welcome to politicking with larry king one of my favorite people a legendary newsman dan rather what does he expect from the president and the president's political opponents in the years ahead as you see parallels between the bridge controversy surrounding new jersey governor chris christie and the watergate scandal that brought down richard nixon plus how far would he go to get a story it's all next on politicking with larry king. on the politicking he's a best selling author he was one hell of a white house correspondent one of the best anchors ever the long time ago the

c.b.s. evening news he currently is the host and managing editor of dan rather reports on access t.v. and i'm honored to have the legendary newsman and my friend then join me he's been with us many times in fact this man while i think we just c.b.s. news would cover hurricanes for us on larry king live he gave the order of a standing order very very warm over tree dan rather with him are let's get right to it what do you make of the bridge gate well first of all it's an overstatement to call it bridge gate and then what are sort of all these serious but a few first from about this all started with watergate watergate became a shorthand word for a widespread criminal conspiracy led sort of say by the president of united states out of the oval office constitutional crisis of the country more than forty people sort of court time now those who know that story to be true but this widespread criminal conspiracy tried always. to soften it by saying well these things happen

all the time as bridge gate it is this gate and that gate there's only one gate and that's watergate good series no this bridge fiasco you can call it that as we head toward a probably better word see what i mean if there is one has to has to have some context for things in the watergate is in a whole different category now this kind of thing does happen in politics very often a widespread criminal conspiracy led by a president whom happened once or a lifetime first of all i think this story has a long way to run. and what's happening to governor christie he's hunkered down like a mule in a hail storm just right now. i was going to ask if he had dan rather is rushing toward christie's going through you just gave it to me well he's also admitted he would rather walk through a furnace in a gasoline suit and go through this. because partly is other is some of your republican compatriots are turning on him like your friends in the desperate

housewives turn on one another that's inevitable in these things happen i think is a long way to run we don't know how it's going to turn out i do not assume that it necessarily knocks christie out of the republican president in law who's going to find out that he knew about it more it could but it was and here now we have to know more they've indicted the other call on people to testify or have someone turned or someone said he did know well that would be very bad news for christie indeed but you mention criminal charges that's one difference here watergate as they say of widespread criminal conspiracy forty people convicted felons as best i can see there's no more been broken here in the bridge gate thing now it may turn out very very best to getting one are they invest in their will in one but as i understand it from criminal defense attorneys it is going to be a difficult case to make but we will see what is not a widespread criminal operation i think where the trouble is really going to come down in the courts are civil cases people say listen i was put out this was unfair

and i think that they'll have some cases you covered politicians for so on the something is always amaze me and i defer to your knowledge of this whether christie knew or not let's take his top aide nixon was going to win that election what is the invading democratic headquarters looking for why you're going to win the election one mayor isn't supporting you so your staff close is of the. well you're going to win whatever are you were one whether governor christie knew about it or was involved or not we don't. no but at least his staff you have to say they were schooled in the high ninety's on a dumb test this was really dumb to do it all on all from all appearances with these be good people did was they parachuted into the valley of the stupid he didn't need to do is read the first he could get them a month from now a year from now on two years and it was a dumb thing to do but look who among us haven't done something dumb our lives and

pettiness the jersey city governors big mayors elected people are all going to come down to help them he says he's not going to go as they cancel everybody down from the state to help out the city why the big politicians major politicians get petty . i can understand of the local councilman but why a governor or a governor's top aide well because nobody's perfect that's number one secondly it depends on organizations take on their personality and character from the top and not every political organization is filled with revenge and that i'm point out the downfall of richard nixon was clearly it wasn't good enough for richard nixon to beat his opponents this is key it was either watergate and it wasn't just good enough for him the big his opponents he's want to destroy and that's the lion and you can say in a way that land where that land was made to determine how long this bridge situation goes because if from all appearances they sought to destroy the mayor the

democratic mayor there in support of the give this report a listen i i was going to discuss this later over europe now fox news channel president of into this roger ailes who's and now they've got a book coming out that really apparently really attacks him i haven't read it yet he was asked in an interview today the distinction between the news and opinionated program his exact reply was i grew up in the era when dan rather hated richard nixon he was a newsman but you knew what his opinion was the reaction well first of all of our reality you hated things i've never seen it just simply isn't true it isn't really really worth discussing i'm respected and continue respecting often the person i respect in richard nixon and he came into office what is true if we know this from the tapes richard nixon hated dan rather and c.b.s. news that a matter of record and roger ailes was and for all of the things he's accomplished roger ailes was an operative for richard nixon use of an expected to say something

