this is all taken care of now the main stories we're covering for you today a surge of anti islam sentiment in the u.k. inspired by norway's mass killer on this graphic peter faris similar attacks could take place in britain. crackdowns on pro-democracy demonstrators in bahrain and the back of condemnation from western governments questions over this selective approach to the arab spring revolts. kofi annan the warns of violence in syria continuing to spawn a cease fire stressing an urgent need for the expansion of the u.n. mission there. he said half an hour's time but now the second edition of june the sun has exclusive new show here on the day he plays to two guests with very

different viewpoints. editor of wiki leaks expose the world secrets these documents the united states government being attacked by the united states strongly condemn. illegally shoot five hundred days now being detained without charge but that hasn't stopped us. today on a quest for revolutionary ideas that can change the world tomorrow. today i am joined by into a cool superstar the slovenian philosopher. a former anti communist dissident

now turned so described communist together we call david horowitz a former left wing radical black panther ally now a fiery right wing zionist i want to know what they think about the future of europe and the united states the conversation becomes heated you get has to be physically restrained we shout rant and talk calmly about nothing and palestinians black panthers and israelis about a bomb or romney and stalin. david you describe yourself as a conservative and you describe yourself as a communist but nonetheless both of you have had a picture of stalin. spasms god is going to make free money don't mess. him in a minute and shout about it out. yeah right. can't talk to

an international shop. all right go ahead david can you tell me what do you mean by conservative and why do you have a picture of stalin well the picture of stalin that was on my obvious well list is death and i'm a conservative because the leftists utopians have no idea what human nature is. and therefore when they get the power they are faced with a big problem which is that people don't go along with their program and so they kill them and put them in gulags. and. the problem with the utopian idea is the idea. of a fenced white styling. me to remind me and kid maybe it's something marginal level even

a good based i think body mind me of this but he thinks they dread of of i become politically expedient and you know me i don't know what to make of what's law is saying when he says that salad is there to remind him of the dangers of totalitarian it of the totalitarian strain on the left or the dangers of. that utopian ideas can lead to because he supports all a totalitarian movements in the world that i can see. you're a supporter of. the closest thing we have to nap season which was a utopian idea in the middle east you know you support the palestinians i don't see anything to distinguish the palestinians who want to kill the jews from the net seethen did you ever visit the west bank. if you don't get the same sort of who is reading it right now we're going to say is that i know that everything i do is

friend i said and i can tell you what i. am not saying i must emphasize these i find it tasteless they say yes oh but not the threat of going to some now doing to palestinians this is state's place but saudi police are out of there screwed up yes they're all screwed by hamas no you know who might be you know not going to saudi arabia i guess that's the way we go way is that i let you know i'm going to ask you not to fight and so on is that i leap only see open the space for hamas to influence them second going to blame the jews for a mosque great oh my god you see this is what i don't like oh i oh my god i don't ever say i blame the truth i'm a good actor you know i don't know what i want to know how serious he just might be look at the situation of we mean now doc who believes in the sound of a sudden i'm going to lose responsible for this united states that is the party

says that vengeance in this the left in the democratic party united states that went to war for saddam and against george bush when he went into iraq we should have settled their hands we should not have you know we should have occupied them for things that they have in this is am not going to run credit which i should have this is not going to syria and that we should have stuck it to iran but bush came under such a talent. from the from the democrat there's never been such as seditious movement by a major american party they all supported the war not all of them but the leadership supported them or they voted in their majority in the senate but the or and then they turned against it and they lied saying that bush lied bush couldn't have lied . about the intelligence because kerry and rockefeller and feinstein all the democrats sat on the intelligence committees they had their intelligence then

julian in in the work that we do the work that wiki leaks does we are. pushing forward the boundaries of a certain type of liberty that is we say protected by the first amendment that is the liberty to to reveal the truth about the world to protect the story to record for me to ference and so on i saw this incredible poster that the u.s. army produced which is a poster of jefferson. with a big statue of jefferson saying the cost of liberty is a turn obedience that is the price of liberty and it had giant interception systems people with guns and cars god and people looking out over the sea with with spike losses they had interpreted jefferson's statement which was that to stop a strong state we must be eternally vigilant into we must have

