meeting war crimes in a war zone the only alternative i can think of would be not having this war at all so i would like to ask you to decide any specific example maybe from the recent history of a war conducted in a good way in accordance with the laws of war i think the whole point of what we call him a terran law is to have some rules of conduct that benefit everyone including the fighters and of course particular civilian so principles and rules such as we must distinguish between military objects military personnel and civilians and so we shouldn't shoot civilian personnel and objects while of course the conduct between the military continues that principle of. principle against discriminate attacks or . indiscriminate attacks that happen which complaint against castigated by us that's a very important principle another one is the prohibition on various weapons use of

various weapons very recently of course the issue of chemical weapons but other other weapons such as cluster bombs for example or in the situation that we've covered barrel bombs that are dropped from helicopters or whatever and affect very much civilians in terms of this indiscriminate attack on civilians i think you just laid out some of your major criticisms against the syrian government that would be launching indiscriminate attacks against civilians something that you mention in this report and in many of the previous reports but you also. make a point in this report that rebel forces themselves often operate from within civilian neighborhoods therefore putting civilians at risk and while i would i think we all would agree with your recommendation that the syrian government should do a much better job distinguishing between civilians and combatants i wonder if the commission can offer specific advice on how. to do that at

a time of with civil war the coverage that we offer encompasses all groups both government and non-government and the humanitarian message that is relayed is one that's relate to all sides so that see nondiscriminatory aspect of our work in terms of covering all activists inside syria as well as a message for those backing them and the current report which is eleventh report. has a litany a sad litany of violations by government groups government forces and it also covers the acts the misdeeds of non-government groups and i give you one example the issue of child soldiers for example we raise very prominently and openly in regard to the conduct of non-government groups in terms of usage of children as soldiers minister likewise in any other war many more crimes committed by the rebels that you list but let me press you a little bit on that because i think this is a crucial point the syrian government as well as the syrian rebels have been

criticized for that atrocities but again i come back to my original point is whether you can really add differently in a situation of a civil war and more specifically since most of the dads come from challis i wonder if indeed the syrian government could have chosen a different way different option of conducting that war and what that option would be from a humanitarian point of view well one angle is prevention and prevention demands a certain order a certain policy from governments and non gun groups to abide by the law so the order from the top must be very clear to prevent violations another angle is protection of particular civilians and that means a respect for their rights and accountability and all that is very very much linked also not only with our work but the u.n. system as a whole in terms of. enabling

a certain system of accountability to take place now you mentioned earlier the prevention aspect that the best i guess what i took from your answer the best way would be to focus on conflict prevention rather than resolution but what strikes me in the report that you just issued was that you criticize again the assad government for they have a use of military force including missiles fighter jets and artillery against rebel held areas to quote prevent every turn to normality in armed group control and wonder what would be the example of normality under armed group control is it actually saying that once. you know a rebel group takes control of a certain territory the the government should just lay down their arms and live them administer that neighborhood in whatever way they please well we have basic principles on this particular emerging from the geneva conventions concerning. warfare conflicts and particular article three which pertains to. a conflict or

civil war even in times of civil war there are certain premises there are certain principles that trip be followed for example if someone is detained you or she should be taken to a regularly constituted court or tribunals and should not be summarily executed yeah absolutely i don't believe me i agree with you on that point but my question was a bit different my question was about. what you call maliki under armed group control and we had just a couple of months ago the example of the city of iraq a watch which was administered by al qaeda associated groups to be sharia trials and people being publicly executed on the streets on your day criticizing the syrian government for shelling those neighborhoods and its efforts you get them read of the rebels but i wonder. if your criticism is really that. it is the

