no one knows if the street looks like the real difference between. the lines but the bottom. line with the police like you not got to. put. up with. this. is. the. limits of. your launching an r t america special report with a long list doug made his mind up but basically everything that you think you know about civil society has broken down. there's always going to be somebody else one step ahead of the game. we should not be the size of normalising mind. we don't need people that think like this on a plane. this is an incredibly situation. where

. the. public welcome to all the part of the russians a big believer in having that own special way to deal with universal problems including a chip aids here is published health officials found skeptically on harm reduction programs instead of counting on traditional values to sound the growth in the new infections but with the number of cases reportedly costing one million last year has the time come to change tack well to discuss that i'm now joined by lois laura's deputy executive director of una it's dr laura's integrated. talk to you

thank you very much for your time. now one of your colleagues and aides recently announced that if russia's interests if your agency can help with negotiate better access to cheaper drugs potentially reducing the annual cost of therapy to last than seventy five dollars per person and i was really surprised by the if position is there any doubt if russia is interested in something like that and conter off this from my own gauge misery is the whole show daughter that was always put to very high. price and to be way too fussy to date access to drugs and to treatment and do you any age of course who is spot off your job your few hours sponsibility to make sure that the experience you are there bought software would they may be used on the other but that's the case he had off used in europe as a whole but as far as i understand the securing cheaper prices is more challenging for

a richer countries than for poorer countries. or middle income countries particularly here and is to europe where some of the countries including russia are considered to be a relatively well off to be offer it assistance of harm reduction or cheaper prices what needs to be done to ensure universal access for this part of that well off that is a clear and is a child link to spatially eastern europe today spain and the highest prices globality in general for access to aids drugs and why is that. good that i mean did they i mean spray you know and a lot experience shows they had that's not the impossible situation to change it seems like a book procurement to buy twenty it's some dime museum going to be by may or well that has some experience seems to me to death scene can prove that's possible i was recently. and be allowed to say yes negotiate for.

flood don't depart i saw feeling to have provided. is a problem dangerous to be facing and you need the system much capital but just how man to stand because one would think that when countries especially when they join forces they they should have known difficulty negotiating with the big pharma and yet it seems that they have it they figure that i mentioned that your colleague mentioned before seventy five dollars per person for an annual course of treatment that's like a fraction then very very small fraction of what countries are paying right now so what's the problem why this good you off your go what's happening death going to these ideals so penalize big pharma be meeting come home to fear being up a meeting go we have a different perspective on the scene could describe does not take into consideration on that because you stand where and maybe when you had to talk about the dark from the man through the bald people of that very when it able because the

food they have difficult dark says every seen you know it's your duty to meet for aids and so they had to most would a been so sides and their way that seems to work today jim softly the national picture again penalize the disco days and who exactly is in charge of that international architecture who decides that this country should be given a discount on prices or you know assistance for harm reduction and that particular country does not qualify who decides that we have to talk about pricing and the ducks as a policy should. do it. but if we talk about pricing and the ball to haul do war disorganised to be been defeating off the prices and so into a national should two shows define you they ought to defy my seawitch because they have the differing of them to apply your norwich and your no i have

a difficult to stun to stand away a pharmaceutical company or fair a lower price for. people use a dizzying off to excess and not to pull weeds aids eastern europe dark says the day ends you have to talk about a global epidemic in my view the right to excess better prices should be to everyone in depending on where you live you do but that's not the whole seems you are guessing the governments themselves slow be hard enough to ensure this accessible pricing because so one could imagine that for example corruption comes into place here and sometimes maybe in some of those countries that you mention eastern europe central asia corruption is also very high and you can it cannot exclude certain people perhaps driving a personal benefit from keeping the prices up is that a factor i don't have the knowledge for this to my usual. i mean not to the international but that affects the epidemic about golf course affects every scene

but he spoke i see that the end goal of a man to have that esteemed in him he have access not doing to drugs to take in all the ads and so and make the deaths possible to the largest number possible if you see it since. i never saw it and i seen it used to be an expect that the government has a position against fasi that they that says in there that. you can't but perhaps not putting enough of an effort to ensure universal access because you know that the universal access in russia for example is still a bit of a challenge only a third of people who have the virus they have ever virus receive the therapy do you think that's mainly because of the pricing or are there other concerns i see pricing is death and to be are you sure and you adding do or do it if you had it being used in europe spain does a job which is difficult for me you do understand this divide we are dark about

