canada. china for asians are today. occupy wall street protesters aren't backing down instead a movement going nationwide with thousands of americans on their side this just like brutal brick beat down by of protesters by police in many of these cities so as the movement rapidly spreads what makes some cities stand out from the rest. and the rage against wall street doesn't seem to be going away anytime soon archie's been on the ground with the crowds and today we bumped into rage against the machine guitarist tom morello performing for the protesters also stopped doing interview and let us know what he thinks about this growing movement. and it's

a case of sibling rivalry the tea party and occupy wall street movements born out of the same ideas if for some reason they just can't get along well explore some of the similarities and differences of each of the two with tea party co-founder karl denninger. the government will be one percent for the one percent by the one percent of the picture reach and so wait a minute that's not how it was posed to go and the ninety nine percent aren't going to take this corporate power any more so as political ties to big business fuels public anger the question many are asking now is where is the government of the people by the people and for the few people. it's thursday october thirteenth seven pm in washington d.c. i'm christine for you're watching r.t. well a major day today in the movement to occupy wall street movement continues to spread

around the country and grow miners take a look at us. let's show you a map of the cities where all key patients are taking place as we speak and it could grow even larger this weekend on saturday they're expected to grow in what's being called the global day of action or protests are scheduled to take place all around the world the call is for people of the world to meet on the streets to initiate global change here in this country of course we've seen the movement move coast to coast and in different fashions just a few days ago this is what it looks like at the bank of america in downtown los angeles. a large group occupied surrounded the bank of america downtown even brought a large check in that they wanted to cash i believe the amount was six hundred thirty seven billion dollars doesn't take into kylie they did get escorted as you

see there out of the building less and less is a really interesting place you see the police standing by there the city council also supports the occupiers even the mayor just a few days ago sent down ponchos to protesters when it was raining. this is very different than places like new york where the mayor mayor bloomberg has said it time and time again that he's concerned what could come out of this he says it could even be riots or in boston where we saw just a few nights ago brutal crackdowns by police so i want to take a look at the movement through the eyes of needle lopez she is a protester at occupy l.a. she's in our studio there in los angeles right now either nina give me your take what are you been seeing over the last few days in terms of this movement on the west coast. a lot of. a lot of really beautiful community everything that's been built thus far is kind of incredible and it's a little bit different i suppose in the movements that are going on in other places

because we don't have the police matelote to deal with so it's nice not aspect also a lot of a lot of people standing up for what they believe in tell me this you know a lot of people look at this movement and they say you know i get it the people in new york are angry at wall street people in washington are angry at you know the cozy relationship between large corporations and the government what is it that people were you are are sort of rallying around in los angeles i think around here it has a lot to do with being upset with people not having jobs it's really difficult it's hard times out here i mean people with degrees can't find places to work let alone people that you know don't have a full college education that is has a lot to do with it along with the illegal for closure of homes. bank loans and stuff people just kind of are tired of it not been able to afford health care is another major issue right now california certainly an interesting place there are

so many good schools there and i see what you're saying a lot of people are graduating a lot of people still in school angry at how much they're to wish in their fees gets raised every year and of course california also sort of the center or one of the biggest problem states when it comes to foreclosures i'm wondering what you see as coming up next in this movement in terms of the days ahead. right now we're still we're getting together and planning out the i suppose a different protest going to from march is that we have saturday we have a major was. in solidarity with the different occupations going on around the world people fighting for their rights ok over fifteen so that they were going to have a major march and pershing square to city hall and. i feel like like yesterday we did have a city council meeting so i think it's going to continue on china hold banks accountable for what's been happening in china see i suppose what other allies we

have and what steps to take next certainly an important message when people look at this and they see that this is not just happening in new york that it's happening coast to coast we do appreciate your time nina lopez occupy l.a. protesters in our l.a. studios thank you and we're keeping our eyes on occupy wall street in new york of course as well now earlier today tom morello the guitarist from rage against the machine performs at occupy wall street in new york he was in l.a. just a short time ago too and argue producer lucy catherine i'll so spoke to him asking him among other things to grade it president obama's performance thus far. my support for obama was three conditional begin with i never had hopes that would be beyond the sort of centrist democratic president that he really is now. many people some of us. because he looks like a different president he talks like a president he would be a different kind of president clearly has a plan but i'm not waiting around for going to change people like i was waiting

