a tentative peace is extended in the east of ukraine as both the army and government fighters evolve to uphold a cease fire with reports of violations surfacing throughout the week. barack obama gives in to pressure from washington hawks in the senate to approve five hundred million dollars worth of aid to syrian rebels despite extremists taking advantage of previous deliveries. and in leagues recording poland cell foreign ministers equate his own country to a submissive sex partner and also is alliance with the u.s. as worthless and the harmful.

is largely international with the big stories from the past seven days and right up to the minute developments with me to bang must say. a truce abroad relative calm to ukraine no this week as both the army and antigovernment fighters in the east agreed to hold fire until monday already got tax however are still breaking out of the cease fire plan involved a lot of diplomatic effort and was supported by key countries including russia a reminder the week long truce was declared in the east on friday that was followed by talks between kiev in the self-proclaimed republic for the first time since the conflict started another republican vowed to recognize the cease fire in the presence of russian and international monitors on wednesday the president of ukraine and russia as well as the french and german leaders discuss the peace process over the phone the same day the legal permission for the use of russia's

military force in ukraine if needed was cancelled putin's request as friday the truce was extended for three more days with anti-government forces promising to abide by it now the piece of it also saw always see monitors released after they were detained in the dunny it's greeting while civilians tired of the military operation clearly support the political drive for stability to do it very good but neither. was yes there's no doubt that it was the. beginning to look for you know what do you really do you should look for you could. not shoot on we wouldn't want to to talk. why didn't they push you really are you with the board no good day in michigan. given that now she is a national pray that you should rethink your provision. if you do you can depend

on. the leaders of russia or ukraine germany and france have once again spoken on the phone they discuss the ongoing peace effort and suggested international monitors could be sent to the border crossing between russia and ukraine meanwhile this is sunday is a footage from the eastern ukrainian city of slavyansk where the truth doesn't seem to be holding. they started firing from the mountain with ukrainian troops are residential areas of the city it went on for forty five minutes i've seen it all a couple photos on my phone the burned cars the destroyed marketplace houses riddled with holes three people were killed and many more wounded and we haven't searched all the buildings yet. the ceasefire was breached by both sides several times throughout the week people in the city of qom are tosca claim their city was shelled on numerous occasions the village of prove all know you saw a spike of violence with one woman reportedly killed him and in slovyansk woman and

her twenty six year old son perished in army shelling outside the embattled city self-defense forces took control of a checkpoint from the army unconfirmed reports claim the army then launched a counterattack but lost twenty of its own soldiers or shelling close to the russian border saw a checkpoint hit a mortar shell hit hardest by the conflict are those who can't stand for themselves as large as maria from last night found out at an orphanage court in the conflict. these can home for abandoned special needs children on the outskirts of lugansk aims to be in a series of calm and tranquillity. children here have food toys but most importantly love. there are eight to six children they scare house all younger than three years old it's been a home and cozy home you have who are all of them that once war reached its walls

it's no longer safe. mines and shells blend just a couple of kilometers away. and while the youngster had no concept of the danger for the adults it's a different story now surrounded it does a lot but then last year it's so hard actually more than half our kids cannot move there are either too small or they have motor problems some have cerebral palsy they need special care and even if we want to evacuate them we need a very special place just like ours is very hard to do. she says of atlanta a mother herself tries to remain positive but it's no easy matter no one can say how dangerous it becomes when they start firing here an internet compelling saved in boss kids was launched to draw attention to this particular case as well as many are there often in tears and care homes that have suddenly found themselves on the front line and where the sounds of shelling and firing have increasingly replaced

gentle lullabies regional lugansk in eastern ukraine while the ukrainian president might seem more willing to uphold the cease fire and bring about peace there are groups within the key of authority is the relied too much on aggression that's according to senior lecturer in international relations at moscow state university marks the border. the government such as it is in kiev has very limited control it depends to a large extent still on the ultra nationalist paramilitary groups for its survival its hold on power in kiev and it has been afraid to challenge them we saw a trade union meeting in kiev attacked by an armed right sector mob with complete impunity and we have seen this repeatedly that they act they attack individuals groups buildings churches throughout the country and the government

does nothing to rein them in and this holds true on the battlefield as well members of the national god squad have returned to kiev they're demanding an end to the truce and the resumption of the military operation the crowd together in independence square which earlier this year became the cradle of the writing that i'll set the previous authorities of ukraine. reeling from the conflict in the tens of thousands of ukrainian refugees now the u.n. estimates over one hundred thousand have crossed the border to russia since the beginning of the military operation by the u.s. has once again expressed doubts about those numbers saying the source is not credible. since the start of two thousand and fourteen one hundred and ten thousand craniums have arrived in russia we just have seen no evidence to support that we don't believe they're credible we're watching we just don't think that the

