turn it into a solid and go. request the gold and silver investors guy. call today eight hundred two five seven go. good afternoon welcome to capital account i'm laurin lister here in washington d.c. these are your headlines for tuesday august seventh two thousand and twelve j.p. morgan says in a court filing pm subpoena of the bank may be too burdensome so will j.p. morgan get its way and get out of it well it looks like they could be off the hook for accusations of silver manipulation this is amid a financial times story reporting u.s. regulators are increasingly likely to drop their investigation of silver manipulation after four years failing to find enough evidence to pursue the case now i should mention one key regulator don't protest this report but we'll find out what chris how thinks he's co-founder and treasurer of the gold antitrust action

committee plus it's been fodder for many a tale i'm talking about this. this they say it was a few secrets. are still very worried so. i'm referring to questions about the true state of the u.s. is gold reserves will reportedly the federal government is auditing the gold stored at the new york that at least so are those who've been calling for an audit for years satisfied or does this miss the point and while we're on precious metals our shares in wal-mart you heard me right as good as gold well some are suggesting the discount retailer is the new safe haven but what does that mean exactly well here's one of our guests recently talking about wal-mart. that's a bit centrally a food stamp place and some of their stores as much as forty percent of their revenue is actually food stamps. there you have it go long government subsidies

will discuss let's get to today's capital account. let's talk about market manipulation today because yesterday the financial times came out with the story that i have right here that u.s. regulators for your investigation into possible manipulation of the silver market looks more like it's going to be dropped now as reported u.s. regulators have just not found enough evidence to support a legal case according to three people they cite for milieu with the situation now since then bart chilton has told a motley fool reporter and we confirmed this with his office that this f.t. report is premature and inaccurate now chilton says he thinks the public deserves

some answers in the near future we'll see about that but bart chilton of course is this the f.t.c. commissioner who said two years ago that he believed there had been fraudulent efforts to deviously control the silver price now what's interesting is given recent events is this seemingly new world where the mainstream is rethinking what it's thought of in the past as conspiracies just listen to sam you see you hear about these things. these were curiously theories right you hear that you hear this about the people of new killing live or people here deleting that the still markets and you said they are and they are. and they are and that's no the gold antitrust action committee gap since one nine hundred ninety eight has been exposing opposing and litigating against collusion to control the price and supply of gold now gotta have collected and published dozens of documents showing western treasury and central bank efforts to intervene both openly answer a pitch asli against

a free market in gold and chris bell is here to tell us about it he's co-founder and treasurer of data and managing editor of the journal inquirer too i should mention and he's come all the way to d.c. to our studio just for us to tell us what he thinks of some of this latest news and where data is in its efforts now so first i just want to say thanks so much for making the trip and for being here what an honor no mind lauren from delighted to be here well we're delighted to have your audience loves this topic and espouse needed by it so i do want to start with some of the latest news that is that has come out one story the los angeles times reports that in fact the federal government has been auditing the gold that stored at the new york fed drilling holes in it to make sure that it's actual gold what's your reaction to this story and how far does this go in addressing some of the concerns that you folks that data have been laying out for years it does not strike us lauren as being terribly relevant of all our complaints has not been that the united states does not have

gold bars and that several depositories and there's not gold in the new york our complaint has been. the ownership of that gold has been oversubscribed over pledged has it been leased or swapped with the gold of other central banks so that the other central banks might intervene in the market we sued the federal reserve back in two thousand and nine and we elicited a statement from the board of governors member or a covenant more with the fed has secret gold swap arrangements with foreign banks and that these documents were among the documents that the fed did not want to release. to us so we know that the fed is surreptitiously active in the gold market we just don't know who owns the gold that's what we want to find out how much is has as u.s. gold been pledged how much has u.s. gold been swapped with the gold of other central banks so that other central banks might intervene in the gold market to keep the us government's fingerprints off.

