like the i.m.f. as a sort of global debt in force or other ones like the s. and p. you have this giant global bureaucracy essentially financial bureaucracy which is dedicated to the principle that no one can ever default. this is crazy i mean not only economically is it crazy but it's doing exactly the opposite of what people have historically done and if you look at the results it looks an awful lot like that terrible death trap that everybody was afraid of throughout human history so very correctly you're saying that for the first time in five thousand year history of debt in credit we're in an era now where institutional a creditor is protected versus the debtor exactly in fact they've made bankruptcy laws more difficult they need lending at interest easier you know the usury laws that we did have were essentially abolished in the beginning of the eighty's here in america and similar things happened over the world suddenly you move from a sort of welfare state model where people from that social benefits this idea

where. you can get credit credits supposed to save the world everyone has one k. the one whose mortgages the poor in the third world are going to be saved by micro credit. meanwhile the terms of the credit are skewed usually in favor of the creditors over the doubters now the result is that you know most americans i would like to make this point you know we're in a position which looks a lot like that social disaster that everybody was afraid of aristotle we're here today you would think the distinction between someone pulling into debt and selling their children into slavery and someone in debt renting themselves and their family into a slave of going to work for somebody else would be probably illegal estate distinction . on the other hand i think there is reason to hope because well i mean we're talking five hundred year cycles here forty years is nothing i mean maybe they got it wrong the first round but there's a lot of room to pick things up ok along the same area of subject of hope. i was

just looking on the web and stumbled upon a story about kiva dot org which is a peer to peer lending site and over three hundred fifty thousand individuals in the first world have loaned money to three hundred fifty thousand people in the third world micro loans. exactly what you're saying was going on five thousand years ago they've extended credit. terms that are reasonable and they have boosted the economy in a huge way so i mean that's a hopeful sign i suppose you could say if that model could be embraced on a slightly larger scale correct absolutely i mean there's a million solutions and the one thing the world doesn't lack is smart people if we put our minds to this it would be very easy to come up with alternative money systems alternative ways to arrange these things i have friends in asheville who set up alternative money systems. software that sort of anybody can use and they've

got thousands of people already hooked in who hardly use cash at all and there are many more they simply strange things directly to each other and there's a million ways to do it and the other thing is the political mobilization visit a real problem isn't that the lack of alternatives the real problem is the fact that anything is going to be cut off politically and that's why i think what's happening in europe is very hopeful and what we have in greece what we have in spain and it's beginning to spread to other countries and the way i like to think of it is i think in two thousand and eight they kind of let the cat out of the back you know for all these years in saying markets run themselves and people in charge they know what they're doing we may not be very nice people but they're incredibly competent in fact of the only people who run the economy and of course we're also told debts are sacred and have to be repaid but we learned with the crash was that none of those things were true people had no idea what they were doing they did get bailed out markets didn't win themselves so once we understand that money is actually a political arrangement it's a social set of promises that people make to one another well and you know if

trillions of dollars worth of debt can be made to disappear if that's convenient for the big players and the good people are saying is well. over right fine if those are the new terms that make sense but if the mocker see is going to me mean anything now it means everybody gets to weigh in on how promises are made and how they're in. and that's what people are calling for and demanding and i i think it's very promising for a new political movement i actually have one more question this is from twitter and if you want to ask questions on this show go to my twitter account at max kaiser and this is from people the question is are you arguing that money quote in a sense of exact equivalents and quote is based on code words and not voluntary exchange i think of that it originally emerged in that context and has been maintained remarkably much through dot com sharks if you look at you know where the first circumstance where people started commuting values of figuring out the

twenty seven of these equals three of those was mostly legal cases and situations of potential violence i think that coins have been promulgated through military systems and i think that. the current dollar system is closely tied i mean look at the international currency system the current the international currency is the currency of the largest military power that's that's not a coincidence all right david grammer we're going to have to stop there thanks so much for being on the kaiser report things are having me pleasure the book is called that the first five thousand years i recommend you pick it up that's going to do it for this edition of the kaiser report with me max kaiser and stacey armor and we thank my guest david graber if you want to send me an e-mail please do so at kaiser report at r t t v dot are you it's all next on this makeover saying by all.

soon which brightened if you knew me by the sun from france to pressure.