hundreds of thousands number is credible we don't have anything to cooperate but this is the u.n. this isn't the russians this is the united nations and there's this is an agency saying you guys give millions and millions of dollars to go in there now. we don't have anything to back up that number matt. coming up early look at the deal that are firmly realigned do you crying towards the euro but there still is no end in sight for the conflict in the east one which washington accuses russia or fanning but as brookport later america's sanction a slag at home. problems of foreign minister has been secretly taped comparing his country's relationship with the us to a sexual act according to a leaked by a polish online magazine writer slav sikorsky believes his country is essentially pleasing america with little in return which according to him makes also a subservient partner in fact us is it to get worse not only is the alliance with america worthless but it has a native poland the biggest neighbors russia and germany moscow was somewhat

sympathetic to his comments there is saying the quest language was most likely a response to similar hurtful comments made by us deputy secretary of state so that would be great i think polluted thing and how the u.n. help glue it and you know the e.u. but it's not just the us the polish foreign minister is less than satisfied with sikorsky pulled no punches when talking about the u.k. prime minister's dealings with the euro skeptics are suggesting david cameron bowed to pressure and when softer when he should have stayed strong as if that wasn't enough sikorsky went on to remember other times he believes cameron misfired political politically saying it's not likely to change needless to say the embarrassingly frank diplomatic conversation has caused quite a stir here is what some of the commentators we talked to say. let me start which is obvious far for everyone here in poland for most of the analysts has just voiced

the opinion which is shared by most of the population here actually it raises other troubling questions about the judgment of america who is after all his country's chief diplomatic representative who aspires to be the chief diplomatic representative of the entire european union and the governments he has been so scathing about the governments of britain and the united states the very countries which have supported him throughout his career into what you feel so much i think it shows that there is a real awareness among the circles of power in poland as to what the relationship with the united states has really brought them which is nothing more news is coming your way including the hidden danger thousands of migrants are trying to reach israel through the silent desert unaware of the kidnapping gangs that lie in wait. if you want other stories a syrian rebels could soon benefit from some half a billion dollars the u.s. plans to splash on the equipment and to train enough one months of pressure from

washington's a war hawks president obama asked congress to approve massive aid to the fighters just a year ago washington gave the green light for a lethal aid to the so-called moderate rebels but that later added up into the hands of jihad is there any way an america was forced to suspend the aid however earlier this month america admitted it has been covertly sending actual weapons to the opposition and experts warn that the u.s. hasn't learned its own mistakes. the obama policy from the beginning has been for regime change as we saw in libya as we saw in ukraine and we've seen in other parts of the world and so now the administration is going to be providing if approved by the congress higher quality weapons to the rebels but the rebels are intermeshed with the if they can interchange an interconnected with all the jihad

and the jihad is control large part of territory they control large checkpoints the united states appears to have a schizo front of foreign policy there they're saying they demand unity in iraq behind the central government which is fighting what they call islamic extremist from isa's and at the same time they're funding these same armed groups in syria to take down an independent nationalist and sovereign government in syria what the u.s. is doing and has been doing this finally in money guns and more occupation tools in a region that it considers to be vital because it's resource rich that's about it iraq has learned the hard way how u.s. aid can be useful all the wrong reasons right now american hard way to do several humvees are being used by extremists the equipment was captured after jihad is to control of iraqi army warehouses extremists continuing their back that fierce fighting around fifty kilometers from the capital. there's also disturbing evidence as to who's being forced to join the militants rand says you can see in this video

boys with automatic rifles are traveling in an isis convoy some children are also reportedly being used as snipers. and it all equates to iraq being pushed to the brink as mostly cuffing off reports. despite the chaos spreading across the country and eerie calm in the kurdish capital the city is just sixty kilometers from the isis front line but it downtown erbil it was business as usual kurdistan has often felt like a separate country altogether even at the height of iraq's most violent and bloodiest moments now with the current crisis shredding the country to pieces it's closer than ever to becoming one kurdish soldiers are now in control of territory that used to be just feuded but no one here seems to think that the hardest would dare march on them. but i have full faith in the forces we won let anything happen. for some the prospect of a divided iraq was

