video on demand i'll tease mine it's. streets now in the palm of your. christian. good afternoon and welcome to capital account i'm more in the circle here in washington d.c. easier headlines for april tenth two thousand and twelve u.s. president barack obama makes a case in florida for the buffett rule a minimum tax rate for millionaires take a look. at warren buffett is paying a lower tax rate than his secretary. that's well. that's not. well then he reportedly heads to a fifteen thousand dollars a head campaign fundraiser so how does how work exactly that presumably wealthy people paying fifteen grand for

a dinner with obama are giving him money for him to raise their taxes what are they thinking for them both talk about how the political process really works when it comes to the money being thrown around and here to do it. just right. now i have to call you brown mr president. on that because you know jack movie version of his story in real life former super lobbyist jack aber mob he pleaded guilty to lobbying related crime did the time now he's exposing the secrets of how special interests get their way in washington will get an inside look also look at how to be a crook. instead of just printing money and buying stuff where did you print money and learn it to other people. it's that simple we'll talk about it let's get to today's capital account.

so when it comes to lobbying and special interests in washington we talk a lot about wall street and the financial sector and their purported influence and of course one of the facts to support that is the lobbying dollars they spend so the finance along with real estate and insurance sector ranks third in the amount of lobbying dollars spent over the last thirteen years and more than four point eight billion dollars you can see there that's after health and miscellaneous business now one might deduce that it's paying off because look at how much more banks are spending is one example of this is commercial banks and they spent sixty million dollars in two thousand and eleven it's been going up now the biggest spenders for two thousand and eleven the american bankers association and a lot of names you know wells fargo j.p. morgan citigroup also on that list up there is bank of america and take

a look at hedge funds they've really increased their spending a lot too and also private equity which is obviously attracting new heat these days if we could do that or do you see it there with mitt romney is the republican front runner and his bain background getting a lot of attention so remains to be seen what that number will look like perdue thousand and twelve now the biggie for finance recently post financial crisis seems to really have been dogged frank regulation and more recently the volcker rule portion of it which we've been talking a lot about now we see the facts and figures but how exactly do special interests influence washington how does it work well we're lucky because today we have an insider here to tell us our guest was the republican super lobbyist kevin spacey played him in the movie version because you know jack we played a bit of he was convicted on charges of fraud corruption and conspiracy related to his illegal lobbying efforts back in two thousand and six he did the time he was

released in two thousand and ten and has been speaking out against lobbying since then we're going to reform the system jack avram office here he's former lobbyist as i said also author of kept. punishment the hard truth about washington corruption from america's most notorious lobbyist so thank you so much for being on the show purpose for having me and i think our viewers are going to be really excited to hear how this all really works from someone who's experienced first hand so you have called god being legalized bribery i've heard you say that a number of times in what ways are these methods the legal methods used to lobby special interests because well i should note that not all lobbying is bribery and not all lobbying is bad in the bar room lobbying is guaranteed by our constitution to position our government we're only sorry and then fair enough. money comes into play there were no abuse to use resources and money in their clients to use it to tilt the playing field that's where the bribery comes in and that's where the corruption comes in and that greatly you look at some of the

successful sectors we're going to talk about the banking sector and others like that are labor unions that's where the money comes from the point of the campaigns and how they deal with congressman things like that and that's a corruption will give me an example of of what you would consider legalized bribery well any time but i didn't hope this way by the way when i was a lobbyist obviously i have a different view of the matter put any yes yes what i've ever been like a two by four to the head to get your attention as it was with me but basically any time somebody who's trying to get something back from the federal government gives something donation a meal ticket to a ballgame to a public servant with the intent of getting that public servant to do something for them it's a great if we did that with a judge everybody would get it immediately it's a bribe these people basically in our system are judges that are making judgments on behalf of the american people and giving them things or raising money for them that that's right pulled out the interesting part of it talk about the raising money that lobbyists do for politicians and what i thought was interesting that i

