u.n. peacekeepers are being taken hostage by armed fighters on the border between syria and israel. that is way to begin seven days of mourning for its late iconic leader hugo chavez the country's president for fourteen years who died after a long battle with cancer at the age of fifty eight here are the latest pictures from the streets of caracas where his body is now being moved from the hospital. the commandant his death raises questions over the future of the country's oil industry with some of the world's largest reserves now being eyed by many not least the u.s. we look at the prospects. also fresh clashes between police and protesters erupt in egypt. despite the prospect of the army taking full control of the rest of city something president morsi is considering following days of deadly violence up top stories.

around the world on screen online international news and comment live from our new center here in moscow this is. our breaking news the u.n. says about twenty international peacekeepers have been detained by a group of fighters on the border between syria and israel earlier an online video emerged purporting to show syrian rebels with the captured convoy well joining me now on the phone is our middle east correspondent paula. paula tell us about this latest development what has happened. what do you do the united nations has confirmed that about twenty other peacekeepers have been detained by round armed fighters in the golan heights on the border between syria and israel the united nations it had been to change to a gold situation the confirmation from the un come to the front to you tube video

that purports to show syrian rebels with the convoy the rebel calling them child the martyrs of young look now in a statement issued in new york the human capability on a regular supply mission and were stopped near an observation post which had to stay in that region which was evacuated last weekend doing due to heavy comeback in the area peacekeepers some members of the un duplicate an observer force to be able to operate in twenty four hours three and four don't get out of the village after molecules in the theory and going on hi welcome to the p.p. prison because they claim it to you in full aberrated what the syrian government to drive the fighters out of the pledge taken time before who had been taken had taken up each one of the united nations back on the table to get it behind that to the united nations force commander in the golan heights what that got him he still being held we don't know where and. overcome shortly after the u.s.

played aid to the rebels and britain says it cannot supply me rebels with on in the future. paula thanks very much indeed for that no doubt so we'll be talking to you more on this is further developments emerge but in the meantime paula live there from israel thank you very much for that update. but as well is morning is late president hugo chavez who has died at the age of fifty eight after losing his battle with cancer now these are the latest pictures from correct as we have for you here in r.t. where his body is being moved from a hospital there in the city to a military academy where it will lie in state the funeral is due to take place on friday thousands of the socialist leaders supporters of a mast in the streets there coming down his death is one of latin america's most remarkable populist rules but it's also left the nation politically divided and early in my colleague paul scott spoke to lucy coming off he's recently returned from the country. it's often been said the child this is a very charismatic figure it's been quite clear quite evident on the streets in the

campaign rallies when we were there watching him operate what china's really did for venezuela is drastically revolutionize the way the country is run and operated before travis came to power was largely seen close u.s. ally seen as sort of embracing the western economic model of us came from very poor background poor roots and he came to power with his self-styled so-called bowl of aryan revolution where he wanted to bring socialist ideals to the country and change the country what he meant by that is radically and empowering the poor communities that for decades had been neglected in venezuela making them feel that they mattered in a system that for many years was set up in a way that was against them he was often able to sort of connect with people in a way that other politicians you don't often see for example he would play musical instruments at his different press conferences his you know long nine hour marathon t.v. appearances may have been somewhat boring if i even even at the political rallies

for example the last one that he held before the election we were there was pouring rain he was fighting cancer we knew that he was sick and he got right up there on stage you know walked away from his security detail walked up up front and started dancing with the crowd and you sort of love him or hate him you really sort of saw the human being come through and i think that really helped people feel that they can relate to them especially the for you know you talk to his charisma there and you mention the poll in the social programs he introduced usual for some of the projects that helped consolidate you support a secular government people living up in those longs or barrios there used to be no way to get down to the city to find work or go to school simply walking down those hills you think about an hour and how it used to be no public transportation until president bush has built these cable cars a literal lifeline for venezuela's poor and i was just cable cause was it that led to his popularity of course of course won't be interesting thing as what you. in that clip we were sort of driving over riding over the barrio and venezuela is

