you have to remember that there just wasn't a build up demand on reserve waiting in the wings or a shock for her so that it could then you know pull it back to normal even if he doesn't have that your team's high global economy remember we are builders are a currency no matter right you may be still have you know like a bit of a side to the world obviously our skating our and you know the world really looks to our poor or you know economic you know other readership i don't want to be saying that russia did it would it impact the world baiting me and our straight

partner i don't think we will the world could ever recover so well grasshopper an interesting example i actually think about what is it and i know and have a friend there and there are many comparisons for the united states to japan that we stand and we talked about on the show but i do want to bring up just the issue of priorities because something that you see even in the shock therapy that russia and europe were priority is where you know the market maybe got the therapy but the people got the shock and they dealt with unemployment and poverty and very serious amounts of pain is there anything that the united states needs to be considering as as far. pain i mean can you get out of a crisis like the united states is because even though it's the reserve currency many people are very concerned about the u.s. debt save us can never pay its bills can you get out of that situation and get out of the economic doldrums that the u.s. is in even with jobs with out enduring pain.

and you know why right now there's a big debate going on in the united states regarding the economic should the government pump more money into the hobby i know paul. to be. cured the problem is the difference between politics and economics go well and he could be made pretty can the enter the government more money into the economy. will you work in the end increases job increases like he remains of that growth and only if you that pollute politically are people i haven't they anybody is going to. be able to right now it is or is it mr asian and congress still kind of taking a step back and looking at solutions yeah i think there is an issue. and if you think you know there is i don't know conservatives to argue that we're you know people are just trying to rile people up against you know the upper class because i think tax task you know what we have. it is

really is part of that all i really do i think this has become so charged that there is almost not a usable answer or particularly from the government and so yeah i do believe that there will be more pain i think that the answer my you know restating in reviewing our tax ok so then who should ensure that pain though do you go squeeze the richest top one percent of the country that controls a third of the wealth in the us to pay for programs like entitlements that are broke you know help the poor help the old that are guaranteed money or do you squeeze the larger portion the poor the poorest fifty percent who control just a few percent of the wealth in this country but who are living off of government welfare for their food for their health care for unemployment in record numbers especially when it comes to examples such as food stamps and stats show that fifty nine percent of people get some parm of. i meant as this and so could you please i

love the way you phrased that question your well inequality shows to us particularly in economics it shows where the money. that at the present you know underneath those how one percent recently is that sure i mean got yourself right now to live at least that is winning in congress right now your problem is only so much you can squeeze from there are people they are generating more income they are generating more well they are just being given holders reunited so you can cut off eating. up where we are is that be your only. union leading and bank. in. the lower classes because they can put the wealth inequality debate should be instructing people when it's not is there ready they ask i don't have it's worse in our citizenry that is not paying its fair share so you know there are good one soon a traditionally controlled it is being controlled that's why they are not paying

their fair share you can grandmothers all you want but at the end of the day they can only pay so much and then only heard again so much that they're happy and work before i answer so you think the so just ensure you think that the rich to be taxed more and contribute more to pay for some of those programs that are caring for the sick the poor and that sort of thing absolutely i being i think looking at you know the rates look to clay and i get very good all of these the please understand that the reason particularly conservatives really like to argue look i hear this is a meritocracy i work hard i got sure the united states is also created with the idea that you earn your keep and you paid and i think that the issue is going to be conservatives they look at it eighty miking i say be able to keep it now nobody thing that just because you were it doesn't mean you deserve the right to that he is happy. people underneath you crudely and you don't simply because. i

think that i think that basically. i just want to make a point along with what you're saying i want to bring up i think we have a picture of the ferrari that is selling out to for our in a lamborghini that were just released essentially they're already all sold out there about four hundred thousand dollars which a lot of those orders coming from the united states they're not even out there sold out for the first model year tons of money does this yes or no does this further make your case that there are people that can afford to pay more. yeah i think it does i think it shows you created this great system where people have a spine managers traders investment bankers and seizing wall street because i mean you can make a big story since about one might look i go round with people telling everybody how every day what. kind of story is being created is there in which. the rate is going to actually go by so you can bet it well you know i would pull up the ladder now that i'm on top now you know creep pretty high during this

generation they're not going to get that you need your take on back in return rates and you know i mean. at the same time though when you look at the broader global economy the countries that we're talking about that are great growth stories are the brics countries that are seeing this growth in their economy and they have a really different model they don't take care of their poor and their elderly at all in the same way that the u.s. and europe can so can the u.s. grow ever the way that it used to or the way the brics countries are while it has this model for government welfare assistance well i think it was interesting about the united states is no longer be expectable story. of the debt crisis really showed i mean it is happening for the last one and a year but honestly now globally i mean. there are going to be different and you are an economy that will work but meanwhile work rather i mean what are your stance on the issue we have and you thought were you happy that. it

