make up their own mind of policy and the kremlin was into fear that much but having said that you know they're still worried about the grove they want to see some some action some sort of growth and the spoil the precious beans cut rates in many ways russia you know being a transition country the the things it has to deal with unusual for central bank anyway is that more volatile i think this is the seventh crisis i've been through since the start of the ninety's and the other say that policy continuity is the key for russia central bank at the moment and that maybe we're not perfect we is cut out for that. bill and never was the supporter of state capitalism she always understood the role of the state in regulating the economy but market economy so the worry of the people who discussed the candidates or potential candidates in the previous period the worry was this

trend to state capitalism symbolized by some people and some names now bulimia is there from italy the continuation of the policy of economic stability of adequate rates of inflation versus the exchange rate of ruble will be very cautious she will be very tough on those who want to violate the status quo also from this point of view more of the economic liberties and more of the economic discipline more of the financial stability that will be the moto of mrs not be all in favor that very much. let's quickly run through the markets very troubling trade on wall street where the session is in full swing this hour the dow and that as dot com managing to stay in the positive territory at the moment european shares and is it a mixed on wednesday the footsie closed in the red the dax managed to stay above

the line just barely in moscow stocks should value on wednesday losses in europe and asia and of course sliding crude prices proved a bit too much for russia's blue chips moving on to the next story the world is on the verge of an energy market revolution its magnitude will make shale gas pale in comparison japan has become the first country to produce gas from methane hydrate in the frozen layers of the ocean unlike shale gas methane hydrate is everywhere in the ocean and as deposits will allow the world to have twice as much energy as we've had with oil gas and cool put together here's how the world energy council's chris the fray describes the impact of this discovery on the global energy markets . it's massive the mast if innovation picks up in the same very similar very. good deeds in the shade it could be the next game changer

potential of. methane hydrates massive again this would really expand the resource space inspired by another order of magnitude russia plans to spend billions of dollars on the arctic self development although some apps for it say that it's not really necessary at the moment to explore such expensive deposits in extremely difficult places what's your take on that conventional reserves are about one point three trillion but what came on board basically with the shale oil is four point eight trillion so a multiple of the existence of. or conventional oil so this is a massive there's no question about peak oil anymore today and this big picture. resource coming to the table obviously puts into question it's all those projects that are of the expensive side and the arctic is a very expensive. oil exploration exercise it's

a difficult one it's clear from the climate from the human from the technological from every single aspect is a number some people say it's just difficult to go into the moon and i think are such those projects that are the markets will be will be very carefully looking after those projects which are coming cheaper to the table at the moment the shale oil context obviously puts big new supply opportunities to the market that were not there by an arctic claim are possibly could vestment pertwee it certainly slows down the priority for it to go forward how can russia is quite conventional oil and gas industry survive in this rapidly changing environment russia is not in the first need. to develop the the alternatives i think the question is the question for russia in march more well there are two big markets various to rapid growth and

that is obviously in asia if you look at china if you look at what happened also in the fukushima context of how it affected the supply the thirst for gas other fossil resources in japan possibly korea and other parts of asia that is obviously a massive growth opportunity there but the players in asia they watch very carefully what is going on in north america they want to tap into cheap gas cheap potentially cheap oil and told us russia position itself. new dynamics in that system of very new dynamics i think it will be very important to come with strong messages with clear vision. an offering of innovative partnerships with the asian players who look for more energy security who look for green growth and that's all the latest from the business team this hour up next on archie we speak with the former cia director michael hayden about the political interests of the united

states in light at the recent death of venezuela and as well as leader of china. these are decent faces of freedom fighters. and. they're ready to clean up a new sort of. liberty anytime. so loot play free float.

up. like to be treated this way. sherry and diary an archie.

he is a retired four star general of the u.s. air force and also served as director of america's national security agency and central intelligence agency joining our team now for an exclusive one on one interview is general michael hayden thank you very much for taking the time to speak with me today thank you i'd like to begin our discussion with major news event that took place last week that event being the death of venezuelan president hugo chavez now mr chavez was known for his hard line stance towards the u.s.

he even accused the cia once of plotting to kill him will relations with them as well as be troubled if vice president nicolas maduro says seeds chavez as president you know one fears that they might one also hope that they might not i think president chavez a very strong populist clearly very popular and some segments there is running society he took an awful lot of the support off a lot of his identity simply by being by appearing to be in opposition to the north just as an opposition to to the united states and whether or not we were causing him problems it was convenient for him to accuse us of causing him problems i actually think the problem for right now that they haven't done a lot of structural although he enjoyed wide popular support among the poorer classes he did not do much to reinvest to reinvest in the infrastructure reinvest in the oil industry which state resources depend and so i think the new president

is going to have to take a very realistic look at what he needs to do in order to carry out even to continue some of the policies of his predecessors which was you know i mean i may be firm some elements of strong social justice but you can't share things you don't have you have to create and that requires greater cooperate. mission with the private sector and other segments of venezuelan society and frankly greater cooperation with the united states let's shift gears now and move on to another topic that's been dominating the headlines at that topic the drones of course due to the nomination of john brennan as cia director now u.s. drones have reportedly killed thirteen hundred people in pakistan since obama came into office those people not just terrorists but a lot of civilians too this has outraged pakistan an ally of the u.s. medic many critics say that the u.s.

