viewpoint on everything from media propaganda to the war on terror so without further ado my one on one but dr noam chomsky. so much for taking the time to meet with me it's a great honor to be sitting here and we're in boston cambridge actually about you know as someone who was a living in the aftermath of the boston bombing the chaos what did you think of the police and media response to them well the. i hate to second guess police tactics but my impression was it was done so that they didn't have to be that degree of militarization of the area maybe they did maybe it's kind of striking that the suspect they were looking for was found by a civilian after they lifted the curfew just noticed some blood on. the street and could. have done so but police tactics as far as the media was

concerned. it was twenty four hour coverage on television on all the channels and also just zero in on one tragedy whilst ignoring the tragedies incurred well in fact across the muslims who is after the. boston bombing there was a drone strike in yemen. one of many but this one we have to know because the young man from the village that was hit testified before the senate a couple of days later described and right at the same time and what he said is. interesting. relevant he said that his village which in iceland they were trying to kill somebody in his village they said the man was perfectly well i could have that brand. he was. a drone strike his terror weapon we don't talk about it but it is just imagine if you're walking

down the street and you don't know whether in five minutes. there's going to be a explosion across the street. from some place in the sky that you can't see and. somebody will be killed and whoever else is around will be killed and maybe you'll be you'll be injured if you're there. just as a terror weapon terrorizes. villages regions huge areas effects the most massive terror campaign going on long and what happened in the village is that according to the testimony senate testimony that he said that the jihadi had been trying for years to turn the villagers against the americans and had not succeeded he said and one drone strike turned the entire village against

the americans that's you know maybe a couple hundred new people who will call terrorists if they take revenge it's a terror generating machine it's a terror to terrorist operation and a terrorist generating machine so it goes on and on and it's not just the drone strike sources forces and so on well that was right at the time of the boston marathon and it's just one of innumerable cases and. this is more than that this. the man who was then who was targeted for whatever reason they had to target and. that's just my first officer's murder there are principles going back eight hundred years to magna carta holding that people cannot be. punished by the state without being sentenced. speedy trial of peers that's only eight hundred years old.

they have their excuses but i don't think they really apply a bit beyond that there are other cases where which come to mind right away or should i wear a person is murdered who could easily be apprehended with severe consequences the most famous one is. bin laden he was. there were. years special forces trained mabel's navy seals broke into his invaded pakistan. broke into his. compound. killed a couple people they captured him he was defenseless i think his wife was with him but to. under instructions they just murdered him through his body into the ocean. with. that that's one of the beginning of the apprehension of bin laden

and the assassination and dumping his body in the ocean and of course the narrative completely fell apart. and also you've said that you know in the aftermath of nine eleven when the taliban said we will give you bin ladin if we if you present us with evidence which we didn't do we did. i mean their proposal was moving sure he could have pursued it but why are people so easy to accept conventional wisdom government narrative with virtually no question here and here a drumbeat of conventional. propaganda in my view takes a research project to find other things and of course at the same time as the boston bombings in iraq thought almost the deadliest week in five years i mean april is the deadliest month and in a long time more that trust is going on every day the suicide bombings yet seen as zeroing in on this tragedy when at the same time our foreign policy is is causing

this effect these effects in iraq as i mentioned mike mccurry which is eight hundred years but there's also something else which is about seventy years ago of the nuremberg tribunal which is the foundation as part of asia as modern international law and it defines aggression. as the supremum international crime differing from other work crimes in that it encompasses all of the evil that follows the u.s. british invasion of iraq was a textbook example of aggression you know the question about it which means that we are responsible for all the evil that follows like the bombings serious conflict has spread all over the region that the region is being torn to shreds. well that's

part of. part of the evil that follows the media's lack of coverage with everything that you're speaking on and i know that america runs on this national of an american exceptionalism but is america's severe lack of empathy unique or do we see this in every country in every just growing up in america and we just you know are isolated with our own viewpoint i think it's true. every great power that i can think of britain was the same france is the same germany but unless a country's defeat like when germany was defeated the second world war. was compelled to pay attention to the atrocities carried out but others don't. in fact it was an interesting case this morning which was i was glad to see it in fact it was finally there are trials going on in guatemala for. real smart was basically responsible for the virtually genocidal destruction of the

mines and the us was involved in it every step of the way finally this morning there's an article saying that something was missing from the trials the us role which is good i'm glad you are to course read in the school of americas do you think that we'll ever see white war criminals from imperialist nations stand trial the same way that announcement it's almost impossible to look at the i.c.c. international criminal court black africans or other people the west doesn't like. i mean bush and blair are the right up there there's no crime reason a crime worse than the invasion of iraq. obama for the terror war but these it's just inconceivable in fact there's legislation in the united states which in europe the school be neverland's invasion. the congressional legislation signed by the president which authorizes the president to use force to rescue any