a country with a massively large urban population of some twenty million people about seventeen live in cities and until chavez came to power these people didn't have access i mean they weren't physically able to get down for example into the city to get jobs that's why the cable cars were important they didn't have any social services like health care for example so chavez helped build these pre health care clinics that gave them for the first time access to services that most people in in developed countries are used to he helped create education programs he also got into these sort of micro financing programs for example if you and your friends wanted to start a sewing commune of sorts in the bank would give you money at interest rates that were much lower than typical financial operations and you were able to create businesses that way and so it really it empowered the community but it also led to criticism that he was sort of using petro dollars to win over support with the poor which we talk about how popular the last election the one you were in october the one you were there for was one of the most divisive it was an even though he won

that election with pretty much the same percentage that he did in his very first the first time he ran for office fourteen years prior to that there were cracks that were emergent because although he won massive support with the social progress programs among the poor there work there was criticism that he wasn't this really building the kinds of institutions that would help venezuela develop economically sure they had a lot of oil dollar wealth that doesn't mean that they were necessarily building the kinds of programs that would sustain economic development and there were also other problems that had pushed supporters away even from the barrios for example the crime rate as well as a country has about twenty million people something like twenty thousand murders in two thousand and twelve just to contrast that with the united states three hundred fifteen million people twelve thousand murders that same year. an incredibly big issue and so was i mean some of the corruption those were also problems in the country that childlessness trying to battle but you know at the end of the day regardless of how divisive he was he's certainly permanently changed the picture of

venezuela and also in the region because he has policies you know he didn't just work in venezuela if you try to export those policies to his allies in the region and sort of try to create radical change in that sense i love him or hate him he's certainly going to be remembered when as we just heard his champion economic reform vost oil wealth as well as one of the world's biggest oil producers and nations depending on those supplies a keenly awaiting wat happens next not least the u.s. . explains. venezuela is a major player in the world oil trade its deposits are estimated at around two hundred ninety seven billion barrels as you can see just there that's comparable to those of saudi arabia the world's biggest or produce another country is currently the fifth largest oil exporter amounting to ninety five percent of the country's export but actual production is far behind it that's due to decades of

investment since one thousand nine hundred ninety eight or output has fallen twenty five percent our production price well i can tell you that right now as far as the oil markets are concerned the price has been relatively muted and that's because assad as it sounds chavez's death was already priced in we are expecting a spike to pending on who will take power unless and a month's time and where their loyalties lie venezuela is one of the largest buyers of russian military hardware and trade between the two is only up russian firms have a strong presence in venice waiter's energy sector rosneft is there our local has worked in the country for almost a decade now on the gas side gas problem has been there since two thousand and eight now contracts with venezuela are all based on deals made with chavez and his government and as we know ross nafs the head eagle surgeon he'll actually be

attending the funeral which have a says funeral and he'll probably be making sure that those deals stay intact. kitty pilgrim there well for more on the legacy of chavez and the implications of his passing i'm joined by a british m.p. graeme morris he's also chair of the u.k. labor friends of venezuela thanks very much indeed for being with us now predictions for the country's future range from the vice president maduro quietly assuming the leadership to a possible civil war after all today madeira did call for calm throughout the country what do you make of the future. well having visited venezuela bill i think the improvements the investments in the software programs some of the points that you touched on earlier in the program vast expansion of. tackling some of the immense problems the legacy of the previous regimes a suspect looking at the trends of electoral success for president chavez i think

his successor will speak in a a very very strong position but he's got a huge problem has he not to take on i know you said you've been to the country you seen the results of some of his reform programs but we also get a picture of a crumbling infrastructure where there's been a lack of investment high crime rates an ailing economy a lot of corruption there that's not exactly the sort of picture that you've painted to me. well that there are certainly issues and crimes a big issue that's recognized internally as well as externally and certainly there are huge corporate vested interests especially in the united states the don't see a continuation of president chavez's progressive legacy he has been a bit of a an example a shining example in many respects to much of latin america in terms of the independence of thought and applying the country's vast oil wealth to the levy ation of poverty on social programs so there is certainly those in the west who