a welcome one do you think that iraq war made of one country as we know what's happening this crisis may be good may be that iraq will have to be divided we'll have area and the sunnis and shias will have there is no one in kurdistan as more and we have oil we have a strong army. they may have or oil but fuel is running scarce for days now iraqi forces battled with isis for control of the country's largest oil refinery this is one of the first things you notice here in our build these massive gas lines some of the cars have been here for hours since the morning many people in fact camped out overnight to try to get online so they can get gas frustrated residents line up to get their share authorities have limited each individual to thirty leaders that's less than what it takes to fill two tanks the people we've spoken to said there haven't been lines like this for fuel since the

outbreak of the u.s. led invasion back in two thousand and three and although there are shortages here in erbil parts of northern iraq have run out of gas even on the black market and so people are stocking up they say that they don't know what the bring the fear is that if you get a lot of words before it gets better that's a sentiment we heard from many here and it's not just a nice fleeing the violence we encountered shia refugees to foxtel gonzi job or came here six days ago from baghdad in baghdad the situation has gone from bad to worse people are arming themselves and getting ready to fight one another all you see the future is bloodshed and violence if something doesn't change iraq will be a country of wolfensohn widows' caffein of erbil iraq. well now the kurds have the support of the israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu as fact a state a move that seems to clash with the songs of washington tell of these longtime geo political ally so without some more news

a while back off to the south break. is the media leave us so we leave the media. are the same motions to the other party there's a big. issues that no one is asking with the guests that you deserve answers from. politics.

speak your language. programs and documentaries in arabic it's all here on all. the world talks of the i p interview intrigued. by. the arabic to find out more visit arabic don't. welcome back this is r t international with the weekly ukraine finally signed a trade agreement with the e.u. this week the failure of the country's previous leader to do so is what's called a ukrainian crisis leading to the current civil conflict however the new leader insists that this is just the first step of closer ties with you. see that. ukraine is a european country under the forty nine article will have an opportunity cost for

the membership perspective this is a very important character for ukraine and to work up. well financially challenged the euro still doesn't appear to be quite ready for ukraine that is commissioner for enlargement has said kiev still needs to prove its european credentials and annex reforms blocks energy commission has won the bailout for greece is peanuts compared to what will be needed to save kids' economy the president of the european commission says the e.u. is simply not ready to welcome ukraine right now and that sentiment is also echoed by the foreign minister of europe's paul howes germany it comes as no surprise to financial experts patrick. ukraine which last year was in a catastrophic position how it's signed a free trade association this year is going to associate with the european union are the point when it's on the brink already of economic disaster this is a catastrophic move for the ukrainian economy the only winners either this or

a few sadly deluded egos whether they're in brussels whether they're in washington who believe some horror rather they've achieved a great geopolitical victory for the people of ukraine there are no jobs to be hard here there's only going to be job losses from the onset washington's been blaming russia for fanning the conflict in ukraine and threatening sanctions unless it stops but america's plans are facing stanch opposition from western businesses and here is why russia being an emerging market with a growing economy and income has been quite attractive for u.s. companies the possibility of being cut off from the market is making american business bosses nervous but just who's involved well bought by is nearly a third of its titanium here up the country is also one of the fastest growing markets for pepsi and u.s. common infections also have a huge interest in the russian market with general motors as well as a ford selling tens of thousands of vehicles here last year the chamber of commerce

and the national association of manufacturers are launched an ad campaign to explain just why new sanctions will backfire they say it will leave u.s. companies are scrambling to keep up with firms from other countries earlier we spoke to the president of the franco russian chamber of commerce and industry. it should have been because actually. the political system is such that no. leaders are talking about it going to be called sanctions so we need to raise our voice and tell them that they should not do it to the again they should use diplomacy to do so do the ukrainian crazies using and kicking in to host g.'s but companies whether they are us your pin or french companies it is something which isn't acceptable for us what the sanctions are doing is isolating the united states' economy instead of isolating russia they were meant to isolate russia but given the trend of world trade for all of the exports that russia has and for

diplomacy it's their actions that they're actually doing in isolating the united states it's a very strange business logic it doesn't make sense logically has to be a political well thousands of israel bound refugees from africa the search for a better life and up in torture camps they fall into the hands of ruthless smuggling gangs who demand money for their hostages the migrant flow through sinai is very intense up to three thousand people per month coming from the eastern african state of the retreat a lead the human traffickers reportedly applied torture and even mutilation rape and psychological pressure against their captives if the families refuse to pay the ransom is the hostages are executed more than four thousand people estimated to have been killed since two thousand and eight and around a thousand fold to be in captivity right now. despite the retreat and president calling for an investigation the local authorities have turned

