no reason to help comes too late and without good intentions. charity diplomacy and business are now to a minimum. please please please please leave stoof yes. absolutely. it's.

welcome back to cross talk where all things considered i'm peter lavelle to remind you we're discussing the bradley manning case. ok david and i go back to you in washington bradley manning has admitted to breaking the law ok but he did a social good is well he exposed war crimes and that's a good that's good for american democracy good for american foreign policy in the long term because there's accountability how do you react to that. i think one can view specialist manning case in a variety of different ways and certainly about what he can be compared to daniel ellsberg from the one nine hundred seventy s. i think that that only goes so far i think ellsberg was more targeted he seemed to disclose his papers to the washington post and new york times to be. what we now live in an internet age where wiki leaks takes. advantage of this information and

discloses it nonetheless i think the united states has a proper and a right to want to try to protect it and its national interest. communicates and that can be used in a way that will endanger the national interests and i think that's what's going on here i want to go back to a white guy said you know and i think it went david finish what david finish go ahead david please do. well i was just going to say to the extent that you are correct that president obama has taken that stand to try do you go after individuals who leak that is certainly true and i agree with you that that does raise issues. with. obviously concern a number of different people as the front page of the washington post today when apparently and the say is unhappy and disclosing telephone records international i am with you i mean as you all of us said this and i predict that that's very

troubling for democracy and i think that we have to be very very cautious about how we proceed and i think this administrator and i it's ironic that i like your age and that's taking these type but thank you for saying this go ahead jump in please do but i'd like to i'd like to bring up a couple of points i'm going to give you a couple examples one john kerry he's spending twenty four months in jail today because he revealed that he witnessed torture and he was trying to get the torture in front of a judge well the torture meanwhile writes a book that's a bestseller on the new york times book list this is wrong when when. torture gets millions of dollars and the guy who reveals the torture goes to jail this is the same case now we were talking about bradley manning before the break where you were saying you know he admitted to some crimes again yes he admitted to some crimes. i say time served and you brought up daniel ellsberg daniel ellsberg

recently said the only way he could reveal these documents that he had he had one chance and one chance only he had to bundle them up and get out and get this information out and it's the same with bradley manning there was no window to sit around and we threw these things although bradley manning did we through the process the defense has shown proven that bradley manning was very careful in what kind of information he released and i think that bradley manning should be commended for anyone to the iraq war ok david here the specialist manning has and the iraq war i would venture to say that we haven't seen the end of the iraq war certainly the civil war and civil strife that's going on there to agree but i think that your point is well taken one sense but i totally disagree with you i think bradley specialist manning was basically use of the duped by wiki leaks and

i think that they took advantage of him i don't think he had the expertise in terms of being able to decide nor did he have the authority to decide to release hundreds of thousands of pages of communiques of the united states he simply didn't have that when you see a war crime you don't have to say this is good in this is not ok but sorry if you want to be ok i believe it when you go ahead go ahead go ahead. david when you witness a war crime you don't need expertise to show that there was a war crime committed when he revealed the thing that really angered this ministration when he revealed the collateral damage video that showed a reuters reporter was killed by our helicopters and that they were flippant about how they had just killed a bunch of people and there were children and in this in this vehicle this is this was wrong we needed to see we need to. see more of these things so we can

understand what's going on in the theater of war when we go into places like iraq and afghanistan and other places around the world this is a very chilling. take away place where you live and you have been here who are going to be let me jump in here david the gentleman the people the soldiers that were involved in that video conducting it are they on trial for committing war crimes and if not why is bradley manning on trial i don't see just before senate bradley manning done well i think there is always disproportionate within the justice system i think that this administration as administration has tried to hold soldiers and marines and sailors accountable for their actions that's what happened yesterday at fort lewis mccord in washington state when sergeant bales pled guilty to the worst war atrocities that happen do you think you will get a life do you think you're. being do you think you will get life. in will i

represent that special i represented specialist barker who pled guilty to perm meditated murder of four iraqis he received a ninety year pretrial agreement the individual who actually was the trigger person received life he actually did not even receive the worst punishment which was life without parole i think specialist manning will not warrant that type of severe set and even if the united states proves the ultimate charges that would take place saying see if you can kill anyone he didn't kill anyone type you want to jump in well i also think that i believe that is we need any murders that took place inside iraq david one second we saw many many murders take place inside iraq and we saw a soldier after soldier be released time served let's let him go dishonorable discharge we saw the one of the. where massacres no one is gets tried this is this

