to the bullshit that we don't see you liberal or conservative and as you can see from this bar graph we don't skew the facts either the talking head lefties talking at righties oh there you go above it all to look at world artsy americans in the spotlight now every really i have no idea how to classify as and it actually took me way more time and i cared women go. hello i'm sam sacks in for tom hartman in washington d.c. here's what's coming up tonight on the big picture. should voting be as hard as buying a gun the republicans on donald trump's sham election integrity commission think so

more on that with greg palast in just a moment and conservatives hate bureaucracy so when will they get behind bernie sanders single payer plan which would do away with the paper pushing waste in our health care system once and for all last charles sour and horse cooper in tonight's . liberal rumble. so donald trump's so-called election integrity commission met for a second time on tuesday this time it was in new hampshire and despite its official sounding name this commission was really created to do two things one justify the president's claim that billions of people voted illegally during the presidential election and to pave the way for a national crackdown on voting rights if yesterday's meeting was any indication it's becoming increasingly difficult for the commission to pretend like it was

created to do anything else joining me now is greg palast puffin foundation fellow an investigative reporting filmmaker and creator of the new documentary the best democracy money can buy a tale of billionaires and ballot bandits i've seen the movie it's excellent everybody should watch it. greg palast welcome back glad to be with you again so i mentioned off the top that the commission was created for two reasons to justify trump's claims that millions voted illegally and pave the way for voter suppression let's start with the first one has the commission found the three to five million people that trunk claims have voted illegally last election. well i haven't found them but they've named them first of all we start out the reasons in new hampshire is that a guy named bill gardner is the center of the claim by the commissioners that six thousand people from massachusetts voted in the new hampshire presidential presidential race in sixteen and what's unusual about that is that they didn't bust

any of those people obviously the secretary of state isn't doing his job by arresting those people they have their names and addresses by the way the secretary of state is bill gardner the guy that made the accusation he made the accusation about these illegal voters but he has their names he has their addresses he hasn't filed a complaint against a single one because it ain't true some people by the way my daughter is one of them goes to school go to school in in their state and but they only drive on their vacations and so they use their a they only have a license from the state where they are born that doesn't mean illegal voter if they were there they would bust them it's very easy to find them but they don't that's just the beginning of the of the kind of fruitcake operation or fruitcakes than christmas in london on that committee they have hons vons but koskie who's claim that there are are you ready one and a half million aliens who voted in our elections in fact in some elections he has

more aliens voting than citizens i guess they're very patriotic now how does he come up with this number because there are people when they get a jury notice because they have a driver's license say i can't serve on the jury because i'm not a us citizen he didn't then assumes he leaps to the idea that obviously they must also they don't serve on their jury but they got that license so obviously they're voting but again they have their names but they don't arrest them florida the republicans tagged one hundred eighty one thousand hispanic surname floridians as so-called potential alien voters they arrested. single one an austrian who voted republican so it's the problem of the phony claim that leads to the second point you make the phony claim is covering a push to get laws to end this so-called fraud this crime which doesn't exist and to do that they are using systems which will take away the rights of you me real

voters mostly however voters of color you mentioned hans von spakovsky this heritage foundation fellow who's been on this voting kick for a while he's affiliated with this panel the mother jones found an e-mail he sent advising this panel before it was created and he says quote if they are picking mainstream republican officials in our academics to man this commission it will be an abject failure because there aren't any that know anything about this who have paid attention to this issue over the years he's basically telling this commission only fill it with republicans that want to do something about this if you don't deal with democrats and mainstream republicans seems like indication you have a pretty weak case if you want to make sure that the jury or this commission is already tilted in your favor. well very important said no professors he doesn't want any experts because there are there are dozens of wonderful experts on voting fraud and voting rights in america and not a single one i mean not

a single recognized expert says that there's more than a half dozen people who voted legally night states who's going to risk five years in prison and baby you do get that five years if they catch you for one single vote it doesn't happen as as loraine many doctor from the professor at n.y.u. the real expert on this stuff says it's more likely you're going to be struck by lightning than commit individual voter fraud the fraud is committed by the government in falsely stopping legal voters from voting if that's what they want to do so spit cough ski and he got caught on this through a freedom of information act request his name was redacted but some wise people figured out who it was and he admitted it was him saying don't put basically don't put on any experts on the panel we don't want anyone knows what they're doing because we want to change the laws the way we want to change the laws to many voters of color we can't win elections that way on our own or bring up another guy

