well i'm tell our been in washington d.c. and here's what's coming up tonight the big picture. president obama has slowed federal spending faster than any president in recent history so why are republicans moaning and groaning so much that and more in tonight's politics panel and we bailed them out and helped prevent a total financial collapse so how does it do you want to thank you me and our government i want to so as is the idea of a case and what does this say about how and titled and bullet proof wall street

feels today. you need to know this a nightmarish scenario of what might happen if republicans in congress refused to raise the debt limit is beginning to emerge an analysis by the bipartisan policy center found that if the debt limit is not raised by the end of february and chain reaction of events will happen that will destroy both the united states is and the global economy to begin with the treasury department makes roughly one hundred million payments among all of them payments already authorized by congress without an increase in the debt limit those checks can't be cut yet in the short term or yes in the short term the treasury can prioritize what they pay out first and keep payments to social security medicare medicaid education defense going for a little while but that would mean all the checks for everything else would stop on

march first that includes food safety inspectors prisons researchers courts. the f.a.a. a the list goes on and on every airport in the country would shut down federal prisons cease to operate religion and enormous shock would hit global financial markets with america stops paying her bills and the benchmark interest rate for u.s. debt will skyrocket forcing operates on things tied to the fed funds rate which includes credit cards mortgages lines of credit to businesses the cost interest on our debt will also go up the interest cost our debt cost of interest and revenue into the government will go down and we'll be in an even worse situation than we were before would be a nightmare for everyone yet it's exactly what the house republicans are willing to make happen or at least say they are unless president obama agrees to medicare and social security insurance program cuts there's no other way to describe this than economic terrorism which is why the president is currently refusing to negotiate

with these republican terrorists he has basically four options call their bluff and hope they back down invoke the fourteenth amendment and throw it to the supreme court mint a trillion dollar platinum coin to pay our bills or raise the debt limit on his own since congress is author already authorized one hundred percent of all the bills that he's just given the job of pain. so how might all of this play out let's ask our politics panel tonight joining me chris allman conservative commentator and activist neil cave senior reporter of human events online editor the guns and patriots column and sam sacks progressive writer and contributor to truthout order so welcome all of you great to have you with us given what's going to happen if the debt limit isn't raised and there's an old say you casually run across a cop shows you know that hostage takers have to be willing to kill or at least serious seriously main hostage where they shouldn't take them in the first place

typically don't so are the republicans chris chris are the republicans genuinely ready to either kneecap or kill the american economy well i guess the real question is is the president willing to do that because he has his that under u.s. control spending is what's leading to this problem and he has been unwilling over the last four years to do anything about it one of them when did the constitution change and say that that the president could authorize spending i thought that was solely the responsibility of congress well look at the last deal that he cut i think we should just let the sequester cuts go into effect and then the president needs to come with some long term changes to some of these programs that will have a where clara's already spent all this money this is not quite a good we already spend it they they do they authorize they open it years they authorize these expenditures less a little bennett and so if you go buy a new car with a credit card and then the bill comes and you say oh i get this twenty thousand

dollars bill for this new car. but my personal credit limits like fifteen thousand dollars do you call it the credit card company and say sorry i'm not going to pay you well if you're president obama you call it the credit card company and say can you issue me another one when it was their donors who bought the car eight thousand dollars limit i mean the response he has running up to the max and then he keeps asking for more and more and he says i'm not going to have her ask our i'm like carting the last kid up bar i'm. never going to stop the spending do you want to stop you understand what i'm asking the question you're crazy it's ingenuous eyes no not yet i've received only a branch of government that has the power to spend money it doesn't matter how many times you pound the table the president does have a new input and influence on congress and he uses that in all it's to increase spending yes no i was old enough so long he just beat up john boehner i'm well over the last ten or twelve dollars always back to the reagan minister i'm old enough to remember when candidate obama promised he was going to cut the deficit in half in his first four years so he should go here to republicans land fill those plans that

