it seeks to shape its international ties the turmoil of uncertainty at home well as those of leaders trial finally resumes. this is r.t. the arab spring iran's nuclear program and the ongoing middle east turmoil are just three things that put the world in a spin during twenty eleven and indeed got tempers flaring at the u.n. as was powerful body next than we hear how reacting to these major events is going to pan out in twenty twelve with the man at the heart of it all russia's ambassador to the un vitaly churkin he joins us now live your best to churkin thank you for taking the time to be with us first of all start by the words of libya the u.n. security council rejected russia's proposal to investigate civilian deaths from nato strikes in libya what of members avoiding air or is it simply a case the ongoing conflicts and i wore important. well you know first of all it was not rejected the fact of the matter is that a number of security council delegations including the russian delegation raise the

need to have some clarity about civilian casualties as a result of nato bombings because for months we heard from made from nato that they are adopting all those measures in order to make sure that there cannot possibly be any civilian casualties and then we have the on december eighteenth of this a disturbing investigation published by the new york times which showed that there were dozens at least of civilian casualties so it makes sense to us and seems to be a pretty obvious thing that they have this matter investigated in an impartial amount and it's a political but also humanitarian case if there are people who became victims of those strikes maybe injured people or their relatives were killed then they should be given some assistance without waiting for a prolonged period of other ongoing investigations like the investigation by the human rights council or i.c.c.

international criminal court which should deal with a whole range of possible. crimes transgressions which took place in libya in the course of the military campaign so it's something which will continue to pursue and in fact i would think that of the matter can be clarified within weeks and not months which would otherwise be the case it was simply a lie in those other investigations and but i don't see anything. in this after all nato is a part of the united nations after all nato has been acting on the basis of a security council mandate so the security council we believe should play an active role also in having this matter clarified but also i think if you put too much emphasis on this issue you will forget that the security council is working quite harmoniously on a range of issues. of pertaining to the conflict situation in libya the u.n. mission is there supported by the security council the security council is working

under the resolution which was adopted by at russia's initiative on a looking into the dangers which are there in terms of spreading weapons out of libya which were left of them that in the course of of the conflict we are helping the libyans to rebuild their political and economic structures so a lot of harmonious work is going on in the in the security council of the united nations on libya even though we continue to have some ideological and political difficulties as to whether it is a loosen one hundred seventy three was properly implemented and the issue of possible civilian casualties which again simply has to be clarified and set aside to the satisfaction of everybody the libyan people and to help the possible victims of the bombings and bus you touched on it just i want to pick up the. austin ills

of post conflict libya how they being made secure how is the u.n. stopping any of those weapons maybe ending up in syria. well they may be ending up in various places and in fact of the traumatic regional effects of the libyan conflict apply not only to the possibility of the spread of weapons but also own migrant workers who were working in libya but then they had to leave the country and create all sorts of tensions in the homelands as to the you know the particular the issue of the weapons it's not just the united nations but under the aegis of the central of the united nations a lot of work is being done on that the best thing i can report of this point is that we're told that the most dangerous of those weapons in terms of terrorist use the so-called manpads man carried anti-aircraft weapons have so far not been that they're to the outside of libya so we hope that this concerted effort of the

international community together with the libyan authorities can be successful in the containing the danger of spread of weapons from out of that country something else i'd like to ask you say the libyan militants known to operate in syria what does that say about the nature of the syrian unrest that we've seen so far and why indeed does it appear that he un members seem to be holding back from denouncing that what's happening there. yeah this is a this is an issue as you know we two weeks ago the russian delegation introduced a draft the security council resolution to the council trying to encourage the political process encourage the league of arab states money during mission which is being deployed now in syria but. we are basing. a proposal or a new draft resolution on the presidential statement which was adopted by consensus in by the security council on august street which called on everybody to stop

violence in syria and which stated that the only solution to the syrian crisis could be found through a syrian led all inclusive political process had all the members of the security council had all the influential members of the international community been guided by the principles of that presidential statement i believe the conflict would have been over in the months ago but what we see is that there are some who are trying to stir up trouble and as things would usually happen when there is a crisis all sorts of extremist terrorist elements show up for instance several days ago there was a horrible terrorist attack in damascus and the day before that the minister of defense of lebanon said that they detected some al-qaeda groups are moving into syria from from lebanon so i wouldn't be surprised that you know some terrorist elements from libya or other places have found their way through to syria in order

to not to stir trouble and to try to fan some kind of s. neko or religious conflict there this is what you know terrorists are all about that about starting conflict and we believe that they're all of the international community in a crisis situation like where we find in syria should be of do to help the people of that country to find a peaceful political solution to the crisis that has been the line of the russian federation all along and that has been our guiding principle in the security council as well so with everything you've just said in mind how much more leeway would you like to see the syrian government given to sort out this from within. well we we don't give any leeway to anybody we believe that the syrian government should be extremely prudent and should refrain from excessive use of force we believe that there has been there been some extremely troubling reports coming out of syria about excessive use of force by those or it is we urge the syrian