cd administered by al qaeda the example of normality that you allude to in your report the elements if we want to use the word normality i would link that very much with at applying implementing humanitarian rules humanitarian law even in times of on conflict in all territories occupied by whomever for example as i said earlier whoever is detained in any territory in armed conflict should have access to a regularly constituted court intrigue not be executed summarily another issue is humans have access to food war to education medical supplies very important to enable that to take place even time of war in whatever territories whether it's government controlled or in opposition controlled areas if those rights that you just mentioned i deny by rebel groups does the government not only the syrian government but any other government have the right to use force to eliminate those rebel

groups from the area principle is this if there's a crime committed one crime does not justify another crime secondly whoever is responsible for misdeeds should fall under the general international law human rights military law and the basic principles that i've already listed for example if if you catch someone for a certain misdeed even in time of war that person should not be executed summarily but should be taken to regularly constitute quote another principle is that everyone should have access to many many men ten assistance a particular medical assistance and that medical personnel in any territory should be protected together with the medical facilities and access to medical care so all these pertain very much to syria today as well as any other situation conflict ok we talked a little bit about the violations committed by the syrian government i think what makes this report is a little bit. from the previous ones is that you know of an upsurge in atrocities

committed by the rebels and more specifically you mentioned that there is an increasing influx of foreign fighters into syria and the syrian government of course has been claiming that for more than two years they've been even providing documented evidence of that but a significant part of the international community was dismissing those evidence as sensually the syrian regime propaganda to justify its crimes against humanity now it looks that the commission that you represent. also find some truth in the claims of the syrian regime that this is not just war not not just a civil war but also a war against terrorism the internationalization and certainly opposition is that this is an international conflict a civil war in colloquial terms and it falls on the what we call him and particularly law concerning the war geneva conventions don forty nine together with protocols of ninety seven the issue of labeling acts or labeling

misdeeds we do have many terms that are being used and you cited some of them now one very important principle in time of war is that acts of terror acts spreading terror among the civilian population are prohibited so those acts such as bombing intentionally civilian population to create terror those would be classifiable as war crimes and we do cover these situations acts spreading terror among the civilian population ok we have to take a short break now but. there will once again fails on conflict resolution should the international community focus more on conflict prevention that's coming up in a few moments on a while the part. of

the. they are looking very hard to take a. long. long view that back with senator gregg there's no. limit the ability.

war is probably the most complex and difficult to. answer. to the phenomenon of friendly fire probably extends back to the invention of gunpowder. kill a bunch of people who don't know the one thing their families there are a us people. reading children. this summer shoots my brother in the leg not intentional because it is because it was night times four in the morning even the best even the best soldiers. are going to make mistakes and this is this whole idea of brotherhood and author. and camaraderie in

this sense it was in this context that has absolutely no place. wealthy british style. from time to time. markets why not. find out what's really happening to the global economy with mike's concert for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines tune in to kaiser report on our. welcome back to well the part of we are discussing the latest report on the trough that is in syria with me kid month a born member of the independent commission that led that inquiry before we went to

break. we were talking about accountability and the standards of war the laws of war that are that should ideally speaking apply to everybody and in your latest report the commission accuses the government of using torture against the detainees including what it calls previously on documented torture matters for example its sides these so-called simulated drowning which to me sounds very similar to a practice american practice of waterboarding and i think we all would agree the u.s. united nations certainly agreed that the treatment of detainees in iraq constituted torture the treatment of detainees in guantanamo constituted torture there are also a numerous reports of torture in believe be in prisons. i guess the question i'm asking is do you get a sense that torture is essentially becoming trivialized in war zones these days because we can talk about the accountability of the assad government for the crimes

against humanity that they committed but all these admittedly the assad government's record on human rights has never been particularly strong where certain countries like the united states for example that is considered a champion of democracy and human rights has committed torture on record and yet has never been brought to account for that well as you know amen day the commission inquiry covers what happens in syria so i'm not in the position to make comparisons with situations elsewhere. in that perspective of course. torture is a universal crime it's an international crime and in the context of what we're dealing with torture is also a war crime and a crime against humanity if it's particularly practiced systematically or in widespread man against the civilian population so all these possibilities in terms