he had and he should use that where the republicans in the senate not filibuster the legislation that came out of nancy pelosi the house of representatives he would have cut the budget it would have cut the deficit more than half so there's a such thing as facts that aren't being really known around here and that's the fact that the president has actually slowed federal spending faster than any president in recent history when it comes down to it but i will side with you guys it is going to his first year if you go back to the carter go before that if you look at it please ok well in fact we have surely we have a we have a graphic job was great this for for a deal this this is these are actual numbers this is from the. from forbes magazine jumped a trillion dollars from this is these are these are and all you do all these years are these are budget deficits by administrations you have reagan reagan bush sr clinton clinton. was junior bush jr and obama let's add a percent and

a barcoded percentage of g.d.p. that's a percentage if this is not this is the amount that he has this is budget deficits as a percentage of g.d.p. and you've got these are the real numbers the actual numbers forbes magazine published this and here you have to go i would lay my democrat g.d.p. gone up that's what you're not talking about his spending has gone up we know he's borrow this scenario in dollars that are giving the president ready for extending g.d.b. to do but lot. i'll give you guys partly this is the president's fault because when we had last that limits he caved in and agreed to about a trillion dollars in cuts and then he agreed to the sequester and all these deals down the road so republicans are banking that is just going to cave again now if miraculously he doesn't even if he pushes the right to the limit and republicans still want to go over and they do take us over and he doesn't do anything about it the never really confirmed the suspicions that a lot of people on the left of have for a long time this republicans are willing to set it on fire in order to rebuild their kind of libertarian society without. without medicare without unemployment i

literally interested when you know there's this very scary scary stories that you're telling me i would be curious to see what happened i think that i was already past the depth i mean i mean we don't where right let's get out there right now we have pleasure which is really what does turning tom let's see i think for the subtle come up the next day honestly it will so you're willing to yes use the hostage and see if he or she lives the metaphorical hostage yes i pray to the soul of the real hostage do you do you disagree with i guess the studies that have been shown that this would be catastrophic you just don't. know it's that study is just predicting the future ok hypothetically if it were studied there were true if it were true and it would go into chaos do you still agree with it. i don't believe there will be chaos but if there were would you agree that if i don't agree of this prediction of the future i mean people are we talking about where you're at is it where's your crystal ball apparently it is ok let's talk about when these. more than one hundred or three hundred employees of the one he's fast food chain in

omaha nebraska stand against screwed by their employer rather than complying with the new obamacare mandate to offer health insurance to its full time workers carry bird death the vice president of operations for the local wendy's franchise is cutting all of his workers hours to part time those shrinking their paychecks and putting the cost burden of finding health insurance squarely on their shoulders or debt argues that he simply can't afford to pay for health insurance for his workers but here's what i say if you run a business and you refuse to offer basic essentials to your workers like a living wage and health care then you shouldn't even be in business in the first place and you know what did what did you think was going to happen when you started dumping all of these new costs and regulations on businesses it's actually a lot less expensive to offer health insurance to your employees post obamacare than it was pretty well i think you know you should you should open a a wendy's and hire these people but you know this guy owns his own business and he's making a decision it's his decision he has the right to make a bad decision have the right to make a bad business decision i absolutely agree with you and in fact one of the

unintended consequence of this i had a long conversation where the potter on the radio show about this today who really knows this stuff you know you speak of b.p. of cigna and and he said what what is happening i mean these people are all basically if they're under four hundred percent of poverty they're going to go on to medicare and all their health insurance is going to be paid for and this isn't the only job is going to do this so professor what we're what we're going to end up with is a national health care system. i've always national single payer health care i've always thought that obamacare is so crazy and burdensome and miss like you can't figure out what it is that basically the whole plan was to move us to a single payer just because people get fed up or it's too expensive it was backdoor single. and if that happens carson about talking about shooting the hostage you just said hey if he can't provide this he should go out of business then those people won't be won't be working twenty eight hours a week they'll be working zero but that's what you and the other liberal actually i

believe the remark was i don't think that would happen i think that if that wendy's went out of business and there was a demand for hamburgers in that location some other entrepreneur who could who could meet the demands of the marketplace and offer a living wage would come along and say well feel less volatile are saying is that they simply cannot make enough profit to know that out well the average. in the corporate profits last year were at the highest level since one thousand and twenty six we're talking this is going to the owner of these franchises they can't stay in business we've seen this all the way this was the unintended consequence going to cut a check actually million dollars a year to two point seven you know well it is as as neal said it is the absolute intended consequence of obamacare to move us to single payer to have to make it so hard for employers that they're just going to throw their hands up and the government is going to have to settle this sam of chris and neal are right i'm all in favor of this i think there's you know some things that obamacare like leading up to the states to try and find ways to insure as many people for as cheaper cost

