economy with max cons are for a no holds barred look lobel financial headlines tune into kinds a report. it was like the if you. did you know the price is the only industry specifically mention in the constitution. that's because a free and open press is critical to our democracy correct help us. to make you know i'm sorry and on this show we would be a little picture of what's actually going on when we go beyond identifying the true rational debate and a real discussion critical issues facing america are you ready to join the movement and welcome the big. well i'm sorry in washington d.c. and here's what's coming up tonight on the big picture. it appears that we now know what chris christie did last fall for the port authority official who oversaw the

george washington bridge lane closures in september said today he has proof that christie knew about the traffic nightmare those claims check out chris christie's political career over and what does that mean for twenty sixteen for the republican party we'll talk about that and more in tonight's big picture rubble and on thursday congressman henry waxman announced his retirement and he leaves congress it'll be more than just the end of a career it will mean the end of an era that in tonight's conversations with great minds campaign for america's future roger robert and richard. you need to knows this this past sunday marley's monos a pregnant texas woman who had been on life support since november in an attempt to save her fetus was finally disconnected from the respirator that was keeping her

body going even though she had been declared dead all the while doctors had said that she was brain dead. and her family had said that they did not want her on life support but john peter smith hospital nonetheless was refusing to remove her from life support spittal finally agreed to remove munoz from life support after a court ruling and after tests revealed that the fetus that she was carrying was deformed and suffering from a variety of health issues it came to this point thanks to an ancient texas law that lets hospitals go against the end of life wishes of women if they are pregnant now even though they want to remove her from the life support now monos this family may be forced to pay for her ospital costs moses has been told c.n.n. that he's receiving medical bills for her care and the hospital is refusing to say whether they're going to cover the costs or not so she moves this family and her family be forced to pay for health care that they didn't even want in the first place is it the responsibility of the hospital to foot the bill let's rubble.

joining me for tonight's big picture rubble are matt purple the system managing editor the american spectator. communications director for democracy with america and chris allman conservative commentator and activist and thank you to all of you for joining us tonight so you heard my intro on the rant i mean shouldn't. actually i in my universe i mean the bigger picture is this involves health care the family should not pay at all and we should add a single payer health care system back in one hundred forty six where forty seven harry truman proposed it and you know end of discussion would be like the rest of the world wouldn't be having this conversation but we are what's the appropriate response anybody want to take this. i think i think all of us are probably in agreement that there's no reason why this woman and her family should have to pay for this. for being kept on life support against her will for months on end after

she didn't declare did it you know i don't think anyone thinks that this is the right solution and you know at the end of the day i don't think she's going to have to pay the bills and for. the state should step in and really the hospital should be paying the bills the speech state required her to be kept alive the state should pay chris you've been very outspoken really pro-life and i'm curious your take on this because they were they were trying to save the fuse so many basically pulled the plug on it became obvious that the fetus was probably not going to survive the term well you know it's interesting we're sort of i wonder if i was really concerned about this case and i went back and did a little research that the language that in the texas law was borrowed from an a california law when they rewrote their end of life laws and they just put it in each other they're always there it was in one thousand in the seventy's ok that california had the law and then texas i think rewrote it in the ninety's and so they looked at what california had did they read it even the drafter said well this is not a case where that would apply because she was brain dead so even the drafters of

the law said this would not have been the case i personally think that the hospital was afraid of a lawsuit their attorney said we don't know what that means so we're going to do this but texas this is in texas right it is exercise tort reform so the maximum lawsuit that you can sue in texas for medical but there it is two hundred fifty thousand dollars that i know nothing for this hospital but they were going the other and they got her name and i know that attorneys can be overly cautious but i think this case is an anomaly i think now that we've had hopefully the worst case scenario texas can go back and say you know what we shouldn't borrow another state's language when we weren't sure what it meant and let's rewrite it in a way that's reasonable for everybody if a woman is declared brain dead obviously this would not apply and you know even the catholic church would say. she's dead and that there's no more moral obligation and that's their doctrine i mean that is what the catholic church centers and i think you know there's two very clear things i think we want to cleave apart here and one