the transaction and we believe there's gold there we don't think the drawing of it really accomplishes much we want to get into the records to see how many ownership claims there are to it so this doesn't answer your questions drilling drilling holes into two to five percent of the u.s. is gold that is reportedly still there is stored there is not going to solve it now let's talk a little bit more about manipulation but of the silver market because this is another story that's come out this week is this article in the financial times that the u.s. is for your probe of possible silver market manipulation has essentially gone cold that they don't have enough evidence to pursue a legal case in your research and experience is that true is there just not enough evidence to move forward with any kind of real case if the if the silver market is not manipulated we learned today it's the only market that is not manipulated and i would have to congratulate silver traders for finding the market that's not manipulated of course we we think differently but. there's two issues about that

financial times story the first question is is it really distant from a nation this is a plant by people who would like for example the silver shorts to be let out of their predicament a little bit easier by discouraging the longs in the market from thinking that the c f t c was ever going to set that market right. as you mentioned to see if the commissioner says that you know there hasn't been a decision yet nevertheless i don't expect to see you have to see that come up with anything here they've been going on with this for almost four years if they couldn't find something by now they're not going to find something i think they have been told finally. candidly that the silver market manipulation is a u.s. government operation likely undertaken to the extreme stabilization fund and. see if she can't get into it because this is a national security issue people forget that back in one nine hundred sixty five when silver was officially demonetized by a new point of fact in the united states as he signed the legislation president

johnson warned silver investors not to invest in silver not to drive the price up because he said the united states government would disordered from its strategic silver stockpile to rig the silver price you can find that signing statement on the presidential papers internet site of the university of california at santa barbara since one thousand nine hundred eighty five the united states government has pledged to rig the silver market well and this is really interesting what you're saying because that's a twist that i didn't expect in terms of silver because what we've heard is there are allegations that private banks have been trying to manipulate the gold price or the silver price excuse me and how j.p. morgan is one that investors and all over the blogosphere people have alleged has involved has been involved in doing this and in fact according to this article this is the f.t.c. has been analyzing files and records from j.p. morgan and their investigation i do want to play what their head of global commodity is life masters said in response to because she did answer a question about it once saying yes there is

a lot of speculation about this on the blogosphere and here is why it appears that j.p. morgan has such a large still for position i want to play that in an action. that often when customers have that metal stored in our facilities they had it on a forward basis through j.p. morgan. hedges itself in the commodity markets if you see only the hedges and our activity in the futures markets but you aren't aware of the underlying client position that we're hedging that it would suggest inaccurately that we're running a directional position. so i guess first do you buy that and what is your take on whether or not j.p. morgan has been manipulating the silver market and then in addition i guess this.

i was reading everything you. that would be great because what essentially says is that the legal basis of the e.s.f. is the gold reserve act of nine hundred thirty four which you just talked about chris how as amended in the late seventy's the act provides the in part that the

department of the treasury has a stabilization fund consistent with the obligations of the government in the international monetary system a fund on orderly exchange arrangements and an orderly system of exchange rates the secretary with the approval of the president may deal in gold there you have it foreign exchange and other instruments of credit and securities before we go to break just quickly what's how do we know what they're doing there's no way to know because it's all right you're going to ask under the law they're exempt from all the freedom of information requirement so they can do anything they want they can trade in any market secretly and they don't have to tell you and that includes gold that includes every security you read that statute again credit another securities that can trade in any market they want to trade and secretly that's the law and what makes you think that they're using that in the gold market as i know that this plays into what you believe in terms of gold manipulation well because we've collected an awful lot of documents official statements admissions from central

bankers from over the years including some that are quite contemporaneous that either admit or really strongly suggest surreptitious intervention on the gold market in the us would be a very convenient mechanism for them to work with interesting when we get back from a break i want to bring up some of those statements from central bankers that you've been documenting over the years including some of the most recent evidence we'll get more into gold manipulation so we'll have much more after the break with chris how the co-founder and treasurer of the get also still had save money and live better well that's the wal-mart promise but is the discount retailer or the new investor safe haven well we'll give you our two cents in loose change but first your closing market numbers.

there's a surprise in. what drives the world the fear mongering used by politicians who makes decisions. being made can you trust no one. with the global machinery where we had a state controlled capitalism is called. when nobody dares to ask we do. question more.