of. responsibility in terms of criminal responsibility and account accountability what is interesting with the situation concerning syria is that. syria is not a member not a party to the statute of the international criminal court so united states that by the way. well i'm not talking about any other countries i'm talking about the remit demanded that i'm covering with due respect to the various comments about syria and syria is not a party to the international criminal courts statute so in that. position so to speak nationals from syria cannot be crossed referred to the international criminal court through lack of that ratification however we do have a means of referring whether it's syrians or anybody else who commit major violations to the international criminal court and that is through the. the auspices of the security council so one of the measures that could be taken up

is through the security council to cross refer cases to the international criminal court as we speak about the use of torture or other crimes against humanity committed in syria and. i'm sure you are aware that from the very beginning of this conflict. it has been marked by and precedented efforts to manipulate public opinion both within syria and outside syria by the government as well as by rebel groups and i think the cons of atrocities not only in this conflict but also in previous conflicts the libyan conflict would be one example of that have been used to you or put pressure on the international community to prompt some sort of action even though for example in believe in the case many of those claims of atrocities were never substantiated my question to you is how cognizant you are that anything

that you say anything that you put in your report can influence the how this war is going to develop in the future any given party may use that report to justify its own course of action with totally. conscious of the responsibility to be fair and impartial and you may or may not know that the commission is a pro bono. we're doing this free to help international museum and of course particularly the syrian people and it's an honor and pleasure to do so so that's the spirit with which we come in terms of objectivity impartiality and total commitment but i think in that area the methods that you are using are not cannot be described as very reliable as far as i understand you rely primarily on interview phone interviews kai as carpenter views personal interviews and as a war correspondent myself i know that at the tunnel or in any war zone you know the stories of atrocities take on life of their own and it's only natural for people to seek to justify the side that they support and demonize the side that

they oppose and i think again the libyan example shows that many of the claims of atrocities that people are so sure about during the war turned out to be unsubstantiated later on what we do is we have investigators who interview witnesses and victims directly over two thousand people have been interviewed already very substantial documentation as to who did what. when things took place and through that evidence we cross check what we call corroboration and after that we synthesize our finding so as to ultimately have a list of those close to the circumstances or the list of perpetrators so i think that's a very very balanced approach bearing in mind that we also welcome the possibility of entering syria we've asked for entry but we're still waiting for a response in terms of entry and if we are able to enter with investigators that

will help us much more in terms of direct access to the evidence at the local level but even today we have some access through skype to those in syria but the methodology that i highlighted earlier is one that assesses and listens to the evidence the witnesses who might be outside syria but they are direct with disses who are checked. and corroborates and. borne i think there vince some examples in the past when the international community including your own commission was absolutely sure about who conducted any given atrocity for example the houla massacre back in may two thousand and twelve the report by your commission put the blame squarely on the assad government later on it emerged that for example i believe it was the un human rights council that published the report saying that with evidence available it wasn't possible to conclude who actually did that massacre and you know there are still a lot of questions unanswered questions about who may have may have been behind

that massacre i guess my question is whether there are not in all your investigations in your experience you have ever come up either against evidence or at least a suspicion that some of those massacres may be perpetrated by people who tried to put the blame on the other side of the situation plays a while ago and so i would invite you to particular look at the updates and the more recent reports restricted other situations the current report the live report actually lists eight massacres eight massacres perpetrated by government forces and one massacre perpetrated by non-government forces so that in the current report i'm sorry for going for that question once again but i think that the houla massacre is a very interesting very interesting example because back then i remember how the entire international community was some exceptions notable exceptions of course but

was rallying behind that massacre and really trying to push that as a. reason to authorize internet international intervention in syria now of course the world's attention is turned to damascus where chemical weapons were supposedly used on you know some part of the international. communities once again absolutely positive about who did that attack but again the suspicions remain well i think the first message ship particularly because you link that situation to many other elements the first message that we've consistently highlighted is is that there is no military solution there is no military solution it has to be a political solution the peaceful solution secondly we are in the road of fact finding. another was looking at the facts and circumstances including. but since then have been many other situations and the current report looks at because it which was a request put to us just