a strong state an aggressive state a surveillance state in order we i think i think it's regrettable that the state is so big that then our defense has to be so big i chaps aleut lee we're going to bow but it's a reality and you know what i'd like to go back to the thing about liberty and equality. of course if people are under equal if people had an equal talents an equal intelligence. the only way to make them equal is to take away liberty that's the only way you can do it there's no other way so of course there's an inherent conflict between the liberty listening to quite a look at an idea at least get in context what you think i am not for. freedom everything should be made by batik but i think. i'm not doing these all i'm saying when the

way. the great power of structure a set of the level of she pocket is east and he then selectively when simply house to put it of course we have only a scholar to do that asked the state power in the sense of saudi we have to do sort of thing discreetly bet that you don't know about pete and i have be we have to play this game i'm not that stupid but when obviously this that i asked east coast thinks like we can east can play a very post even though i don't see any they would also laugh if i disagree if the revolution got to be ready if we had a new revolutionary government yeah i mean you revolutionary government and wiki leaks managed to get hold of all this going got that government and we were going to publish it i mean i'm sure your question what i would i would i do it would be good to me i cannot that if you spend joke yet you know what it's still difficult

for me to answer this question now when i will be part of this evolutionary government i will send you my own sort of figure who like selling say better yeah. yeah i've also heard ideas it's got to be ordered liberty it can't be but everybody just thought of that in some sense a video on the front front of guantanamo bay the slogan is on a pound to defend freedom in iraq there is a prison camp camp liberty. these to me seem to be abuses of the word freedom and i want to know from you do you really think this is a tremendous state that is growing up in the united states is that entirely necessary to combat the rival risk competition the united states has from china from europe or or is this now

a self-feeding system it's you know there's the people are the problem people are the problem they're greedy they lie they're deceitful they manipulate up they you know they're egocentric we understand that and people in government i just the same dangerous people with more power so that's why we have the checks and balances and i'm i'm all for you know morse group me and this and that however. we live in a context the united states and israel are under attack from the international left which is very powerful for marlys dictators in south america that some boy seems to get along with. from the islam of fascists. and we live in an age when they have nuclear weapons and chemical and biological i think there's going to be and i could cast a few that will towards everything that happened in the twentieth century in the

twenty first because of this don't use don't you see the the creation of an enormous secretive bureaucracy doing each other favors involved in rotating door contracts think that don't you say that that perhaps can be similar to what occurred in the soviet union and we need a strong soviet union me if we eliminate competition but the fact is that look you got a leftist in the white house the guy who was brought up and trained by communists whose whole political career was in the communist left you have competition you know you can't have what you think of this monolith and you know the secret that controls everything you have if you prefer to think of it as many mafias and they're all at each other's throats and that's what keeps us somewhat safe. jay briefly you know first let me state something without any america needs i will

admit it's countries like like like russia. shut down the opposition i know asked against their own and i know whom you mean and i think isn't this the guy whom when he made the bush said you know the man better i look into putin's eyes and i knew i can trust that the guy but he's just that would know what i'm saying is that look look stupid things that bush so yeah i mean i thought it was a good idea yeah ok let me go on so listen i'm unfortunately you know you didn't say listen you eat calm you nice you know that. like to blurt out. the through a position to them democracy you must know these governors like to call everyone who opposes them fascist if you did a mob this democratic all fascist scum that evolution what i am afraid is that you use the word common use in the slightly similar way who advocate a little bit of critical automatic and condemn i think establishment he's

a common extent of call you by name calling on these they are only not referring you know everybody to barack obama yet was involved meaning don't want to send that he was not going to then you have no idea of barack obama's background who he actually is if you say that because this is not just about my own well i don't care about saying you guys challenge background was. just boy and hoot boy and i have some of them as we both know let me go briefly on but don't you think that nonetheless i think and deceased and you join you in a subtle if not this is a good thing but don't you think that nonetheless for me the great satan get over the bush presidency was that we've he's known i wouldn't use the word of aggressive sometimes you need not intelligent politics that he he that he's out of he's dk was that the united states effectively. com came

