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more news today violence is once again flared up. these are the images the world has been seeing from the streets of canada. giant corporations are on the day. i'm julian a son but that's just saying. it is true when he wakes exposed the world secrets these jackets belong united states government being attacked by the powerful united states strongly condemn us going after white people all illegally shoot five hundred days now i being detained without charge but that hasn't stopped us. today we're on a quest for really high ideas can change the world tomorrow. from humble

origins my next guest imran khan became a household name as captain of pakistan's victorious cricket team he then left sports and launched his movement for justice party in the most dangerous political environment on. for years can anti corruption party was ignored in two thousand and seven us state department cables referred to him as pakistan's one man party. but pakistan is changing. over the last two years widespread anger over u.s. drone strikes and corrupt political dynasties has proven millions to his cause i want to know why is he now front runner to be the next leader of pakistan. hi julie . i'm all right i have a bit of a cold but i think that's a good thing because my voice is a bit sexier than normal and i have to compete with. my to get everything just to

sit with you everybody just to well i think you know interesting time is a bit more interesting than my interesting time i saw these videos of your rallies last night so i think this is great but i worry you're going to get blowed up. so i hope your interesting time doesn't get any more it. didn't you know to go. yeah this isn't because those are some of them just. like i mean i was you know when i saw this goes to hospital so i used to see you but it got me going in six months later they were going so i have a completely different attitude to life and you know to ralph a lot so you might as well make the most of it. you don't realize that you're back to. the wiki leaks mid not just. let me let me pause you a merry go broken up for some reason where we're just lost you for a minute ok you're you're back again. back the middle of the world but by the sun

the with the exposed all of these two faces one additions you know who was sucking up to the marriage in the same. drive and telling them how great they were. you know sucking up to them and public giving completely opposite state it was a rare specially this one really just this guy. who was declaring leads this religious logic and he literally doing the medic and he said look if you badly need to become the prime minister i do whatever i want to do. and he's considered the most anti american politician so he was it was a. it really exposed a lot of people who. know him around can you describe what what are the big power factions in pakistan is the i.s.i. the army is the supreme court the old families how would you describe the basic

power structure of pakistan. well the bible and my guests are just like in the middle east is above a statistical and friends jordan status for what you call the boss director benefiting from the system and the majority of the population want to change it so what you see in the middle east is exact numbers but as the west looks upon muslim societies at this some war would be fundamentalist and liberals islam and fundamentalists are birds actually and this is really the divided up in the muslim world which is why everyone looks surprised by the arab spring and by is the one with the following i have been are is the symptom of the same people who are going to go to the middle east people want to get james and decided to squabble now what does this do just one focused on we have political mafia else all of the political parties have not got together against me so they have sort of the this is

a desert this is a good some of them got this is a good sign is it iran that if people are gathering around to oppose you very very must be scared. oh maybe five because the last time by the sun we saw red is as big as the doing to god one. a lot and one was forty years ago was the go you would do the five don't be uneasy and when that these sort of the numbers don't know you swept the election he just went and he was an underdog and the stooges fight is a lot of work so that's one of the records good we researched the wiki leaks cables from islamabad to see what they said about you and in two thousand and seven the us ambassador said. who's p.t.i. party is effectively a one man show has little to lose his credibility rests in his self created role as a politician he sticks to his principles and he's popular with the pakistani

intelligence here and elements of diaspora but has never been able to turn his starring role as captain of pakistan's only team to really win the international cricket championship into an effective political party that's obviously changed now what's happened in the last few months with julian what happened was the. media. from hospitals fired on words we certainly. appreciate independent deliberation jones. the most. the most watched programs begin to fail programs so the today if you watch our television it's late having read jeremy bash one don't sweat gave you have. these these guys have become

a billion moves like jury votes and you will have one on the mean one of all the journals and. where you would for instance have a big brother in england or some sort of rock here don't even want to watch it don't interfere programs. such as the desire. to understand the political situation of people such as the interest that the diamond there they have the highest viewership it's a what's happened in the past six months i mean there's really been a tremendous rise the opinion polls that i've read have your popular support at something between sixty to eighty percent. of the pakistani population perhaps you can describe this. how your party has grown in size and momentum and what's it like in the for you try to manage this incredibly fast growing organization first of all at once go to elections in two thousand and eight.

because you know these elect the elections bug manipulated by the bush administration big group to deal between with cher and businesses with all of the corruption cases blood and not only the other politicians they were given an amnesty by a shark and this was the deal brokered by the americans and it was the end not all national reconciliation ordinance so in the name of reagan solution the americans got all shut up and been sued together and got all these are a case in the latest book drive with due dates above that whole bushkill were about on the back when she got them together and some of. the suits sulfide and along with the lot of the by just boycotted the election. because we've for the supposedly boring. for a while wake up and go on because we stood up and actions and then as the