associate this panel is someone who testified before the commission on tuesday and we know this because the white house released a bunch of public documents and one of them included this power point slide from a guy named john lott jr he's a conservative commentator fox news guy he's also a huge gun rights advocate so you're wondering why would a gun rights advocate be here while you read his powerpoint and it says democrats love background checks republicans want to make sure elections are secure so why don't we use the same background check system we use for guns and apply it to voters what was your reaction when you heard such a severe brilliant idea like this one. well i don't think it's bad to stop insane people from voting then we might have a different president but the real issue the real issue is right whether it's a gimmick once again the more impediments and roadblocks you put in the way of voting the more that the easier it is to keep the voter rolls whiter than white most of these laws apply to new voters that means young voters. and other words

democratic voters for one thing for example they want to prove you have to prove that you're a citizen that's one of the things that the commission is talking about that you have to prove that you're a citizen to have the right to vote well that might sound reasonable except that means that you need either a passport or your original birth certificate driver's licenses social security cards they don't mean nothing in terms of whether you're a citizen or not so once again it's about impediments the more impediments the whiter the voter rolls because it only applies to newer voters that is those people brought in through voter drives the new hispanic vote the young vote and african-american vote so this commission just had its second meeting on tuesday it didn't get off to the best of starts even before they started having these meetings they sent requests to states around the country for voter all information most of the states said take a hike we're not giving you that information you've mentioned numerous occasions

and since you've been coming on the show talking about this commissions there's been numerous occasions where members of this commission have outright lied about things and spread misinformation they're getting caught in these lies are you surprised that this commission has an imploded yet and i mean how long can it keep a limping forward and still have any credibility or is it just lost credibility and just continuing on like a zombie at this point. well i'd be very careful that zombies as you know can be very deadly and the problem is that we have a republican controlled congress the guy in charge that commission is kris kobach i call him trumps vote thief in chief he actually engineering created many of the vote suppression techniques we've talked about a big one called cross check that is organized and controlled completely by kris kobach where he supposedly tagging people voted in the same state excuse me in two states the same election people named jose garcia. and david kim this is what he

considers the double voters so i'm very worried that this commission's going to be making recommendations to a congress a republican congress that wants to hear that there is vote fraud that wants to hear methods for supposedly stopping vote fraud and what they really mean is stopping voters of color i'm very scared of this zombie you know we make make fun of these guys we think this is ridiculous six thousand people driving in from massachusetts to vote in new hampshire they've got nothing that better to do except the risk five years in prison pulling that stunt you know we laugh but the jokes going to be on the american public this is our big problem this is a real serious dangerous guys and remember bill gardner the guy with the crazy accusation about the massachusetts voters in new hampshire he's the secretary of state in new hampshire kris kobach is the secretary of state of kansas these are powerful important and dangerous people don't kid yourself hans von spakovsky

advice was intended to marry are a few democratic state officials on this commission have we noticed any pushback from some of the democrats on this panel because this is largely a partisan issue here you have largely republicans trying to restrict votes and democrats largely trying to expand the franchise. well they had the that guy bill gardner the secretary of state of new hampshire who goes along with coal box idea the illegal voters from massachusetts and double voters everywhere he is a democrat by the way believe it or not the league of women voters has told me they don't think of him as a democrat they don't think of him as anything except a danger to the state and in fact the response when the league of women voters challenged bill gardner as having any role in determining who gets to vote the league of women voters then was called the communist league of women voters by the chairman of the committee kris kobach this is their response to legitimate concerns about the qualifications of members so it's not just

a question of partisanship and it's almost entirely a republican panel but remember they as violence because he had demanded they don't even have the kind of normal crazy republicans you have to have crazy crazy republicans and a few democrats who are completely rejected for their and frankly racist operations of voter rolls in places like new hampshire greg thirty seconds left your guy who's been on top of every election scandal for the last few decades from florida to ohio to this year with the states and cross-check what do you have your eye on right now heading into two thousand and eighteen is it this commission is there something else that we should also be paying attention to. well whether it comes to this commission or not it's the idea that you have to prove you're a citizen to vote which people say that you ought to be able to prove you're a citizen to vote but the effect has been where they tried it in kansas is thirty five thousand students in kansas were barred from the voter rolls because they didn't have that piece of paper that original birth certificate or they're too

young or too poor to have or have any reason for a passport those are the only ways you can prove you're a citizen this would be a massive massive attack on any voter registration drive look out for that for that citizenship requirement that's the big danger that's coming right at us the zombies are on the march investigative reporter greg palast thanks so much for coming on the show. thank you for. coming up conservatives are all about repealing obamacare so let's do it and replace it with medicare for all that more with charles sour and horoscope parents nights alone liberal rumble after the break.

all the feelings of. every the world experience. and you get it on the old the old. the old according to jesse. the modern world come along for the ride. all the world just dates and all the news companies merely players but what kind of parties are anti american playing are to america offers more artsy american

personal. many ways in the landscape just like the real news a good actor bad actor and in the end you could never you're on. some other part of the world all the world all the world's a stage and we are definitely a player. you guys and i made a profession. powerpoint to show you how artsy america fits into the greater media landscape is not left or right but we are a solid alternative to the we don't skew liberal or conservative and as you can see from this bar graph we don't skew the facts either the talking head lefties talking at righties oh there you go above it all to look at we're all artsy americans in the spotlight now every really i have no idea that a classified as it actually took me way more time than i care to admit. it.

