in europe the big lie that some true independent central bank is the hallmark of democracy independent some for bank nobody votes for him it's controlled by the only it means growth pure democracy let's have an oligarchy that's what an independent central bank means in the long as he will. run by right wing bankers who will say we want to bring in an anti labor economist like the lady in france and out of the i.m.f. . and we want to be anti-democratic anti-labor and you say that's the whole market democracy but how on earth are you ever going to have a civilized the scriptures democracy in the euro is a toxic mix very much so i mean essentially we're dealing with a neal version of plato's republic being played out in central banks i mean it's absolutely terrible there's no democracy you just follow up on a point that you made you know how to argue that there is a real structural dimension to this crisis that was financialization as starve the real economy of capital and entrepreneurial energies that would have gone into

innovation previously and as a consequence of that we're not seeing the deployment of as many innovative technologies as we perhaps would have in the past nor the development of the i think you're right to a certain extent it's a false crisis but on a deeper level there is some real division to it as well your job and you're going to be i mean i agree i mean to your general global problem about our financially dominant you know financial services about how bad the banking sector you know but i mean that that's true ever but i come back to what i said i think i'm a year at the year i was a currency you know it's kind of it's kind of cry so much of the way you know the sort of ha ha ha ha ha that goes down to the idea i think he's was working that he imposed you know it's a very deflationary policies on countries that could survive it i do think that's a separate issue what do you hate anglo merkel so much i don't hate her it's the fact that you've been beating her up although there are the programs she has bought the banking myth she says we have to give money to the banks and make them sell. if

they lose all the money in the bad debt make them good you've used the word financialization she doesn't she thinks that the economy needs bankers to run it in to make it work but the bankers product is and the reason we're in a crisis is that the debt crisis because the bankers have created irresponsibly nothing government to tell banks to be productive parasitic that's the free market rip us off hey that's the free market our job is to give the bankers enough money so that when they make bad loans they can do everything they get paid and we're willing to sacrifice the economy year after year we're willing to sell so merkel is an american politician she can deliver her constituency to her campaign contributors and if that's the kind of politics you have a new europe then the american dream everybody thinks of the right of the eurozone and referring to old europe the way they've just about europe's the wild one point which is the best you're scared of the losses of european banks which would suffer

if you know for example i mean it's obvious to anyone that greece should default on its deadbeat yes one hundred seventy percent of g.d.p. is a crummy contract he said said you know there's absolutely no way to begin to repay is that it actually if you talk if you talk to people in the balkans are mostly quite a hedge funds and about it they know they're not going to be paid on how to set up on a percent on the year i know that i've been lucky to get fifty cents on the year right and i'd settle for something bad but that's a scad of the losses so you have a subset of b.m.p. and the bank or the rest of it that allow it to happen if it were the most out of everyone if they allowed the peripheral countries to default and then if they didn't rescue dogs to bad to be good you could have a debate about afterwards if you did. this you were going to be have to. do it in way where everything is above board and everyone can see the figures be much better and we have the same issue with sweden a lot of course the swedish banks were terrified as was the swedish government life begins with default and i think you're absolutely right matthew we need to get right on we have to stop maintaining this fiction that these debts everything. bill

there not just to just take a huge haircut everybody will know when they came so i'll write just cancel the public would actually benefit from this if the banks would take a haircut just to get back to the point michael made i mean i think what he was describing was a kind of a functional outcome of the system when michael has used an analogy or metaphor before they're rather like a mat is a parasite that actually convinces it's supposed to act in ways that it wants and so we have this idiology that's present and that's how the system runs in a very parasitic fashion you have a colony of those who actually control intellectual production and politicians pick up on that and i think many of them think they actually are acting in the public interest so we're jeff and i disagree with the europeans is that we're free marketers we believe in what adam smith said adam smith said that no government has ever repay its debt and he was right and we believe that the pretense that governments can repay the debts the banks know very well that they can't repay their debts what they want is now foreclosure time is