governments began to mess up because once the guerrillas came through by corruption broke all records and biased nationally because when you were allowed to big government to close and serve as the way it was doug remembering that i want everyone to know is what got in the election that this election is a disease it's going to be a disaster for the people of bias the one it's only meant for the bush administration to have one who. was sure it was struggling so you would like to go there wanted another puppet government so they could pursue this war on terror without a lot of them was bombing on europe and so. whatever i was saying and went to the roof the war on terror was has been devastated by this for a because forty thousand by this time is a big get in a war we have nothing to do we're up busy our own army killing on people and then

then doing suicide attacks on by us that is evidence and. the cost of seventy billion dollars of this war totally has been less than twenty billion so i was able of these things and suddenly. it just resonated with people and almost two years ago my gut grass started going up as though says the big bad and the who wanted to go see this james. we are seeing not politicians rushing to me so people who are electable is realizing that the war although not belongs to me and i'm going to do and i heard it even even musharaff tried to say to you. you you pm me president. well there you see bush or. does not understand what's happening in pakistan because he's outside is all over you know politics is on the face of he doesn't

realize that on the ground and based on the situation is his commute different number one he'll be the biggest liability to get i like to. do it he's responsible for the mess he's responsible for this is a record corruption because he's the one to give them amnesty the good of the good of the new order in the world i've given is given amnesty and that are going to just elections again and then get into bomb on and secondly this war on terror so he's responsible if you look at say the soviet union which also had a lot of corruption for people said well that. well at least the black market is a market. so you're going to have some kind of trading it helps you get around regulations which are impeding business. what is the problem with corruption in pakistan why is why is corruption bad for pakistan just to give you know the statistics that enough and i am history of sixty years the total debt if you

milledge it by bikes don is about five trillion in just four years the debt has gone up from the problem by twelve thirty. so we had. to do to service our debts so out of one point eight trillion. debt servicing is eight hundred billion harvard goes to debt service and six hundred billion goes to before the army how do they need to million people have two hundred billion to be used as a livable so clearly the ganges and wind up so that in itself russia could still go on and years of my son we are looking at the atlas we are looking at. us going down the drain the country is heading towards complete chaos we don't have money to don't run the country and at the moment load shedding we

don't have money to buy and you do. not buy our generation so because we get a lot of buy food for up large initial of the government are there's almost fourteen hours of no shipping there's no electricity for fourteen hours a day. and the corruption in pakistan the tax evasion is one thing but the the stealing of money from the treasury how much of that ends up back in pakistan i.e. it's just taking from the poor the middle class and transferring it to the rich in pakistan versus how much of the money is taken out of pakistan and stashed into london banks or stashed into swiss banks or u.s. companies. so do things number one because we do not have money to bear for to get finest oil for our generation the country does have ignored shipping

this electricity for fourteen to fifteen hours and it did eighteen hours in the rural areas. that would mean the farmers don't run there. the birds to water their crops that means factories and industries are closing down there because there's a massive unemployment on top of the inflation so that's one aspect of corruption the second is it was sort of this money ends up and this was god's. dog wasn't the only political leader in the middest money are excited by this done and i have everything in by you stand in line and apart from more particularly this head of political bodies there have banned guns and brought their properties abroad and this is not a plan so of this money most of this money and some of the country let's move on to the u.s. . tell me about this assassination of osama bin laden in

pakistan what was the feeling in pakistan that the i.s.i. was hiding this i would get a lot of that there in confidence why. was a solid bin laden in pakistan and you know what you must understand is that some of been not there was trained by the i.s.i. and cia. did warlow adam were trained by the cia and i.s.i. about twenty years back so this is this is these people were assets of by this time are. they would really by the by just an army in the i.s.i. financed by the cia or but they were fighting the soviets and for a long time these groups had very close association with the most unsecured agencies no suddenly comes no new lever and you do a lot of the leading degrees does i mean we shadowed us at one really to be stolen . but it didn't mean that all along the way people would have accepted this because

here what people are trained for jihad our job and this is in this just means by doing the foreign occupation so obviously the can miss them having indoctrinating not only. these militant groups but also your own intensities that they're fighting foreign occupation is it is a religious duty play right some subset of the i.s.i. some people perhaps who are dealt with him in the past who are still loyal the cause people who would have thought that if i do another foreign occupation which is now the worst is also as it is today of course if it's possible as it is there a feeling that the u.s. is helping our clean out militants in pakistan or is there a feeling that it's a violation of pakistani sovereignty and this was the ultimate humiliation. it is a go through which is a i don't know the most part are devoted dozen people dead fighting and there goes

war. and as i said the country had lost far. in terms of when do you last was then the aid given to us and the government was the figure to seventy billion dollars is going to be debated so this war isn't going to the supposed to be a second posting for the worse and then out and i did not trust us and actually game and kill someone on our own soil it wasn't that the battle factors combined in the second place and secondly here's an ad that would be about your friend and so forget about what the government on i'm done with the people of the country who didn't know what was going on because it. was the hours that i was being abused the only way to have kept them or europe all by the way because of this is either the environment or in goods but what about the people so good that there was

