pm safe here. time julian assange. it is true when he makes expose the world secrets these documents belong the united states government being attacked by the powerful united states strongly condemn the said quote after quote people illegally shoot five hundred days now i being detained without charge but that hasn't stopped

us. today we are on a quest for revolutionary ideas that can change the world tomorrow. from humble origins my next guest imran khan became a household name as captain of pakistan's victorious cricket team he then left sports and launched his movement for justice party in the most dangerous political environment on a. for years can anticorruption party was ignored in two thousand and seven us state department cables referred to him as pakistan's one man party. but pakistan is changing. over the last two years widespread anger over u.s. drone strikes and corrupt political dynasties has proven millions to his cause i want to know why is he now front runner to be the next leader of pakistan. julian.

i'm all right i have a bit of a cold but i think that's a good thing because my voice is a bit sexier than normal and i have to go basically. to get everything just to sit with you everybody just to well i think you know interesting time is a bit more interesting than my interesting time i saw these videos of your rallies last night so i think this is great but i worry you're going to get blowed up. so i hope your interesting time doesn't get any more you. didn't even go to go. yeah this isn't some of them just. like i mean i was you know when i saw this goes so i used to see. and you could but i'm going in six months later they were gone so i have a completely different attitude to life and you're not around for long so you might as well make the most of it. you don't realize the impact to. the wiki leaks mid not just. did let me let me pause you

a merry go broken up for some reason where we're just lost you are going to like a you're you're back again. back the middle of the world but by the sun the with the exposed all of these two faces one additions you know who was sucking up to the american in the same. and brave and telling them how great they were. you know sucking up to them and public giving completely opposite state it was a rare especially this one really just this guy. who was declaring leads this religious logic and he literally doing the americans he said look if you back me to become the prime minister i would never want to do. and he's considered the most anti american politician and so he was it was a. it really exposed a lot of. how iran can you describe what what are the big power factions in

pakistan is the i.s.i. the army is the supreme court the old families how would you describe the basic power structure of pakistan. well the babyland by cosigning just like in the middle east is above us just full and trans-jordan status for what you call the boss structure benefitted from the system and the majority of the population want to change it so what you see in the middle east is exact numbers but as the west looks upon muslim societies and there's some war we want to be in fundamentalist and liberals islam fundamentalists their brothers actually and this is really the divided up in the muslim world which is why everyone got surprised by the arab spring and by is the one with the following i have been are is the sin by the same people who are going to go to the middle east people want to get james and his to the school board now what does this do just one focused on we the political mafia

else all of the political parties have not got together against being so they have sort of the this is a desert this is a good some of them got this is a good sign is it iran that if people are gathering around to oppose you very very must be scared. oh maybe five because the last time by the sun we saw her at least as big as the doing to god one of. the lot and one of the guy she was forty years ago was the girl you would do the father don't be uneasy and when that's these sort of the numbers don't know you swept the election he just went and he was an underdog and the statistical bodies. so that's why difficult skin we research the wiki leaks cables from islamabad to see what they said about you and in two thousand and seven the us ambassador said. who's

p.t.i. party is effectively a one man show has little to lose his credibility rests in he so created role as a politician he sticks to his principles and he's popular with the pakistani intelligence here and elements of diaspora but has never been able to turn his starring role as captain of pakistan's only team to really win the international cricket championship into an effective political party that's obviously changed now what's happened in the last few months with julian what happened was the. media. from hostile fire on words we certainly. appreciate the independent television jones. the most. the most watched programs begin to fail programs so today if you watch the

television it's like having read jeremy backs one don't sweat the give you have. these these guys have become the billion moves like jury votes and you will have one on the mean one of all the journals and. where you would for instance have a big brother in england or some sort of grow up here don't even want to watch current affairs programs. such as the desire. to understand the political situation of people such as the interest that they are diamond did they have the highest viewership it's a what's happened in the past six months i mean there's really been a tremendous rise the opinion polls by brit have your popular support had something between sixty to eighty percent. of the pakistani population perhaps you can describe this. how your party has grown in size and momentum

and what's it like in the for you try to manage this incredibly fast growing organization was full of what go to elections in two thousand and eight. because you know these elect the elections bug manipulated by the bush administration big group to deal between with cher and been received with all of the corruption cases blood and not only the other politicians they were given an amnesty by a shark and this was the deal brokered by the americans and it was the end not all nationally can see this ordinance so in the middle of reading solution the americans got it was shut up and been sued together and got all these are a case in the latest book drive with due dates above that whole bushkill were about on the back when she got them together and. so sue the sulfide and along with the lot of the by just boycotted the election. because we for the

supposedly boring. for a while make up went down because we stood up and actions and then as the governments began to mess up because once the good riddance came to buy our corruption broke all records and biased nationally because when you have a lot of big government to close and such as the way it was doug remembering that i want everyone when i was what got in the election that this election as it does is going to be a disaster for the people of bias the one it's only meant for the bush administration to have the public one who. was shut up was struggling so he was like to go they wanted another puppet government so they could pursue this war on terror without a lot of armed was going on in europe and still so whatever i was saying and went through the roof the war on terror was has been devastated by this alone for

a because for two thousand and one despite his have been killed in a war we have nothing to do we're up busy our own army killing on people and then get it then doing suicide notes on the box that is evidence and can be done again the cost of seventy billion dollars of this war totally it has been less than twenty billion so all i was able of these things and suddenly. it just resonated with the beeb and almost two years ago mike the graph started going up as though says the bigger the who wanted to go see this james. we are seeing our politicians rushing to me so people who are electable is realizing that the war banner not belongs to me and i'm going to do and i heard that even even musharaff tried to say to you. you you pm me president.

