market why not. find out what's really happening to the global economy with max cons or for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines tune into kinds a report. welcome back to cross talk are all things considered i'm peter lavelle to remind you we're discussing the bradley manning case.

ok david i like go back to you in washington bradley manning has admitted to breaking the law ok but he did a social good is well he exposed war crimes and that's a good that's good for american democracy good for american foreign policy in the long term because there's accountability how do you react to that. i think one can view specialist manning case in a variety of different ways and certainly about what he can be compared to daniel ellsberg from the one nine hundred seventy s. i think that that only goes so far i think ellsberg was more targeted he seemed to disclose his papers to the washington post and new york times today. when we now live in an internet age where wiki leaks takes. advantage of this information and discloses it nonetheless i think the united states has a proper and a right to want to try to protect and its national interest. communicates and that can be used in a way that will endanger the national interests and i think that's what's going on

here i want to go back to a white guy said you know and i think they really want david finish what david finish go ahead david please do. well i was just going to say to the extent that you are correct that president obama has taken that stand to try do you go after individuals who leak that is certainly true and i agree with you that that does raise issues. with. obviously concerned a number of different people as the front page of the washington post today when apparently and this a and had him disclosing telephone records international am with him as you all of us citizens i predict that that very troubling for democracy and i think that we have to be very very cautious about how we proceed and i think this administrator and i it's ironic that it's this and i like your age and that's taking these type but thank you for saying this go ahead jump in please

do but i'd like to i'd like to bring a couple of points i'm going to give you a couple examples one john kerry he's spending twenty four months in jail today because he revealed that he witnessed torture and he was trying to get the torture in front of a judge well the torture meanwhile writes a book that's a bestseller on the new york times book list this is wrong when. torture gets millions of dollars and the guy who reveals the torture goes to jail this is the same case now we were talking about bradley manning before the break where you were saying you know he admitted to some crimes again yes he admitted to some crimes i say time served and you brought up daniel ellsberg daniel ellsberg recently said the only way he could reveal these documents that he had he had one chance and one chance only he had to bundle them up and get out and get this information out and it's the same with bradley manning there was no window to sit

around and we threw these things although bradley manning did we through the process the defense has shown proven that bradley manning was very careful in what kind of information he released and i think that bradley manning should be commended for any of the iraq war ok david here the specialist manning has and the iraq war i would venture to say that. we haven't seen the end of the iraq war certainly the civil war and civil strife that's going on there to agree but i think that your point is well taken one sense but i totally disagree with you i think bradley specialist manning was basically use of the duped by wiki leaks and i think that they took advantage of him i don't think he had be expertise in terms of being able to decide nor did he have the authority to decide to release hundreds of thousands of pages of communiques of the united states he simply didn't have

that we're going to see a war crime you don't have to. this is good in this is not ok with me if you want to believe it when you go ahead go ahead go ahead. david when you witness a war crime you don't need expertise to show that there was a war crime committed when he revealed the thing that really angered this ministration when he revealed the collateral damage video that showed a reuters reporter was killed by our helicopters and that they were flippant about how they had just killed a bunch of people and there were children and in this in this vehicle this is this was wrong we needed to see we need to see more of these things so we can understand what's going on in the theater of war when we go into places like iraq and afghanistan and other places around the world this is a very chilling. take away so i mean you have been here who are going to let me jump in here david the gentleman the people the soldiers that were involved in that

video conducting it are they on trial for committing war crimes and if not why is bradley manning on trial i don't see. the fortunate bradley manning the well i think there is always disproportionate within the justice system i think that this administration as press administration has tried to hold soldiers and marines and sailors accountable for their actions. that's what happened yesterday at fort lewis mccord in washington state when sergeant bales pled guilty to the worst war atrocity that have do you think you will get a life if you think you are. being you think you will get life. and well i represent that special i represented special barker who pled guilty to perm meditated murder of four iraqis he received a ninety year sentence by pretrial agreement the individual who was the trigger

person received life he actually did not even receive the worst punishment which was life without parole i think specialist manning will not warrant that type of severe set and even if the united states proves the ultimate charges that they claim saying he didn't kill anyone he didn't kill anyone you want to jump in well i also think that only that is we and the murders that took place inside iraq david one second we saw many many murders take place inside iraq and we saw a soldier after soldier be released time cerner let's let him go dishonorable discharge we saw that in the sort of square massacres no one is gets tried this is this is wrong and we will be paying for these debts a long time to come you will see an american president come out some day and apologize for everything we did in iraq and this is going to happen you know this

and i know this in the future we will be apologizing for the war crimes we've committed in iraq and this is an opportunity to have a truth and reconciliation conversation use bradley manning as as a person that we can use as a a as a hero so that we can start these talks about what we want to see out of our military david jump in go ahead i don't think. i don't think the specialist manning . as a hero i also don't think that he is a spy i don't think he is the next aldrich ames i don't think he is a quite long tory i don't think he is a walker he is an individual who is taken advantage of and i think that that will be reflected in his sentence i think that he has been willing to plead guilty for the crimes that he committed to the extent that the united states has who took advantage of you this is a knave b. but. you're saying you're saying julian

a songe see if that's what i'm saying i would say this is a julian assange about wiki leaks this is nothing this is just an. actor it's a lot of talk so that they can go have. been talked about but the as it were in the case. then see i mean they don't you people and they say if you add a case ok when it's time to i go ahead david david let me just say many people say shouldn't the new york times or the washington post who revealed the same knowledge of the same information that bradley manning and shouldn't they be on trial as well and i say absolutely not this is freedom of press this is freedom of information this is over. classified classification of information and this government needs to be held responsible when it commits war crimes this government needs to be transparent when it could when it starts and finishes a war we need to know what took place and we as

a community so that we can make decisions as a community as a democracy do we want to be involved in this what's going on how do we best proceed because you want me to tell you some of the pundits are on the sunday talk shows every single day they got it all wrong these guys are telling us again and. david go ahead. realize it but realize where you're at and who you're talking to you you're talking to people worldwide and you're talking about a critical a huge which i think that you're correct on there is overclassification there is a tension between the fourth that state and the press being able to get access to information there is tension in terms of releasing of documents i agree wholeheartedly on that but i do think that you have to give credit where credit is due in the moment the massacre's all of the individuals who are participating in that went to jail for at least ninety years they received at least ninety year

sentence and i think that that says a lot bailiff will go to jail for the rest of the life that the law now am i suggesting to you that there isn't some medium ground some atmosphere where specialist manning is held to. ask which he himself as agreed he and self has agreed that he should go to jail for a very very long period of time for the crime he committed i don't think bradley manning is racially and that in your grandly manning admitted david well i mean bradley manning admitted to something so that he could like it take like you said takes place all over the united states every single day these plea agreements where somebody comes out and says well you're going to face thirty years or we're going to give you ten years or three years and here take this and admit to that and people admit to guilt all the time so that they because they don't have the finances they don't have the ability to fight big government well and this is what

we're looking at we're looking at we're looking at a close system of military court where bradley hit remanding has very little choice very little chance of getting out the information that he wants to get out to the american public and that's what he said he never said i need to go to jail for a long time can you say about it just start a conversation if you need that conversation we need the conversation about what took place in iraq why we went to war and why we went to war in afghanistan and why we're still there in afghanistan all right gentlemen to frame a shot i want any discussion we have run out of time many thanks to my guests today in washington and thanks to our viewers for watching us here darkie see you next time and remember cross talk rules. you know these.

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i would rather questions for people in positions of power instead of speaking on their behalf and that's why you can find my show larry king now right here on r.t. question more.

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