well to hear people say and recognize that the eight point three percent unemployment numbers in america are false because when you don't include one point two million people on the rolls you can't say that the number has gone down number three it is capitalism the open market that creates jobs and opportunities allows people to grow thrive and survive you can't say and you can't sit there and pretend that you're in any way have any intellect whatsoever and say that dependency doesn't put downward pressure and doesn't hurt people from rising up if you create an opportunity for people to get something for nothing and you put them in a place to desire the something for nothing they will never try and build up to say otherwise you think it's going well you know you're just going to just. david go ahead i don't think you'll say sure there's no you can go on david i don't know just tore up the welfare checks and went to work the jobs would be there right right. that is i'm really not what i said what i said david you've got to actually pay attention to the words that come out of the mouth what i said is that when you

pack about the idea that dependency class as if it's mythology that's not true that is an accurate when you have more people on it ever than ever on food stamps one has to ask the question why some of the question has to deal with the economy some of it has to deal with the ease of being able to do that as opposed to other things so you have to take a look at it in its totality not in the political landscape you desire it but quoting karl marx as a guy who understood that is how little known is that there aren't jobs for those people their jobs are there for those people that's the obvious if all those welfare people want to get a job is it they're not you david gentlemen i want to go to new york david dreier engines we have you have free time you want to say oh no no no telling when you play i have to go to new york ok lou i think it's one of the interesting things that's happened right now is that and i would tend to agree with you and particularly in looking at europe and in the construction of the welfare state which was very popular with people in europe after the war but as the financial

ization of the economy occurred you have this double whammy where the state can or cannot produce protect these people anymore and you see slashes in budgets and all that austerity doesn't create jobs at all that's a double whammy and that's another reason why the middle class at least in europe is being crushed and there's very little prospect of seeing them coming back. in fact a. note on a do not g.'s turned on extremist case of will first state is that it's not good it's not intrinsically good or bad so the problem is in many western countries the heights and always that we are who bad the with state so it is not investing in should share in some novelty cure and countries such as had earned you have a good way for a state that is investing in the future of children giving giving saying what all the genes a bitter education in in italy in their literature. in technologies in math and

in fact a good way for states is a way for theta which is investing to well future up so the problem in many western countries is that we are of welfare states of. fat cats we took which are not investing in the future of our children in order to to to have a better situation then to his use of frustrations of the middle class we have to invest that have been education and not simply need to cation mitch mars and we do ok again very interesting here because we actually look at who is going to house we had so little has done i mean our children we have to look who has the money and the fat cats as you say or the states and states seem to have not the money right now tony if i go back to you does it bother you does it bother you that the the very rich in the united states particularly have recovered completely from the crisis of two thousand and eight they're getting their bonuses their dividends vary and the economy is actually growing but the middle class is still being pulverized

i mean how do you feel about that because you know if you're really well off in the top one percent well you don't really worry about much of anything because you just outsource everything abroad. well i i don't accept the premise of your question and in the slightest i think that one of the greatnesses of the open markets is the opportunity to thrive and survive in my point to david earlier was that this idea that the job has to be handed to somebody whatever happened to the creation of the job what happened to the small business owner engaging a small business this goes back to the conversation about regulation which is a good conversation about how you grow an economy and make let's make it easier for people to open the business less paperwork more interaction with customers and that's a far better opportunity and let's not talk about the rising wage just being stolen by a by the by the owners that's not true rising wages help people all the way around though those companies and corporations. are the people who

create opportunity ok david go ahead because i haven't heard of an increase in wages for a long time with these are rising the part of the problem with the with the small business is it's part of the problem there's it's not regulation that's the you know yeah there's some regulation and so the problem is the customers aren't there people don't have the money now they've got so far in debt they're trying to get out of debt when people aren't buying small businesses suffer small businesses take the hit before the large businesses do so you've also got this peculiar perverse kind of new monopoly where the big companies the wal marts and so on are our cost cutting cost keeping prices down which is what people want but that means they keep pressure on their suppliers so that those wages stay down so that you've got this big problem when wages are down all over and the more unemployment the more downward pressure there is who's going to buy the stuff businesses private sector

won't invest because they don't see the customers there it's going to take the business private businesses will create jobs if demand is there if the. man is there they won't create jobs they'll speculate they'll put their money somewhere else it doesn't make sense for them to invest in the real economy it doesn't make sense in them to invest long term this is why you've got such gridlock in the political system frankly i don't think the conservatives or the liberals know what to do they don't have any solutions so let the wealthy do what they can and make as much as they can you know before i don't know before i don't know what's going to happen but it's not going to be good if i go to you i mean and i'd like to focus a little bit about the political implications of this is david was saying here i mean if we look in the united states we see not only gridlock but we see fragmentation here and we don't see really strong allegiances anymore that we would think we're middle class because we can have the occupy wall street movement we can have the tea party simultaneously ok and that's