around for him to change this is a movement from the bottom up it's movement has to be reckoned with and many people see the problem is the reserve and what do you think. that that's i think that's. frankly small potatoes would be to the overall problem the fact that the. country and the planet is owned and run by people who don't deserve to be doing made a profit they do in the name of privilege. they do it at the expense of human rights and the expense of environmental rights what you're seeing in the currently one thousand three hundred cities towns and hamlets across the world are being occupied is people across the spectrum do not feel represented by their corporate masters enough they're represented by their government sponsored and i feel represented by the tea party the democratic party the republican party having their voices be heard that it's about time. i found out about how to. have potentially might have a crime and might have what the crimes are and the crimes are the fact that people

can no longer afford to keep their homes that's a crime while the bankers who torpedoed the wall street mel thesis that originally torpedoed the economy goes on account of those are huge economic crimes which caused death and destruction to the to the poor working class families united states all these people just like i lost a billion by said that they're going to take him off see peace peace up those are the kind of crowds but you can't if you're the president's if you're the president i'd say you can't prosecute those crimes because you depend on the speaker. to get in office to stay in office because of the quote interest you serve i work for a united states senator for two years senator alan cranston from california. and while he was a very progressive person more president obama i got to see witness firsthand every day he was on the phone asking rich guys for money none of that money comes for free we're not but the strength of occupy wall street occupy america is that we're not we're not begging and pleading for help we're not baby and pleading for some savior to wave a magic wand if we cast a ballot not avoid every four years is

a bonus of finding itself and figuring out what it's going to do to change the world inspired by the arab spring inspired by the greece and spain and yet the u.k. inspired by the feeling that all you need to do to change the world is get out your door in the morning stand up in your place in time people are angry and they're dissatisfied and they're not serviced by the mainstream political parties and are not service five you know the hate mongering of the right wing populist movements and this is a place where in your hometown tomorrow your high school you can start occupy libertyville illinois it's a place where people can gather to express their grievances and express their solidarity with one of like we feel like right now we're to do something about it not sure exactly what that's going to be we've got a place to go to stand together i mean it doesn't make a revolution for me to report on something i pepper sprayed in the media didn't report on it nationally until several people got arrested you know it was happening the media was reporting on it and now you know the guy from a chance machine is performing so let me just point out to it's happening whether or not they think sarah her name i'm right here is that her right influence with

him and he has an eye for free. press yes. if you ask him. that my dad or a couple like that's the i don't even know i don't know that it's necessary to overcome the media's skewed portrayal i mean all the candidates seem to be more have been i follow i follow it seems to be a more. accurate a well rounded representation now that was three weeks ago and you can't stop me at last we can find a rationale for getting this one hundred sixty happen around how. he about like we think it's random. letters of the. word should people be. they should be surprised if it occurs but it also should people don't. appreciate that you were considerate actually hiring these officers and like.

i was actually. hiring blackwater but. it's real as he said first ignore you then they laugh at you but with. that was rage against the machine guitarist tom morello. now with us several crews on the ground and you just saw tom morello speaking to our producer lucy catherine up now from what i understand from those in the thick of things on the agenda for today a full camp cleanup session protesters have been asking for donations of brooms and cleaning supplies they've been hoping to cleans aquatic park where so many have been camped out for about four weeks now since new york mayor michael bloomberg announcement those campers would have to leave tomorrow morning at seven am so the park could be cleaned well there are concerns if they do leave they won't be allowed back in and i say they plan to position themselves with brooms and mops and human chain around the park to nonviolently stand their ground so what's in store

for the rest of the nights and one of these protesters have planned for tomorrow i want to go to producer who's a calf now who is in our new york studio for the answer. either lucy you have been busy young lady i tell me this are people actually cleaning up today. not only have a painting out today they've been cleaning up throughout the occupation and we have to keep in mind that the way that this is organized they have sanitation committees they have people specifically dedicated to taking out the garbage making sure there's not a lot of food in and disgusting things on the floor they are very well organized in that regard now today they saw a ramp up of the cleanup we've seen people literally standing on crawling on hands and knees scrubbing the ground to try to prepare for the potential showdown tomorrow and there's no indication really that any sort of cleanup effort is going to prevent the potential showdown because it really according to most protesters isn't going to be about sanitation it seems to be about getting the protesters out