would want to see chavez's legacy continue and the opposition has considerable support from the united states in particular who want to see change of regime there would you think that opposition could have a chance of gaining power after all chavez was accused of suppressing political freedoms freedom of speech but do you think that help from the u.s. there is a chance that the opposition could gain some sort of ground. well i don't think that that's a legitimate criticism of president jimmy carter he runs an internationally respected institute as conducted research and monitored ninety two separate elections and he says venezuela's elections are the freestone feresten seen and you know given their long tradition of democracy the success not just in the presidential elections you know all the votes in the subsequent elections for the governorships the prevention of provincial elections chavez's party did exceptionally well and so i really think

a good feeling for chavez and for his legacy i think they're in a very very strong position i suspect the opposition candidate will do it again because. he will have to support the right wing media and certain elements of the of the not for me to write it states but. given the success that president chavez has hired in terms of lifting so many people out of poverty it's quite a remarkable achievement giving them access giving creating lots of opportunity access to education health i think this is quite a powerful legacy and i think it's a strong basis for local support and party just briefly much of that success grim of course based on what pretty much all of those oil reserves all that oil revenue what happens now what happens now after his death what we see the door open to these massive reserves will there be a massive scramble what happens and who could benefit from this if there is there

is a change there. well bill the reserves are always there not believe that venezuela has. some of the biggest normal reserves anywhere in the world and of course one of the things that. disconcerting to the united states is that president chavez nationalize the oil resources of the country and is using the profits and proceeds for the benefit of the people and particularly for poor people there in venezuela so i think their normal oil reserves and their. ability to fund social programs is beyond dates or you know there are think we have quite a future in that regard thank you very much of your time graeme morris british m.p. also for inviting me thank you very much indeed that's graham who's also chair of u.k. labor friends of venezuela joining us live there from the u.k. well of course we're interested in your view on what awaits venezuela head to dot com and vote on our on line poll now of course we want you to tell us what you

think will happen following the news of chavez's death and we can see that opinion is fairly divided this stage almost half believe the country will carry on as before led by the vice president a third say that the country might fall into the opposition's hands which of course is backed by the u.s. so they say a little less fear that the country will descend into chaos due to an imminent power struggle and finally less than ten percent seven percent at the moment think that the country become more moderate under a new leadership so go to r.t. dot com and have your say if you haven't done so already we could to hear from you well we are to have interviewed hugo chavez and that was before he was diagnosed with cancer and here are some of the highlights of that interview in which as usual he was never afraid to pull any punches. you know bush and his era his village are an aggressive imperialist policy greatly home the world i said there was a smell of sulfur i meant bush had been there maybe he was accompanied by the devil

and it was him he left behind the smell of sofas when i first came to latin american summits i was an old bird in comparison to other participants at the end of one summit video gave me a piece of paper he had written chavez now i feel that i am not the only devil at the summit i would have won the election if i had been an american of course it would have ended with my murder as happened with martin luther king and many other leaders. clashes are again raging in egypt's restive city of port saeed while president morsi is considering giving the military full control there at least six people are being killed and hundreds wounded in the latest wave of street battles between security forces and young egyptians on his car across one of bell tree rings as well. president mohamed morsi met with top security officials on tuesday reportedly

to discuss pulling the police out of the restive city of course and instead putting the military in place this is because of four days of clashes between police and antigovernment protesters in this restive city including protesters torching the national security agency building with additional fires in the government headquarters and the security directorate this comes of course i had a very contentious verdict on saturday for this. massacre that took place last year in february and it started when thirty nine defendants were moved from the prison the families of those defendants in this case were very upset with this and so the crisis began between the police and protesters seeing hundreds injured and at least five kids meanwhile we have violence here in the capital as well just off the three square by the nile has been intermittent street battles between anti-government protesters and police although the opposition is not cohesive there are definitely similar grievances being expressed across the country that there's been no change

since the revolution in two thousand and eleven a feeling that president obama is making very unpopular decisions such as backing this four point eight billion dollar i.m.f. loan which will see subsidies cuts and tax hikes in addition people are saying that the constitution was drafted by islamist dominated constituent assembly so people really here are feeling that nothing has changed and there are many problems in the country which means that is a very likely this is the violence is likely to continue in the next few weeks. he lived in moscow coming up later in the program for you don't sing on the edge about a story which he just shocking acid attack on the bolshoi theatre chief which left him almost blind and ballet fans speechless we've got all the details on that after the break.