a arrived oh you can't pay give us the parthenon give us your water supply give us your tourist land this is the big grey and that's finances now doing military with that kind of finance methods and give you the last word but kind of is that kind of finance destroying the real economy. well certainly seven years i mean the assistance that peripheral countries can be made that day is he's absolutely catastrophic for these and for these economies i mean i think you know people just need to look at the figures of what's happening in places like greece and that's just the most extreme example say things happen in portugal and spain you know we see recessions in the u.k. the united states but this is a nine hundred thirty style dustball recession that they have taken on these countries and it's it's completely crazy right it's really i don't know of all in a lot of very pessimistic no it always happens when we discuss the euro i want to thank my guests here on the global policy forum here in the us love it thank you very much and thanks to our viewers for watching us here arche see you next time and remember cross talk rules.

stronger relation is for mutual benefit russia and the u.k. agree not to allow their divided opinions on the litvinenko scandal and the resolution of the syrian crisis to stand in the way of their political and economic partnership. and to find out whether or not prime minister david cameron would have been a good k.g.b. agent joins me in eastern hour for details from the crime. generating power iran plugs its first nuclear plant into the national grid the facility at bushehr was built with the help russia. it's closer to the center of the eurozone debt crisis as it's crucial asperity package and as the final stages triggering a new wave of protests a tough spending cuts the top stories this hour. international

news and comment not from our headquarters here in central moscow this is r.t. on solve issues in russia u.k. relations should not stand in the way of healthy and profitable corporation that's what the leaders of the two states concluded after their meeting at the kremlin and he said now he has more on the outcome of the first official visit by british prime minister to russia for six years. president it's made of call the talks direct and constructive david cameron called them axel would the two leaders have pretty much agreed to disagree on their sticking points saying that they have to be able to move forward in other spheres especially business how lot of talk at least

in the news conference a lot of questions about the lives when you go case and how that will if it will really continue to in fact ties just to remind you alexander litvinenko was a former russian security officer who was poisoned with polonium and died in london i diplomatic spat broke out between the u.k. and russia after that british authorities want to tax to buy russian citizen on the table go boy but according to the russian constitution in fact article sixty one which president made it reminded david cameron once again today doesn't allow for the russian federation to extradite its citizens to another country to be tried both sides saying that they don't want let's make it to affect any further growth i david cameron went as far to say that the issue is not parks but we will continue to grow in other spheres let's see. it remains an issue between britain and russia and we haven't changed our position about that and the russians haven't changed their position but i don't think that means that we freeze the entire relationship

it's not talking an issue is just recognizing there is a disagreement that hasn't changed the two countries are changing their arrangements because of it but we should work on our relationship beyond it get through the years of course work together in many different formats including the g twenty the g eight the un security council in both sides spoke about that in terms of the most pressing international issues they spoke about libya and it turns out they spent most of their time speaking about the situation in syria david cameron mentioned that he believes that that sanctions should go even further and president medvedev. it it out that you or you would read it doesn't think what's happening in syria is right and something needs to be done but by no means can this turn in to another libya crisis russia believes the resolution in syria should be tough but at the same time balance to address to both teams in the syrian conflict president

assad and the opposition only then can such a resolution succeed it should be tough but not automatically sanctions syria is already under u.n. u.s. sanctions it doesn't need additional pressure so certainly no major breakthrough in british russian relations but a very positive atmosphere considering that a british official at that level hasn't been in moscow on a visit like this in so long positive atmosphere lots of laughs in fact one of the last questions asked up a news conference by the b.b.c. to david cameron asking him about rumors that he was possibly recruited or attempted to be recruited into the k.g.b. back in the ninety's cameron said he doesn't think he would be a very good k.g.b. agent present day to beg to differ. i'm pretty sure that david would be a good k.g.b. agent but in this case he would never have become the u.k.'s prime minister the official visit at this level ended on quite a light no lots of laughs there after that joke about the k.g.b.