drone campaign is actually inciting a lot of hatred towards america and breeding terrorism and terrorists do you believe drones are the right weapon in the war on terror and are they being used in the right way this is a complex question and it doesn't allow the simple answer richard haass president of the council on foreign relations said something very interesting in an interview in which i was a participant richard said when it comes to targeted killings in the use of drones he's looking not for a switch but for a dial and i think that's actually very profound that's i think that's very insightful look we are we believe we are a nation at war we are at war with al qaeda and its affiliates this war is global in scope and we have both a right and a duty to take this fight to the sentiment wherever they may be and in some cases that requires targeted killing and some of the ungoverned spaces that remain on the

planet now for the longest time the immediate effect of a targeted killing that you have as as we say we have taken off the battlefield someone already convinced trained and prepared to do harm to the united states that immediate effect trumped everything else that that effect was overwhelming in terms of the calculus one had to make. as to whether you should do this or not do it but even then three four years ago even then we realize that wasn't the only effect there were also second and third order effects effects on our allies effects on the willingness of others to cooperate effects on al qaeda recruitment effects on the global image of the united states and no i think it's fair to say that those second and third order effects there are becoming more prominent in terms of the overall effect of an individual action but you've got to turn the dial you've got to take into consideration the second and third order effects before you make the decision to take this kind of action you see that the u.s.

is a nation at war when does this war and when is it deemed a success what needs to be accomplished for the u.s. not to be a nation at war any longer that's a great question and it's one with been asked by my countrymen were war tell me when i'm finished let me know how i've won when we need it i understand and and i know there will come a point at which folks like me with my background and my experience need to go to our political leaders and say you know folks the war paradigm served us very very well but it was not without its own cost it was not without its own effects and now i think we have pushed this threat down to such a level that the war paradigm is no longer that useful to us and we need to move into a law enforcement or an international cooperation kind of paradigm now to round this out i think that will come some day that there's not today you served as

director of the cia for nearly three years and you were still in that position when u.s. president barack obama took office there were reports that he was on about using drones excessively and you had to persuade him. tensions possibly running high at that time is there any truth to those reports it's very difficult. for me to talk about specific operations or to confirm or deny things that my government hasn't confirmed or denied but i think in general i think i can give you this statement with the exception of detention interrogation which of course became a very popular and well known cause with the change in administration. president obama and braced very strongly much of the war on terror strategy that president bush was conducting during president bush's second administration clear he just said there's no longer work in care he also said he did but it's very interesting he used the phrase we used internally right internally the phrase was

we're at war with al qaeda affiliates and that was our operational expression of the president's more public global war on terror so fundamentally nothing really changed in terms of what the security structures of the united states were doing you know there's not a new discussion regarding drones that's being had and that has to do with the topic of anonymous drones some recent examples of of that include two drone attacks that took place in pakistan last month those attacks reportedly killed nine people including two al qaeda operatives now. immediately filed a complaint a protest with the american embassy but u.s. officials came back and said look we're not responsible for that attack that we haven't had any activity in pakistan since january and the pakistani government says it wasn't us and there's now no clear way to know who was operating those

drones in pakistan do you believe that this drone warfare this drone campaign that the u.s. has been leading will eventually open up a pandora's box of anonymous jones because as of last month there are over forty fifty countries that are now using drones well that's a great question and i know the incident incidents you're referring to and. you have to understand i'm not a government of four years i only know what i read in the newspapers but i find it quite curious. what does it teach me what does it suggest to my thinking one thing is the trouble region of pakistan history is was. no one is exercising sovereignty it's also great for as you point out the. use of unmanned aerial vehicles is not a god given american right the other nations will fall i mean we have been leading the technology here but the technology is not all that daunting other countries

will follow on our footsteps that puts a great deal of pressure on the united states in terms of how it actually conducts itself with these weapons we are indeed setting precedent that others will almost certainly follow president obama is no longer running for our second term in office or running to keep his job some would say he's running now for the history books do you believe he should deliver on his promise to close guantanamo bay i actually think the promise was a mistake right now i realize there are a range of views within my country on that but i go back to the premise and by the way president obama agrees with the president promise we are a nation at war he said that consistently otherwise he couldn't do many of the things that he is now authorizing us to do you have to begin with the war paradigm one of one of the aspects of armed conflict is the right to detain enemy combatants