is the state run in english speaking russian channel it's kind of like. russia today has an extremely confrontational stance when it comes to us. welcome back we're talking precious metal market manipulation by the government it's an intriguing subject and chris paul has been done has done a lot of work on it over the years he's co-founder and treasurer of gap to and managing editor of the journal inquirer and chris before the break we really got

into the silver market manipulation investigation and also the audit of the new york fed school but now let's really get into your bread and butter which is the evidence that you found documented and in pursuing in terms of central bank manipulation of the gold price so i'm curious i guess i know you've been getting evidence over the years you've submitted for your requests you've sued so i want to know what is maybe the most smoking gun piece of evidence that you've found that this is going on and maybe also the most recent well probably most contemporaneous or in two thousand and nine september two thousand and nine a member of the federal reserve's board of governors cover them were handling our freedom of information request of the fed wrote our lawyer a letter explaining why the fed was not going to give us their gold documents among the documents the fed was withholding from us wrote their records of gold swap arrangements the fed has with foreign banks well if the fed is not involved in the gold market there is no need for gold swap arrangements with foreign banks that is

a confession and admission the letter is posted at our internet site and as a matter of fact the fed won that part of the lawsuit the fed the court ruled u.s. district court in the district of columbia ruled that the fed does not have to give up the records of its gold swap arrangements with foreign banks but simply the fact of those arrangements i think was a sensational confession that the fed is involved served in the gold market the fed has gold secrets that's only one of the gold secrets that the fed was allowed to keep. the fed could be asked one of these secrets what don't you want us to know about the u.s. gold reserve that letter acknowledging secret colds. it's involving the federal reserve was dated in september two thousand and nine that's pretty contemporaneous yes and before we get into how it works exactly do you i do want to ask why would the fed want to do that's why it why why would they be involved in the gold market

and why does anybody sitting there need to care that maybe isn't invested in gold governments have been involved in the gold market for a long time more and. in recent decades it's because they have concluded that gold is a competitive currency that is a currency that competes with their currencies and more important is a determinant a primary determinant of interest rates and the value of government bonds there is much academic literature on this subject some of it was written by lawrence summers who was then the economics professor at harvard went on to become assistant treasury secretary and treasury secretary of the united states lawrence summers wrote a paper explaining how the gold price is the determinant of interest rates and the prices of government bonds governments really in suppressing the gold price are more interested in supporting the government bond prices and keeping interest rates low that is the essence of the gold price suppression scheme so essentially when you hear ben bernanke you say that gold is not money and the central bank holds it because it's tradition and are you thinking that he's making that up and just

putting on a good eye. and is trying to avoid answering the questions like the questions we put to the fed we were seeking access to their gold records the government's own gold because that is a form of money that determines interest rates and government bond prices and you don't have to trust me you can believe larry summers who became treasury secretary of the united states and why should anybody care that this is going on or potentially going on because this gold price suppression scheme is part of a much greater scheme of controlling all the currency and commodity in equity markets in the world you know when you control the currency markets you do control the world when when. nazi germany took over europe and world war two we have this image of the nazi looting of occupied europe as having been done by the gestapo and the s.s. at the point of ban that some of it was but very very little of it was most of the nazi looting of europe during world war two was done through the rigging of

currency markets much history is historic literature on that subject if you can regain the exchange rate you can turn every citizen of an occupied country into an agent of the occupation the nazis arranged through the rigging of exchange rates so that the production of all of occupied europe flowed into nazi germany and none of it flowed back out and for a few years nazi germany and one hell of a trade deficit but because it controlled the currency markets in europe it didn't care and i want to know how you think it works how the price is manipulated exactly in terms of central banks ordination and any divide between east versus west and the role of the b.a.'s well big question first the manipulation used to work very candidly in the open through the disordering of western bank gold reserves in order to keep the us dollar gold price of thirty five dollars an ounce

this was done through a mechanism known as the london gold pool the united states bank of england i believe six other western european central banks all agreed to disorder their gold reserves through the bank of england in london into the london market the thirty five dollars an ounce that is the war of the viet nam revved up and the one nine hundred sixty eight in the great society was was going strong and there was a lot of inflation in the united states the gold offtake became so great that the gold pool collapsed the us gold reserves ran down from twenty five thousand tons to the eight thousand tons left today the london gold pool of three question united states was closed in march one thousand nine hundred sixty eight that was an open mechanism of rigging the gold price since. time governments have tried to rig the gold price through agreements among themselves not to buy gold at market prices we have some memorandums about that more recently the whodunnit through gold leasing which is lending gold into the market