and david cameron also back with prime minister vladimir putin and members of the civil society where the pope is there was on human rights. and professor of politics at the university of kent dr adrian pap's says the u.k. and russia are currently facing many similar economic difficulties which together they could overcome. britain and russia suffer from a lack of diversification just as britain depends too much on financial services the rest of the pen's too much on natural resources like oil and gas so birth economies need to diversify but it is not just a national issue for this is also a global issue we know that a huge imbalance is there's lots of hot money circulating that money needs to be channeled into productive activities in britain in russia and elsewhere and i think there is a mutual benefit from operating in areas like technology where britain can certainly help russia explore some of its natural resources we know that from energy and other areas but also you know russian investment in britain is also important to all sorts of areas like civil aviation even the car industry where the two

countries couldn't visit some form of technological exchange you need to build a high tech money factoring in an industrial base across europe and it seems to me that britain and russia have a lot to cooperate on precisely in this field. as russia and the u.k. moel their differences over approaches to the crisis in syria moscow is steaming ahead with its efforts to mediate peace there russian lawmakers are hosting a delegation from damascus after holding talks with the opposition last week president bashar al assad's advisor says the country would appreciate a fact finding mission by russian officials which moscow has promised to send any day now anti-government demonstrations in syria flared up in march with the regime responding with brutal crackdowns at least two thousand six hundred people are said to have been killed russia wants the u.n. to take action to push the warri side towards dialogue says a sad needs more time to implement democratic forms the u.s.

and its allies want a more aggressive approach that will target the region and already called for south to step. iran's bushehr nuclear power plant has officially begun operating and is now providing electricity to the country's national grid it's the first such facility in the entire middle east region artes and in english has been following the launch in bushehr. this is a truly historic day for iran as its first nuclear power plants and bush era is joining the national energy grid it's going to start operating at thirty five to forty percent of its capacity that is the blight thirty five to forty percent of energy and is going to reach the hundred percent potential within the next couple of months now this is something that has been in the making for a very long time this is a joint russia iran venture the russians out of story expert has been vigorously helping the rhenium side of in construction of this nuclear power plant socially since the one nine hundred ninety eight the opening of the plant has been attended by russia's energy minister spazz called and also by the head of some story experts

both of whom have underlines the importance of this venture for both countries now russia's energy minister has said that it's all a tissue of course conducted by russia and iran should be simplistic or nice with international standards to give to the rate income the parts when through difficulties and problems building plans and how do we can be proud to the results that are drawing the attention of the whole world i'm sure gratian in operating the station and developing other nuclear energy projects will be distinguished by the atmosphere we created while working together you have to remember that this is the first nuclear power plant in the middle east so we should never underestimate its importance it's absolutely integral to iran no russia is going to supply the fuel for the power plants and it's also going to discard all the fuel this is going to continue for the next three years so russian engineers and specialists will stay at the plant will stay in iran for the next couple of years but then afterwards they will slowly and over to the iranian side and then by two thousand and fifteen. the

plant will should become fully operated by iran on its own like we said this is a very important venture for both iran and russia and of the there is a lot of hope for this power plant which is which has just become operational in bushehr in iran. and shortly this hour for you here in r.t. israel in growing isolation we report on how some of the jewish state's neighbors have brimming with anti israeli sentiment in the wake of the arab spring. global market slump on monday over fears that italy's debt crisis is worsening as the country's fifty four billion euro austerity package goes before the lower house of parliament for final debate the government plans to make changes to the way its rural communities are run but some people are beginning to lose faith in their government's ability to make the right decisions that he's either going it went to one rebellious town that wants to break free from the rule of rome. welcome