heard you say was it's the politicians expect that if they're going to do something in the cases that you get yeah i think that you know the lobbyists the way the obvious can say that the most is by raising money these these folks can look at they can grow. the reason is certainly the senate races they cost tens of millions of dollars they have to spend their time raising money all of the time the people who have the incentive to get their money are people who want something back from them until we get to a system where all of those people are excluded we're going to have a corrupt system and that unfortunately is what we have in congress understands the game and they understand that somebody gives the money that they have to at least be attentive to their needs numbers to really do everything they want but being attentive bad is where the corruption actually enters the process how much money i'm just you know what is the figure that's a significant enough bigger to where someone is going to feel responsible to do something or a lobby well i hold by the way that any amount gets them going because if you're a normal human being somebody does something for you something nice for you buys you something gives you something in town that leads you're going to feel gratitude

you may be a jerk and don't feel gratitude but it's unlikely that somebody like that is going to want to go on and probably kiss him well maybe some of this is only going to go . to the public and they're going to feel gratitude in the moment that gratitude enters the process it's not a question of how much frankly ten dollars does it anything that's good starts the process and that's why we have to cut off all money from lobbyists their clients to support with officials at ten dollars was good enough by when some of these may be people that are trying to reform the banking system be more successful than they j.p. morgan's a number of that are spending a lot of money well i mean of course not exactly i mean the people who are spending a lot of money are getting all the more it's not the ten dollars everybody's equal can give ten dollars ten dollars or ten million dollars i guess what i'm saying is once the process starts once the gratitude starts there's a problem and that's something that we don't want in our public servants and unfortunately something we see virtually entirely through the the whole system i mean i'm with you there i want to talk some specifics because you've been writing recently about one of your clients that was tyco in the past and how you convince

members of congress not to impose a retroactive tax on inverted companies so these are companies that reincorporate overseas usually it's to avoid paying u.s. corporate taxes or a tax haven. and moving money overseas is something we hear a lot about with corporations so how did you go about doing now let's attack their tyco came to be they were basically far down the road to being in trouble and the senate had already put them into their bill the house was about to do it and they've been failed by other lobbying firms and the tack i took was that i organize the company psychosis is basic conglomerate about three hundred fifty companies and so all the vendors all the companies the hands of all these vendors and organize them to call the senators and congressman so as to say to them listen we're your donors were your friends were your neighbors what are you doing you're killing the goose that laid the golden basically you're interfering in business in a way that's unfair they actually were proposing to put a retroactive tax so the tune of about four point eight billion dollars on psycho

it would have wiped them out and basically wiped out all these vendors as well so i don't lobby it now i used to be hard to get out of this is ok that's it but that's an example of a common tactic to rally the troops to oppose it yes i think we've seen more and more of the last decade that lobbyists realize they can't just do everything inside the beltway they have to go outside the way they've got to go in the districts in the states and this is one of the dangers by the way with the decision since as you noted super pacs that lobbyists can marshal unlimited funds that they are good at what they do and have dramatic impact in some of the races out there and that's something we certainly didn't something we see a lot of that you think that's going on now it is worse than when you were a lobbyist and i don't know if it was worth it was pretty there was a lot of is there was pretty bad but what we did that i think basically our attitude was we were going to do everything we can to win and that meant that we're going to play harder we're going to have more resources together we're going to send more contributions than anybody else and we in fact not only lost one time

over ten years and that's because of the amount of resources i had the tilt of the playing field in a way that frankly made it impossible for people to compete against us ok let's talk about banking and that's obviously a sector that spent a lot of money and we've seen a drain bank continue to get what they want it's. regulation is far is that in backing the bills the taxes the rules i mean far beyond the bailouts that we saw in two thousand and eight so i want to talk a little bit about that you actually brought up in one of your recent pieces you talked about what the top lobbyist really the american bankers association executive v.p. was talking about launching a fight against obama's proposed increase to the bank tax you point out that the banks have been successful in lobbying against taxes like this it's not just the bailout money in two thousand a way that they've been successful in kind of having a say in he said they were going to deploy some grassroots pressure that's known as astroturf and you said come on i don't buy that is working what how do you think the banks are affected well and lobbying and getting their way but i think one of the things i had i took issue with what he did was that he's he's announcing what