american brought to the hague for trial. you know this is. i do you know and i speak you know of the drone wars i can't help but think of john bellinger the chief architect of the drone policy who was speaking to a think tank recently and he said that obama's ramped up the drone killings simply to avoid the bad press of getting out of capturing suspects alive and trying to get now when you hear things like this what is your response to people who say his hands are tied he wants to do well but that's i too was pointed out some time ago. well street journal military correspondent what he pointed out is that bush's technique was to. capture people and torture them. obama has improved you just kill them and anybody else is around it's not that his

hands are tied he's a that's a much more. it's bad enough to capture them and torture them but just the murder on executive whim and as i say it's not just murdering the suspects a terror weapon to resit one knows. it's not that they want hansard that's what he wants to do i'd rather be detained indefinitely and then be blown up as well as my family and friends around me. and that terrorizes everyone else. there's. there are recent polls which. sure the public and the results are kind of interesting. they don't. particularly like to run but they don't report of a threat it's right very low they do see threats in egypt and they react. yeah the united states is the major threat.

yemen is riddled. with us but basically the us report is a major threat why is that why would you gyptian rockies and you know money over your the united states is the greatest. worth knowing. stick around i have much more from my interview with dr tom feeney after the break. some of these traditional chili lines the bridge into bill passed down from generation. this is a total destruction of the culture of mexico by telling them i mean this is not going to impact asylum in mexico whatever happens here. in the congo you know all the warning and so forth. why do you think this

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anything like. welcome back eyes here's the rest of my sit down with noam chomsky. the controversial policies obviously the national defense authorization act the n.d.a. which you're plaintiff on the case you've also said that holder of the humanitarian law is actually worse you know providing material support for terrorism do you think that both of these policies are just caught a fine practices that are that have already been in place for decades i think. is pretty much codified practices that have been employed it was a little went a little beyond the court case is narrow it's about the port that went beyond.

authorization to imprison american citizens indefinitely without trial that's. i mean that's a radical the illusion of principles or go back as i said eight hundred years i don't see frankly much difference between. imprisoning american citizens in the prison anyone else and their role persons but we make a distinction. that distinction was. extended to the humanitarian law project ground there was a concept of material support for terrorism already sort of a dubious concept because what's how to decide what's terrorism well that's an executive with him again there's a terrorist list created by the executive branch without review without anyone

having any right to contest it and if you look at that terrorist list it's. it really tells you something so for example nelson mandela was on the terrorist list until three or four years ago the reason was that one thousand nine hundred eighty eight when the reagan administration was strongly supporting the apartheid regime in south africa in fact. of the ruling congressional legislation in order hate it they declared that the african national congress it was one of the more notorious terrorist groups in the world that's mandela that's one nine hundred eighty eight barely before apartheid finally collapsed and he was just on the terrorist list until then. to take another case in the one nine hundred eighty two when iraqis invaded iran the u.s. was supporting iraq and wanted aid the iraqi invasion to hussein was taken off the

terrorist list it's not a terrorist given its head well it's you know it's its executive whim to begin with we should take it seriously but that was putting that aside material assistance meant you know you get the gun owners and like that under the obama administration it's you give them a do as well as part of the linguistics and language of the war on terror what it obama's rebranding a bush administration policy did a public consciousness. the policy of murdering people instead of capturing them and torturing them. can be presented to the public in a way that makes it look clean it's presented and i think most people see it this way as a kind of a surgical strike which goes after people who are planning to do us harm. this is a very frightened country terrified country has been for

a long time so if anybody's going to do us harm fine first kill them and some of the reactions or how this is interpreted is quite interesting for example there was a case about a year or two when a drone attack in yemen killed a couple of little girls and it was a discussion with. a well known liberal columnist joe klein. time and he was asked what he thought of it and he said something like. it's better that for them or killed four of four little girls here so because in the logic is mind boggling but if we have to kill people elsewhere who might conceivably. have aimed to harm us and it happens

a couple little girls get killed that's fine we're entitled. i mean suppose any other any country is doing that. to any anyone we regard as human. cruel but this is very common and i remember once when right after the invasion of iraq the. thomas friedman new york times the middle east specialist columnist was interviewed on the charlie rose show you know the sort of intellectuals through this good. as asked him what we ought to be doing in iraq and. you got to see the actual words to grasp it but basically what it was what he said is something like this he said. american troops or to smash in. to houses and. make