. two that could pave the way to single payer for other states want to choose a single payer the problem is republicans in congress were all about states' rights or blocking waivers that give states the ability to create single payer systems under all of their vermont has already authorized it passed the law signed by the governor one of the state has been waiting for the republicans in congress to pass legislation giving them away for what they did that is a blocky but there's something sad about it too because it's this collectivization it's almost working like the cornwallis all of us were writing wise it's own laws and i like to visit basically these independent operators are basically forced to either join a large corporation so corporations or larger networks they're the ones the chains are the ones who are going to survive we've seen a lot on it but i look on a lot of companies in america actually i'll stop operate in america and move to canada because they don't have to pay the cost of health insurance if we go to a single payer system those companies might come back to america would not be a good thing i'm not sure a lot of those wendy's are going to move to canada often about that so out of that

there is lots of employers who you know if they're having to compete with low wage nations that don't provide health insurance would be a much easier burden them if they didn't have to provide health insurance either which is offered by the government although see it we'll see how it plays out more of tonight's politics panel coming up right after this break. let me let me i want to know what let me ask you a question. here and this is what we have in the debate we have i know you said. the truth is this is just a bad thing to get here in this race we're being i don't mean to talk about your name and. you know how sometimes you see a story and it seems so for lengthly you think you understand it and then you

glimpse something else you hear or see some other part of it and realize everything you thought you knew you don't know i'm tom hartman welcome to the big picture. here is mitt romney trying to figure out the name of that thing that we americans call a donor. i'm sorry i'm just a guy who cares an awful lot about my country music stars are a fool you know what kind of mind their terrorist cells in your neighborhood all want to give us a defeat terrorism be a liberal and the christian point comes i can see your totally out of the. you know the corporate media distracts us from what you and i should care about because there are profit driven industry that sells us and facials that garbage we

call that breaking news i'm having martin and we're going to break that. welcome back there's the night's politics panel on our panel are chris allman conservative commentator and activist senior reporter human events on line that are the guns and patriots columns and sam sacks progressive writer and contributor to truthout org let's talk guns the city council of spring city utah is taking the n.r.a. his advice that more guns means less gun violence so he wants all residents to own a gun and take classes and learn how to use the officials think it will help supplement their short staffed police force meanwhile congresswoman gabby giffords is injecting some sanity into the debate she's launching

a new organization to take on the national rifle association americans for responsible solutions is what she calls it and she hopes it's going to break the stranglehold that the n.r.a. has on our congress also general stanley mcchrystal this morning call for a ban on what he described as weapons of war that are now on our streets so who is going to win this fight and who should win this fight sam. well there are two different answers i think i mean the gun lobby is pretty strong you know unfortunately as you see after every mass shooting that has been is and has been repeated as people's attention gets off it people attention might lose here and even congressman woman gabby giffords you know she was she was pretty pro gun when she was in congress i mean she didn't have a high grade from the n.r.a. but it's hard for any that i'd hate to disagree with my fellow liberal here remember when sarah palin had that interview with. c.b.s. what was your name. the katie couric you're. with katie couric it was kind of

a turning point the campaign where americans went. you know it's like that i think that when wayne la pierre went off on that rant a lot of americans wound really you know they're really that crazy i don't think they i don't going forward i don't think they're going to. obviously i hope i'm wrong but i mean when i was saying is that you know here's someone who was impacted by gun violence and that's what made her change in iraq it seems like. you know that's what makes people change not seeing it on the news going to be the james brady of this generation well i think it was very sad the way james brady was manipulated for his wife by the well by some to sort of push for these these gun control laws like he ate he was and i hear of them and continues to be and be his wife was really the one running in that little kind of yeah and i think that you know obviously obviously it's their decision whether they want to exploit this tragedy or not but the fact of the n.r.a. or or gabby giffords. or this the city that wants everybody to have