they've been living this way since the seventeenth century. their rituals are strict. their communities are the salafis. they clearly distinguish between their own and the alien. and guard their families and think the treasure.

news continues here in r.t.m. villa on the stage whose dunston self into a whole lot of trouble offit one of the bolshoi theatre is top sort of us who recently played ivan the terrible as admitted he was behind a shocking acid attack on the company's ballet director setting a fillin the assault left the victim nearly blinded aunties and. has this report. one of the world's most famous theaters the bolshoi is still recovering from a huge scandal when its artistic director was thrown a ball of us into his face but it also seems to be losing one of its leading don says vital dmitrichenko admitted that he must to mind it this acid attack on the artistic director of the bolshoi sergei filin because he disliked his boss

certainly this is enough for him to be prosecuted to be punished but the unconfirmed reports suggest that he carried out this attack you masterminded this attack because feeling as the artistic director of the bolshoi did not allow his wife to perform a leading role in one of the one of the place supposedly the famous swarm like the other two men the one who carried out this attack and the driver who brought the executioner to the place also admitted to carrying out this attack we all saw in the black swan hollywood movie how tough life can be behind the scenes of the big ballet this certainly was fiction but it's no different to reality the bolshoi has been surrounded by lots of control over seas from addresses being cut ahead of the blaze ahead of the big stage to gloss being put in the dancing shoes of the performers in one of the scandals one of the administrators even had to

resign because of pornographic pictures were made public on the internet definitely . has been surrounded by control received but it's never made criminal headlines as was the first case like that or feeling partially regain his eyesight we understand that he's now under treatment in germany and probably he will be returning to work in six or seven months time as has been predicted by doctors now. to other international news here in r.t. europe's largest active volcano has erupted in a stunning display of spouting lava and pluming smoke small villages residing on the slopes of mount etna said to be at risk of a number of roads in the area have been blocked volcano which is situated on the italian island of sicily rises more than three thousand meters above the ground and the rocks a number of times each year. at least sixty people been arrested following a student demonstration in canada's montreuil protesting against the height in tuition fees police in riot gear used tear gas and sound bombs to disperse the

crowd it's a repeat on a smaller scale of scenes witnessed during the so-called maple spring of last year then hundreds of students ended up in jail and get broken promises over education fees. huge crowds are valid in the philippines after one of the country's muslim groups was attacked by security forces over a territorial dispute in malaysia yes trunk was carried out on tuesday in the state of home to hundreds of thousands of filipino settlers protesters accuse the country's president of a banding in his people in a territorial struggle and urging a peaceful resolution. britain has been left alone a voice in the bar defending bankers' bonuses as the rest of the bloc to rein them in the measures are popular with a sturdy europeans many of whom say it's the bankers who triggered the financial rollercoaster in the first place. explains just why britain is so adamant. it's that time of year again bonus season is in full swing the chief executive of

h.s.b.c. is set to pocket a two million pound bonus this month for the way that u.k. bankers get paid could be about to change that's if the european union has anything to do with it at the moment the average bank a salary is just under seventy thousand pounds a year but bonuses for top bankers can be many times more than their baseline depending on personal performance the success of the bank and the market as a whole last year the bonus pools of leading city banks went up to as much as two point four billion pounds of c. but if the e.u. proposal goes ahead next year banks would be blocked from paying out bonuses larger than double in employees basic salary much against downing street swishes some banks some teams of people some revenue some profits some tax revenue.

and to that extent written before voices inside the city say that big banks in the u.k. might be forced to pay higher base salaries in order to keep the most talented executives there are very few sectors in which united kingdom is a world leading financial services is one of the high basics impose a constant overhead which can be adjusted easily from year to year whereas the bonuses can be part of the success of the market has been that element of flexibility you can award a larger bonus in one year and. another year and with the european economy still flatlining voters want to see those bonuses down but there are fears that the measure could end up putting london at a disadvantage to the text tape. coming from buying because not just in the bonuses