a blind eye to the kidnappings israel's israel's prime minister once even described refugees as infiltrators around the esta foreigners as a swedish retreat and journalists and activists trying to raise awareness about victims of torture by putting their plight on the big screen. shot ordeal. shot up with the actual moment she. was. lying. there were melting plastic bags and dropping it in their backs this is the burns. on asked on a stressed interview to r.t. that she believes there's a big difference in the way captives are treated depending on their nationality i have seen kids children that are two years old being tortured the torture is not

any other tortured like we see the horror movie or something it's where people are tortured twenty four hours a day last year and more original woman was kidnapped in the same area and it took about a week for her to be released americans getting kidnapped in the sinai. it took only twenty four hours to release them this happens all quite often to westerners as well but they're out with a base and they don't get to experience the torture as a free country. it has to do with was race. you can watch the full interview recorded for him in the now with an exe and now we're on our website at r.t. dot com now time for some more headlines from around the world this hour rescue teams are continue to search through the rubble left by the collapse of a twelve story building in seoul the india that killed at least nine people a few hours before a separate building collapse in new delhi left at least eleven did and does

a structure when. residential dwelling came down officials say heavy rain is to blame along with poor maintenance and low quality construction materials. anger over the huge amount to spend on the world cup has led to yet more protests on the streets of brazil more than two hundred tried to march to the maracana stadium in rio de janeiro but were stopped by police several demonstrators were wrestled to the ground and detained chanting the world cup rallies began last year and have all courage more or less daily ever since. when the temperature is rising there's a little more refreshing than a cooling at least according to one polar bear in siberia the animal decided it wasn't prepared to wait for his food to be filled up and simply lay down in the gusts and what they like to visitors to the zoo captures the moments on camera and now the shower loving bear is on the way to be a u.t.v.

sad face. now that is adorable up ahead on a boy looks at whether the west should change its perception of ukraine's term oh i mean military crackdown in the country's southeast. some people say freedom isn't free and they're right in fact freedom a only cost the price of a bottle of water or an old t. shirt fans celebrating the recent victory of the l.a. kings noticed that they were not alone what was believed to be a police trove of flying over them filming them i thought of moral contempt for drones or just for the hell of it the crowd began to throw random objects until it was brought down i think this event makes two very big points firstly

a lot of the surveillance state is not that hard to stop i mean there are satellite photos being taken of us all the time and it's a spying on our communications but any camera or other device been throwing distance of a brick is at the mercy of us that are you know one percent and secondly generally if a crowd of people does something few ever get punished i mean if this drone was actually a police drone would they try to lock up the entire crowd for breaking it no they wouldn't and they couldn't for some reason if one person commits an act of civil disobedience they are in ford but if a crowd does that they generally get away with it so if you're going to defend your right to privacy from drugs bring fifty guys with you and everything will work out just fine but that's just my opinion.

hello and welcome to worlds apart for your is the west soul of the so-called collatz revolutions as a means to democratize the post soviet space are the current events in the ukraine with the bloodshed and divisions they've already produced likely to change that well to discuss that i'm now joined by timothy calls and a professor of government and russian studies at harvard university professor called and thank you very much for being here on the show the western media has so far avoided assigning any color to the events in the ukraine and i wonder why do you think that it's i think because the just when some selves are not assigned the color that you're right there is no color assigned to it i think it's probably too late it's a revolution without a name. but isn't that also an attempt to mask the fact that the colored revolution

has already been attempted in ukraine and unfortunately the supposedly pro democratic forces that already came to power a couple of years ago they failed to produce a lasting democratic change in that country yes your and revolution. was a great disappointment and this may explain the fact that you know some of the same forces tried it a second time i don't know that it explains why they didn't decide it a color the assignment of colors is largely an accident i think it reflects associations often with flowers of one kind or another this happened in the winter maybe it wasn't so obvious but then case you're right it's it is a sort of unnamed. but i mean the fact that they were called colored revolutions also how to explain to at least western audience that you know the events in georgia ukraine and noted later kurdistan were sort of one of the same while it may or may not be the case i wonder if you see what is happening in ukraine now as

a continuation of that same trend that began back in the early two thousand and twelve. i think so it's. largely the same sort of phenomenon that has it's it's protests very often in the past the. provocation or the trigger for the event was a disputed election so this was the case of course in ukraine in two thousand and four this time that was not an election there was no election on the horizon it was going to be another year year and a half before the coach had to. seek reelection that was as we all know the decision of his government not to sign the association agreement with the e.u. so there was a trigger it was a different one this time it produced an outpouring on the streets of the capital city and then what's really different though is that this took part a violent turn it's different at least for. ukraine and it is stun had to violent.

