this is live within your means same with voice they gave we don't remember if you know me and social realities is us can dish out the economic advice they can they take it especially considering the recent brush with the debt default what should america learn from russia's dose of shock therapy. and what lies beneath the debt ceiling drama well ninety nine economic problems and unemployment is one a big one so where are all the jobs experts are saying the trail of evidence leads in only one place and only one direction and that is preaching showing us. how

funny because the security firm who uncovered the cyber attacks didn't say that so where does the mainstream media get off pointing fingers. at evening it's wednesday august third eight pm here in washington d.c. i'm lauren lyster and you're watching our t.v. while the united states may have barely averted a default on its debts but it didn't tackle its overall debt crisis in a whole agreement nor did it show washington's ability to come together to tackle a crisis period but you point one trillion dollar deal it's spread out over ten years and many of those cuts are t.d.d. it doesn't make much of a dent in the fourteen point five trillion dollar debt as it stands and it doesn't tackle the money promised but which the u.s. doesn't have for unfunded liabilities that is in title minutes and something about

bill at two hundred eleven trillion dollars and with the u.s. being the purse kreiger of solutions for other countries such as russia in the past is it time for the us to get a taste of its own medicine we are more about that but first let's look back at what some of the past u.s. prescriptions have entailed. congress has now approved a compromise to reduce the deficit and avert a default that would have devastated the u.s. just had to swallow this bitter pill but many still doubt it will how the patient's recovery but will instead prove to be a poisoned chalice our economy is not growing at all in fact unemployment remains very high foreclosures remain very high no recovery is taking place and are we on a suicide mission we may be gesturing you know to kind of deal with there at the same time make it impossible for the government to play any role to save the economy an economy is going down rapidly. some point shortly after the collapse of

the soviet union russia became an american the border triple nearly economic theories but can americans take their own advice now to deal with their own economic crisis. live within your means the same advice they gave us with our economic and social reality in. the russian guy had it russia central bank in the immediate post soviet period the year he took up the job in one thousand nine hundred ninety two so the worst poor people inflation in russia's history the us the saarc internet and of the communist economy was in collapse but there was nothing to replace it with. so this situation was disastrous for good was over a hundred billion dollars in gold in foreign currency reserves listen fifty million which effectively means new. people so refuse so then governments remember holland

america's advice so-called shock therapy was a plant the markets might have got the therapy but the people got the shock to shelves and must pull their genes girls or as one politician sued for more kids to a communist economy is easier it's like trying to turn your query into the chute which do the opposite is much more it's like trying to revive a dead fish it took more than russia a decade to revive the quarrymen and return to economic growth transforming the country's fortunes after the disaster of the nine hundred ninety s. but will be your knowledge of patients in dire need it could all be. in they thought it was good enough. for america if you want to argue about art. well that's for a twenty years later the world is concerned about the united states and sovereign debt and russia which actually defaulted on its debt in one thousand nine hundred

eight is now outperforming most of the world at something my next guest has pointed out she's an economist with a c.m. partners margaret bogan reef she joins us to tell us if and how the u.s. should be taking notes thanks so much for being with us now you make the case in a recent article i read of yours that the u.s. as it stood poised for default russia's economy is looking really good and really is the exciting growth story for the brics countries looking back of course russia was a country that had to go through a lot of pain in order to get to where it is today including shock therapy in the ninety's as we saw in that report so do you see any lessons in that for the united states. well i think russia obviously offers an interesting market in shock therapy but i don't think it's actually you know but a lot of united states but let's take a look at russia ninety ninety eight in nyc in august thank god the rest of the week that in your our economy so when the government decided to devalue the currency to default on benefits that ducking or better it was as shocked as to

discover that obie could bear it but needed in order to reset and go look at the united states now if we in fact if i didn't want to use it would cause the worst and make the global economy the want to be able i don't know how easy or many are sitting could ever come out of it but will russia offered a very interesting speech you have to remember that there just wasn't a build up demand entrepreneurism waiting in the waiting waiting for shocks her so that if it does you know pull it back to normal the united states doesn't have that beauty supply the global economy remember we don't build the river runs deep no matter right that we still have you know like a bit of ice in the world obviously our trading partners and you know the world really book was for you know economic you know other leaders it we were to i don't want to be saying that russia did it would it in half the world don't ating me and

our slate are i don't think you'll. ever recover so well robert an interesting example i have to think about or wanted to see and is and i let him have it and there and there are many comparisons for the united states to japan that we stand and we talked about on the show but i do want to bring up just the issue of priorities because something that you see even in the shop therapy that russia and durable priority is where you know the market maybe got the therapy but the people about the shock and they they dealt with unemployment and poverty and very serious amounts as pain is there anything that the united states needs to be considering as as far. pain i mean can you get out of a crisis like the united states is in because even though it's the reserve currency many people are very concerned about the u.s. debt a the u.s. can never pay its bills can you get out of that situation and get out of the economic doldrums that the u.s. is in even with jobs without enduring pain.