a gun i think that the city in utah doesn't want to have guns in the schools because they want their kids to be in danger they want to do it to protect their children these are these guns well i mean it is currently our school kids yeah exactly so it's a problem. you know i mean if we had guns in their homes they didn't say guns in the schools and who will have the knowledge of the who will have the guns people who go through a federal background check and who are not felons and who are not adjudicated mentally ill just like everybody else going to the entry well there are forty percent of the gun sales that don't i mean when you can go on the internet and say i'm a gun collector and talk to another gun collector and have a sale that doesn't have a background checks this stuff happens and you know what i do use that term to when i was at d.o.j. i actually worked on the background check system that was that was my purview and although i'm a strong supporter of the n.r.a. and the second amendment rights i think that technology has reached a certain point where it's very easy to do the checks and yes i actually would

support any time a gun tain just hands that there's a background check shouldn't shouldn't we take a lesson from automobiles i mean when cars when henry ford first rolled out the model t. at that point time cars had been around for a decade and a half or so there was a couple of dozen different car manufacturers and there was no licensure of cars and people were getting killed left and right because there were no rules that you know they were just coming up with stop signs they had figured out red yellow green lights or they were just starting you know when when ford made a mass product and so we said ok we're going to register the product itself the car because it can cause death and see we need to be able to track that we're going to read it we're going to certify that the operator is competent driver's license and we're going to require no this was all the same time but you know over the course of about a decade a half and we're going to require liability insurance for the person who owns or operates the vehicle want to do the same thing with guns well first of all there's no constitutional right to drive it. car and there is a constitutional right actually only arguably there is article one section eight

provides for congress to build roads and if congress is authorized to build roads then you would assume that you know we're all going to think about it yeah next time i'm pulled over for speeding i. mean come on i'm here at your office or yes you can build roads but you couldn't build roads for horse and buggies you don't have to build all this as it says that they could build it for i mean your post office you have it makes no difference there's a constitutional right to keep and bear arms and people have that right unless you're a member of a militia. you know that's you know that's not what the supreme court said that that is the right and the supreme court says the up is a person and i don't think that's true it just goes to school yes i think he will agree that supreme court is not always right here i actually believe they are right and i think i want to move to this town in new tech as i bet robberies are going to go way down just like kennesaw georgia yes i guess it wouldn't be just down the road from kennesaw georgia that's a fantasy you never broke into a house in kennesaw georgia and i know why i never going to do it and i know why

you never broke into our. lives in the numbers that have been in such a small town that those numbers just fluctuate all over the place be noted sure i've spoken to an officer from kennesaw it contributes to guns of patriots and he said that all the time when they picked guys up they would just shake their head they said i was warned don't go to the saw don't go to the saw it's a it's a you know one of those vanishing check relations but with your grow your gun i mean you know the crime actually went down because crime you know in the big scheme of things to me but here is alex jones last night on piers morgan went off on this thing about we got to have our guns because some day we're going to take on our good moment here he goes. can't work took the guns stalin took the guns mounted to guns but all castro took the gun to hugo chavez took the guns and i'm going to tell you seventy seventy six will come loose again if you try to take our firearms doesn't matter how many we're going to take on our government with our guns really

does anybody seriously believe besides the fact that hitler actually promoted the use in ownership of guns the nazi youth in particular they had gun clubs but you know historical factual aside chris only the nazi youth though not the jews did they i don't think he was encouraging the jews don't know i don't think so you know right because you see what we haven't really who want to have them and when you can register them and control who can have them then you can control who can't have them and the people who disagree with you are the people who let me let me rephrase that because the because the jews in the warsaw ghetto were actually fairly well armed and didn't do them a whole lot of good what what. can you identify any indigenous revolution a revolution where the local people were fighting off themselves they were overthrowing their own government which had become oppressive that was successful i can think of a lot where foreign invaders were repelled or foreign forces like our revolution where we threw off the british but they were hard with they were about to me about

