hello again and welcome to spotlight the interview on r.t. i'll bring our friend to be my guest on the show is. more than four decades ago in czechoslovakia the so-called prague spring. it was a period of political liberalization which ended up with nassif invasion of the warsaw pact armies into the country besides being important in history the prague spring was also a breakthrough for one of the most renowned photographer the twentieth century he was a good elf photographed the invasion and the resistance and today he's here to share his experience. as a student who is considered one of the most equal actual photographers of modern

times started his career by turning his lands on the gypsies in slovakia and romania later for his strong landscape photography but he's best known work is on the song that invasion of czechoslovakia nine hundred sixty eight it was published in the british army times magazine under the pen name peepee make out regular popular an award winning photographer. how was the codell kind of welcome to the show a good reminder my should be with this. is that if that's how to pronounce i'm just going to check but there's a tell all the time in france they say. in english so you can call whatever. it's very hard for me being a russian to talk to the czech national about the events ninety sixtieth's even after all these years well what about you are you all right with russian. after

forty years of you know it's very hard for me. in fact. before going to moscow it's not my first time was going. before going to moscow but they have been here for eight years so before going to moscow i was the thing which i was most afraid not to get emotional. because still. it is very close to my heart. because because the first sure all the fish the word was that this invasion in prague in czechs lower i.q. was over but by the socialist countries by the countries of the of the warsaw pact but actually it was led by the soviet army and most of the soldiers were russians of course he was khalid has and i would like you to excuse me because in the past we all of time were saying russians russian so i would like to apologize to all the viewers if i say russian what they really mean soviet union soldiers was it was

a different country and yours was a different country and ours was a different country well as a matter of fact today well the face of europe has changed and there's no more socialist countries on the face of you could we say that actually your country czechoslovakia was and your people were the first to spark this change to start the process is a true. i can't talk about that you know i was never interested in the politics. and i was living in czechoslovakia and it was similar in their show. before sixty eight nothing was possible and suddenly in sixty eight everything's that will be possible i mean even even people who are not interesting politics certainly involve so i can talk about what was really happening it doesn't interest me much but there was so happy to

bring happen because suddenly i could say what they wanted to say it was the perestroika in russia years later thirty years later would go but yes i can tell you that i in one thousand eight hundred nineteen i couldn't go back to czechoslovakia but i was innovative to come to russia to photograph but history. so every day when i was in front the law. they're sending a lot of people are saying i was walking around moscow quite a few being arrested because i photograph something what they didn't supposed to photograph but exactly i would say it was probably something similar so so you did find things things in common even even being just a photographer. well actually more than forty years ago russian tanks and tanks of other socialist countries rolled into czechoslovakia to put an end to the country's reforms this is what sparked the need of the house to see that.

spring nineteen sixty eight was exceptional in the history of what was known as czechoslovakia the country was dominated by this period of liberalization was taking place the czechs on the slovaks were anticipating a milder more democratic version of the soviet regime the reformist alexander do puke i just come to power huge the communist party's group on the country granting citizens agree to freedom of expression the reforms however were not received well by this. of it you know and a series of negotiations followed but the you were ceasars leader their new direction if wasn't satisfied with the results eventually on the twenty first of all the troops from five warsaw pact countries and to czechoslovakia soviet tanks were deployed in the streets of the capital prague during the uprising seventy two

czech and slovak civilians were killed later on a group of moscow citizens held a protest on red square against the invasion demonstrators were arrested then lead upon ish to the soviet invasion put an end to this short period of liberalization in czechoslovakia which had to wait a further twenty years to be read of this soviet regime. yours if you graduated from university back in one thousand nine hundred sixty one and you got a diploma of an engineer yes the same year when you graduated you you actually. organized your first exhibit of your photographic works doesn't mean that then when you were a young graduate you already wanted to be a professional photographer or it was never like a hobby i still don't consider myself to be a professional killer. is you know i think i'm a much of what you make money. yes i'm living from the front of you know that that

makes you professional. i think it depends on how you look at ok so let's say a lift from the photography but i still consider myself i have the same life all these feet and i started to feel a photographer so so would you consider yourself making money by photography but but still a lot like a. selfie an amateur like for example agatha christie's poor ole miss marple they weren't professional detectives they were amateurs. you know what in fact what they want to say that. when i was engine and i study already engineering i started to make for us. to make for because something was interesting and it developed great love to the photography