a reflection of the inability of the republicans and the democrats to get out of this economic mess and i would throw in the cultural wars that are absolutely useless for the united states and not so much for western europe i mean how is this happening here because again we look at middle classes of having certain political identity that's changing as well and it may not be good it may be good i don't know yet in fact in many many countries of the west you are increasing frustrations of the middle classes over the last twenty years and both heights wing and the left wing so lucian's fades in front of economy clearly to see an endo fairly t. over thinking and thinking you know well middle class so there are problems high to know is that you of extreme frustrations the development of strong produced. over all you hope and maybe or so in the united states n.z. is frustration increasing vicious cycle of political end they could make

problems so high trying and lift. these are your two two he creates class and these international competition you we have quite an hour or so of political systems of the west all week and week and i guess that in the end that's why i say the least i could go back to that problem if i go to tony on this because the middle class in the united states has been crushed for thirty years it is damaging the democracy in the united states because people are not seeing that they're the the political process can address their needs because far away from the united states most people look at the republicans and democrats and say what in the world is the difference between the two the do what's the difference between mitt romney and barack obama i mean standing at a distance there is no difference. yeah but that's another conversation ok today right now there is a ground for i'm ok and i'm good i'm good lately up for that but your conversation

is really about is government the ones to make this decision and those the ones we're supposed to depend on if you create the situation where people are depending on government to solve their problems they will of course be dissatisfied because they can't work it could never ever happen government can't solve your problem what government could do is create more problems for you and that's what we're seeing that's why these elections coming up the twenty twelve elections presidential election senate elections are so incredibly important because it's a conversation of dependence vorse versus independence does government to do for you or are you to do for you that is by the way the entire tea party thesis you do for you you enable your life government doesn't control came to me and say we don't want to. run out of time here many thanks to my guest today in new york chicago and in los angeles and thanks to our viewers for watching us here r.t. see you next time and remember prospect.

chinese state media says the u.s. and nato countries support of syria's opposition is driving the nation into civil war party troubles to one violence wrecked the army and the rebels have clashed. decision time for greece it's creditors debate whether athens will sink or swim as the population rages against deep cuts made to secure the bailout. on the path toward london and washington warn israel against attacking iran's nuclear sites asking for time to let sanctions do their job our top stories this hour.

around the clock around the world this is. the u.s. and its allies are pushing syria into civil war by backing the armed opposition there says a chinese state newspaper regime joined moscow's efforts to bring about a political settlement in the crisis torn country with a top chinese diplomat recently visiting damascus amid reports of ongoing violence in the country artist marie financial has been to one of the syrian cities caught up in the conflict. by danny the particular matters northwest of damascus lebanon just over the border once and relaxed luxury mountain resort the town has recently been the scene of brutal clashes between assad's forces and anti-government groups there was a lull in the fighting and as we approach the city we're not sure who's in control

at the checkpoint they are happy to see a russian television crew as solid hint about who is in charge here russia is among the few countries still talking to assad and calling for others to have dialogue with the regime along with china it to be towed in the years security council's resolution and voted against another one at the general assembly which put pressure on assad to leave. this town nobili home to around twenty thousand people who looks abandoned the reminders of recent turbulence tell their own tale of what happened here on these walls you can see the story of the conflict how it was developing here in the city of there by danny initially there were some graffiti is here about president bashar al assad then when the armed groups operating in this area took control over this town new graffiti is a period of course and to government one of the army regain control of his adani they destroyed them or they tried to destroy them all at least but some still

remain. when we are in town we can hear sounds of shelling some turn a deaf ear to it all is fine shooting i don't know those who agreed to talk don't want to show their face. the army intervene and it's killing us they're shelling random houses searching arresting people there's f.s.a. an armored groups on the ground too few. but not everyone here says the situation in the same way was when armed people came here we asked the army to stand up for us now they are controlling the city at the dulles shop is an area where much of the fight in took place. i was away when i arrived the army told me there had been a big battle here says the army is now here there's no armed groups anymore no tensions of the daniel the clashes between security forces and the armed opposition groups here near the town of the dunny have been very severe how it all stopped the