when it comes to health care republicans say they're all about repealing obamacare so maybe they'll get behind the democrats' latest repeal and replace plan let's rumble. joining me for tonight's rumble are charles sauer economist and president of the market institute and horst cooper attorney and senior fellow at the national center for public policy research thank you both for being you know thank you let's get started bernie care is finally here today vermont senator bernie sanders officially unveiled his plan for single payer health care saying it was the start of a long fight and to the international shame that is our current health care system . we begin the long and difficult struggle to end

the into the national disgrace of the united states our great nation being the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all of our people as proud americans our job is to lead the world on health care not to be woefully behind every all of the major country bernie's plan the medicare for all act of twenty seventeen would gradually phase every single american into the existing medicare program over a four year period from that point onwards health care would be free i repeat free for everyone in the same way that when you call the fire department they'll put your house out for free it would be virtually no co-pays no premiums no deductibles no nothing oh yeah and unlike obamacare burn care would cover going to the dentist and the eye doctor would also repeal the hyde amendment which bars federal funds from being used to pay for abortions now honestly guys this is i think

a slightly more interesting conversation going on within the left and the sort of schism you see between the left flank signing on to bernie and you see a lot of so-called moderate democrats who might be angling for two thousand and twenty one even signing on to bernie sanders health care bill versus sort of the old guard hillary clinton other people who are still not quite on board with that but. you know you come you go to battle with the people you have so let's talk to you guys on this. a lot of the main objection here is this is too expensive you're not going to be able to do this well it is telling that the proposal doesn't come with a funding sort of associated it comes yes actually with a raising taxes on the wealthy does it not why am i creating payroll tax doesn't identify any funding source and says they plan to introduce separate legislation once they get forward on this but that's not urgency of the bill have included fundament like higher taxes on the wealthy higher taxes on wall street and also

it's going to erode taxes on working people let's be on a big day today would have been nice to come up with the full plan ok i agree with you there ok but let's to let me get my point let me set it up first let me get to my point here working people will have to increase taxes for this to work but think of how much money people spend on health care right now hundreds of dollars in premiums a month or if they get it through their employer maybe it's less but their employer is spending hundreds of dollars on premiums a month and as you guys say that cross is eventually passed on to the consumer and everything like that so if the government says so let's let's put out a number that same individual spends you know fifteen hundred dollars a year in health care related expenses if the government says i can do that if you for a thousand dollars increase in taxes instead of fifteen hundred dollars that you pay and you won't have to deal with insurance companies anymore you don't have to deal with death panels created when insurance companies deny you certain sorts of trial last time i heard is i don't like about it why don't let is that my horses that every other country in the world employ us the last time i heard

a set up like this i was playing make believe in my backyard while i was growing up the fact is is that you complicated for you know these are just made up numbers your hundred dollars eight up my pals in dollars and they don't police police protection for all of us through taxes we pay for honest i are going to pay or bill is made up this is the this is this is the left doing that a funny job at single payer medicare. isn't the government paying for health care medicare is actually done through the insurance companies the administrative costs per individual are about twenty percent to thirty percent higher for medicare patients first private absolutely not absolutely it's completely true you won't but you know what the numbers are five hundred dollars for a medicare patient first four hundred four hundred dollars eighty five is very care is older people they require more medical care no there's nothing in here that overhead c.e.o. bonuses that's what you said the administrative cost was one of the oldest candidates for president other than the his competitor hillary is advocating this

single payer idea let's consider what would happen if the three of us were to go on this program my mother uses medicare and by the way she has co-payments oh by the way she has out of pocket expenditures for her medical treatment pharmaceutical and otherwise oh and by the way she has to actually buy a supplemental plan so that she can get some of these other things this idea that's being advertised that you just show up at the doctor and it's amazing isn't true go and talk to your mothers going talk to your grandmothers and you'll get a whole different and not a single one of them will say that they want to get rid of medicare they all love their medicare actually want to stay on medicare and rather than just the three of us we're talking three hundred twenty million people in there in this year oh you're leaving people this is why i'm mad what is going to decide who doesn't want medicare and i want their medicare well we haven't got it we have medicare your wife is over sixty two i know she's on sold security disability and that's how much