i right now there's a big debate going on in the united states regarding head of the economic should the government pump more money into the economy i know a whole band of debating has an economic theory the problem is the difference between politics and economics so well that he could beat me up or they can the enter the government more money into the economy. john i think it's like thinking through be me or that. me if you get out of the politically on people i hate anybody going to articulately right now with this or is it ministration and congress will kind of taking a step back and looking at solutions yeah i think there is an issue of priorities and if you think you know there is i don't know conservatives to argue about classwork you know people are just trying to rile people up. because i think tap

tap code you know what we ask of our. it is really is part of the problem i really do i think is it has become so charged that there is a host not of evil. particularly from the government and no doubt i do believe that there will be more pain i think that the answer my. restating in reducing our taxes so then who should endure that pain do you go squeeze the richest top one percent of the country that controls a third of the wealth in the us to pay for programs like entitlements that are broke you know help the poor help the old that are guaranteed money or do you squeeze the larger portion the poor the poorest fifty percent who control just a few percent of the wealth in this country but who are living off of government welfare for their food for their health care for unemployment and record numbers especially when it comes examples such as food stamps and stats show that fifty nine percent of people get some form of. as i said so could you please i love the

way you raise that question your well inequality shows to us i think it will be in economics it shows where the money is and not only the percent you know underneath those how one percent to be sure i mean got yourself up right now live at least that way reading in congress right now is a problem because so much you can squeeze from those people they are generating we're generating more wealth they are casting builders reunited so you can cut out eating problem i don't know where we are just that you're only hanging off you're not stimulating and think like you're great about meaning you know the upper or lower classes but the wealth inequality debate should mean start thinking which is not is there a great basket i don't have we're seeing our citizenry that is not paying its fair share so you know there are one student traditionally controlled it's being

controlled that's why they're not paying their fair share what you can grandmothers all you want but at the end of the day that you know in the case of what i mean only hurricanes so much so they're happy and we're beating the lancer war so you think the so just in short you think that the rich should be taxed more and contribute more to pay for some of those programs that are parenting for the second the poor that sort of thing absolutely i think i think looking at you know the. clay and i get. these you know understand that the reason particularly conservatives really like to argue look i hear this is a meritocracy i worked hard i got sure you see things that you created with the idea that you earn your keep and you pay yours and i think that the issue is going to conserve if they were eating my ice if you will to keep it that nobody thing that just because you doesn't mean you deserve the rights that he's half. people

underneath you. and you go to sleep because you or i think that i think that basically. i just want to make a point along with what you're saying i want to bring up i think we have a picture of the ferrari that is selling out the ferrari in the lamborghini that were just released a century they're already all sold out there about four hundred thousand dollars which a lot of those orders coming from the united states that are not even out there sold out for the first model year tons of money does this yes or no does this further make your case that there are people that can afford to pay more. yeah i think it's i think it shows be created a straight system where people hedge fund managers traders investment bankers and seizing wall street because i'm trying to kid me a bit exorbitant and i would write a book i go probably equal however they want but i think if the ten story is the created it is the one which. welcomed him for a day thank god actually that guy so you better well you know i want to pull up the

ladder now that i'm on top now you know three pretty kind of this generation there are not that you get paid back and we're going right then you know last night at the same time though when you look at the broader global economy to countries that we're talking about that are great growth stories are the brics countries that are seen as growth american me and they have a really different model they don't take care of their poor and their elderly at all and the same way that the u.s. and europe can so can the u.s. grow ever the way that it used to or the way to perhaps countries are well it has this model for government welfare assistance well i think anything about the united states is no longer being factual story or get out of the race it's really show i mean it is happening for the last one and a year but honestly i need a goal that they're going to. get and you are behind me that will work and it will work i mean what are your stance on this issue we have i need to use the word

promise you have to say that. strong candidate or you know the united states well the country if you operate them both i don't think the united states should go rushing to him because he. wrote for millions of different carriers and the united states so do i do lessons can be heard in the future absolutely that's what's so great about economy but the issue is i don't think the united states should be using right now as an example or we're house argued so you know rahm was he i don't think i actually. and that was according to margaret bowden rita economist a.c.m. partners. now the debt ceiling drama is over as we noted but the country's problems are absolutely not the debate over jobs may have been overshadowed by the debt but the crisis appears here to stay more than nine percent of americans are out of work and at mated two million of them according to the bureau of labor statistics are

ninety nine er's these are people who have been out of work for more than ninety nine weeks meaning that they can no longer get unemployment benefits now also the number of low income jobs and what has risen over the past twenty years so more of the jobs that are available forty percent of them are low income jobs like service sector jobs and even still given that for example on the national hiring day that mcdonald's held when a million people showed up they those people that apply they have less of a chance of getting a job at mcdonald's than harvard applicants habit of getting in so those are several big issues all statistics but they're very real and they've affected my next guest who hasn't been able to find a job since january of two thousand and nine my next guest is brian fit and he might know a thing or two on the subject he joins us live from long beach california thanks so much for being with us and giving us your personal story. and looking.