revolutions or overthrows the second one of which doesn't have a name either actually the overthrow back here in two thousand and twenty ten it's doesn't have a name now in the west there is uprising so i usually pre-trained as people struggling for democracy and you mentioned the political trigger that is that was common in georgia and ukraine. also to some extent in that kurdistan at least in their first revolution but i wonder if you really believe that people. are motivated by political thinking rather than economic thinking which is usually the case in. most of its base economic grievances it seems to have been a mix of kind of snowball of many different things so there was there is economic prostration in ukraine as we all know for for good reason it has not kept up economically. there was a lot of frustration about corruption and many ukrainians rightly or wrongly

thought that this association agreement with the e.u. was going to mark a kind of symbolic break with the past we had down the different road things would get better. some of this was probably naive actually i have no problem with that but in any case people felt that they felt and not produce the first wave of protests but keep in mind that. it was rather limited and it seems to have passed a peak but that's when the ana coaches government they despair a big mistake at this point when things were kind of quiet and down cracking down on that march. need to develop a theory that it was and that seemed to really turn things around towards the dispiriting. protest against the government itself and against him remaining in office so this was clearly not planned by anybody but once it got going it acquired a certain life of its own when he saved wasn't planned by anybody. i think it was

in this time that many people in russia take that with a considerable degree of skepticism what do you think is the role of the outside actress and i mean the west in ukraine because i meet are they there is also russian influence there well you know we had this discussion about the orange revolution as well right and there's a big literature on it people argue back and forth how much of a difference did western they make. you know american support for german support for n.g.o.s in ukraine is a long standing pattern and goes back twenty years so. the united states has never really funded revolutionaries in kiev but it has funded a wide variety of n.g.o.s. but this it seems to me is more a constant background factor than anything terribly dynamic so it's not clear why you know something that's been going on for so many years would all of a sudden have an effect in twenty thirteen miners had no effect in two thousand and eleven for example when it had no effect in two thousand and ten when the coverage

was elected in a bitterly contested that on the whole fairer election than he defeated in the should go and there was no protest at that point so i think you have to take the the immediate circumstances into account now. we mentioned several of those kind of revolutions before and obviously there are national specifics to all those uprising spread one thing in common as far as damage this concern is that i immediately or a couple of years down the road they lead to violence and bloodshed and that was the case with the rose revolution in georgia because. you know later on launch these military contain against south said there was violent riots in kyrgyzstan and ukraine up until a certain point was a notable exception but now they're saying it's no longer the case i wonder. given the mass existing mass in ukraine not only domestically but also the ripple effect it produced in the international community to have

a major crisis on our hands do you think it may change the state department thinking as far as you know color revolutions are concerned and so the question i mean i think. expert opinion is the vital. and again national circumstances are important in georgia but georgia's had a very violent twenty twenty five years of independence it didn't start with the colored there with the revolution of two thousand and three and they are they had a civil war and they the fight against the obvious is all these things that already happened ukraine though as you point out it was different to ukraine as had a lot of division a lot of contention but it until this past winter it had had almost no political. violence so from that point of view is actually much less violent than russia which had the war's intention but it changed this time and so will lead to a reassessment in washington i mean i think there is some second guessing there

already and at a minimum i think people may want to be more careful next time in terms of thinking through the consequences of unqualified support i think is both probably if if we're talking about a government that's perceived as having you know crossed a certain line in terms of autocratic behavior then. americans will tend to be sympathetic to the opposition. but it is interesting that you know the united states was initially pretty receptive to your own approach because everybody would have been frustrated with you simple they thought he was going to be more businesslike he would get things done. and i know this from direct experience they had maybe not the high hopes for him but i think they thought he would be better. and the same applied to the europeans and i think sorry for interrupting you but i think it was in government had a lot of frustration of it you know i'm like the americans or the europeans they found it they found him and i'm unreliable breaker and i will act as if this is one

of the polish. of specials might have been come rosko i forgot said that. unocal which is style was to sit on the fence and try and help the cause on both sides so he was inconsistent and indecisive and i think in the end that frustrated everybody that is seven earlier that nobody planned for that and. i also think that this is sort of a prime example of a chain need jerk reaction because i don't think the united states plan for ousting in a call which neither did russia i think planned for taking control of our crimea and together we have a major crisis on our hands. do you think that is likely to be resolved in some sort of constructive way. now because the stakes out very high both sides have put themselves into a corner and. how do you walk back from that we're in the forest as they say. well it's going to have to be done in a very deliberate way and with compromises. so the united states is certainly not