locals tell us that their town has a unique story when the violence started the residents decided to intervene and there has allegedly been an agreement between the army and the opposition that both of them leave the town although the military officer we have been able to speak to didn't confirm that and we can still see. many military and machinery inside the city we had a look around and counted at least thirteen tanks but the military tell us they were only used as protection on the way back through the checkpoint an officer keep supporting everyone suspicious in this violence locked nation raif nationality seven danny syria. international politics professor hearing you're watching told me a little earlier that he thinks beijing wouldn't like to see events in libya repeated in syria. but simply wanting the possibility of these

three eventually becoming part of the. i mean there is a very interesting parallel between the syria situation and libya situation with the british army for example the libyan opposition it was a lot of rhetoric and. it's doing some kind of encouragement for the opposition not to accept any kind of political solution keep fighting and this call for a start. we've begun is very concerned obviously about. possibility of peaceful resolution of the syrian situation is undermined by any rhetoric and also this direction. it's the moment of truth for greece's eurozone finance ministers meet in brussels to decide its future they've said they're hopeful a deal will be agreed with the french finance minister insisting all the elements are in place but it stops counterpart called for the e.u. the european central bank and the international monetary fund to maintain

a permanent presence in greece in return for the bailout greece has already met all of its creditors previous demands the country's forced has forced a massive new austerity package to qualify for the one hundred thirty billion euros of rescue cash but there is now talk that funds could be paid into a specially set up account and says access to it would be restricted and if it misses its target the cash flow would stop the rage of the greek people however is only growing with every new political measure imposed as artie's jacob greaves reports. voting for more soviet dubbed by greece's caretaker prime minister as a moment of historic responsibility emotions some especially the greek population feel has been lost on euro zone leaders. feel disappointed and sad because these measures were imposed on actually foreigners and we didn't have a say in. to greek people that. there is a wise old greek proverb that

a person who borrows and borrows becomes a slave who he borrows from an uptick sickness after passing more unpopular cuts greek politicians are told that brussels amber lynn had perspire in the decision on another bailout that and questions over greece's place in the euro led the country's finance minister to talk they were toying with a nation's future this is by no means the first set of austerity measures to be imposed on greece but with a significant amount of coalition m.p.'s choosing to say no it does mark a shift in thinking among governing politicians. share the grievances of the public and offer them an alternative if the greek economy is not restart just if it doesn't go down the alley of development that eventually greece we at some point pull back. in that case what will happen is that all of the assets of this country will actually pass in the hands of the. all the funders in total forty three m.p.'s

in the ruling coalition chose to say no to more starer to that even among those in favor may remain hostile to the euro zone's message and how it's being delivered i think to such type of message is brussels of helping to european forces in greece. and all of us that the measures don't solve the problem they make it worse we need development we need development for the survival of the greek economy the growing fear among both the greek public and politicians appears to be that eurozone leaders aren't all that bothered about their well being there's more people as we say very live victims of this situation because it's rewarding greece cover way the way veritas last sunday's mass demonstrations and continuing uproar sent a message to those in athens and brussels that though voting through austerity may have been an historic my. meant as one of the likely to put the nation's problems to bed. meaning rather than be resigned to the past seas of anger are likely to be

part of greece's future. greece assy athens. when earlier i spoke to harlan green from popular economics dot com and he believes more austerity without a plan for reviving the economy is futile they're using the wrong vehicle for this all. basically have the rebuilding of greece and it should be the i.m.f. that is running the program out of the european behaves the i.m.f. thousand or so to redevelop the country reconstitute in greece's case they've lost productivity they've lost what we call economists call aggregate demand by just demanding austerity without a plan for recovery it's a plan for recovery that's missing that i haven't seen yet if you just call for hysteria the u.k. . kills it it kills the economy merkel's counterpart her sure you know the socialists that was voted out by her. instead of austerity they should

be giving them more aid to help them rebuild their economy i mean i've been everywhere in germany agrees with shortly what i believe is running the economy and that was holman green editor of popular economics dot com who believes the bailout will bring greece very little benefit. the west and britain of warning israel not to attack iran's nuclear facilities saying new sanctions need time to work to iran currently being being visited by un inspectors denies accusations it's developing atomic weapons but israel which also accuses taran of attacking its diplomats abroad could now be on an unstoppable path to a military strike as artie's are going to reports from tel aviv. israel's leaders are actively drumming up the military rhetoric. iran is the biggest terror exporter in the world the israeli government and its security forces will continue to act forcefully systematically and calmly against international terror region eating