is that was this a catholic hospital you know because i don't think it whirls i don't think so yeah . there's two to separate things here one is the pro-life side which you know. i wish that that baby could have been saved i wish that if the section could have performed there have been cases where women have been in comas and a c section has been performer around the same time i did manage to save the feet as it was very unlikely i know i'm just missing first trimester problems and there's also the end of first harasser well by the time the by the time she died i've supported i think it's twenty two twenty three weeks and yeah but then the other separate issue is really the hospital in the payment and that is the hospital only did this for one reason they were worried about a lawsuit so should they have to pay for keeping her alive for a cynical reason like that absolutely the muniz family can't afford this they should have to pay for health care they can't afford like i said texas did tort reform they said oh you know the republicans ran around so if we just kept you know make everybody's life worth a quarter million dollars and not one penny more no matter how much damage a doctor does to somebody they may mutilate them for the rest of their lives and this by they've been the thirty fifth person they're incompetent doctor still the

most you can sue in the state of texas for medical malpractise is two hundred fifty thousand dollars period they got that passed during the george i believe it was during the george w. bush governorship i know there's a huge price for it right around that time a bit but this is what i don't understand why this is anything to do with the hospital being cautious about lawsuits well as it is if they will because i still don't want to play what he said i want to pay what it's going to. come out of the hospital bill doesn't know what this does or are going to really have to you know what we want this has to do with an archaic law that was inherited from another state where they didn't think this through they need to take this case and they need to take it back to the legislature and they need to say ok we need to you know put in a regulation we need to figure out how this is going to work in the future so the high shows that happen again we should honor and respect the wishes of the family in the woman who was to me to bring to her her family knew from the very get go that she didn't want to be kept on life support there's no reason why there should be any law forcing an individual to use their alien will as anybody you know don't want to go there she didn't sign a form either saying that her husband on saturday. her husband had just lived

through a crisis and her husband knew that this is not her and that's the. it's kind of that's one of the arguments about in favor of marriage is that you get to you know ok you know i'm married to louise she can make decisions for me if i can and that's how it should work then again that's. death penalty yesterday speaking of life and death issues federal prosecutors yesterday announced they're going to seek the death penalty for boston marathon bombing suspect. what's his name's. tourney general eric holder so the nature of the conduct at issue and the result in harm compels this decision this at a time when states are saying you know that the drug companies will no longer sell laws drugs to kill people because the drug companies don't want to be complicit in state sanctioned murder and so they're having to come up with these weird cocktails that keep people alive for like twenty minutes. and so now they're saying well

let's go back to firing squads or bring back old sparky you know just rice and skin is the time to say enough is enough you know there's no science that indicates the death penalty discourages murder in fact if anything the opposite the states with the death penalty have the highest murder rates states without death penalty have lower murder rates it's the same with true is it's true of nations there's no time to say enough of the barbarism already and let's start at the federal level i mean i thought president obama was pro you know pro-life is what it used to be called it used to be the anti death penalty movement before nine hundred seventy three it was called the pro-life movement. i mean i don't think president obama was ever death penalty but i think again after you know coming from illinois he knows better than almost anyone else the problems with the justice system our inability to really ensure that everyone gets a fair trial and that's the number one reason why we have to end the death penalty it was going to be ultimate punishment and until we can be absolutely confident that our justice system is infallible there's no reason why we should happen well

i'm going to i want to say on a doubt in this yeah i would say we're going bad we can be confident here but still when we say. we are going to kill people by force of law. i started to get really and whether it's we're going to kill people with drones and accept the fact that sometimes we're going to blow up wedding parties or whether it's we're going to kill people with the death penalty except the fact that sometimes we're going to kill innocent people i think they're morally equivalent and yet we i think we need to really look at what our punishment is in cases like this ok this guy who came to this country was made a citizen and then did one of the most disgusting despicable things he could do which was set off bombs at a public event where a child died as well as two other people and two hundred sixty other people were injured ok death penalty we take that off the table this guy should be cracking rocks for the rest of his life not three culturally sensitive meals a day not a t.v.