like this and frankly i don't take it personally don't take it seriously do you agree with the think before that fox news channel is a actual a part of the republican party. you know what i'm pausing only because i want to give a thoughtful answer that i understand that argument i think it goes too far which is to say i think ailes is considers himself still a part of the republican party i think in so far as he's able to that he wants his channel to be that way but i don't want to indict everybody at fox news channel because i know some of the pros there who are pretty good i don't want to dance around your question but i do do think that roger ailes would say this about him he is a very good businessman he's very smart about television and he built a network when i for one wasn't at all sure he could do so and has he used to do benefit the republican party yes the record is very clear on that but is it a sole property even propaganda machine for the party and have stopped short of

that right now or move to some venues more card expectations for obama in two thousand and fourteen what's going to happen in the house and the senate well as united as goes many times the straight answer kind of question is i don't know i want to discuss it with you but you know i've been around long enough to know that he who lives by the crystal ball learns to eat a lot of broken glass and i really didn't more than my share to talk about what's going to happen i would say at the present time we're talking here near the end of january in the election year i think the republicans keep control the house of representatives i would not be surprised if he's in games and seats in the house republicans keep control of the house in the senate and other things will gain seats in the house and the senate but i don't think enough to get control of the senate it is not going to be a good year for brock obama and the democrats in my judgment you essent if you once back that president obama's opponents politically want to cut his heart out and throw his liver to the dog politically where he is that still true even more today

it was when i started do you think it's part racist. i do apart only because i know that people jump over them but it was later so venomous well here's a little bit i do want to make clear not everybody who disagrees with obama not nearly everybody not everybody in the republican party if your question was is some of it as yes i think it's impossible to have on the first president of color in the white house and not recognize that that some of the dislike for him and his policies of it is rooted in racism no question about it but not by no means all of it and let's acknowledge that president obama has made his own mistakes he hasn't operated a perfect presidency. so it gets complicated but the answer your question is some of the races of course as an american as a journalist what are your thoughts is no dinette hero or a villain you know no human has that person who is the most difficult question i

try have to try to answer these days i come out of i think he's neither a hero nor a villain at least not on the basis of what we know because we don't know the whole story or you know they really we don't have a legal question about that but for example when i'm not did he get the job intending to be the leaker that he became or was he conscience stricken and he got the job which was things like that we don't know but again i don't want to bash with it but i think like most people i'm i'm a bit torn on the one that i think the information on the medium and long will it will be of value to society we stand a chance of being a better country because this information gets out in the short run i understand the irgun this is listen the country needs to be able to keep some secrets such as who in ours my apparatuses has contacts in pakistan and other places bows and enjoys difficult to come down on it that i think he's neither a hero nor

a villain i think those who say bring him back to this country let him. stand trial that's fine but it quickly gets in the question if you're going to put him on trial what about the head of the g.s.a. of what do you know the lawyers on the at the n.s.a. who didn't deliver to the congress what are your thoughts on the right to listen to phone calls of. domestic or foreign you know i don't want to really railing varnell he denies that no i think in twenty first century reality. oh that the government has to have a very constricted and very limited ability with proper safeguards built into it to listen to some cold old really opposed to use blanket listening to calls over and there is a system in place as we know a month in the system is perfect last point for cyclists is to be used that you

have a court where they're supposed to go to those court and the court and supposed to be a check and balance now some of the time they have to go to the court other times it looks like the court may be the quote the fix is in but i tend i can subscribe to the theory of this is the government under no circumstances can listen to no telephone calls to most it was not given the terms to burma which were operating and i didn't how do you feel about i greeks totally one hundred percent would you say it's a dilemma but they've got to do what if you knew someone was going to do something or you had strong suspicions and you could prevent it do you not for that years and how would we judge any president who said well i could have known what you know what i decided to leave but i'm not and will be right back with the great dan rather coming up more right after this. controlling the needy agenda social media expands in scope and influence you to

twitter and facebook entertain and inform hundreds of millions of people every day however the same are used to promote hoaxes and mass propaganda pursuits is it inevitable that venture media is doomed to follow the whims of those gaming hijack the internet. or the economic down in the find it wrong that you feel something only. and the rest of the life it's a neat take it will be everything on thing. there's so little self reflection on the part of both the american public and the american decision makers i wonder why is that we are in the continental sized country of three hundred and fifteen million people very self-absorbed we are.