to filipino a small town in the middle of italy it also claims to be an independent principality and to prove it it's even started printing its own money the man on a new note says town mayor lucas a lhari now self-proclaimed prince i guess everyone dreams of being a prince when they're a little boring and so did i now i get to live that dream filipinos going solo in protest over government plans to slash council funding he wants all towns to merge having the number of local authorities with a population of just six hundred village teano and it's may have put the chop. it's a terrible idea because it makes no economic sense we have everything here to be autonomous and besides our neighboring towns are at least thirty kilometers away so it's not practically possible it wouldn't even save that much money most regional administrations do nothing bushie get rid of them instead of italy's in deep debt

one hundred twenty percent of g.d.p. the second highest in europe but unions are furious with the cuts accusing the government of punishing those already at their poorest even some of silvio berlusconi's own allies now oppose them with amendments piling up but filipinos fed up the term and to be the next san marino a constitutional republic within italy that has no national debt a rare thing in europe the methinks the town can live off its natural resources of wood and water but currently profits go to private companies there are constitutional hurdles but since autonomy is not illegal it could just be a matter of time at the moment these notes aren't legal tender just souvenirs but the plan is for two theory to be worth one euro and for this to be the only currency they could be spent in the shops and restaurants here. is this is always

been slow in this sleepy town but shopkeepers hope the new money will bring new cash. i'm sure that once we start using the new currency the economic situation here will significantly improve it will have a positive effect on tourism of course attracting more people to the town. far from being a p.r. stunt filipino means business and berlusconi knows it he's visiting the town later this month to stave off the rebellion but he'll have a fight on his hands filipinos a source of rome's water supply and the mayor is threatening to cut it off if he doesn't get what he wants i've given it r.t. filipino italy as financial words echoed deeper inside the euro zone fears are growing that greece could be heading away from the euro unable to contain its debt crisis you have of a developed the editor in chief of belgium's leading business magazine the trends thinks that greece should jump ship. but the greek economy is in an

outright depression now g.d.p. is shrinking at the moment at seven to eight percent on an annual basis unemployment is officially at sixteen percent but in reality it's more close to twenty five percent what we hear from people from the i.m.f. informally is that the budget situation is out of control so there's no way that greek and greece can escape from this situation unless there's a somewhat orderly exit from the eurozone followed by a huge devaluation of the new greek currency i think we have passed the point now where we can argue that we can say for greece within the euro zone greece so we'll have to exit it can be organized in an orderly way but the risk is of course that there will be contagion in the direction of countries like for example portugal maybe ireland and of course i'm not even mentioning here that would be an enormous

problem countries like spain. and greece is planning to impose a new property tax to address its budget deficit thousands of people join together we can protest against cuts and increase taxes imposed to secure international rescue loans and a little later we talked to greek campaign calico glue who believes eurozone membership has harmed not built his country's financial well being. so with the help of the european union greek farmers have stopped producing can imagine a country like greece right now contra feed its people we don't produce enough meat we don't produce enough we give them boil we are imported and though we had skin from the european union that farmers were paid so that they wouldn't produce anything. we've destroyed one of. the main assets of our economy the investments

that were made in europe were only to sell germany you know what's the biggest investment that's made in greece for the past ten years super markets. and we ended up buying german products buying german cause maybe greece borrowed a lot of money in the past ten years from you know from germany especially why don't you check out how much money germany has made out of greece the past ten years you'll discover that it's more than what we borrowed. banker is warning israel it faces growing regional isolation is the turkish prime minister arrives on a visit to egypt one is expected to cement closer ties with current with both countries experiencing recently strained relations with television on friday night a raging mob in the egyptian capital stormed insects the israeli embassy forcing

