hello i'm john are going to washington d.c. it's friday so that means it's time for the big picture rommel. joining me on the panel this week vince collin a senior on light editor of the daily caller erica kennedy a democratic strategist here in washington d.c. and brian darling columnist of human events and director of government studies at the heritage foundation let's get started ok there are been two raids this week by

l.a. occupy philly and you know the old saying firstly first they ignore you then they ridicule you then they fight you then you when it's starting to look to me like they're winning l.a. city council has announced in response that they're going to have a vote on whether or not to strip corporate personhood you know to support a constitutional amendment to end this which is one of the consistent demands of occupy wall street groups all around the country similar resolutions of past in boulder in missoula today on my radio show i had jack abrams off on here's what he had to say about it. would you support a constitutional amendment that says that corporations are people and money isn't speech well i think it's got to say a lot more than that to be honest with you there's a lot more there's a lot more problems here but if you do that then you could get out and you could start with then you could pass the laws that you're talking about right now the thing that is impeding those laws is the is the fact that corporations are considered persons and money is considered speech you do blow those things up and then you can start passing laws stopping the revolving door stopping the buying off

of members of congress or i agree and so meanwhile millionaires are marching on capitol hill demanding that their taxes be raised the narrative in the media has shifted from oh my god we've got a debt too what about inequality and where are the job. bob's conservatism frank luntz who said he's frightened to death by occupy wall street so isn't it pretty clear that there would then said. if i was three so what you have isn't actually especially i can tell you one way that corporations are online people people don't get all the loopholes that corporations do i mean corporations are certainly have a very close proximity to the federal government and these occupy protesters are interestingly out protesting the corporations which are composed of smart people who actually see advantages that they can take with the government they take them but really these protesters really should be in front of the white house saying look we can't have a government that creates this kind of system and even the republicans now are asking that some of these are going to be part of the. people is the supreme court

i mean and then that goes back to you know people that were appointed five as public i mean i would this is what i would say is that i think about occupy wall street and i wish was a little bit more organized at the same time what it does do is it illustrates the fact that there is mass discontentment and that it isn't necessarily just wall street isn't necessarily just income inequality isn't necessarily just one thing or the other but that there's a whole slew of things in which we've divided up this country left behind the mass and left behind majority and that they they're at this point with you know high unemployment there's a lot of people who want anything else to do because they don't have a job and so they can sit out there and they can continue to kind of be the beat the drum and actually show up and kind of illustrate this is what it looks like it's all it looks like it was revolt brian it turns out that among occupy wall street people you have a higher level of college education than you have in the workforce as a whole. you have a higher level of arrest rates too what about five thousand arrest for this urban

canada how many banks there's a been arrested here so you're really not i think they're exercising their constitutional right to assemble. your conservation right to engage in urban camping in a set up a campground the one of the city becomes that's not what the. works for just to sit there and set up a campground and protest against we don't even know what's now what are they protesting against he have to listen to the city what are you going to tell you some of them were never people to market your different ways because of the civil rights movement these people are protesting and they're gauging in fights with the police or they're engaging in violence there have been rapes on these occupy wall street movement by the way we. make that is like a fox less money making machine at college football because sandusky was a pedophile being that you can't say that occupy wall street is so because there's one thing i mean if you have five thousand residents not isolated in this manner that these people are every so consider being arrested on purpose or camping out and people who are bringing attention to what is what they should you know why is

this so scary so often since then why is it why why why aren't conservatives of seeing on the fact that that occupy wall street people are getting arrested for things like trespass and you've got banks that we just discovered took seven and a half seven point seven trillion dollars according to bloomberg even the white house didn't know about it seven point seven trillion dollars made a thirteen billion dollars profit but most of it their own pockets over a thousand people are going to a million dollars in bonuses why the hell aren't those thousand people and conservatives is not the some of the loudest voices when it comes to the bailouts i mean it was the push of that as you know what this is that you're absolutely right i mean this is better if not something matter of fact that you're absolutely right i mean that's the point you have conservatives who have come out and roundly denounced bush's involvement they've come out and said this is ultimately you were the occupy wall street be that the bailout no no no i mean let me let me comment on something that was said a moment ago my fellow panelists here mention that this is somehow a majority movement it's a movement that's taken the mantle of the majority all movements do this they say look i'm speaking for everybody here we all think this and i'm you little show me