not anything like that yes we shouldn't kill him but let's make his life really really heart public floggings no let's make him crack bring back the stocks do something that you know i mean if he cracks rocks it's going to end up with. a big well he's also not a big guy sure he will be out in ten years and brad rocks that is a little trite but you know i think you have to know the issue before and that is that you know you brought up a state by state example you know we debate you sometimes deterrence versus non deterrence the disproportionately affects people the black community and so forth i don't think when we start getting into the sociological arguments i think we're going too far i think it's as simple as it's immoral to take somebody's life and we ought not do it unless we absolutely have to and that applies to abortion as we almost touched on before that applies to the war and that ought to apply to the death penalty too i don't think that we need to do this anymore i'm you know it's not in the constitution we should let the states decide but i think you know you're seeing a rash of states move in the death penalty direction now i think that's the right

way to go and in fact what is in the constitution here at the moment is that we shall not have cruel and unusual punishment and times change as jeff. and pointed out and as times change the standards of society change and you know we've seen this in really big ways like the end of slavery and the right of women to vote and we've seen this in thousands of smaller ways and this is why this is somewhere between big and small i think and if you look at the countries around the world that have still have the death penalty as opposed to all the ones that don't i think we've got a graphic of that someplace there it is yeah it's full screen right now that company yeah yeah the red countries are the ones that have the death penalty right it's basically china and a couple of countries that are that are. don't really have functioning governments right now i mean it's or you know whatever it's a. bad bad guy so. i'm surprised it's a consensus yes thank you that's all the more of tonight's big picture rubble right after the break.

i got a quote for you. it's pretty tough. to stay where it's about story. let's give this guy like you would smear about guns instead of working for the people both issues the mainstream media were pretty much on the bridegroom's didn't. because. they did rather it was. were. a piece of. it was terrible a. very hard to take up that once you get to put on a life that you never had sex with her thick hair.

i'm going to. play. politically. one of them. for a. while

to magnetize big picture rubble with a tonight our map purple nails rocha and chris all that let's get back to it i want to play a clip of chris christie from his brigade press conference so early ron. i have absolutely nothing the heart. and i have not given the instruction to anyone yet but my instructions everybody will be to cooperate me answer questions i have you know josh i have nothing to hide any questions anybody wants to ask me they can ask. you know from from law enforcement you don't even want to ask the commands so we have nothing to hide. them from the heart so it looks like he actually did have something to hide david wildstein the export authority official who oversaw the politically motivated link closings of the george washington bridge claims that he has proof that chris christie had direct knowledge personal knowledge of the

closings and the traffic nightmare in a letter released by his lawyer wildstein claims that evidence exists evidence exists tying mr christie to having knowledge of the lane closures during the period when the lanes were closed contrary to what the governor stated publicly in a two hour press conference so you know christie is denying this new will all those sorts out but whether or not he's guilty of anything whether or not he goes to jail or sixteen people in this administration do sort of like the reagan administration you know we had more elected a more senior administration officials go to prison than any other administration has for the country yet nobody remembers that about the reagan administration whether any of that happens i still think by twenty you know his twenty sixteen probabilities are toast and what i thought was really interesting is the national journal today is reporting that the leading contender for the republican primary right now is mitt romney and there's this major rehabilitate mitt romney effort going on and is out there doing the new circuits right now netflix just released

this biopic about mitt that makes him look like you know the sainted figure and actually i don't know the whole thing i watched the first half of it and i just couldn't do it anymore i stopped to watch i watch you watch the whole i watch the whole thing on tuesday ok i think it doesn't necessarily come off that much better in the end you know i think it's going to be you know i shouldn't but it's a great it's a great story and listen the guy had phenomenal access and but i think everyone. you watch it it's a real one i haven't seen it so there's still some of the stream scene in there where he's talking about how it's going to be sort of an apocalyptic scenario if obama gets elected you know you like a bunker or something which is a little bit you have. in front of the cameras and gene wilder and romney comes out today and it says it's just americans it's a tragedy for america that mitt did get to be prime for this family all it's going to drink poison or something well you know what sorry republicans and conservative first i tend to vote republican but. mitt romney you waited in line we gave you

a chance you lost chris christie you said you were a man of the people you said you were a straight talker if it comes out that you're not sorry we don't need that kind of baggage let's move on i mean you know what's funny is that chris christie is not really a conservative at all and yet so many people in the establishment republican party are pushing him and it's got some pretty extreme oppositions but but you know do it the guy who ran against truman he was also the guy who ran against franklin roosevelt for his fourth term well you know you've got a prosperous in the republican party and the rich and they're losers yes we do have a president of serial killers or not you know real losers in the democratic party actually the guy who ran twice was grover cleveland and he won both times even though there was a republican in between. the only democrat who held the white house during the last half of the nineteenth century but. so do you think it's possible that it was i mean i don't know you know i don't know the republican base will ever nominated romney and i think it's kind of funny because usually from the republican you know