a definitive in there was a very strong reaction born of feeling of humiliation answer to think that you know that the us argue that someone bin laden is a terrorist responsible for the deaths of many americans so they have a right to go in and take him out i'm saying is the. war on terror is the law is so hard the confusion is that you win a war on terror by bombs and. you know killing actually war on terror is one when you win hearts and minds of people if you lose the war this is that that is the where this is going to end i mean by just one is already in place to do that it was eight years back by this time and this blogger is just it's a polarized society then it was here two years ago whatever we do military this is not a solution we have. for eight years the americans and feel for eleven years but what

are we going to do now what is different and as i understand said madness is doing this if it is over and over again and expecting a different result it's not going to happen and there's no military solution only way is political solution by just the bottom the political solution we do not have one occasion to look it will all get a bit of both so you need election is a good bit of government hope for the osce we'll start a political dialogue help the americans in an exit strategy from understand it this is the one we are honest. we discovered a cable in two thousand and nine from the islamabad embassy. prime minister of. interior minister mal ak went into the embassy and offered to share. that is the voting record system for voters in pakistan and

a front company was set up in the united kingdom of international identity services . which was hired as the consultant when that drug to squirrel out. the. all of pakistan it's it seems to me that is a theft of some national treasure of pakistan the entire pakistani database registry office people. judy it's so shameful. you know never has a country's ruling elite for personal benefits never had betrayed their people as much as this elite and we show and the currently. not only have they done to us they have been darkest number of people who have disappeared by mistake. on suspicion of terrorism they were biased i mean these people from by just any sort

of handle would do the americans on a business mission of of. them being involved in some terrorist and people have just been. people that in the minute it suspects up and limited to troop drawdowns . and not only suspects their wives the children the neighbors i live in egypt never has there been any wording in what these people innocent or not new country has ever been but it's one and out as we are being moments to entry as i said is the bullshit in full bit of my history never has a country that willingly betrayed its people saw the light at the start intruding a need for personal benefits because all of their bank accounts across their money laying abroad and guess what the americans go on about guns they do believe only so from the from how how would you reconfigure their pakistan relationship with the

united states were going to be a complete severance what would you commit drone strikes what kind of intelligence cooperation what would you do in practice. have a relationship based on the dignity self-deception. so it should be a relationship like the u.s. as with india it should not be a relationship with moscow and lucia tippett and even worse the bystanders a hive that big to kill americans and it is it's not considered lish is it that is feed it's loaded over to the people above is someone who has it delivered to the americans the only thing that you that the americans should be dollars that look there will be good there is a promise but you can only do that if you loan the perceive to be a student of the americans or you going to be a problem get and then deal with terrorists or at the moment the generous or the

militants have declared jihad against bugs on government so that given your songs and on and on and up with these guys say that these are people are going to something americans so the woman should pull out of this war this jobs the will of the job goes we need then against our sifting through the end of me this is it within our borders and then only can we get into that it will be don't desert from us and so therefore number one step has to be pulled out as a lot laurie we become a sovereign independent state and the relationship with the us should be of dignity and self-respect no longer the. last relationship you know your you give a good description of how the war on terror in pakistan has been counterproductive it's created immunity towards the pakistani government thirty five thousand to forty five thousand pakistanis have lost their lives why do you think the united

states pursues. its agenda its during drone strikes in pakistan if if the us ambassador even is writing back saying that it's counterproductive what is the driving forces from the us. well julian i think it's because the the just like us the policy in us is being driven by a budget and it's the this is the army people who would produce clothes because only military people always think of military solutions if you look at it here and you know this is true out there wasn't general magnum are on i just remember a lot of dough and while they're all saying we're back in there it's just that we've done the corner we're about to win the war of a few moments a few more moments and this will do the trick so gentle is what i was thinking like that. one final question iran. have you met a.q.

. and what do you think about the father of the pakistani nuclear bomb. i've made a clone of you know. there's not a free society but a couple of years back but i warn him for twenty years because he'd give the first edition to when i started building the gansa hospital he was the one going forward first. here's a hero his is. harold washington by the sun because if i was in the news of the one it was someone there was security in other words of the same reason given by the israelis that they needed the bomb because their cell phone or. hostile neighbors is ascendant by the sun before she was with india which is seven times the size of my guest on and there's a lot of the security in the country and this is a guy who's supposed to have secured us so from their point of view he's

a hero worship and biased on what i think of him i don't really know or see him or him disapprove of racial knowing that the ones of you why don't. you know by the americans and we share over the others into my room so that we see that logo ready to. give all evidence that i never was alone and it's not i don't really know what of the it budget on television that it was avoided but he said he was forced by oneself to do that so i don't have the truth behind it julian bus only i managed to do here i don't know diddly. for a word of it which has gotten you into a nuclear bombs. but at the moment there's the where the situation is. people will live on here this ever since we've had acquired nuclear weapons even though there's been a lot of attention we've come across but there has been no war would be focused on india and before the nuclear weapon there were three wars so the people will argue

from that point of view ok. thank you very much to i wish you all the best because i think you. what to do with. freedom of information is the rules of war because we are basically. by people with information. this is a video and i listen i'm the biggest beneficiary there's going to be these look fields would have just. like you would never have i just. love coming to the bar so do you think the little bits thank you good luck. six click. click click click. click up.

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