he's doing in advance and there's a there's a certain arrogance there frankly that we're going to deploy the grassroots that sort of undercuts the whole notion that it's actual grassroots that. the parents should go on what has been going on in washington for years they have put hypocritical bans actually voted bettles into action but interesting do you think that that shows a bit lobbyist feel they can get away with anything they don't even have to to kind of give the p.r. to make it sound like they're not trying to tactic i think that's definitely the case certainly in this case and i think we've pointed out there are others to love you still all powerful lobbyists such as i was really get almost everything they want because you know personally you have a team of people you know the system you have experts on your staff as i did who know every intricate detail of people you're up against they don't know what's going on they don't know the timing they don't have the inside information that you do in terms of what congress is doing you're giving the money they're not you're

taking you know it's a play golf they're not you're traveling for them they're not you're dealing with men's advantage over the common people and anyone who's frankly doesn't have the resources you do so then i kind of got us off track because of the tangent on his comments. how do you think the banking sector gets their interest in dance but i think the banking sector to the agree that anything proposes a tax increase they have a built in advantage in the sense the republicans are just not in favor of tax increases and they don't favor closing loopholes alist the marginal rate comes down so anything that's proposed that can be fashioned is the tax increase there's an immense advantage going in and we saw that also by the way in terms of what was going on with the oil companies the energy companies but the so-called subsidy that was that he did a few weeks ago all they needed to do was really say this is a tax increase so that's number one and number two you told me about lobbyists that come to capitol hill they are often times members who were on those committees they not only know every intricate detail they know all the players are going to have

all the decisions so they know exactly how to say what they have to say to them to keep the status quo in place and i think that's been immensely effective net industry and by the way many industries that it's to find somebody who knows the game knows the players and knows how to work the process then add to it a little shake a little money in there and you have a you have a wonderful lobbying to take when we get back i want to talk more about that revolving door we have some good examples i want to ask you also about the revolving door from washington not kick a street bike to wall street so we will have more we can offer and former lobbyists in a moment still ahead we will have more with mr abrams i want to find out if they made money has bought junk or is the free and easy experience now if it goes that far at first or close the market and there's.

a need but i was like nine years old and this is you know the truth. i confess i am a total ghetto friends that i love driving hip hop music and pretty. much it was kind of the jester. i'm very proud of the role without she has played. the game. you know sometimes you see a story in the scene so you think you understand it and then you glimpse something else and you hear or see some other part of it and realize that everything is ok. i'm charging welcome to the big picture.

what drives the world the fear mongering used by politicians who makes decisions. who can you trust no one who is imbue it with a global missionary zeal where we had a state controlled capitalism is called sessions when nobody dares to ask why we do our t. question more. welcome back we're talking to jack every month former super lobbyist about the influence that wall street and a financial sector has on the political process so let's talk about the revolving door because we started before the break now the center for responsive politics

reports thirteen hundred ninety former government workers employees work as lobbyist for the financial sector now that was at the end of two thousand and ten now here are some examples so you have former congressman michael oxley former chairman of the financial services committee now is a lobbyist some of his firms clients include now dac thomson reuters trent lott the former senate majority leader lobbying firm clients include citi group goldman sachs g.e. greatly on another example of you richard gephardt house majority leader formerly now the firm that he works for clients include boeing goldman sachs g.e. so jack avram up when you have these guys as you kind of started to get into before the great going from washington to lobby for the financial services sector what exactly does that tie these companies what do they get with that it's the it's the connections here the connections the access but it's also the expertise of their people of the men simple as the gentleman that you put up on the screen are

obviously incredibly powerful but there are only three among the many that you mentioned but to me it's not just again this sector this is happening in every sector revolving door spin so quickly in washington there's really nowhere you can go to watch it people don't break out of the congress and jump right into the lobbying world the influence world they often know cold themselves lobbyist by the way as we saw with newt gingrich calling himself a history professor i think that there's some focus now you mean american legal all the as the starting to focus on what is the definition of a well it is we have to basically start looking at that because people are sneaking into the lobbying industry lobbying the way and then just sneaking under the under the radar and we don't american american people don't actually get to see it he said strategic adviser is one that is kind of a code name and you call for ending the revolving door that correct how do i do you know how to. and some of the other reform groups are trying to come up with a porno that would survive constitutionally i'm not sure a lifetime ban which is what i have a kid would work but certainly at least a decade ban if you are somebody on capitol hill you should not be able to talk