certain amount of reaction against the tea party now we're having figures like mitt romney sort of i don't think necessarily he has anything to do with it but then people like liz cheney and jeb bush who are you know coming out of the woodwork again and trying to i guess pull the party in a more quote establishment direction the g.o.p. has enough fresh blood even with chris christie supposedly out of the race i'm not convinced he is but they have a rand paul scott walker there are plenty of ideas not all of the road on to the you know we national i want to water walker has had a very i guess you guys need to remove i think the recall elections were a very unique situation i think once scott walker has to face voters and frankly has to come clean with a lot of what's gone on and. to do you know i mean i think the army was a consummate con about why anybody that i would not. like this is that the people voted walker obama is a great extent how do you interact democrats i was right when a couple of billionaire brothers through all you know you know people of that. i liked what he did and that you know that if he does come out of it that's my goal

is to say about christie relate to he's not necessarily out of this and this guy you know between don zimmer and this other guy who came out today they need to stop thinking the new york times is the f.b.i. they need to there's three different investigations going on right now they need to cooperate them and you know i as i said i'm not passing judgment on his guilt or and they're trying to take i'm i'm i'm cynical simply observing the politics of this and i just think he's politically. and i think reagan would have been if the if the. contras stuff had happened in eighty two instead of eighty five and eighty six but many millions of americans are now realizing that they're too poor to afford obamacare and it's thanks to republican lawmakers across the country twenty five states which are either controlled by republican governor public and legislature refused to expand medicaid coverage case in point i think a great case in point is florida you've got over seven hundred thousand people in florida and the people who are signing these folks up. it's it's it's pretty it's pretty amazing they're talking about how people are coming in saying i

make less than fifteen thousand three hundred dollars a year so i should qualify for free health insurance that's what you know it's that's the case in other states i want to see for example so i'm here to get it and they say no sorry even though rick scott the governor the republican governor wanted to take the money even though the republican senate voted to take the money the republican house of representatives said no it's important member that rick scott initially didn't want to take the money right and then he went back and tried to take the money and the republican radical republican florida house said no you can't do that here so you do so the question in my mind here is is in two parts of are they just present this is a question number one when medicaid was first rolled out it was optional for the states to pick it up it was fifty six percent payment by the federal government in the lot of states said no i don't want that it's going to cost us too much and within six years of its rollout in sixty five i think it was maybe sixty seven within six years every state picked it up so a isn't it just a matter of time before all these states do it just because of the pressure and be

. in two thousand and fourteen as people are starting to really seriously aggressively now figure out five and a half million people are falling into the red state donut hole the john roberts don't all you know whatever you want to call the republican guard is this going to hurt the republicans in the twenty fourteen election. this is one more example of why obamacare doesn't work it was quickly and poorly crafted let me tell you there's no you know whatever it is is done very acid you know really does because they gave the option for the states to not expand our roberts did that yes supreme court did that. it was mandatory. ok it was mallory and when i went in the spring it doesn't work let me tell you what happened in north carolina to a very good friend of mine his contractor makes me no independent businessman he went on obamacare website to see maybe i could only own insurance made and get a better deal plugged in this information last year because of some buying and some

selling and whatever his actual taxable income was low enough he got an email back saying congratulations your unrolled in medicaid he said he called me because i don't want to be on medicaid i don't need to be in medicaid i have enough money to buy my own insurance i was just shopping around they said we're sorry we you can't get off you know you know he has you know he has been and now for a month and a half trying to reach somebody in the state and this is a republican state to get off medicaid this all is all horribly hafted all he has and we have probably no i understand the problems of life probably bureaucracy and you have the same problems with health insurance companies but the fact of matter is that if he doesn't build anything to medicaid he doesn't have medicaid he doesn't have to worry about that and when it comes to raises an interesting issue you know the american legislative exchange council has been pushing this clawback thing in the states where if you're over fifty five and you're on medicaid you're not actually your health care is not actually being paid for you're being you're borrowing money and you have to wipe out your own the state to pay it back and this