people you got that israel believe they should have access to. you have provided drugs that's to me is a right is a human right you know that me and to end this crisis i was so high and i often loss of these become a major challenge but he's not going to be i seen where i see the spot you are a few days strategists to facilitate the excess body cell so he is vetting wotton now there is a hard to beat here in russia about how serious the hiv aids isha is here and the algae that it's a full list latched epidemic especially in siberia and the here also the government says it is concerning but the activists are being i'm julie alarmist and where do you come out on this is the new europe today has defied us to growing epidemic in general. demeanor you'd see. to some extensional if you it to be fair to say that eastern europe today is the face of the global reads

epidemic it is no question about it but. it's a very good on the situation it democrats they vary a lot inside the same we go into you may have a very different situation then you do use decays ever to add into what they can give an example if i do use this seems to be that thing some pit those will. be going there i direction. infections are you going belle but that's not de alledge everywhere well everywhere would be i assume some of the siberia and towns and some of a citizen they hear elsewhere there is a very high number of injecting drug users as well as other at risk groups what a zero want to ask you about is there is also. i debate about how that what is the main mode of transmission in russia because. the epidemic any of the

demick would be far more difficult to contain once it moves from gross to general population at large has that rubicon been crossed and russia from dirty needles into unprotected sex but it's a very dynamic epidemic as you have seen knowing in eastern europe as a whole did. definitely the. people death injecting drugs they steal. in my view unexceptable he skipped off to getting h. i.v. induced regional. but it's not do you want to you know there are places in these regional where to. offer the future off the epidemic. they have to bring spatial costs to me no areas where we had to stop to get that. data is start to skid the top to five percent or. or familiar in the general

population enough people that injecting drugs may be infected is a try these extremely high to me as it's a big head for leg. off diffusion of cool soft is epidemic into swedish now. having been following this issue for quite some time. what the russian officials would say to that is that in many of those regions if you mention they also have wider availability of the testing so do you at this moment understand what is actually driving the numbers of the better testing or indeed the rise in the in the number of infections the rise in the number of infections the definite thirty is the difficult to because seven debauch because this is well defined three and. death going that i areas east new york often middle australia because it. rates on the rise of the global in scope today we ought to start to see often degrees in the

number of infections. what made you look as a part of dorks mainly an epidemic that we had to biggest in sub-saharan africa outside africa we had seen in many regions in many places in many communities if the dems on their right slow because sub-saharan africa has long been the center of attention and as you pointed out that they also received a somewhat privileged access to both drugs and they attention of global public health policymakers one that explained that you had to be sort of the right oh down now does that we did and i did so recent on that is on the conclude if you follow forty's to add that money goes international money that is a media elation she between the investment and dissolute and of course most off their money we're in debt in a right to do so and should continue sub-saharan africa if you do and if you good

the flow of money gordon did it did them to he won't we have experienced the scenes of. hiv. it will be only stable when to finish the money should continue to be there but the problem is it's a global epidemic we need to find a new balance. for his sauces all so flowing to epidemics bodies to see it used in europe india's reaction i've heard you make the point earlier that hiv aids has turned into a syndrome of social exclusion discrimination they have the tools or have the drugs to deal with it by the apparent they know the heart of the brain to use those tools fully as somebody who is credited for designing the program for universal access in brazil to the access to therapy in brazil i wonder if you have some of the whys and how to break through that how to make at least on the policymaking level to see the stigma as not just the social concept but also something that prevents effective

policy to ports first again. grew as you did his driving day dividend to day is basically the the concommitant to pay demick off discrimination your body not to get on treat the men because in that idea shows like price we discussed but is not to primary actual people are not getting access because they don't have had the did they i do not profitable come to a health center because they may be discriminated they are not comfortable because you lost and allies it because they aren't funny. they have sex who is the same sex today day is a gay male so we not go through desists is is by law forbidding these is to act despite fooling does it damage but event to people death to people discriminate they go on to their own they don't but you speak on prevention they don't have access to drugs my second point you we have three decades of experience we have you

live and we know what sort is a combination of four factors one sport usually the ship that's clear that you needed to sayas that we saw that brought along. button issues. mainly. on the people including the most when able we solve discrimination. and of course money these are deformed doors that must war if you want to bring this epidemic. to laura's for have to take a very short break now but we'll be back in just a few moments stay tuned. but also. the ship between kids it was suggested.