a very low interest rate created the gold carry trade with government bonds and through the futures and derivatives markets futures puts. calls on gold that activity seems to take place largely through the bank for international settlements and and basil switzerland but if you have access to infinite paper or electronic money you can sell puts and calls and you can buy futures and sell futures you can rig any market you want by bombing the market critical points scaring the retail longs out of it and then you know buying back your short positions the bank for international settlements is very heavily involved in the gold market that's a matter of public record it's in there their annual report it turns up in news reports sometimes the i.m.f. was selling gold the bank of england as it has acknowledged that it was leasing gold at least until two thousand and seven but they are trying to do it indirectly now and through paper products to conserve the actual metal in their vaults that

didn't work very well for them back in one thousand nine hundred eighty eight they lost too much model i do want to keep this going for a one minute before we do that because i have to ask you a contemporaneous question about gold today because there are reports i'm saying that they sell your gold send your kids to college it's not the safe haven everybody thought it's been trading sideways for the last year with a lot of volatility i'm curious what you think would make gold breakout and also why the huge spread between gold mining stocks and gold. well. you know the financial times and always been against gold and they're entitled their politics sign up for grabs to the floor and what i do begrudge the financial times is their their refusal to ask any critical specific question of a central bank about gold i resent their their willingness to be the voice of dissent from asia but just before we go what would cause the gold price to break out i think the truth would cause the gold price to break out if if the world

realized that perhaps eighty ninety percent of the gold that thinks it owns does not exist that it's really paper claims financial institutions that do not have the gold if it's paper gold evaporated the gold price will go up very quickly there you go and there's a lot more information on your website that people can go look at documentation and such because there's so much more i would like to get into but i've only got one shall our shows i appreciate you being here thanks so much chris and how co-founder of. all right let's wrap up with loose change because dimitri i want to talk about this story about where investors may be turning to a slowing global economy with

a volatile growth in stocks we seeing gold is a safe haven we talk about it a lot but according to some reports the metal may have some company a big company. it's rolled back at wal-mart and everyone's touching it even though it's just by driving smarter routes and making sure our trailers are full or we save millions of dollars on fuel calls and when calls go down prices go there were so. wal-mart bloomberg is reporting wal-mart is the new gold attracting investors who see its shares as a safe haven the reason why this appealed to me and i thought it was interesting to me tree is what is this saying that poverty and government subsidies are the safest bet because as you heard michael krieger at the top of our show say that wal-mart is heavily driven by food standards for food so food stands and then as a safe haven bet is that people are going to continue to be financially strapped for cash and be looking for the best deal in town it's

a kind of perverse logic works if you're an individual investor but macro wise so you know and it's funny too it's funny because they were like talking about how low prices because that's the thing that wal-mart always talks about low prices and that makes sense and it's good we don't want low prices but the stock market and investing is the only place where people are looking for what's rising in price and we want to we get worried if things drop in price but in reality it's a good thing interest but it's leverage is the problem you get these guys that are over leverage them when prices drop they get pushed out of their positions yeah well i don't know about wal-mart being as good as gold but i do want to get to this story we don't have time to play this sound bite probably but it's just it's do good so it seems that botox has a growing burgeoning population of people who are stressed out by the eurozone crisis and other issues with trading one street so a dermatologist was quoted talked to bloomberg and said that the largest growing sector of their customers is wall street men humanitary you have some competition.

where do you think. this is a great image i love this here because you know look at i you you see this in the black friends got that cold stare can you measure how he looks the doctor when he goes to inject him with botox we don't know if one point get botox but i mean you know but it explains why they why these bankers look so calm and collected in public when they are under no scrutiny because they can't register facial expressions properly. in the room. or is that that that blankfein gets botox in the in his forehead too because you know he's showing you know there are a lot of her right ok well anyway and i think this is amusing hollywood has some competition movie about it that they do so much for watching and makes sure to come back tomorrow and in the meantime you know you can follow me on twitter at lauren lyster and give us feedback on this show any you missed at youtube dot com slash capital account you can watch as an h.d. on hulu at hulu dot com slash capital das account and from everyone here thank you

so much for watching come back tomorrow we'll have scott patterson on high frequency trading in dark pools have a great night. stop and look at the current of the unemployment the national debt. ceiling government. ask yourself does it really matter who with. with billions created daily you can gamble with your money or turn it into solid gold requests the gold and silver investors here are free call today eight hundred two five seven the goal. is. to.

walk nuclear fallible. side. radioactive fallout of all government betrayal the government. and laws and law it and law how can the truth be revealed if there's no official evidence there was indeed a very great danger to the servicemen concerned who were given no problem protection and to the people of this country generally because of radioactive fallout.