lately is not the ninety nine percent ninety nine percent of three of you not identifying with me taxing millionaires more so that actually is a lot of the issues that are the majority nobody is saying well the job creators need to be left alone so they can go on creating jobs and government jobs i mean if there's a. anything that you do that you only got around jobs aren't as good as privates and only jobs they have in common with the majority is some of the banks than the frustration with where the economy is well beyond that yes but beyond that but beyond that the occupy protest that's all they offer is in frustration there's no substance has had so much time to develop and education here in the us from what i already know that laws angeles city council is going to vote on a decision whether or not to end corporate personhood missoula and boulder have both on the same we're actually seeing legislation i think that changes but the majority of people have been feeling like you sat it hasn't been focalize and so up until the occupy wall street there was a way to kind of not see it every day where a legislator and various leaders and media could just it was at home it was in

people's living rooms but they didn't have to confront it and what occupy wall street has done is saying you have to confront and interest the nx that the majority of people are failed what do you think the tea party movement is about if you're a prescribing these elements of just anger and frustration economic it was the let's let's take it to something specific in animas effort last night senate republicans voted down extending tax cuts to middle class people why you know this is a well that we'll get to that the actually the consequence of this will be raising taxes on eleven million working people by about a thousand bucks a year as you all know and grover norquist as i'm sure you all know said that if you let the books bush temporary tax cuts expire that's a tax increase because that will increase taxes on millionaires and billionaires but if you let the payroll tax increase expire grover norquist gave them that i should have been saved i don't know many dominator that's not actually got he said that it was actually you know we're down with the no two taxes and he said. it would be a violation to use this is an excuse to increase taxes put

a permanent surtax on millionaires for a one year extension of the social security system as opposed to in july you and i don't we all know it is not all there is here and it's actually it is over an arc which is more than a year and games you're right over heating up the congress cannot die. the republican version that was paid for by freezing the pay of government officials in yeah let's fire i want you people so that we can get people in there you have rows of fire a bunch of middle class people so you know i mean people that i've worked in that i work for the government and i've worked in the private sector and both times my landlord got a rent check and my landlord did not care where the money was coming from this idea that we have to cut this pay for government workers we can have bonuses for our you know wall street billionaires and that we can continue to allow the wealthiest one percent to pay a lower tax percentage than everybody else when you're nowhere going to there is a contradiction to me to think that we have really nine dollars and we're not going to you know it doesn't go down it went by in the money's being borrowed money going

to the private sector and when demand as you will have more people in jobs you know more people manufacturing more people in stores will have more small businesses and then the other thing about the payroll tax cut is it helps small businesses small businesses do benefit so if this were which is one of those interesting things i mean obviously the idea of a holiday conservatives argue that they want consistency in their tax code they don't want these types of things now let me let me go back to this element on grover for i mean i don't identify because i haven't heard anybody address by but i sure over norquist to the washington post editorial board in july you may recall that there was this controversy surrounding the fact that he said to them that allowing the bush tax cut to expire wouldn't actually be a tax increase technically you and i remember that but that actually goes in line with. what this is causing me to wonder is who wants a damn about grover norquist so take that i mean who like this guy you know what do you mean he says himself that he's not emperor of the world he's not a leader is a lobbyist is what he's actually and what does he done he's forced members of congress to sign a pledge to the people to the voters saying they were going to ask what's wrong

with it i made entirely their pledge to the constitution and he made an eloquent argument last week on meet the press he made an appearance and he talked about this tax and he made a very simple you know the government shouldn't simply dip their bucket into the water into the overall cash in the united. it's bring it over to the other side of the lake and just dump it back in to experience say that they've somehow created wealth that they could create a five trillion dollars of the budget deficit. i'm going to give it to the right guys are going to do as well i think the government is trying to balance its books and we have to own the bush tax cuts went in we saw the deficit and grace and we have had two wars that we have not paid for and i think with and terms of balancing the books somebody you know you have to raise revenue you have to raise revenue or you have to work trillion dollars in deficit spending since barack obama was sworn in. that's not the issue here what i'm finding amazing is that you grow and you knew it so that you found vince built some sense. whatever i mean are seem to be