government to cooperate to face fully with the when it ordering mission of the arab league but also telling that the everybody must put pressure on on the destructive elements of the of the opposition or various destructive elements which may have found their way into syria that there are violent acts are not going to be condoned by the international community and this is a this is a key to finding a peaceful way out of the situation there and this is one of the discussions we're having when we talk with all colleagues in the security council about all draft resolution i'm talking about the armed groups out into the problems within syria is it difficult for the u.n. members to put sanctions on to syria because of the previous broken promises about non implemented reforms to now scale back it'll. well you cannot really talk about broken promises because some reforms were announced. some of them we are pretty far

reaching like changing the constitution and getting rid of the political monopoly of one party but of course are to expect that those real reforms can be implemented in a situation when the the crisis is sort of teetering on the brink of civil war even under normal circumstances in any country or reforms of such magnitude on all these if we implement but i mean the point i'm trying to make is that the sooner the crisis the military clashes stop the better position the international community will be to demand that the syrian authorities move along the reform track as quickly as possible towards forming the constitution doors conducting democratic open elections but all that in a situation when there is an armed conflict being encouraged from various quarters when we see weapons being moved. illegally into syria all that of course becomes

a separate conversation and bus i'd like to broaden this out next and focus in about what might be ahead in two thousand and twelve more generally in the region islamist parties have made inroads in the countries whose governments were overthrown in twenty eleven what additional risks does it bring to the middle east and north africa or indeed what action do you think that will require from the u.n. into twenty two. well it's hard for me to speculate about the possible role of the united nations but of course. some of the domestic political developments are pointing to the fact that this democratic process of some of those revolutions is not necessarily something which which is going to happen easily or at all what impact is it going to have on the regional situation it remains to be seen but let me say that i believe that the greatest. danger in terms of disability ation in the next year if i make my if i may make that prediction might come from the very

disturbing growing confrontation between the west and iran this is a very dangerous scenario russia has been working very hard in order to prevent the scenario from playing out but we do believe that in a peaceful solution can still get the upper hand that we do believe that iran can start talks with the international atomic energy agency on those unanswered questions about their alleged former military activity in the in the military programs in the nuclear field would do believe that there is still a possibility on the basis of recent russians or russian initiatives to restart the talks between iran and the group of the six of which russia is a member so i think that the the great focus of those who don't want to go see a very dramatic escalation of tensions and conflict in that whole area would be to

make sure the. peaceful track the negotiating track in relations with with iran prevails into solvent well to be clear the u.s. senate israel most notably the people that are worried about iran are any of their fears justified in your view. well there are concerns which are certain to share concerns about the possibility of around developing a nuclear weapon and that's why we have been working so hard in the format of the six and in the security council that's why away a vote on the for sanctions resolution resolutions in the security council target the iranian nuclear and missile programs a but we also do not accept the proposition that the best way to prevent the war is to stop the war and certainly any military move against iran of this at this point or if it in any in any kind of scenario i could possibly imagine would have

a dramatic consequences which would in no way improve the security of the region which will in no way improve in the long term the security of israel and which could really have very tragic consequences so we have been saying that for a long time and this is our consistent. stand if you will so again our effort is going to be a target at the doing whatever we can in order to prevent the scenario of a regional catastrophe being carried out in two thousand and twelve just looking at the news the last couple of days as a potential flashpoint could be the strait of hormuz how worried are you about the potential for conflict there. well those reports seem to be extremely troubling yes and this is not the way to go about it but over the past few weeks that we have seen. the build up of various accusations and counter-accusations this is quite

troubling could we now talk where the relationship next between israel and the palestinians as we head into the new year the peace talks appear hamstrung on one side by israel going forward or more settlements on the other the palestinian statehood bid already of course getting that unesco recognition do you expect any breakthroughs in twenty twelve might that manifest itself. well i sure hope so that if not break through with us that least some progress is going to be made but at this point in time i'm not extremely optimistic incidentally you mentioned the palestinian unesco bit and of course they also submitted their application for the full membership in the united nations we don't see at all oh it can hurt the israeli palestinian negotiations because the palestinians have very wisely stated from the outset that they did not see their membership in the united nations as an alternative to negotiations with israel is that they accept that yes

in the final analysis the problem will have to be settled in their direct talks with israel is but also they believe that there must be certain parameters within which they will be talking to the israelis and one of the elements of those parameters is that the settlement activity on the west bank and is jerusalem will have to stop because now we see a situation where the west bank almost entirely covered by israeli settlements and outposts so it's logical for the palestinians it would seem to ask what kind of two state solution two state solution there can be if there is no land for us essentially on the west bank for some pockets of territory which are populated by the palestinians and the rest of it is has been basically taken over by the israelis also they want to be to be sure that i want to talk about borders this is something which will be resembling the borders of one thousand nine hundred sixty