now amir bloomberg did say to the folks that stay there indefinitely so you can exactly go back and turn on that that promise that statement and so a lot of people here so expect that this is going to be some sort of a backhanded way to force them out to come out of the park now they're not the officials according to the the statement released by the n.y.p.d. and the brookfield management companies that they're not asking everyone to leave immediately what they're doing is they're cleaning the park in three different sections so we're certain sections clean it up and let folks back but they're not going to allow about this sleeping back starts all of the material that these people have been relying on to essentially maintain their occupation which a lot of folks sort of see as a battle a potential warning shot one interesting development we heard today is the local teachers teachers union announced that they're going to be donating storage space for people to keep their possessions and protesters say you know what if we have to give up our items will still stay there we'll sleep in shifts we'll sleep standing will sleep seating seated we're not going anywhere and that's the that's the

rallying cry from the protesters in the park today what's the reason lucy i mean this is the private part from what i understand and as you said for four weeks even though sleeping bags and targets aren't exactly allowed there for weeks they've been allowed there with no real issue what's the reason the mayor and the police department are giving as to why you know now they won't be anymore. well keep in mind that the mayor's live in girlfriend is actually one of the people that's that's on the board that oversees is or could be park liberty plaza protesters are calling it so that little conflict of interest isn't really lost on anyone here but folks really do think that you know the mayor is nervous and if i were the mayor frankly i would be because the numbers are growing we saw rain unpleasant conditions you know not the kind of situation where you would think protesters would continue to camp out and and people are still coming there were a bigger number today's numbers today in the park during the day than we saw before and these kinds of potential showdown downs conflicts potential backhanded

evacuations are only going to boost the numbers and so a lot of folks here suspect that the establishment elites are worried that they're worried that these kinds of occupations are spreading across the country that they don't seem to be showing any sign of slowing up they're expected to spread internationally in fact to europe across europe on october fifteenth and folks just don't know how to handle that you know if i were the police chief i would be nervous as well although the irony is that these aren't you know enter tests with six in hand it's a lot of families a lot of students a lot of actually employed people who happen to want to do something to change the system that they feel is stacked up against them and one other interesting to point to bring up for tomorrow is there's a family sleep over scheduled so there's going to be a lot of kids and family is expected in the park tomorrow i don't know how a massive show of police force is going to go along with that that's going to look pretty bad in terms of pictures out in the media i saw that on the agenda family sleep over i think tomorrow and saturday night with the i want to get you to talk

a little more i didn't realize there were these sanitation committees i think that's really interesting it's almost like a mini kind of government without a head is being established what other kinds of committees or groups are there that are sort of helping make this show run more smoothly. it's shockingly organized as someone who was watching it from washington and had to have the opportunity to spend the week past week in there i mean they have medical teams they have security guards they have they have all kinds of different working groups for example folks that focus on food folks that focus on are raising money they have a committees established to welcome a new occupiers into the camp to sort of go over rules and try to make sure that there's no conflicts or fights within that would give the mayor with and why p.d. any more additional reason to crack down and the one thing to keep in mind is that everything that is done in this occupation is very transparent every single evening they have something that they call general assembly which is basically

a giant meeting where anyone can essentially speak that's when they offer their proposals on what they want to do for example as we speak right now they're meeting in zuccotti park trying to decide on the plan of action for tomorrow and anyone the police the media anyone that wants to come by and listen and figure out what their processes moreover they post everything on the web site so there's really nothing shady or underground or undercover about this process at all which is all the more reason why people are so frustrated and confused and puzzled by the official police and city reaction to this occupation it's certainly been great for us we've been reporting on this from inside you know our studios here to be able to watch that global stream online and just last question for you lucy you you mentioned this global day of action on october fifteenth this is the day that cities from all around the world are calling to all sort of gather together any sort of plan of action since you're sort of in the polls the heartbeat of this whole thing. yes