supporting the idea that there should be no tax increases on millionaires in order to maintain a tax cut for average working people and i'm guessing that you're in favor of the tax cut i'm in favor of the tax cut and the increase in the tax the three percent and i'm against that i'm against increasing tax i'm against increasing taxes on one portion of americans to cut taxes on another portion of americans where i whine about is because it's not fair but why don't we cut taxes and everybody i think conservatives believe in that you want to cut the payroll tax let me make it profitable who earn over a million dollars on average pay seventeen percent total income tax well. you know you don't know what you're making and you well know that conservatives support comprehensive tax reform that doesn't raise the tax burden on the american people let's close all the loopholes but let's not do is not going to get us not i don't i mean don't there's not enough corporate jets out there and like suddenly balance the budget off of that but has to be able to do this maybe this discerned is that

people who are job creators are these other is that they're different than middle class americans or that you were classified people already and that the problem is that we're not focusing on what's better for the whole country when the whole time is better. you know the individuals you have that's a great point and you know and if you were to look at if you look at that i don't know when we got to the point that it's not politically sensitive to say this but when we get to the point where we just like can continue to accept that less and less people are going to pay into the tax code to support everybody in the united states because that's what we're doing i mean the conversation is about condensing the tax code to a concentrated class of people that's why taxes on the rich is easy because it polls well and i know that and i capitalists tax rate of fifteen percent for people who earn their living as capitals as opposed to what people people like it is all mine i mean it's all that we have that we have that we have to take this quick break i think we'll be we'll be right back with more with with rubble after. what drives the world the fear mongering used by politicians who makes decisions to

break through that sort of people have made who can you trust no one who is in view with a global machinery to see where we had a state controlled capitalism it's called. when nobody dares to ask we do our t. question more.

what are the big picture of alarm panel vince cullen a senior online editor of the daily caller a democratic strategist here in washington d.c. and brian darling columnist of human events and director of government studies at the heritage foundation let's go back to it in ninety three. seven vote yesterday the senate passed a six hundred sixty two billion dollars that's like two billion dollars a day war funding bill meanwhile thanks to republicans insist austerity the low income home energy assistance program. democrats come up with the most awful acronyms you know the republicans it's like the clear skies initiative this is why you any i saw it's budget nearly cut in half just in time for winter and meanwhile the horror of energy is saying the price of oil is expected spike by ten percent so why is it that we have no problem finding enough to find enough money to fight and lose wars but we can't afford making sure that poor americans elderly americans

don't freeze to death as well but are we missing as this is i think two point one it's an annual defense bill i mean it's what has to come up with something that they have to actually address three times what the defense bill was major damage became something that they have to address a national security actually is sort of like a constitutional responsibility we can argue over the scale defense fund so as the joint wealthier but you're ok for general welfare yes but if you're a liberal and i find it interesting when you argue on the issue of for instance energy and big oil yet you still are you for subsidies to pay for oil for anybody i mean the idea is like this for the consumers this is this is like you know you know the mortgage lenders rather than the banks you're billing i mean the point is that oil companies then have the luxury of government available to them in order to charge whatever rates they were no this is this is sort of the you know an elderly person who's who's making the choice between you know i was there are bad but that doesn't have to make that you actually go but what is what what what what are you what are we missing here in my own mouth and i think that anybody that and i think that there is a now see him a moral imperative to make sure that people count phrase at death in their homes

and anybody that gets up in and waves their religion around or talks about you know morally i don't believe in this or morally i believe in that said look at the low income heating assistance bill and not say that you have a moral obligation to make sure that we're funding that's been. how much is that for me every year the increase it hits us because the price of oil isn't all that it's used to give subsidies for air conditioning i mean it's not something it's all very much for giving a system if you want to look at who to blame how about the democrats aren't the democrats controlling the senate do you think president obama's going to veto this bill i don't think so i don't think it's that role in the price of oil they control the senate they control the agenda they wrote the bill carl levin how are levin is the is the chairman going to give that you're going to get you're going to get an increase in the heating assistance program for low income people through the house of representatives with paul ryan and enjoying always early in the republicans even though democrats control this all fall if only legislation has to originate out how is this has nothing to do why does the president veto it if it's so bad if he's got a problem having our present to be telecast has to get it yes or you so do you

think the president if there is a cohesive he'll say nothing is better than a little bit and so what you're suggesting comes up if it comes up in the supplemental bill probably add money and right at the end of the year when they do want to play mimics attention and all these budget busting programs that they're going to do right at the end of the year and and you are so you're predicting this is an average of a thousand to fifteen hundred dollars a person for a relatively small number of people in most of the northern states particularly northeast you're predicting that that money is going to come through it always does you get republican senators like olympia snowe and susan collins that are always pushing it at the end of the year and nobody ever looks at the bottom line it's got a good bit of a reasonable. you know maybe you will it brian i hope you're right and we'll all come back here after the first of the year and what will that ultimately i just you know say that on this issue on this vote erica mentioned the idea that simply because money isn't there that somehow heartless to not take care of people there is money i know that and if if government is the only place where we can decide