and a fairly strong one there were two thousand. in the study it's a very extensive study done by a well respected scientists. do chemicals that down the advertising. really increase the risk of cancer and i chose a means of known to use them in the launch of tests is it a sham that skepticism. is is true by independent scientists so did the industry. i read and station from my time as well as the others why is that in the me too happy definitely didn't like what we've been doing and if you want to learn more you'll get a definite on the outflow the. back. is it big business against health. this is starting to show us.

all. in safety. welcome back to worlds apart from the least the worst deputy executive director of the hearing aids dr laura's russia generally receives very negative press for the way deals with hiv aids but i think there's a few positive stories and one of them being how russia managed to contain the mother to child transmission in two thousand and sixteen the russian authorities reported and ninety eight percent success rate and i wonder how do you explain this

because to me it seems like a positive discrimination going on they specifically have decided that on that particular group we're going to put all those factors that you mentioned before in place so do you think positive discrimination that kind of work. do not go as a screaming issue is so bad to death i don't think in seeing those two sink is misleading to call discrimination ok well let me say this thing on the one particular group the death i understand there are. definite today seen there actual food at a shot should be. schools to eliminate what the shut down as we show out some major major step to do is offer but he does it to do good though there is no question but of course it is the epidemic is moved i mentioned is very dynamic if you want to read you want to throw you feel when i read you they did join need to dan duffy hiv you need to think seem a lot of attention to all groups that they could do everybody that's been able to

reach ivy that one of such groups would be if the q. community you mentioned before that. male on male sex is bad in russia it's not bad but what is bad is the propaganda of what is referred to as nontraditional sexual orientation and. it's also evidently clear that the outer beauty community many countries is more vulnerable to this disease than in others i wonder how many you know caught they say media venue for themselves do you think the russian officials their actual public sector public health sector rather can use any other what are their means of getting used to reach that group specifically because since media and television programs on data frowned upon the you still need to have some tools to say we specifically to that group definitely. did did they have to demagogue. mindef to have sex or is male game him is one dane crees ever had in the

or in the development in the developing warrant and who had to go to dave this epidemic site on the rise why is very few exceptions because do it left behind even in their western developed country yes definitely a death some measure to show to be you know a of course you have some recent developments maybe off that perhaps became available to the dead. very recent case shown that in some places it's tough to have a half inch but in most of the police today we have seen this epidemic is on the rise. that i'm into a strong allies death to one of their ways that i see i see in q we we are going to seem even weighed on bio med school to use in science you know but sure we we've been to progress in the same way body system bring discrimination don't. you

see the timor and that's going to be a some sex relationship is ben i like i said by law you know i mean this is watch food in there put them. you know he has sinned this is him doing these he's become a martyr a martyr fundamental challenge death despite eventing us to move the bin duffey trivia so sites that do not think that being a homosexual mihm being to have been as a best of that injecting drugs a migrant that but he was on there did the caustic with that they cannot but he does if the damage could own does not work then that is a show you know exclusion and they charge ve they come to get in of in negative hiv you want your group and the head bands up harming just that particular group but why society as well because a i don't think anyone can actually solve that. sooner or later the way that the disease always sprats from one group to the general population. let me

just tell you i have a view on dad that's not my primary concept you know my primary concern is diffusion office site a site is the children debts of growing up you know they option that you have here is to grow up you know enough aside that to be not includes if. and they received death yourself. and you'll be exploded too in the future it's a very interesting film norman. when we speak about discrimination due to gay marriage forty states this same as i mentioned in this same way the mention race is beliefs general far be it police in seems they do it in them. is not the show is not the response to the general population that they show they usually use is we each kind of society to want to do well but i agree with you i think there are many ways to approach it and one thing that i noticed and they russia passed its own