but in general is huge estimated to be over and above forty billion pounds a year so the point here is that effectively this is taking away people from the economy this could be forcing people to go elsewhere and the trickle down effect of that will be dramatic overregulation in other areas has cost the k. many of its manufacturing hubs also new economies coming on board and that has obviously had an effect bankers might not be the most popular characters in all sincerity stricken britain right now but the fact is that the financial services industry is vital to the u.k. economy and a few of those that have one thing that is including chancellor george osborne say that they're concerned that it can happen as thinking that it's not just on the city of london but on the british economy as a whole the rest of europe however is determined to push compensation in the financial sector down with a final vote penciled in from

a bonus season next year could end up being an altogether more subdued affair. see london. just turned twenty seven minutes past the hour in moscow time for the latest business news with natasha joins me now in the studio so all eyes of course on venezuela what is going to happen to russia's multi billion dollar investments in his energy sector well that's the billion dollar question but as you'll get to find out from the business bulletin actually some people say that russia is going to lose it all just like the united states did when chavez came to power all the details after a short break frank sinatra. well

. it's technology innovation all the latest developments from around

russia we've got the future of covered. twenty nine minutes past the hour here in moscow you're watching business r.t. welcome to the program the death of the venezuelan president hugo chavez leaves a lot of unanswered questions for oil producing countries like russia and the united states one of the biggest uncertainties has to do with the country's future energy policies just hours after the world learned that chavez lost his battle with cancer the head of the country's national oil giant petroleum is devon as wall of ballard to continue the social leaders legacy. said quote the situation in the sector will not change but there's absolutely no doubt that the competition told in as well as energy assets will intensify with deposits estimated at almost three

hundred billion barrels the country's reserves are comparable to those of saudi arabia the world's biggest oil producer so it's understandable why the united states a superpower in the american continent has its sights set on venezuela the us oil companies after all were the ones that helped the country develop its first walls in the beginning of the twentieth century under child as many foreign owned assets were confiscated here's how much the u.s. companies claim they've lost in venezuela conoco phillips once the biggest foreign stakeholder in as well is looking to recover more than twenty billion dollars of lost assets xom mobil is seeking twelve billion dollars for its last several negro project chevron is still working in the country but it's under constant pressure there ironically the united states remains the biggest consumer of venezuelan oil not to mention that the u.s. refineries mainly process that dense high sulfur oil that venezuela produces but

russia and china. also i have a sizable presence in that as well and was never pledged to invest up to forty billion dollars over the years with its now subsidiary. developing several fields in the south east region for almost a decade russia's largest privately owned oil company lukoil has been developing venezuela's already no coal oil belts and russia's gas giant gazprom has a stake in the gulf of venezuela russia's also a big in china i should say is also a big investor it's state owned c.n. fisi has a big project in the who me and four block china's development bank agreed to lend the country forty billion dollars against crude oil sales so the biggest question is what's going to be done as well as energy policy in the post chavez era will the

successor likely to be nicolas maduro be even more radical than chavez as he tries to prove his loyalty to a child as in his ideals those are the questions i asked jorge mon to pick a of plots energy agency. i mean in this area where the completely speculation area so we can be right or wrong but when you change or leave there you always have some changes to the spall it's right it is almost the norm that the policies after they're being set by somebody else that they're being respected initially but then they tend to change over time so what is more likely is that they'll be perhaps a loosening of those socialist ideas because on a frank bases you can see the auction in the production in venezuela and i think the pressure is building to run to venice or i mean the street

a little bit more market oriented you have also seen all the efforts now in mexico to run the only industry more market oriented so frankly i think it is likely that at the beginning it will be the same but he will change later on perhaps a little bit less socialism more market oriented ok well if it's more or less clear with mr mudd dural we're likely to see some continuity what are the chances that the opposition should it when the election well actually perform a complete about face when it comes to vent as well as energy policy essentially kicking out companies from russia and china and replacing them with those from the states. well i don't think things change that quickly and that dramatically of course the opposition wants to go on a full market basis but we know that in the world of politics it's always the world

of compromise so on a compromises basis i think of as has been offering oil to some of its friends in the caribbean and central america i think they'll be pressured to maybe cut back a little but not fully one hundred percent. with the russians and the chinese is an issue particularly with the chinese market price. if in a solar cells at a market price there's no reason why china shouldn't buy it at market price because china buys from anyone else at a market price. the russian companies will have no choice but to leave venezuela losing billions of dollars in the process that's according to consent of the national energy security fund in my opinion there are two possible scenarios for. of course the main question is what will be the result of the new elections in the us will. of course vice president my daughter will really election.