whether or not something is hard for our let's that's a pretty sad over the six years that i stand here but everyone i have saying that you know what i'm saying is that for everybody that stands up and sat you know i don't believe and you know gay marriage because that's morally wrong i don't believe that when you. throw out the cast of morality or your religion and then you have to turn your back on the poorest of the poor and the people that are literally going are there not asking for like you know ninety degrees and just throwing all at me they think i just i think we've got it out. thank you herman cain can we go back to the. new gingrich is getting radical the same poor kids should be cleaning the bathrooms of their schools mitt romney starting to slip might have something to do with this check out the obvious differences between these two candidates these are two interviews forty eight hours apart and fox t.v. . why do you think that you are more electable the new hampshire union leader

endorsed speaker gingrich over the weekend saying he was he has courage conviction and isn't just telling them what they want to hear now the editor there joe mcquaid confirm that that last line was really about you it's reagan's line was are you better off than you were four years ago if you get the nomination what would your line be about obama and you really stand for many years of this. so basically the primary is they're going to kick romney's butt and their kids seen in the new gingrich they're giving him fluff ball interviews you know he famously picks politicians in the u.k. to actually become prime ministers he's picking republicans in the united states really is this i thought rick santorum was a paid contributor huckabee was sarah pailin they didn't seem to push them to the front of the repugnant at this time they did huckabee last time around but who gave the republican party or when did the republican party give the murdoch empire the

power to pick through their nominees because certainly said look i don't go and i don't recall that happening but. if you don't know what i mean if you don't you don't go to fox news the whole fox propaganda you get i mean so mitt romney has a difficult interview on fox with bret baier and then. it goes on gets a flow on having to get softballs run out and i agree but you know that newt gingrich is going to have a tough interviews when he goes on the future he's had some very difficult interviews on fox in the past it's not as if they want him to win i mean they're not playing favorites but that you know anything that hannity is m.-o. i mean that guy brings on these guys in the talks and like it can very can friendly conservative way to all of these candidates when it comes to like the way the foxes treated the debates no other news outlet has actually received as much praise for the criticism with which they've approached these candidates let me just read where i mean ospel theory here than what something i've noticed over the years is it seems like and i see this on both sides and right across the board in the media that when somebody is down they try to bring them up when somebody is up they try

to bring them down because if they me if the media can maintain a horse race then there's more tension there's more excitement and more people watch and more people will see ads and the media and the networks will make more money but that's right and that's what i don't think that's a symptom of fox i think that's right across and i do think i do think that media for it is a great i think i think the fact that there are still covering herman cain at this point is a great example of the fact that the me a lot of the horse race always never run it with who i mean this is a spender take us for a. but and media i you know i hear me talk radio personality reports talk about like oh gosh can you believe he's still going out there why are you still covering him why and i think that that's you know that there are a lot to blame for that i think the interesting thing that what we've seen happen with newt gingrich which is hasn't happened for any of the other kind of up and down candidate in feet for perry we didn't see him again and that his numbers are going up and romney's are actually going down for the first time you didn't see romney's numbers take a hit when herman cain and rick perry it went up so i think that you know there's something else

a more dynamic here that's at play where maybe i don't know maybe like newt gingrich knows where respect stand is very. very artificial and you actually those are the moderates dogs are a lot of blindness and they have no weapons rock obama can't win the election i don't think i think republicans can only lose it and the mainstream media is doing everything they can to beat up all of these different republican candidates are knocking them down they're blogging them so when they go into the general election they may have a tough time winning because it's going to be a lot of are you going to make the other argument that when we go into the general election all this stuff is already out and it will be considered old news and so when you can get covered and then it's all going to be about marco rubio because all this is about who gets to be his running but i think they're also taking it i think they're making that if they don't we have to go to the court it was a quick vote question. last question for. turns out the republican debate at the end of the month in iowa we hosted by none of the donald himself in what will likely be the most watched and biggest train wreck of a debate so far everyone is wondering just what kind of questions donald trump is