about congress and the in the senate and their staff and probably apply to the administration as well you should be able to go through the door and benefit from the influence industry by influencing people and i think that it's a very dangerous thing for the republican well you mentioned a staffer and i want to talk about that if you talk about how you used to hire them and you're going to advance the rights of that then they feel like they're also working for you when they're still working for these members and i mean it just an example that stuck out to me you have the chair of the senate banking committee who brought on as his staff director a former lobbyist for the american bankers association j.p. morgan and freddie mac. so what is the influence of the staffers well i think the staffers when they come off the hill or actually more effective than members i would actually try never to hire members because they were kind of lazy and they were sort of self-important and felt entitled staffers were real raisers and killers they could get things done they knew exactly where the trains were flying to and what the how to put things on them and unfortunately the members are generally a little less active let's just say so i would only go to staffers but the other

side of the revolving door going from industry back to capitol hill or into the administration personally frankly i think it's fine if they want to see several things one that they don't have any big pat parting package financial package will see them get several million dollars as a little gift on the way out there they don't have that and it was you know they can't go back once they make it into the ministration that's it now they have to find some place else to work if that were to happen frankly i don't think we'd see any of them doing it but then your reasoning with the staffers and hiring them early was they felt that they're working for you so if you're in the administration and you know it when you're done goldman sachs is going to hire you again are you doing their bidding when you're working for these and i certainly absolutely i mean they have so-called protections to keep people sequestered from certain issues but the truth is they. they all want to influence in some way there's some even if it's not illegal by the way and one of the problems in washington is that the laws are drawn in a way that you can be completely contemptuous within the law you can be completely corrupt and not get near or going over the line and so unfortunately we see these

people who get into the administration the homes of capitol hill or they're getting ready to come back off capitol hill and they are indeed working on behalf of the interest they are officially going to benefit probe and i want to know how long those lines talk about some of the washington to wall street revolving door movements there are so many and we talk about them all the time on this show but just to give our audience a few you have phil gramm with the chairman of the fed of banking committee he was an outspoken champion of deregulation ok he played a role and pushing and writing the repeal of glass steagall also inserted a provision into the commodities futures modernization act that exempted over the counter derivatives from regulation we all know who the how that wound up he went on to join u.b.s. and the vice chairman another example would be peter or is that he left office of management budget to work with the vice chairman or study group robert rubin former treasury secretary joined citi group he was chairman of the executive committee of citigroup board of course before he was treasury secretary he was

a top trader and exact at goldman sachs so before you say you don't really disagree with this is this ok well i think it depends what they do if they're coming out in their would they have expertise by the way is program i think does he was take an economics professor maybe ruben as well if they have expertise in financial markets and they're working in the areas that are related to their influence where they're not going to be spending time using their past connections or trying to help shape the strategies of government affairs for these companies i don't have a problem with it but most of the do nothing though i think most of them are very involved in the government affairs strategies because they know it better than anybody here in the government affairs department how could they know that's why they're desirable to a firm like that out of sort of old and sac right yes but i think they have to be i don't have a problem with somebody going and working for goldman sachs if they want to work in the. financial sector but the minute they are back in the government sector that's where we have a problem and i think that they are going to make bad they have to be barred from having any influence at all on any contact at all there has to be an absolute wall

set up so they can't be involved in government appears yeah i don't know how that would be possible banking really good at finding loopholes as we've seen with the volcker rule that they've lobbied so many loopholes that i want to ask you one of when i was doing this research and this is something that's come up time and time again on the show is the amount of money goldman sachs employees have spent on contributions and the number one guy ok nine hundred sixteen thousand dollars over the years eight puts them in one of the top spots we know with m.f. global his firm imploded and he seemingly still customer money was the c.e.o. of that firm i have not seen him and yet do you think there's a case to be made that spending that kind of money in politics can get you a get out of jail free that no i think that unless the administration space is going to be the decision of the administration. the people of the just sort of those who work on my case that the trial attorney and law and level are very honest generally and they're going to look for the facts and look for the evidence and try to act in that way however the political decisions that are made at these sort of