so my debate with president obama is not that he hasn't lived up to his promise to close it. but i think the promise to close it was unwise by the way you realize that we reduced the prison population at guantanamo during the bush administration far more dramatically than has been done in the obama administration i mean we understood the branding issue that was going tunnel but we also understood we were at war i mean look on labor day weekend for your viewers that's the first weekend in september here in the united states and two thousand and six i moved fourteen prisoners from cia detention sites the so-called black sites to guantanamo i needed a place to put the guantanamo was a perfectly legal perfectly acceptable place recent polls are showing that only fifteen percent of selected muslim countries approve of president obama's foreign policy is that dangerous is that troubling and anyway it courses it's not

a popularity poll i mean we're not out there to be loved something george w. bush said right was i mean draw a comparison of thirty nine years of military officer so i go back a long way i remember something called the cold war and i bet you many of your viewers remember it as well and during the cold war we actually talked about the close fight and the deep fight and here in the cold war the deep fight was largely illogical and it was about western views towards economics and political democracy and soviet jews and frankly that was argued very strongly between the two groups but one that was argued mike hayden from pittsburgh pennsylvania had a legitimate view on communism because whatever else communism may or may not have been it was a western philosophy and so when we entered that conversation my views had legitimacy because i was speaking from my own cultural tradition. in the current

war the deep has to do with something going on inside islam no it's very hard for my came from pittsburgh to enter into a discussion about islam i have no legitimacy in fact fact when i do enter in that discussion i make things worse. because i have no authenticity and making that kind of comment so what we see going on i think is a struggle within islam it's a struggle that all the monotheisms have gone through christianity judaism and now another islam and it's a struggle with modernity without drawing your viewers too far back into history. christendom went through this in the seventeenth century at the end of the thirty years war when we decided you know we've got plenty of reasons to fight with one another but let's not include religion in the list any more right and we embraced a more secular approach we separated the sacred from the secular i think islam is going through that great debate now but that debate is within islam and we'll have

to see how it turns out sorry that's a very long answer but i think that's really what's going on if you've most recently spoken about the threat of cyber warfare and you said that it's coming from china but what about groups like anonymous this is tension is something that the chinese have armed they've worked for over the years the mandiant report that came out about two weeks ago that focused very heavily on one particular unit in the people's liberation army that worked for the third bureau there pale way through as we call it i had a i had someone a colleague of yours from your profession call me up and say wow this man that report is big news and i said well it's big. but it's not news i mean anybody who's been doing this knows what the chinese have been doing now to be more accurate the chinese even stealing stuff they have not been using the sergeant name to create damage or destroying networks or or things like that but they've been stealing stuff on an unprecedented scale know all right through them one day all

nations do this i was the head of the american organization that did this for the united states and frankly we're quite good at it but we and some other nations around the world self limit we still secrets out there in the server to maine to keep americans free and to keep them safe. we don't do it to make them rich we don't do it for commercial benefit. well let me rephrase that it's espionage and espionage is an accepted international practice when that mandiant report came out. some were say but we the hands of the united states are not clean the u.s. has also played a huge role in cyber espionage and even some sang that the u.s. had a major role in the stocks that attack allegedly carried out by washington and tel aviv against iran so isn't the u.s.

in in some way throwing stones when it lives in a glass house i don't even speculate given my background on who may or may not have been responsible for stocks it but i do agree with the premise of your question it's a really big deal i mean someone just used a weapon comprised of ones and zeros to knob the particle description was to take over the control system in advance and destroy thousand centrifuges which i've used almost an on avoid good. but i can rephrase that sentence and say someone during a time of peace just used a cyber weapon to destroy another nation's critical infrastructure. wow that's an important development yeah i fully understand the import of the fact of stuxnet and leave alone who may or may not have done it i will have to leave it right there general michael hayden thank you very much for your time thank you.

you know sometimes you see a story and it seems so for life you think you understand it and then you glimpse something else and you hear or see some other part of it and realize everything you thought you knew you don't know i'm tom harpur welcome to the big picture. victims multiply here each day. it's very profitable to invest in colombia with that every profit out of the it is a very high return on investment. is good knowing that he has it but i've been working in this area for thirty years and i've always had to pay the armed groups

when they needed betis i knew the managers of change their name and strategy but just tell the same murderous. high ranking suspects give no comment or you have to say about that mr president as soon. as the president didn't. both the media. i won't give an interview i'm sorry but no. investigation is a dead. end up he says sick and stop your bullshit and keep quiet or else you'll suffer the consequences. even if they're your bodyguards to watch themselves because the same goes for them. blood rivers from synch i've never heard of such a case as ours are so much money and gold has stolen so many. for all the gold in colombia.

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