going to ask the candidates all the candidates except jon huntsman who dropped out of the debate already saying he doesn't want to be part of the presidential process but for the rest of the field what questions should they expect from trump will be a real ask mitt romney what he uses in his hair the hill as newt gingrich who is divorced divorce lawyer is is let's see trump is on number three for i don't know and you know as herman to see us come in can advance to star in the next season's the bad. i think. i tend to believe that he probably want to ask any of those questions because none of them involve his product line i mean that probably has something that has to do with like one of his tie it's right like what are you waiting for i've not been the main sees lately but it would be on t.v. anyway if i wanted them and if you were hard to get more viewers when you're at the trump pacino what would you say your favorite thing about it would be either i mean i agree i don't see i don't think i don't think don thompson anything that hasn't been some sort of a promo for his product so i'm looking for like you know trump kind of backdrop i

mean it unless there's a way a product come out i don't know the time he'll ask him when can i get you on the celebrity apprentice and when you get on what is your favorite charity so we can know what to give money to if you actually win you know i'm curious if you could fire anybody at the end but if i had or if he asks everybody for their birth certificate and rick perry can't produce one i'm very proud of you very proud of myself i got the birth certificate. brian thank you all for being with us that much appreciate it. how do we know pepper spray is awful because no one's lining of volunteer him to be pepper sprayed back a few years ago when we were debating whether or not water waterboarding was torture people were volunteering to be waterboarding all over the place but would you consider waterboarding which you get the truth out of you know we could

waterboard you or you visit on sunday. i'll do it for charity down here later this year he was laying down on the table to about a seven foot table its feet are now in a box his feet are elevated his feet are bigger what are you doing i am tying his feet up to speed or being tied up. to. his neck. ok. to. you when you train take the rescue the selfie goes in your mouth and then puts out a conclusion it's torture same thing happened after police start employing tasered remember that there was a big debate over whether or not that was excessive force on the part of the police so a bunch of reporters lined up to get tasered. are you ready. i was

. just. you know. an idea of how regular people might react to. how crime reporter for the chronicle and some truly. i'm about to get to yes i'm told that it hurts like oh. now the new weapon of choice for police is we're seen so often used against peaceful occupy wall street protesters is pepper spray. was.

and g.o.p. t.v. also known as fox news has been quick to defend pepper spray as. being all that bad . and all that pepper spray and they were just sitting there pretty cool like they must not make it that way but at the going to the internet we had a. great man goes gives in to roam around in the grass crying running i mean are you kidding me but the image is obviously disturbing i thought he had you know one of those attack conservatives you got to have one of those big canisters on your hip and. did it cross a line i don't think so i say one hundred percent effort spray you do. it and some parenting classes as well first of all pepper spray that just burn drives right right i mean it's like a derivative of actual pepper it's a food product essentially but a lot of experts are looking at that and saying is that the real deal has it been diluted yeah it's just a food product no problem while fox seems to be content defending the use of pepper spray no one there is lining up to be pepper sprayed like hannity was lining up to

be waterboarding. maybe that's because pepper spray really is that bad i had the inventor of pepper spray on my show this week and i asked him. if pepper spray is a food product and i put it on my burrito he didn't exactly find it funny but i use weapons grade pepper spray too to spice up a burrito pepper spray is so fortified and is formulated to a point of gases and propellant and the chemical that's of us going to such nutrition is cooler than evolved that unity jenny to there is impossible to eat that is not food anymore thousands of times i'm stronger than any kind of bird you ever put in your mouth well and i've had i love. it is designed to immediately produce inflammation of mucus membranes that means your eyes shut you have difficulty in breathing what are the long term effects of these individuals i mean you know each one of us respond to chemicals and diseases are different we really

don't know what's going to happen to these eyes of these are as rigorous as them and we just entered the unknown world that's what i was shocked and this was the guy who invented perspiration the point of this pepper spray is a chemical weapon it is more painful than getting tasered and has far more long lasting effects than waterboarding at least physically which might be why g.o.p. t.v. talking heads are willing to praise its use from a far but not willing to put their face in front of want to attend a pikes pepper spray canisters and until they do so hannity or meghan kelly are all rally walk the walk and taking a face full of pepper spray and they should hold off on making comments about how it's a legitimate use of force against peaceful protesters and the occupy wall street. coming up on the big picture of this week's conversations with great minds with author journalist and medical ethicist dr perry at war.