is something that alec has been pushing twenty twelve twenty thirteen to actually over the last half a decade or so they've been putting out press releases on this trying to get the states to be more aggressive in taking people's money i mean this is bizarre that that's completely off topic maybe it's not actually it's piece of it but i haven't heard from that and from i don't really you know i don't know going to comment on the alec thing i don't follow them nearly as closely as you do i think but i think this is the latest in a series of problems for obamacare this one i think happens to be caused by republican governors who rejected rejected the medicaid expansion absolutely as a problem but the idea here because it's a problem for obamacare is the latest problem of the law i mean between the website . i mean look we've got a website back and that isn't even breed being being built but we don't want somebody shows up just saying i don't believe this thing we're going to have severe damage to the health insurance market this thing has to be done by march they've got a new contractor working on it we've got something like ninety three million insurance cancellations scheduled for this year when the new grand fall they are over in

every. we've got premiums going up all the that was written in the federal register that those are the number of cancellations that are going to go out so yes this one does appear to have been caused by the fact that we didn't expand medicaid but this law is a disaster it's not all the you know the carrots and the sticks and the shifting parks they're not even really going to said that it couldn't be mandatory because it was unconstitutional for the federal government to tell the states it had to be mandatory so you know now you're good moaning the fact that they're holding the constitution in this aspect no i'm asking the question is this going to bite the republicans in the book i think i do much as i will the democrats i think and i think it will when you when you have a person that is you know making fifty thousand dollars a year and can't get access to health insurance and actually there's and there's one story about this florida law we're a gentleman you know if he goes into renal failure then he can get access to health insurance and i was in dollars a year he he you know if you make under fifteen thousand dollars a year you don't have that same problem read the story i made forty eight hundred

dollars on his unemployment rate why is he not in medicaid because he's not even bumping up against the poverty level that was the whole bogus story i mean it's it's not a bogus story to this gentleman who is suffering because of the lack of back story that you know but if he may well under the level he went on the bogus story look at the one that kathy what's her name the republican official we're going to get the response used to you know kind of this this woman are going to grow up. about so much what are the biggest touted by president obama as being this great health care success story later came out now not coming with morris rogers another woman came back and said no this is not working for me i don't have health insurance anymore i mean this. stories like this on both sides only we should hold up dueling anecdotes i think we should focus on the problem which is that this is going on or sludge policy that does not work so why is it all true that we've got to we need to build a health insurance system in this country that provides catastrophic care and has a strong safety net underneath it for people like this as a result we have the exact opposite i get

a free new pair of eyeglasses every year on my health insurance plan and people who really needed or bumping up against the poverty line can't get it because you know it's just it's far too complex it's far too but that's because you or your employer is paying for your really nice health care and that's great and part of the great thing about obamacare is that it in the difficult part about it is that it mixes in a system which kind of frankly wasn't working for the vast majority of americans tries to compromise with the republican solution that was offered in the early ninety's and as a result yet we've got a frankenstein monster of a situation if it were up to me if it were up to millions of progressives across this country we would have a single payer for jordan in the association but everybody is eligible for medicare yet because this really is a republican proto good answers this question already before we went into. chris thank you all for joining thank you thank you coming up during world war two and the decades that followed the united states experience a period of parallel prosperity but all that came crashing to an end during the reagan revolution of the eighty's is it possible to reverse the reagan revolution

or was that just wishful thinking at this point more on that tonight's conversations of the great minds. there are native to. the network. it's going to give you a different perspective you want to never i'll give you the information you make the decision. it's a revolution in the mind it's a revolution of ideas and consciousness. extremely you approach would be described as angry i think in a strong. one single. chance are for. leg length in the finish line at the marathon. was. the

lead. i would rather i asked questions to people in positions of power instead of speaking on their behalf and that's why you can find my show larry king now right here on our t.v. question more.

on thursday california congressman henry waxman announced that he will be retiring at the end of his term waxman has never been the flashest of politicians but he's certainly been one of the most effective a tried and true liberal and during his forty years in the house of representatives he's helped as crucial pieces of legislation like the one nine hundred ninety clean air act amendments the safe drinking water act amendments and most recently the affordable care act obamacare and waxman finally packs of bags and heads back to the golden state congress will lose one of its most effective negotiators but also lose a way of looking at the world waxman grew up in an era of on peril of prosperity for american society and like many people from his generation believed in the power of government to do good during his time in congress the country has changed a lot and.