going to recognize to recognize the annexation of crimea i think it will be probably become like the baltic states a nineteen forty. it's it's a fact and the united states is has does not have the ability to reverse it it's certainly not going to use the attempt to use military means but nonetheless it won't be accepted that is a form of compromise you know in a sense if. this is the last change in borders that happens this way then i'm not saying will be forgotten but you know people accommodate themselves to new realities if it turns out that it's just the first step and that this is going to go on indefinitely. and threaten the very existence of ukraine as a state then we're kind of in a different game now you've cited russian politics for quite some time now. we often hear in western media especially you know western position american politicians like to say that russia has to be stopped because if you know if it's

not taught a lesson this time around tomorrow it's going to invade you know i don't know it's twenty and maybe the day after you know russian troops will be a. what average do you believe that to be the case do you believe that could insult emitted ten days to restore whatever is left of the soviet union or to build another imperialistic country in its place but it's very hard to read his mind of course you know it's just it's tough because he's very closed when it comes to his ultimate aims and intentions but my own personal reading of that is that no i don't think he. wants to. i don't think he thinks russia is capable of doing. but he has raised the stakes on the one particular issue which is that they don't think russians and russian russian speaking population is on the spot soviet space but what is so threatening about that because you know that part of pressure against that also very common in the united states you know protecting you know i don't

think it's the threat comes from being sympathetic towards or trying to act in support of people who are from the same group as you are it's when it's really more precisely about changing the borders of states in order to come to think that's the real flashpoint and here people start thinking about the one nine hundred thirty s. right these historical analogies are slippery and can be quite dangerous i don't think we're living in a repeat of the 1930's but it's the border change that's the professor goes on let me stop you just there we have to take a short break now but when we come back we both examine the use of history in geopolitics so don't go away.

with the economic downturn in the final. days the deal sank night and the rest of the thing became everything. forever new should to go straight from being a violent. of the existing order to big a well run from a crusade is impossible it just won't happen because the act of the revolution is so bothered that they were off the show so great that there is a period of. since the end of the cold war the media environment is transformed almost beyond recognition today there is a global battle for hearts and minds and the west mainstream media is losing.

right to see. her street. and i think the truth. on our reporters. on the. welcome back to worlds apart of really discussing the crime and the events in ukraine with timothy cult and a professor of government and russian studies at harvard university mr colton just before the break we were talking about the change of borders and i don't know if you would agree with me but this change of borders came as a big surprise not only to people in the west who have but i think to too many

russians and you were surprised well i was absolutely surprised more or i think president putin didn't think about i mean couldn't imagine something like about three years or two weeks prior here he to that decision and you cannot argue about the legal aspects of it but i wonder if all this talk and surprise could be attributed to the fact that the west simply has gone cost some to russia taking everything. that the west is pushing on it because that's admitted that russia has very substantial not only security but also economic interests in in your crane well obviously there is rivalry over ukraine it's a contested zone and this is not. the new but it has become more acute in the last few years mostly because of the good behavior not because of us behavior but sure there is competition there's no question about that but again it's i think the redrawing the boundaries that turns out to be i think the real detonator in terms

of the american government opinion. the fact that that russian russia's response to this retaliation for it takes the form of changing the boundaries of the state if you're a professor of government and russia is not is what other actions russia could have taken to defat inst interest and to make sure that the west and the stance that this is the red line for russia and i'm not asking that you know rhetorical terms what all since in terms of you know policy is what are the actions where they're at rest goes on well russia over the years you know had a rather effective strategy for dealing with ukraine including you know using economic levers of various kinds which could be used up until the very last minute with chemicals which of course but also using russian media russian soft power to influence vote of voters in central and southern eastern ukraine but he's like that you're talking about the soviet politics but i'm asking you about the west in

general because it's one thing to build your relationship with the neighbor but i think. you know what happened here and what prompted this significant reaction on the part of russia was had let very little to do with the ukrainian authorities and more to do with the actions of. a western mysteries isn't the possibility of nato coming to the crimea or will nato i mean there's a long history here of course and the nato issue had actually been dormant for quite some time so say what you like about this didn't the new authorities in kiev the last thing that was on their mind in february was saying a word about nato but i think here russia quite effectively blocks you know the the move towards membership action plan for ukraine and georgia. twenty zero eight for what it's worth my view always was and this is partly because russians told me this that. in the case ukraine getting some kind of plan for joining nato but that's when russia would have taken crimea back and said this was a form of deterrence if you like this was an implicit threat but here we what we