they will work for. january two thousand and nine and i've just been able to like a little gigs here and there are little things good. things so my question to you is just you know in that time two years and eight months is a long time how many jobs as you say you've applied to and what kind of jobs and how often. i been applying for everything. lately i haven't really been applying as much but in the beginning i was applying everywhere mcdonald's walmart burger king anything i like i was going after anything i just want to make some money and i mean i know how to build and repair a computers i'm really intelligent i can pick up on things quickly learn things. i'm not good enough for mcdonald's apparently why do you think that is what it how do you not be able to get a job as a burger flipper or you know i saw something you said you know sweeping floors what do you think is the problem. i think there's just too many applicants because i know that at one time i was applying for some position that somebody posted on

a craigslist and. i sent him an e-mail and it was just one position that they had open maybe maybe two i think it was one and they said if they got over like two hundred applicants for that position so many people i employed that are applying now you see lawmakers and pundits and the president of the united states talking about the unemployment problem talking about jobs all the time especially now they're starting to talk about it again now that the whole debt ceiling debate is over that you're actually living it that they get it. i don't think they really do because. they're up there in washington and they don't really . you know they're not like just like everyday people you know suffering and trying to look for work and they don't know what it's like. to apply for mcdonald's and not even get called back you know so what do you think they're missing what it what do you think they should be doing differently. i think that they need to be

focusing more on jobs and not letting them go to china because like even if the job if the jobs that i'm looking for being shipped overseas. all the jobs that are being shipped overseas. the old people here are losing the work in that and that's just more competition for me as more people applying rolled in these low paying jobs right and as i mentioned you know forty percent of the jobs now they're available are low paying jobs in this country as manufacturing jobs have gone overseas and been replaced by the service sector one serious one of the things that have been reported is that now a lot of job listings are saying that people who have been unemployed for a long time should just need not apply that they want someone that's been recently laid off or is currently employed have you felt discriminated against because you've been unemployed long term do you think that that has made it more difficult for you to get a job you know it's tough to say exactly what the reasons are but i think that is

a contributing factor. and then my other question you know we recently just heard al gore former vice president say that u.s. citizens should be inspired by the arab spring and take action here to get things addressed and to make political change i want to play a little bit of what he said that we need to have an american spring a kind of an american tahrir square nonviolent change where people from the grassroots get involved again do you think that's the answer to get involved politically so that your voice is more heard and maybe some change could be enacted you had any kind of faith in that kind of a response. you know. i'm not sure because there are so many lobbyists out there you know being paid by corporations and are just there to just make more money for themselves and screw the little people you know. so do you feel

really there's nothing you can do well i mean we can try. to less all of us get together all at once you know. just one person here and there you know it's not really going to do much but maybe if we all got together maybe we could. change them. all right well we certainly appreciate you sharing your story and we wish you the best of luck in finding a job that was brian france who has as a ninety nine er in south now as you just heard al gore is calling for an american spring inspired by the events that we saw in the spring in the middle east and in north africa but just what is going on with the arab spring now so that egypt the move to democracy was applauded and supported by the united states at least outwardly and now former leader of egypt hosni mubarak is set to face trial in cairo for among other charges the sanction of kill the sanction killing of protesters now as for the country as for egypt just what has this freedom and his

push for democracy brought for its people and those protestors let's look. this quaint cairo is now one of the most famous in the world and many around the globe even those with little knowledge of arabic know its name means liberation well the revolution of january put this part of the globe on the map but apart from that what else did read the people of egypt. this man has been running his own business for thirty five years it used to bring him enough money to send his son just started to canada and take his large family blogging one seeing that with the economics of a station called find rest and political uncertainty for how months into price has been badly fractured now he can barely food to see his children he says the wind of change may have brought freedom to egypt and is drawn to survival strong in its way . out of our feeling like you know i love the revolution when it happened i

welcomed it but look at the time like a light at the end of the tunnel you see it's not getting better we have nothing to eat just don't tell me about democracy for hungry people it just doesn't matter. the point is poverty fuel the revolution your growth has dropped from five to just one percent some thirteen million people live below the breadline unemployment as he twelve percent. egypt's revolution was regarded as the most successful arab spring chapter and it took eighteen days to end one of the world's longest dictatorships former president mubarak will face justice even days charges of corruption and sanctioning killing which carries the death penalty five months on there is little satisfaction and dictator free egypt is far from the best place to live and the getting ready. and getting ready.