well there you see bush or. does not understand what's happening in pakistan because he's outside is all over you know politics is on the face book he doesn't realize that on the ground based on the situation is this is a completely different number one can be the biggest liability to get a leg but number two he's responsible for the mess he's responsible for this is a record of corruption because he's the one to give them amnesty the good of the good of the lord in the world i've given is given amnesty and that i can just elections again and get it to bomb on and secondly this war on terror so he's responsible if you look at say the soviet union which also had a lot of corruption but people said well that. well at least the black market is a market. so you're going to have some kind of trading it helps you get around regulations which are impeding business. what is the problem with corruption in

pakistan why is why is corruption bad for pakistan just to give you know the statistics then you're not going to i am history of sixty years the total debt you may lead by bikes son is about was fighting it in just four years the debt has gone up from problems by politically. so we had. to to service our debts so out of one point eight trillion. debt servicing is eight hundred billion harvard of debt service and six hundred billion goes to before the army how do they need to million people have two hundred billion to be used as a liberal so clearly the ganges unwired so that in itself russia could still go on in tears and. we're looking at the atlas we're

looking at. us going down the drain the country is heading towards complete chaos we don't have money to don't run the country and at the moment load shedding we don't have money to buy and you do. not buy our generation so because we get a lot of buy food for a pardon or slow the government are there's almost fourteen hours notice you did there's no electricity for fourteen hours a day. and and the corruption in pakistan the tax evasion is one thing but the the stealing of money from the treasury how much of that ends are back in pakistan i just taking from the poor of the middle class and transferring it to the rich in pakistan pursers how much of the money is taken out of pakistan and stashed into london banks or stashed into swiss banks or u.s.

companies. so do things number one because we do not have money to bear for to get finest of oil for our generation the country is having load shedding this little electricity for fourteen to fifteen hours a day eighteen hours in the rural areas. that would mean the farmers don't run they're. the do birds to water their crops that means factories and industries are closing down there because there's massive unemployment on and off the inflation so that's one aspect of corruption the second is it that it was sort of this money ends up and this was a dance of the dog almost all of the political leaders in the middest money are excited by this done and i have everything in by you stand in mine and apart from more particularly this head of political bodies there have banned guns abroad their property is abroad and this is not declared so of this money most of

this money and others that the country let's move on to the u.s. . tell me about this assassination of osama bin laden in pakistan what was the feeling in pakistan that the i.s.i. was hiding this hour bin lot of that they're incompetent why. was a solid bin laden in pakistan do you know what you must understand is that some of been not there was trained by the i.r.s. and cia. did warlow adam were trained by the cia and i.s.i. about twenty years back so this is this is these people were assets of by this time on. their would really by the by this and i mean the i.s.i. financed by the cia and but they were fighting the soviets and for a long time these groups had big bull's associations with the most unsecured

agencies no suddenly comes no new member and you do a lot of the leading degrees does i mean we shadowed us at home with you to be stolen. but it didn't mean that all along the way people would have accepted this because here what people are trained for jihad our job and this is in this just means by doing the foreign occupation so obviously who can miss them having indoctrinating not only. these militant groups but also your own intensities that they're fighting a war and occupation is it is a religious duty very very some subset in the i.s.i. some people perhaps who are dealt with him in the past who are still loyal as goes people who would have thought that if i do another foreign occupation which is now the worst is also religious duty of course if it's possible as it is there a feeling that the u.s. is helping our clean out militants in pakistan or is there a feeling that it's

a violation of pakistani sovereignty and this was the under which the leadership. it is a go through which is a i don't know the most about thirty five thousand people dead fighting and there are those war. and as i said the country of lost. in terms of what do you lost those then the gate given to us and the government was the figure to seventy billion dollars is going to be debated so this war isn't going to the supposed to be second posing for the worse and they're not and i did not trust us and actually game and kill someone on our own soil it wasn't that all factors combine in the sacrifice and secondly it is an error that we should be about your friends and so forget about what the government on and don't want the people of the country to do to know what was going on because it. was the it was being abused

the way to get them or europe all by the way because of this either the environment or in goods but what about the people so good that there was a definitive in there was a very strong reaction born of feeling of humiliation answer to think that you know that the us argue that someone bin laden is a terrorist responsible for the deaths of many americans so they have a right to go in and take him out i'm saying is that the. war on terror is the law is some of the confusion is that to win the war on terror by bombs and. you know killing people actually war on terror as one would win hearts and minds of people if you lose the war this is that that is the where this is going to end i don't buy just on his war radicalised did that it was eight years back by this time in this little corner especially it's a polarized society than it was eight years ago whatever we do military this is not