saw oddly was a very different sequence that is russia finally does this and does it you know using force in a very sophisticated way with almost nobody getting killed but it does it at a time when the ukrainians don't seem to be considering nato membership at all even today they're being very careful when you say that they weren't considering me to membership in l a ukraine was actually on the path of becoming an online state at least this is something that you know comments have sort of touted and promised the russian leadership but the new authorities and especially the five right groups that constitute a significant part of in your thirty's they they were very open about their desire to kick russia out of crimea to terminate that long term lease. to machine code. and said if she ever was elected president first and she would do would be to terminate the lease now that they're in russia had lots of cards that it could have played it could have simply refused to discuss the lease but i think i think i

think in terms of putin's willingness to go over the edge on this one that the security aspect of this is not trivial you know the base is very important to russia but it was you know it sometimes governments do things that they think is the right response at the time but then have attacks that they didn't really anticipate and my sense is that they underestimated the depth of reaction the day began on this one but it's not only that i think i'm more concerned about the wider effects of this because you know we've had this convention in europe at least since one thousand nine hundred five that states may break up. as happened with yugoslavia's happened with the u.s.s.r. but it's big countries don't take parts of smaller. yes. of course russians will say well it was cos of both which is true i think that was a mistake but the united states didn't the next cause so i think it's just this addition to the large country that just created a difficult to stop yeah right and this principle could be applied elsewhere and i

think you know one of the great achievements of the twentieth century was this convention that we all arrived after nine hundred forty five that boundaries are not changed by force even though this means that you know given the fact that in addition to the principle of sovereignty the principle of self-determination it's it can be very unjust for some of the groups involved so it's a matter of competing goods in a way and russia should always bought into this i think putin now has wrapped himself up in contradictions because he always supported the principle. and viability of borders he opposed after all the cost of a decision and now he cites the cost of well i agree with you that. russia finds itself in a rather difficult position but so is the united states because the adventure of the state department nowadays is exactly the opposite of what the you know those same people were saying just like four months ago i mean it's the contrast between some of the hearings and the at the senate foreign relations committee is just

striking i mean if you play back was victoria nuland was saying you know four months ago and what she's saying now there is a. tariff on a fatally i don't follow her statement very close in the short she's saying well i mean she used to criticize very harshly the use of force by a by the government and now all of a sudden she is in favor of restoring the constitutional order so i think all the parties are of these very big geopolitical game i know it's very consistent i'll grant you that and you know i'm not an apologist for u.s. government policy i disagree with disagree with the important parts of it can i take you back to these topic of color travel listens and the kind russian leadership has long been extremely says. vicious of color revolutions as a means of change and you know people in the west used to say that that's because you know that presents a threat to put in zone political survival but i think he may now feel vindicated because he always said that that was not only a threat to him personally but also

a threat to the country and what is happening in ukraine now clearly from his point of view is a threat to the country's very existence do you think that may. provoke any change on the part of his thinking as far as russia's domestic politics is concerned well i mean certainly the spoke latin affairs become tenser and more control oriented since these events started november which is what exactly what you would have predicted. you know once again i think he's wrapped up in some contradictions and you mentioned the one with relation to american policy i mentioned the sovereignty issue but here's another one so russia is indirectly at least supporting armed groups in eastern ukraine that are using just really really questionable tactics to express their unhappiness with the situation well these are all the same tactics of would not be tolerated in russia under any circumstances but russia is lending its moral support and perhaps i don't know the details of

course financial support to these people so you know it's just i can't imagine that these fighters in in the dawned are the kind of people that normally putin would feel any sympathy with but i don't dr called and i think the same could be said about for example that you support for the opposition in syria i don't think any american politicians would feel very warmly about you know the people that they. at least politically and we also don't know financially and i guess militarily support if they can take you back to this idea of the color revolution being a means of democratic is ation russia has seen a wave of antiquity and. protest back in two thousand and twelve and early two thousand to eighteen eleven twelve yeah and you know some people in the west saw that as a possible russian iteration of the orange revolution there was a lot of debate about whether that is possible and we talked about the reaction of

the elites and the kremlin to some extent but i think what is also interesting is the reaction of the russian people and i think even though the liberals who used to take to the streets back in two thousand and eleven and two thousand and twelve they're now a bit more cautious about where that would leave the country because russia is obviously no stranger to you revolutions do you think that may have. chilling a fact not as far as crime and politics is concerned but you know some thinking on the part of the russian intelligence a which tends to be more liberal than the rest that put them in what we already see there i mean there is a split over this issue i think among the opposition forces and there are some who want to rush my down and others who think this would be a very dangerous idea for russia i mean i think when you look back over russia's political history since gorbachev starts change in one thousand eighty five there's actually been very little support for revolution from below i mean look at yeltsin you void using the word revolution you know he helped destroy the soviet state but