for the people now i'm talking about well much better than a day is today. but it. is there really. people are indeed tired even those who backs the chains this young man is from the revolution jews coalition he tries to remain optimistic and he says sounds a lot like south conviction that a number of the state we've been living out of the budget for many many years to many it says that it's great will you do so we do need to be more patient and this is difficult we have a lot of programs right but we do need to wait for a little longer. recent three need to mistreat sions in a few square shoes that this choice is has been pushed to the limit and it's this is patients in the past to save egypt from problems through. grief and. the eye keeper mcafee claims to have uncovered one of the largest ever cyber

attacks they're calling it shady rat and the main target was reportedly the u.s. but more than seventy organizations were targeted over five years they range from government to the olympic committee and the united nations now mcafee won't say who it think is responsible it's not guessing either and computer security experts say no one can prove who's behind it but that hasn't stopped the mainstream media from pointing a finger in one country's direction it was that maybe you guessed it what the washington post that experts are miliard with the analysis biggest snooping probably originated in china and then there's this. packer's infiltrated dozens of u.s. government and corporate networks including sensitive computers for the u.s. government and the u.n. experts are saying the trail of evidence leads in only one place and only one direction and that is beijing china now mcafee does not name china but computer

experts looking at the type of hacking done and the material being targeted say this is very likely the work of china as bad as china the bogeyman this time in the shady rat scandal but joining me live from the u.k. and oxford is graham cluley he's senior technology called consultant at the post to tell us of a problem with us thanks for being with us now i know you're a cyber security expert and you're one of the few that hasn't joined most that we're hearing from in the media saying that china is to blame for this even though there's no evidence of it so why is that why are you the only one thing this. was just all one is a little bit of proof it seems so easy to point a finger at china and say that you must be the ones who have done this and the proof simply isn't there now i'm not saying that china doesn't have computers i'm sure they do but you know what so do the belgians so do the greeks over the french the americans the canadians everybody's acted and it's just too easy to point

fingers just in one direction so why do you think everyone does that people in your industry and the media that's all too happy just to repeat that why does everybody just point straight to china well no one's going to question you if you blame china no one's going to say well which you got that idea from if you blame china because it's almost become the except the food country to blame and maybe it was china which was responsible for this but it's actually really really hard to prove and for the mool it's really difficult to prove that it's state sponsored because there's no real difference in what an attack looks like it's some kid eating pizza in his back bedroom then if it's being done in beijing china. with chinese general looking over the shoulder of the haka it doesn't look any different and i think we have to ask ourselves why you know all these stories coming out over time and if there might be a little bit of hype going on and reasons if that's the case here in this industry this is where you work so you see kind of the conventional wisdom who stands to

gain in china being a conventional wisdom for the bogeyman. well the obvious people who are going to benefit of the people are currently going to the government and saying we need a large chunk of money to protect our side of the fence and there's this great big red arrow out there which are trying to pack into our systems or maybe government systems do need to be better protected and invested in but it's really handy isn't it if you have a boogie man out there as well and if you keep on saying it's a government which is happening but let's be honest everyone is hacking each other you know using the internet to spy on each other because it's so cheap and so easy to do it's a lot easier than parachute i mean james bond in front still microfilm to launch a trojan horse attack a very interesting point that you made i want to get to that point about at that particular any and how crash raising cleaning ited states have found that up significantly with our government but i want to touch on this actual report because you do that i knew what i was reading you didn't seem to think that this was

necessarily the massive a larger you know attack that this is being played out today on the media today well you know when i read the report i kept thinking all this is going to be interested in something really juicy in here we find about secret weapon plans were found out about patents which are being stolen but actually there was nothing new in that what we heard was that companies get hacked well we know about that already turns and there wasn't even any indication as to how many computers at these companies start or even who's computer inside the organization so if it's rose on reception who has a computer hacked mcafee would have picked that up and said look this company they got infected they've been hacked that's very different than if the c.e.o. of a company got hacked so there was no indication of what information is being stolen there was no indication of how deep the actual infection was and i think that's why we really need more meat and so there was anything there actually which a story the funny thing for me was today is the first day of the big security

conference blackout. this is happening in las vegas and guess what that's the day they rolled out the reports move meijer up a lap and it's up and if you look at the last big security conference are saying february mcafee had a big report on that today as well pointing the finger at china so then do you see anything wrong or anything very insidious about the fact that the united states government could use something like that to justify ramping up its cyber security response but i think i always worry when i hear american politicians and generals talking about the possibility of a digital pearl harbor many talk about cyber terrorism and things of that so i think they are conflating the danger in trying to scare people perhaps unnecessarily at the same time of course we do have very tough people take from our networks and it has to be properly protected and you know you do need to ensure the defense is that all i'm asking for let's have a bit of evidence this is really the case now.