the solution we have. we did it for eight years the americans feel for eleven years but what are we going to do now which is different and as i understand said madness is doing this if you go over and over again and expecting a different result it's not going to happen there's no military solution only ways political solution by just the bottom the political solution we do not have politicians look your blog at a bit of both so you need elections a good bit of government hope for the osce we'll start a political dialogue help the methods exit strategy from understand this is the one we are all of those. we discovered a cable in two thousand and nine from the islamabad embassy. prime minister of. interior minister mal ak went into the embassy

and offered to share an address that is the voting record system for voters in pakistan and a front company was set up in the united kingdom international identity services. which was hired as the consultant on that drug to squirrel out. the. all of pakistan its it seems to me that that is a theft of some national treasure of pakistan the entire pakistani database registry of its people. judy it's so shameful. you know never has a country's ruling elite for personal benefits never had to betray to people as much as this elite and it would show up in the gutter elite. not only have they

done as they have been just some people who have disappeared by. on suspicion of terrorism there were biased i mean these people from by just any sort of handle were to the americans on a business mission of of. them being involved in some terrorism and people have disappeared. people that in a minute it suspects up and limited to troop drawdowns and not only suspect their wives their children that it was a deliberate it never has it been any meaning in what these people are innocent or not new country has ever been but it's one and out as we are being moments country as i said is the bullshit bit of my history never has a country that willingly betrayed its people saw the light at the start intruding elite and subversive benefits because all of their bank accounts across their money

laying abroad and guess what the americans go on about accounts. they do believe only so from the from you know how how would you reconfigure their pakistan relationship with the united states were going to be a complete severance what would you permit drone strikes what kind of intelligence cooperation what would you do in practice. have a better relationship based on the dignity self-respect. so it should be a relationship like the u.s. as with india it should not be a relationship with last relationship anyone was there but just as a hired gun big beard to. kill americans and it is it's not it's civilization ship that is feed it's loaded over to the people above is done nor does it deliver to the americans the only thing that the americans should be doorless the law there will be a good there is

a promise but you can only do that if you lower the perceived to be a student of demands or you going to be a problem get and then deal with terrorists or at the moment the terrorists or the militants have declared jihad against bugs on government so they're giving their songs and on and on and up with these guys say that these are all out to something americans so the woman should get out of this war this job's the will of the juggalos we need then against our sifting through the end of me this is it within our borders and then only can we get into that it will be don't tell us and from our side so there's one number one step has to be pulled out as a lot more worried we become a sovereign independent state and the relationship with the us should be of dignity and self-respect no longer the. last relationship you know your you give a good description of how the war on terror in pakistan has been counterproductive

it's created in the miti towards the pakistani government thirty five thousand to forty five thousand pakistanis have lost their lives why do you think the united states pursues its agenda its during drone strikes in pakistan if if the us ambassador even is writing back saying that it's counterproductive what is the driving forces from the us. well julian i think it's because the the just like us the policy in us is being driven by a budget and it's the is the army would grow it was close because only the military people always think of military solutions if you look at it here and you listen to i think it was a general magnum r r i just remember a lot of dough and him well they're all saying we're back and it's sixty's that we've done the corner we're about to win the war of a few moment

a few more moments and this would do the trick so genitives was thinking like that . one final question of iran. have you met a.q. . and what do you think about the father of the pakistani nuclear bomb. i've made a clone of you know. there's not a recently but a couple of years back but i'm going to for twenty years because he'd give the first edition to when i started building the gansa hospital he was the one going forward first off. here's a hero his is. here in washington by just done because if i was in the news of the one it was someone would give us security in other words. the same reason given by the israelis that they needed the bomb goes this owner. hostile neighbors is

ascendant by the sun before she was with india which is seven times the size of my guest on and there's a lot of the security in the country and this is a guy who's supposed to have secured us so from their point of view he's a hero worship and like. what i think of him i don't really nor was he in war and this is a proliferation of the good ones of you why don't. you know by the americans and we share over the others an igloo hundred percent of the logo ready to. give all i want is that i never was alone and it's not i don't really know what of the it budget on television that it was avoided but he said he was forced by oneself to do that so i don't really believe the truth behind it julian buzz only i managed to do here i don't know diddly. for the world of it which has gotten you know a nuclear bombs. but at the moment there's the where the situation is. people will

i don't hear this ever since we've had acquired nuclear weapons even though there's been a lot of tension and we've come close but there has been no war would be focused on india and before the nuclear weapon there were three wars so the people will i don't from that point of view ok. thank you very much to i wish you all the best because i think you. what you did with weekly freedom of information system was toward the thing because we'll basically controlled by people with holding information this is really a boil and as i said i'm the biggest beneficiary there's going to be these lawyers would have just been through the mission and people like me would never and i was just sort of coming to the bar i was so there you think oh well that's thank you good luck.

keeps. putting. download the official ante up location to go on the phone or i pod touch from the i.q. stops to. watch on t.v. life on the go. video on demand ati's mind old costs and says feeds now in the palm of your. question on the t.

dot com. if. he. believes. it's.