there will be no. contracts and. so the fate of our companies in israel will be. quite good or maybe a mother asks. for so extra expenditures or something like these but he will not abolish the contracts. but in my opinion there is of course the possibility of another scenario because the position is really squares drawn would remember all of us present elections. in two thousand and twelve. gap between. chavis and his main rival was just several percent and it means that a mother or lose the election and this scenario will be extremely dangerous for us in kabul. and that. in this case we will see the return of american

companies to work as well because it's not a secret service reserved for americans from venezuela there were seriousness and ization of the industry. and of course they want to topple this country and in this case we'll see the result of russian companies maybe we'll learn some lessons from this story because for me it's a serious question why our companies there are so active in in western. europe because we have huge resources in russia we have green fields in eastern c.b.d. we don't know what to do is our arctic said when why the americans to be our partners in the russian project. and at the same time when the west billion dollars . for me is a very strange bullis. time now to take

a look at some figures first the energy markets as expected crude remains pretty much indifferent to the news of the venezuelan leader dying because it has been the to supported price in event both it and brant have been shedding value pretty much before trading sessions mainly on higher than expected u.s. inventories now moving on wall street where trade is active this hour the stocks are mixed with the nasdaq actually slipping into red over the past hour that's following a record high for the dow one choose day the dow remains a beat the sour you have closed it makes on wednesday the footsie hit fifty two week record in early train before sliding down to end the session slot to negative in germany the dax finished above the line moving on to currencies the euro fell against the dollar ahead of the e.c.b. meeting scheduled for thursday here in moscow the russian ruble finished the day

mixed a lower to the dollar but higher to the single currency and finally the equities here in russia proved resilient to lower crude prices on ones they think modern gave moderate gains for the days bear bank will outperform the market gaining more than one percent each. and not full of the latest from us and business next on our team out in the part niall learns all the details of how washington board hundreds of billions of dollars into the banks at the height of the two thousand and eight financial crisis and where the measures have let you keep it here in our city.

these children are in me. they're serving a sentence just like their mother. little ones born in prison. now must pay for the crimes committed by their parents. kill babies on our t.v. . more news today violence is once again flared up. again these are the images the world has been seeing from the streets of canada asked china operations or on the day.

he was the special inspector general in charge of overseeing the troubled assets relief program otherwise known as tarp and his three year experience as outlined in his book bailout how washington abandoned main street to rescue wall street r.t. is happy to be joined by neil barofsky for a one on one interview thank you very much for sitting down with me today it's my pleasure you refer to washington as an alley in world a culture more concerned with looking out for themselves or the next headline what happened with the tarp program that led you to say something like that well you know it was a remarkable thing coming in i was i was a lifelong democrat i even contributed to then senator obama's presidential campaign but i was actually appointed by president bush republican and it was so striking to me as a you know as a lifelong democrat of how little things have changed and everything i think over

time it became increasingly so was very much politicized decisions were made with an eye towards the the press cycle what's what headlines are going to get generated and sometimes it just resulted in remarkably head scratching counterfactual arguments that had very little to do with what tarp was supposed to do so the official story line official narrative which survives to this day is that tarp or tarp was incredibly successful because it helped preserve the financial system but that's not what tarp was supposed to do history was a vote was eventually rewritten by the treasury department to make it seem like tarp all was ever supposed to do was put this band-aid over a broken financial system and all those other things for which there would never have been a bank bailout all those things are supposed to help people other than the executives at the giant financial solutions well that just got ignored and sort of brushed away you've said that the largest banks in the u.s.