slated from the world by two large oceans. we're trying to think of foreign policy is something we do to other people rather than that but something we participate in . the back to dan rather the former anchor c b s evening news and now of course with exist he adana understand the president is no one from the administration or is the president and first lady going to be a little bits of the things. all things considered probably the right right call because well because there's so much going on in the soviet union including the persecution of gays and lesbians but there's only

a part of it it wouldn't be very difficult for him to go in my judgment but i have no doubt it was a close call on his mind because after all the olympics with most of his in very special category and you try to lift above nation and for that matter international politics but in russia at the present time just not possible. ok we have a situation this country at present is unpopular with congress on whose popular it was a hero in america these groups well it's a good question maybe united do a book where of all the heroes on i think there are a lot of heroes and i think the cop who walks them only beat in a tough neighborhood by himself and my hero i think the single mother with three kids is working four jobs trying to keep her. her family together is a her on their day to day heroes all over the country in terms of transformational political leaders pretty short supply right now and you look up and down the society but we go through these periods you know larry you know i've talked about

the so many times before i'm so i'm an optimist by experience and by nature i love this country with a deep abiding. love and i'm up pretty well in future i know there are going to go listen we're on the downhill slide going to back side of the slope we're in the room on the spending they get and we have no overall commanding heroes in our political life but you know what we'll get there we'll get there and i don't have any doubt about it great lawyer dear friend of mine a way that we've been a williams i asked him once you're an optimist so pessimist is that of course i'm a pessimist unintelligible i'm not going to take the opposite view that i don't know that. compare that i wanted you to compare the controversy over lara logan's now discredited sixty minutes report and the problems you had if you're a national guard service report on well joining an ordinary but i want to make it very clear i don't want to add to c.b.s. news these problems are a local problem i know what it feels like to be in the vortex of those kind of

controversies and i'm pulling for everybody at c.b.s. news and. virtually and of all my life there is a great difference between their situation this is the one you mentioned and what we would do with the bush next good story would see it clearly where our story our story was true you could argue in play you did that we reached that truth through a flawed process and there are plenty of people that they knew the story was true but they couldn't stand it so they had to make it out to be false that's what happened to us kids think our story was true did george bush's father use influence to keep him from going to be a nom getting him an initial guard yes that's true. george w. bush there's no joy in saying there's did he disappear from his natural born obligations that's a fact those things are true to our story was true we caught his own you can argue pressured him that the process was not pristine but i'm going to cook when i come back to i'm not walking the logan shoes and i'm not walking sixty minutes shoes i'm

no longer at c.b.s. on that they've got a lot to deal with of this and not only add to their problems you asked me the difference between that situation in which they have acknowledged that when they had a problem witness all account i told me near the end of his life that he was disappointed it was. that kind of a raw deal and you certainly felt when they did the fiftieth anniversary of j.f.k.'s death and trying to airbrush you out when you reported from dallas so many reporters on that scene in that area and you feel like you're finally you know what i like you any do you want to start of the grass was a great day and i said you have his work and i love it and all it happened is the the years of the detail and i do think that. we need to see when it comes to history they can airbrush me out of the picture they present when it comes to the

history the news organizations and be trying to change history and the c.b.s. news history is whether they now like me or not like me who there doesn't you go through just this coming year and a version of tiananmen square in which we were at the union square the civil rights movement which i covered. not to mention the kennedy assassination so to try to change history and that's fairly serious what they do to me doesn't matter all right you've done a lot to get a story including i told you tried heroin back in one nine hundred sixty five right so you would cover it better so you would understand since i've tried pot i like potter in fact i got a friend to smoke a because i thought i would start smoking again but part was i thought a part should be legal i've said that before always heroin or iran's older quite different thing. this is the scene is the houston police station in one nine hundred fifty five i'm covering the police plead heroin nobody really knew what

heroin was my recollection is they had arrested some musicians he came to town and they were talking about a trojan with heroin what is heroin i work in the radio stations or as and when you want to do the police say well we don't know we've never tried it so what would you do it for me this would not happen today and you can say it was a damn fool thing for me to do but this is what happened between us and what it was like of the number one otherworldly is the best way i can describe it i can also say it gave me a three or four day headache afterward and i came out i would say to myself i don't know what he what he sees in this stuff and i know i never want to face it again and never did it it isn't katie couric on the internet we're on the internet. what do you make of all this where's it all going well with our new words oh going but it's part of the reality and going to be part of reality for a long time to come you know we went through in terms of journalism but. also the society we went through the print age of newspapers that gave way to the radio era

radio era gave way to the television era now the television iran might have been used in a way to the internet era doesn't mean it's going to replace television more than television replaced radio but the internet is the future when anybody likes it or not now i have to think that overall in the main the internet is a force for good information education edition for news as they have its problems yes one of them being that with anonymity you can smear your neighbor or anybody else nobody can tell for that but nonetheless and if it isn't already true larry i think it's already true but if it isn't but truth now that most people get most of their news from the internet it soon will be strictly young people now that that's a people don't leave a visit all under the age of forty other it's only will depend on newspapers by and large for most of the news noted and on television radio they go to the internet that's where it is yeah but the young they grow up and the old get older and leave us what happens to newspapers in twenty years they are around i think they'll be