strategy of dealing with hiv aids last year and while in in a couple of parts it actually comments on the effectiveness of peer to peer intervention and i know that there have been actually some projects made came out for example in st petersburg which involved peer to peer intervention so i wonder if even if russia has this law that reach some describe discriminatory when it comes to the distribution of information about same sex for relations i wonder if you see any scientific public health interest from the russian officials to work specifically on the job group because it is one thing you to pass moral judgments but it's another thing to do your job as a doctor and as as an official responsible for public health you still have have to address as they can't right i think is what something this will give us from deformation that. you know you need some level of pragya much as me and

we. we can not to wait to fossil sites to be ideal. to bring dave hiv epidemic you don't you need to have to be but argue much now russia is a very peculiar country when it comes to values and their fact on public health if you actually look at the service it's pretty progressive on many social issues but there is a drive to promote these so-called traditional values and partially bad drivers motivated by public health concerns that idea here is that the year you can drive the number of children being born you can decrease the disease so it's a very interesting combination and irony because on one hand you're trying to contribute to public health but on the other hand you are sort of on demining your ability to implement some of the liberal policies like harm reduction for example you come from brazil i think brazil has also a very interesting mix of liberal versus conservative values how do you balance the two for

a for pay for the benefit of all well i left to brazil twenty years ago and them again my myin go the way that i see it seems two days very much into a national. but. from my experience in different parts of the war they see this tension always exists in some place off course we use a much stronger emphasis on on on open policies on crucial and so in some basis goes in there with a ritual. and you. brought this. to h. i.v. when come to save you lifes. we need to find a way for what they see in these regions. in the us so much driving to them as our few international started that it's you off include joy or to bring people together. i think we need to focus more on deists too and its

simplicity of aspects and up but i believe that the but they cannot there be more who is who discrimination on exclusion on you push this epidemic forward but the you know discrimination exclusion works not only on the national all public health level but also geo politically russia is now in a somewhat challenging geopolitical situation with the west with ukraine and there is also a drive to exclude it from a number of international fora but i think the aids issue of the hiv aids issue is a little bit different because i heard you say that you actually want to encourage as many russians to be present that they all start on conference next year as possible or why is that because it seems to me that the a chevy eight is a very issue very rare issue when russia is actually not being pushed out of the international community. c h r u v u and they sponsor stage i.v. maine as a best buy them from india seems that we can do better in the future. the e.u.

is a t.v. us defaced opposed to an inch he started in his study to. the global society we face a challenge and to proportion about the j.v. minded that at this time from the begin to now at the least thirty five you know people they die because it's really talking about the measure of job and to measure it to that but to see the sun have a hash and some police we've got stuck to change that is the school since some places ended it less fundamentally because we are pollution a different way we brought people to the center. people leaving these h. i.v. people and the people who knew they would to each of you and to us deists throughout the maid is the sponsor so a sept i don't see it as a best find it if you are you are to have a live in need to be. will be helping us to move forward their agenda stu why rush to be able to offer this to fluster well i don't know that is that is that are many

aspects is dynamic aspects that to meet need to change that is no question we spoke about but you we need the russian federation to go to it to bring does know is a group of them well it is good to hear because there are lots and lots of very consequential issues like for example the arctic protection or counterterrorism where such cooperation is actually lacking that as i said i think the h.b. eight is one of the very few exceptions and i think they in their role of the netherlands is very interesting here because now the us is very interesting. about is very much connected to the whole situation around crimea because of the plane because of the war there and yet. there is still an effort to bring the russians together with the ukrainians sent together with other people from other countries in you said that you hold that base could be sort of spread to other areas but why do you think the people of the west a different on that because they there usually. don't make exceptions when come to

each i.v. i see a martyr there i follow international so you think you are you. and from the view as the un needs as the united nations the new is aids we vest to heaven on death the primary job is to convene is to bring people together to being good nations and going to still get at the bidding does epidemic and we have been more than sufficient david this that does this bus will to do y. and these moments i used to take god to fact to stitch. saying dick will cinquanta off debts i mean looking for did the russian federation do the shipping more than ever to bring us through to help us to bring visited them a good deal i mean looking for the russian federation on expect to use their recent as death you have been to his office. he says shown so far and i mean looking for the russian federation to do to show to us that sponsible two to two

brigades in a vault wrestlers are have to leave it there i really appreciate your being with us today and tara here splashing of comments on our twitter facebook pages and i hope to say again same place same time here in the wilds of party.

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