which is luckily enough lastings there today so that's what i wanted to say that in fact i am still the same man who started photography fifty years ago you were there mature for governor for ok in the sixty's and when when these reforms when this period story car in czechoslovakia started what were you interested in photographing these events you said you were not political i was not i was not. really interested in the politics of course but i can tell you hold it happens i know a photograph as a photographer before any news. and i never photographed any newspaper. i never photo you have any story. but it happened something that one day i came back from a woman in every photo you have gypsy and next night my girlfriend called me and they said the russians are here. she called me three times because i thought i

didn't believe she was drunk that was at four o'clock in the morning you know and finally when she said open the window and listen i open even though i could hear the plane flying very i don't know five minutes so i realized something was happening. any hesitation these are thinking about politic result think i just pick my camera pick my films and i get on the streets. and i started to photograph and i thought that it was important. because i was czech it was my country. and it concerned me directly. and suddenly because what was happening you know there were photographs everywhere there were so many things happening it was so is it before talking it out. you turn

around and picture was there i have two pictures i'm not sure if these pictures are here there's one picture of the known picture which is a man against the tank opening and the second picture which is very good picture two young men it is the flame which is what every thirty seconds. after one after second. so it was incredible and i think you know for me for me the biggest the most interesting thing is that i was not the man who fought to get out of the news but suddenly this what i did become classic example of the report that it is considered. with a lot of people with cameras on the streets that there were not too many people is the commerce there. and of course the russian soldiers they have the order to prevent they quit the grounds. to destroy the cameras or take

a survey and the shooter after the photo they probably didn't shoot him but if you hear shooting behind you you don't bother much with a beach only run away. there are but. you know i think. like you my pick chess might be better than the some other ones and definitely more complete and my that different that the pictures of all these professional photographers came that you know. i think because i was it was my problem it was my country and i got out through it says photographer. spotlight will be back shortly after the break so stay with us or go.

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morning news today violence is once again flared up. these are the images the world has been seeing from the streets of canada. giant corporations are on the day. first. player. playing player. hello again and welcome to spotlight i'm al green of and here in the studio with me today i have photographer just so i could duncan. you said that your pictures the pictures that you

took during the progs printing in the back nine hundred sixty eight probably were better than pictures taken by professionals from from the agencies with a lot of people the courage to get into czechoslovakia for a from a professional agency yes but they probably they didn't have it like like me because i was the first on the spot. and in fact the first day it was the most interesting you know i had a certain picture in fact my picture was being published in. book and magazine as a little russian soldiers look on what was going on in the streets because i was standing just next to the soldiers was it you said that the russian soldiers even could shoot in the direction of people taking pictures so it could have been very

dangerous was that it would lessen. people being killed but i know that the russian soldiers they can i think. you know they could of course when when your tank is burning and you are there is the gun you can start to shoot it is clear and there are decisions and there are not children shooting but of course people are shot you you are talking about. burning soviet world does that mean that the resistance against invasion world was very strong and i mean the czechs and slovaks were very serious about fighting back . you know. they didn't have a chance that there they understood that they didn't have any chance or since you know i can talk to you on the about but out. there really i wouldn't and after of

course the product is not. is not my skull and i can call tell you and my pictures are showing i published this book in eleven countries and my book. is published also in the russian and it show what was happening in the center of the broken seven days. how did you manage to smuggle your pictures abroad because after going after the invasion the regime was were was a very strict soviet regime no war period troika know what liberals are so so it probably was hard for you to to to to get your pictures i look at her and you know . all these events in sixty eight. where there was really like it. that i wake up early there was the first fun with all these pictures. that nobody fake my feelings but i

really i didn't did this picture is that it is the aim to publish and. i developed my films only one month or two months later and then i started to make those little prince i was showing them my friends and i left some of them as my friend then came czechoslovakia came somebody one curator of the photography from washington smithsonian institute. and he saw them. he asked if he can take six with them so my friend called me as to give it to him in the big day. and then he was front of it who in that was president of the long for target of. and he saw these pictures he was very interested then in these beaches so he sent a message to. ask if the photographer has more of these pictures and if i would be willing to send them they got i said no no i don't. want to have them