the french revolution the french revolution failed it was followed by three american residue things about us it's touring our own government we were throwing off our government at that why didn't we threw off the british government well before the revolution on the other side of your heart they were already on our side of the ocean right but they were in charge. the brits were in charge yes exactly and we threw them off that's my boy who came here threw off the british that's my point we're still trying to combine all of that and when i look at you know you compare for example age of does the area well it comes down to this do you want to have a firearm in your home to protect yourself against ok an invader yes but do you need one hundred clip magazine maybe do you ok for a bigger who or what about maybe your time maybe i mean queens new york. has just whipped through my community and there's looters and there's violent gangs they just need to get out of the well maybe i don't want to get out of town because

whatever momentos i have in my world are in this foundation this flooded foundation and maybe i want to protect rove if you're going back to the whole new orleans thing more of the people who were killed in new orleans were black people who were killed by white people who were like shooting them as they were trying to flee the city coming across the bridge i mean that there are some really grim stories there and this is against the law and it's not it's already against the law it is was planned but but again we really you have a choice of an india is you know threw off an oppressive government nonviolently south africa nonviolently i think that there's some. to be said for that egypt the people wanted to rear square and they said we don't have guns you know whereas a nice area they're saying ok we're going to take the guns and take down the government sixty thousand people have died already but let me ask you this anything we do in response to newtown connecticut is that going to work nobody out of this problem cannot say what we should do is we should enact policies that actually work

to do what we want them to do i don't disagree that whatever she does as john's right that we know that there's going to be a revolution against the american government if if if there's an effort to disarm and yet not yet in the end one our guy had lunch and a fairly democratic thing some day there were but tom were we to have a tyrant or a despot sometime you know like we look at the you know sam's crystal ball in this future a catastrophe they were able to get loans are as it is guns what are you saying you'd rather have the syrian situation play out than the what option changes if there were crazed troops who are going to attack me and my family i would like the option to die on my feet i would i would submit to you that when those tens of thousands of people were standing there in two or square including women with baby carriages and they said shoot us if you watched and mubarak ultimately said i will step down that i think is not mutually exclusive i think we could have a had those people pulled out the m sixteen zero he would often square i mean

chairman square those students were machine gunned and you would help us and i think that you don't argue that much of the much of the change much of the modernisation of china right now has came right out about that we're going to do it you're going to celebrate their market on their kneels idealism of wanting to go down to hell gunfire the you know why can't you have a rocket launcher look there's an idealism to that why not there is an idealism to this but there's also a reality to this and that's the eleven thousand people are killed every year in america as a result of guns the last several mass shootings in america use the same sort of weapons that we classify as assault weapons with huge going clips despite your idealism. we all have idealism but there's a reality that we have to pass laws to make sure that these weapons are in the hands of men no no i want or i believe in school and any of those things that none of these laws will well would have prevented you just said you agree with more background checks that law could could could do something there but if we didn't have clips that had hung around ammos in it bullets in a hundred rounds shooting that's what the guy who i had

a hundred bull are you talking about banning one hundred rounds are you talking about banning fifteen rounds and there's no big deal at this. time and. point out that ground check chris. thank you very much for being here is that a. crazy alert americans love their colon more than their lawmakers a new study out by public policy polling in which americans were asked to compare their feelings about their lawmakers in washington to other typically unpopular things and let's just say we really like it there is this wife republican controlled congress for instance a whopping sixty seven percent of americans prefer a lice the biggest fear of all on three school nurses two republican controlled congress that has nothing fifty eight percent and fifty six percent of americans

respectively prefer colonoscopies and canals to the republican controlled congress in fact we prefer the republican we dislike the stupid republican controlled congress so much the fifty six percent of us find sitting in traffic involving a bumper traffic at that every rush hour even more favorable than our elected officials should be said however the republican controlled congress did beat out a few things according to the poll americans like congress more than they like lindsey lowe and be a ball of virus. or the kurdish. no more. importantly.

you know how sometimes you see a story and it seems so for lengthly you think you understand it and then you glimpse something else and you hear or see some other part of it and realize everything you thought you knew you don't know i'm sorry welcome to the big.