is wrong and we will be paying for these debts a long time to come you will see an american president come out some day and apologize for everything we did in iraq and this is going to happen you know this and i know this in the future we will be apologizing for the war crimes we've committed in iraq and this is an opportunity to have a truth and reconciliation conversation use bradley manning as as a person that we can use as a a as a hero so that we can start these talks about what we want to see out of our military david jump in go ahead i don't think. i don't think this specialist manning is a hero i also think that he is a spy i don't think he's the next aldrich ames i don't think he's a clean lone tree i don't think he is a walker he is an individual who is taken advantage of and i think that that will

be reflected in his sentence i think that he has been willing to plead guilty for the crimes that he committed to the extent that he will that that statement who took advantage of him can you this is a navy but. again i think you're saying we are seeing julian a songe see if that's what i'm saying i see this is a julian assange and about wiki leaks this is nothing this is just an. actor. so that they can go. on to talk about but the abhisit who are in the case. then see i mean they don't you people and they say if she does you advocate ok when it's time to i go ahead david david let me just say many people say shouldn't the new york times or the washington post who revealed the same knowledge of the same information that bradley manning and shouldn't they be on trial as well and i say absolutely not this is freedom of press this is freedom of information this is over

. classified classification of information and this government needs to be held responsible when it commits war crimes this government needs to be transparent when it could when it starts and finishes a war we need to know what took place and we as a community so that we can make decisions as a community as a democracy do we want to be involved in this what's going on how do we best proceed because you want me to tell you some of the pundits are on the sunday talk shows every single day they got it all wrong these guys are telling us again and. go ahead david go ahead. realize that but realize where you're at and who you're talking to you you're talking to people worldwide and you're talking about a critical a hue which i think that you're correct there is overclassification there is a tension between the fourth that state and the press being able to get access to information there is tension in terms of releasing of documents i agree

wholeheartedly on that but i do think that you have to give credit where credit is due in the moment the massacre's all of the individuals who were participating in that went to jail for at least ninety years they received at least ninety year sentence and i think that that says a lot they will go to jail for the rest of the life that the law now am i suggesting to you that there isn't some medium ground some atmosphere where specialist manning is held. task which he himself as agreed he and self has agreed that he should go to jail for a very very long period of time for the crime to he committed i don't think bradley manning is racially and i think you're grimly manning admitted david well i mean bradley manning admitted to something so that he could like it to like you said takes place all over the united states every single day these plea agreements where somebody comes out and says well you're going to face thirty years or we're going

to give you ten years or three years and here take this and admit to that and people admit to guilt all the time so that they because they don't have the finances they don't have the ability to fight big government well and this is what we're looking at we're looking at we're looking at a closed system of military court we're bradley manning has very little choice very little chance of getting out the information that he wants to get out to the american public and that's what he said he never said i need to go to jail for a long time can you sit on it to start a conversation that we need to a conversation we need a conversation about what took place in iraq why we went to war and why we went to war in afghanistan and why we're still there in afghanistan all right gentlemen the great nation i want any discussion we have run out of time many thanks to my guests today in washington and thanks to our viewers for watching us here darkie see you next time and remember cross talk rules.

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a report on nobody chooses to be homeless no one chooses to me and us are all. it did was. get in the six pm get out six feet six. they were in. school. to me the class people. were against. it's tough to think about all of this comes to. an end to know that many may not have only been lost to choose should never be me but they're also due to foreclosures that never should have. been told.

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think. story leaked documents flush out the true extent of the united states surveillance network potentially blanketing the online world but the government insists it's protecting america. he's promised to remains defiant over a wave of protest against him calling the rallies illegal but sparking fears of further division in the country. talks between the u.s. and chinese leaders are overshadowed by the country's fiery exchange of accusations in espionage and growing tension over america's. may. also reporting to a wave of fear and fury across france as extreme parties face being outlawed to fascism brutally murder a teenager in paris.