these stunts on t.v. dot com. stories on our t.v. russia city of jeddah slava list made its last respects to the victims of wednesday's plane crash that killed almost all of the top local ice hockey teams. thousands of people streaming into the stadium where the locomotive goes level played on sean thomas it jaroslav all as a city mourns and grieves the loss of their stars. a nation on guard a new security threats emerge on the eve of the tenth anniversary of nine eleven as some fear that the u.s. war on terror has created more enemies than it's destroyed. plus a television set of cargo strike at new sourdough of relations as an average bob at the age of capital storms the israeli embassy forcing its staff to leave the

country. just after six pm here in the russian capital this is our team expert joining us now the stadium where russia's lokomotiv ice hockey team play their last game has been transformed into a venue of mourning and tears more than one hundred thousand people have attended a ceremony a memory of the team and all others a perished on board the forty two in a crash on wednesday our correspondent sean thomas is witnessing the city's grief. the tone inside the stadium where the locomotive players played their games is very somber and quiet and respectful as thousands of people from all over russia and the city come to say their last goodbyes as this three day mourning period comes to an end and we've been hearing some of the personal stories of the players who is lives

were tragically cut short we know of one player who just before this flight had proposed to his girlfriend and was hoping to start a family we know of another player who has declared that this was his final season and he wanted to give up hockey so that he could spend more time with his family of course losing his wife on the way to his first game of his last season also a flight attendant twenty nine years old just got married three months ago and was planning to leave the aviation industry so that she could start a family of her own now as to the rebuilding of the team and the spirit of moving forward best a geisha is still going on right now as we speak but beyond that we have the opportunity to speak to players from former lovell locomotive teams who said that they will come back so what they can help rebuild this franchise and make it the championship team that it once was we also have the opportunity to talk to the next generation of players the people who hope to become professionals and this is what

they had to say about moving forward from this tragedy. as a city continues to more than one very dedicated group of young men have choosing to honor their heroes in a unique way by getting back on the ice with you because told us that we should go out onto the ice and play for all the guys follows a life similar to the story told us the winter games. for these players practice in fear is special as it was from this very or you know with the blue team on their skates for the final time. i met them on the fifth and sixth of september they're trying. sessions before minsk or they were confident and quite optimistic and determined all over britain very high spirits here. one coach working with this new strain was supposed to be on the flight and though he is back working now and stars are still strong for those affected by this tragic loss i think it sets hard hearted daughter caught all their life their families their relative sense or so i

just research this them are going to do. go on i'm a mom i come to this everybody as of the next generation of jaroslava locomotive hockey players it's not just about rebuilding the team for the future of the city it's also about getting back on the ice as a form of therapy to help them get through their grief yeah but also i have a strong wish to win bigger growing pot now when they use championship and it gave me to reach my friends where it was young and while this team practices an even younger group is ready to follow in their footsteps. some of the players who died were from our school they told us about them and cannot just one more year later played in the team i never got to talk mark to school i want to be in the new team that will be the success of not committees next week i'm scheduled to be tested for

the club the county is going to come rights to school. proving that even though they've gone from the ice the members of this ill fated locomotive team will continue to be in the hearts and minds of the people of jaroslav ill and the nation for generations to come sluggish on thomas. so how is the city robbed of it sports stars and families of their loved ones or you can had to argue dot com for the latest updates investigators continue to rule out theories behind the deadly catastrophe believe is being that the fuel was contaminated two or more about the possible causes of the crash you can add to our web site that's our team dot com. security is being stepped up across the u.s. following a terror threat on the eve of the temple anniversary of the september eleventh attacks american intelligence intercepted communications from an al qaeda operative in pakistan indicating plans for a vehicle bomb plot against new york city or washington but as are these a really important i reports a decade on that many u.s.

citizens still feel vulnerable in their own country. ten years ago america was rocked by unprecedented terror. clearly three thousand innocent lives were lost and a post nine eleven world was born. our war on terror. begins with our countdown. but it does not in there. it will not end until every terrorist group of global reach has been found stopped and defeated washington's military reach began with the hunt for osama bin laden america strikes back afghanistan as with bombs and missiles from the air and sea then a preemptive pounding into iraq. in the decade that followed america's fight for freedom has been stated by torture secret detention and rendition human rights

violations symbolized by landmarks like kuantan i'm obey grade and the block airbase prison we had garnered the empathy not only of the world but the muslim world and if we had the courage to be vulnerable. we would be far safer and more secure than we are today instead we drank deep from that very dark hole licks of nationalism journalist and author chris hedges says america's terror unleashed throughout the middle east has opened a pandora's box of evil students are over a million iraqi dead since the invasion. you know hundreds and hundreds of civilians killed in pakistan thousands killed in afghanistan not to mention millions of people displaced in the refugee camps i mean but the terror that we have unleashed. will not go on the way it is and it will strike us eventually however in