from iran. a potential israeli rocket clash looks more likely than never there is speculation a preemptive strike against iran's nuclear sites could happen as early as spring or summer although that's not causing undue concern in israel i think possibly people you know they make their plans for a vacation you know pass or a vacation summer vacation possibly people are beginning to wonder well is there going to be a war is something going to mess it up or i think they're probably going ahead with it with sort of a thought we're back it would be nice if we could get a flight that we could cancel you know you know is that sort of thing israel has previous experience when it comes to putting an end to you kim vicious which pose a potential threat in one thousand nine hundred one is jets wiped out reactors in iraq they struck again in two thousand and seven hitting sites in syria but with iran's nuclear program things may not be so simple that if israel attacks iran it

will not stop iran forever from getting nuclear weapons the only postpone it for a relatively brief amount of time the. installations are too diverse and far flung to destroy a factor fully israel does not have us poor white house secretary adviser was in israel over the weekend warning against a move on iran saying it was better to wait for tougher sanctions to take effect in the coming months but mines may already be made up i think one of the things to create this aura of inevitability is to shut them up to shut up opposition at home and of course to convince the united states and europe that this is an inevitability it's going to happen. don't oppose it in fact why don't you help us out there is a question mark however over whether israel has what it takes to carry out the mission i doubt with the we have the capability. of creating damages to

the extent of the mediating the program and even if israel's military prowess will allow it to carry out a strike on underground facilities in iran chances are it won't end there as you know saddam hussein and bashar assad by the time they knew what was happening was over and could just you know grumble without adding to fight back do you imagine you run sitting still you know all day day after day day after the war is. back i think any any sane person realizes that there are almost guaranteed to be missiles falling on israel and considering iran one of the twentieth century's longest wars against iraq in the one nine hundred eighty s. the consequences could be far reaching and destructive. israel has been suffering some bad weather is of late but it's likely that even the strongest winds will blow the country's foreign policy off the course and when it comes to israel's forecast for iran this storm clouds seem to be growing every darker in tel aviv r.t.

. plenty more for you to check out at r.t. dot com that's our web site online all the time here's what's there right now background check the u.k. wants access to the private information of its citizens as part of an anti terror initiative law that could see people's emails texts and phone calls monitored. and high tech starting cannons on guard at russian ports the country's planning to buy the state of the art weapons to fight underwater terrorists all the details on that story for you at r.t. dot com. the u.s. presidential contender ron paul has warned that his country is slipping into a fascist system with the government ruled by big business speaking to supporters in kansas city the republican candidate said americans individual liberties were being stripped away let's not talk to wes benedict who is the president of the political action campaign which helps libertarian candidates running for office joining us in the states so is ron paul right. i think ron

paul is right and i think it's sad that america is moving away from freedom and liberty and towards fast his own in fact a libertarian candidate for president several years ago made a movie called america from freedom to fast as i'm outlining many of the different ways that we're moving in that direction it's a shame and what all of those different ways could you give us a tangible illustration in the way that american people are perhaps looking into this fascist state well sas is a means different things to different people and i think there's two categories that we have to worry about here one is the corporatism corporatism where big business and big government work together at the expense of it at the expense of freedom it's not what i would call true capitalism or a real free market rather than businesses working to improve themselves by developing new and better products or improving their efficiencies they hire

lobbyist and imagine with that competition each business gets better each group gets better because it performs better but rather than our best and brightest minds focusing on improving their own businesses now we're getting to a situation where is more profitable to hire lobbyists to get favors from the government and that may come in the form of handouts or corporate welfare or also lots of industries like to say like the oil industry would say we need subsidies or solar or wind energy would say you know we are clean energy so we should get subsidies in should penalize oil or petroleum based products that happens in all sorts of inner cities industries it happens at the local level. giant retailers getting favors and tax incentives that hurt small businesses that's the business side or the corporate fasces in that we're seeing more of an america. it's

a bad thing in it it results in a lot of corruption and i think you know that corruption is is one of the big reasons that other countries around the world have not done better than they have in the past but there are many of them are improving in china and india i think are improving their economies are growing meanwhile america has slowed down a we're moving in the wrong direction where there are echoes of the occupy wall street message. is in some ways he's trying to appeal to that movement and in day when support from them in this campaign absolutely the thing with the occupy wall street movement is they're right there are big corruption and the bankers and well connected people are stealing from average citizens. what i might agree and ron paul might agree with some of the solutions advocated by some of the occupy wall streeters i don't have faith in the government to solve these problems i think putting more power in the hay.