its staff to flee event was sparked by gyptian officers were killed in a border clash with israeli forces last month meanwhile ankara expelled israeli diplomats last week of a televisa refusal to apologize for killing nine turks during last year's raid on a gaza pound aid flotilla the turkish pm says the attack was a case for war country tries to refrain from the action and to take it and get some. spectum from. jerusalem thanks very much indeed for joining us there live in tel aviv not the anti israeli sentiment in color was fueled by some of his refusal to apologize for the killing of those five egyptian offices but is that the only reason why we're now seeing this anger against israel. certainly i would say that if you look over the past two or three decades within egypt even though there was a peace treaty which provided stability and security to the region inside egypt the media was constantly pumped with very harsh anti israel incitement and despite the

fact that cairo was officially in a peace treaty with israel egypt and people were subjected to daily barrage is of anti israel rhetoric now if you're subject to that kind of rhetoric that's going to build up and it's going to create a very negative view of israel and these views and what we're seeing now is as the regime is losing its power losing its grip the military regime in egypt these forces are now coming forward in a spontaneous spontaneous way and you're seeing that in the incident that took place outside the embassy but you say that the egyptian authorities the military authorities seem to be losing control of the moment it's pretty volatile isn't it to have those elections as soon as possible and when those elections do happen do you see any change in the sentiment towards israel after that. well it's very difficult to predict what will happen but we know for a fact that one of the largest organizations in egypt is the muslim brotherhood

this is an organization organization that has been providing social assistance to egypt for population and injecting that assistance with their radical islamist ideology so they're hoping that by the time elections come around probably around october they'll be ready with the support base and electoral support base that should give them a respectable amount of representation in the egyptian parliament so we're going to have to wait and see here in israel what will happen. who's going to take power in egypt right now we are seeing a definite weakening of the military regime and we've seen some very negative consequences as a result of that already and of course israel shouldn't just be concerned with what's going on in colorado but of course at the moment it seems to be losing favor with turkey that is something of a big concern is it not for israel as we said at the start of this it seems that many kind of have to say that israel is in danger of being isolated how important is that friendship or losing that friendship with. turkey was a very important ally and i'm using the word was unfortunately it's quite clear that

it no longer is. turkey because of internal political processes and the ideology of its prime minister has decided to embark on a sort of neo ottoman project to project itself as the leader of a new leader of the muslim world and as part of that attempt it is confronting israel creating provocations so that it could turn around to the muslim world and say look we are the ones who should be leading this region and as a result we're seeing increasing harsh rhetoric from turkey's leadership and provocative moves and it's a dangerous game and i hope it doesn't get past the point of rhetoric but certainly we're seeing a dramatic shift in relations with turkey and it's a source of great concern there's no denying that whatsoever israel only has a peace treaty with two arab countries as we are saying it's being isolated even so it seems content of it really has to keep up good relations with its neighbors because clearly it doesn't have much influence on what's happening in the middle

east at the moment. let's correct it has very little influence on what's happening at the moment of course good relations are but one of the problems is first of all who are our neighbors if we've signed a peace treaty with a government or representation and then that government falls we have to wait and see first of all who's going to replace the government before we can figure out what our state of relations will be and this is in effect what's going on all around us israel is looking around and trying to figure out who will be standing on the other side of the border tomorrow next week and next month it's a very. unstable situation and that's the strategic surroundings that israel finds itself in at the moment and just briefly how important is the friendship with the u.s. clearly be seen the u.s. backing the so-called democratic change within the middle east but at the detriment of relations with israel so where does that put the u.s. and israeli relations. well the religion of what the u.s.

is crucial it's fundamental the u.s. is closest ally. and at the same time there are certainly voices in israel that have expressed objections to the way the obama administration has handled the arab spring of this whole period that we're witnessing you have people like. who was the former head of the mossad who said that obama was far too quick to back populist movements that had no clear agendas and to abandon leaders who were formally allies at the same time you have other all the more optimistic voices in the country who believe that ultimately at the end of this evil democratic regimes in the long run can can form after all of this mess that we're seeing in the region so it really is a case of waiting it out and seeing what happens and responding to events and trying to figure out again who will be on the other side of the border who will israel be facing when the dust settles.