around but again having said i'm an optimist i understand the argument that they're finished i don't think so anymore than normal going to remember radio came in everybody's that was in newspapers or that is where they were vanished when television came in is that both radio and television if it is it doesn't work out that way i think newspapers will be around i think their content will be more of what we want or longer form it is now because people who want longer form news reports and information good news but you miss the old days of free networks and p.b.s. . sure do of course i do something will say that journalism we have twenty four hour news but the journalism was better than that there are no morrows now. i'm not sure that's true and i'm not sure on the best person to judge it would have to go you know i'm a i'm a child of the thirty's forty's fifty's sixty's and seventy's i do agree that there are moral stands alone this is one of the problems i had with walter cronkite um

i'm sorry for the way cronkite. was of a vital icon and a legend but marone was the founding son developed twenty journalism one know it as we know it i don't think it a one of his matched moros the quality to sustain quality of his journalism but i'm not always enough to say listen the golden age was back when i was doing it back in the sixty's and seventy's there are a lot of good journalism around the way in fact the three anchors at a.b.c. c.b.s. n.b.c. a very good one to agree of for him first rate first rate and the newscasts are first rate but they're not many people as many used to watching them well i have some argue the newscast and i think overall we're over adult beverage i think the three anchors would say they probably had to go through it because there is so sensitive they've always been interested to ratings and demographics but i don't think any either any one of the three network there's there's no or it's hard or

it's hard news as the anchors would like them to believe that they'll have to speak speak for themselves did you run a tough ship and seen you the managing editor i was so with your orders cast there's anyone out there anywhere but come down from above and say don't rub those . basically you know c.b.s. at that time i can't speak for you know the deal was i was anchor and managing editor even years which meant i had to call on every story it was a collegial process i would ask a lot of other people's opinion but in the end i decided what went in the broadcast and what didn't now after the broadcasters over i was accountable plenty of times i got hauled into the news division president's office and said then what the hell do you think you do if you try to track this thing into the ditch but that's the way it worked then only there were only two occasions in the twenty four years that was anchor managing editor of the evening news that

a news division president. came anywhere close to commanding that we do something coverage one was the and you were a member this case of drawing a blank for a second a congressman. condit member there he the killing of girl in the lantern gary renard it is very condit everybody else it was august news was late everybody was running with that story i didn't want to run with it and finally the news division president in effect that then you got to run something on this and i said it's her journalism the words she said you got to and so but by and large c.b.s. when i was there i got to make the calls on the evening news but i was accountable it was over you know i didn't make all perfectly obvious why did you ever come close to leaving c.b.s. of your own militia going to another network you know ted turner and well a lot of first let me correct that. in my heart of hearts you know but there were times when i did carefully consider it. one when when roone arledge zero tried to

get me to come to a.b.c. news in one thousand eighty seven united eighty or it was a powerful push where i really went there and they've you know well if you know what i mean and then. around the two thousand i want to say in one thousand nine hundred ninety two thousand odd ted turner came with an offer and quite honestly i've always wanted to work for ted i admired him from the los early on but those two times i considered but each time over money was better elsewhere and one could argue might have been better financially to go you know somewhere i've seen be as leaders tattooed on my hands i understand and i had to find a loyalty and also not just loyalty but i thought it was the best place in the world for electronic journalist to work no regrets on sure you always have regrets you know might or could've should've done there's the one thing ok if you don't.

you know i love reporter you do sense with these cool i have a patient who was not with i have a lot of lot larry many of which you know many of which have been exposed over the years i have a lot of wounds someone's over inflicted some of them still open wounds but i think even people who disagree with me for like one reason that we didn't have a patient cover he was always and you stay with you from going is that actually i love to get home story and big stories even better and to be up front to be in the really big story. there's nothing like unique kind of got it wakes up and says what's going to happen today absolutely my feet at the floor every warning save where to store things under in here for all of us and thanks to dan rather for joining me on the politicking today for my views out there i want to hear from you join the conversation on my facebook page and share your thoughts on twitter by tweeting at king's things and using the politicking ash tax it's all for this

week's politicking we've got a surprise guest for you next week on the. no the playing. field in big spirit travels with the flame from its birthplace in

greece. joining james brown for an elemental and epic journey around russia and beyond. where i. put it on june sixteenth one thousand forty one we had a graduation party at school and the war broke out.

the shops were always full of goods. but in september leningrad was plucked. one day mom went to europe saw that all the shelves were empty. in november they bombed it but die of steel warehouses with this it was the main storage place for all the food in the city people would be eating the earth because it had small traces of sugar in it i tried to eat it as well but i couldn't . the third night it was incredibly heavy bombing. it was a direct treat told that very sheltered and everyone was buried underneath. all of them with day.

coming up on our t.v. for four more rhetoric president obama lays out his plans for reforming the n.s.a. what he had to say and the future of the u.s. surveillance. arming citizens is this a way to curb crime a police chief of a major u.s. city thinks so well look at the issue coming up. in the movie and dependence day a washington d.c. was leveled by aliens but a new report says d.c. is endangered by a different kind of explosion the story coming up later in the show.