is strong can it or you know the united states well i think every country you are operating they are bold i don't think the united states to go rushing to intervene . it's really different paper capital and the united states so do any lessons can be learned in the future absolutely that's what's so great about it but the issue is i don't think the united states should be using right now is an example where we're. how those are you know. i don't think so actually i question is why can't you or i keep money abroad and bring it back without being taxed at normal rates but corporations might be able to get a great question and i thinking of. it look at this your government policy makers need to understand policy correction only work on the margins the majority of the time and here is why and let's call it the rowsley and orderly and me

absolutely knows that your thinking is the a shift on the margins. and or you know like you say. so you look at. the corporations bringing more money back the united. or money i'm not going to buy their spelling increased demands last four years even numbers were one point three percent growth. so you can ask we're going to be going to happen you know we're going to work for hundred thousand dollar cars being our economy that creating jobs here is not this is another example of over politicized. right except that's what people thought on as a solution but i want to thank you so much for your analysis on all of this that was margaret bogan gray she's the economist at a.t.m. partners. now the debt ceiling drama is over as we've noted but the country's

problems are absolutely not the debate over jobs may have been overshadowed by the dead but the crisis appears here to stay more than nine percent of americans are out of work and that mated two million of them according to the bureau of labor statistics are ninety nine ers these are people who have been out of work for more than ninety nine weeks meaning that they can no longer get unemployment benefits now also the number of low income jobs in the what has risen over the past twenty years so more of the jobs are available forty percent of them are low income jobs like service sector jobs and even still given that for example on the national hiring day that mcdonald's while going to a million people showed up they those people that apply they have less of a chance of getting a job at mcdonalds than harvard applicants have of getting in so those are several big issues all statistics but they're very real and they've affected my next guest who hasn't been able to find a job since january of two thousand and nine my next guest is brian fit and he

might know a thing or two on the subject he joins us live from long beach california thanks so much for being with us and giving us your personal story. looking. people were. like you said january two thousand and nine and i've just been able to like little digs here and there little things. that he will know things so my question to you is just you know in that time two years and eight months is a long time how many jobs as you say you've applied to and what kind of jobs and how often. i've been applying for everything i've missed out lately i haven't really even been applying as much but in the beginning i was applying everywhere mcdonald's wallet or burger king anything i like i was going after anything i just want to make some money and i mean i know how to build and repair computers i'm really intelligent i can pick up on things politically learn things. i'm not good enough for mcdonald's apparently why do you think that is what it what it how do you not able to get a job as a burger flipper or you know i saw it as

a nice and you know sweeping floors what do you think is the problem. i think there's just too many applicants because i know that one time i was applying for some position or somebody posted on a craigslist and. i sent him an e-mail and it was just one position that they had open made maybe two i think it was one and they said that they got over like two hundred applicants for that position so so many people i employed that are applying now you see lawmakers and pundits and the president and the united states talking about the unemployment problem talking about jobs all the time especially now they're starting to talk about it again now that the whole debt ceiling debate is over that you're actually living it they get it. i don't think they really do because. they're out there in washington and they don't really. you know they're not like just like everyday people you know suffering and trying to

look for work and they don't know what it's like to apply for mcdonald's and not even get called back you know so what do you think they're missing what it what do you think they should be doing differently. i think they need to be focusing more on jobs and not letting them go to china because like even if there's a job even if the jobs that i'm looking or being shipped overseas. all the jobs that are being shipped overseas. the old people here are losing the work and that's just more competition for me because there is more people applying for old and being low paying jobs right and as i mentioned you know forty percent of the jobs now that are available are low paying jobs in this country as manufacturing jobs have gone overseas and been replaced by the service sector one for us one of the things that has been reported is that now a lot of job listings are saying that people who have been unemployed for a long time should just need not apply that they want someone that's been recently

laid off or is currently employed have you felt discriminated against because you've been unemployed long term do you think that that has made it more difficult for you to get a job you know it's tough to say exactly what the reasons are but i think that is a contributing factor. and then my other question you know we recently just heard our former vice president say that u.s. citizens should be inspired by the arab spring and take action here to get things addressed and to make political change i want to play a little bit of what he said we need to have an american spring out of an american carriers square nonviolent change where people from the grassroots get involved again do you think that's the answer to get involved politically so that your voices more heard and maybe some change could be enacted do you have any kind of faith in that kind of a response. you know what. i'm not sure because there are so many

lobbyists out there you know being paid by corporations and are just there to just make more money for themselves and screw the little people you know. so do you feel really there's nothing you can do well i mean we can try but i mean let's all of us get together all at once you know didn't do just one person here and there you know it's not really going to do much but maybe if we all got together maybe we could effect some change. all right well we certainly appreciate you sharing your story and we wish you the best of luck in finding a job that was brian frett who had as a ninety nine er in south. and still ahead here on our t.v. the mainstream media is ordering some chinese takeout today but we'll fill you in on why we smell eighty rat that story.