a post nine eleven america citizens have been forced to compromise there for. in the name of security that past decade has paved the way for new state practices such as warrantless wiretapping intrusive airport screening and greater authority for law enforcement but some call it a police state in the making and as this national security state grows and as it becomes easier for the government to. ignite us in all aspects of our lives i think that we are going for the we worried about is the issue here is larger than just the specific isolated workers it is easy to eat your that is all around us and much of it may be white here at home for people in our own country. since nine eleven a rising tide of islamophobia has passed through this formerly tolerant nation according to the f.b.i.

the four men intended to carry out their plan today dozens of muslim americans have been arrested and convicted in so-called f.b.i. for oil terror plots plots that were orchestrated and manufactured by government paid informants these cases have been created by the government and yet we're supposed to feel safer because criminals that would not have come up with a plot how did not going brought them on a platter by the u.s. government are now in jail and we have you know snowball at the highlands that's going on around the world only raise more hatred only raise more gut feelings only reinforced i mean there it is very violent you know narratives of american imperialism around the world and we i think we've created more enemies than friends you know if we targeted communities rather than making them partners not only has it not made us any safer i think that it has undermined you know the very fabric of american society the fabric of a post nine eleven america that the united states has conducted an operation that

killed osama bin laden the leader of al. card skill we do in the name of freedom. and i guess yeah that's right but it's clear that our military says. these are. around the world the man behind nine eleven may have been. the international scene and yet the workers are in a fortnight artsy we're. well let's talk more about the anniversary of nine eleven with linseed german for stop the war coalition is joining us live from london imus german of the seeds of course of horror that i'm told are nine eleven it's quarter response it was see the invasion of afghanistan and later iraq and it was a decision that would come to attract much condemnation but then again at the time it wasn't possible that they had enough reason enough intelligence that perhaps did not have any other option but to do what they did. well i don't think so many of us

at the time right back ten years ago did say that we thought that the response from george bush would make things much much worse it wouldn't make the world safer it wouldn't reduce terrorism it would increase terrorism and the it was also another alternative that you could treat bin ladin and his allies as criminals you could capture them and bring him to trial you did not need to wage war against one of the poorest countries in the world and we had an alternative for the people who now justify these wars are using the terrible scenes from nine eleven to try to get sympathy from all walls but we are in the much much more dangerous state now than we were ten years ago no one should be any doubt about it but then again there's been no terrorist attack in the u.s. inside eleven and of course some of the writing has been killed so perhaps the u.s. markets and fighting terror are are working. well they may be for the u.s. but these terror methods of spread to many many parts of the world we've had very

serious attack here in britain back in two thousand and five again the people who committed the time the suicide bombers made it absolutely clear that their motivation was opposition to the wars in iraq and afghanistan and of course al qaida has spread to live here to somalia to many many countries around the world so the idea that just because there hasn't been another nine eleven in new york or anywhere else in the united states this means greater global security is simply false ok some say the u.s. has created many enemies during its war on terror not just those that existed even before the attack but who or what are these enemies. what the problem is there was a problem with al qaida. that was aimed at bringing the americans into a war with it had. just perspective this is growing but in

addition to that there is when the situation now where muslims around the world and not just muslims many other people oppose u.s. and british policies over these wars impose their policies over palestine over a whole range of issues and these people are now being lumped in as extremists and terrorists in the same why when you took the enemy as the enemy for people like was from blair is getting wider and wider exactly you are saying that the muslims around the world are being lumped together basically one of the legacies of the word terror is this emergence of islamophobia especially in the west how do you think this trend could be reversed. well i think. there has to be fought politically if you look in europe there are now very very dangerous signs for example the planning of women wearing veils and wearing the burka many many attacks are no asks the prevention of the building of mosques in countries like switzerland all of these things have happened but that route we need to deal with the political reasons for islamophobia and the major reason why islamophobia has grown so much

has been because the west is waging war in afghanistan iraq and now most recently in libya and it needs to criminalize and demonize the people who is waging more against and therefore it has as tony blair said today if you look at why these people do they do it because their religion tells them to do this is absolute nonsense but this is a common theme of lies asian which is going on around ok i just want a question on afghanistan i mean are the taliban is still strong those always say that the future of a country should be left to its people but is the country really ready to police and protect itself. well it's clear that the whole process of afghanization which is the idea of having the afghan police the ask afghan army taking over from the occupying forces is a failure at the same time one of the reasons so this is a failure is because the taliban and the other forms of resistance have not diminished in the last ten years they've grown we were told in the vendor two