a few months ago as well as many other massacres and unlawful killing zone so this is the progression of the analysis with a view to accountability and thirdly i think it's very important that we really the message that the act is the perpetrators may have some backus what we call constituencies behind them and so our message also is to invite and influence the constituencies behind the various groups and troops and so on to abide by human rights in metairie and law as well as to ensure that the people they give money to comply with human rights and humanitarian law while ensuring compliance what you just said is a crucial piece of the puzzle here of course and i would like i mean the continuing support for the for various parties in this conflict and making sure that proxy parties proxy powers also comply or with their accommodation that you suggest but

coming back to what you just said and i think it's included in the reported that there is no military solution to this conflict all basically you. in the context of your report it is more or less related to the syrian government and the fact that it has to rein in its military offensive but if there is no military solution in principle shouldn't we also recognize there that there should be a normal a true solution as applied to the rebels because it was their rebel forces who actually saw the military solution as a way of advancing their political goals they preferred the military solution from the very beginning they continue on the path of their resistance as a way of advancing that probably most legitimate goals and moreover. the united states one of the proxy parties to this conflict was talking about the military intervention just last week so if there is no military solution for the there should be no military solution for the assad government should that also

apply to the rebels and to the outside forces. you some words that i wouldn't use the words that i would use would be no military solution and that we would go towards a political settlement political solution action bearing in mind that it's. yes that's that's a message for everyone and we welcome very much a media in support of this mystery she in terms of the need for a political solution and having said that again i think a couple of words might be useful to you from the speech that the chair delivered today in the human rights council in geneva we use that what influential states influential states should also help us on this in terms of relaying the message of human rights and humanitarian law as well as to help ensure compliance with the principal concern such as the need to distinguish between military targets and non military targets so protection of civilians as key and non use of certain weapons

and weapons that we classify as illegals as well as conduct of us to compliance with the military and this time would have borne if i could i would add only one option to that place that you just mentioned and that is thinking twice before encouraging as a military rebellion or uprising for whatever democratic cause there may be but unfortunately we are out of time they have to leave it there i really appreciate you talking to us and i would like to leave our viewers with a quote from robert jackson the chief u.s. prosecutor adding your own back child who is sad that the war itself was a major precursor for future atrocities and resorting to it was the biggest crime of all but this is all we have time for so please join us again same place same time here in a while the part. unexplored

antarctica what is it in this icy expanse that attracts the people who come here. just a lot but you know i only go to the duchess. and. a new generation of polar explorers is coming. we have a new group of specialists here now all of them are young how are they going to get along with each other i don't know. who. i used to be a bureaucrat. seriously. what adventures await in this mysterious land. of a minute what to eat and what are they actually doing in antarctica. little

bit. of a golden globe. i live on. the street. you. wish i. could. just see. a little.

bit of your mom and watch n.b.c. news all the face time people. pleasure to have you with us here on t.v. today i'm wrong researcher. i know c.n.n. the m s n b c news have taken some not slightly but the fact is i admire their commitment to cover all sides of the story just in case one of them happens to be accurate. that was funny but it's close and for the truth and might think. it's because one whole attention and the

mainstream media works side by side the joke is actually on here. coming up. at our teen years we have a different approach. because the news of the world just is not this funny i'm not laughing dammit i'm not i. but i think if. you guys stick to the jokes well handled it makes sense that i've got to. live.

live live. live .

against jumping to conclusions. on last month's chemical attack in syria on the. i'm a culprit. a deadly rampage at a military facility in washington d.c. sent shock waves through the nation and to raises deep security concerns. and the r.t.a. gets exclusive inside see into the life of the fugitive whistleblower edward snowden in russia months after his revelations on american global surveyor.