quite a bit actually at eleven in the morning they're planning a mass rally to converge against chase bank sort of protest some actions there there's a different rally a massive virgin's and washing square park planned for one pm and the most interesting thing that will be keeping an eye on at five pm on saturday we're expecting a lot of people to turn out in times square to occupy times square not as a permanent occupation but sort of as a show of force a show of numbers trying to get new people interested in the movement and knowing knowing how new york city is laid out and the amount of police that's already present in times square i wouldn't be surprised if something were to go down there perforce we'll be keeping a very close eye on all of that for you all those people standing in line for their discount tickets for broadway will certainly see it in times square a lot of people there on a daily basis are to producer lucy catherine and lucy of course has been bringing us the latest pictures and interviews from occupy wall street she is also a master tweeter so many updates throughout the day about what she's seeing and

hearing at occupy wall street you should definitely keep an eye on it to stay following this movement follow her on twitter lucy catherine of. all right so with this group of people loud and angry and making demands it didn't take long before the comparisons began between the occupiers and the tea party and we've been comparing and contrasting for a few days here on our t.v. and thought bill maher made some interesting points the other night on the rachel maddow show check this out. the tea party will put let's let's remember story sort of started out as protesting some of the same things member the belo to the banks they didn't like the big banks it just shows how easily the people in the tea party could be herded to something else they were sort of on the same page as these folks but most of the watch fox news makes no what they were really upset about was things like obama care and taxing the job creators and somehow they were not on the

wrong side of the issue again. also important to remember that as the tea party got co-opted by fox news in the koch brothers in the various message machines it also did grow in power and strength and pretty clearly helped shape the outcome of the two thousand and ten election remember where republicans sucked and swept into the majority of the house of representatives also change the direction of the national debate so the connection we think is fair and we want to take it a little deeper so to help us do that earlier i spoke to the one of the original founders of the tea party karl denninger karl is also one of the founders of the web site the markets so i started out by asking him about something posted on his website by libertarian pete blum who wrote that occupy wall street is basically all things that the tea party were in the original tea party but ignored by the quote republican booster club so here's carl's point of view on that. i think they are to some degree accurate one of the things that we had originally with the tea party

back in two thousand and eight were two protests one that was held on wall street the original protest against the bailout of bear stearns and then a second one that was held in washington d.c. that we call the toilet bowl protest because it featured a toilet bowl in which people could deposit their collateral for the federal reserve and those were very small business there were thirty forty fifty people there we hauled out a lot of you know a lot of signs and handed out some banners and flyers and proper stickers and d.v.d.'s and things like this and then everybody went home and the problem with protests and the political process is that it's very easy no matter how big the protest is to for the politicians to simply wait until the people go home and then they can ignore you well i keep my wall street was a little different and back in two thousand and eight i wrote that when we will actually see changes when people call home they set up camp and they refused to go home so that appears to be happening now and there is of course you're going to expect people to try to co-opt what's going on but that is

a very dangerous process because as the authorities look at this and try to make up their minds what to do you have two basic outcomes one is that we see some justice here and to some extent that probably doesn't involve prosecution the statue of limitations has been intentionally run on some of these things but not all and the other is that the other real change really needs to happen is we need to be examining who promised who what and what can actually be to whimper because a big part of what's being groped about here that i've seen within the occupy wall street movement are things where the only real solution is for people to go bankrupt but that has to happen impulse saw it's the student who takes on seventy thousand dollars in debt studying history probably wasn't all that smart to do that but somebody made him a seventy thousand dollar loan and a solution to that is for him to declare bankruptcy and have that. it would be destroyed richard gurley could not but the person who made the law would also need

the seventy thousand dollars lost in what we have built in this country over the last three four years. forestall or shortly declare bankruptcy it was there i was there for close with all of the street the debate goes on if you have to suffer the loss of a load that was built a circuit robot toy guess where do you just sit and cry i just want to stick for a little while longer with kind of the comparison between the tea party and occupy wall street we put together some points of our own some similarities between the two movements. here we have in the both of them are a joke and an aberration and a bunch of weirdos at first they both are angry at the elites several concerned about jobs the economy they're both reports by wall street bailouts disenchanted by the death of the american dream and those people in both movements feel left out of the system the tea party of course angry at government occupy wall streeters angry at corporate america we've had you on the show before and you know you've told us so many how in so many ways despite any power at the tea party was hijacked i'm