thousand and one of this war in afghanistan was wrong was finished the taliban was a spent force now the taliban is getting stronger and stronger the americans and other forces are already talking to the taliban and again in afghanistan that will have to be a political solution but how many people will have to die before that happens or it is very very quickly is overall a safer place than it was ten years ago. i think it's incontrovertibly a more dangerous place that we now have the spread of wars we have more and more to call for attacks on iran we have wars going on in many many countries the consequences of the war on terror has spread throughout south asia and for out the middle east and is a much more dangerous place in the responsibility flat lies with the governments who started this war in the first place all right thanks very much for your thoughts lizzie german of german stop of our coalition thank you. well we asked the

people of new york what kind of impact the tragedy had on their lives. is more like go to seoul things are predictable you don't know what what's going to happen next i don't know you kind of more aware of it or it's just more on the lookout people shouldn't change bird will think it will reach a motor people like accepting that people can be different in about ten minutes time watch what people on the streets of the big apple have to say about nine eleven ten years after the terrorist attack rocked the city. if you have something to share on the subject log on to our website to participate in our latest poll here that's argue dot com and today we're asking the question what there's not a lot in need of food now ten years on and so far the most popular response is a convenient pretext to invade iraq and afghanistan. conspiracy from rob americans of their freedoms comes a close second and as some of you say it means a tragedy the nation must learn to let go as an enemy attack the u.s.

will never allow to happen again we'll just go to our dot com and sure your opinion . seems to me at least some people. have a. look back at nine eleven. president obama has pleaded with voters to support his half trillion dollar package of spending cuts aimed at creating jobs and stimulating the sluggish economy with almost ten percent of americans currently out of work the latest rescue pride needs to be passed quickly by lawmakers but you're also led to a publisher of the trends journal says that the politicians are looking at the

wrong places when it comes to combating us of employment. if anybody watched that you could wonder how any self respecting adult could have any respect for these politicians jumping up and down and clapping like trained seals that every two bit lawing all this speech was is obama's campaign speech on one and you have the republicans that want to cut back in title mention anything going to the people who are scary measures and obama promising empty promises the federal reserve and some sixteen trillion dollars in stimulus package will loans etc and they couldn't create jobs well obama said he wants to create infrastructure jobs perfect but they creating them in the wrong place is they creating him in afghanistan fareed building iraq now they're going to be rebuilding libya oh it's

simple there's a way to solve this cutback on these massive wars and defense spending and repatriate the money number one and then listen to what else obama wants to do he wants more free trade pacts oh great export jobs overseas why don't you export americans over to china panama indonesia and vietnam to do them so we have to re trench we have to stop these trade agreements that are raping america all of its resources mental and natural. egypt is on high alert after a night of riots that cairo left at least three people dead and over a thousand injured a demonstration for reform in the country quickly turned violent as protesters that set their anger against the israeli embassy i'm off toward out of the high rise building and ransacked parts of the embassy which was virtually on staff appetite after hours without intervention of riot police used tear gas to disperse the

protesters. all responded by throwing powerful bombs israeli diplomats and their families have been flown home as television the attack the incident comes less than a month after israeli forces killed five egyptian policemen in a border clash presidential candidate abdullah gul says tell of it has only itself to blame for the embassy assault. those are a loser being that there can. be if you talk lately the sponsors of the egyptian government even respond positively to their demands even really modest reduction government also is really lenient with those who even as you saw the egyptian people it was really a futile so i rode back to the president and to the egyptian government to so there's a real network of good something for egypt and we have double standards. so use your own for example and the out of your knowledge and good embassy it would be here isn't because it was

a good it's. now the fact that they're going to go gibson's this is a very bad move. it's time to take a look at some other news dominating at the world headlines and let's start with the ghazi the cradle other countries revolution hundreds of people have walked out of the streets to protest the actions of the new libyan government meanwhile libyan rebels are pulling back from buying one here one of four remaining colonel gadhafi strongholds as nato airstrikes reportedly started in the area towns held by loyalists had been given until saturday to surrender to the new libyan leadership as rebels continue to search for the fugitive leader colonel gadhafi is audio messages claim he's still in libya despite reports of his family and some associates crossing the border into niger. at least one of the sixty three people have died in over one hundred more thought to be missing after a ship sank off mainland times in iraq but already say the ferry carrying more than five.