like. dr. richard. arnot. you know sometimes you see a story and it seems so you think you understand it and then you glimpse something else here's some other part of it and realized everything you thought you don't. charge because it.

the id for mcafee claims to have uncovered one of the largest ever cyber attacks they're calling it shady rat and the main target was reportedly the u.s. but more than seventy organizations were targeted over five years they range from governments to the olympic committee and the united nations now mcafee won't say who it thinks is responsible it's not guessing either and computer security experts

say no one can prove who's behind it but that hasn't stopped the mainstream media from point a finger in one country's direction it was that maybe you guessed it well the washington post says experts for miliard with the analysis biggest snooping probably originated in china and then there's this hackers infiltrated dozens of u.s. government and corporate networks including sensitive computers for the u.s. government and the you were experts are saying the trail of evidence leads in only one place but only one direction and that is beijing china now american people is not. i think and the material being targeted say this is very likely the work of china is bad china the bogeyman and this time in the shady rat scandal but joining me live from the u.k. in oxford is graham cluley he's senior technology called consultant at so post to tell us there's a problem with this thanks for being with us now i know you're

a cyber security expert and you're one of the few that hasn't joined most that we're hearing from in the media saying that china is to blame for this even though there's no evidence of it so why is that why are you the only one saying this. just all i want is a little bit of proof it seems so easy it's a point a finger at china and they must be the ones who have done this and proof simply is no no not so much china doesn't hacking into computers i'm sure they do and you know what so do the belgians so do the greeks so the french the americans the canadians everybody's at it and it's just too easy to point a finger just in one direction so why do you think everyone does that people in your industry and the media that's all to happy just to repeat that why does everybody just point straight to china well no one's going to question you if you blame china no one's going to say well where do you get that idea from if you're going to china because it's almost become the accepted the food country to blame

and maybe it was china which was responsible for this but it's actually really really hard to prove and furthermore it's really difficult to prove but it's state sponsored because there's no real difference in what an attack looks like it's some kid eating pizza in his back bedroom then if it's been done in beijing china with a chinese general looking over the shoulder of the hacker it doesn't look any different and i think we have to ask ourselves warner you know all these stories coming out all the time is there maybe a little bit of hype going on for different reasons if that's the case if you're in this industry this is where you work so you see kind of the conventional wisdom who stands to gain in china being the conventional wisdom for the bogeyman. well the obvious people are going to benefit of the people who are currently going to the government and saying we need a large chunk of money to protect our cyber defenses there's this great big red arrow out there which are trying to pack into our systems or maybe government

systems do need to be better protected and invested but it's really handy isn't it if you have a boogie man out there as well and if you keep on saying it's a government which is happening but let's be honest everyone is hacking each other you're using the internet to spy on each other because it's so cheap and so easy to do it's a lot easier than parachutes named james bond and trance to microfilm to launch a trojan horse attack i think interesting point that you made i want to get to that point about cybersecurity and how crash rate and play in the united states have ramped at significantly with our government but i want to touch on this actual report because you do that and you and what i was reading you didn't seem to think that this was necessarily the massive a large you know attack that this is being played out today on the media to me well you know when i read the report i kept thinking all this is going to be interesting because i'm really juicy in here were found about secret weapon plans were found out about patents which had been stolen but actually there was nothing new in what we heard was that companies get hacked well we know about that already and and and

there wasn't even any indication as to how many computers that these companies type or even whose computer inside the organization so if it's rose on reception who has a computer hacked mcafee would have picked that up and said look all this company they got infected they've been hacked that's very different than if the c.e.o. of a company got hacked so there was no indication of what information has been stolen there was no indication of how deep the actual infection was and i think that's why we really need more meat before there was anything there actually which is story the funny thing for me was today is the first day of a big security conference black hat. which is happening in space and guess what that's the day they rolled out their reports new to me during a lap and it's up and if you look at the last big security conference are saying pedigree mcafee had a big report on that day as well pointing the finger at china so then do you see

anything wrong or anything very insidious about the fact that the united states government could use something like this to justify ramping up its cyber security response but i think i always worry when i hear american politicians and generals talking about the possibility of a digital pearl harbor and when we talk about cyber terrorism and things like so i think they are conflating the danger in trying to scare people perhaps unnecessarily at the same time of course we do have very valuable data in our networks and it has to be properly protected and you know you do need to ensure the defense is that all i'm asking for let's have a bit of evidence that this is really the case actually see the evidence rather than just believing this nonsense we are with you we want to see that evidence and until then we are not going to point the fingers at anybody again and we appreciate you for doing the same and getting up and clarity on that with graham cluley senior technology consultant at the focus and that is going to do it for now for more on the stories we covered always at our web site r.t. dot com slash you.