people understand that we're not going to allow terrorism. he said suck on this we're not going to allow terrorism in our society you've got to better understand it so that terror is women and children the. have to be. humiliated and degraded and frightened so that because so that. the that goes i mean it's mind boggling that's the peak of the liberal intellectual cultures and we have famous like richard dawkins saying that as long as long as one of the greatest threats facing humanity i mean that's a whole another form of propaganda the liberal elites perpetuating this not of this neo con sort out of the much for. all the media i want to talk to you about that because obviously that's instrumental in manufacturing consent for these policies i

mean your book media control was written a decade before nine eleven that it outlines exactly how sophisticated the propaganda model is when you wrote that book did you have any idea how far it would come and where do you see it in ten years for it it didn't take any force because it's been going on for a long time. and take. the us invasion of south vietnam curiously that for is in the media when we invaded south vietnam john f. kennedy in one thousand and sixty two. you bombing of south vietnam the u.s. air force all through as napalm. authorized chemical warfare to destroy corrupt. started driving. peasants into. what were called strategic kamut basically concentration camps where they were surrounded by barbed wire. protect

them from the guerrillas who the government knew very well they were sporting what we call that of someone else did it but it's now fifty years over fifty years i doubt the phrase invasion of was ever pure the press could hardly i think it to tell what terry and state would barely be able to achieve such conformity fact probably wouldn't be able to and this is a critical does it and not talking about the ones who said there was a noble cause and were step back you know which incidentally obama pretty much has but it's become so sophisticated and i don't know if it's just because i'm younger and i've seen it you know just in the last ten years and in the post nine eleven world the media sophistication and my question is you know with the internet need ban technology do you serious first of all of this trend where more people are just going to be making this form of media propaganda relevant or do you see it

worsening i mean the internet gives options but options of which is good it's good more options but. the print gives plenty of options you could read this in general if you wanted to the internet means you can read faster ok that's good but you know if you think back to the time of the shift from. say the in the invention of the printing press it was a much greater step forward than the invention of the internet i was a huge change the internet is another change smaller one and it's. it has multiple characteristics so on the one hand it gives access to a broader range of commentary from asia. if you know what to look for you have to know what to look for. that also provides huge mess material which is.

we'll put it politely off the wall. how isn't a person without background framework understanding isolated loans in his living rooms. and another form of propaganda is education you've said that you know the more indoctrinated you are i'm sorry the more educated you are the more indoctrinated you are and that propaganda is largely directed toward the privileged how dangerous is it to have an elite ruling class with the illusion of knowledge perpetuating it advancing their own world view on humanity and it just is perpetual feedback loop of the ruling class as old as the hills and there have always been. every society has had some form of privileged elite who claim to be

repugnant tories of understanding and knowledge and. want to control what they call the rabble make sure that they like the people who say we want to be ruled by countrymen like ourselves you know the people sores not the knights and gentlemen who better presses they don't want people to have thoughts like that so therefore there are major propaganda systems it's kind of striking that propaganda is most developed and most sophisticated in the more free societies the public relations industry which is advertising industries mostly propaganda lot of it commercial propaganda but also you know control that developed in britain in the united states to frist. and for good reason it was understood for centuries that people have won enough freedom so you just can't control it by force you therefore have to control beliefs and attitudes next thing

it's always been done but it kind of a quantum leap forward about a century with the development of these huge industries devoted to as their leaders put it the engineering of consent. if you read the founding documents of the p.r. industry it is he says we have to make sure that the general public are incompetent like children if you let them run their own affairs or travel. the world has to be run by the intelligent minority and. we therefore have to control we have to reject many people's minds of the world in order many regiments of soldiers for the room good just as you don't let a three year old run in the street you can't let people run the world affairs. and

get these countries like yourselves. who know the people who are going to be in real trouble. that's a standard idea and it's taken one or another form over the centuries. and in the united states it's institutionalized in the major industries. so hopelessly and slaves and those who believe that they are free and that was go through said that thank you so much dr chomsky amazing this and front of you wouldn't take the time to talk to you about all these things are pretty lax appreciate it. and i'll leave it on that powerful now as always thanks for watching and i'll see you right back here tomorrow.

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about. hurting for cash down. on tax dodgers hoping to plug a trillion. white house and the fourth estate american journalist moved to protect media freedom which they believe is falling victim to government fears that some delicate facts may surface. and as the friends of syria prepare to discuss peace between president assad and the opposition u.s. lawmakers give first stage approval to a bill of that could allow direct weapons shipments to the rebels.