the left doesn't understand the own the government programs that they're advocating for this the fact is medicare isn't a good program we've had to move doctors we don't get good service with the doctors we're at the drugs that we have to buy are very very expensive and we have medicare which you just laid out that's glowing system of this free system where you just walk out. free is never free sam right i said no i said you know there's going to they are going to pay higher taxes the same way i do it for fire services for the lease for schools and everything like that and you know we suffer because we all pay our taxes and the only one under sixty five year old people get who can't have access to the regular program get medicaid also a government funded and everyone knows how inferior that is with you turn our entire system push out the private sector and replace it with this what you're going to do is guarantee we all have subpar care we've got to move on to another

topic i'm going to give you a homework assignment i'm on twitter at sam sachs you can tweet me one person over the age of sixty five who doesn't want their medicare one person or that if i may say. doesn't want arnie's bella's that's already well under six i know it doesn't i'm saying it so that's the point though the point is everybody loves medicare was on it you're saying that people i just gave you my wife and he gave you his mom that's a derivative i don't headed there we went over that are we going to move on so security disability family treasury secretary steve admitted this week that the administration's call for a fifteen percent corporate tax rate might not be possible even so magical thinking about tax reform still very much alive in the white house just this morning donald trump who to quote with irma and harvey devastation tax cuts and tax reform is needed more than ever before go congress go so explain this tweet to me how will giving rich people and businesses a tax cut to help people who are in flooded homes in florida and in houston everyone who has a job should thank someone who has the wealth to cover the cost of their job tax

cuts make it easier and cheaper to operate whether you're a business or a corporation if you're in texas or florida you absolutely would like more employers more opportunities for goods and services at a lower price that's easy so more and more employers. more opportunity how are we going to fund anything if we're just not going to pay taxes is that what are you recommending here i mean corporate taxes are an all time low if they're at an all time low that's why we're not ready to raise that twenty five or thirty five percent they pay effectively ten to fifteen percent and you want to add on a lower and i want to add more band-aids on top because that's going to what make them pay more and know that way is that what we did in one thousand nine hundred six was we actually removed all of these layers of tax reform and corporations actually started paying taxes but there's a reason there's recent research done by corporations i think actually some of the wealthiest corporations in the world paid zero that he says he adding more and more

band-aids to the bills and it gives them more rare outs to not pay taxes well that's the point what reform does it lowers the rate and the lemonades a whole lot of the deductions that he explains we keep adding a lot more one ration stashing trillions of dollars of cash right now they have plenty of money to hire people and do all this stuff that's the incentive would have created you have a high tax rate you leave that money overseas it just makes it runs as you would term said today though he's turning into a bit of a squish i think he said that there will not be tax cuts for the richest americans he said the bare rate is going to stay the same and that it might even go up does this trump have some more common sense on this issue than you guys have at this point i believe with the president is ultimately going to sign a plan that is going to lower the overall rate for corporations and i were to kill or high income individuals particularly those in the escort situation are also going to see substantially lower rates that will make us competitive it will bring

jobs and top income tax rate for much of the golden years of america when we have the middle class as strong as it ever has been the top income tax rate was between ninety and ninety five percent it's right now thirty nine point six percent should it be low as you just pointed out all we did during those periods was to create a whole bunch of band-aids so that even a little hard a little not. the top rate was ninety but the effective rate was as little as thirty yes that's the question why i say to people if you can hire the town you can get away with it why not have a top rate that is real i think we're mixing things we're mixing corporations and individuals i'm comparing the rituals people and even individuals when that rate was nineteen we still had a pivot to asia maybe sixty right now if the percent on one had already had so much more than they're paying right now because you didn't are the only people that are in less look the only people that are actually paying the ninety ninety five percent are the doctors in. some teachers that actually

can't go and hide their money because there is a better rate does but i don't know how much it exist as the time if you couldn't structure your income in a way to avoid the rate then you got saddled with that higher rate if you couldn't find other deductions but most people figured out what to say or do so they didn't receive it in the form of income that could be taxed at the higher rate why are we making people go through all those distortions i'm totally all about getting rid of tax loopholes i'm also all about making wealthy people pay a rate we don't allow the us have that allows us to have a sustainable middle ground like we did for fifty years but where democrat you have to find that number the reason democrat kennedy lowered the rates was to eliminate all of the fraud and manipulations charles our horrid scooper democrat candidate thank you both that's the way it is tonight don't forget democracy it ain't

a spectator sport as tom always says get out there get active tag you're it. for decades the american. class has been railroaded by washington politics. big money corporate interests that's drowned out a lot of voices that's how it is in the news culture in this country now that's where i come in. i'm michel martin america i'll make sure you don't get railroad to go get the straight talk in the straight news. but. if you. want to talk to your street looks like

a real treat this would be analyzing the bottom. line with like you not i got. to deal. with it so. there's a real irony going. you still don't like i'm laughing at it responsible ways new people and there is always alerts what is the most noise c.n.n. sales team here like the baltimore area now wholesale surveillance you feel you have all made while those who contribute to size less than trump has used the social media site well i know it's our lead story cause it's garbage real genuine.