the last thing he wanted was to go from that to a social revolution he even wrote about this in his memoirs so putin of course is more conservative than yeltsin but i think for him the the word revolution when a country doesn't want to see that linked up with russia because they look back to you know what happened earlier in the century in the funny central and other lucian's and so badly so. maybe there's been a bit of an adjustment since twenty eleven and i don't think you know that a lot phenomenon was really about making the revolution was rather more limited than that i think on this counting the votes in elections and that sort of thing to which the government's. not to just be negative about them. to respond i mean. certain changes were made i might say they didn't do change enough but governors are going to be elected they return the districts to the duma lections i mean they have made some changes in how lections are carried out that i think are going to help stabilize and i think as far as the media i concerned the scope of discussion

i don't know if you would agree with me but my own experience as a journalist tells me that the scope of discussion. that exists now in russia is actually in comparable to what we had even a decade ago and why is that because of the internet or because of the internet and even the federal channels which are usually believed to be these big megaphone of how the government translates its point of view or rather the since missions its point of view i think even there the the scope of discussion is much more diverse than it used to be even during the yeltsin's there. well i don't know about that but it's it is why i mean i think a lot of americans are not aware of that and. the written so there's been this recent tendency to encroach on the internet there who knows where this will end but it's mostly focused until now on social networks and their use as a political device and the secret services to missile services demanding information about users so it's not really content oriented but i think this is

unless they want to go to a chinese firewall system which is would be a very character step there's not a lot they can do about this now the typical use view on russian democracy is that you know russian people want to free them and the evil government suppresses the need for freedom and i think here in russia and possibly even in ukraine the relationship is much more complicated because people on one hand they want freedom but they don't trust that neighbor with that freedom and that puts very complicated sometimes contradictory self contradictory demands on the russian governance i wonder if you could talk more about that and if you think that putin. represents. form of leadership on one you know extending some freedom quicker telling the others but not doing that because he necessarily want secure self and power but rather responding to the demands that the russian people who don't govern well i think he wants to stay in power well i mean the russian people let's admit still

want him to stay in power right now because something to that i think it's not just mistrusting their neighbors but also this general culturally ingrained view in russia that for in order for this country to stay together and stay afloat it has to have an effective state and this is couldn't score belief i think describes everything else he was very clear about it when he became president and i don't think he's deviated from that. and he's to to a considerable extent delivered on his promise but i think the problem here as it will emerge in the coming years is that. these ideas even if they're good ideas or they're useful corrected to excess before they also need to be adjusted and corrected and if he becomes a leader for life i think that will be impossible and this will lead to demand for changes later which may defeat the purpose to achieve you know made this changes in the first and i think you made it clear that he doesn't at least for now intend to do so but you know that position isn't that also due to the fact that the united

states for some reason sees democracy as something that he can bring to the country whereas i think putin strongly believes that democracy is something that you have to grow within the country and that bad process takes years if not decades in fact he himself said that this is a very long term project meet which may indicate how long he wants to stay in power well i think the united states is maybe less naive about this than it was ten or fifteen years ago so democracy promotion still it's still a significant foreign policy priority but it has to compete with other priorities and so we see this not just in relation to russia. where we currently. basically no activities along these lines that in your country but plain others think about egypt there are always other considerations that may be very important to the united states asked operator in the world of states and liberal internationalism is not the only value to be served by physical and i really appreciate your being on

our show and to our viewers please keep the conversation going on our twitter you tube and facebook pages and act hope to see you again same place same time here are worlds apart. well into the. show thirty four can just spend over eighteen billion euros on culture that says it should reach one hundred fifty million degrees with some talk a mosque still to sell something peacefully to france we travel in search of the song. knowledge we've got the future of coverage.

his name was joseph was he was nazi germany's minister of propaganda the midst that he created exist to this day. it was the gerbils propaganda was supposed to actually trying to denigrate other nations while at the same time raising ordinary german so students who could. keep its complete use of go bill snoop precisely what the masses need to hear in order to make them follow him he was like the pied piper from the fairy tale who made grants follow that you know this by. the myths created by the chief nazi ideologist bound for tal saw in the west we have to fight these myths today in memory of those who walked in the second world war. dramas the truth be ignored to the. stories others refused

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