i don't want to take those soul then finally they convinced me that magnum is the it was from michael. agency sirus organisation the station here that i don't need to be afraid so that somebody else came for some different these individuals don't know exactly i think he was the doctor for medical con congress and he took in they got this old circle smuggling anyway yeah but what was the reaction in prague your reaction or friends. or your photographs your pictures started to be published all around the world to all all the world publications know in a trout but i know what he saw that really in his mind know about it now in fact the only thing the whole way you. and all my pictures never use it worst on the free europe of voice of america somebody here the news i'm learning was checked for

. received the call and nailed their cup our prize for his picture. and by chance therefore first anniversary in august one year later i was in this group my theatre group which i photographed they play many chuckles and they came to play call and. what happened run sunday i get to aunt and everybody are still looking in the magazine so i look to the magazine was full of my photograph. but of course i couldn't tell them they were my photo so so so so so all the time when your pictures were published anonymous check for doug and only not only or look time. i my pictures of not publish was on mine for sixteen years mainly for the reason that i still have got family in czechoslovakia and of course they could have problems when when you decided to

immigrate to to leave chicks like you was for political reasons or did you get a good job offer for money. i didn't know anything about my example that i knew that they they got the negatives so as not not at all in my view it was not for political reasons the policy the main reason or us and probably you can understand it because you are younger than me but i was afraid. i was afraid they're going to learn who is this proud of her who would take all these pictures from praxis. and even a new i went to jail really and as that is good to jail. people read. for much simpler things. and the charge would have been smuggling pictures yes i think's no legal for drug of you

know a charge would be. saying something bad about your course like your own country yes well in fact i was very happy that for sixteen years i didn't say in the speech or by my name and the arguments that had become i became known by some different sort of each of which are mainly gypsy pictures and not by these pictures was that a difficult decision for you and was a difficult actually to get out from czechoslovakia so it was a very difficult but the difference what you said how did you manage what you said the regime didn't change as quickly as they wanted you know one day a russian came and but all these people in the ministry. in the gypsy group which you needed to get their recommendation they stay there. so the story is a little longer but maybe we don't have a time to tell it. but you left your family back in church to like each other for

the first couple of years later they joined us no no no. my thought my my parents. and i was not able to see to them. no when you come to prague these days do you see it from a different angle of what i mean the city the people the country i after after so many years you spent abroad you know. exile it gives you. exile is. can be bad for some people i have written the book which is called exile. which is not about people who are in the exam but people it'll outside of the society and just of militia. who is the nobel prize writer polish. to and he said exile and kill

but if doesn't kill you make you stronger and exile gives you one possibility to start your life from the scratch you live in the moscow you come a relay here they know who you are influence you can change from one day to other they you suddenly you are you get in some and nobody knows anything you have your whole suburban go on and you have to start your life you ask about the proud going the route the others other present which gives you it gives you possibility if you are lucky enough i was lucky enough that after twenty years could go back that you get back. and you are able to look on everything what you knew different and different mine

and i get to practice every day i took three four five streets alone i walk alone and i was looking like for the first on the contrary which a new perfect. do you know of a home in front. of an apartment in prague i had i have two apartments you know when the one in the old factory in the communist. parents we have still have study on when i got in and then. i can say that there is no voting place both are beautiful and very different and then space that i look on this beautiful church. very different like and i can tell you i have these two plans but if i come there if i open the doors in the proc i think it's fantastic but if a leaf i'm not sorry to leave it all on the white house anyway when you come you

know it's a visitor you coming home when you come to prague is a true yes i would correct you. what is the home. for me the whole. river you live you have i thank you thank you very much for being with us and i hope muska will be your home for the next couple of days later mike thanks just a reminder that my guest today was your codell capital photographs of the soviet invasion into czechoslovakia back in ninety six to you and that's it for now from all of us here if you want to have your sales call tonight where some of them are too i mean interview next time just drop me a line at al green of party t.v. dot are you let's keep the spotlight interactive will be back with more comment on it what's going on in and around first question until then stay on r.t. can take thank you very much for that.

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