close to losing the position of unified as the. under bush you're not that states lost effectively control over latin america and so on and so on and i think and this is not i don't say to some lefties gee finally we got united states but i think we are entering even templer going to do a very dangerous. weather all these dreams diplomatic up is somehow a game controller for me over and again i'm not saying this to be any you know what i mean of these things yeah you said dangerous what did i get it and why this will unite us not is war bad listen let's face it and many lefties three let us be off your scent that is him or whatever other european welfare state deem marked then. if you'll permit me this utopian love mark then i think even united states

during most and this may be the unique period in human history after one of my own who went for a statement of so many people in such safety. three daum and so on don't make so much fun of fuel again i think it's funny as he always was a disastrous period europe europe is a cultural theme park it's significant that's what happened that's what your welfare state that just took you out of the pot i have had personally i have personal experience with a socialist dream paradise of sweden and i can tell you it is nothing like you have a tithing but it wasn't twenty five they have to go by stealing from these something has broken down this week the swedes have no morals david striving for if you talk of the striving towards a better position even if even if that position is liberty it is more liberty that

is the striving a direction that people wish to have that they can measure contemporary events by the direction of their hopes and ideals have we now abandon that true religion because religion is there waiting in the gap to just say to seize utopian vision that people can't live with the sense most people can't live with the sense that their lives are meaningless that they just you know born and die and are forgotten . so if you're a religious person then there's a divinity is going to make sorted out in the afterlife there redemption in the next life if you're not religious you want a redemption in this life that's what the left is about it is a religious movement and it's not an accident that all things is these utopianism whether it's communism or fascism or announces already but i am or what or liberalism. it was for you would talk the people have to want to make things

better as you would be may take a lot of in addition to make a modest change so you know i'm trying to think of of one that would fit what you want to do when you want to do what you do is a radical means that can have very destructive consequences as that of most managers when you have to get you know when you can keep it and call call it but when you can for example keep that in court of course you don't say oh let's try to be friendly be debt not see guy dad do it from all this flee you have got a momentum i know that's the be i get asked if i hope we're here i hope we agree at least and both all of that you talk b.s. that for me that's why my point he's in the same mode this month i see as you see all of the riyadh approaching but then sort of catastrophic and oh i'm saying we should fully consciously confront this catastrophe no easy utopian think

companies only need that iommi so i let me try to tie up these discussions and you are just going to have a second if that is not equal at the end maybe that is your man he still needs the time you need he's a communist you know and i was going to say what is the natural war is the natural condition of mankind has always been war it's right somebody from the beginning ok and many of them peace occurs only when there's a concert of powers or a single power that can intimidate would be aggressors now i ask you who would you like that power to be other than the united states. i don't know but you know i think it's no longer even the candidates for me and united states get well that's right that's why we're facing such catastrophe but you're contributing it by encouraging leftists isn't the way to keep the state accountable is to have a free market in states i mean different political options different political ok

and then people who don't like the conditions in one state can move to another state they can move their businesses they can move their assets they can do that then leaves the united states is not equipped to do as as we showed in iraq we can't we can't even occupy a country we can we can barely conduct a four day war that was a six week one and when. america is it's a country where people are so there's so much opportunity people are so busy having fun. i don't want to go to war americans don't want to go to war and i think america has to be lied into war no actually it was tony blair that that united states is crippled. in part because it's commander in chief that is a leftist here i expect what he said and he had yes if united states have a set of attacks and so on to go out of i'm sorry to inform you it is because of people like obama who can succeed that four days into obama's administration he or

theorize these drone strike in pakistan who do you think about really is what when he came into office and actually when he was running he knew that his weak flank was the military so he picked pakistan. he has killed more civilians and the left much and get away with it because the left because the left is a religious force it has nothing to do with principle the left doesn't care about. asians being you know killed by drones you know those because what does he want what does he want to do on the streets protesting what obama schooling in pakistan and afghanistan you know beyond you know i don't have any respect for leftists anymore because i don't think their principal. has any way out of the financial we have both going to cause the want of some drama you want to cut it because they want to mean as a social unit could because they want to vomit because you think he's