right your advice for the occupiers down there right now. don't let it happen that's i mean it's a very you know it sounds clean to its own simple it's not one of the things that the occupy movement seems to have going for it used to it has not turned around and issued a sort of formal demeanor this is a good thing not a bad thing everybody's looking for a set of demands the problem is as soon as you point out with gross list of or so i think when you've got to keep it simple and short then somebody is going to say well we gave you so many percent of it. and the fact is that's exactly the sort of thing that happened with the tea party we were told that it was you know we were going to get what we wanted especially through the elections well one of the things we wanted was a linda gray into government deficit spending it as you can see that didn't happen so you know there is this there is this movement within government to say oh well you know we could throw you a bone or two it's kind of like to get all of

a pet maybe a lot so i don't buy it anymore well though as far as a lot of those tea party members that were elected into office kind of selected in two thousand and it seems like they were a lot of the ones voting against this deficit spending just didn't have enough of them i guess you could say important also to talk about the differences between the two groups even members of the original tea party wanted the last government and last government regulation most of those down there on wall street believe big banks should be more heavily regulated and also be held accountable for things like for example the mortgage meltdown. according to another prominent tea party member there are almost no similarities i want to play this for a car and get your reaction. i just think there's a distinction here these people are not like tea partiers they're not law abiding citizens they're camping in a hard working thing is the law and they're breaking the laws on the brooklyn bridge that's not two party behavior that's not america loving behavior. so karl what about this charge that the occupy wall street protesters are law breaking on america loving fifth and i seem to remember this thing called the first amendment

and the last time i checked the constitution including the first amendment of which it is a part of takes priority over people saying you can't wave signs and speech. i understand that there are people who think that you know this this whole thing with the current bridge blocking of bridges were on but there is plenty of controversy over exactly who go to who and blocking what bridge you're whether or not it was a spontaneous act or with the police actually shepherded the people out of the bridge and it turned around and walked them in and arrested well you know if a police officer says walk this direction and you do it and then he turns around and cosign you i'm not quite so sure that that's your fault certainly a lot of controversy about bad day and brooklyn last week let's talk to you about how in both groups are being and have been received by the american people and i says a new poll numbers compiled by time magazine's new national poll or it shows that the occupy wall street movement has a fifty percent favorable rating by the american public tea party rating i think

and percent you know to be fake here is karl doesn't surprise me we have a basic problem here in this country in the he acts that took place over the last thirty years with regards to national and get within the system generally whether it be in education housing all the poor and medical care for that matter all of these things are very complicated and difficult for the general public to understand and people in the media and people on wall street like it that way because if you don't understand it then you don't you don't get what happened but the american people know that they've gotten hosed they cost their jobs they've seen them offshore to china they've lost their houses they saw a huge run up in home prices and then a collapse you seemed to stock market crash is now in the space of ten years and maybe we're in the middle starting a third one in people are saying you know what i'm. i know that i've gotten screwed by all of this but i don't know how i got screwed i just know it happened and it

all came from new york and washington d.c. clearly americans are frustrated but how does real change happen you know tea parties with i think the argument that it already did happen at the ballot box in two thousand what do you think. i want to take exception to a couple of things first is president obama so these things may have been immoral but they were against the law that's not true filing a hundred thousand follett's courage or affidavits in courts across the country is a crime selling things to people that you know are garbage and telling them that they're perfectly good debt instruments is a crime these two things in particular standing alone are things that have been in . in a second in particular was admitted to under oath in front of the financial crisis inquiry commission it's a part of the public record these are not the only things that could be investigated and prosecuted should somebody choose to do so but when you have a system that is essentially

a revolving door you have corruption that is not illegal per se and yet it is a serious problem for example and also a former treasury secretary twice went to washington to get the leverage limits removed from investment banks the first time he was turned away the second time he got what he asked for and every one of the firms that failed bear stearns and lehman brothers being two that were formally under that restriction but more than double the leverage that was formerly equal at the time they blew up so these restrictions that have been taken off of these institutions by the very people who then go to washington are a big part of the reason that we're in this mess wrought in house prices because without the ability to run at leverage you could never finance these this bubble in the first place and that was cauldrons or one of the original founders of the tea party also the founder of the website and market sector that is going to do it.