seven this has been the key a key element of the international approach to the negotiations between the israelis and the palestinians for a long time supported by that of peace initiative by numerous resolutions of the security council and numerous documents of the of the court it unfortunately in the year two thousand and eleven was sore at the end and see to to try. depart from those parameters that particular parameter of the peace settlement which of course makes it even more difficult to restart the negotiations but the record is still active if there is a room in the security council to do something and let me tell you that there is a lot of frustration among members of the security council about the fact that the security council has not been doing anything on the palestinian issue and a number of members of the security council i'm not talking about the russian delegation a number of members of the security council say when you have to have a resolution which will reconfirm those parameters well we tried to have

a resolution on the on the settlement some time ago but it was vetoed by the united states so a lot of frustration is there but hopefully both sides exercise restraint and. i should say that we have seen some positive movement from hamas politically in terms of their sort of palestinian reification but when the from us on the bus and also there moderating their political stand we believe and we have sort of moving trying to move them in that direction coming to the need to recognize the existence of israel within one hundred sixty seven borders and fortunately even though there are still some rocket attacks by some extreme elements in gaza overall this calm is being maintained between the palestinians in these rarely is present a bus very courageously announced the use of force in dealing with the issues of

their relations with israel with course we're all in the security council elsewhere a saying that there can be no resort to terrorist tactics there so there is a lot of there is a lot of pressure from various quarters to move the parties in the positive direction but whether or not that one can expect a major. progress in two thousand and twelve well as you know some analysts are pointing out that it's going to be of elections presidential elections in the united states and the usually this is not the best time for the u.s. leadership to exercise some leverage in the area of palestinian israeli relations so it remains to be seen one hopes for progress but how much can be attained in two thousand and twelve it remains to be seen and buster we've already had the pleasure of a company for over twenty minutes now while we've got you in the studio and like to ask you just wanted to briefly other questions while while we've still got

a bit of time the u.n. so far hasn't taken any action on the council your report about human organ trafficking in kosovo that accuses calls for the liberation army of those atrocities why is it taking so long to start a u.n. investigation indeed what exactly this is this is a very young. well you know all the service is very disturbing to us we don't understand why our western colleagues in the security council refused to make sure that the current ulick's investigation in kosovo is really a credible investigation and that everything indeed is being done to make sure that the perpetrators should be found so the serbian delegation together with our delegation perdue produced a very simple draft resolution which simply calls for the creation of office of special representative of the secretary general which will monitor or the work of ulick's and make sure that the witnesses are well protected we believe that the units mechanism is not sufficient for proper investigation for witness

protection and forty put into the security council we are concerned that what we'll see is a result of unix work is that of the favor in five or six years of. the secretive active it is that they will announce that they have not been able to discover anything and that the witnesses either died or were killed in the process and that will be it so we don't want this particular. gregarious crime to be swept under the carpet but for some reason as i say there is a resistance to us to that from this investigation done properly and full fledged from our western colleagues but i expect that there will continue that work with the serbian delegation in two thousand and twelve and i hope that that resolution eventually is going to be adopted to make sure that this crime is not going to be forgotten again because you will recall that once already. the international

tribunal and former yugoslavia somehow missed it i mean they stumbled in the un to the problem but then walked away from a real investigation and the international community cannot repeat this show i call it mistake again so a painful issue we believe that proper things could have been done easily. without much additional expenditure by that resolution of the security council but one of those situations when we find inexplicable resistance from some of our colleagues in the security council which will keep trying to overcome a bust or as we're looking ahead to the new year there are several dormant conflict zone all over the world where there's a worry that it may break trouble may break out if neglected thinking about cyprus and turkey india and pakistan and a few others too whereas the un security council focus on conflicts going to be twenty twelve is going to be solving current ones or averting new ones maybe as well. well we were trying to do both preventive diplomacy is

a very big concept for the security council and for the united nations but we're also try to encourage. the work which is going on on some longstanding conflicts cyprus is certainly one of those situations which is being monitored by the security council but again this is a place and problem where the part is themselves should reach agreement one troubling again aspect but it was quite similar i should say in my view to the situation in the palestinian israeli negotiations even though the context is completely different there have been for years the number of principles recorded in security council resolutions for an eventual cyprus settlement and basically. it says that it should remain one country so i think in my own understanding at least that in in the in the solvent eleven it was saw some efforts to depart from that principle and the come up with proposals which would essentially in every practical

or in many practical ways and political ways split the country into two so i think that has created the additional. problem for the prospect of the talks about the the two sides are talking. there is support from the united nations good offices of the secretary general of the security council is watching so it should be possible we believe to move ahead on that issue. between the two parties in two thousand and twelve metallic churkin russia's ambassador to the u.n. seasonal greetings to you wish you all the best for twenty twelve and thank you for being on our all the best all the best to you thank you. ok hope you can stay with us our programs continue it's now coming up to five minutes to nine moscow time i'll be back with the news in full five minutes from now.

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