a communist leftist i could think of a lot of obama because quite on the contrary i think that he's not keep it close at the left he's not he pretends to be a leftist he's not that's the point i know what you're talking about slob like you know him and i'd listen no talent gallery i mean even when obama is doing but then just because they're a leftist even lefties out of your own class that lefties friend i thought ecologies not my friend i don't buy this democratic left of you know the good guys through democracy blah blah blah all i'm saying is that the problem we've gave and i use to come in the sim is steve here with us. i'm afraid what happens oh you don't find this so you know it isn't the problem yet the problems are going to be here forever you have a you know that the problems and problems actually that's a good about this think you ok let's yeah let's let's homeless gentlemen gentlemen

that we saying we have a lot of ground we have a lot of ground point we have a lot of ground zero we have to fanatics and that i think through this amazing that he has got to get out of this i think that i'm going to have a lot of ground to cover and i do want to go over it ok so. david you were in the black panther and you stayed in the black panthers post well you know that was never a member i raised money for you help them you were you were involved in that activity and you supported them yes. you made those bankers who can't keep that now if i use the metaphor. and you brought in a bookkeeper from then ramparts magazine which you which you were editing. but even paper and i just want to draw your attention so a letter that was sent to you. in my mind you were the person responsible

for baby step sending her in to order the panthers books at this particular time was tense about to dressing her in a clue klux klan white sheet and sending her home to took you know this isn't this isn't that i mean that just slanderous letter by a bitter guy. you know who actually was involved with the panthers before i was it never said anything. the left will defend the cause and will sacrifice any individual in this case it was me. david do you think this this tragedy i mean you're involved in a murder i mean a murder was around you this is. something of great personally importance to you and it must have affected your your outlook on the world but do you think that you this open your eyes to the reality or rather it khaled your perception i i was very aware of that so then he was killed in our body was discovered in february one

nine hundred seventy five. i mean i didn't do anything politically after that for the next. nine years. i voted for reagan in one thousand nine hundred eighty four and that's when i emerged as a conservative of course i came under tremendous attack from the left but i hadn't said anything. was going to say i haven't said anything negative hadn't done any political activity attacking the left in all those nine years because i was very aware that i was. you know i felt i had been betrayed by the movement i felt guilty. when i had supported. so i waited till i was relatively cool and you know it's in your character to. if

you're passionate or not but that david is that you started writing biographies after that believe on cadence that into rockefeller's now the big american family right i mean when you started writing all those biographies did you interview members of those well connected families yes you moved into a new sort of orbit as a result of your bonnet and. i really had remained pretty much the same all my life i didn't move into ending the war but i mean i did i did i had to i lost every friend that i ever had as as a leftist and that was at midlife. so i had a reconstituted my friendships and i think that's a big factor that keeps people in the left is that they know that if they cross the line they're going to lose it well their friends.

i mean what yeah just. ok ok all right sorry about that no problem i am for about he's been weak human face but you will be allowed to do. you know because it is you know that you know he put down activism or what you do at all i have to go to universities with bodyguards because of the fascist left in this country i have assassination threats a lot of i'm the only guy in d.c. now that i was physically assault that by i think got to be a community and by can you need some kind of announcement at least so i might come out and not getting like you who will you be voting for in the upcoming election where we don't have a candidate yet well i mean amongst the cat amongst the candidates oh i think romney has the best chance to beat this guy it's a big debate about yeah i'm not i'm not happy with anybody. i you could hear me

it's very tragic and really maybe even back to the long term for the vitality of the night that states that it probably couldn't it looks to me like these simply wasn't able to produce a candidate which would have enough growing force and it's very sad i don't look happy about i agree it's too bad but thank you david horowitz sunday night is that he's not going to want to spend the commune east he's a socialist with a few months a stop because no way scott i don't think he said so sometimes you don't think the noblest fount of his knighthood frocks growing up that you. ok thank you never. write. ok if you know but you know you have to do a little bit of study in the sport of the sports madness.

six. playing be a staple you on the plane unions to save you could not fly you out of something you know so i think it's time to raise the stakes. wealthy british style sun it's time to. go. to high growth. markets. scandal find out what's really happening to the global economy for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines just to name two kinds of reports on our team.