top of the just apartment sometimes you find say in a republican administration that they're going to really go after a republican and kind of had a little bit of that myself you know with the with the bush administration or they make the open decision because when the ministration was famous for not going after their people what the a coma ministration will do we just don't know i can't imagine for a minute that nobody at the just part is looking into this even if it's at a very low level i can imagine also that somehow former governor corazon is that in the clear i think they're probably going to need to go through all these things that a crime is committed they're going to bury its ups and ignoring but i think the pressure from the republicans would be immense and i think the administration doesn't need that had it so if they do see something there i would unfortunately for senator course i expect to see some trouble ahead. i appreciate your being here i wish i had more time with you there's so much to get to maybe for another day that was jackie vermont author and former lobbyist.

live . all right let's wrap it up with loose change i've got to train shanna to talk about a few. loose points so have you ever had an interest in being a crack well we have good news for you there is a you tube clip detailing how to do just that unfortunately the video also details how you're being rod every day let's see if you notice any similarity. they will all be reduced to recover slaves for you to do with as you please you said this to make a little remarkable sociopath a bastard. so there the narrator was referring to bank loans so if you want to be the super across the world some money someone unfortunately

already been to it the way that you need three the banker the sadistic not the michael bastard banker the federal reserve on top of the game right but the banks also create loans out of thin air they create money out of nothing i made a loan to keep all fractional reserve lending right but they didn't and that was ok they don't have reserves there's nothing well they do have reserves but they really don't actually because there's no reserves in the system there's a matter right because they won't tell you the loans that make are become the reserve there's no capital the system is just create loans and they lend it to us so there's no way they need to fall and they go home and that's pretty much the system that's what the itself it destroys the middle class and all you have depriving is these all of the arcs sitting on top of this. system where everyone is working for nothing and the whole system just collapsed and you have these robber hoods on the jungle and in the forests shooting people with arrows and gangs it's like that that's the world we're heading into that's what hunger games is all about people should watch. these very dark what are you in advertising promoting them there let me go i want to go to our own another dad ok with this base shuttle

program ending last year nathen he added a new way to get astronauts into space and terser richard branson and virgin galactic. we have a great relationship with nasa i think the stars are ready please step nasa to see you know like good studies trouble will continue. to go over the next five or six years while they get to build the new vehicles we'll move over branson because shift in policy could open up space to ownership by private companies a space policy consultant is shopping around a bill in the capital allowing property rights for private companies who seek to develop space resources and infrastructure because the one nine hundred sixty seven outer space treaty prohibits sovereign nations from owning a less chilled body that has been signed by one hundred countries including the us but there is a loophole in the tree which is not explicitly prohibit ownership of space resources by private enterprises of course the us is taking imperial mission to the

outer space saying hey we can make this private property for you at powerful and listen i think and well right so i mean i think the key here is is can we have a small businessman in the space that should be the key the entrepreneur to be out there and trying to mine some moon rock feels like that because you don't i'm pretty sure the barriers to entry are really high on getting your hands on. training to be an astronaut and everything that entails and so sure that. would be the whole point of entrepreneur. capitalism is you want to drop those birds and those young entrepreneurs that are now in silicon valley want to get them in the space ships and space suits and offer the space mining some space rocks and make some stuff happen in space that's what i'd like to see. i don't know what happens when the aliens come and dispute your property rights janet. i'm not sure about that it's a p.r. campaign in order to get someone to go and be entrepreneurial in your anus is going

to be high. ok well good thing that they are out of time so we can hear dimitris respond that's all we have time part of how they pray during the end don't forget to follow me on twitter out or unless they're going to be back on the show that you can dot com flash capital account thanks for watching and have a great night. wealthy british soil. the time to explain the. markets why not. why not what's really happening to the global economy with my stronger for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines tune in to cause report.