did and still do hold a gun to the head of america's financial system why placentia in the most recent stuff that we've seen coming out. department of justice and they have done some big settlements they did was h.s.b.c. over sort of a breathtaking amount of money laundering they've done some of the library cases on interest rate rigging with some of the big european banks and one of them that big questions has been raised well why are you not requiring guilty pleas from these these institutions with a response apartment of justice was well if we charge these institutions it could potentially destabilize the entire economic system of the world the global economic system and this is the i mean the stunning admission and look i give them an a for honesty this means that in essence there's two sets of rules and now the special subset of too big to fail slash too big to jail corporations and that of course creates a tremendous incentive to do what to commit more fraud to break the laws so who is

managing the u.s. economy the government or the banks. you know look at that's a fair question a lot of the management of the government of the government in the economy is sort of outsourced in a way towards the banks you know that's how tarp was originally run was it wasn't that ok here we are us the government we have this these hundreds of billions of dollars we're going to save these banks we're going to save these guys for the purpose of we want the bags to put this money back into the economy to increase lending to businesses homeowners to get the economy rolling again but when they did it they didn't do it the way that you would think that you would if that was your goal would say ok banks j.p. morgan chase you know here's your twenty five billion dollars but when you use this you know you're going to agree that you're going to use it to increase lending and we're going to measure that or we're going to incentivize that or at least require it if not incentivize it and keep track of it like that's how you would think would be if the government was running the program but that's not what they did they gave us the facts no shrinks attached no conditions no requirements no incentives no

transparency when i said hey hey guys why don't we make the banks tell us what they're doing with the money so we can own report. have a says whether throwing these goals you know i was told that i was stupid that i was playing politics that if i did it myself i was going to destroy the banking system this led to tim geithner himself cursing me out of the meeting when i suggest that he was a thing less than the most transparent secretary of the treasury in the country's history and this is all part of that incredible deference that they show to the bank so it was give the money to the bags and trust them and of course what happened the banks and use the money from and they make they hoarded it they lied to back to the government they invested it they did whatever they could to maximize their profits they did almost everything other than increase lending and lending actually contract it so that certain example of where the government had incredible amount of control and leverage and chose not to use it is that because the banks have so much power and influence in washington and that number is number one reason

why the banks. trumped the homeowners when it came to talk it was a remarkable thing so it's a yes but it's not like sort of just the traditional way we think of the way that any corp arch corporations or powerful corporations have influence in washington where we typically say that we think about of the money and the campaign contributions and the lobbying and all that it's totally valid but what i saw was far different and frankly far more insidious and to me much more damaging and dangerous it was more of the complete ideological capture of these individuals and by that i mean these are people who fought and believed they were doing the right thing but so a den of side with the interest of wall street largest banks that that became the only the only thing that mattered but even those who didn't come from washington tim geitner secretary of the treasury was present in the new york fed. who never worked at a wall street bank but still is so surrounded by it and so had adopted this world

view that you know i don't think he was lying when he thought that oh i'm doing what's best for the country the problem. is that he was so blinded by this prejudice in favor of the wall street banks that that's all that mattered overall how much have the ballots cost the american economy what's your figure whatever i have a number of always just recounting whatever the officials are so treasury's official number now i think is in the new order of fifty to sixty billion dollar losses on the tarp program. i think that do see below is a lower number maybe about twenty four billion dollars of losses so i'm not i'm not sure of that but i think that there's this tendency to minimize the cost of the bailout to make it seem that oh it wasn't all that bad look at these numbers are low here where we made money on this part of the program that it glosses over really the incredible amount of damage i mean we're talking about in the tire years worth of g.d.p. or the entire production of the entire american economy wiped out because of this

financial crisis and one of the biggest costs which we've not yet realized you know the way the ballots were conducted is that we put essentially a bad date over a gaping chest wound and we have the same type of broken financial system that we did in two thousand and eight only with banks that are more concentrated more powerful and more dangerous and all the bad incentives that led to crisis in zero eight in many ways are still in place thus leading to why believe as the next financial crisis there's still chance to do the types of things to keep that from happening which i hope will happen but if left undisturbed whether it's two years four years or eight years it's going to happen again it's just sort of naive to look at all the incentives and all the things that are still in the system that caused crisis before and presume that for some magical reason they won't happen again what are the biggest challenges for the u.s. economy at this stage is it still little or weak regulation is it the power of the

banks or is it other issues like get unemployment whether. the number one challenge let's all sort of short term medium term long term it's all it's sort of depending on what and what you do look right now we have an unemployment crisis in this country long term unemployed is just been devastating our unemployment rate is too high it's been too high for too long you know we're going to have people who are out of work for so many years it's going to be markedly difficult for them to get back to work this fuels income inequality which is a very very significant problem in this country and is going to be a long term structural issue that somehow we're going to need to contend with you know a recent study came out that of the so-called financial recovery that the top one percent basically gobbled up all of the recovery melts and then some while everyone else is guy actually gotten poor little the richer got richer the poor got poorer these are sort of unsustainable long term trends that are really problematic for

the economy as far as what i think is the biggest threat of a giant shock it is still the fragile nature of the banks and the amount of money that this will cost if we don't arrest it before another crisis strikes is staggering the last crisis cost thirteen trillion dollars one can only imagine what will happen next time because last time it least we had a lot of room fiscally we were our debt you know the debts in the deficit that we've been running since then have given us a lot less less flexibility to deal with the crisis the idea of getting an eight hundred billion dollars stimulus through congress and then in the base of the next crisis may be politically much more difficult getting a seven hundred billion dollar bad like what we had because in part because of the terrible way the bailout was run and minister is going to be a problem next time you know we could be looking at a crisis that will make the last one look almost pedestrian you know so that i think is really one of the sort of potentially medium to long term dangers to the economy that if we don't fix it you know could prove very very devastating do you

think the eurozone should and bark on something similar to tarp you know i think that europe's problem with its bags is probably even worse than our. here in the country with our bags they're about your european banks or even larger as far as percentage of the g.d.p. of the various countries i think they probably enjoyed even more support through the implicit guarantee which is all but explicitly in the difference between you know deutsche bank in the german government is almost it's almost impossible to discern in a large a lot of large european banks are are simply are beyond too big to fail so you have a situation there where these banks get into a crisis the european governments are going to have to bail them out but my advice is don't do what we did which is just preserve that status quo and then move on which is what we've done here and leave that broken status quo in place europe should do exactly what the united states needs to do break up these institutions what do you think it will take for u.s. banks to face true justice or for the government to actually put the citizens for

tax nothing's going to happen in the near term i think that's pretty clear the only way i think to break through and get the types of reform that we need will be one in the aftermath of another crisis which is you know which is which i think will be devastating and let's hope that that doesn't happen but most realistically that's probably the way we're secondly i think if there's another good big enough significant enough scandal and the one reliable things about the largest banks is that they are scandal producing machines it's again it's not surprising it's because of the incentives it's because of the lack of accountability or lack of punishment it's profitable to commit fraud or bend the rules or break the rules or take huge risks the differences between now and two thousand and eight is that there are a lot more people out there now politicians academics journalists who recognize that we have a broken system who recognize that the only path towards

a stable economic system that will benefit everyone is by breaking up the large financial institutions it's not enough and not enough. little power to get it done now but i think if when the time is right there is enough support that i that i hope that this can get move forward and finally get the protections that we should have had back in two thousand and ten but don't have yet it's pretty bad right now how much worse would it have to get you know i don't know and you know we saw glimpses of the occupy wall street movement we saw glimpses in the tea party movement you know which was originally about the unfairness of the bailouts is what triggered a lot of the tea party anger but we also saw those movements you know are they've transformed so i think there's a lot of anger out there still but it hasn't found a place to be channeled and but look i think we continue go down this path it's almost inevitable that it will start to once again erupt and the question is what is that trigger going to be a can it turn to something more than

a bunch of angry people yelling into a significant political movement it didn't happen with the presidential race of twenty twelve but you know again i think it's going to be to take some additional extra oil shock to get people into the into this game but it is a problem and it is you know some of this stuff is difficult to to understand actually i don't think it's that difficult understanding it's actually made complex by the banks and the politicians in order to make people think that it's more complicated than it actually is and look one of things i try to do in this book is try to explain these in ways that people can understand and realize that you know what you don't need a doctorate in finance to understand that our system is broken and that you know so much of the banks lobbying power and the politicians power is try to confuse people with concepts that are under true i mean just simple distortions of basic economic truths in order to carry their agenda and try to you know educate and bring people up to speed on this stuff is probably part of that process now for oscar thank you

very much for your time my pleasure. wealthy british style. six platinum. markets why not. come to. find out what's really happening to the global economy with mike's concert for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines tune in to kaiser report on archie.

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